Christopher Perlera and Laura Toro

00:05 My name is Laura. I am 37 years old today is August 17th, 2013. I am in Atlanta Georgia and I am interviewing Chris bed late and I met Chris through my work at the layout the Georgia Association of Latino elected officials.

00:27 And my name is Christopher perlera. I'm 27 years old today is

00:35 August 17th 2013. We are at the Atlanta History Center and loaded oil is a friend colleague NPR from Vallejo.

00:45 Okay, Chris. What do you consider yourself? A Puerto Rican where it where are you from? I give a freelancer. I consider myself Salvadoran even though I was not born in El Salvador. Although I do hold Salvadoran citizenship because I think the way the law works as long as you have to Salvadoran parents, you have the opportunity to go in and formal you ask for citizenship for your children. Although my situation is a little bit more unique just because the Civil War caused a lot of the city Hall's of the time in the 1980s to be burnt down and it just so happened to be right around the time that I was born was right During the Reconstruction of both my parents home town for the head last lived before coming to the states. And so I was formally written down in the records of both of their towns. So technically I have to Salvadoran identities one that's scratched and pain.

01:45 Out there in the void in addition to my formal Salvadoran identity and my u.s. Citizenship.

01:54 Okay, and what did your parents have to do in order to for you to get your Salvadoran citizenship? I think it was around around my my 14th or 15th birthday trip. They took to El Salvador with just my brother and I say behind that they went through the formal process of visiting the government buildings and their cities to ask for a copy of the official birth record on file and talk to their contacts at the embassy and so in my in my personal files where I keep my birth certificate and Social Security card, I have copies of these letters written in Spanish and stamped and sealed with the official seal of and the notary saying that you know, I am officially a Salvadoran Citizen and these are my parents and I was born on this day in the city of El Salvador, even though that's not quite exactly that you were born and where

02:54 And Boston Massachusetts in the Boston Children's Hospital. Okay. And what year was that? Can you help me with my math picture? I was born in 1985. Okay around what month November 9th 11 something p.m. Okay. Okay, I'm November 16th a little bit earlier than your year what you mentioned some documents written in Spanish that you have. How important is Spanish to the language? Absolutely being a

03:33 A u.s. Born Latin American

03:37 Having being a in the a child of an immigrant family with another culture on another identity language to me has always been the fulcrum around which my my my my real identity lies behind especially given the circumstances of my education early on in life. I was very very fortunate in participating in a bilingual immersion program called The Amigos program in Cambridge, Massachusetts and every single week, we would go back and forth between English and Spanish going for with the exact same curriculum as in the only difference was a change in the language and I through 7th grade up until I move to Georgia, which was a whole different and very drastic change. I did that for kindergarten through 7th grade.

04:29 And I didn't pick that habit of studying and functioning in a regular basis in Spanish to English until I got to college again and decided to go into Linguistics and history and participate in the Hispanic Student Association, but it is incredibly important to me and it's something that I plan to have a keen focus on with my children and even with my friends children as you get older and you're in your married Friends start having children, I always joke around I tell him hey if you would like your child to learn Spanish, I'll make you that promise or whenever I hang out with you and your kids are on I will only speak to them in Spanish and they're going that would be amazing in it. It makes me feel good that I can I can give them that that that benefit not Services because it's something that's very important to me personally.

05:15 That's excellent. Excellent with what would language. Did you speak in your home with your parents? And you mentioned you have a brother or brother? Yes both because my mother although she speaks English just fine. She's always had a heavy accent in trouble vocabulary. So I always speak Spanish to her no matter what but for as long as I can remember, I've always spoken English to my father and he speaks English just as well as I do even though he showed up at the age of 18 or 17 and he just has a knack for language and he'll he has a Wandering accent in Spanish. She just sounds like whoever he's talking to the same for English and people look at him when he's when they ask him. What's your name is like well, my name is Jose while I do about it later and they're like, that's not your name. You're lying to me. Tell me your real name and my name is Jose. They don't believe him.

