Connie Williams and Lance Friend

[00:06] CONNIE WILLIAMS: My name is Connie Williams. I am 68 years old. The date is August 27, 2022. I am in the story court's virtual recording booth and I'm here with Lance, my one small step conversation partner.

[00:24] LANCE FRIEND: And. Hi, my name's lance friend. I'm 49 years old. The date is August 27, 2022, and I'm in the storycorps virtual recording booth and I'm here with Connie, my one small step conversation partner.

[00:40] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Hi, Connie. Hi, Lance. Thank you both for being here today to participate in one small step. So, Connie, I'll ask you first, why did you want to participate in this one small step conversation? I wanted to participate with storycorps because I think it's important that we take the time to get to know someone that's different from us, to listen to their points of views. We can always agree to disagree, but I just think it's important that we listen to one another. Great. And how about you, Lance?

[01:19] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah, I found it interesting, very similar with what Connie said is to, you know, in most of our lives, we tend to associate with people that are like us. Right. Or have similar beliefs and opinions. And I found it an interesting way to maybe get to know somebody who comes from a different background, different opinions. Could be politically, could be socially, it doesn't really matter, but just a space to listen and to understand. Maybe a different perspective.

[01:54] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Fantastic. Well, I will kick us off by starting us off on the bios that you both shared. So, Connie, I will have you read the bio that Lance shared. So could you please read the text of that bio? Yes, I am a white male, age 49, born in Scottsdale, Arizona and relocated to Dallas, Texas at the age of five. Only child born into a republican family from the midwest. Mother was a carrier educator for this from 45 plus 0445 plus years. And father was a career salesman. I grew up in a modest household but was fortunate to have many opportunities. I outside of school, I had a close relationship with my mother's family. Fathers, not so much. And my relationship with my father was difficult, to say the least. Great. Thank you. And Lance, could you please go ahead and read Connie's bio?

[03:02] LANCE FRIEND: Sure. I'm a Christian from Texas. I believe in equality, inclusion and social justice. But I don't feel that we, the United States, are one nation under God. Being raised by a single mother taught me to be hardworking and independent. I'm curious about other cultures, how and why they do things differently from us. And I'm willing to listen to opposing viewpoints and Issues that are important to me are racism in America, the lack of integrity in politicians, and the current health crisis.

[03:37] CONNIE WILLIAMS: So from here, I will leave it to the two of you. Is there a question that either of you would like to start with based on something that resonated with you in the bios? I would. I would like to know from Lance why your relationship with your father was difficult.

[04:00] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah. So as I said, we. I grew up in a. I guess I would call it a modest household. Right. But we had, you know, it was a modest household, but it was a performance based household. Right. Only child. Everything revolved around performance. So as I grew up, starting from the age of five, you know, it was learning how to ride a motorcycle. Then at the age of 8, it was racing motorcycles. By the age of 13, I was racing pro. I was traveling around the entire United States in stadiums, outdoors, hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of money behind me at that point in time. And it was. It was the perf. I think it was more of a performance based. And he was a very. He was a performance based individual. Right. He grew up racing boats, jet boats, in. Actually in Scottsdale and Firebird and in California, in the Modesto area out in California. But everything around our relationship was based around performance. Even then, carrying that type of performance based relationship into the marriage with my mother, he was an abusive individual, both verbally and physically, which is something that put a significant strain on our relationship. Right. Is that as the only child and as the protector, it strained that relationship definitely over a period of time that just made things complicated, to say the.

[05:45] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Least that I fully understand. Is there a reason why you didn't know his family?

[05:53] LANCE FRIEND: It's not that I didn't know his family. I think his family was distant. Right. So he. He had a couple of brothers, his mother. He was adopted. He grew up in a pretty. I would call disruptive childhood to where father was in the circus, carnival traveled, and that I didn't know a lot about that until he passed. And I lost both he and my mother within 20 days of each other during COVID And so learning, I think learning how he grew up put a lot of insight into the man he was. And, you know, not that he strived to do things bad or he did the best he could, but at the end of the day, his family was just a bit distant. Right. It was a fragmented family. We were always closer to my mother's side, my grandfather, my grandma, my grandpa. I never knew my dad's dad at all. So he was really raised by a Single mother as well, who was a pretty hard lady in her own right. So I think just naturally, through how the family dynamic worked, that was how it went. Right.

