Raymundo Gomez Hernandez and Alexander Ewers

Recorded November 15, 2018 Archived November 15, 2018 40:36 minutes
0:00 / 0:00
Id: chi002807


Raymundo Gomez Hernandez (22) talks to his husband Alexander Ewers (24) about growing up in Mexico City knowing at an early age that he was gay, even before he knew there was a word for it. He talks about heroes, his experience at a church camp (conversion therapy) in Mexico, his religious beliefs, how he met Alexander, and how their first date ended with Alexander uttering, "Bye, I love you," which they laugh about now.

Subject Log / Time Code

RGH talks about heroes.
RGH talks about about the writings of Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz.
RGH talks about asking for a husband for Christmas when he was five.
RGH talks about the conversion therapy/Church Camp he was sent to in middle school.
They talk about God and religion.
They talk about how they met.
They talk about their first date.


  • Raymundo Gomez Hernandez
  • Alexander Ewers

Recording Location

Chicago Cultural Center

Venue / Recording Kit


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00:01 Hi, my name is Raymundo Gomez Hernandez. I am 22 years old 2 days November 15th 2018 to Thursday. We are in Chicago, Illinois, and I'm here with my husband Alexander. I am Alexander ewers. I am 24 years old. Today is Thursday November 15th 2018. We are in Chicago, Illinois, and I'm with my husband, right?

00:24 Hai re Hai Alex so I can see all day right so

00:30 To start today

00:32 What is a hero to Hero?

00:36 Wow, well

00:38 I use Securus.

00:40 Someone who's willing

00:44 To do sacrifice for the greater good someone or you can admire someone that has the power to lead and at the same time who has the courage to do. What's right, even if it's bad for that person, but not for the greater good.

00:58 What do you mean by that person like sacrifices, you know, we are used to looking at heroes from comic books and action movies where they always safe the innocent once and they fight the bill has been read in reality believe human size of a little more complex than that. So Hero has to be someone who's willing to put others in front of him.

01:20 Like their welfare is more important than

01:24 Dumb know you I know you really like manga and Comics like that. I do do you think that's the biggest influence into how you fear Heroes?

01:35 Well, it's definitely has shaped most of it throw my life. I mean ever since I was little my favorite TV show was Power Rangers.

01:44 And growing up as I discover Japanese culture in the comic culture of the United States. I realize that I really like this area fantasy, but also I believe that

01:59 All of my screens that I've gone through in life have told me that heroes are not the person who has the best intentions for the person who can actually show the courage and power to get this intentions into fruition and cuz good results for the people.

02:18 Interesting cell

02:20 Intention really doesn't matter for the hero much money review. I think intentions are good for Motors but not but he wasn't want to be at the results because then you can admire them. Then you say Myers like it's a bad thing. It's not I don't think it was my kind of Tatian. I just

02:43 I think that.

02:46 A lot of people live in a pink bubble and life. Would you feel like ideal spouse when should be is the definition?

02:56 And I feel like when you actually see the horse.

02:59 Problem since two equations of love you realize that sometimes like jelly station just takes you farther away from the truth. And that's why I feel like idealizing a martyr is

03:12 Something a little people to specially who are fans of History interesting. So I mean with those of you do you have a hero?

03:22 Like that person in your life not in your comic books. I know you love Power Rangers like in my personal I think do I have a hero?

03:35 I don't know if I just have one gyro.

03:38 But I could just choose one. I could just use one but let's go by we have time so let's go by like as a kid. Who was your childhood hero?

03:52 And what does he think as I was growing up? I believe in the fantasy Heroes.

03:59 But I never actually believed the heroes were real or could happen in real life. So he didn't had this view on someone specifically the first time that I actually come close to finding so we could be hero.

