Artemus Hill and Deanna Flinn

00:05 August 20th, 2021. I just turned 50 years old and I'm here today with Artemis from one small step.

00:16 Artemus was born in Brooklyn, New York, and move to Bessemer, Alabama. When he was five raised by his grandmother. She instilled in him, great values that helps him cultivate his interests. He's a huge nerd. He loves wrestling anime. Video games movies, TV shows outside of free time. He's a tax accountant to finish school with his master's living in the South as a black gay asexual. Kid has made him fight for a better world by educating people on the many isms of the world. It's nice to meet you or Miss.

00:52 All right. If I am Artemus Hill, today's date, August 20th. I just turned 29 years old on August 1st. And I'm with my one-step partner, Deanna. And Deanna is Canadian. She's an artist. She has traveled and lived in the Caribbean and felt like each other and she visited and stayed on as like visiting another state. You love story corpse in love this moment and we welcome speaking to someone in learning more about being an American during this crazy time and maybe I can share what it's been like you can share what is like dealing with this on the other side of the Border. Nice to meet you as well be Anna.

01:38 Why did you want to do this interview today? So I wanted to do it because

01:46 I generally like meeting new people and this worked out perfectly that I get to talk to someone. I've never met on a totally different background. Not from just don't want to drown my local area. And I like reality shows. You know, how you bring random people together and you see how they all get to know each other and become friends and always thought that was cool. So I figured this was kind of similar to that cuz I know I would never be on like big brother Survivor.

02:18 I did, I wanted to do this because I'm a photographer. I've spent a lot of time sitting in front of my computer editing images. So I listen to countless. Is it Carl? I'm outside. I listen to episodes of storycorps podcast and just always thought it would be really cool. The stories always moved me, they were so genuine and authentic. Can I just order when they put out the call? I just thought it was incredible. And I think I, I signed up months ago. And when I finally got partnered with you, I was really excited. I'm also a little bit nervous. I don't know why me too. That's why I feel like I fumbled that intro.

03:03 Degrade actually never heard of story, Corp and my church. The Unitarian Universalist. They made of like a posting about it. And I don't like that looks interesting. And then that's when I signed up for it. And then, after I really found out what it was, I don't know. Okay, I really want to do this.

03:26 There's a H & H an hour.

03:30 In your daily works. If you have any time to listen to anything outside of working with numbers, it's a great way to pass the time and do the internet thing for me is right now. I'm actually doing doordash or ubereats. Yeah, so the job I got. It doesn't start until October 1st. I got to make money from house because I realize I hate the job search process and I'm so doing that. I find a lot like listen to podcast music and stuff.

04:13 I'm I'm completely out of my wheelhouse and last summer. I got a job as a server which I've never done before and it's really wild to learn how to do that during it. It's all I've been really low.

04:39 I mean like we're a little bit more outdoorsy like authentic more so than the rest of the provinces in Canada. So it's been really cool. But we had a really high Spike of cases during the winter. So we had a lot of like we were working and then they took away indoor dining and we couldn't dine outside cuz it was raining and then take out really took off. So I have a lot of respect for the Uber guys because I feel like you guys are like the postman of like the meal delivery service.

05:11 It's a really hard.

05:14 It is people don't think it is like oh you just picking up food and drop her off, but

05:21 The restaurant sometimes run out of items and they don't let the customer know. Or I got to let the customer know. They're getting mad at me. Like, you know, what, never mind. I got to call support and get money. Making the trip, even though I didn't ask you to go order or people don't put the correct address is a message. You talk about this other address cuz I'm like, I just drove on this side of town. I got a crazy little stuff in doordash and benefit analysis, like, okay, this order this far, I'm making this much money. Is it worth it?

06:04 Anything that your background so you can kind of figure out now. So I was like, looking at your intro and you mentioned, you live in the Caribbean. I'm a stand-in. What country specifically. You went to because my father is from the island of Grenada. Sadly. I have not been there yet, but I wanted you been to that Island in other countries as well.

