DeAndre Smith and Shaun Walls

[00:03] DEANDRE SMITH: All right. My name is Shawn Walls I'm 43 years old. Today's June 28, 2023. We're in Colorado Springs, Colorado, and I'm interviewing DeAndre Smith He's a community organizer and a friend of mine.

[00:20] SHAUN WALLS: My name is Dee Smith 43 years old. It's June 28, 2013, 2023, in Colorado Springs, Colorado, and I will be interviewing my partner, Sean Walls who is also a friend of mine and inspiration in the community.

[00:42] DEANDRE SMITH: Word up. So, man, we'll just start, man. You know, when we organize, a lot of times, it's an individual thing. Like, we got a drive in us that wants. That makes us do the stuff and feel the stuff that we feel. So, you know, when it's all said and done and we're gone, how do you want to be remembered?

[01:08] SHAUN WALLS: I just really want to be remembered by. I want to be remembered by my community where I grew up, as a person that. That cared about the community, that didn't have any altered motives, and it was just a help. And hopefully I can inspire or be mentioned when the young one's coming up. You know, I just want to be the blueprint. I just want to be remembered as the blueprint to bringing a community together.

[01:41] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah. So, you know, I know you, but the people that might hear this might not know you or where you came from. Tell me about some of the important people in your life that shape this type of this thinking for you in the way you get down.

[01:55] SHAUN WALLS: I was born into it. So my dad was my number one inspiration because I seen him doing it. So everything that I'm doing basically just came natural just because I seen him doing it. I remember how people. People responded to him. All my friends, everybody I looked up to that I thought was cool, that I thought was the toughest or the realist. They all respected my daddy for the stuff that he was doing. And that's when I knew that I didn't have to be in a gang or be accepted by certain crowds by being something that I wasn't. I could be myself and really impact people's lives of all walks of lives, you know, then you have, like, Mister Dunlap, who's like, the patriarch of the whole south side, and he really touched south. He really touched the south side. He really touched k land and Colorado Springs as a whole. And the way that he did it, he didn't ask for the city to come in. He just made it happen. And so I took a lot from him and the things that I was doing when it comes to us needing funding instead of us begging for it and worrying about whether we're going to be able to do something or not because of a grant or something. We just worked hard and fundraised and figured it out. And then when the money start coming, it made it easier for us in the long run.

[03:18] DEANDRE SMITH: Word up. Yeah, man. So with all this community work, how long you been doing this?

[03:24] SHAUN WALLS: We've been. One body's been doing it for. Since 2012. We did our first event 2013, and we've been running strong ever since. So. Ten plus years?

[03:36] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah. Ma'am, what you most proudest of today? As of today, one of the things.

[03:46] SHAUN WALLS: That I'm most proud of right now is just the fact that us, as a real, genuine grassroots organization, I'm just proud that we're able to do the work that we're doing without the assistance of our city, the city government.

[04:11] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah, that's definitely something to be proud of. And the way that one body was able to make it come about just doing all the things that you said. Because what happens with us a lot is things happen around us and we don't pay attention to how it happened or the people that did it. You know what I'm saying? And for you to have that thought, like, man, you know, I don't got a. I don't got a gang bang or mister Dunlap didn't need the city, you know, like those things, that's like a different. A different way of looking at life, man. And, you know, the community benefited from it, man. So what does the future hold for the south side? What you see.

[04:54] SHAUN WALLS: I think that with organizations like yours and mine working together, and we have completely different missions, we have completely different way of going about things or whatever. But one thing that we do have is we have more in common than we have that are different. And for us to show people that we can work together, I think that that's the example that we set for everybody else to let them know that we can work together. And as long as we working together and we don't really need outside forces, so we can police ourselves, we can support ourselves and provide the needs of the things that we need with the resources that we have at just the tables that we created on our own.

[05:42] DEANDRE SMITH: And so, yeah, so, you know. Cause I, you know, obviously, I think. I think about the same stuff. Right. But I guess I kind of. I'm thinking, what are your hopes for that? Like, what do you want that to turn out? The fact that we can do all these things, we can't take care of ourselves. We don't need outside people. What is your hopes for? That is that realization.