04:13 Was when I started learning about all the Revolutions in Old the independence war that some countries have to go in Latin America and how the were people who fought for them. Like they were leaders who maybe they didn't fight with the arms on the front lines. They were leading the whole movement with a DS and they were doing it for the greater good and she will have to suffer discrimination personal attacks a lot of negativity in their life with date still went forward knowing that in the future that was going to lead to a greater good. So if I had to pick one, I mean

04:52 So on The Wider scope pick one and I'll go more specific.

05:02 I would say San Juana Ines Dela Cruz who she was a nun in Mexico and the times of the colony. I think there's some Netflix special about her. I'll probably there is a reason why I think she was curious because even though she spent most of her life in a convent.

05:21 Is she doing I should get to spend most of the world. She could a whole movement of women empowerment thinks of her poetry in her writings and Jada she was she was percent of the time were so radical that people thought she is it is better. We keep her put in a tower for the rest of her life.

05:43 But she didn't care no matter how many constructions you got how many punishment she got she still kept writing and there's so many artists nowadays that it was from her in Latin America and Europe to what have you learned from her that you I don't know. What about love.

06:02 She it is it is believe I actually do you learn about love from a nun ya.

06:13 Is she at a letter to a woman that she fell in love with and the letter was also this guy's as a rhetoric to attack man in the patriarchy. So when I read this it was she was talking about how

06:29 KH her heartfelt loving someone say to Ashley her not to see I thought the radical lesbian feminism started in like the sixties. I don't think it started all the way back to then. I mean reality LGBT people have any Humanity for

06:45 Century Cinema lenium has been more head and I guess in the past but yeah, I learned a lot from her. I learned that love isn't easy. I learned that the idealized view Society gives us can be a distraction from find real thing. And it sometimes you do have to adjust your expectations. So you can understand how do we have in this world instead of being depressed for no not chipping teeth. Perfect ideal love that. You know that it's commercial ice.

07:14 How did you find out about her?

07:17 Well when I was in Middle School.

07:20 I'm starting to learn about myself and I always knew that I liked men. I just didn't know that was hoping you would call being gay and that it was so wrong according to Society of the time. So when I was in Middle School, I was talking to one of my teachers and he was really cool just for context. This isn't Mexico City, correct? Yes. Yes. It was a Mexico City and I was going to one of my teachers he was my literature teacher when we were better than we were just reading all things from the colony because that's the crazy one and he realized that every time I wrote I would use Hartz to point my eyes. It was a very feminine thing to do, but I always liked it and then he asked me if I knew what I was and I said, well, I think I'm gay. Like I've seen things about everything seem so bad and then she's like one of you try reading about this.

08:13 And tell me how you feel in a month, and then he introduced me to her writings and she had so many like introspective poems that help me understand what I was going through.

08:26 That what I was feeling was who I was but just because I was telling me not to feel it. I start developing this in a kilt.

08:35 And they were actually very helpful for me.

08:38 It's weird to think that us being both gay, but we grew up Worlds Apart that our experience is coming to our sexuality aren't too much different. I think.

08:53 Humanities Universal and even the word sometimes if I had by circumstances like demographics or nationalities we can still experience the same thing.

09:07 Wow.

09:12 Interesting cuz I remember going up in that very conservative Christian School and being told that my that then my sexuality but nobody knew I was gay. So I mean I play with Barbies as a kid and I was never really into sports or anything. So I wasn't too far off of it wasn't hard to guess. But I just remember that like having it how much better it would have been for me if I had a teacher like that teacher that showed you that book that was but just you know,

09:46 Help me figure out that what I'm feeling isn't some evil or

09:55 Some Abomination cuz I mean like in Middle School specially during that time. I remember like I didn't have the language.

10:05 To label what I was feeling. I didn't know that this is what gate was and it's funny cuz I had a gay Uncle so you like you would think that I would

10:16 Have gotten that but my family's shielded me from so much of that because he died of HIV like like that's something that I should have been exposed to but I wasn't and it got to the point where it in middle school. I thought I was transgender because I didn't know that guys could feel these things that guys could feel traction to mend and it was okay. I thought that the only way I could feel attraction to men was if I was truly a woman and it was so complicated.

