Carlos Moore and Mia Raquel

Recorded November 6, 2019 Archived November 6, 2019 40:12 minutes
0:00 / 0:00
Id: MBY019376


Carlos Moore (49) talks with new friend and StoryCorps facilitator Mia Raquel (24) about what triggered him to start learning about his family and the research he's done using the Bible as a resource in the past 10 years to better understand his ancestors' history and place in the Transatlantic Slave Trade.

Subject Log / Time Code

CM recalls growing up in a small town, Kilgore, TX. He talks about some of the memories he had as a child.
CM recalls meeting some people from Ghana as an adult and not understanding why they were apologizing to him. He talks about doing some research, including using the Bible, to understand their apology.
CM talks about how his great aunt taught him and other children Hebrew and how he started to make sense of his family history.
CM reflects on struggling as a teenager, being called the n-word and being excited now to understand himself and his history better, and to be able to share it with the next generation.
CM talks about the resources he's used for his research.
CM reflects on how his friends' apology really triggered a curiosity he hadn't previously explored.
CM talks about his kids and how he's talking with them about this history, and how he keeps learning new things.


Recording Location

Dallas Public Library: North Oak Cliff Branch

Partnership Type




StoryCorps uses Google Cloud Speech-to-Text and Natural Language API to provide machine-generated transcripts. Transcripts have not been checked for accuracy and may contain errors. Learn more about our FAQs through our Help Center or do not hesitate to get in touch with us if you have any questions.

00:07 My name is Carlos boy. I'm 49. Today is Wednesday, November 6th. 2019 location is Dallas, Texas.

00:18 The name of the interview partner is Mia Raquel.

00:23 Relationship to the partner

00:26 Carlos Moore

00:30 Hi, I'm Mia Raquel. I am 24 years old. Today is Wednesday, November 6th, 2019. I'm in Dallas, Texas here with Carlos Moore and he is my new friend.

00:45 So I think we're here today to talk about your family history. So why don't you start by telling me where you grew up and about your family, I grew up in a little town called Kilgore, Texas about an hour and a half from Dallas East.

01:03 Hour from my Shreveport, Louisiana

01:07 About 15,000 people in the town. I'm one of us 6 siblings and my family history down there over a hundred fifty years. And so

01:24 I wanted to talk about how beautiful a place Kilgore was with known for oil down there. It's not affect the Pickens family it snowing in the United States for oil and it one time you're going to have to richest acre in the early nineteen-hundreds in the world. We have Kilgore Oil Museum. I'm on alumni of Kilgore College what play basketball during my team was retired text about two years ago, but I want to talk a little about my history and Kilgore very strong family.

02:06 Just great loving parents grandparents aunts uncles worked hard working class family. Like I said it when I was young I remember

02:20 Admit your quarters Larry we grew up. We're probably about 25 homes ball family on that about

02:28 10 acres down there. So we were there and occasionally my great-aunt used to keep us when I was about seven and I recalled her teaching us Hebrew and

02:43 You know when you're young you running around and playing and every day, we would go over there while my parents would work.

02:51 So she was teacher some words. I remember one of the song for you to sing with Kumbaya.

02:59 Ella means in English when you understand that that means come by here.

03:06 Yacht

03:08 You know, how did luya Kumbaya and soul?

03:13 I just kind of took that in throughout my years really didn't try to learn more about it as I got older and I ventured out in after college. I got a chance to go to Europe in play professional basketball in the early 90s in Berlin Germany, and I sprechen sie Deutsch German beautiful place was just excited cuz I know my father fought in the second war and he was in Berlin Checkpoint Charlie so that history was exciting, but when I was over there

03:49 I've got a chance to meet some people from Ghana and Nigeria pretty close. We live in the same duplex.

03:59 You know in apartments in they would apologize to me as we got closer and I never did understand that. I'm in my early twenties, you know, enjoying Berlin playing professional and got a chance to work for the Army working with the youth over there. That was exciting. But oh

04:21 I never understood why the apologizing to me so probably in 2005. I met someone who kind of educated me on doing challenge me to start doing some research on the history and everything like that in the apology was that they were participated in the transatlantic slave trade their ancestors did and everything. So that was just so

04:48 Unique, you know to understand him telling me that in.