[06:09] SHAUN WALLS: Our community take responsibility for the changes that we need to make. That's what I want. I want the community to take ownership and responsibility for the things that we need in our community so that we're. Cause if we take care of ourselves, then we don't have to worry about really outside forces. And then when the outside forces do chip in, then it's just icing on the cake. But I. At the end of the day, it's the people that's gonna be able to make the change. The people that sitting in the front offices, they don't have the people. That's why they have to come to people like us to get to them. But we just need our community to. We need the gangs to come up and take responsibility for their actions and help with the process. We need the moms. We need the churches. We need the fathers. We just need to just start standing up and stop making excuses and really go out there and just put in that work and just get what we need.

[07:09] DEANDRE SMITH: Right? Yeah, I feel you. I'm the same way, man. And so, you know, we. 2013, I was still in the army and was just getting back. I just got back from a deployment in 2012. I was a complete different person then to now, you know what I'm saying? And, you know, taking action for the community, for the betterment of the community with the best interests of our people in mind. You know what I'm saying? It takes a lot of courage, you know, and fortitude. But the thing that I want to talk about is how we got together with the chinook, with one body, and then, like, how we see that moving forward and what we want from it. You know what I'm saying? I kind of want to get into a discussion about how all of the stuff that you just said, how we take that power that we've built and cultivated already up for these past about two, three years, it's been. And flip it over to what we see, because my vision is the same thing. All the things that you said, I don't disagree with none of it, but what I want to kind of, like, have a kind of prophetic conversation a little bit and just like, this is what I'm thinking and seeing. And, you know, hopefully in years to come, if people look this interview up or hear this thing, you know, they can see what our mind was before we even really got to it. Cause I feel like we just really. We got the base of the other community together, and now we're gonna get to the point where it's like organized money, organized resource that we created for ourselves through all of the work that we've done. And we're going to be able to disperse this thing in a tactical and strategic way to be able to do all of the stuff that we was talking about to take charge of our community. So with Chinook and one body and moi, all this stuff, Mandy, what do you see us being able to do? Like, where can this power get us and get to with the people where you see it being in your wildest dream?

[09:30] SHAUN WALLS: So I see two levels of what we can do. I see what we can do politically, but I want to focus on what we can do within our community. So kind of like what you were talking about, what, what I see happening or what I'm working for to happen is that, like I said, we take responsibility for it. But one of the things that people, like, overlook is that the power is really in the people, right? And so my whole thing is to. Is to help the. Help the community understand where that power lies. And the thing about power is sometimes it can be abused. And so one of the things that I see is that we don't abuse our power, that our community let us know what they want and what they need, and us in the position where we are in that we go out and get it for them and that we don't let our own personal feelings affect our judgment into what we need to be doing for our people. Because I think that's where the problem lies, is that when people like you and I are put in positions to speak for the people, we stop speaking for the people and we start speaking for ourselves. So that's what I really see, is that you have people that are genuine about the betterment of everybody, because if everybody is doing well, we're all happy. If everybody gets a chance to go to the party and be welcome into the in crowd or whatever that looked like for you, then everybody's happy. And so we just need to make it to where we have something to where we're proud of. If we don't have nothing to be proud of, then people tearing up stuff are just going to continue to tear it up, and it ain't going to even really matter because we ain't have nothing in the first place. And also, if I. If we have something that we're proud of, then we'll be able to hold the people accountable that are tearing it up. And so my whole thing is to be able to create something that we can just be proud of and protect it and us be responsible with it when we are in power politically.