10:44 But I wonder what 1/1 Ines Dela Cruz, that's her name. So when I should have let her she could help me.

10:57 It was it was very helpful for me reading about her and he'd help me being strong for all the rejection that came afterwards them in either when I was about twelve Junior High and by that time when my family's are catching up what was going on. They send me to church camp. One of the first one of the first realize you were gay. When did I win D-Day?

11:23 We'll start with when did you?

11:26 I was really five.

11:28 I was watching TV with my grandma and we're watching it like a romantic comedy or something and I just realized like in this movie.

11:39 The guy comes inside the girl and there's they're happy and she feels finally safe and

11:46 Things are good. And I knew I want that, you know, I want to grow up and be like that now that the guy saves the girl but be the girl who finds a guy saved, you know, and when I turned sassy, what do I want for Christmas that time I said, well I want I want one of those husband and they thought that I was just, you know repeating things as a kid, so they gave me a figurine of Power Rangers. That should be good enough.

12:13 But if you're saying Power Ranger turn the gay I wouldn't say but they had a lot of God. So you think that's when they realize yeah. Yeah. I think they knew they sell we timed it was going to go away but when they realized it was not they send me to I can't like I said this church camp and I was there for about 2 or 3 weeks.

12:41 And he was just weird. I mean

12:44 You have adults telling you in such an angry way into any so bad when you haven't done any damage to anyone. It's very confusing. Like how can I be wrong? Because I I find my definition of being a bad person when you do things that affect others viciously and maliciously and I I was enjoying I was just thinking my life student that was a straight-A student. I was doing all my chores at home. I never got into trouble until then. So I I I was very perplexed by why people were saying weird things in your Champion, really I mean,

13:25 I got us a very significant experience in my life, but it didn't change who I was, you know, it's interesting that you still call it Church camp because I mean what I call Church camp and what you call Church camp. I completely worlds apart from each other. Lol. Yeah. I like I like my church camp is be

13:48 Live. Big bouncy balls with Crisco and try to catch them in the lake and your church camp. You were told repeatedly how terrible you were. I mean, it's probably what you was cold compression therapy here. I mean we were at the regimen we have to wake up early in the morning. We pray like four or five times a day. We had very specific meals and all the activities that we had the group Pacific meals, like there's anti-gay meals meals that you would expect a woman to cook for you and your married.

14:29 So you will get used to that kind of food and eventually want it. So like another reason to get married, you know, if a woman likes women though, I bet the cooks are men. I have I have no idea the food came from a room that we had. No you no access to it and we can just we were supposed to eat. We were always like a church distance from each other because we're not even by accident like you cannot even like cross elbows every night. They would put us in bed and they would like tape around her leg with the blankets are they needed someone left the bed during the night to do you know bad things and this is what your 12? Yeah, but they were all agency was. I think the youngest was like 10 the oldest like 17.

15:17 And I was there for like 3 weeks and I mean that most guys were just there but we talked we knew we were not going to change. We just knew we have to go by the rules and stay there as long as you were told him that we were going to be free because if you were to be defiant or break the rules then they were like Corporal like actual punishment. Would it were the punishments like well, I remember there were two guys who I think they are at the time that were dating or they were really close. So one time as we were because one of the things we do is we had to exercise every morning cuz we're real men. Do you know they

15:58 To get the blood going by running and blue running. I want one of these two guys he fell and he's been tired of helping by like putting out of hand unit stand up again. And when one of the priests saw that she got really upset so he took them to one of the other Halls it was like a cabin and they were head with canes in the back.

16:24 Until you had you walk in like a like it would had like one time Berkeley went to her son. Looks like we could cross mark and it would not have going until you get like a blood Mark or like a bruise and I say as long as you have that bruise on your back, then God will protect you from the evil of homosexual entering you again.