06:09 Just cuz he doesn't need light skin tall. It's a bit incredulous. You're preaching to the choir here. So how old were your parents when they came here they come together or did they come separately and then meet over here separately they knew each other and I think there was some kind of small crush between them a little bit of a star-crossed lovers kind of story. Although there. They never really got into it with me. But I knew they had met their families were real Loosely acquainted in El Salvador El Salvador not being a very large place and then my father came over I want to say he came over with some kind of family Visa, you know, those ridiculously complicated as we will know and I think you sponsored by my great uncle his uncle on the on his

07:03 Mother's side father side. I can't remember but he was this Uncle of his great uncle of mine was one of the very first if not be first family member we had in the states and he kind of started the whole migration process my dad's side and my mother my mother had a much more difficult story. In fact that I do remember now, my mother is one of the many countless people that crossed me over the border the hard way not on the plane not in the car not with any kind of documents and it was only through luck of where she was coming from and political climate and having family connections that and of course getting married to somebody who is already in the process that she was able to get a quick path to citizenship for residency and citizenship, but she had a very troubling Story one that I'll never forget because it's involves a family member. We're no longer really close to me all that kind of drama happens and schisms occur, but this purse

08:03 That I used to consider like an aunt that you are one of those some of those friends is very close. I remember a story of the of the coyote that was that was trafficking you my mother. And in this in this you're very close family friend essentially trying to take advantage of them sexually and but this woman was she's she's a very strong woman and she's definitely the type of person that can take care of herself. She always has been I've ever known as anything else definitely not Meek fact the opposite and from what I'm told that this woman was the pretty much the make the only reason to my mother did not get raped along the way to the states Yeah, you mentioned that you were born in Boston and you were there until 7th grade.

08:58 How do you how do you get the how did your parents make it to Boston by Boston was Boston and then Cambridge, but it's all about family go to where you having the strongest connections and we have a huge family presents in the New England area that that time definitely Boston. The only people if they knew they could live with because a family in transition a any immigrant story. You're always going to be learnt hear about that. First person that got there is basically the halfway house and you show up and you spend a couple months a year you get on your feet and you repeat the process all over again. So that's why they ended up in in in Boston and staying with that Uncle and I think my mother, you know analogous stay with an aunt.

09:46 And

09:48 It just continued on from there the both of them being the oldest sibling the oldest children on his side of the family. So they then they were the pioneer of their their their siblings as they came to the states. What brought your family to, Georgia?

10:04 The Georgia it's much less of an immigrant story more of the classic Northeastern coming to the South Northeastern are coming to the South just the cost of living the general expenses that you have in comparison in my my family. They tell me that they they also had a very keen interest in giving me and my brother a much more wholesome environment.

10:30 It's Georgia, which is where I spent my my formative years between 12 and 21 is a pretty safe place. Very safe. Very wholesome. It's got its rough Parts like any other place but it's got a pretty decent school system in comparison to the Northeast and so all economic and educational factors and just general quality of life. They decided to pack everything up and come to the South also changed with a bit of family drama. My parents are divorced these days the back in that died in that time that that's dresser was already present and I think whatever baggage they had whatever Temptations or he'll fall so they had in that area and like many people you think you could pick up and leave and you can leave those things behind so I thought there was also a little bit of that but I don't I don't try to dig up those memories for them coming out of school sensitive for most people. That's fine. That's fine. So did you go to school you went to school at UGA? That's it.

11:31 And I thought they were to go to school UGA having not spent my entire life there. I had an absolutely no problem staying in town. A lot of the kids that I went to school with said, I don't want to be stuck here. I want to leave Athens. I want to go somewhere else. I want to explore the world and I told myself as I'm perfectly fine, very excellent school being a minority and having good grades. I had the great opportunity and just tremendous in a blessing lock whatever you want to call it. I got paid to go to school. I was up about $3,000 every semester to go to UGA and that's one of the biggest things that I always wondered and ask my parents as I would if I wasn't a good student and what if I wasn't from minority group, what would you have done is like we would have found a way so you might not have been able to go there or it might have taken longer, but we would have found a way.

