Crystal DeBerry and Torey DeBerry

[00:02] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Doctor Crystal DeBerry I am 40 years old. Today is January 13, 2024. We are in Memphis, Tennessee, and I'm interviewing with Tory DeBerry my husband.

[00:15] TOREY DEBERRY: My name is Tory D. Berry. I am 43 years old. Today is January 13, 2024, and we are in Memphis, Tennessee. I'm interviewing with my wife, Crystal D. Berry.

[00:29] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: All right, bae, it's just me and you.

[00:32] TOREY DEBERRY: Let's do it.

[00:36] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: I don't think either of us expected to be here, even in this moment, to share our story. And we have now been married for, what, eleven years? Is he 1111? And the number prophet is turning ten next month. Indomitable families affected by incarceration.

[01:02] TOREY DEBERRY: Mm hmm.

[01:03] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: And five kids later. I do want to start by telling you thank you for taking RJ and Celine as your own, even before we were serious. Cause, you know, we first met, I don't think either of us thought that it was going to result in marriage. Did you? In the beginning.

[01:26] TOREY DEBERRY: In the beginning? Well, when I first met you, I remember telling you, you gonna be my wife. But I can't say I was playing at the time. You know, it's just one of them things, like, when you say something like, you just, you know, it come out, but then you be like, whatever.

[01:45] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: I like the time you accidentally slipped up and told me you love me in the store.

[01:50] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah. We was in Walmart when that happened.

[01:54] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: That's what I'm saying. I don't think either of us. I don't think either of us expected where we are today. You remember that time you came in the bedroom and you were like, are you gonna do this time with me?

[02:13] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah, I do. Um. What did you say?

[02:20] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: I said yes. But were you expecting me to say yes? Right. As a. You know, this was my first time. I was expecting with Courtland. And to go through this thing of, you know, the feds coming to the house, you being arrested, and it's now looking like, okay, how many years will you have to serve? Cause I know at first it was like 50. What? Career. They said they want to career you out, right?

[02:48] TOREY DEBERRY: 50. Yeah. They could have gave me up to 50 years. It was my second time. So I. On one hand, I felt like that I was gonna be able to beat the charge because this charge, like, what they actually had us charged with, really didn't have anything to do with me. And then, on the other hand, I know with the feds, anything could happen. You know what I'm saying? So when I asked you that question, I don't know, I probably was just asking you that I was wanting you to stay, but I felt like at this time, that if I did get a lot of time, like, I wasn't. I really wasn't gonna be expecting you to stay, but.

[03:39] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Oh, so you really didn't expect me.

[03:41] TOREY DEBERRY: To stay if I got a lot of time. No.

[03:44] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: No. What's a lot of time? Like, how many years? Like, if you would have been sentenced. For what? Like, more than what? Cause you were sentenced for five.

[03:53] TOREY DEBERRY: Five is a lot easier. Ten years. Ten years. Honest.

[03:57] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: I mean, heck, if I could do five, I could do ten. Yeah, but things, like anything passed, too, is a lot.

[04:04] TOREY DEBERRY: Well, I understand that, but things happen.

[04:07] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm. You right.

[04:09] TOREY DEBERRY: In ten years. I mean, there's a lot of things that happen in six months, but ten years, that's a whole decade. I really wouldn't expect you to stay for ten years.

[04:20] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Tori, do you want to ask Crystal why she stayed?

[04:28] TOREY DEBERRY: Not yet.

[04:29] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Okay. Okay.

[04:33] TOREY DEBERRY: Ask me something else.

[04:39] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: So did you even see our relationship lasting? Okay, I get it. Right where you ask me, hey, are you gonna serve this time with me as well? And I told you, yes, but, I.

[04:51] TOREY DEBERRY: Mean, when you say our relationship lasting, like, what, you mean marriage lasting, actually making it.

[04:58] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm.

[05:02] TOREY DEBERRY: I did. I did see it lasting, but I knew that anything could happen at the same time, I didn't feel like that we would begin, like we would be getting a divorce or nothing like that, but anything could happen when you away from each other for years. And one thing I knew that you was pregnant with my daughter, so I knew that my family was going to be very supportive of everything that you had going on and anything that had to do with my baby. So at the time, I guess going through the incarceration process, like the pre trial process, I really couldn't think about that part of it, really. I was more just trying to get the least time as possible. And then what? And then another thing that. Well, one thing that actually helped me and made me feel good during the pretrial process was you were. You were reaching out to different people, trying to get the character letters to submit to the judge for my sentencing. And I seen how you was really on that, and, you know, you know, I knew you was doing it. Cause you wanted me to come to the house, you know what I'm saying? So, like, that made me feel good. That made me feel like that you was really rad for me that time.