[11:55] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Mandy. Yeah. All that. I'm with it, too. And, you know, the thing for me is what I see with my wildest dreams about this thing is that we have a true political knowledge and a true understanding of what's happening to us and the reason why these things are happening around us. You know, all too often, you know, the powers that be will put, will mess up our environment. They'll do whatever. Like right now, we're talking about the county commission and redistricting some of these precincts in the city, in the county. And you know what? One of the things I said at the board meeting was the decisions that they're making at, at that level affects us and affects our environment to the point that we're reacting to these things that they've. That they've created. And it's in this, our life. You know what I'm saying? So all of these things you're talking about being proud of the neighborhood, working with each other, and making sure that we keep our focus on the people and not being powerful or whatever, these things, all of these things happen because of the situation that's created for us that we're forced to live in. So having a true understanding of what that stuff is, having a real way to affect it in our best interest, and then all of the other things that we've already been doing and the ways that we get to that are through these events that we throw in and the program that we're doing with the teen nice and all of the stuff, just developing these programs, you know, we got different ways that we're trying to get to a goal that doesn't look like being proud of your community, but really, that's what it's creating. You know what I'm saying? It's creating that thing. So that's really where we're doing it purposefully. Amongst the moi and the Chinook one body and whoever else, too. All of the rest of these organizations, grassroots, that's been getting down and doing quality work. That's what I want to get to, where all of our stuff is amniotic and we're in an ecosystem that we created, that we control, and that's benefiting us financially, emotionally, physically, all of these things in our community, man. So I know it's like a long winded thing, and it sounds cooler to say, we gonna throw the juneteenth and have a good time. You know what I'm saying, but throwing the juneteenth, having a good time, that's just providing, you know what I'm saying, the conduit to be able to get these things done, man. So I really want to be able to have the community be responsive to these things in a way that they know it's not about the party. You know what I'm saying? It's really not that being at the party and creating the things, one thing.

[15:00] SHAUN WALLS: That we got to understand, though, is things like the Juneteenth, things like the party, that is the most necessary thing in community.

[15:10] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah. And what do you mean? Like the gathering?

[15:13] SHAUN WALLS: The gathering, yeah. That is the most important part of community. There's no community if we're all at home on our cell phone, nothing to do.

[15:22] DEANDRE SMITH: Right.

[15:22] SHAUN WALLS: The only way that you know that your neighbor is when you come out your house. So there's no community without gatherings. So the thing is, that should be a normal thing. You can tell the difference between a family that has family reunions every year than a family who does not. And I don't care how good your intermediate family is, you can tell the difference. Because the thing about it is, when we grew up, we had more things out. We had times where we were able to go out and hang out. You know, your neighbors, you called them uncle and Auntie and all of that type of stuff. And then it gets to the point to where, when you're not going out and you're not interacting with the people in your community, for one, the people that don't like you, for whatever reason, they're not never gonna like you because they still got their preconceived notion. But when you run in two people and you're in the same places, and you guys find out you have some things in common, empathy comes in, even when it has to do with opposite sides.

[16:26] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah.

[16:27] SHAUN WALLS: So that is the most important. That's the most important thing. There is a situation, and this is how I know that we have to have gatherings, is because there were some people that I grew up with that was having problems with their kids. So their kids was beefing with somebody at school. And one of my. The guy went to the other. To the other kid's house to knock on the door to find out what's going on. He ready to go up there and knock heads because his kid is getting bullied by this other little kid. Come to find out that the dude, that other daddy was somebody that they grew up together and was like, basically, like, it's like basically family. But how would you know that?

[17:10] DEANDRE SMITH: Right?

[17:11] SHAUN WALLS: You have to get out. So people always act like you need a program, you can go here, and we need mental health and all this type of stuff. How you gonna know who to go to, right? You don't even. Everything starts with trust. If you don't trust the people, you ain't gonna listen to them. You gonna stay in your own little. In your own little world. The only way you can build trust and build relationship is if you're around other people. So the most important thing is the gatherings, the party, is the most important thing. You can't have none of that other stuff if you don't have the party. That's just the thing that I believe is the missing piece, and why there's a disconnect between what the politicians and the people that are supposed to be speaking for us don't understand. And so that's the main thing. We did it with the moi. We had different gangs, we had representation, every gang in this city at one table, talking about stopping gun violence, or at least having it to where they can communicate, to see if they can resolve problems without shooting each other or having safe spaces. And it worked almost immediately. We didn't know that they was gonna go along with it. Was it dangerous? Of course it was. But the thing is, if we didn't ever sit down at that table, which is something that never happened, because some of those guys, the last time they seen each other was over a barrel of a gun. So communication, presence, and fellowshiping, and getting together is the most important thing. And we seen that firsthand with enemies that are now able to call and talk, and better yet, shake hands and tell each other they love them from day one to year two. So that was, that's the main thing.

