Samuel Wilson and Pauline Mansfield

Recorded August 31, 2013 Archived September 5, 2013 46:53 minutes
0:00 / 0:00
Id: atd000970

Description

"Life Story of Sam Wilson, Jr."

Participants

  • Samuel Wilson
  • Pauline Mansfield

Recording Locations

Public Broadcasting Atlanta

Venue / Recording Kit

Partnership Type

Outreach

Initiatives

Keywords

Subjects


Transcript

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00:01 My name is Pauline Mansfield. I'm 66 years old and today is August 31st 2013. We are in College Park, Georgia. Family reunions, and I'm having a conversation with my cousin Sam Wilson Junior.

00:22 Hi, I'm Samuel Wilson jr. I'm 46 years old and I'm a Libra born in Harlem raised in the Bronx New York. I was born in October 18th 1966. I am the son of the late Samuel Wilson senior and Aura Irene Thomas Wilson coy.

00:50 I can tell you that my parents were divorced around 1969 or 1970.

00:59 And relationship. I'm the cousin of Pauline, Mansfield.

01:10 Sam, you know as we've been here at all Middleton reunions are in College Park this weekend.

01:20 We have talked about a lot about family and how much we love family and we talked a lot about the fact that you keep in touch with so many family members across the country on a regular basis. What is it that makes you so

01:39 Push to do that

01:43 Well, I can tell you is coming for my upbringing, you know, it's I got it for my mother and every time when I get like birthday cards from my paternal grandmother Sadie Wilson, she always smells me birthday cards and holiday cards, and she'll send me a monetary gift. So when my mom always tells me when someone sends you a birthday or any holiday card you call and say, thank you.

02:20 Because that's what family does when someone sends you something in the mail and they never forget your birthday or birth date. You always have to say thank you either call them on the phone some of thank you note and saying thank you and that's how I was taught on my mother's side of the family. See I come from like family values.

02:46 We will taught in our family, you know by helping each other looking out for each other and always make sure that everything is intact.

02:58 I think I got my upbringing, you know, like from my grandmother my late grandmother. She was always not only sends out birthday cards to family members, but you always brings camera with her. She will bring like a 126 of old-fashioned 126 camera and she always carried around with her and she will look down in a little camera screen that she will hunt that little red. And we see them spots coming out and when I see all the photo albums that my grandmother took she like five or six photo albums. I will look into the photo albums. I see all families on my mom's side of the family. She was a Thomas the polls family who married a Wilson which was my father is Samuel Wilson senior.

03:59 They will all come you know his relatives with family that's on Catherine's mother's relatives. They will come up for like the holiday not just only for the holiday, but for the baby christening my older my oldest sister wall Trina and I will both christened at the Mount Calvary United Methodist Church. That was my grandmother's church. So then everybody will come up and see us getting christened or Baby dedicated. It was my parents and along with my maternal and paternal on my maternal grandparents my godfather and all other relatives.

04:47 So after the dedication, we will all be at my parents house on 139th Street between 5th and Lenox. We lived in the apartment complex called The delanoy Village which is now called Savoy Village and all of our relatives on both sides of the family with a Volvo, you know have Fellowship we laugh we mingle you don't we get to know each other all of it? Because I look through those pictures. I look back and I see my paternal grandmother my maternal grandparents. My mom my aunts. My my uncles were alive at that time. They would all come and see my oldest sister wall Trina and myself for all holiday greetings and things like that.

05:43 What is it that?

05:46 You will first of all who was the relative that you keep in touch with the most?

05:54 I usually keep in touch with the most says I should say my aunt Catherine.

06:01 Cuz after when my grandmother died in 1983, then she will pick up where my grandmother left off. So she would send me birthdays in holiday cards and select cuz like I said, we keep it in the family and that's family values and she too will send me of monetary gift and I will call for the next day and I say thank you for the card and a monetary gift, but I get in the mailbox. So, you know the thing in your life that makes you most happy.

06:37 What makes me happy?

06:41 Makes me happy is you know keeping in touch with the family.

06:50 Most most mostly I keep in touch with the family on my late father side as well as my mom's cuz

07:02 Keeping in touch making sure I say hi. How you doing? Is there anything I can do or is this something that you need? Cuz when my mom usually calls me and said need something, you know pick it up for me and I will reimburse you.

