Frank Vincent Iudica, Lucia Maria Affi Iudica, Carla Iudica-Souza, and Paula Iudica-Costa

00:00 Maybe again

00:02 My name is Paula Nicole. Iudica-costa. I'm 36. Today is June 11th, 2005 and we're at the Grand Central Terminal and I'm here to interview my father but my sister and mother are also here today.

00:25 My name is Carla Utica Sousa. I am 39 and it is June 11th. We're here at Grand Central Station and I'm also here to get my father for his birthday with my sister and my mother present.

00:44 My name is Lucia Maria at Utica. I am 66 years old and today is June 11th, 2005 and we're here to Grand Central Terminal and I'm here with my husband to ask a few questions in with my two daughters. They will be interviewing him.

01:11 I'm on Frank Vincent Utica.

01:14 Age 74 and patriarch of the family.

01:22 And today's date is June 11th 2005.

01:28 Where at in New York City Grand Central terminal

01:32 And my two daughters and my wife are with me here.

01:43 So Daddy tell us I guess was the start with how it all began hear your favorite story of the immigration of your father to this country.

01:55 Grandfather and grandmother came from Sicily

02:02 About 1900 or shortly thereafter.

02:10 They settled in Paterson.

02:13 I can remember my father telling me that they didn't know a word of English.

02:19 I opened up a little Italian grocery store.

02:23 And

02:25 Felt sole with Italian people. So really never did thoroughly. Learn the language and of course, my father was born in 1907.

02:41 And

02:44 His first language was Italian didn't learn to speak English until he started school.

02:55 Mother

02:56 Came from Holland with her two sisters and her father Eva and her mother and father stayed behind and Holland to earn some money, too.

03:11 Just I'm sorry just a reverse.

03:16 Grandfather came over first

03:20 Stayed here about a year and worked and earned some money to bring his wife and my mother and her two sisters over.

03:35 He worked as a painter.

03:39 And

03:42 I can remember from stories of my grandmother and she was very very homesick and returned Holland for a visit in 1914. And when she was due to come back World War 1 started and

04:07 There was some doubt as to whether they were going to be able to come back.

04:13 But they did manage to get passage on the ship and come back and we're the last ones to leave before all Transportation was cut that cut off between Europe and the US.

04:34 What are you what do you think about you know, how your your mother who was like they came from Holland on the Nova on the boat and your father who came from Sicily and had a had a beer while your father was born here, but his parents came from Sicily. How do you think about what they how they met and how they created a family

04:55 They experience some poverty.

05:00 When I first arrived

05:05 My father being the first born in this country.

05:15 Of course has helped had to help his father with the store.

05:22 And I can remember him telling stories about going back and forth to New York to produce markets with the horse and wagon and bringing produce back to Patterson to Giselle are.

05:37 And

05:42 He later had two sisters.

05:47 I born

05:49 One of which became a nun?

05:54 The other was born

06:01 Later only

06:05 She was only six or seven one.

06:09 Her she lost her mother and father and my father became a guardian.

06:15 I'm not there was a quite a bit of struggle and sacrifice.

06:22 Of course. Yeah like me of

06:27 Making adjustments learning language

06:31 And

06:34 I wish I could remember all of the stories. My father told me when he was alive.

06:42 But I was able to put together that there was a lot of hardship.

06:49 When you think back on like the stories that you heard of their hardship, what's the one that kind of?

06:57 Catches you that you can almost feel great courage and the great sacrifice that was necessary to pull up roots in Sicily to come to the u.s. And

07:20 Finding everything so completely strange.

07:25 I'm not that applied to my father and my mother at my mother's side to.

07:31 Night grandmother and let and the two girls. I can remember my mother being very very frightened of going to school because you couldn't speak a word of the language. She was just before school age. She started school here.

07:52 Being thrown in with a lot of other little girls and boys were American and she couldn't speak a word of the language.

08:02 Caesars

08:05 Things that made an impression on me when the stories were told to me.

08:13 Of course, I my mother's family. We're not poor in Harlem. They were at least my mother's mother.

08:25 Came from a rather well-established family in Amsterdam.

08:31 But my mother's father was a working man.

08:38 You work today?

08:40 When he came to this country and He adjusted much better than my grandmother did she Miss Thailand and she missed the revolution may have the Comforts that she had in Holland.

08:59 What's one of your favorite stories that may be a funny story about your maybe your mother growing up here are your mother your mother is?

09:10 Coming-of-age here funny. I don't remember that my grandfather.

09:21 Got into the into the milk business in New Jersey. I got a milk route delivering milk and

09:33 He is.