12:27 And they always tell me it's like we really appreciate the fact that you always could take care of it and we didn't have to really step in and that's something that's still kind of it weighs not heavily but it has a significant impact on my retrospect into those years. But yeah, I went to UGA I had a great time and

12:49 Is amazing I met a lot of great people. That's what I meant to say. That's why I've had my first involvement with Kaleo and okay, I'm Jerry and that's why I eventually I met you. Okay, you mentioned earlier that you studied Linguistics and history and cheese in French. All of my friends is fairly rough Seas days. My Portuguese is still fairly good but I do have the advantage of 40 speaking Spanish album not the same. You definitely have a leg up and I took that same opportunity to better my my understanding of Spanish and in taking the Linguistics. I really really got a feel for how to teach somebody I a non-native speaker or having no exposure the little things like how all the sounds in both languages for the most part exist there just in different parts of the word. I did some tutoring got paid very well for the tutoring.

13:49 But it it's it's definitely one of that even though it was the least focus of my studies with a lesser of of the focus. I I'll never forget everything that I learned in my in my history courses in my Linguistics courses centered around Spanish language. Okay. So your intention when you study the romance languages was to go on to become a teacher. No, actually I always thought I wanted to do something in law or business and I'm of the of the mindset of a few college is great and all but at the end of the day, it's just a piece of paper and in the great scheme of things it says about what you learned in the journey and if you can get that elsewhere and get ahead in life. That's that's great. That would be best. But a lot of people will just look at this piece of paper and judge you so I said to myself I need to get this piece of paper. And so I just know what's going to be most interesting to me and in the long run and a lot of individuals are not as fortunate. They think you know, they'll get a liberal arts degree in of Summer.

14:49 And then their jobless so they're stuck in a rut in a job that they hate. Thankfully that was not the case for me not the end up in law school or the end of the month. So how and when did you make the transition from Athens to Atlanta that was a dizzying and ridiculously fast Journey it all happened over the course of a week. Okay. This is probably one of them in the past two years of my life has had the most transformative portion of my entire life and in the greater scheme of things.

15:26 I ended up coming to Atlanta specifically because the secretary of state of Georgia Brian Kemp called me and he told me that I really like the way you ran your campaign in that campaign was originally for the commissioner's commissioner seat in Athens and then transformed into a House of Representative seat. And although I did not win. I impress a lot of people in the process and he was one of them and him being from the general Athens area and so he called me we had a brief conversation and he said that he was really interested in having me on his team that he's always keeping an eye out for Bright Young individuals to get to get more involved and it would be a good opportunity for me to jump to the state level.

16:11 And so we had lunch a couple days later and we talked about it and he said the very first thing was this is government but not a lot of money involved in those like it's okay. I'm very frugal but I recognize this is a good opportunity and it was and it has been and so that's what took me immediately. I found an apartment and I cleared everything that I was doing nicely, you know ended any projects any organizations that I was with fishes my letters of resignation at work and he just happened to be friends with the owners the bank of course and so he contacted the sea is CEO of that was also, you know, we had a very good relationship and he said hey, I'm about to put one of your employees is that fine. He's like not that's perfectly fine. We're very happy that he's moving on to bigger and better things and then boom I was gone in a heartbeat.