07:23 And what keeps the family together, you know that's communication and making sure that we do the right thing.

07:36 And making sure what Mom that tells me to do. You know, I always be committed. That's the most important word commitment and I was taught not only on you know, I my family but also in church as well as being a church Deacon you have to be committed.

07:58 How are you? Do you know how we're related to each other Sammy?

08:04 I think my aunt Katherine has shared something with me back in 2002. And when I was visiting my aunt my aunt Catherine's relatives on her mother's side of the family back in October of 2002 on my birthday vacation. She was picking me up to spend time with her in Crisfield and she was sharing with me that she went to the Milton reunions and she was sharing with me that your cousin is a Tuskegee Airmen.

08:39 And I was shocked to find out so I keep thinking to myself, you know being related to someone who's famous.

08:50 And I can say like down to the years that my mom takes me to the library. You know, I read some books, you know, you know, she forced me to look at roots and everything.

09:09 Well, I learned that the next scene all the stars, you know playing and you know, reacting history and everything, I didn't see the whole chapters of the series.

09:27 I just saw a couple of chapters.

09:37 First at first when I was little I said nothing to happen, but as I've gotten older and when I went to the black and white Milton family reunions 2006 when I see both sides black and white and I said to myself I see something white rose that they know my name. Is it like is this for real? I keep saying myself. They know my name. I was like, oh, oh I was like, I knew something was going to happen. So they related to us.

10:13 There they just carry the same last name. Is that right? Yes.

10:19 Do you feel like they're Kim?

10:23 I don't know if they like Ken but to me, but to me I'm saying it personally but it's like family to me. I don't care if you're black or white, but I'm family to everybody on both sides great-grandfather.

10:43 That I did not know and Middleton is my great-grandfather and he's also your great-grandfather. And the reason why that is is because your grandmother was Evelyn Middleton, correct? Your father was Abram Middleton. So that makes him your great-great-grandfather now on my side of the family my grandmother Julia Mariah Wright.

11:21 What's the daughter of Abraham Middleton?

11:27 Abram Middleton

11:30 So where are we are cousins? I don't know whether we're second cousin third cousin second cousin once removed. I have no idea yet, but we're cousins because we share a great-grandfather and that's our common Bond.

11:48 So we're from the same Branch the Abram Middleton branch of the Middleton family tree. So we will always be connected. If you have children your children will be connected to my children and all down the line because of that one answer stir way back in 1827 when he was born, you know, so he made it possible for us to be actually we exist because he lifts which is really a beautiful thing. But I wanted to switch up on you a little bit you have at you. You said you work for the radio station for a few years. That's a really interesting job. What did you do?

12:38 I want a radio station up in New Rochelle New York. It's it's like a community radio station. It's the call letters is wvox AM radio in New Rochelle New York. I worked on the weekend shift. I work on the Sunday shift from 4 p.m. Until 1 in the morning. Not only I was the radio DJ which I was from 5:30 until 9 p.m. Sign of time, but it was also a technical director for one of the Heritage black time program what it means like programs, you know, probably saying that their communities their Heritage for the Irish program of the Irish, she'll also for the church news, which is a church news kind of like news regular news that has announcements from different churches.

13:36 I was also the technical director for the indo-caribbean program, which is like Indian and Caribbean, you know the same like East Indies, you know Caribbean music as well as the Caribbean programs.

13:51 I was there open till 1 in the morning cuz I did like different programs and different shifts.

14:00 It was Heritage programs the community radio station that worth it was all mix it was integrated with music and talking information.

14:18 So that's my shift was.

14:22 How did you get to be?

14:25 Is super DJ.

14:31 Must be because of my because of my voice growing up and I was little you know, you know what they want to read Because I will know that the kids will be laughing at me because of my voice or anything like my voice was strange either was deep or some other how I don't know but as I got older and learning to read and my voice it was like

15:05 Something that I was talented with. I don't know. I'll tell you that or you always felt that someone had told me that I have a good voice. Thank you.