[18:57] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah, man. Yeah, yeah, I'm with you. Shout to Sam Christiansen and John Chris Janssen, who I opened the Chinook center with. That's one thing that Sam, you know, I get antsy, you know, say I be moving around a lot, man. So when I feel like earlier on in my organizing life, when I felt like something wasn't really catching or vibing or whatever, I was ready to switch gears and pivot to something different. And Sam would always remind me, like, nah, this is the work. Like, the people just being here, that's all it is. It's not like this magic thing that happens to get, you know, you don't need 100 people here, you know what I'm saying? Whoever's here is who you need here. And Will is good. It reminded me of that stuff, too, with events or whatever. Like, nah, man, you gotta focus on the ones that's here. And that's really what it's about, man. So, yeah, man, I'm with that. So when we started working together, I was in the street protesting against the police, doing things, and you would get calls about me. They would hear that we was organizing, and, you know, you was getting. You had space in the Chinook center. The one body is a member group of the Chinook center, so people will call you, man. And I want to know, what is one of the funniest memories of me with the uprising? All of this stuff, man. Tell me something you remember.

[20:34] SHAUN WALLS: Nah, all of it was funny, because really, to be honest with you, when they first start calling me, I was wondering, like, why are you calling me? I didn't understand why. So that was just funny all in itself or whatever. And so. But it didn't matter what it was. It was like, if Sean was upset about something, we need somebody to go talk to him. And so I guess I was just that one or whatever. And so it wasn't like no one specific thing. It was just crazy of how, like, people would want to sit down and meet me and want to talk to me and all of that type of stuff just because of that connection with you. But that's when I knew. I was like, hold up. And then that's when we had that conversation. Like, they gonna eventually try to tear us apart. And we got two different approaches. We just gotta figure out how we can make our approaches work, because what you're doing is necessary, and there's a time and a place for that. What I'm doing is necessary, and it's the time and the place for that. There's a time to walk up there with that stick and let them know what it's gonna be. But there's also a time for Kumbaya. Let's make it work. But we have to have that balance. And I think that that's why we work so well together is because we have that balance. And the number one thing is just the respect, because one thing I guess they did realize is that the utmost respect that we have for each other. And I think that's why. Cause I never really asked nobody, like, I did say, like, man, what made you think I can talk to him? They were like, well, you're always with him, so. But, you know, but I think. I think they can just see, then they can just feel how we are with each other. And I think it plays a big role that, like, we ain't never, we can, we know that it wasn't no backbiting on each other.

[22:34] DEANDRE SMITH: Right.

[22:35] SHAUN WALLS: Like, if somebody approached me about Sean, it's almost like you talking about me. And I think that was like, one of the things that they really saw to where it come to. It became a time where now they calling you about me.

[22:48] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah, I just left a about you. Just a minute. I can't wait to tell you.

[22:55] SHAUN WALLS: So it's like, but they see that rapport and they see that respect that we have for each other. But I think most of all, they see that passion that we willing to die for what we standing on, and it's for good. And so I think that's one of the things that you notice right away, is that we both passionate about it. We both gonna stand on our square and we gonna have each other's back. We gon, we go disagree.

[23:24] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah. Especially by the police.

[23:26] SHAUN WALLS: Yeah, we gonna disagree. We don't have some situations to where we gonna have to have that car conversations and we had a couple.

[23:32] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah, yeah.

[23:33] SHAUN WALLS: And the thing is, is communication.

[23:36] DEANDRE SMITH: That's true, man. Yeah, man. I feel the same way, dog. You know, and as we get ready to wrap up here, man, I just, you know, I think I want to say that these things that we've, that we've accomplished, you know, all of the stories that we could tell, man, it's crazy, but it feels like it really is just getting started, you know what I'm saying? Like, we couldn't have imagined, I would, my wildest dream wouldn't have imagined none of this thing happening with the Moi, the way that it went down and looking at, you know, we had these conversations where we're looking at the horizon and seeing what might be ahead for us. And, man, literally, there's nothing that is off the table. Like, you know, we're talking about movies, documentary and, you know, shit like that, opening businesses, you know what I'm saying? Like, these things are real legitimate conversations for us. And it's gonna change our community, man. So I know I asked you all the questions, bro. Do you got anything you wanna ask me?

[24:42] SHAUN WALLS: One of the things I wanted to ask is I want to know who has made the biggest impact on your life. And what's the thing, what did it, what was the one thing that it taught you?

[24:59] DEANDRE SMITH: Oh, man, the person.

[25:03] SHAUN WALLS: Yeah, person and situation.