[07:16] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Do you feel that you reconciled any of those feelings of the difficulty and with your. With your father?

[07:25] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah, so they were reconciled. I think, post his passing, to be quite honest, it was, you know, forgiveness is a powerful thing. Right. And, you know, while he was alive, there, again, the last, I would say, and he and my mother were married for 50, 55 plus years. But while he was alive, it was difficult to forgive because the behavior was still there, quite honestly. He was a. He was just a nasty guy. Right. And he was. He was somebody that I didn't want to be. But I will say there's a lot of traits that. That I picked up, positive traits. He was successful. You know, I think he. He taught me a lot, even though it kind of came in backdoor ways. But there was. There was a lot that was taught there. Taught in the wrong ways, but probably had the right outcomes. Yeah. Forgiveness. I think forgiveness is a powerful thing. Right. And. And I've had to learn how to do that over. Over time, for sure.

[08:33] CONNIE WILLIAMS: May I just say that I'm sorry that you lost both of your parents within 20 days?

[08:37] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah. One on Christmas and one on January 15th. So Covid took them both down.

[08:46] CONNIE WILLIAMS: I'm sorry to hear that.

[08:48] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah. Thank you.

[08:50] CONNIE WILLIAMS: I don't know if you're aware, but there are grief groups out there and available. I participate in one right now because I lost someone that was dear to me and I was struggling, actually. I've been struggling since my mother passed six years ago. And then it was just with COVID and, you know, people are dying just left and right, and it just got to be too much for me to handle. So I sought out a grief group, and I found it very helpful.

[09:19] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah.

[09:20] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Some very good friends there.

[09:22] LANCE FRIEND: That's very good. Yeah, we. You know, it. I found a lot of solstice with the church, the pastor who, you know, was able to kind of bring all that together as well. I think. I think you're right. I think that, you know, to me, the current health crisis is terrible. Right. I think it's, you know, I've probably got my own views on what it is and why it happened, but I don't think that Covid was a mistake by any means. I think Covid was deliberate, and I think it was. It was a. It was a deliberate. It was probably the best, to me, the best weapon that was ever created without ever firing A shot. Right. In my opinion. Right. And it's scary because it just shows you how vulnerable I think we are. And I don't know. You know, Connie, looking at your bio, I don't know if that's kind of where you were going with the current health crisis, but could you. You know, what do you. What do you see there? Because I do agree the integrity of our politicians is pathetic. You know, whether you're a Democrat or Republican, an independent. I don't know if anybody's telling the truth these days. And you might have one side or another. I don't know if either side is in the right at this point in time. But could you elaborate on that a little more? On the health crisis you talk about?

[10:49] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Yes. Yes. With COVID I felt that I'm a single woman, and I'm pretty okay with that. I like to travel. I get out, I meet people, I socialize. But with COVID and all that coming to a screeching halt, I found myself feeling really, really lonely. And I, like you, thought it was deliberate as well. It's like, I'm not exactly sure who to blame it, but my first thought was, this is biological warfare. It was just too much and too fast, you know, and then it changed everybody's way of life. But in that year, I found that I prayed a lot, I got to know myself a lot, did some introspective, you know, just kind of looking inward and figuring out who I was at that point in time. So it was a difficult time again, because you. I felt isolated. I felt distant from my family, who are all in Texas, and I couldn't go visit them. And I normally made it a yearly trek to Texas to see them, to stay connected. But without that, I was feeling distant. And, you know, the rules were changing daily because I was still working. We were sent home immediately. Just go home. They didn't know what to do. And then we were off. I'm a first responder for six weeks, and before they realized, oh, we can't send those people home. You gotta come back to work. So we went back to work, but then we were locked in our individual offices at work. We weren't allowed to have lunch together. We had to wear a mask anytime you left your office just to go to the bathroom, or you get your lunch and you go back to your office and close your door, and you eat alone. So it was very taxing for me, and I just assumed that everybody else was feeling that as well. I don't, you know, and to watch the news daily I had to stop for a while because watching the number of deaths across the United States was just staggering to me, you know, and it's like I couldn't wrap my brain around, how are we losing this many people? What are healthcare professionals doing? And it just seemed to be a disease that we've never seen before. You know, we've had SARS before, so why is this so much different? Why were there no treatments for it? You know, why were the elderly, which really concerned me much more, you know, prone to die? So I had those concerns. And I'm the oldest person on our staff BY at least 20 years, you.