16:42 So we knew we didn't want to get hit so we just have to go by the rules for those two to three weeks. It's terrible.

16:48 They never hit you. Did they?

16:54 Yeah.

16:56 They can eat you. Well, we had a writing assignment one time and I am very bad leaving my driving habits. We have to write about our faith in God.

17:07 And

17:09 I i title myself. Okay. I'm going to write whatever I can to get them out of my bag. Like I don't want to be in any trouble.

17:17 But I forgot to know you not use my cursive writing with hearts and stars that I probably right but that's always been me. So when they do they sell such a flamboyant thing one of the other priests took me to one of these rooms and then I was supposed to put my hands on the table and they had like of this it was like a like a piece of fabric. That was really heavy.

17:41 And then like slamming on the hands feel like I guess the count was how many times I rode hard than my eyes.

17:49 And then my hands were like red and sore for like the next two days, but that was the coolest I got to punishment.

17:56 God how do you cope?

18:03 Well, you know, I knew it was temporary and it wasn't going to be there forever.

18:09 And

18:12 A lot of the times in my life when something bad happen. I always live with my body reacted is by giving me a really bad neck. It's like I would really want to scratch my neck. And those are nice there were these cars so we put one around my neck. And I with you ladies and I started that habit and it's been like another I mean

18:38 Remember that cuz anytime you help PTSD attack. You always start it starts by you scratching your back. Yeah, so like it's been 10 years since that's and I've worn his car every single day of my life.

18:52 The most rarest cars to have now

18:57 I think last time I counted I was close to 300.

19:03 Thought we overlap. Yeah, but then I had to donate some City unlike the old ones.

19:12 Is it going back to?

19:15 You have a dream about your faith in a god.

19:19 I mean it's interesting for an atheist, isn't it? Yeah, I pretty much at that point that you realize you're an atheist. Oh, I knew. Yeah. I I just I couldn't conceive I believe in God and I still can't you see

19:37 I

19:40 Event

19:42 I just did I just lucky enough that I've been able to study a little cultures in history throughout my life. Is that really interests me?

19:49 And after we after reading about so many empires and all civilizations only way to like modern society.

19:57 I can see the role that religion has played in humanity. You see humans tend to be chaotic and thus organized because we are sometimes

20:08 Dream Empire the size of greed or anger. So what they need is needed a system of belief that would keep them in check. So you can actually have a social contract or in a society. Like that's what religion came I think that if you find something strong NFL people can believe in that tells him to be good because as good as it's going to get them or did you go to buy buy it and I don't think there's anything wrong with it. In fact, I think religion still plays an important role in our society nowadays.

20:39 But that's all I see to it. I see an extremely beneficial if done properly system of human.

20:48 Organization that can a the society and at the same time I believe humans can be sometimes, you know drown in this feeling of nothing that you are know what's going to happen. If you die. You don't know how important you are the world. You don't know you have a purpose and religion can feel that boy. So you can Center of your worries into the Practical things like how to be a efficient successful worker how to work in society how to make a family

21:16 And even though I believe the oldest good things come from it. I don't think there's a higher up figure that's controlling everything you like a puppeteer. So I respect all religions. And I mean if you have if you have someone who tells me how you want to go to church with me, I'll go respect the rights and the prayers for you like me an interesting cuz you know, you're an atheist and I mean Universe list, so we're pretty much on the exact opposite of any religious Spectrum, you could please assist very peacefully. Like I know there's a lot of a PS4 very cynical and collect to prove that are wrong. Lucia stronger dumber than them. I don't want to do that. I honestly don't know if they're dumb you're not that that intelligence not measured by religion, I believe.

22:09 I presume that there is not a God and a religion only works as a function of society's organization. But you have religion. I respect it. If you want to have holidays, go ahead if you want invite me. I'll celebrate with you.