[07:03] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm. What were some of the things other than, you know, the character letters, like you were saying with the pretrial, but while you were actually in federal prison. Can you recall some of the things that we did that was, like. That kind of helped you keep going? Like, while you were in there.

[07:24] TOREY DEBERRY: I mean, you came to see me every weekend on the weekends that you really couldn't come. Like, you made sure that my mom and other family members came. You actually brought your mom a lot of times. And even with different business with counselors and stuff, you would. You would. You would talk to whoever was needed to be to contact you, was basically doing everything that you could do to make my time as comfortable as possible.

[08:11] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Do you remember when I was sending you them questions from the new way gang?

[08:15] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah, we. Oh, yeah, we played different. A whole lot of games through mail.

[08:23] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: I would write out every quiz. You should have saw me in the living room stopping and pausing. Pausing and play. Pause and play. I'm trying to write the questions out, write the answers out, and then making a copy to send to you. And then we were like, okay, we're gonna mail them off on Friday, so make sure you have your own system so that we wouldn't cheat.

[08:42] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah, they meant a lot, too. They meant a lot. And just every. I mean, you did a lot of stuff. Everything. Like, you didn't let me miss a moment. My child growing up sent me pictures every week. We wrote letters back and forth every week.

[09:02] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Hmm.

[09:03] TOREY DEBERRY: You were. I mean, you were the model of prison wife.

[09:07] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Thank you. That sound good and bad at the same time.

[09:11] TOREY DEBERRY: I mean, mom.

[09:12] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Right?

[09:13] TOREY DEBERRY: I know, but whatever situation. I mean, I guess whatever situation that you are put in, you need to be the best at it. And you was.

[09:23] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Thank you. Were there any fears that you had that you never told me about?

[09:30] TOREY DEBERRY: Any fears?

[09:31] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Fears? Yeah. Did you used to think about not being in the home or.

[09:36] TOREY DEBERRY: Well, like, fear is, like, it was always a fear that, like, it would always be a fear of another man coming in the picture. It would always be a fear of that. It would be a fear of, like, just the kids being, like, vulnerable without a man even in the house. You know what I'm saying? So, yeah, it was some fears.

[10:11] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: What about fears with your return? Like, okay, I'm getting ready to come home now. What were you thinking about? I know I was just on edge about, you know. Cause I remember doing, you know, group therapy sessions with the support socials, you know, with some of our indomitable members. And, you know, anytime either one of any of us had a loved one coming home, it was almost like this holding of the breathe. Like, once you all would receive an official date of coming home, the anxiety heightened. You would think, okay, with this date, right? But it heightened because you hear so many times about, you know, someone gets a date to come home and they die or they're killed or, you know, they come home, but they go right back in. Like, it was just a lot of hoops and hurdles or making sure that the paperwork was completed right. So I know there was a fear.

[11:06] TOREY DEBERRY: For me now, that was a fear that maybe the paperwork went right and you supposed to pick me up at a certain time, and then by the time, because you will never know if you are really, really getting out until you get out. You get out, because they will have you packing your stuff up and everything. Like, I've seen guys give all they stuff away because they know they going home tomorrow. They giving all their stuff away. The counselor calling them to the office, signing this, signing it. Then on that morning, they sitting, waiting on, waiting to get called. And all of a sudden, like, they got a delay for something next week where they had to change her. They didn't, they didn't have a bad. Something happened at the halfway house where they can't receive you today. So, yeah, it was that type of fears. And what did she say?

[12:16] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: It was just a matter of the fear of when it was time for you to come home. What else?

[12:23] TOREY DEBERRY: Then another thing. It was a yde a concern of how I was going to be able to adjust and adapt to what you had going on, like, how you was running the, you know, running the household. So I know when I came home, I know I probably changed a lot, and it was a lot of little friction going on with the way, because I never really was a parent. Like, I don't like, like, I ain't have kids. Like, like, I took care of Celine and Junie before I left, but, yeah.

[13:07] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: You can do a toddler.

[13:08] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah. I really didn't know how to even be a parent for real. So that's something that I had to learn, and I'm real still. I'm really still learning. And it's been, man, Oprah, ten years, so.

[13:21] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Cause there is no manual for this.

