Cheri Lyon and Stephen Wiard

[00:01] CHERI LYON: Cheri Lyon, 65. It's March 20, 2023. We're in Taos, New Mexico. My interview partner is Steve Wiard and we are colleagues.

[00:18] STEPHEN WIARD: My name is Steven Wiard I'm 74. This is March 20, 2023. We're in Taos, New Mexico. And my interview partner is Cheri Lyon, and she is a colleague.

[00:35] CHERI LYON: Hey, Steve. It's so great to be together. So how'd you get to Taos?

[00:43] STEPHEN WIARD: Well, that's an interesting story that many people get asked upon their arrival or after time here. I came to Taos first time back in 1981, actually. I was, well, I guess I need to go back to 72, 51 years ago. I was stationed at Fort Bliss in El Paso, and after officer basic training there, drove back through New Mexico on my way to eastern Kansas and came through Taos Spent a night here and thought, wow, this is a cool place. Went back to eastern Kansas where I started teaching high school for 18 years and serving churches part time. Came again in 81 to visit a friend in Albuquerque and then came back in 95. Came back in 95 by myself. Spent a week here, had a little b and b and really, really like Taos. I seemed to connect with it. I was here about a week. I didn't even get to Santa Fe. I just hung out in Taos. My hair started growing longer when I was here and people started asking me for directions. Thought I was a local. And I said, I like this place. And then I came back a couple more times in the next 15 months and then made some inquiries about the, about the Methodist church here in town and connected with the Albuquerque office of the Methodist church. And they said, we don't take too many people from out of state, but you can send a resume. I did so had some interesting references and background, and I was persistently tactful. And after about eight or 910 months, I got a surprise phone call in the spring of 97. And they said, if we pay for the airline ticket, we fly to Albuquerque for an interview. And I said, sure. I said, no one has ever paid a flight ticket for me to go interview. And so I went to Albuquerque and interviewed for about an hour with a committee. They asked me all kinds of questions about theology and teaching and politics and all that sort of thing. And that went well. I had long hair then. I had a ponytail. I remember some friends saying to me in Kansas, said, steve, you going to cut your hair for that interview? I said, no, I was 48 years old at that time. I said, this is who I am. I clean up pretty good. I'm just going down and we'll give it a shot after the interview. Two days later, they called me and said, that church in Taos is yours if you want to go there. And I said, I'm in. Game on. So. And that was 1997.

[03:39] CHERI LYON: Wow. And what a great time you had.

[03:43] STEPHEN WIARD: Yes, it was a good run. I served full time 21 years, and now I do part time, as you know. But I stayed away when I left for three, three and a half years to give you time to establish yourself and your presence. And that was important. But, yeah, it's been a unique place. I took a pay cut when I came here, but I was willing to do that. I was divorced after 23 years of marriage. My two kids were grown, and I got to be here in Taos.

[04:16] CHERI LYON: Well, it's been great to follow you. Big shoes to fill, but. So tell me about the early years of El Pablito, what you know about how it started. It obviously started way before you actually got here. But what you know about that, because it's got a great history and kind.

[04:33] STEPHEN WIARD: Of your early years here, certainly. El Pablito United Methodist Church is a unique little congregation, a unique church to begin with. Methodism does not have a strong history in northern New Mexico. Presbyterians do in the protestant realm, and, of course, Roman Catholic. But. But there was a Methodist presence, late 18 hundreds, early 19 hundreds. Then it kind of faded and died out. The powers that be decided in the late fifties, 1960, that they needed to establish a church here again, a Methodist church. And the little church that you and I serve, El Pablito, was organized officially in 1960, December of 1960, but before that, its history is amazing. It was, as you know, and to the listeners, it was a gas station. It was a gas station. You know, it was not built as a church. Most places where you go to church, there's a construction edifice that was built for that purpose. This was a gas station. And before that, it was a bar and a cafe. It was El Palido bar and cafe restaurant. And I just think that's incredible. And I always felt like Jesus and the prophets would hang out in a bar and a cafe and the gas station. You know, we keep saying to people, stop by. We're still trying to fill them up and send them out. So it's a really unique history in that sense. And the church did what it could for many years with different clergy and laity involved. And then in the mid nineties, the pastor who was here and some other folks in the congregation decided that they recognized the poverty in New Mexico. And people who people were often hungry and food insecurities. And in 1994, the shared table was established. And that's the name of our local food pantry. And they started by serving hot meals. And we have a small church. It's not a big physical plant, but hot meals were served. I came in 97. We were still serving hot meals. And then we began to outgrow. We just didn't simply have the room to feed people. And the other reality is the board decided that if you give somebody a hot meal, it's only one meal and they're done and out the door. But if we can give food commodities, they can take those commodities home and get three or four or five, six meals out of that. And so we moved in that direction and got donations from a variety of sources. And then it's continued to expand. The program has expanded, as you know.