09:37 This occurred right after he had a very bad accident where he when he was painting. The surprise first job was house painting he fell off a scaffold and broke both his legs.

09:51 I'm in this free and the recovery, he he got a job delivering milk. Then he sat in the horse wagon and my mother and her two sisters did all of the running with the milk and of course a little sad there, but there was some you are connected with with all of that, too.

10:18 How about your father said your father's funny story on your father's side father.

10:26 Started school in Paterson

10:28 And before he was out of school, he got interested in music.

10:39 Got some money together to buy an exhaust a phone.

10:44 And some drums and he taught himself how to play and by the time you became a teenager.

10:50 He was so I rather accomplished musician.

10:57 Or at least for those days you didn't have to.

11:02 Be a great musician to entertain in those days and he got a job with a band and he

11:13 He went a few years.

11:16 Playing in speak-easy sisters do during prohibition.

11:23 When he met my mother and I'm course my mother.

11:28 Didn't like that at all and her parents, of course like that even less because it wasn't entirely legal and a musician. That was not a profession.

11:42 Knows that you sent was.

11:45 Something that you play boy. That was a fun way to make a living.

11:54 At least in those days and also my mother's people were Dutch and everybody around them words Dutch and my father was Italian man didn't speak the language didn't have a trade at least it a trade that was respectable. They wouldn't call music to trade or profession.

12:24 And then there was some conflict there.

12:29 Eventually here in order to win my mother over. He then you quit music.

12:39 Kept some of his friends and did it for his own entertainment, but never

12:46 Never pursued it as a living anymore.

12:54 Was fast forward a little bit talk a little bit about meeting your wife and your courtship with your with Mommy.

13:02 That was

13:05 1962

13:11 I

13:14 Just before that got a job teaching.

13:17 I came out of the military.

13:21 Went to college spent four years in college and then got a job teaching.

13:28 Top for 2 years and then decided I had to travel a little bit.

13:34 So I

13:37 I made arrangements to go to Europe One Summer. That's 1962 and traveling around here.

13:48 Your mother was tripping was traveling with her.

13:54 Two aunts and uncle three aunts and uncle and the

14:03 Please

14:05 Became quite it on one of those little like daily excursions in Heidelberg, Germany.

14:13 Finally met again and famous and

14:17 Then we start the car respond when she went back to Brazil or she live and I came back to the States. We started it.

14:28 Writing letters back and forth

14:33 From there on we have made arrangements to me. I went to Brazil.

14:40 2 years a year 264

14:48 I went to Brazil one was.

14:52 Then that I proposed to your mother.

14:56 I was ready to get married then but of course her family would have none of that and she wanted it.

15:06 Touch all the bases to a wedding and so far. It's

15:11 I had to come back the following summer to get married.

15:19 When you look back on your meter, you know, how you grew up with your parents and you see where you are. Now. How is your life different than

15:29 What you would have expected your life to be when you were my child my life different now that

15:37 But I expected it to be.

15:42 I know I really don't know. I never thought of marriage and family when I was single.

15:50 Just not something that I spent much time thinking about.

15:57 Hive

15:59 Really didn't

16:01 Think that I would be married because of you.

16:04 In my mid-thirties very satisfied with life the way up.

16:17 Are you here later, Carla Cain?

16:23 I haven't been of course.

16:28 I have to be a breadwinner.

16:33 A few years later full of came and we bought a house.

16:39 Ramsey

16:41 I am I was a family man.

16:48 When you were growing up, did you ever think that you would do as much traveling as you had done?

16:53 No, I I really wanted to travel and I love to travel and it's one of the things that attracted me to the Navy.

17:04 When I was 18 years old 17 years old.

17:10 And I thought that might be the only way that I would.

17:15 Get out and around and sees part of the world.

17:19 So much wood. I did I join the Navy and

17:23 Six months later the Korean War started

17:27 I saw the world when I went aboard shipping to Japan and Korea and Hawaii and

17:43 What's the happiest moment of your life?

17:48 I guess when your mother married me.

17:57 What do you think? That's the toughest. Of your life was?

18:06 Well

18:08 The uncertainty that went along with

18:13 Being married right after marriage and trying to find a house.

18:20 Trying to make enough money to support a family and then I felt that pressure like

18:28 Quite hard at least in the beginning and then things started to fall into place and they started to pay teachers a little bit better and

18:41 It worked out but those first few years were tough for your mother and I

18:48 We were told that we couldn't afford a house real estate people laughed at us when we went to look for a house cuz I was a teacher and didn't make enough money.

19:01 That was pretty rough on your daddy.