15:18 And

15:21 And doing getting into radio cuz growing up doing real was wasn't happy. What was going on in radio back in the 80s when it starts changing and everything and I was staying with my dad and my stepmother and my cousin's my dad was Samuel Wilson senior and I was staying at my cousin's house after my grandmother's funeral Junior Govan.

15:55 You stay with your new go bad just for the Mother's Day weekend back in 1983 van and I grew up in houses that were next door to each other all of my life. We had a driveway that separated our houses his father.

16:20 Was my mother's brother.

16:23 So he was my first cousin, but we were so close we grew up like brothers and sisters. I didn't know you ever stayed with Junior Govan. When was that? This was on the Mother's Day weekend of 1983.

16:41 And and what was the occasion? Why did you stay with him? This was from my grandmother's funeral. She was buried in Fort Washington, Maryland, and she belonged to Grace United Methodist Church.

16:59 I did not know that because when I got the obituaries ma, my grandmother's funeral and I saw the information that she was born in Maryland because Me growing up I thought she was born in New York because I never asked my grandmother if she was born in New York or Maryland, so I was just keep silent and don't say anything. I don't want to say anything.

17:31 Anything for private oil say anything stupid cuz I'm known for that saying the wrong thing.

17:42 Yes, I do. You remember most about him he was tall.

17:49 6 foot 1 tall somewhat like my grandfather, but I can tell you that my cousin is that I'm meeting for the first time.

18:10 And when my grandmother was alive my grandmother and my aunt Catherine alone with Margo and Donna they surprised me with a surprise visit to Fort Washington Maryland. Cuz at first I thought we were going to someplace else. We're going to Kings Dominion Richmond. They gave me a surprise visit that I got a chance to meet all of my aunts all the culverts my aunts. Novela Leola Sheila and Isabel and all of the cousins at my age that was there. So I got a chance to see like everybody.

18:57 And then it was more common in the near future life happy and Rich. I don't mean rich in the sense of money. But rich in the sense of justice.

19:12 Having good. Come to you. What what makes your life happy and Rich?

19:20 Think happy is coming from the heart.

19:26 Just happy from the heart.

19:31 And reason why I'm saying that is dumb very happy, you know where I am right now.

19:39 You know, I mean in terms of where you live on your job or where I live and and also on my job I can tell you that on my mom's side of the family that I had a cousin who was the first black to be hired at CVS. His name is Ernest Bowles and he's a Thomas Bowles that's on my mom's side. That's my mother's father's side of the family.

20:16 And when I graduated from trade school back in 87, just see you later. 88. My mama said you should you should go down and fill out an application for CBS and

20:33 And why you doing at school down to UPS don't have a vacation for that as well. So my mom always says don't fill out one thing. You should fill out as many applications as you can because you never know who's going to hire you either one of them. So my mom always says always try to fill out of all the applicants as much as you can because

21:01 Where she was coming up? She was always have to say you got to struggle real hard because coming from her family and on in Virginia and coming to New York. She had to go to that struggle through the Civil Rights Movement racism and everything. She had to go through pictures at work.

21:29 I never had any mentors at work when I first came to CVS as a regular employee in 1989.

21:39 I was just going around delivering packages cuz I was a messenger when I first came to CBS working as a messenger dropping off packages to every Department one for the TV department and one for the records department, cuz the network had records. It was just TV radio and record.

22:04 When I got into radio the radio Dept, that's when I got a chance to see what radio was like, I find it fascinating to see the person the person behind the voice and what matches that person or persons he or she that either what is the news on music? So I got a chance to reporters on on News Radio 880 at CVS, but also their sister station on FM 101.1. They play oldies.

22:47 Sammy you're very active in social media Facebook being one of your favorite things to do. Are you on Facebook every day? Yes. I'm on Facebook every day. And do you feel that helps to

23:05 To bridge some kind of connection with family. Why do you what do you what do you do most on Facebook day is it to chat with family?

23:15 Yes to chat with family and to share with family. But let me tell you how I got into it. It was my classmates from Truman High School. They're going to take out me hook to Facebook. So I just want to know what was what was Facebook. What is Facebook?

23:37 Do you still stay in touch with your classmates? I still stay in touch with my classmates both Truman High School and is 144 junior high school. So sanfl is stands for intermediate school or another school or Junior High School.

24:01 What school did you attend?