[25:06] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah, well, probably my mom's mandeh but, you know, just like everything, man, my mom taught me everything. And she passed away right before we started the moi. We were starting the hunt of black men, and, you know, moms passed away, so we kind of pivoted, and the moi came off of that. But my mom, she wouldn't. She always taught us to stand up to bullies. And you fight a bully, no matter who they bullying, you not, you know, give them the business end, you know, the military. When you asked me about the situation of war, you know, I was in the army for 21 years, man, so a lot of that stuff shaped the way I think and act. And I saw, you know, I was. I would go to different countries and the same things happening in my neighborhood, how we was doing them over there, you know what I'm saying? Or whatever. Like. Or I was in a better situation doing that than I am at home. So it really shaped the way that I saw America and saw policing in my community and, you know, the personal responsibility of the community members in trying to affect that. So, yeah, I say, my mama in the war, those two things did it for me. And then, you know, of course, when they killed Devon Bailey, I saw red, and I still see red off of that. You know what I'm saying? So those three things, you know, they say preparation and opportunity meet. Then that's where you get success from. And unfortunately, you know, and this, when we're talking about defending our community and defending our people, our opportunities look like tragedy. You know, it looks like the police killing somebody, where we got to organize around it, or they're trying to break up the south side with the county commission redlining that they're doing with the redistricting. So these things, those are our opportunities and our preparation that we've done, that we've mixed up with all of this stuff is gonna meet that opportunity, and we're gonna be successful from it. So that's. That's what drives me right there, man.

[27:08] SHAUN WALLS: I just got a couple more questions.

[27:10] DEANDRE SMITH: Oh, okay.

[27:10] SHAUN WALLS: So what made you look at one body with the one body has more of a Martin Luther King approach, the kumbaya, let's come together or whatever. What made you. Cause a lot of times, it would be a situation where. Not a lot of times, but there's times where there'll be a situation where you will feel like, nah, let's smash on them. Don't talk to them when we trying to. You know, one body would be more like, man, let's go talk to them, and let's bring it together and see if we can, you know, work it out. What was the thing that made you say, all right, well, I can trust they judgment on certain things like that.

[27:52] DEANDRE SMITH: All of the work you did. So I started, I was watching you, you know what I'm saying? I see you doing stuff, and I'd be like, man, hey, whatever this brother's doing, we need to protect them, bro. Cause they finna try to take him out, you know what I'm saying? Like, that's the way I was thinking. I didn't understand a lot of this stuff, you know what I'm saying? So I knew. And then also when we opened the Chinook center, we opened it in Kland. And I did that on purpose because I wanted to be in the neighborhood, you know what I'm saying? And I knew. I knew that I needed to talk to y'all. So when we opened up, that was the first. Well, you remember you was there. That was the first meeting that we called. We didn't meet with nobody in the Chinook center before. We had D and Jen in the conference room to let them know what the Chinook center was and what we was trying to do, and we needed the help from. And then it was never even a question. So, you know, it was one of them things where we didn't really know, you know what I'm saying? I didn't know that you was gonna have our back, you know what I'm saying? Or how. What way it was gonna be. The man, I think it was the juneteenth, when the first juneteenth, when we kind of, you know, everyone was trying to figure stuff out. You guys was putting on the first. We're on the third year this year that just passed that first one. Nobody knew what it was gonna look like or whatever, you know what I'm saying? And we had a misunderstanding with the police, you know what I'm saying? So just for the people know, the Juneteenth is a vendor event. They come and set up tables and booths and all of this stuff. And the police came, and they had a pig sitting behind the table with all of his SWAT gear on, which.

[29:27] SHAUN WALLS: Was not approved, which.