[13:47] LANCE FRIEND: Know, so what do you do? What do you do?

[13:50] CONNIE WILLIAMS: I'm a assistant fire prevention chief.

[13:53] LANCE FRIEND: Oh, okay.

[13:54] CONNIE WILLIAMS: All right. And so we. I mean, we had to go to work because our contractors were still working and they still needed services that we normally provide. And of course, the contractors are construction workers that are building and they're working outside and not wearing their mask. And I'm feeling exceptionally vulnerable because of my age and health conditions. And so it was just a lot to manage, and I don't think it was managed well. But I can. I'm really not in a position to say that because I'm not a first responder for healthcare. You know, I didn't have to transport, but we have paramedics that were transporting and being exposed daily. And, you know, and then you had all the questions that we had to ask before we could even have the ambulance respond. You know, is this person positive? Do they have to suit up? Will we have to disinfect the ambulance when he returns and, you know, get rid of everything that's in there? And it was just. It was just overwhelming. It was overwhelming.

[15:05] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah, it. I agree. And I, you know, I learned a lot about it when. Because my mother and father both, you know, my father passed first, and that was on Christmas. And by New Year's Day, my mother started the cough, and they lived about three hours away. And when I talked to her on New Year's Day, her sister had flown in to be with her because I lost my father, and I had stayed three or four days. And I said, you know, mom, I'm gonna go back. I'm gonna get some things taken care of, spend some time with your sister, and I'll be back. And by New Year's Day, when she started the cough, I said, mom, you've got Covid. And she, you know, she was a. You know, I'm six, two. I'm a big guy. My father was five, five My mother was five one. So you can imagine the family Dyn, right? But, you know, sweet little lady who said, I don't have Covid. It's my seasonal allergy. And I said, mom, you've got Covid. And she ignored it. She refused to go get tested. Two days later, she was in the hospital. And then she died 13 days later. But the interesting thing about it is, when you were in the hospital, I got to know the healthcare workers obviously quite well because they both passed in the same town. And the split on how to treat it, what it was, were the right things or the wrong things being done. It was crazy, right? And we're still in contact, actually, with my mother's. With the nurse who was treating my mother, because there just weren't even enough doctors. So these were nurses treating. And she was a contract nurse who, again, we've kept in touch with. She went from Texas, then she was sent on contract to California. And we talked to her recently, and she said, I just wanted to let you guys know, I quit. I quit my rn. I'm not nursing anymore. Then we said, you know, why? And she said, I couldn't watch people die. She said, you know, we were seeing patients die at a 30 to 40% rate in their hospital in the daily. In the ER. So, you know, in the ICU, if they had 15 beds, seven would die a day. So, you know, I don't know. Interestingly enough, though, when you talk about how you were with COVID mine was a bit different, right? Because I. In my job, I used to travel, prior to Covid, at least 200, sometimes 300,000 miles a year around the world on an airplane, millions and millions of miles right under my belt and my suitcases. And, you know, prior to Covid, I was really never home, you know, I mean, nice house, lovely home, great family, but I wasn't really present, if you know what I mean, Right? You know, you kind of come and you go, and I, you know, I would. I would get on an airplane in Dallas and I'd fly to India, and I do that and be back within four days. And I thought, well, that's great. But I spent so much time in an airplane, I felt as though I was isolated, to be quite honest, from my family, because I was never around. So we did the same thing in our business. We sent everybody home, right? And we said, you know, I work for a company. We're based in Paris. 330,000 people around the world. I've got about 16,000 that work for me in North America and we sent them all home and I went home and I didn't travel for, on business for a year and a half. And honestly it was, it was one of the best things that ever happened to my family because we were here. Right. So a bit different, a bit different from how we felt. But I would agree with you 100%. The isolation piece to me was the scariest because what it tells me with our political environment and whether, you know, that's, that's a social environment, the political climate, whatever is that there's going to be another one. Right. Because Covid still isn't gone. I mean it's still here. What it showed, I think what it rang true to me is that no longer does there have to be a war like going on in the Ukraine to stifle an economy, to stifle people, to hold people back to. In any of those things, it's as simple as a virus being released. Right. And it's scary because what's the next one? Right. And what happens next and what's the role in government or the role in the healthcare system? What does that look like going forward? Right. Because I think it was, I'm no science expert, but I have to think it was handled pretty poor. When the, when the data findings came out that said they, they had somewhat of an antivirus a couple of months into this thing. It was developed in the UK by one of my customers. So that's how I know that. Right. Which is interesting. And it's scary to me of what's next. Right. And it's to me, it's a scary world. When I look at the climate that my children, I've got a 17, a 15 and 11 year old are coming up in now because I think the amount of unrest between the political parties is out of control as well. It's like if you're a Democrat, you're on one side, a Republican on the other side. Look, I'm a Republican fiscally, but on my, on my views of what you do with your body, your sex, the way you live, how you want to, I don't care. None of my business.