06:36 Currently I started my sailing journey in Grenada. Grenada has a medical school, which is amazing. When you see it when you're sailing, it looks like a Barbie Village cuz all of the buildings are pain and they also have an international airport. So I was flying in there and that's where I got picked up. I was crew for six months on a boat and then ended up staying down there for 4 years, but for an entire year, I Island talked. So I've been to every island between Grenada and Puerto Rico, just sailing, which was pretty cool Grenada. I highly recommend visiting. It's an amazing Island. It's really, really cool. It's one of the bigger islands because it does have an international airport is not a lot of the islands can handle the size of an International Airport. Beckley has one. Like there's not a lot of them down there, but I highly recommend instead sort of the one thing. I will touch on this a little bit later, but I grew up in

07:37 On Eastern in Eastern, Canada, Eastern. Canada is very, very mixed race. Very I like there's sort of its interracial within my family out here on the West Coast. It's not very much. It's more sort of Caucasian or Asian. The interesting thing for me and the Caribbean was learning about the black culture and the matriarchy of it. And it was really interesting for me because while I was stealing and visiting all of these islands we weren't doing like the touristy thing. We weren't staying at the resorts or doing anything like that. We were hanging with the locals eating with the locals learning from the local and not just fascinated me. Gave me.

08:16 I ended up traveling to the Caribbean because I'd met a family that built a concrete boat and raised three children on the boat and their six-year-old could have a conversation with you. Like, you were an adult and that just kind of blew my mind and I was like, she's not getting that from a book. She's getting that because she's meeting all of these different people from all these different cultures. Cuz they used to just continuously sail around the world. So that's sort of what piques my interest to go down there and it was it was amazing for me cuz the West Indians is very much. It's super strong and a matriarchy, like the women wear the pants in the family. As long as the guys provide things are pretty much maintains, you know, like they sometimes there's a strong Father, Figure presence. Sometimes there isn't like, it was really weird. Get invited to homes for like 4 days and they took a pig or a goat on an opus fit. Everybody would bring a gift and it's just I highly fuel it. If you can find, if you still have family family down there. I highly recommend going.

09:16 I don't know what it's like for them for covid or what traveling is going to be like, maybe after maybe next spring or something, you can start to plan. But yeah, I would definitely do it. You will, it will be an incredible experience.

09:29 Oh, yes. I definitely would like to do that because I got put in my background, My grandmother raised me cuz my mom and father had issues. I knew him growing up, like my mom, call him when I get in contact with her, but my grandmother adopted me. So I only know like my maiden side of the family. And when I went to Brooklyn, New York graduated, that's when I actually met him in person. And I was like, oh, wow, it is Buddy cuz like he hasn't the big accident. So he'll be talkin like really fast. Can you say that again? What if we talk on the phone and then take over and I'm like, I have no idea what you just said, but I'm just going to be like, yeah, but I definitely like to be one. I've never left the United States of America.

10:29 Travel within the country. And I, I got my passport, last, not the application in last February and then covid hit. So I don't get it until like, July, go anywhere, but I'm waiting on the day.

10:54 Yeah, I'm supposed to go to Montreal, which is about a five-hour flight in October for an artists residency. And I'm really kind of, I mean, I want to go, I'm excited about it. But I'm also very apprehensive unvaccinated. I've had both vaccines. So I'm comfortable with being out and about and mask, no mask, whatever. But I just don't know what that's going to be like, cuz Montreal is one of the province's that was kind of, they went on lock-down, a lot more seriously than we did. Like they have an 8:00 curfew. There was one woman without pretending that she was walking her dog, but she actually had her boyfriend down on his hands and knees. So they could be out past curfew like your case.

11:42 Oh my gosh.

11:46 I'm up for him.

11:50 You be careful. I'm currently actually. I caught cold it last week and I am stuck at the house right now. I felt sick last Sunday and I was like, I hope it's cold over this cold and I kept getting sticker. So I took the test like a drive-thru pharmacy test on last day and do the how long it took them by Sunday. I got my results and I was positive, but I mean, I feel chills headache, fatigue loss of appetite, all of it, but I only get with that for like 4 days. And now I'm doing much better. I just have no sense of smell but I am vaccinated. So that's why I believe like get the back then you can get it. You won't end up in the hospital and I'm living through. I feel if I did not get back there. I would end up in the hospital in a hospital.