24:04 I had attended private school down in Manhattan on The Gramercy Park section. It was called the Stuyvesant school. It was a private school. It was like inside of a brownstone building on East 19th Street off of Irving Place between Irving Place and Park Avenue South. I went to high school at truman high school in the Bronx New York from 1981 to 1985.

24:41 And I graduated in 1985.

24:45 Now I know that busted Wilson is your

24:50 Grandfather no. Yes.

24:56 I got a chance to meet my grandfather back in 19. I think it was 82 the first Wilson family reunions that took place back in 1982, but it started in Queens New York in the Rosedale Village section and my grandmother my paternal grandmother told me about this family reunions, which would take place on Memorial Day weekend in 1982. So I got a chance to go and me and Granny and Aunt Catherine Markle and Donna and Aunt Catherine II husband and we got a chance to go to the family reunions first. We start up. We went to church First Baptist Church in Queens. That's how I got a chance to meet my great-uncle.

25:56 Anthony Wilson I remember Anthony

26:01 As well as my great aunt Lillian and her daughter Olga and Allie and a few other relatives.

26:12 All of my aunts. Novella and Leola they told me I look like a Uncle Joe my late Uncle Joe cuz I was yes, I'm tall like Uncle Joe 6 with 1 and every October when I go see my aunt they call me Joe cuz I look like my Uncle Joe so I was trying to figure out you know, I want to know what really happened to my Uncle Joe cuz when I spoke to Olga when she came down for a visit, she didn't end the family reunions. She was visiting one of her classmates. I want to know what really happened to him. Cuz I heard from one side that the other was trying to get him up to stay in Canada for a while while Vietnam was still at War.

27:11 And you know, she she told me that he was playing with Russian Roulette and you know saying that the casket wasn't open for the funeral and everything it it was hard to talk about it, but I really want to know the truth about it or what really happened to Uncle Joe & Ness would really happen about being in the Middleton family.

27:38 The best part of being in the Middleton family is that I come from a family that had Talent.

27:48 That made contributions to this country.

27:52 Being a cousin of a relative this from the ministry the media education and politics.

28:03 And being from the media working for the media as well as being a church Deacon the ministry as a Sunday school teacher education and getting involved in politics. We had a guest at my church Community Protestant church. That's the church. I belong to in the Bronx. We had a guest that came by two years ago talking about the living wage bill.

28:35 And I want to know more about it because I look around I see employees that bringing home a little bit of money. But as you work in the field, but coming home living in poorest conditions that make you sick.

28:54 And I think I got that from my mom because she was in the local union 1199. She was in Jacobi Hospital and recently back in the seventies. They were on Hospital strikes a nurse. She wants an X-ray tech. She worked at Jacobi Hospital in the Bronx from 1972 until she retired in 2005.

29:19 Before Jacoby she had once worked at Lincoln Hospital the old Lincoln Hospital off of Buckner and Southern Boulevard in the Bronx and then before that she was at Coney Island Hospital in Brooklyn. So she have to travel all the way out to Brooklyn. She didn't like long commute. She like to be like in one place close to home of the New York.

29:45 I was born in Harlem from 1966 at Santiam hospital until 1969 when my parents were divorced. So then my mom and my oldest sister wall Trina, we moved to the Bronx cuz that's where my mom had lived at in the Bronx, you know moving from Virginia. She had lived on East 168th Street between Fulton and 3rd Avenue right by the old 3rd Avenue L and her sister my maternal aunt and her brother my uncle and they had a dog so and my godparents they live two flights of stairs.

30:29 So it was kind of like a like I said earlier Family Values. So you have to make sure you keep it in the family and make sure that you take care of some things that you were taught to do and be committed.

30:46 What makes me happy is?

30:50 Being a family that that keeps in touch.

30:55 And I can say that keeping in touch with family and sometimes you know, New Jersey call my mom will see the time but if something comes up like something I have to go to like a family reunions or a Akai chance to keep in touch with her maternal relatives. I will let her know that you know, I got a chance to visit or if I'm visiting.

31:24 If I'm visiting new relatives the middletons and Wilson's, you know, I will let her know that I'm getting ready to go and meet a new relative whether it's in Brooklyn or queens or somewhere up in the Bronx next to her.