22:21 But I just don't believe although I don't have the need to prove you wrong. I think that's just so I remember last year when

22:33 You know me. I'm very curious about religion to win. We're living in Bloomington. And since Bloomington has a Hindu temple. I asked if we could go celebrate Diwali. What were your thoughts when I asked you?

22:47 Will you have my husband so I have to be completely honest I was very confused.

22:54 Because

22:58 I thought you were.

23:02 Trying to explore this new exotic thing in your life. That could be cool.

23:07 And I didn't know that was going to disrespectful to them or not.

23:12 So I went with you because you know.

23:15 I wanted to be respectful to your choice. I just I

23:21 I don't think

23:24 That we

23:27 Can be as freely as to do all these things without taking into consideration how it would affect the community like sometimes you don't know if an outsider to a very strong release Community Howard The Outsider can be to that might be offensive in might be something that they feel attacked by.

23:46 3 Fahrenheit in since I did ask my Hindu friend come all who worships there and like I was talk to her about Diwali and she invited me initially how I tell me about that and that's why I said yeah, let's go. I still have my reservations. Of course. I usually tend to be very cautious when these things, you know in history some of the most violent groups and most violent reactions have come really just go to felt attacked. So I always keep that in mind as you

24:18 You're so certain.

24:20 And your beliefs end.

24:24 I'm not like I because like I I struggle on.

24:31 Importing one single answer about it like being raised in Evangelical Christianity. I am not comfortable with the answers that provided to me and so I explore and I have to explore because

24:45 Part of me

24:48 Like after I was rejected from the church for coming out.

24:54 I tried to stay away from church or any religious expression and I couldn't do it like that. I needed something there.

25:03 And so I found

25:05 After a long arduous path universalism

25:11 But it's weird cuz it's I don't know like

25:15 It just a couple you like. I'm surprised I Married an atheist, honestly.

25:21 Because one

25:24 I never thought I would like when like that part of me who because my upbringing like you always taught that atheists are like the devil their evil. Anybody doesn't believe in God is not a good person is gone is a son of Satan and you need to reject them like being as we are told scripture do not be unevenly yoked with a non-believer, but I found myself not believing he's not believing how they told me to believe and here we are remarried, but I'm also surprised about how little

26:03 Of a fact that was

26:05 And me choosing relationship with you and eventually marriage with you like it was not a major part of our marriage. I think this comes to explain that or show.

26:19 Religion to tell the Sami people evil or bad and I think when people say well religion rejects me or for assembly Christianity when I accept homosexuals, I say that's not entirely true. I think I think a lot of religions

26:36 Are running to the world things to be interpret what the actual

26:43 You can say sacred writings or their coats do or say and this is what priests do for example, when you go to church, they interpret their own understanding of the Bible and then give it to you. So when you're rejected regular paper for interpreting the Bible in certain ways, I mean like I was rejected by

27:03 What is the form of Christianity I was raised in that group there exactly mean that religion itself is protecting you and it doesn't mean that all rich people are bad and ulna religious are good or bicep. It just means that you probably encountered the wrong interpreter someone who's willing to pitch hate instead of love.

27:24 And that's why I respect a religious. I think there's there's not good or bad in all of them. There's just

27:33 Belief Sarah mutual and whoever Enterprise and besides how to take them.

27:38 Like and I believe that about everything else there's things about religion that I don't think right but as long as people who believe them harm me under the don't bring it to into my life that I have nothing to say to them to free to leave them. It's interesting you say that police are neutral like

27:57 I feel like from what you've said.

28:00 Clear that there's not a neutrality to belief.

28:04 I believe so mutual I'm saying like for example the Bible itself the book just take it by what it is. It's a set of stories.

28:14 That depict how people who believe in this relationship behave and then the second part about the Son of God coming to the Earth and telling us how we should cover for a sense of how we should my Redemption and get to heaven. Bye. Toot by itself. I don't think it's evil or good. I just think it's a book depending on the priest depending on the pastor to interpret in so many ways and people always say welders bad things. They can do the Old Testament about how you can sell your daughter for this amount of goats are gold or like how you should know where this type of fabric and things like that and then I asked people to look into it historically.