[13:24] TOREY DEBERRY: So that was. That was a fear. And another thing. Well, the first time I came home, the fear was me trying to find a job, trying to find something to do to make money. You know what I'm saying? But this. But this time, coming home, it really wasn't a. That wasn't too much of a fear because I already had things in place. I already knew the barbershop that I was gonna go to that I was gonna go back to and everything. So that was basically in place. And one thing that I really appreciated that you did also, you kept my phone, my cell phone on the whole time. And as different customers that I had before, they would call my phone and you would keep them updated on, you know, my outdated stuff. So it's like, when I did come home, every customer, every customer that I had, every client I had before I left, they came right back. So it's like, I came right back in making money the first week, basically.

[14:42] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm. And I want to give your mama credit too. Cause she's the one that paid that cell phone bill. I just wanted to support. But mama D beard was. Yeah. Because I think she and I had a conversation about the cell phone, and I was like, no, I really think we may need to keep it on, you know, because people are calling. They want the updates. And I, you know, she and I were, you know, had decided that it probably would be best for business to be able to communicate with them, because that's what they knew. If we. If we would have let that phone get cut off or changed the number, yeah, that would have been. That would have been a lot.

[15:21] TOREY DEBERRY: Real big deal. Because people. Because it was a, like, like I knew I was leaving. So before I left, I was given certain customers to certain people that worked in the shop, and. But some people didn't even want anybody else to cut their hair in the shop, so they actually left. Like, the majority of my clients left and went to other places to get service while I was gone. But when I came back, all of them came back like clockwork.

[15:51] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Right?

[15:51] TOREY DEBERRY: So. So when I left, I had probably 70, 75 clients. When I came back, within the first two months, I had over 100 clients.

[16:02] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm. When. So that time I came to visitation, and, you know, I was talking to you then about, hey, I think God is telling me to start this nonprofit. I think I'm supposed to do x, y, and z. Right? What were your thoughts? God is telling me to quit. My God is telling my wife to quit her job. To start a non profit equals no money in some cases.

[16:30] TOREY DEBERRY: Right. At first, my thoughts was like, quit your job? What you gonna do something like that for? You know what I'm saying? But then as you continue to talk about it, and I knew that it was heavy on you, I said, well, baby, it look like you're going to quit your job then, because God had already been providing for us anyway, because income had went down. And so.

[17:07] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Yep, because I had lost your income all those years.

[17:11] TOREY DEBERRY: And we just worked together, and I just told you whatever that you needed to do to make it happen, just. Just do it. And I remember when you came and we had to sign the power attorney papers. Cause I gave you power attorney over everything.

[17:31] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Oh, I forgot about that.

[17:32] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah.

[17:33] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Am I still a power of attorney? Where is that paperwork? Let me get in my file cabinet.

[17:41] TOREY DEBERRY: So, um. And I know, just, like, you had to do things in my name.

[17:53] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: To keep it moving.

[17:54] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah, just keep it moving. And we was behind when I came out, but, man, it was such a blessing for me to get all my customers back, and we. Man, we got it back together.

[18:08] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm.

[18:09] TOREY DEBERRY: And, yeah.

[18:13] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: So now in thinking about, you know, indomitable is turning ten. This is like our baby, right? The nonprofit indomitable families affected by incarceration, you know, and now coming. Actually coming up into the three events where we're hosting now in celebration of our success. Why have you continued to be supportive? Because this nonprofit is a lot, if you think about it. It's more work with this nonprofit than our for profit business.

[18:51] TOREY DEBERRY: I mean, I'm. Man, for one thing, I do have a passion to help people that's been affected by incarceration, because, I mean, it's big, and I'm actually obligated because all this really started because of me anyway, you know what I'm saying? So. And at first, I wasn't just too much into it until, you know, I realized, like, it just almost, like, a light bulb went off in my head. Like, man, it's all because of you. You need to. You need to get to it. You know what I'm saying? So I just, you know, it's even. Even, like, my clients, like, I just. I really like helping people, and I. And I I'm just the type of person that like to see people do good, so even, like, when, like, it could be a person that I don't even know, and. And he tell me, you know, he come in and get a haircut. He was like, man, I just got out yesterday, man. You know what I'm saying? So, you know, saying they do something to me. So I, you know, I cut his hair and talked to him and almost, like, counseling him and just asking him questions different, like, what he gonna do. Mandev, man, where you staying at? Where you working at and stuff like that. And I just try to help him the best way I can and end up. Man, we end up having this long conversation, and I might give. I might say, man, since you coming home, man, that's your free service man. Take that money and go buy something for your kids that help you out. Something like that.

[20:52] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Right. I feel like we still have a lot of work to do, though, with the nonprofit. I feel like there's still a lot more people to reach. I know it's hard.

[21:02] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah, it is. It's almost, like, never ending.

[21:07] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm.

[21:11] TOREY DEBERRY: I don't know.