12:46 Alabama will probably the worst state as far as like vaccination. We're like below E like 35% or something. It's crazy and they just released like you Avi big hospital down. Here are no more. I see you dance, like it is crazy. It is specially miss our travel a lot and miss so many, many people who have been the most influential person in your life. And what did they teach you?

13:22 Sorry, I lost your first iPhone phone.

13:25 Most influential.

13:28 I met a lady. This is super interesting in the Caribbean when you're traveling, you have to find places to like have like a, make a phone call or pick up internet or do your laundry or whatever and it's really funny the culture. It's like the colored Bodhi culture, like people kind of like boats will come into different languages and sometimes people end up like sailing to Islands together. So you sort make friends and you travel together a little bit. It's kind of fun. But I met this one lady that traveled with us to a couple of different Islands. She's this little tiny bit of a thing like, she was maybe 5 ft tall. She was a professional diver and she was diving for a magazine doing research. And she was actually involved in the very first hijacking of a plane. Yeah, and I just like her, like she survived. I think they had, they kept her captive for like 90 days or something and then, they eventually Let Her Go.

14:25 But I just end this was not recently. So it's not like current kind of conditions or even 911 conditions, because when I was in the Caribbean, I left right after 9:11, so I would have met her like three years before that. So like late 90s, and it was just, it was incredible to hear her story. She gave me this book on how to light cure anxiety. It was a like a little pocket book. I guess you noticed that. I was an anxious person. It was really funny. But yeah, just the story of that. Look, she she just somehow she survived it. She said there was a lot of people who didn't, but like there's been people like that all through my life that I've run into her new run into because I've been traveling or because I'm growing up in the east coast. I don't know if you got this from being born in Brooklyn, but we're more outgoing. We look more to connect with people, starting conversations with people more friendly and just because I have that trait, I kind of run into people. But I've always, I've often thought about her that like have the courage.

15:26 To really sort of persevere in and get through that situation that I can't imagine how, you know that. I mean there was lots of things that probably happened to her during that time that she didn't share, because when she came back, she told her story and she wrote a book. I never read the book. But yeah, just sort of kind of always kept her image kind of under my wing because no matter what we think is happening in our world. That's really kind of crazy. There's always somebody that's kind of feeling something worse.

15:56 How about you? Do you have somebody that's an influential person for you or some of that kind of sticks in your brain?

16:06 I've met a lot of people who one time I see no more like school.

16:18 Honestly, it's crazy. I don't think I really have one that really sticks out. I'm not talk about my grandmother. But I mean that's not cheating cuz she raised me, but if I had to think of a person

16:35 I would say okay. If I used to work at would have called the BJCC arena in Birmingham, Alabama and I worked as a guest experience, team specialist. So basically I direct people where they need to go and one day I was standing out there and they were telling me, you know, you got to talk to more people cuz I kind of like then once it's all really met. This guy names that and we just started talking randomly about this job. And then how can he was like, hey, would you like for me to like blast you on LinkedIn to help? Try to get you a job? Cuz I'm complaining about going to school and not finding jobs in about 2, and I can stay like me talking to him, it really kick-started.

17:30 My journey to like land an internship and land a job in. So I'm like, he, like, like me talking to him. Help get me to get a little bit better at networking. I always hated networking. Like, I can talk to myself in a normal setting, for a professional business setting, I was intimidated. And then I was like, I have no experience. Like, I can't do anything. So what am I going to do with talking to him? It really got me to realize, everyone is a human being, and everyone has a story. And for the most part, everyone was at one point a student trying to find their place, know whoever it is. They would call it whatever person trying to find a career and so talking to him and getting to know him and really help. And then I went on from there and make other people.

18:26 Joined other organizations in during the pandemic last year. I landed two internships and want to thank you. I was like, I'll be at work whatever. We're call center. Don't ever do it. So she sold out to try again and if I clear my last year and that's when I met him in ages, kick-started everything and it worked out right now. Thank you. Cuz I used to live my brother. Oh my God, and I'm so glad I moved out of there, my brother but I live with him too long. I only had that one room. I had and see if his like condos in those really small and Facebook.