[07:43] CHERI LYON: It's amazing. You know, it's hard to believe that we are serving twice a month about 350 households from all over the county with food boxes and so, and with each box weighing about 20 to 25 pounds, you know, that's tons of food going out.

[08:08] STEPHEN WIARD: Yes, it is. And it's so important because New Mexico is a poor state. Socioeconomically. It is. It often ranks with Mississippi and Louisiana and Arkansas. It's a beautiful place to live, but the poverty here is high. About one out of three children live in poverty. And that's one of the reasons that the shared table expanded with the support of the church and the board. Several years ago, as you know, we decided to expand to the south end of town. And so now we distribute on the north end at the church, and also at the south end of Taos at what is called the Taos Community center. So we're at both the north and south end on the same day, on the second and fourth Wednesday every month, all year long, distributing food commodities. And I have a lot of people, as you do, no doubt, Cheri who often ask at Thanksgiving and Christmas and say, can I come by and volunteer and help? Say, sure, you can do that. But the reality is people get hungry in March and they get hungry in July and October, and we're there all year long. And we also realize some time back that rather than just food commodities, we now supply and give to people basic healthcare supplies, soap, shampoo, diapers, toilet paper, toothbrushes, condoms, trying to help them in any way we can. And they're very appreciative.

[09:46] CHERI LYON: Yeah. You know, I think one of the unique things about our food pantry is we serve a lot of people who live off grid. So who may not have the same access to water that everybody else does, they're hauling water. So they're having to be really careful about how much water they use. Many of our community members that participate in shared table aren't hooked up to the electrical grid. So they may be using solar panels, many are using solar panels. But so being able to cook, being able to store food is a real challenge.

[10:29] STEPHEN WIARD: It is indeed. And one of the realities, as you well know, is that we've added freezer space at the church where we can now freeze meat and other items and distribute those on the second or fourth Wednesday. And when you mention the number of boxes, you give out commodities, you know, if you think average maybe two to three people per box in a family home, that's 1000 people.

[10:55] CHERI LYON: Yeah.

[10:56] STEPHEN WIARD: That's a thousand people that are receiving something to help with the food insecurities. And that's part of the mission of a church. I really believe that and I know you do as well. That's what churches ought to be about. To me, it's about service, and so we try to do that. The prophet in Isaiah 58 speaks about giving bread to the hungry. Matthew 25, the conversation with Jesus about when did we see you hungry and when did we see you without clothes? And he said, when you did it to the least of these, you did it to me. So that's part of the calling of El Pablito. I tell people, and you do too. I'm sure that it's a small church of 50, 60 people, but on Sunday morning we have a small service. On Wednesdays we have about seven, 8900 people. We reach 1000 people and they say, wow, two different services. I say, yeah, Sunday is the small one when we're in the sanctuary and Wednesday's the distribution at shared table, the food pantry. And since the pandemic, those needs have gone up even more so. And you know that with your involvement there too, and maybe you want to speak to that.

[12:19] CHERI LYON: But yeah, the pandemic really has made a difference. We went to drive by distribution to keep everybody safer. And then with the increased volume as inflation and gas prices have continued, we've stayed as a drive by, which people really like because we're able to help lots of people at one time. As you mentioned, the church interior is small, so we could not actually fit 250 households coming through in a three hour period. We just wouldn't physically get inside. But we can manage it with it. And, you know, we're really blessed with amazing people who help out, who volunteer people from all fates and no fates. A lot of people who are picking up food help out. A lot of people from throughout the community participate. So it got me to thinking, what are one or two of your favorite memories? Stories about shared table wow.