[21:23] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Right, I agree with that.

[21:26] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah. I mean black, white, India, I don't care. You do what you want to do. But the climate concerns me right now because it almost seems as though it's an all or nothing.

[21:41] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Yes. There's no middle ground.

[21:43] LANCE FRIEND: None.

[21:44] CONNIE WILLIAMS: And that's what made me want to do StoryCorps for one thing. Because there has to be a middle ground. We both have to, no matter what side you are. And you have to be willing to bend and adjust and accommodate. If we don't, none of us is going to survive this. And I can't figure out why people have it or can't get that. You know, if you don't lend a hand or reach out to somebody else, then we're all going to just burn. It's like it's not going to work. And that's been the case since the beginning of time. And I don't understand why. We're in 2022 and we're still having these difficulties. You know, we haven't learned a thing.

[22:27] LANCE FRIEND: It didn't seem, I don't know, you think about that, right? Is that. Is it, you know, what's it based upon? Is it based on, you know, the division? Is it based on money? Is it based on belief? Is it based, you know, I don't know. Right. But you're right. It's like the division. Even when you look at the division in the political parties right now. Right. If you think about, you know, I guess when I became aware of politics, I was probably truly aware of politics. You know, you're probably 16, 17, 18, something like that is when I was aware of it. But there used to be middle ground. I mean, you would have the Republicans, the Democrats, you would have, you know, collaboration within the parties. And the news was the news. Right. And I think the biggest change I've seen is that the news no longer is the news. Right. The news, you know, if you remember, like, who was it? Walter Cronkite. Right. I'm just. I forgot what his tagline used to say, but it was something like, and I'm just here to report the news or something like that. It's. No, that's no longer the news outlets now, or in my opinion, the news outlets have turned into propaganda for whatever party they want to push the agenda out for. It's not the news anymore.

[23:57] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Right, right. And that's my issue with politicians. I don't think. I'm hoping there's somebody in there that's willing to look out for all Americans except for their political. Their own personal political agenda and what can I get out of it? So for me, my political upbringing was pretty much Democratic. Being raised by a single mother and, you know, we did rely on social services for a period of time to help my mother. And so I have a tendency to want to help others. If I see somebody that's in need and I have it, I'll give it to them. You know, that's Just me and the way that I was raised. But I think I wasn't really politically aware. Maybe when I was maybe 16 or so. I don't recall my mother ever discussing anything political in the household, but I'm sure it had to happen. But I just. Maybe I just wasn't aware. But I'm really curious to know, did your relationship with your family deepening during COVID while you're home with them, did you get to know them a little better?

[25:14] LANCE FRIEND: I did, yeah.

[25:15] CONNIE WILLIAMS: I did, yeah.