16:59 And when was this this was 9 months ago 9 months ago. Oh my goodness. So tell me a little bit about running for office for a commissioner seat 4, what is the commission or what it would put a commissioner to and I'd also like to hear about what prompted you to run for office, especially at such a young age the commissioner of course will vary depending on your municipality. You're you're counting and we have a consolidator. We as an Athens-Clarke County the Northeast Georgia area has a Consolidated Government. There's a rumor about 10:11 members of the commission the basically the Commission in conjunction with the mayor in the city planners in the high-ranking executives of City management, they

17:44 Decide everything and anything on the local level. They passed the ordinances. They pass the local laws and and are representatives of their respective districts. And at that time one of the many reasons that prompted me was that there the northern part of Athens wish you may already know this Jerry might have mentioned is one of the Athens-Clarke County has a very high concentration of not just Latin Americans, but documented Latin Americans and the Northeast the northeastern or the most of the northern area of Athens or what they call North Athens locally.

18:20 Had a district it ended up with a district that was 30% of the electorate was Latin American. Wow. So there's this day I still get increase on a very regular basis from local officials saying do you have anybody that you know that even as an acquaintance as you know professional in a relationship that would be interested in running and I still haven't I haven't had anybody cuz most of these individuals are either old school businessmen that I would say that due to the greater demographics would still suffer some kind of other conscious or subconscious discrimination because of the way they talk or look or they're not interested but

19:00 Let me not that the whole reason that I even got into it was I think I started having a heavy involvement in the nonprofit sector and it was really really rewarding and most of the reasons that I ended up a non-profit was because of some kind of wool how any nonprofit start their stuff there's a lack from either a government service or some other any kind of Outreach. There's there's a void there. So I figured the next step is of course jumping in the government and I was approached by some friends are now friends event of that plan complete strangers that had seen me in about and they had just said people ask me for potential contacts in candidates. Somebody had asked them some friend of mine and I said, you should talk to Chris D'Elia and it all just exploded from there.

19:48 But even before that witch this is the the much more personal note. I have a family member that

19:57 Maven I almost I almost choked up because they and I tell him it's all the time. He's a cousin of mine. He's younger than I am and his name is Frank Pinto. He lives right now. He's in Guatemala, but he does a lot of traveling he works in the startup environment in like Manhattan, California Silicon Valley. He's been very very successful and he is very very driven, especially given he lost his older brother that's about my age to a heart attack. He was in he was about 22 years old and he had a heart attack and was incredibly disruptive and very unsettling my horse losing anyone is a tragedy of losing a sibling at the age of 21 or 22 years old when in when you imagine people at the peak of their health was very destructive, but he took everything and he made

20:44 He made the most of it.

20:46 He figured he's told me you know, what my parents lost their son. I'm going to do everything that I can to make them proud of everything that I'll do in memory of him. And he was the president of this fraternity. He started to countless, you know student organizations to help out in the community. He had business ventures, he would just pick up a project and he taught himself how to code computer language and he's a biomedical graduate from Columbia full ride and how we went to visit him in New York while he was doing his last stay at a company that dumb I think they've been purchased sense, but they're their main focus was transforming any content on the internet to touch screen content, which is what most of us used to stay on swipe and

21:32 We went there and it was just like you see in like the Facebook movie. There's tons of really expensive toys Lego sculptures that cost thousands and thousands of dollars a 50 by 50 wolves just all white board and I have like a bookcase ladder that you would have to go across the whole thing and I saw everything that he was doing they would work incredibly hard during the day and then they would party very very hard at night. But at the same time this was a summer job and during the school year. It was all business all about helping people and he just surrounded himself with people of substance of some shape form or fashion and he just for doing so many things and I looked at my life and I had a pretty decent life had a good job at a bank and I was responsible and I didn't have too much outstanding debt, but then I just look I'm not doing anything in comparison.

22:23 And my brother did the same thing and so we both got back. We just committed ourselves to just doing everything possible in any shape form or fashion. And whether it's helping people yawn starting a business or just developing our careers with learning something new and cuz that was an think October or November and then by January I was running for office in heaven was already working with two or three now prophets. Wow, but I give him full credit for getting me out of I won't even call it a right but most of us get kind of content with whatever it is we're doing and we don't want to do more because we're worried about failing or or what we want to accomplish, but I just said forget about it. Just give it a shot cuz most people will never try

23:07 And I owe it all to that cousin Franklinton so you so it would be safe to say that he is a leader that you admire in it at somebody that definitely motivated you to take on leadership roles whereas other otherwise you may not have absolutely without a doubt.