31:41 I will let her know cuz most of the time you know, she will always get worried all the time.

31:53 Family, you have an incredible memory for detail at how do you do that? I mean you remember Day to Remember streets you remember people's name is is that some kind of special gift. I just want to share this this was back in 1980 when my mom and my little sister from the second marriage and my mom got remarried to a new husband who's Jamaican from Jamaica and they gave birth to a little sister. That's from the second marriage daughter from a different marriage cuz my mom got remarried to a different husband and

32:48 From the second marriage. Okay, her name is Erica from the second marriage my mom gave birth to a new daughter. She still lives.

33:00 And the she too has two daughters. So I'm an uncle of two nieces now back to the question that you was asking earlier. Just looking through the drawers that cuz we move around different places in the Bronx and lo and behold I saw my birth certificate.

33:22 This was something that was never talked about and I see my birth certificate. I saw my name and my late father's name and my mother's name and it have where you was born my birthday, October 18th in the year 1966 in the hospital side of ham hospital, and it said we were born in New York City, New York.

33:51 So that's how I remember of my birth certificate cuz it wasn't shared.

33:57 So once I found my birth certificate it was something that was never shared or never talked about.

34:04 Cuz it was an old saying they want cable for protection.

34:08 Something on the birth certificate that surprised you it was something on there that surprise me.

34:15 That I lived on 139th Street between 5th and Lenox.

34:23 On the 5th floor, and I said that's where I would lived at on across the street from where my grandmother has lived at because she live in The Brownstone across the street the building that my grandmother lived on there was only four floors. The the apartment that I lived on was only five or six floors. So I left it at birth certificate. It was like I was like, no one ever tells me anything.

34:55 But as I've gotten older than I would know who I was. I feel like I know who I am now.

35:05 And everything cuz when will my 10th birthday came up my mom at ask me? When is your birthday October 18th uses the year I put the wrong year because I never I keep forgetting the year. And my mom said you were born on October 18th 1966 and you gain to be 10 years old. So you have to remember the month the date and the year because if you don't remember or can't remember the month that you were born the date and the year you don't get no birthday gift.

35:44 You don't get no birthday party know nothing until you start remembering the day that you were born and where you lived at cuz this was back in 1976. I was in the third grade. I got left back. So then my mom and my stepfather I pulled me out of private school and put me in the public school in the Bronx and Co-op City.

36:07 So that's how you start learning what to do and start getting smart and getting today's don't bring home season things cuz I was a good kid in school. He was a good student. I was a good student, but I just had a reading and math problem is you like pronouncing words hard to pronounce words.

36:31 So have you overcome then? I overcome that. You know, it's not just the reading was also math cuz I'm bad at work problems is like it's something that's so and so go to the store and buy a box of soap powder for that was 75 how much change should get back? So I'm not that good at doing word problems. You be up like talking about just doing word problem. So I'm bad at that know what your passions are you love me is Dick you love DJ

37:04 What do you do?

37:08 When you're not doing that, I don't mean work. I mean just I know your daddy. Can you use you a renaissance man? Sammy you have lots of things going on. What would surprise us that you do your family your your Middleton family surprises we go. Oh my God.

37:28 Would that be the one thing that I have did before I was doing it I was doing some little artwork.

37:40 Cuz me growing up. I learn how to paint, you know, if I see something imaginative if I see a train rolling by I would paint.

37:50 Draw a picture of a subway car not in a while. But you know if I feel like doing something if I look for a family member, you know, I would ask them. Do you have a picture of that? Not only drawer that but I can do like a collage I will cut up a picture from an old picture. I will take it to Kinko's and I will cut up a picture and I will get a bristol board. I would get glue and I would try to pay stub some of the family members.

38:27 Bristol board is like an artboard that I get from the Art Shop cuz after I graduated from Truman, I went to Center for the media arts. What is the I don't know what the center for the media arts is what is that? Exactly? It's a trade school that I went to it's no longer there but it was there back in the eighties. When I graduated from Truman My First Choice was radio broadcasting, but I got turned down by the first choice. So the least the second one was Art and Design.