19:26 I'll let him stay condo all the time. But yeah, I'm glad. I meant that guy's back and I we stayed in contact for a little bit, but I fell out, but I just want you to know.

19:45 I don't like the getting people if they like to have some type of impact on my life.

19:51 I'm really curious. We have something in common, which I was raised for probably about three years of my Teenagers by My Grandmother cuz my mom kind of lost the plot. But so we have that in common and I think I don't think you should just count your grandmother is being somebody is of influence. I'm really curious about what that was like for you because I know what it was like for me and that I mean, in our life, experience going through is completely different. I mean, just decide from like you living in the US or Canada, you are all black gay men and I'm a white straight woman in her 50s, so it's kind of like, I don't know. I'm I'm really curious to know about what how you feel about that and how she influenced you. Because I mean, I feel like you've gone really far and on your own a lot of it, right? Yeah. So my loving grandmother got restless, all she passed away, back in 2014.

20:51 Adopted. Me and my brother was young and realize how important that was. But as I got older, really realize like she uprooted her life in, like, Ohio to come to Brooklyn and get us cuz I mother was going through her problems at the time and you know, she was the loving life for all intent and purposes is my mother like weekly she is. And then and every way a parent is a parent to you sign a permission slip and buy me clothes and you know, Christmas is getting me gifts, taking me places and of course, you know, as any child and teenager would we had the teenage angst and the weirdness of like she didn't want me to have my mother due to certain issue.

21:51 You sound like why you're blocking that but then as I got older found out everything I found out why. And so I really appreciate what she did for me and my brother. I mean, even though I feel like, you know, we're family that doesn't mean she was obligated to do that. But she still didn't like razor like my full 1823, whatever age I was when she finally passed and she just you know, who steal to me. Great virals, especially as we got older we should talk about 12. I was going back, she would explain you know me being a black person in America and living in the South. You explain the nuances of that. You know, I've had to talk with, you know, you get pulled over by the cops.

22:41 I remember when I got my first job at the library, in Montevallo, because I knew it was the library and it was a very chill place. I don't feel like I had to wear. It seems like no, you're wearing that stupid. Why you're black? You're going to outperform the kids and I went there. I was the only person to dress up in a suit Maybach. Love, that is probably why I got there. I don't know. But, you know, she just told me stuff about bad and even when I was struggling with a counting, I don't know if I want to do this and she told me I don't care how long it takes you just please graduate and get your bachelor's. She said, even if you change your degree and go to something else graduate and I was happy, I was able to do that for me and I feel like doing it for her cuz I didn't want to like get her out of Bessemer, Alabama, you know, accountants make good money, so I know I can get her in.

23:41 Living spot. I really wanted to repay her back. So yes, she's really influenced me. And all I was hard when she passed like a parent. Pretty much. My mother biological mother is in my life, but we don't have that connection and I don't feel loved her. You know, I'm always going to respect her and that she gave birth to me, but we both have the understanding. My grandmother is my mother.

24:18 I was in, I'll never forget this. I was in high school. I think I was like grade 11 English and my I had a feminist for an English teacher. Like it was kind of unheard of and she I don't know what we were reading if it was To Kill a Mockingbird or The Outsiders, but she kind of said out loud. She said it's okay to not like your parents as people and that, I remember that, like, cracked my world open cuz you can you love them for being a parent and for doing everything that they were able to do for you, but then I kind of being able to say, okay. Well if you are a person in my circle, I would necessarily be friends with you. So it's it was really it was that was kind of liberating being given that permission. It was really kind of cool.

25:03 Have any question for me or did you want to know anything more?

25:12 We have another and, you know, he'll care the Canadian Healthcare System. It's amazing. I feel so lucky because when I lived in the Caribbean and I had to go to the doctor, it was a nightmare because every every island had a clinic, but you had to pay for it, right? Cuz it was all of the currency down. There was US dollar. So I was a dive guide for a while and I bust my eardrums and I went to the clinic and they had a kind of, I don't know if the regular doctor wasn't available, but the nurse diagnosed me just was having an ear infection. And I lost part of my hearing in my left ear to give me like some polysporin drops or whatever. And I think I paid like $1,000.