[29:29] DEANDRE SMITH: And we obviously, I didn't say, let's go get D and tell D. No, I went and told the cop to take that shit off. Like, you need to get the hell out of here. So we started. It was a whole thing, man. And d, like you didn't even say, like, you was never like, oh, Sean, you know what I'm saying? You didn't tell me not to come around. You didn't tell none of that, you know what I'm saying? Like, we did scuff up a little bit, you know what I'm saying? But it was because of the situation. But it wasn't never no back turning, like you said. It wasn't never like, oh, man, he don't got my back. It was never one time that I feel that. So I just went with that, you know what I'm saying? And then the same thing with John and Sam. Like, they're experienced organizers, you know what I'm saying? Before we even did this, they had done years and years. They was in Bangladesh organizing and shit. I. They saw you, they saw the things y'all were doing. It was like, nah, that's the. That's the work. That's the legit, you know, we want to be just doing the same thing, except for politically, you know what I'm saying? So that's where it all came from. It was never like a, well, if he. If they. If they mess with us, then we'll mess with them. It was always like, we need to make sure one body is with it, and so we could get down, you know what I'm saying? We always knew that. So in for it to be three years in now. And just last night, man, I'm so excited about the conversation we had last night, being able to intermingle the moi with the Chinook, some of the stuff that we got going on with labor rights, and, you know, like I said, political education, man, it's just. I couldn't even sleep last night thinking about the things that we're about to embark on. So, yeah, man, that's why I always had the trust and the faith and knew that this was the boat that we needed to be on right from the very beginning. Cause of that.

[31:15] SHAUN WALLS: What was the thing that, like, from the. When you first jumped on that stage and waved that fist in there, you kind of toned down. And now it's more like, you think about what you about to say, and you gonna. You don't really go off the passion as. So, as much. What was the thing that helped you be more mindful, I guess I wanna say, of what you say on how you approach it. And what was the thing that sparked that change or whatever, the adjustment.

[31:52] DEANDRE SMITH: So when I first started, I was by myself. Like, I didn't know. I didn't have John and Sam, I didn't have nobody. All I seen was my neighborhood, and I had a city council member to blame it on. I was on Yolanda Avila's hind parts every day. So what, you know, then I got John and Sam and John and Sam got me, and then we got people in Chinook, and people in Chinook got us, and all of these things started happening. What changed? It was the housing march. I knew. So the housing march was my. We weren't gonna do it. I pushed that thing with John and Sam so hard. Like, they were like, sean, calm down. We ain't gonna get 200 people to do nothing. You know what I'm saying? It's just not one of these things. They really didn't want to get down. But I was like, well, I guess I'm gonna do it by myself, and y'all gonna watch me do it by myself, and of course not. They gonna help, you know. So I organized the housing march, and I knew it was gonna strike a nerve, you know, I knew it was gonna be something where they were. The police was gonna do something to make it where we would have momentum, you know what I'm saying? And lo and beholden, they did it. You know what I'm saying? They completely violated every right of ours known to man on purpose, too. They set us up, and we knew it. So we was able to find out that we had an undercover cop. They were infiltrating us. We was able to find out that they had illegal surveillance. And all of the stuff that they were looking on our Facebook and all of this stuff, we was able to find all of this and blew it up on them. So right now, you know, on the intercept, there's a. There's a story on the intercept called Alphabet Boys, talking about episode eight, talking about the Chinook center, how they infiltrated us and broke all of our, you know, broke a bunch of our civil rights. So from that point, I knew that I didn't have to do that no more. I don't gotta go march and I just gotta go tell them, you know, I'll strike this bitch up. You know what I'm saying? You know, we'll show up and do. And you'll change all of this stuff because we said so. Like, you seen it, you know what I'm saying? So we don't have to. We're just telling them, well, we'll do it again. And they know that we'll do it again. Then it's the same effect. So now we're able to have a cause. Honestly, that was never the goal. Being in the street protest, that's. That was never the goal. Our goal was to get oversight of the CSPD. Our goal was to get affordable housing, apartments built downtown in the city. All of those things happened. You know, we got an oversight committee, we got a new mayor. We got it. You see the Cranes downtown, there's 16 cranes in the south side. So we won. You know what I mean? And usually the loudest one is the one that's losing, you know what I'm saying? And the one that got it organized, I just talked about this last night at the MOi meeting. The ones that are at city council, the commission meetings, organizing and protesting, they losing. The ones that are winning are at the table already. And we're at the table. So, you know, I hope they don't make me do it again, but I'll do it. And you're going to be right with me, too. Okay. It seems like you guys obviously work very well together and there's a lot of like, collaboration. But I wonder also, you guys are touching on things where you maybe think about things differently. And I wonder, do you what your.

[35:27] SHAUN WALLS: Approach to things are that is different from Sean's and how you guys still.

[35:32] DEANDRE SMITH: Come together at the end of the day, even if you're coming from different sides of things.