39:04 So that was my grandmother have given me give me a piece of paper and pencil just Draw Something Draw Something. I will think of billboards go to a picture of billboards that I see on the highway or something off of a subway bus. I will do that and you still do that. I don't usually do that anymore because I'm doing some other things.

39:34 But when I came back from visiting my maternal relatives, I should see my family every time I see a relative. I'm meeting for the first time. You know, I will get a chance to know that person so I would ask my cousins. Do you have a picture of someone so all my uncles that I didn't meet?

40:02 So I would know I would ask my cousins who were my uncles were cuz all my uncles were gone too soon. So I will get a picture and when I get home, I will do like a collage and I will create it on Facebook. I will call it the cold with family website. Let's keep in touch.

40:26 How do you say I know you going to actually do that? Yes, cousin Alva left off when she did the Milton family website and one of my other younger cousins cousins born that the Wilson to expand website. I said to myself. I want to learn how to create a website for myself. So I said I want to do the Cobra family website on Facebook. So I will get all the collages all the pictures all of the aunts all of the cousins and my mom because she was a cousin-in-law to the Cobra family.

41:10 Back in 2010 or 2011 to 2010. So I started that.

41:19 I noticed you travel a whole lot to Sammy going to various reunions and

41:26 Is it mostly for pleasure is or is it to stay in touch with family?

41:31 I would say both.

41:34 And to meeting relatives and to seeing different cities that I didn't went before them for history. Yes, cuz me Ben the shoe want to go.

41:49 You see well.

41:53 I've been to cities. I've been the Detroit.

41:58 When I think of the traffic up Motown, I've been to Philly when I think I feel I think of Gamble and huff and the movie and the movie Rocky and Trading Places. I went to Boston and I went to DC. That's why I go to okay. I haven't been to Charlotte yet.

42:21 Cuz everytime I be on the Greyhound bus I see shall I see it city with big buildings tall buildings?

42:36 Well, I guess by my train of thought was that you need to try new things, but you're trying new things all the time.

42:43 Yeah, trying new things all the time. If it's family, I will go with new things. If it's not family, then I wouldn't go that I'll probably wait until whoever relative that I meet for the first time then I will go you know that you made it out family reunions this year. It was new to you.

43:06 The most important person that I met for the first time was cousin Phyllis Jackson from Los Angeles, and she wants worked at NBC.

43:20 And when I thought about I thought you was working at the NBC affiliate in Raleigh, North Carolina. Burbank, California. Cuz when my late Cousin Connie was asking me that the we have someone to CBS I said, hello that NBC.

43:44 Cuz we have

43:47 When I found out that I have a cousin both were going to NBC for Milton and Wilson's I keep thinking about cousin Phyllis and when I looked at the profile on her and I see that she was in the Children's Program in the apartment. I see a picture of the Smurfs and all the other cartoon shows that I I'd rather watch it on Saturday mornings, and I said to myself when I'm watching all the shows when I was little watching all the old school cartoon shows on NBC like the gold show or Land of the Lost or

44:23 Gary Coleman on mr. T or the Snorks that my little sister Erica be watching I said I have to meet fellows.

44:33 And

44:35 I want to get

44:40 I want to meet Phyllis because I want to get advice from her because being a CVS employee, you know, I want to find out what to do when I'm working the mail Department because we have new people that have liked being on the internet and getting packages need to get out ASAP and wanted to find out more and how to show respect for the employee or employers and everything cuz most of the time you have to say to yourself. Sometimes I got to deal with these people or employees because either they want something ASAP.

45:27 What are they black or white or any other minority they want something going out fast as they can because being in the opposition in that field that is very stressful and you got to be at the top. So I always wanted to ask Phyllis. How can I get what to do at CVS with my employees in the mail Department? Because I have two employees one white one black and they are older than me and they've been at CVS longer than me and I have to train them what to use the computer how to take calls how to get the information get you know, what's the names of the room numbers their extensions what Pakistani supposed to destinations? I usually tell my ass.

46:19 Wasn't who's it going to and the phone numbers and in case if they step out we need a back-up plan and everything. So I have to tell my guys is very important. So in case if I'm out sick or death in the family will jury duty. Make sure that they know, you know ahead of time if it's the old saying they never took the time. Well, this has been wonderful doing the interview and I thank you very much for doing it. Thank you very much.