26:03 But here, I've had, I have spinal stenosis and I go see my family doctor every Monday at 9. She does the trigger point injections, which relieve my pain. It's kind of like a form of acupuncture, whenever I have a problem. I can go like ever. If there is like knock on wood. I haven't caught covid or been sick, like, seriously, for the past two years. I had a hernia surgery and that was fine. Everything was covered. Its I guess the, the main difference is that if you have a problem, you don't agonize over, whether or not you should go to the hospital, cuz you might not be able to afford it. You can just go. So, I had a complication with my hernia where my right leg went into spasm. Like I couldn't even stand up. I had to take a cab to get to the hospital and it's like there was no question. Like it's something that you don't.

26:59 It's a beautiful privilege. You don't think about it. You don't think about while

27:05 $10,000 bill.

27:06 Spend my entire savings because I have a hernia, and I need to get the release, because, if you've ever had a hernia, like, it wasn't in my belly. It was where your your thigh. And your torso, me to call it in my 18, year old died at the same hernia at the same time, which was really weird. But it was, it was excruciatingly painful. And like to be able to get that fixed was a bloody Miracle. Like I've had sinus surgery. I've had rotator cuff repair. I've had my knee operated on and never once have I had to worry about and even with having joints and things like that worked on, I could say because of an artist. I'm not like a huge income earner. I've always been considered on the lower-income, the side, especially for being in Vancouver, which is I think the second most expensive city to live in, in Canada.

27:58 I live in a rent-controlled apartment though. But so I could have access to like, have having access to Physio in hospital because I was considered low-income. So I could go cuz for my rotator cuff. I went to Physio for almost a year cuz it was, it's really like when they operate on a shoulder because it's such a big joint in your body and takes a really long time to rehab it.

28:20 So I'm I feel an incredible amount of luck and privilege just because I mean I know if we pay I don't have medical insurance through a company and if I need a prescription, I have to pay for it, but you can always ask for the generic and then pay a little bit less. You know, that's the only expense that I think I would be concerned with. What is it like for you? It is the hundred percent opposite of America. Part of the benefit package, which is usually cheaper or if not, you know, the low-income people. Will they release the Affordable Care Act? So people try to go through there, but then I don't know, you know, some people say it's better to be private. I'm like me personally know, let's do it. Like Canada example, I had health insurance.

29:20 Through the Affordable Care Act. I had to let that go because the premium I was paying was not good. As far as me trying to pay my rent and unemployment stupid down here like the crazy. It worked out for me last year cuz I got sent home because of cold. Is it outside? I got it. I was getting great payment and I became one of those people. I would, please do not ask me to come back to work because I'm making more money sitting at home. I paid off collection, debt, of course, I paid off my pills and my credit score went up, and that's how I got this apartment, human thing or something, but they always think worst case scenario people taking advantage of it. I'm like, but there are people actually using it for the right reason.

30:20 Play one of them. So I'm glad it worked out for me with that. But then this year, when I try to get unemployment, how do you determine it is, you got to work the last three quarters of the year and I didn't work the last quarter. When I had a internship that ended in December and when you try to call the number, you can reach nobody like it's stupid. If I have any unemployment after my internship in it, and that's why I went to doordash and I just said, screw it. I got to provide when I go to do but I will say this as a black man in America. I'm used to shit. Not going to, I got the person. Sorry. I'm used to being you're not going my way or my people's way. I mean, I'm wearing a rubber band now black labs matter from last year was crazy and

31:11 So basically I'm saying like people are survivors.

31:18 My grandma taught me things. So, I'm not going to give up your stupid stuff down here. Like I'm literally, like another reason why I can't wait to get this job, is because of the benefits of health insurance and I can finally see a dermatologist cuz I have a skin condition and I've never been to a dermatologist when I was younger when I was under my grandmother's insurance with Medicaid. I think that's the one. I get them, confused to be honest. But you know, once I turn 18, I got kicked off of it. And then the law changed with Affordable Care Act with a key to stay on until they like 25, I was happy and mad at my dang. I miss my time but insane. I'm glad kids was still in college. If you have health insurance through their parents. I'm not one of those.