[25:16] LANCE FRIEND: And it's a blended family, right? So it's my daughter's 17 and then I've got two stepchildren, the 15 and the 11. And it gave, you know, and during the time. I'll kind of set a stage for you. During the time of COVID we had. We had bought a new home in 2019. Model home, gorgeous, gorgeous piece of property. We moved in and out of the home six times, fully moved in and out of the home six times during COVID because the home had defective water plumbing. So by the. So we had a leak and they'd fix a leak, another leak, they'd fix a leak. And then we had to literally take every piece of plumbing out of this 6,000 square foot home and replumb the entire house. So during COVID we were kind of gypsies, right? I mean, we, we, you know, we moved out of the house for five months. We lived in a rental property. We moved back in, we had another leak a year later. We then had to live in two separate townhomes next to each other because in Dallas we had the big storm, right? So all these houses froze. Everybody was trying to find living accommodations because they had no water. So now we're in two town homes. We had a nanny living with us from Italy for those two years. During COVID she couldn't go home to see her family. I mean, we were a band of misfits, right? But we made it work, I guess was the point. And I think what, what the best thing that came out of it. If you, if you can look at a silver lining of what did Covid bring to us? It brought the family closer together about my relationship and my wife closer together because she traveled all the time too, right? So that, that's why we had to have a live in nanny to where we would had overlapping schedules. She was in one country, I was in another country. And it slowed us down. Right. And I think what's come out of that is, you know, now it's. Instead of saying, hey, I've Got to run up to New York for the night. Right. It's. Can I just do it a different way? Right. Maybe I'll just. I'll do it over, you know, a video conference or I'll do this. But, you know, I used to travel to New York to do a dinner and then come home. And I think it slowed a lot of people down, though. Right. But the fear is. I think the fear is, is that now going to change the way people work? Right. Is it going to change the way you work? Is it going to change the way they operate? You know, when are people going to feel safe again to go travel like they used to? And I don't know. I don't know if they will. Right.

[28:14] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Yeah, I don't think we will. At least I don't. I am just getting. I see a little window of opportunity for travel again. And so I went to Texas to see my brother. We were in Mesquite. That's what I remember earlier. Yes.

[28:30] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah.

[28:30] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Yes. And then I came back and I went over to Denver for four or five days to visit my niece. And then I came back and I was down in San Diego last weekend with my brother, you know. Yeah. So I'm trying to. It's like, oh, I have a window of opportunity. I have to get out there. Well, I can, because I think it's coming back again because we monitor the numbers and already we're back in face mask. Unless you're behind closed doors in the office by yourself. You know, we're doing that thing. We're doing the sanitizing again. And so the numbers, I think we started out with 20 positive cases, and then that was on a Friday. And then we had 46 on Monday. So we can see that it's happening again and it's never been gone, but people are. You go out and about and nobody's wearing their mask. And I'm trying to, you know. Yeah, well, it's better than nothing.

[29:28] LANCE FRIEND: Right? I mean, is the mask even effective? Because that, again, that determines who you ask. Right. And who you talk to.

[29:34] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Right. I just thought it was better than enough. And if you don't want to wear one, that's your own choice. But for me, I thought it was going to protect me. If you're healthier than I am, you don't think it's going to help you, I'm okay with that. I'm not trying to force anybody to do anything that they're not comfortable with. But for me, you know, if I'm talking to you, I May take a couple steps back, you know, so we can have this conversation. But I have to do what I feel I can do to protect myself. But that's my biggest fear was, you know, what if I get sick and I'm here by myself?

[30:09] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah.

[30:10] CONNIE WILLIAMS: You know, if I call an ambulance, are they going to come from me knowing that I'm COVID positive, you know, it's like, I don't know. Plus, I'm old and I'm black. So I've got all the categories filled. Check, check, check. You know, will they just take me to the hospital and let me die? And that, that was my biggest fear really, were choosing, having to choose who were the best candidates for survival, you know, and I wouldn't fit that category. So do I even call them or do I just stay in the house and die? You know, it's just, it was. I'm just a mess. But I think the fear comes, the division is fear based because we just don't know. We're not willing to allow someone to have a different belief system than we do. You know, it's just. I've just never seen this before.

[31:00] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah, I think that's interesting, Right. Because I'm under the same belief system as you is that if you want to wear a mask, go wear a mask. If you don't want to wear a mask, don't wear a mask. But the thing that I found troubling in the current climate is when the government stepped in to say, we will shut businesses down. Right? You think about it, they shut the. I mean, New York's lost over 45% of their restaurants that will never come back. Right. Because they. So they've shut. They shut all these private businesses down through a governmental mandate and then said, tough, right. I mean, it is what it is. If you go out of business, you go out of business. And that's where I think the lines got crossed, in my opinion. I. That to me is not fair market economy. That to me is not allowing people to choose what they believe is best for them. That to me is bordering on, you know, a socialism type driven agenda of we're going to tell everybody what they can do and how they can do it. And that again, that worries me. Right.