28:53 When the book was created, they were probably social rules that people were not following they whoever wrote it or whoever put it together. Maybe if I had some of these regulations to the believes people will follow the only time they become obsolete.

29:08 So in modern society, of course, we're not going to follow those rules don't apply to her side anymore. We're in the recital. We're not as a side of exchange of goods or things like that where monocyte would have way more complex structure organization. So you just have to adapt it, but it's not bad by itself to difference between Jefferson you speak very academically about a very human subject.

29:36 And it's something that I think that I can't do because I am so

29:46 It's so intertwined in me. Like it. It's not something like I can't imagine my life without some form of religious expression.

29:55 But you can

29:58 I mean I iron I can understand that. I was also raced under this mixture of my mom. My mom used to be Christian and then she met my step dad who's agnostic and then she became atheist and my mom's brother. He's actually Jewish.

30:22 And my grandma comes from a Catholic background, so I was raised knowing that there's oldest different types of religions and I can do for the world is so instead of taking it too hard at this might any cannot be changed her ways. Well, maybe there's more

30:37 Will use him as we have the capacity to study to learn. It's interesting cuz that's the same question. I asked maybe there's more.

30:47 And buts were a completely different opposite ends of the spectrum. I don't believe in the magical. There's more like maybe there's a God. No, I believe there's more in there like there's more knowledge to acquire. Well, as I said, maybe there's more that I'm not satisfied with what just want to answer like I want options I want

31:09 I don't want to say this is right and all of this over here is wrong. Like I don't want to say that Allah is the only God and then we'll screw and a Dash like I don't want to say those kind of things cuz I'm not comfortable with making such.

31:24 Decorative statement. I'm not liking that I'm not saying that my way of thinking is Right. Anyone else is wrong and dumb I'm saying this is how I believe this how I choose to believe reality is and if you ask me I'll tell you but have no interested in prove you wrong because this is just my belief this when it comes to like being tolerant to other Steven points of views like this people who genuinely believe that you have to be a virgin till marriage. Otherwise your son is going to be born if you get pregnant in to send that's fine. If you want to preach that for yourself and your life I will not fight it but if I don't want to live my life differently

32:08 And this is a conclusion that I come to After All These Years of Living.

32:14 It's interesting that use the verb preached that protect yourself because like the actor preaching his others oriented. So if you're preaching something I'm telling it to you and other people.

32:27 I wonder if there's even like an ability to even just preach for myself. I think that's the way to go. I mean you are the one who decides how to live your life.

32:36 How do you think that will work when we have kids are for kids for the record to kiss? Thank you. I buy it. I think we'll cross that bridge when we get there. It's going to be complicated.

32:55 Can you talk about?

32:58 Do you want the truth?

33:05 We met at a coffee shop. Yeah, that's what we

33:11 Tell everybody we met online. What are we where we originally meet dating app? What was the name of the date again? I'm not going to grinder we met on Grindr.

33:26 Yeah, but we tell everyone family members and friends that we met him at a coffee shop. How do you tell your 84 year old grandmother you put on Grindr like you can't do that.

33:38 We met on a dating app. He asked me to get coffee after that. We had coffee and that coffee. They were just when you clicked you.

33:49 You never

33:52 I don't know. I just remember I was terribly nervous.

33:56 And then you walked in and remember I asked you if you wanted a cop a cup of coffee. And you said no I don't like coffee and I was very tempted to walk out right there because you know my addiction I've never liked coffee and I don't think I'll ever like coffee but I decided to redo the coffee they because I wanted to talk to you and you talk to me first Like You Talk to an online first and then you ask me out to cook it to go a coffee and then I got coffee and we never stop talkin like I was there for an hour and a half at least.

34:31 Him and then I had to go back to my office to work.