04:53 I didn't understand it and now it's acting 93-94.

04:58 2324 you know young not focusing on that but as I got older I'm 49 now. So in 2005 my friend Benny kind of started so that you need to do the research and see why they said that he knew something. I didn't know so I did and I realize

05:19 And connected it when I was young 7 years old and my great-aunt they learned it from their grandparents. So you talkin 400 years for Generations never think so I could I am kind of put it that together and then I was understanding and last year January President Trump. He signed HR 1242 which commemorates the slaves coming over here in 1619. And so I said, wow, that's almost interesting. That way. I learned it from her grandparents, you know, so I can make it maybe in the 4th generation and then my friend he open the Bible in show me and Deuteronomy 28:68.

06:11 Waze says the Lord. Thy God shall bring you into Egypt again with ships. I said wow.

06:20 That's all we got over here, you know and that was interesting for me because I never understood why on the back of the $1 bill. That was a pyramid. I always was curious about that. And so you're doing the research realize that America is considered spiritual Egypt when you understand the pyramid and everything, you know synonymous for it. And so like I said, I am the research and realize

06:52 It's 2005 when my friend being jealous me America is considered Egypt. You know, I said if any setup it says the Lord that God will bring you into Egypt again with ships. By the way. I speak of it. You also see it no more and when I was in college the research, you know that we were doing the things that I didn't know the history from slavery to know I never could find out researching. So I started doing research. I was curious after 2005 basketball. I need to go and start doing the research gotta understand that because I did put it together.

07:34 No, it did modern time the HR 1242 that was passed the 400 years and then my descendants of my ancestors we came here in 1619. So you got 400 years and then I connect to do with my aunt.

07:52 She learning Hebrew as well, you know, we came over here in 1619. Jamestown, Virginia was the first place for slaves got it and everything. So you have 400 years and 228 explains how we got here and I connect the nested. Wow. That's so interesting. And now when you coming you talkin about a Bible 2000 + years old and I connected that in so revelation.

08:25 11 and 8 hole so shows in 2015 President Obama. He passed the law where a man can marry a man and soul. Scripture quote. Stay in head.

08:38 The dead bodies meaning spiritually dead men. Like I was skinny explained that my great-aunt. She was called negro on her birth certificate. Her daughter was called colored.

08:53 Her daughter

08:55 No, it could be the age of my mother was called Black and then on my birth certificate, it has African-American, so

09:05 Throughout the years it was being changed and so I just was intrigued by that that I could physically see it and identify to why our next Saturday changing every so often like that in so my conclusion was that off when I read Revelations 11 and 80 set. The dead bodies mean spiritually did the be great in the cities of Sodom and Egypt.

09:35 So now in all 50 states of America marry me and my mama can a married woman and I hadn't realized and Deuteronomy 28 American spiritual Egypt. So you talkin about a book written back so long ago and then in the modern times President Obama pass the law. So I said wow America is that place? I can't connect the dots set up my ancestors, you know in my history and my studies to that the Bible was talkin about us because I didn't know that you know, I didn't know I didn't learn any college. I didn't learn it in school, but I travel the world, you know with my work and finance and got a chance to do some detail research. And so that's why I'm here and I'm excited ecstatic.

10:29 I know that you know, you know really about my history.

10:34 And it's just don't like a like that is going on in my head and I can only imagine that.

10:43 If you didn't want so I want to ask a couple clarifying questions. So your great-aunt was teaching you Hebrew. So I'm wondering if you can explain what the connection is between that because it is are there members of your family that were Jewish or how did the Hebrew come to be a part of the the family history also get some that was the language to yet understand a little bit about the history when we got it. We weren't allowed to read and write know if you realize some of the movies that depict. Time they strip this down and took identity from us and we didn't know who we were so is this unique and ironic as matter fact, I can show the research I did the oldest African-American church.