32:18 Why didn't have it? So screw everybody else to do or like when they can we talk about getting rid of student loan debt. If so, do the people that paid it off, like, I see why they mad right now. Do you realize how much money you paid it over here? That probably prevented you from doing other things you want to do in life, but you had to pay the big bills to the gutter. I would love for them. You can't believe they don't have to cancel all my accounts, a half of it.

32:52 Be successful in that cuz I know it's one of his. It's what he wants to do, right? As part of what he ran on forgiving that debt. Yes, part of me. Feel like he's either not going to be like he, maybe just said that to get the window. Like, I feel like with this last election. It really was born about beating Trump and make sure he doesn't stay in office. Then actually, as a Democratic president. Here's my plan, to, like better the world. I feel like they just hit the high points through with that would get a lot of us to vote. And, you know, a lot of young Millennial gen Z, people who care about, none of us wants to be alone. So course, I'm going to be, like, with the politics. I feel like they're just getting in. Just to say I've got in some of these promises are not coming through. I mean, I'm still glad something's gone. I did not and it was crazy. I am going to the election party.

33:52 Who's going to win? Hillary is not going to win. I bought it with her, but she is not going to win cuz she's a robot and I was like, I don't think she's going to make it in Trump really like in power his base and the people that believe what he believed to vote and they came out of Baltimore and went through four years of the whole world.

34:22 But there's this. So I have to ask you a question because I

34:30 As I explained like on the East Coast having black people is, in my sister married, a black man. Like it was its comment like it's it's kind of like nobody was really.

34:41 You didn't stand out, like, you kind of everybody was kind of like, part of the community together. That's not to say that there wasn't racism or any kind of problem like that, that truly exist. I'm not whitewashing that at all. But out here in Vancouver. I wish you could see it because I always, I have such a strong. I want to ask when I see a black man. I dated one for like a minute and I asked him but he didn't have an answer cuz I don't think he ever thought about it cuz he was, he came from a really privileged family, but what it's like to be here in Vancouver in a very white and Asian like it's 60% Asian 40% Caucasian and then sprinkling a little bit in there with there are some black people and I want to know so badly. What it's like for them because there's no like I often think about like Michelle Obama's thing that she said about, you can't be what you can't see. Like if I didn't, I can't imagine what it would be like to be in a world where I didn't see other people.

35:41 Like me, I mean like 8 cuz you have no relation and then we didn't go through black lives matter the same way that the US did. But we're there was definitely marches here. Like I went and there's definitely a local movement, but I don't know how it feels to be so isolated. Like I just can't and I want to ask so bad, but I I don't know if it's ever going to if I'll ever get the courage because I also don't want to be offensive in that question, but I can't imagine how that feels. So what it's like to be a black person in like, as Celtics, huge minority like there's nobody like I mean if there's a black man on the bus and the bus is full. He might be the only black person on their, there might be some people

36:33 From India, or Pakistan, or a brownie but like that for me is different. Right? Like that's a different situation. So, I just, I want to ask them what it feels like to be so isolated. I just so curious cuz I can't I think that would feel terrible for me.

36:52 I would say, it's

36:56 There's the moment you feel like an outsider like a going to a college classroom. I will tell you I believe all black to do this when you go to college and go to any area will you know, you're like it's not that many of you you're going to look around and count. Okay, it's like three of us in here. Okay, o v. Start a new job. You going to find that work here? Cuz sometimes it can be a little off-putting. We're like you get those companies in. Like yeah, we all about the first three diversity and you look at the board and it like, all these white guy hasn't made like, the one white woman like a one black, but it's for me. I hate more of like, to microaggression stuff. Do you know what a microaggression is? I feel like that's worse than over racism, because some white person.