[32:25] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Yeah, I think that was a major concern for everybody. But at the same token, I thought, what were our other choices? What were the choices? I mean, I heard a lot about the big government because even our offices were divided on what we should and shouldn't do and who's getting vaccinated, who isn't getting. I mean, we were actually having in house fights about this. It was getting altercations amongst the employees, you know, because some refused to take the vaccinations, and they have a right not to be vaccinated. But by the same token, those of us that choose to be vaccinated have a right to do so as well. So, you know, it just seemed to me that the ones that chose not to be vaccinated had all the power. So I said to them, if you're filing grievances because you don't want to be vaccinated, what's there to keep us from filing grievances because we want to be vaccinated? So then nothing gets done because everybody's fighting. So just everybody choose to do what you can do to make you feel good at the time, to make you capable of operating, you know, and functioning. It doesn't have to agree with me, but, you know, we can divide the room, go over here and do what you need to do, and let's move on without just getting so stagnant till we don't do anything, you know? And it was. It was just.

[33:54] LANCE FRIEND: I think. I think to me, it was the. If I think about it, it's the course of action without the course of all the knowledge, right? And what I mean by that is, I think so saying to someone, you have to wear a mask to enter a restaurant to walk in the door, but once you sit at your table, you're good. You don't need to wear your mask anymore. That, to me, is the dumbest thing I've ever heard in my entire life. Right? Because does that really mean that the COVID can't travel at a table, but it can only travel when you go in the front door? Right? And when you start to put things like that on paper, it just doesn't make any sense. But somebody came up with that as a way of, in my opinion, control. Again, my opinion, it was. It was a. It was a control thing to say. We have to show that we're doing something, even though is it really working? Right? And I don't know, and I don't know if anybody really knew whether it was working or not, Right? And now, you know, I think we.

[35:01] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Had a lot of that during COVID because nobody knew, you know, and now that you say it like that, it really doesn't make sense. But for me, I was just kind of concerned about being in a group of people. Like, if you just walk in a restaurant and there's waiting out there, waiting of Course, I think, well, it's better to mask up and not. But that's just me. I know. It's just been a very interesting time. It's a trying time, and it's. And it is a scary time.

[35:35] LANCE FRIEND: Scary.

[35:36] CONNIE WILLIAMS: And for me, I'm just trying not to be. I'm. I'm trying not to live in fear. That's my goal. You know, I try to make good choices for myself and just move forward. That's all I can do. You know, at this point, you know, I have a question in the chat box from Julia. She's curious as to how I ended up in the Central Valley from Texas. I was married to a military man for 32 years, and we lived in San Diego for seven years. We moved to Corpus Christi for three years, into Hawaii for three years, and then we came here to the Central Valley, and things got a little difficult, and we divorced after 32 years. And I ask myself that question every day. Why am I still here? My brother calls me to ask me, when are you coming home? It's like, why are you still there? You know, and it's a small town.

[36:33] LANCE FRIEND: What do you think about California compared to Texas? Because that, That's a huge difference.

[36:39] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Yes, it is a huge difference. California is. It's. Well, first of all, let me just say that the Central Valley, I don't really consider this to be California, because California, as I knew, was San Diego, Louisiana. San Francisco. That's what I've known to be California. Central Valley is rural. We're growing vegetables here. We've got cows and goats and sheep and hay. And it's a lot like Texas, actually. I don't know if you know, Victoria, Texas, but my mother grew up in.

[37:16] LANCE FRIEND: That area south, right down by the border. Yeah.

[37:20] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Yeah. So my, My mother grew up there. So that was familiar to me. But that's no place really I wanted to stay. But I have a home, I have a job, and I have friends, and my daughter's lives in Fresno.

[37:35] LANCE FRIEND: Okay.

[37:35] CONNIE WILLIAMS: So it's. I know I want to move, but I want to move so bad. But I. It's kind of like the black hole. Everybody says, oh, it'll grow on you. When you first got here, nobody wanted to stay. It'll grow on you. It's like, like black mold. But. But I'm here, so.

[37:51] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah, it's. It's. But I, I, the, the. The political climate out there's highly charged as well. Right?

[37:59] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Always. Yeah.

[38:01] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah, always.

[38:01] CONNIE WILLIAMS: You know, they tried to run the governor out of office several times.

[38:05] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah.