34:35 I talked to you that day.

34:37 But I remember our first date date our first dinner date. Yeah, it was the Friday after that coffee date.

34:46 That coffee day was actually on a Tuesday, but the Friday after you asked me in a few we went to get dinner and it was a nice dinner after that coffee day. I went back to my office cuz like you never have my office was was sick as a graduate teacher like there was with me and a bunch of cubicles and other teachers and I went back to my friends and told them that this one felt different. I felt special that there's something unique I guess I was right.

35:19 So we had our first dinner date.

35:23 We went to Medici you barely ate any of your dinner. I am a very slow eater forever now. So I just had something very light and then we saw that terrible movie.

35:42 Hosea polish interpretation of The Little Mermaid

35:45 So bad at the art house. That's so weird. I don't even know why we went to see that movie like they cut the mermaid and half and then they like sent to her. It was just so weird. Yeah, it was just as those. What are they? Do they are?

36:03 Cut her and 1/2 much lobster tail. She couldn't sing anymore. I know and then and then there was a guy who was wanting to have sex with one of the mermaids that why they cut off her tail vaginas Virgina and they got it did it but it was we are so that she like cut her like she wanted to get her tail cut off the guy's life so you can have sex with the guy and somehow it works like she had actual leg since you walk which is like medically possible and then at the end she wants her tail back cuz then she lost her voice. Yeah, cuz somehow the mermaid's tale the movie was so bad in the room and eating like the eight people. Yes. Yes. There was a dinner the cruise remember like the mermaid is going with this guy dinner cruise in there eating another person and then she gets so mad that they got doesn't love her anymore because he finds another girl had her that she just kills him Indiana gets her tail bag, and it's

37:03 I don't get how that was a little mermaid. Like I'm going to stay with Disney cuz I kind of like them or

37:11 And then I walked you home and you kept telling me my house is closed. My house is class. Your house was not close to be fair. I was close to me.

37:22 That's close to us, but not close because you're like, oh, it's just up here. It's just up here in the corner and corner and it still wasn't there.

37:33 It was awkward about that night, but I said goodbye. I said I love you. It was worth it was instinctive. It wasn't even like you like I didn't even mean I love you. I literally went on the phone like as I open the door to my house to say bye love you, and then my roommates are in the living room they heard and they were like, well that must have been a really good date, They said now there's a really good Sam sleep together.

38:01 Oh, yeah, and then you know.

38:05 Then what year in almost 2 years after that, we're Mary. We got married quick, but I don't regret it.

38:14 I think you know if you know what you want.

38:17 In a good light good laugh for that.

38:21 60 more years marriage promise me

38:25 Yeah, I just

38:28 I'm happy to be here with you.

38:32 You think when?

38:33 You close the door after he said I love you. Oh, well first I thought it was funny.

38:42 And then

38:44 I got that sense that there was something to move feel safe about this, you know, sometimes and Love You Phillip briski feel like things are like you're walking on thin ice. But after this after that one day, I feel like I know this is just a stable. This is good. And after that after you close the door, I like ran down the block and I called Janette who would have been when I bridesmaids in our wedding freaking out because I caught what I did was like damn I cannot possess. I love you in the first date.

39:23 But I just it didn't feel like a red flag with you felt like you was okay.

39:31 Said I love you first and then you'd like when I first felt love you said it first, but you said it in French and I have no idea what you're saying to Tim Janis like what?

39:46 Are regardless I still love you, and I'm happy to be here with you and I love you, too, and I'm happy to be here with you talking.

39:53 Popeye

39:55 Sorry, can I just ask so after did you address it after that? I didn't want to not fertilized egg few months. I mean my roommates give me what my roommates winded up being my best friends for life. Worm in my wedding party. We always talked about it. Just a thing. Like Alex said, I love you right after the first interstate like a month or so, but now I just felt like I had to walk on eggshells book the next month after that exhausted, but I do