[21:12] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Do you. Do you ever see us stopping this work? So we do free group therapy sessions for men, women, and now the kids. And, I'm gonna be honest, groups, you know, they are really flourishing like no other. Right. And then, you know, we have the first property that we've renovated, and now we're renovating the second property we're getting started to anyway. Four families impacted by incarceration. I mean, do you. Do you ever see this work ceasing? Like, do you. Do you see an end goal for us with.

[21:49] TOREY DEBERRY: I really don't have. I really don't see it. Like, I see it of evolving into something else that I don't know what it is, but it's definitely gonna be evolving into something else, because incarceration and, like, this is, like, in the world. Like, this is big business.

[22:13] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: You know, it's a billion dollar industry.

[22:15] TOREY DEBERRY: So it's almost like it'll never end.

[22:18] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm.

[22:19] TOREY DEBERRY: And so it so is. So it's just taken upon us to at least try to slow it down.

[22:30] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Slow down the recidivism rate, right. At least in Memphis, Tennessee, if not even on a national level. Did I ever tell you that I have really wanted an indomitable resource house in every zip code of Memphis? Did I ever tell you about that bar? Yeah. So when you talk about evolving, you know, of course, the original. The whole point at first was to, you know, have group sessions, group therapy sessions with women who were like me. But it was supposed to be cute, though, right? It was supposed to be mimosas. They would come to my house. You know, we would just, you know, everybody would bring the kids, and we would eat.

[23:05] TOREY DEBERRY: Yeah, but they ain't nothing cute about this.

[23:08] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: You're right. But I didn't know that. Right. Like, I knew it wasn't. But just to make it so not heavy for me and the women when we would meet, because life was already heavy after, you know, or, you know, before and after the sessions and things like that, so. But then, you know, I remember coming across the, you know, the one young lady who actually admitted about, you know, working for the feds, and then, you know, just realizing, you know, the heaviness of these women's stories. I was like, okay, nope, it can't be cute, right? And then now, at this point, I want my house to be my safe space, because everybody's incarceration story is different. And so it started off with, okay, let me do group therapy sessions. But then I think the social work in me that I need to save my community from this is a matter of, let me put an indomitable resource house in every zip code of Memphis so that people can just walk into this house. Right? Like, how? I have my office now. It's a house, and people love it. Like, oh, my gosh, I'm at home. Can I take my shoes off? Did y'all just cook your lunch? Like, it is. They don't feel like it's an agency where they are. Another number. It is cozy. They come in, they even take the blankets and put it on them, right, like, as they're waiting. But, yeah, I really wanted that to happen. An indomitable resource house in every zip code of Memphis, where the community can just walk in, and it would be governed by social workers. Go, social workers. I'm all about social work. And people can walk in and ask, hey, I'm in need of this. Can you point me in a direction of this? Or, I'm in need of these services. So I don't know. I still feel like that's a part of our story down the line, too, though, to just have a resource house.

[25:00] TOREY DEBERRY: In every neighborhood zip code. We definitely on the way in that direction.

[25:07] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Cause we already have three, right? I don't know how many zip codes it is in Memphis. I'd have to go back and look, but we already have three in different zip codes, so I'm excited about that.

[25:19] TOREY DEBERRY: Okay, so, question. Why did you stay? What was the.

[25:30] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mmm. It's a lot of. Okay, I'm gonna answer that in a timeline type order. So I remember when the feds came to the house and you left, and I had to kind of get the house back in order, and the kids were there, right? Like, they were there. They were asleep. They slept through the whole thing. And I remember waking them up and just having to get them ready for school. I was like, let me just at least wake them up, get them ready for school, drop them off, right. So I don't have to worry about that part. Now, keep in mind, remember, this is before I was even pregnant with Courtland. So it was just RJ insulin. So I dropped him off, and I called my mom, and I'm like, hey, this just happened. And I said, how can I be with him? And I do therapy, you know, and how do I explain this to my clients? Like, what do I do? And I remember, you know, mama saying, well, you're gonna go to court, you're gonna talk to the lawyer, and you're gonna figure all this out for yourself, for you all's situation, because this is different. And I would have to agree with her when she said that, you know, again, I love my mom in law. Mm hmm. I know y'all do. I don't. I don't know who really got married. I don't know if it was me and you or you and my mama. Cause y'all had, like, this best friend type dynamics. It's so interesting, but I love it. But I remember thinking when she said that, how, you know, me, you and I weren't serious in the beginning, but you knew I was a single mom with kids. And, you know, you would always ask me every night, hey, is it anything you and the kids need? Even before you met my kids, right? Even before you met RJ and Celine, it was, hey, would they. Do they need anything? And I remember one time saying, yeah, I think RJ need, like, a blue shirt, green shirt, orange shirt or something, some color he needed. And you were like, okay, where have you already looked? I'm a pass a Walmart. I go look in Walmart. Right? It was that type of. When all of this happened, I had to go back and really remember, like, okay, I am remarrying, right? Cause this is after my divorce. I'm going to remarry. We were already talking about getting married. We were already going and getting ready to start, like, the premarital sessions and things like that. And I think when this incident happened, I think me and you really, truly understood that it was important for us to kind of dividend spiritually to see if we needed to be together spiritually. Because when I say to divide, it was, okay, you go pray to God about what you need to do about this situation, and I'm gonna go pray to God about what I need to do. And let's see what God is telling us individually to come together and figure this out. And so I remember, you know, the day I had to call you because you were in jail, the day I had to call you and tell you, hey, I'm pregnant. Right? You were in jail. I had to tell you that.