[38:06] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Probably still in progress, you know, but I. Texas, I'm, I'm a little bit concerned about your, your carry. Everybody can carry down in Texas. It's like I went to when I was down visiting my brother. It's like, do you have a gun? It's like, do I need a gun? It's like, everybody's got guns. It's like, what? And it's just, it concerns me not about your, your option to have a weapon, but the fact that you can carry them in targets, you can carry them in Walmart. I mean, what if I accidentally bump you with my grocery cart and you're having a bad day and I end up dead? You know, it's just that. That just kind of makes me all very nervous.

[38:49] LANCE FRIEND: That's interesting, because that I could see that being, I could see that being out there. Right. As a concern, but it doesn't really happen. That's the thing. Right. I think. Because on the flip side of that, you never know who is caring.

[39:08] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Right? Right. You know, and knowing that fact that you don't know, I just assumed everybody's backing down and taxing.

[39:16] LANCE FRIEND: No, I mean, look, I mean, you know, because you, you know, it started down here that you had to have a concealed carry permit, right? To carry. Well, that's gone now. So now anybody can carry. You can carry anybody outside concealed, open. So you'll see, you know, like if you go over to Fort Worth, you'll see a lot of the, the cowboys over there with the gun on their, on their holster. Right? Just right on their side and it's out in the open and the whole nine yards. But I think it's, I don't know. To me, look, you know, I've got plenty of handguns and weapons in my house, right. I don't carry them around. I don't feel the need to carry them around, but I have them. Right? So. So who knows? But it's, it's. I, I could see that, but it's not like that. It's. It's not like the wild, wild west.

[40:09] CONNIE WILLIAMS: And people kind of feel like it.

[40:11] LANCE FRIEND: To me riding cows. Yeah, it's, it's. You know, Texas is. Look, the reality is Texas has got so much California moving to it right now. Who knows what's gonna happen with that?

[40:28] CONNIE WILLIAMS: That's true. That's a lot of California.

[40:30] LANCE FRIEND: Right?

[40:31] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Everybody, everybody's fleeing the state.

[40:33] LANCE FRIEND: You know, they are all. Well, the industries are right. If you look at, you know, the, the Tesla or the Toyota or the. I mean, I could, I could drive five minutes from my house and name 10 corporations that have come here from California within five miles. Big ones moving thousands and thousands and thousands of people. Right. So who knows? I mean, Texas is, you know, that's a state that's always been a very Republican state. And it's a state right now that I think the Republicans are fighting for their lives in. Right. To figure out how they're going to continue to carry the state. But, you know, again, shame on everybody at that point in time. Again, I go back to one of the very first statements I made. I don't think any of them, I don't think any of the politicians at this point in time are setting out to do what you said in the beginning of this deal, which was have the best interest of the people, the constituents in mind. I think they have the best interest of themselves. I saw a report that came out yesterday about student loan forgiveness and the amount of student loans that have been forgiven for current sitting members in the House. And in the House and Senate, there's a gentleman in Texas that had 1.4 million.

[42:01] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Wow.

[42:02] LANCE FRIEND: Forgiven. And that to me is just. There's no excuse for it. Right. So, you know, look, I'm, I'm not a fan of forgiving student loans, to be quite honest, at all. Because you're not forgiving anything. You're. I'm gonna have to pay the bill or you're gonna have to pay the bill or somebody's gonna have to pay the bill. Because if you're gonna forgive student loans, then you should forgive trade school loans. You should forgive, you know, any, any type of loans that somebody took out to better themselves or better their family. And to me, it's, it's, you know, it's. I just don't get it. Right. But I don't think the politicians are doing. I think they've gotten so far away from what's right for their people, what's right for the people that have voted for them. I don't know how you bring that back into swing.

[42:58] CONNIE WILLIAMS: So that was going to be my question for you. What do you think that we can do as a society? I just kind of feel like we need to kick them all out and start all over, you know, and just because it's not working.

[43:11] LANCE FRIEND: No, I don't know. Right. I mean, I, you think about the how, and I think everybody knows the what. Right? What, what do they want? They. But I don't know how you get there. I really don't because you're, you're so divided. The country is so Divided at this point in time that, you know, I don't know how you get there. I don't have a good answer for it. What about you?