[13:22] STEPHEN WIARD: There have been many over a couple of decades, no doubt. But one of the things I want to preface that by saying, as you did, echo a big thank you to the volunteers and the community support we've received for so long. I guess one of the positive things that I always liked was when August got here, September, there were often families or a single mom with two or three kids, and they're getting ready to go to school. And, you know, I used to teach school. I taught high school for 18 years in eastern Kansas. And I know what it's like being a teacher, and I know what it's like being a student coming into a classroom, not having supplies you need. It can be embarrassing. Kids look at you like, what's going on? And, you know, we don't do this in July at the shared table. We don't do it in February or November. But August, September is a good time that we try to make school supplies available. And it was always fun taking a mom or a dad or the kids to Walmart, for example, and to some local store and stocking up school supplies and having the money to do that, you know, to get brand new notebooks, to get pencils, to get a new backpack. That's pretty exciting. And while we're in there to say, do you need a new jacket? Do you need some sneakers and a new shirt, maybe? And those kids just really light up when that happens. So that's always been exciting to me, is to make school positive and shared table and the church have a hand in that. I also often would carry crayons in my pocket and I'd give children crayons. You know, it's amazing what somebody who doesn't have crayons gets to pick out three or four crayons or get a box and some paper and go home and start being creative at the age of five years and, you know, just let people feel good about that, that hour, that time they come by the church and the shared table to know that they're accepted, they're welcome there and give them a lift when they leave. Another example, Cheri is many years ago I was asked to often have been asked, as you may have as well, to speak to different community groups, civic organizations and school classrooms. Again, if you can talk to fifth graders or fourth graders, high school kids, about the need in the community that might make an impact on them later in their life. I spoke to some fourth graders several years ago, and I took in a box of food items we give out and talked about shared table and what people need. And we had a good q and a, and at the end of it, there was one fourth grade girl. I never forgot what she said. She said, she raised her hand, and I called on her. She said, you know, I like the shared table because you might not think you need anything, but you just might. And I wrote that down, and that now is our. That's our slogan. That's our motto. We've got it on the van that hauls the food. It's on the worship bulletin. From the mouths of babes. You know, here's a fourth grade girl who says, I like the shared table because you might note, think you need anything, but you just might. And that's true for a lot of us. Many people are one or two paychecks away from economic difficulties. So it's been encouraging that way to help others. And you and I both know, Cheri there are people who come to the food pantry, for example, who don't have a traditional church connection. And for many of them, that may be the only church connection they have institutionally. And some people ask me sometimes, we don't proselytize there. That's not part of it. We just. The witness is just distributing the food, healthcare items, and the goodwill. But when some of our clients find themselves in jail, in the hospital, or they die in 21 years, I'd get a phone call, as you would, and to be of help for those people. So it's just a way to spread goodwill and see that ripple effect, go out there with others as they help one another, carry the boxes, distribute the food, have maybe a social time when no one's yelling at them. There's no. It's a safe environment, and they can come and get renewed, and that's what the church needs to be about. No question.

[18:41] CHERI LYON: You know, you're really right. We don't evangelize or that. But I don't know how many times people have said, would you pray with me? You know, or, my husband just died. I'd seen him always together coming through, and then one time, it's just one. And that happened several times during COVID but for other reasons as well. Or we celebrate. We have one man who comes sliding in just before we close. We know to anticipate him because he's coming from dialysis, and so he's got just enough time, and he's so sweet. We're all keeping him in prayer for a kidney. He's been on the list for a while and was actually in Albuquerque to get a kidney, and it didn't work out. But even within that, he picks up an additional box, which is one of the things we encourage people to do if they have a friend or a family member that needs a box and can't come for somebody else who's in dialysis and doesn't get out in time. And, you know, dialysis is hard on your body. So to have the energy and the connection to be part of shared table is a lot. Is a lot. And so we're always just so delighted to see him, to know that he's well, and we're so eager to hear that he gets a kidney as an example. But, hey, I was thinking about one of my favorite stories about you and the shared table food pantry.

[20:20] STEPHEN WIARD: What's that? I don't know what's coming.

[20:22] CHERI LYON: Yeah, tell us exactly. So what? In the recent years, and this has been true on and off, I'm sure, forever, but recently, we've had some bumper crops of apples in Taos county. And a lot of orchard growers, particularly those that have got kind of either large family orchards, but not commercial orchards, have donated their produce to shared table. And so one guy, Gene, who lives all the way down in Rinconada, which really isn't that far, but it's a good 30 miles, you know, to Taos, he came up to drop off apples, and that was how I first met him. You know, he just. He called ahead and said, hey, guys, open. I want to bring all these apples. So he gets there with all these boxes of apples, and he says, let me tell you how I found this church and shared table. So he and I get to visiting, and he says, you know, I was driving through here one day, and it was a pandemonium, which it often is on shared table days with cars parked on the side of the road. And we used to. We aren't doing that now, but we used to have people parked on the side opposite of the church, on the other side of the road.

[21:44] STEPHEN WIARD: That's true.