[35:37] SHAUN WALLS: So me and Sean always had this like, little joke. I'm more like Martin Luther King, he more like Malcolm X. And if you could talk to Sean.

[35:47] DEANDRE SMITH: Oh, okay.

[35:48] SHAUN WALLS: And so that's kind of like, like our like little thing or whatever. I'm the one that's gonna, I'm the one that's gonna bring the community together and Sean's gonna be the one to protect it. And so when it's time for Shawn to stand up and protect us, we just gotta stand up behind him and have his back. And so we had that understanding. We had that understanding from the very beginning when we saw how different our approaches was to things. And when you, I mean, anytime you growing up, there's always a time and a place, like I said earlier, for that or whatever, but it starts with respect or whatever, because there are certain things that I wouldn't do unless I know that he's with it. And so all you really need is that one person to have your back in that, you know, that's going to have that same energy when it comes down to it, that you have. And so that's really what he is for me. And I think sometimes I'm that for him because like, he started off doing everything by himself and he was the one that's out there making all this noise. And the same way he felt about me when, when I was out there working and he was running his business and stuff was the same way I felt. So we had the same, we had the same feeling about each other, because I was like, nah, you out there, like, by yourself. Like, we need to. We need to be there to back you up. We need to be there for you. We gotta protect you. And so then that's when we started. We tried to get the 100 black men, and there was something that was kind of inspirational about that, because during all of the protesting, Sean did a call for 100 black men to come in and stand on the city hall to just be present for when Stephanie Rose and him and a few others were speaking or whatever, because I don't really remember exactly what sparked it, but I know that there were some mercenaries out there with guns and trying to intimidate, and I, they made a comment, and Stephanie was like, no, I don't need your help. I got 100 black men. And so Sean made the call. And it was no question. I just jumped on board with it. But what I learned on that day or whatever is that we don't have to, if we're present and people see us together in solidarity, that it can be powerful. And so I expressed that to him, and we had the same sentiments or whatever, and I kind of was telling him, like, yo, this is what we need to do to make sure you ain't out there by yourself, because there's so many people out there, you wouldn't know that he was by himself. But I knew because I'm sitting up here looking, I was like, these people ain't riding. They wouldn't. They gonna be here for the show, but who's gonna really have his back? And so that's when I went protection mode, and I was like, well, I know I got people that can hold him down. And for what he's doing for our community, it's effective. And it could be really effective if he waved that stick and we stand behind him with it and we don't have to talk, we don't have to do anything but be there and just to make sure that they know that if they coming, we ready to come with it. And so I think that's why we just know our roles and we just know our position and respect each other enough to disagree and come up with a solution. Because sometimes my way is so far to the left and his way is so far to the right that we gotta argue it out to get to that middle ground to where we both feel comfortable with it. And we've been able to do that. And so, you know, just gotta be able to disagree and just know that where our heart is or whatever. It's trust. Cause that's my whole thing with him. I trust him and respect. Trust and respect is the reason why we're able to work together. Because he ain't afraid to tell me how he feel about a situation, and I ain't afraid to tell him how I feel about the situation. And so with that, we just figured out the best way to handle it. Because we knew from the very first day when we had that first meeting is that they gonna try everything to tear us apart, because we gonna be stronger together then apart. And I knew I needed him, and he knew he needed me. And so here we are today.

[40:26] DEANDRE SMITH: Yeah. Good to go. All right, man. Well, hey, you know, I feel the same way, brother. You know, I love and respect you, man. And, you know, man, shit, you call me, I'm coming, no matter what. So the trust is, you know, that was the first thing, man. So I just want to thank you, my brother.

[40:43] SHAUN WALLS: Appreciate you.

[40:44] DEANDRE SMITH: We keep going. Hopefully, you know, if anybody, whoever hears this or, you know, goes back to look it up, just, I want you to know that we love our community, we love our families, that we do this stuff for our kids and that it's not a game for us. I see myself being 70, 80 years old, still trying to push the south side to greatness and making sure that the things that we build are always going to be there, man. So, yeah, man, I'm in solidarity with you, and we're going to keep going, man. So I appreciate it. And we're going to go ahead and wrap this up, man. I love you, brother.

[41:25] SHAUN WALLS: Love you, too. Southside Cayman. And we out.

[41:27] DEANDRE SMITH: All right.