23:28 Is there anybody else that you know or out there that has prompted you were motivated you in a similar fashion?

23:38 I think ironically enough for the other benefit the other person that benefited greatly from the trip my brother Reggie perlera. I saw a mediately that he there was a spark in his eye and the competitive nature of my Monk's brother said there's some time exist immediately came out. I looked at my brother house like my brother guy and I've given them plenty of time to catch up and so I see you in everything that he's doing and what he gets involved in. He he immediately encouraged him when we got back. I think he was incoming sophomore at UGA. I told him you want to get involved this vaccine Association you want to run for one of the officer positions and he did he ends up being I think he was a graphic designer for for 1 year, and then he ended up being the president the next time around and he took tremendous leaps of faith and confidence in getting involved in that same kind of startup sector and made some incredible connections with huge companies like TripAdvisor.

24:38 Reynosa TripAdvisor is in the I think he wants them like Travelocity. Someone bigger Expedia and TripAdvisor and he just went to visit our cousin again the next summer. He had no clue what he was doing. He said I want to get a job in this in this environment industry within 2 days. Our cousin had an interview set up with him and being a complete unknown never having done any work in it. He landed the job and ever since he's just continue developing his own business his own goals his own his own your nonprofit and student body Endeavors. He's in Australia right now. He's decided. He's like his Black II the last semester study-abroad man. He's a every single opportunity that I had while I was his age in the school that I said. Maybe I'm not interested about it. He's taking it and so he is definitely an inspiration to me.

25:27 The same time he'll tell me it's like you inspire me because sadly as is the case with a lot of families that are starting a new place. Most of our cousins are more focused on just having a job and starting a family right away and just being content and happy and safe and very few of us have I wouldn't say it escapes but very few of us have not had children immediately after the age of 18 or 19.

25:54 And they haven't gone on to it and you'll do amazing and great things are fantastic people. I love them to death, but

26:02 My brother yell basically between the three of us, we all inspiring each other and we all kind of compete and are constantly asking what were you doing is like what I'm doing this since I okay. What's next? What are we going to do now? It seems like very healthy competition. So you ran for the commissioner seat and Athens and I'm just kind of curious or was going to run you were going to run to the house instead. Okay, so then you ran for the house for the House of Representatives and the pain and everything at a campaign to have a staff I had volunteers. How old are you? I was 26

26:46 Yeah, wow, they're still younger of Representatives out there and very short people. There's a guy I forget Michael Caldwell and he's like 23 very very successful. Businessman and I have real real sharp guy real nice. There's there's some really young state representatives out there. So what was it like running for the House of Representatives? It was the busiest time of my life and even now no matter how busy I get I always think it'll never be as busy as either running someone's campaign or running for myself again and

27:24 It is just in its what did you do? What were you what were your day is filled with appearances on the radio on television. If you're lucky are your newspaper interviews going to events functions fundraisers continuing everything that you were already doing and making sure you're taking plenty of pictures. It's a Non-Stop schedule of just constantly meeting people shaking hands and you can never stop smiling which I was lucky in that because I am always right. I'm not smiling. I'm depressed or Furious or something, but it it's it's very draining because it's essentially like taking on two additional jobs at the very least where you working while you were working. I was still working with my nonprofits and of course that everything takes a hit by everyone was very understanding and again because of the the nature of the political

28:24 That is subtle but inherent in a banking atmosphere and r r Banks, I work for a bank called First American Bank and Trust they were there very involved in the community all their officers involved politically and in various organizations and Rotary Club and things like that. So they were all very very supportive of what you call the old money of town there been around for a long time, but they are very supportive everyone that I had boarded them working with this very supportive and but it's still never consider myself as busy as I as I was during that campaign season and that was only for about four or five months before I am I my stretch of the journey ended and every single time, I think I'm tired of this is nowhere near as much as I was doing before. I just pick myself up got to keep going. So what it what your election was this last year's.