[21:45] CHERI LYON: And shared table happens on a main highway, the main road, it's not really a highway, but the main road going through Taos. So it's got a lot of traffic. And we're at the edge of town. So by the time people get to us, if they're exiting town, they're picking up speed. And as the people are coming to into town, they're just beginning to slow down. They've been at speed. So it's a fairly fast moving group of people. And so Jean tells me, yep, I knew this was gonna be the church I wanted to be part of. When I look out there and some guy in shorts and a long tailed ponytail is out there directing traffic, trying to get this little old lady across the street with her box of food. And he said, I asked somebody, who's the guy in the street? And one of the folks said, oh, that's our pastor. And he said, that was it. That was for me. That was my church. So what a connection. You know, just being out there just speaks volumes about being present.

[22:58] STEPHEN WIARD: And indeed it does. I guess I say, well, maybe that. Maybe that's really street ministry.

[23:07] CHERI LYON: Exactly.

[23:08] STEPHEN WIARD: Yeah. I remember directing traffic because a lot of people had vehicles that weren't always in the best shape. And it takes a moment to get out there. The traffic's fast. We got a lot of cars. And for a guy who has a high school nickname of crash, that was my high school nickname. I'm very sensitive to that. Tried to help out. Yeah. So. And some people come by bicycles, some come in their vehicles.

[23:37] CHERI LYON: And we're grateful that we're a bus stop for the people coming in from Tres Piedras so they can get out. And then almost always, either one of the volunteers or somebody coming by actually gives people a lift into town to catch the bus. You know, it's kind of interesting, I think, for people outside of Taos. Taos is still a place where a lot of people hitchhike, and it's. And it's reasonably safe. You know, I think in Albuquerque, hitchhiking is not encouraged because it probably really isn't safe. But here, a lot of our shared table, community gets to us, and it's.

[24:19] STEPHEN WIARD: A visual witness also. Cheri Yeah, I've often felt like it. It's kind of a good thing that that little church is right there on the highway coming through town, because there are literally hundreds of people driving by who've said to me over the years and to you, wow, I saw you had a big crowd there Wednesday. Distribution. All the people, all the cars. And it makes them. I like to think it gives them pause enough to say, wow, I'm grateful. You know, here's people who have needed, who, for whatever reason, may be in less fortunate circumstances, and they see the work we're doing, and it is a witness, a visual witness. And that's an important thing, I think, for the community to know what we are about. We are not the only food pantry in Taos. We're not the only church that's doing good work. But this is who El Pablito is, and that is very much a part of the church's identity. You know, people may or may not do church, but they support shared table. And they've said to me over the years, they've said, steve, I don't really do church, but if I did church, I'd do your church. You know? And they've become involved, many of them, because of shared table. And I've been standing in a grocery store line or at a coffee shop or a pub, and sometimes people walk up and. And especially when I buy the school supplies or I'm in there, they say, what are you doing? And I'll tell them the reason, and they'll reach in their wallet and hand me a $20 bill and say, this for the food pantry, or they'll write me a check for $50 and say, use this where you need it. And I'll say, thank you very much.

[26:03] CHERI LYON: Yeah, I'm always amazed when we're in the midst of a distribution and it's happening at its wild pace, as it often does, and somebody will just drive by that's not part of the food pantry and hand over a check and just say, hey, just want to be part of this, or cash. You know, I think one of my most powerful moments at distributions has been we have a gentleman who's got some serious health problems and is older, and a neighbor brings him in from out by Carson, which is way out there on the mesa, and he's off grid, and the very first time he doesn't have his own vehicle, he shows up and he said, I just wanted you to have this. And he gives us dollar 40. And I was in tears. I was just like, you don't have dollar 40, you know? And he says, well, I've always wanted to give, and I do get some money. He's on Social Security disability. And he said, you know, I used to send it to the people on tv, the preachers on tv, but he said, you're my preacher.

[27:22] STEPHEN WIARD: Now.

[27:23] CHERI LYON: He's never been to church inside the worship, but it's that connection, and without fail. And now he's not well enough to come. So a neighbor still comes and picks up a box for him. But I was just amazed. The neighbor handed over the $40 check from him. And, oh, about six months, a year ago, he had to be airlifted to Albuquerque from Holy Cross Hospital here, and he wasn't able to give for a while completely reasonable because he was paying off medical bills and that, and he was just so torn up about it. He said, I am just so sorry. And I said, hey, it's okay. You know, you had to be airlifted. But that heart, that incredible heart that.