19:09 In all those years that you taught how you tougher how many years before your time 34 years. What's your favorite story about?

19:19 Your

19:20 Work as a teacher

19:25 First teaching kids for 34 years adolescents. There's a lot of things that happened in.

19:34 My first experience was a special class for handicapped.

19:42 Boys and girls well and was all boys and first 15 boys.

19:54 Having 15 boys Hall taller than me and all black and

20:04 I called it my celebrity class because I had a a Matthew Mark Luke and John.

20:13 And also George Washington and a Ronald Goldman.

20:21 So there's

20:25 Hi bonded quite quickly with these boys and

20:32 We had a good relationship.

20:34 Then I stayed there for three years and found the place where it was a little more money and made a move for that reason.

20:47 What's the most important lesson that teaching taught you?

20:53 Well, how are you learned a lot?

20:58 About

21:02 Adolescence from work at the moment. I think those first few years. They taught me more than I thought that in fact, I think that might be the experience of most teachers when they go into.

21:18 Situation

21:22 But they've never been in before they learn more than they can teach.

21:28 Getting along with them and bonding with them and

21:33 I think that's what I learned from them.

21:43 It's funny that you were talking about how.

21:46 Your your parents experiences immigrants and I always remember you talking about your students that were immigrants and it seems like that was always something that you always had a soft spot for his for the kids that came to school that didn't speak the languages or that had unusual names or that.

22:07 And if it's funny that you know the link, is there a few years later when I had classes and met you when the kids came into the school district from other countries, which happened quite often in the in the seventies and eighties people were coming into our country from Korean from from South American countries and many times. They didn't speak speak English and they were somehow they found their way into my classrooms because I had some experience teaching

22:51 Kids with communication difficulties

22:55 And the

22:58 But they were regular kids. They were just

23:03 Language barrier

23:05 Kids that age overcome that quickly. It's I can't remember that being a real problem for more than a few months.

23:17 Then any of those kids a blend right in?

23:23 How

23:26 Can you tell them how you feel when they both graduated?

23:34 Great satisfaction for your mother and I when

23:40 Both my daughters graduated college

23:44 And the boat became doctors different fields.

23:52 Course, I was the roof of a lot of a great satisfaction for

23:59 Their mother and I

24:04 If you could do it all again, would you raise us? How would you resist it? Would you raise us differently?

24:09 What would you do differently?

24:13 Can you be truthful?

24:19 I

24:21 Always feeling well.

24:24 We come from a town in north northern New Jersey called Ramsey. Very very.

24:33 Good school experience, I think both my kids had but there was one weakness that I recognize their it in my opinion in this. I don't know if it was in the school district. Are we with my daughter's interest? But I think that there was

24:58 A shortage in their knowledge of History

25:04 And for that reason

25:07 I think that they don't have a full appreciation for their nationality.

25:19 And it's this has been a sore spot with me. I never

25:26 Made much of it. In fact, I don't think I ever brought it up.

25:33 Both of my daughters really appreciate

25:39 Being American and it's something that I feel very strongly about. I'm

25:47 I'm a patriotic person and then I wasn't able to pass that along to them, which is been a frustration for me. You said you wanted.

26:08 How would you like to be remembered at?

26:14 I never thought about.

26:19 Passing on being remembered. I had one of those people that think I'm Immortal I guess when I'm

26:33 When I'm horizontal

26:40 Nothing will matter to me. But how would you like your grandchildren to know about you?

26:47 Well, I would like to think that they

26:52 Appreciated of me as a father and the grandfather.

27:01 I've always thought that you don't look for things back from your kids few you give it's a parent's obligation and that's their role to give and not expect anything back. It's very nice to get some appreciation back, but you don't expect it and don't expect it.

27:29 But it would be nice and it would be a satisfaction.

27:36 If in the afterlife I could look back and never look down on the earth and Save.

27:42 I left something.

27:45 I appreciate what I did.

27:48 If we were to be here.

27:51 You know like 50 years. The tables are turned in your grandchildren are sitting in your place and they're talking about their grandfather. What story would you like them to know about you?

28:06 Like what little anecdote about your life for?

28:12 Oh my goodness.

28:13 Well, they were both very very young. Maybe we're building on that yet now.

28:19 Maybe that's to come right. But what store would you like them to?

28:25 II have about you that hasn't happened yet.

28:37 What advice would you give us about raising our kids?

28:43 Well

28:48 Try not to forget some of the important things.

28:56 Some of the things that I think we're missing in you they have to appreciate and and have a reverence for

29:08 Where is there from?

29:11 And their country and all of the opportunity and and and the advantages that they derive from it and not take them for granted.