29:24 2012 12 okay. So what was election day like for you both nervous and a little puzzle Santa Claus like well, I may not win. I got out spent by a ridiculous margin and for primaries and that that counts a lot. I was out spent $100,000 to like $5,000 and $100,000 was all that person's personal money. They didn't fundraiser at all. They lost terribly after the primary, but I think that when I see this this person thinks because now looking and working in

30:03 VA in the state government we do a lot of great things and we do a lot of things that aren't so great and looking at the climate the culture and the way things are done in retrospect. I would not have been as happy as I thought and I realize that anyone can make a difference and if you really want to make a difference, you just need to get involved in some paper fashion. You got to get the ear. You have to get in the circle trust of somebody in that process and you will make an impact because all they do all day long is consult their most trusted friends and advisers. You don't have to be that elected official to make a difference. But do you think you will ever run for office Yes again, would you run for the House of Representatives? What are you probably be a senate Runner Congressional run anywhere between the next for 8 years Brian Kemp.

31:02 Secretary of State a great deal for bringing me into this new stage of my political and professional development. Then he all he gave me was the chains like a reason to be in Atlanta in the seeing and knowing that I worked with him and everybody is very very inviting but his next campaign for re-election. I'll definitely be involved in that and any other elections have happened. There's there's rumors about what he may or may not run for and I want substantiate them. But whatever he wants for I'll be very supportive of unless of course something something just pops up out of nowhere has happened somebody resigns and and there's a very good chance you'll I could run sooner. But otherwise I'm there's plenty of opportunity to keep me occupied in the meantime. Okay? Okay. So would you consider your current role with the Secretary of State's office of leadership role?

31:56 I would absolutely say to leadership role. But as is the case with most of my leadership roles.

32:04 It it always involves asking a great deal of someone or a team of anyone without having any formal Authority. I have I'm not I'm no one supervisor. No one answers to me directly. But at any given point I have to be able to persuade them to do exactly what it is. I need from them and in their capacity as an employee as a staff member do that. Well, sometimes they know that if they if they don't know just that I try to be a lucky like I have not I can't tell you what to do. So I'll tell her boss first as I was about to ask you if you would direct employee under you something to do this man. I just want to make sure you're aware. So they're not you know strassner. You think they might have too much to do. I'm very very respectable of that because that's their job and then I go and I just I'm just very nice about it and come up smiling. I asked me how today's going to be a cup of coffee. Let's go have lunch with some big. Otherwise, I'll just say hey we're working on this. It's very important. It would mean a great deal if you couldn't even

33:04 A few minutes and we can talk about this particular item. And for the most part it works just fine. Everybody is very happy that they just not being told what to do for forces iku Steve you better do this or you're fired. Nobody likes that but I also know that as a representative of Detachment of the executive office in like well, we should probably do what he saying, but I never try to never try to make it seem like that's why they should be doing it just because they're important and they're the person I need to make this to do this job. Well,

33:40 What is it like as a Hispanic or Latino working in the political environment, especially here in Georgia and the South since be kind of conservative is lonely.

33:55 It's lonely. There are no up there very few others. I mean the Georgia Association of Latino elected officials. We know exactly how many there are out there.

34:05 For the percentage of the electorate and the population as a whole is just being involved in government where the where a very small chunk of that and that that's what one of my main things in in one of my several new roles in the past couple months is kind of picking it up in getting together as many of these interested parties from Latin American communities. So just say I would like to be involved but I don't know how what I can do is like well, let me tell you and I just pick him. It doesn't matter what side of the aisle I have no friends on both. I mean like if you depending on what your personal and social views are as I can get you in touch with somebody important thing is that you get involved by some it's it's interesting. I seeing as that I I walk in talking and in dress like them. I don't I don't feel like I'm ever hang out with the dreaded the or discriminated against that was going to be my next question. Have you ever felt like somebody, you know, I may be able to look at your name and be like, okay.