[28:21] TOREY DEBERRY: Well, I called you.

[28:23] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Yeah, you called me. Yeah, you're right. You had to call me. I couldn't call you. You called me, and I had to tell you, hey, you know, I just peed on a stick and I'm pregnant, right? Like that whole situation of, okay, now this is another layer to this. Cause now, you know, this is happening with the case and crap. Now I'm pregnant. And do we proceed with getting married? And I think for me, it was that moment when, you know, I was God was like, yeah, if you are praying to me, you know, want to lessen his time and, you know, to bless this union that we had, like, the relationship, then I definitely need you all to. To go about it the right way. And I think marriage was that answer, right? To, if we gonna do this together, then we need to be together.

[29:19] TOREY DEBERRY: And I think at that time, we was already. Yeah, we was already going to marriage counseling anyway.

[29:24] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Yeah, we were. Before it even started, we had. Remember. Cause we moved in together. And we was like, okay, well, if we're moving in together, this is. This needs to head to marriage. And then on December 31, we're like, yeah, let's just not even start the new year. I think we called your childhood pastor was like, yeah, we're going through the sessions. We're about done with the sessions. And I remember even in this counseling sessions, when I asked him what would he do if he was in my shoes? Would you marry? Would you stop or what? And I remember he took a pause and pastor bond was like, don't let the fed steal your joyous. Right? Because other than the case, the relationship was really good. So I think it was just a matter of even having to realize that your story or what you go through sometimes is not always about you. Sometimes it's just about to help other people. And again, I think between mama saying, mm mm, girl, he done did too much for you with them kids. I think you need to, you know, figure this out and really get them questions answered, because you and I both know, media, newspapers, articles, all that information is skewed, right? But you are going to know this story. So what made me stay was just realizing why, you know, we. We were even talking about going into marriage anyway. And so if this was something that we just needed to overcome and conquer, then let's just see how the cookie was going to crumble. Or I come together.

[30:55] TOREY DEBERRY: Mm hmm.

[30:56] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Mm hmm.

[30:57] TOREY DEBERRY: Do you have any regrets?

[30:59] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: No.

[31:01] TOREY DEBERRY: None?

[31:04] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Not about the incarceration piece. I mean, a marriage is going to be hard. You know, we've, if we gonna put it out there, you know, we've talked about, okay, if we had the divorce, what would that look like? But it wasn't because of the incarceration piece. Right. If anything, I feel like, you know, our testimony throughout this whole process definitely have made us closer. But as far as, you know, the. I don't have any regrets. You know, indomitable is turning ten. You know, I've had people ask me, if you and I didn't make it, if our relationship didn't make it, what would happen to the organization? And again, I think that's when I talk about us spiritually having to go to God individually to figure out how to make it work collectively. Indomitable is still going to do its own thing, because, one, it's not like I really, truly started it. God said to do it. So at this point, indomitable is going to be a thing forever, no matter what's happening with our relationship. I think we did good.

[32:13] TOREY DEBERRY: We did.

[32:16] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: So thank you for doing this. We've never done this, so thank you for doing it.

[32:21] TOREY DEBERRY: Gotta start somewhere.

[32:23] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Yep.

[32:24] TOREY DEBERRY: So, um. No, I was just gonna say we may do. We may need to start a podcast.

[32:39] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Here we go. We got mics in front of us. Podcast. All right, I guess. I guess we gonna start in the living room. Yep, we'll just start in the living room. The people are. The viewers are going to hear kids, though. It's five of them. Thank you, babe, for doing this.

[32:57] TOREY DEBERRY: Thank you for allowing me to do it and trusting me to do it.

[33:04] CRYSTAL DEBERRY: Yep.