37:56 Okay, I can clearly see. This person is racing. Let me stay awake. But when is microaggression people will say things that they don't think is coming off his race, but then you catch it and you're left with a thought. Like that, that just happened. Should I say something or, wait? I'm going to cause a problem. If I say something to the black person's going to say, so I can give you an example of one of my friends in college. I used to go to church with his family and we went this one time and we will go to lunch afterwards. So it's all white family and it is me another boy, that's from, he actually African from Nigeria. And then there was a woman there from Nicaragua and the three of us happen to be sitting at this table together. And the father makes this joke. He tells the joke where he went to Panama is the the local said your, your family is like pale has no color.

38:56 And then he looked at the three of us at this table, and he said, I guess y'all are my color people tables. And I don't like,

39:06 That just happened what the something? But I swear he looked at me understanding for some reason. Nicaragua evening over her head and she didn't catch it. I said, okay, this happened. I'm in the middle of nowhere cuz they live like way out from Montevallo. Album school that I have. No car goes to black people here. And I think when the any situation ain't got no car and I want to say something but I ain't trying to cause no problems and then I end up missing. So I just went outside and I just sat by myself and I never told my friend that story cuz I mean, that's your father. So is like if you really going to take I don't know. At the time, I'm thinking it's going to take my side or you going to be like when you talk about and then that's going to cause problems between us, but it's like

40:06 Like that Walmart. Oh my God, you just don't get it. I wish you could understand and it's like those hurt more, like, in in like Lakota phrase languages. Like I see it everywhere all day. Like, it can happen on our commute to work like anything, but we have to pretend none of that happened and then coming to work and do. I've been at work made me say something. You don't want to lose your job. So it's just make it hard to be a black person in America. And then, you know, growing up. You see movies with Jordan people, white that they get the one black hair. He got killed Old. Oh, he's a, he's playing a gangster Thug. Drug dealer, something terrible.

41:06 If you do like, you see it everywhere and have to live with that. Like I mean, I've been stopped by the cops before they call it a WWE walking while black. I've had that happen to me. I literally got the cop just pulled me over. Like, where you going. Where you coming from?

41:24 School. The sub Student Union building, like I'm giving him every answer. I can give them, he still wouldn't believe me. And then finally, he said you're not the guy I'm looking for and drove off and I was like, I just got profile while I had the craziness that. And then black lives matter happen. What was the George, Floyd the murder of George Floyd? I ain't you saw the video and I wish I didn't. And then I was trying to study for the CPA exam and I'm in the study group and there were moments where some black other black CPA Canandaigua post. I would love to study but it's just so hard. I can't do it because of what's going on. So every nun black person is telling them, you know, you got to push or pull up and I'm sitting there reading all this, like, don't get it for you to say that you just don't get it.

42:17 I mean so it's hard but we do that good stuff come out of it. You know, what culture is amazing. America would be the music room in Cologne. You know, I can't imagine, I just know. I mean, I honestly I mean obviously I physically will never be a black person or a black male. So I will never know and I can't ever even imagined to know what that would feel like.

43:03 There's a herd of doctor car. He's on, if you go on YouTube and Google him. He does this these one or two our long lectures on. He's a professor at Howard Howard University and he goes, he gets interviewed by this radio personality or first name is Karen. I can't remember her last name, but ever since everything is happened with George Floyd. I'll listen to them every Saturday to kind of to try to open my world up more, to realize my footage to understand, maybe a little bit more, what it would be like to be in your world, but I don't know that white people ever will like, I know. And that's why I have such curiosity because I'm a person who is empathetic. I'm a loving caring person and I can't imagine

43:54 Having an experience like that, just because of a physical feature. Like, it's just that horrifies me very brave.

44:05 Thank you.

44:13 But yeah, I know it's rough out here, we shall overcome. I was thinking that famous phrase from the Civil Rights Movement. The matter would help me, you know, keep my head up and just try to take it one day at a time.

44:34 But one minute the closing statement for final thoughts. I have loved this conversation. I feel like both but have to revolve around what we can while we can go for days. Talking, like 45 minute time limit. I would love to stay in contact with you.

45:05 I would love that.

45:06 Warriors.

45:11 Oh, yeah. Hello Bella.

45:41 I don't know.