[28:12] STEPHEN WIARD: So many people have, and that humbles us all. It gives us perspective. There used to be an individual that would often come by and hand me $5 and say, I want you to have this. It reminds me what you were saying, too, about the generosity of individuals. Early on in my ministry here, we had a program on Wednesday, the Wednesday we're not distributing food for children because there's a lot of need for children. And there was a woman from another organization here in town that was helping as well, named Melissa. And our program was called far out. And the acronym was fun art and reading and outreach. Far out. We called it far out for kids. I wanted to do some for children, and one time we had six or eight kids, and I wanted to do something special, so I took them to the local pizza hut at that time, and we're ordering two or three pizzas, and they're drinking sodas, and they're happy because these kids, these kids don't get to go out and eat much, and they're talking, and we're just a lot of energy. And at the end of the meal, I get up, go to the cash register to pay for the meal. And the young lady at the cash register says, your meal's already been paid for. I said, what? What do you mean? She said, there was a gentleman in here who saw you and all those kids. And he said, I want to pick up their tab. And he paid for it all. And so I went back to the table, and I told the kids, I said, some man just bought our pizza. They said, wow. And there was one young boy I remember distinctly. He spoke up, and Oscar said, may God bless that man. I thought, yeah, that's right. I never knew who it was, but it's a touching story, and it reminds me of how people give. You know, people will give when they believe that you're doing good work and, you know, you don't have to get caught up in all the dogma. Too often institutional churches and others get caught up in the dogma and the rules and regs and all of that. You know, Jesus went around doing good, and we need to remember that, and we need to be socially active. That's what I. That's what our church is about. That's what El Pablito is, and it's continued. And you've carried that forward, you and others, in significant ways, in terms of, through the pandemic and all that's a part of it. The fact that you're fluent in Spanish. We have some individuals who come in and you can converse with them as well. I kind of stumbled through it myself, but, you know, people still connect with one another, and that's so important, hearing about Pizza hut.

[31:34] CHERI LYON: You know, just. I picture it as communion at the Pizza Hut.

[31:37] STEPHEN WIARD: Yes, indeed. That'll pretty.

[31:38] CHERI LYON: It's that breaking bread together. And people may not want to come into a church itself and be part of a communion service, but the just breaking bread together, which for you and I, is what communion's all about.

[31:58] STEPHEN WIARD: That's right. And if I may, I have one more story that happened early in my ministry here. I think about it because there are snowflakes outside today as we're doing this interview, and it's the first day of spring, but it was Christmas Eve, and I was doing, offering a Christmas Eve candlelight service at the church, as I. As I did regularly. And there was a friend there, a friend of mine now gone, named Jack. And we were getting ready for the communion that evening. Snow really falling. Heavy, heavy snowflakes, and weren't quite time to open. It was not quite time to open the doors. But I heard this knock at the door, and so I went and answered the door, and there was a couple there, a young couple with a baby. Now it's Christmas Eve. Young couple with a baby. I'd never seen him before in my life. He said, do you have any food? Cause I said, how can I help you? He said, do you have any food? And I said, I don't think we have anything here at the moment that I can get you at that time. He said, do you have any bread? I said, I don't. And then I looked to Jack, and I said, bread. We have communion bread. Yes. I said, I have bread. I said, get the communion bread. We got the communion loaf. Cut it in half. Gave him half a loaf of bread in the midst of the snowstorm. And they were very grateful. And it was. You talk about Joseph, Mary, and Jesus coming to the door and knocking on a Christmas Eve, and I can give them some communion bread. It's like, wow, that story just touched my heart. And you just never know when the presence of. Of the spirit is going to show itself. Those things make me grateful and glad of what we've done and what you continue to do and others that's so important.

[34:28] CHERI LYON: Well, you've touched the hearts of lots of people, and I think that's what speaks the loudest. So thanks for sharing your stories.

[34:39] STEPHEN WIARD: It's been fun. You're welcome. And thank you and others for keeping the story going. You know, it's. You know, it's important to see what we do continue in a way that can make a difference. And even I always liked the name shared table. I remember that Evelyn and some of the early folks in the church when I came here, they had this idea. They said, we ought to find a way to get people some food. There's a lot of hungry people in Taos And then one of them said, what should we call it? And I think it was Evelyn, now deceased, who said, well, let's call it shared table. And that's been a good name. It stayed with us to gather around and share a table. And someone said, it's not original with me that we need to build longer tables in this country and not higher walls. We need to share a table and what's on it with others. And that's what we try to do, and that's what the church ought to be doing. So I'm grateful to be a part of it. And have you come in as well.

[35:54] CHERI LYON: Well, you know, a favorite hymn of the church, and not just ours, lots, is I love to tell the story. And so it's been great to be able to tell the story today and many stories about El Poblito and shared table. And may the stories continue.

[36:12] STEPHEN WIARD: Indeed, let us hope so. That this old place, it was a bar and a cafe and a gas station and a church and a food pantry making a difference. That's what the ripple effect is all about. We all do it as best we can and keep it going. Thank you.

[36:29] CHERI LYON: Thanks, Steve.