[43:40] CONNIE WILLIAMS: I don't think anybody knows, and that's why we're stuck. But as I said, just the two of us taking the one small step and having a conversation about it is definitely a step in the right direction. And I think if more people could do that and experience. I've enjoyed talking with you, they'll realize that we're more alike than we are different. And so if you just drop the shroud of fear for a little bit and just let somebody else in, I think our world would be a better place for it. You know, I lived in Hawaii, and there were all kinds of people there. There were Chinese and Japanese and Koreans and. Yeah, I mean, Hawaiians. Just locals. And I loved living there because there was not one majority of any people. I learned a lot about different cultures, learned to speak a little bit of different languages, and just enough to say good morning to somebody else that was different. And I think my life is more enriched for it. But I don't think a lot of people feel that way. As you said when you were starting, you know, we have a tendency to stay with what we know, you know, and to hang with the people that we know that are like us. And I have always. And I think it's probably the military lifestyle that has made me reach out, reach out to people that are different. You know, I want to know you. I want to know why you do the things you do, how you do them. Because I don't believe that our way, Americans way, is just the best way. You know, we have all this. I always just go back to the basics. If you think of childbirth, you know, the women in Africa, you go out there, grab onto a tree branch, hold on, and you give birth to a baby. You know, we have hospitals that lay you flat on your back. Your labor's not going to progress that way. You're not working with gravity. So why are we still doing it that way? You know, it doesn't make sense. We can learn from other cultures and do things a little bit differently.

[45:53] LANCE FRIEND: Yeah, yeah, I agree. And I think I've had the opportunity, you know, over the past. I'd say I probably started traveling heavy when I was 20, 26, 27. And, you know, I'm 49, right. So 20 years of a lot of cultures and a lot of different environments and on the road. And let me tell you, there's a lot of things we as Americans tend to do that, we don't do real well. Right. And there's a lot we could learn from other cultures, without a doubt. And I think having the openness to understand and having the openness to accept things that aren't like what we're accustomed to is huge. And I'll tell you, you know, the reality is when you look at your profile and you look at my profile, even though, you know, I mean, both from Texas. Great. You grew up, you know, probably in, like you say, in the Democratic household. I grew up in Republican. We've got a lot in common. And I think if people could just get there, people would realize they've got a lot more in common than you. Then you don't. Right. And that goes back to the. How do you bring the country together? I just don't. No. Unless people drop the stereotype. They drop, you know, you're not. You didn't come from where I came from or you don't know because and whatever. The because could be a million other things. I think those things have to change before, before you can align. And I think alignment is the biggest problem right now that I see.

[47:46] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Yeah, I agree. We have a chat question for us concluding. What gives you hope for the future for me is having taken one small step as we're doing here today, just reaching out to others and listening, you know, opening your heart and your mind to listening and receiving something that's new and different. So that makes me hopefully also I'm not too hopeful about the political world, but for people in general, I think we can do it. I know we can. We've done it before, but we just have to lay, like, as you said, lay some beliefs and stereotypes down and just move forward and get to know people as they are. You know, And I used to tell my daughter this when she was dating. It's like, you know, when you get this fan, I want you to look at him real hard and you have to take him the way he is. What you see is what you get. Don't look at the potential. Don't think he can change with each other. Just look at people and accept them for who they are, where they are at this time. If they're in a bad spot, help them out. If you're in a better spot than they are, then that's fantastic. Help other people. And I think that's the small step. It makes me hopeful.

[49:23] LANCE FRIEND: I think what gives me hope are my children. Right. You always want your kids to do better than you did. Right. And I think what gives me hope is being able to lay a foundation for them so that they can be the best that they can be, right? And then them being the best they can be, translating that into, you know, what, whatever avenue they go down, right? Whether that's a, you know, one wants to be a lawyer, the other one wants to be a scientist. The 11 year old, he's just trying to figure out where his shoes are on a daily basis, right? But the kids give me hope. And I think when you look at, when you look through their eyes, you know, they don't see. I think when I see the generation growing up today, I don't think our kids or my children see the world as racially divided as, as you probably did growing up or I probably did growing up. I, because I think it's become more the melting pot. So I think hopefully that, that hope it will start to break down even more with the, with the political climate, with the kids coming up. The kids being, you know, they don't know boundaries and I think that's the beauty of them, right? Because the, whether it's the good or bad of technology, technology is broken down. You're in a, you're in Hawaii, I'm in Texas, you're in California, you're in Japan. They don't know those boundaries anymore. So hopefully that starts to bring things more into frame and then we go from there. So that, that gives me hope.

[51:22] CONNIE WILLIAMS: Thank you both so much.