11:40 And Macon, Georgia the slaves build it and it's almost under some years.

11:47 It's a wrap up in the top part. It's written in Hebrew. So you do my research of the Hebrew and I was curious about that because when I was in Germany, I didn't know why the Africans were apologizing and they explain the minutes to listen we rounded you up and we participated in the transatlantic slave trade and 1619 and everything. And now you have that YouTube is so phenomenal with all the information is out there the internet, you know, you can literally do the research. So like I said, I never did

12:24 Do the research then when I was young, but now I'm 49 in the I connect the dots. I said wow.

12:32 When you read the Bible is talking about someone and I never learned it from my family, you know, we we didn't know you know, because then we started kind of waking up now, you know with my research. I started educating my kids about

12:52 Something that we didn't we didn't we didn't get him in that school, you know, the family didn't know and everything and then you do a Jeremiah 17 and 14 thoughts about that. We were going to come to a place and not know who we are and that's why I said like I have a lot of friends from Germany, they can go today history where they started and we can do that. We cannot I can't tell you anything in this time now, I can't even tell you anything from

13:29 1619

13:32 I cannot tell you so that was unique and there is a zondervan Bible dictionary. It talks about the ham. You know, the three sons Joplin.

13:48 Ham and Shem in what I was taught to school and you know some of the research that we was from Ham, but we're not from Amber from Elmo stupid genital father of the dark races. That's what the title says when you do the research, but it says not of the Negroes

14:11 And so that research that I've done it.

14:16 It says, you know any other dictionary Bible book talks about him and it says how much the father of the dark races the Ethiopian the Egyptians the Canaanites but not the Negroes and when you do the research on our history, we the only ones that called me growth and then a little more research. I did the maps and it's going to change them.

14:42 Before the transatlantic slave trade, they had another area called negroland. But now in the bottom time you can see that and everything and so I connect to the dock that some of my research during the 70 AD.

15:03 The Jews work ran out by the Romans and they fled into Africa on the west coast in my research in the last 10 years. That's how we ended up on the west coast and then I was able to understand why the people that I met in Europe in Germany was apologizing to me cuz they was rounding us up on the west coast of Africa and you know, we got it I lived in Trinidad Tobago. I've done some research and know some of the histories

15:39 And I live in Santiago Chile.

15:42 Also, so I know.

15:46 The ships went to those places and it was just I run it that I was able to do that research and know about it. And so that's how I was able to kind of Bring It full circle know like I said, why do you know it's counter for so many years. I did not.

16:05 Think about my great-aunt teaching me that and then you know living in Europe and some of the people say you don't know who you are. Yeah. They have some of my African friends apologized to me and like watch it while it's a beautiful thing. You know, I realized that my real nationality is I'm a Israelite and from the tribe of Judah means the line and then when you do the research in the Bible, it shows who Judith Judith Judah is a

16:46 If the lottery, you know other 12 flies in the Pacino father was Jacob which was changed to Israel. And so that's how I started connecting to the Bible to see like, who are they talking about in the Bible that 50 Chrissy's cuts when you go to Deuteronomy 28 chapter, it shows you all the closest you do end up in there like a if you understand some of the struggles with the African-American Wii Fit those curses. That's what I started, Don't do. Nothing matches who we are, you know and everything, but that's something I like, you know going to school and learn it even going up with my grandmother been married to preacher. He never talked to me about that funeral that you went to a theological school and you never told me that and so in the last

17:43 7 years already been doing a lot of research to know. To connected and said while the Bible stalking about us because that's been done. The one secret. The one thing that said behoove me that I did never know about him. So now I'm just kind of like not even sleeping. I'm so excited to know, you know how you just discovered something. So beautiful like that and then when you read Hebrews 7 in

18:12 14 it talks about Christ and you know where he says he's from he's going to try with you.

18:19 Can you go to Revelations 1 1315 they said his head was like wool or liability here. They said his eyes were red and inflamed they say the skin was bronze like it burn in the furnace and I'm saying wow.