35:05 For you and why are you here? If you think you are some of the last name, but I'll tell everybody is just fine the easy way and so they can't quite pieces together cuz it's not very common. In fact, if you want anybody with my last name, they're probably related to me if I almost definitely related to me, but until they hear me speak Spanish to somebody else. There's like I kind of thought you looked Hispanic but wasn't really sure and where it where it where you from and the starts an awkward grab into my cultural identity, but there are people that will make comments like, oh, well, they're not all like you I was like, well, you just don't know enough of us looks like there's plenty of people like me out there. You have never taken the time to get to know them but they do it with no malicious intent just for ignorance but ignorance can hurt just as badly important is your your Hispanic or cultural identity to you.

36:05 Circling back to I was born here and my parents never made a huge stress about my cultural identity and as a child, I just grew up always thinking that it was the right thing to do to be proud of where you're from and where your family came from. And what makes you unique and we're always talking about the u.s. Being a cultural Melting Pot but too many children these days especially in Latin American Community grew up with the stigma being afraid to be identified as an as anything other. I have small children's cousins in my family that they don't cry if somebody really like all your yeah, you're not white or Hispanic or some other possibly derogatory term some of my darker skin family members and it's unsettling and it's it's it's kind of infuriating. Sometimes they know you should be really proud as matter where you from in this case. You tell them you're from El Salvador your family from El Salvador and you're proud of you know, who you are and where you come from and I never hesitate.

37:03 Will tell people anything they want to know about about the country of whatever I know would you ever consider going to El Salvador to live or be there for a little bit of time maybe do some Community work over there? I have done a little bit of that. We lived in El Salvador for about a year since I went to school there very very different most of that kind of products that we didn't involve less well-to-do family members because we're all we're like the Country Cousins. We have some very distant relatives that are more successful. But my family they were there all farmers and lived in very poor areas down the country, but I thought about it. That's one of the other things that I would say Mike my cousin Frank is beating me on cuz he's he's been doing that for the past three or four years. He'll just take up a missions trip and he'll he'll work in whatever capacity he can.

37:56 And if if I can make the time it's not about having it but making the time that's something that I I want to do in the future.

38:03 Is there anything else that you'd like to share?

38:08 I was super excited about doing this today the interview story corpse. I have a friend that he would have been interviewing me. Not that you haven't done a fantastic job that he is a huge families like every single time on the radio. I just stopped and pull over and listen and hear he was really bummed cuz he was actually going to Chile to visit our mutual friend, but he's otherwise he was just because of his enthusiasm and how much joy he takes from the program in the work that you guys do. It was it was contagious and I tell all my family were eventually be able to find it and you don't some library and don't even see Taylor Swift

38:47 Is it great to be here?

38:52 I have a question you talk about how Frank was an inspiration to you and how you were able to pass on some of that to or your brother at your work in kind of an advocacy mode. Have you been able to connect with other members of your community and seeing how the information that you have learned has helped them and form their lives or gotten them to another place man. I absolutely and this is one of the the questions that come up but I always think of it a little more abstract but in everything everything that I do from a non-profit of political or business perspective my happiest moments as it were come from finding people that are not your traditional leader or think that they couldn't jump into the roles that I've jumped into and that's that's what I consider. My main mission is to find these people and set them up because it's it's it's really it's relatively easy.

39:52 But most people are very afraid of it and sold finding the leader of the person that's willing to take the plunge and get over that fear is is the most gratifying in the in the happiest moment so that I try to do that all the time and I've had yeah, it's it's far and few between I can probably count on my on my hand. I've maybe had five or six people that I found in the past 2 years that I really thought and set them up and connected them with the right people that it's like they're going to be there somebody now, but they're going to be somebody even more later on.