18:37 You know, like I can tell you like in my teenage years I struggled with so much going to eat Kilgore, you know, because I grew up here in Dallas in Pleasant Grove area.

18:57 I really just kind of

19:01 I really just kind of

19:08 I really just was excited about that that I founded information up about who I am and struggling in my teenage years, you know, cuz I grew up in Plano Pleasant Grove. I'm sorry, and it was predominantly I carry and I move down to Kilgore.

19:27 And I was called the n-word and I struggle in school cuz you know like the teacher I remember one great opportunity my grandma's I told her what happened in the lunch line the teacher made us get in the back or the afternoon of the students. So I said to her she came up there during the lunch hour and it was beautiful cuz she misses Barnes who we used to my grandmother was at a paper route should see through all the papers there. So she came in to listen, this is Brian. You can't do that.

20:03 You don't make it.

20:07 Feel the same way. You know, she knew her cuz they had a little corner store used to patronize and don't pay, but she never responds in. This balances was my English teacher, so I never suggested that but my grandmother came and told her you don't treat kids any kind of way you treat them all the same and that's how she raised us as though. I was a really nice moment, but I struggle with a lot of things a lot of questions. I have to be who I am in 2019 to know what I know to understand so much about myself now, that's a beautiful thing. You know, I cherish and now you're at the wonderful friends in Europe. I live in Germany and Belgium and Amsterdam for a little bit and then you're traveling and living in Trinidad.

21:03 Living in Mexico Mexico Canada, Chile. Just meeting just wonderful people and you know, I'm excited now because I know some things that I didn't know about myself. So now I said a long as I would like for my body. I'm going to tell that true feel so that's why I'm here to talk about imagine that as a fully-formed adult. It must be kind of this light turning on for you to figure these things out. I'm curious. I have two questions. I'm curious if you have any like living ancestors like I don't know if your mother is still alive or anybody that you've been able to talk about this with and then my second question is

21:54 Let's see all answer that one person to see if the one comes back to me.

22:04 That was hard cuz I try but you know, but I feel good cuz you know, I had a wonderful relationship with her and she was a beautiful strong woman and she taught us how to love ourselves in got us out of work hard, you know, and I lost my dad when I was sixteen, you know, and so but it was locked up in the happiest and I wish I could tell her that you don't like the strong women that I had in my life to know my aunt. She died in 2005 my grandmother passed all of the other ones, you know that raced has been a long day. You're not making sure that I passed that information down to all of my nieces and nephews and my kids, you know, cuz like I said, I know that information now that powerful you don't you didn't know I had no clue on any of that and that's just like I'm telling you I don't even sleep. I'm so excited because

23:04 That light is on and you know when you know who you are and where you come from.

23:12 You know where you going? You know and that's what I said like cuz the history of the Israelites when you understand from Egypt to you know, the Syrian the Babylonians another Grease the Romans they be our nation's you know, and that's why I guess try to encourage the kids to kind of do that research. You know, I said listen don't believe what I say do the research. I was actually a nice segue into my next question was going to be how have you been doing this research kind of what resources are you drawing from? And you talked about the Bible quite a bit, but how has it been piecing together this puzzle like what what have you been doing to do that? I've been able to like there are so many.

24:05 Books that I am go to the library and artifacts of some of the things that I could I've had some friends, you know from Africa that can collaborate the role. Like I have some friends from Congo here and comes in back way right now. I was put on the African Union committee this ironic that they chose me. I'm important region 6-b osper, which is kind of give me helping me get some information from that perspective, you know to understand

24:48 The African knowledge that that comes with that, you know and everything and then I have some Jewish friends that help talk to me about some things, you know, and everything is so I pretty much just been just coming to the library when I have some free time to just do the research on some of the monuments that are in Virginia. You know, they have a monument up there close to

25:20 Clothes to wear

25:26 We are trying to see there. It's not Jamestown, but it's your Jamestown and there is a sign that shows it has Israelites literally reading on that, you know, 250 Acres that they are City that they develop and everything and it's just just doing the research and everything. I've been able to

25:50 Get some odd data from a library Congress some of the Congress sign some forms back then and it had Israelite there, but you have to really do the research to know and then it's beautiful because a lot of the other African Americans that I meant, they've done the research as well suspension. I have a great organization that I work with on Facebook and we have some people that are experts in history, and I'm so I've got to know them they give me some great artifacts, you know on kind of make me understand.

26:33 So like I said, I'm excited. I think eventually I want to do a memoir.

26:40 And got it all together. That's my goal. You know, it was some professionalism to a memoir maybe some videos you never talk about.

26:54 What do you think would have happened? If you never went to Berlin and your friends there didn't apologize. Do you think you still would have wanted to know this history? Was that like yeah, do you think that was like the pivotal moment or do you think you would have connected to it? Otherwise, I think the triggered something in me. Why do you apologize or not? I don't understand that. You know when when I didn't know back then like for me I thought it like I was just so I can tell you which area from Africa.

27:33 You know, my ancestors passed you I didn't know that you know, and so that was interesting. Just I'm going to start digging a little further now, you know, because like I said

27:48 That was something that triggered something in me, and I said all wow. So now I need to kind of

27:55 And I'm I'm excited because you know how some Starion that out. Baker the show and talk about.

28:05 The 70 AD how

28:09 They were chased out and that's how they ended up in the west coast and that's what we were rounded up and you know, so you can kick connect to history with that. You know, I was just going to let the light up in me to to do that in there while you know, like girl growing up in the church and not understanding the Old Testament, you know, cuz it is kind of like a wasn't. It was just like cuz like that information wasn't taught. I didn't know and so I took it on myself to start reading and understanding it and then

28:50 It all makes sense to me, you know after while.

28:55 That's why I like when I

28:58 It came to me my auntie Jimmy Hebrew and just like it was stored there. And then when the gentleman's apologize to me it just kind of turned on the light and going to Berlin and that one of my good friends. He died. When I Was Eighteen he was supposed to go to the Army over there in about two months before he left he drowned at the high school graduation. And so it was just like life. Sometimes I think works out I went on his behalf. I went there and it was just as my friend played over there any today

29:38 You want to go play some basketball and Germany? I didn't think about it. I just did it right now. My son's he plays on the German national team. I got a chance to work with ducting is over. Do you know who just retired from the Dallas Mavericks? He's driving. I was going to ask about your kids and the role that you play in facilitating this knowledge with them and encouraging them to do their own research. Are they interested in in this or

30:12 Yes, they are very much interested on Christopher. He's 25 now and like I said players on German national team and he's a business person my daughter Alexandra. They went to the John F Kennedy School in Berlin tonight at a great working relationship there when I played basketball camps and Clinics for kids to get back and down, you know, Berlin has so much history over there, you know, and they love that. Aspect of it. You know, I've been really want to probably set up a foundation my daughter calling here. She also is

30:58 Entreat, you know at HEB 15 this year, so

31:03 They were like, wow dad, you know you just this is some picture that you know, they're not getting school. So I'm just trying to

31:12 Applied it to them so they can know who they are. And now that is too you know and everything just like

31:21 I have a lot of friends from Mexico and one of my friends he just passed in them.

31:28 The Mayans they are part of the tribe of Israel as well. And I had a chance to tell of my friend Gonzalo the about 3 months ago. I told his family that in after the funeral they came it was his grandkids cuz he was 8 years old and they came and hug me and they were intrigued by it. And I know you know if the car is means hard worker. So the Mexicans are hard workers, you know.

32:02 I know some of the names of the original names that when you start doing the research, you can connect the dots and everything because like I said, like there are there were 18 Nations biblical names and see you have to go back and do your research just like the Africans original name are the ammonites the Israelites.

32:31 The Japanese are the ammonites.

32:34 You know, the Chinese are the moabites the Arabs are the ishmaelites that's just an example of some things that you can do the research on you knowing and see it connect to their history that called yours and everything. And so that void for me was feel you don't like uh not knowing that from Africa in to know if only got to connect the dots, you know.

33:05 Quit by researching some of the books and everything. You know, like I said, I'm going to make sure I

33:13 Put up a website and it's just a beautiful thing to know who you are, you know, and be able to spread that beautiful news, you know, and everything is not encourage young kids to do that research. I couldn't even wanted to do they researching you do not know the history that's exciting for me. And I'm like I said, I don't even sleep I stay up and I'm like a sponge, you know anything I can learn.

33:42 I saw I saw I'm going out to do that to learn everything I can and just spread it.

33:48 And give

33:50 Things that we do know about our self and identity. That's why I'm here to tell my story now, you know it preciate it for this opportunity to come in.

34:02 Just life right now at 49. I'm enjoying it passion about it fashion about spreading the information and going up in the church and they're not learning things. They're you know, like some of the things that was deliberately not talk and if you don't learning going to Bible study, but

34:27 Understanding now at my oldest age 49 when I was young. It was just some things in the Bible that they weren't being talked because it would open up just playing some of the history in the artifacts that connect to that to know who I am by Design. You know, when you do a little research on the transatlantic slave trade we couldn't read it right in.

34:59 Like I was 7 is on Saturday. So when you get to the research in espanol, Salvador see Saturday is the Sabbath and so it's a beautiful things like we used to wear fringes.

35:14 I could tell this to to remind us who we are.

35:19 I started I used to eat like pork. I stop eating when I started understanding my Heritage and knowing that the pig is called the swine in the Bible. I didn't know that you know, when I was in Germany, she wanders a pic. So I did the research and it's unclean and a lot of the African Americans have high blood pressure diabetes cause we eat unclean Foods in that unit. Leviticus talks about the diets things that we supposed to stay healthy. And I know that's wonderful thing to make us one of their Hobbies. I have I'm going to set up a salmon fish farm.

36:05 What a garden in a bakery cuz my mother was a chef at Neiman's market for 15 years in dollars between her and my grandmother. They taught me how to cook. So clean foods to promote jobs healthy eating in knowledge. That's why I'm in my life and I'm ecstatic to know like I said, it was like $1,000 in a day. If you do not enough time. I don't sleep now because it just now with my position with the afternoon commit. We going in the cities and want to create jobs, you know, let people have access to Capital, you know, promote entrepreneurship in my family.

36:55 I learn how to be an entrepreneur and everything was feeling so many times to you eventually get it right now and everything. So my life is just wonderful. That knowledge that. I have no one can take it from me. And of course I want to keep on spreading and I love meeting people, you know, I love traveling and learning different cultures.

37:21 You know, I love cooking you don't just love life and sports was played a vehicle for that.

37:29 Completely. So now I am now I think the next thing is I really just want to come and do a book Memoir some videos. Yeah. It sounds like you have to really wonderful projects to give back to the community especially kind of feeling lost in the community. And now you feel like you found your identity and so being able to give back to that must feel really amazing and very rewarding and I hope that one day I can come eat at your clean food restaurant recipes as well, you know, so I would love to have you there, you know and don't want to encourage people though.

38:13 Forgot to eat healthy for the NFL team, you know spread the love is life and life is about what you give to it, you know and everything.

38:25 Learning from my mistakes, you know that I made in just growing everything about learning something new about myself and giving back before my time is up, you know, I'm so

38:40 For having dinner with my family, you know, they taught me how to love and how to treat you with respect, you know regardless of their color.

38:51 Racino religion just to deal with a character, you know everything and try to elevate people help people. And that was the one thing when I live in Europe that was beautiful for me and I'll get over there and seeing how you need. Berlin was it's always special to me and I got a chance to meet Alfred nobel's great-great nephew. In the Nobel of the Nobel Peace Prize in the sky was member being in Beverly Hills speaking some Jeremy Riddle in

39:26 We're doing some renewable energy housing in the the next phase here Sakana create jobs eating let people have access to Capital. I'm in the private banking now and I see this just kind of evolving for me. So it's a beautiful town in my life.

39:53 Thank you so much Carlos for sharing with me today. I feel like I learned so much.

39:58 Thank you.