29:31 If let me ask a question if either of you or both of you.

29:37 We're born in another country.

29:41 Do you think it would be where you are now?

29:47 Depends on a lot of different things I guess.

29:52 Where are circumstances?

29:55 When we were born, I guess if you do something sort of.

30:01 And very broad globalux you no idea. It might.

30:06 It might have been harder for us as women to to be where we are.

30:11 If you had been in the United States, I mean that's kind of a generalization a little bit, but I think that that's probably true.

30:22 What do I do?

30:25 What are the things you would like your grandchildren? They would pass through to their children?

30:38 You're asking me what I would like to see them pass along to their children.

30:49 An appreciation for for country for God to have some faith in something.

31:01 Can I have some of the values that we have?

31:08 And to think to regard as important some of the things that we regard as important.

31:18 Family

31:22 Religion

31:24 I'm country.

31:28 How about your mom?

31:30 Well

31:32 I want

31:34 I want you to bring up YouTube lots of love and everything else that Daddy said to.

31:44 In all ways family is very important.

31:51 Why of growing up?

32:17 Tell us a little bit about your childhood.

32:24 Well

32:27 Childhood with a

32:30 Snyder wings of tragedy and

32:35 Disasters in Southport FL off a cliff

32:45 I'm looking for a while. They didn't think I was going to live.

32:51 Came through that.

32:56 You're too later. I was playing football for the high school and amazed everybody.

33:08 Had my teeth knocked out.

33:13 What's your what's your favorite story about you as a young child?

33:22 My favorite store

33:28 I think of

33:30 A picture I have of myself when I was.

33:35 Oh, I guess about a year old with boxing gloves on.

33:43 And in a pipe in my mouth

33:49 My mother tried everything to break me of the

33:55 What would I make coffee is the pacifier nothing worked until she bought me a pipe like a man smokes a pipe.

34:06 And that took the place of the past by so there are a lot of pictures of needs and a little little boy with a bike in my mouth.

34:18 What about tell you always thought about you childhood than what you did during the Summers?

34:30 When you went to your grandmother has used to have a rooming house, right? That's a sure I spent two.

34:43 Lot of time there in the summer the beach.

34:49 My first job was on the beach and

34:53 Thank you. Nikki beach chairs and beach umbrellas and so forth.

34:59 I remember you talking about how every every morning what they used to do with you if you were there with all your is the rest of your cousins, right?

35:10 Well, I'm not very often all together.

35:18 And at different times different to I had the

35:23 One boy cousin and Nana and I'm like 4-5 girl cousins and my sister.

35:34 And I don't remember us ever being down the shore all together. That's why didn't you know now it would they did that those days would never do it. Now. What do they use to do with your with your kids send you the beach active? Well my aunt and my grandmother were running a business.

35:57 A rooming house like a hotel small hotel. I may have to end it took a lot of their time and attention in a lot of work. So whenever we were there.

36:11 We were sent to the beach.

36:14 8 in the morning, we were on the beach and we didn't get off the patient till 6 at night.

36:21 All that's that was the day before that was the time. They before they invented the skin cancer looks like that we didn't I didn't think about those things then.

36:33 I love that new time one of my my aunt's would come down with a stack of sandwiches and a and a big canister of milk and we had our lunch on the beach but every day and all day. We spent on the beach and be enjoyed it for you loved it.

36:56 I'll ask you questions little bit different this this whole thing is about history and and we're talking about your personal history. What what historical event that happened in your lifetime you think had the most impact on you?

37:16 Well from a very early age. I was always attuned to history can remember is very young boy being fascinated and completely taken up with things that were happening in the world. I can remember the Russian Finnish war and I was only I was only seven or eight years old at that time that I can remember these things very vividly and I can remember no other war in the Pacific and the warden year if I can remember these things and they did have an impact on me if you are what I asked what to

38:05 Historical events had the most profound effect on me was probably be Pearl Harbor and the attack on the World Trade Center to years ago.

38:20 What do you remember about Pearl Harbor?

38:23 I can remember I was 11 years old one of our neighbors came running into the house and told us that it did the Japanese attack Pearl Harbor and

38:41 We would probably be at War the next day President Roosevelt and made his

38:50 Day of infamy speech and all of this had an effect on me. I am of course at that time. I

39:01 Couldn't know that the war wouldn't come right to our Shores and then where I live.

39:10 It turned out the war was on the other side of the ocean, but

39:17 When it first started and I was 11 years old are you I didn't understand that. I thought we were going to be at having when they're there would be fighting on our street and so far so there was a lot of fear and then

39:32 Had an impact

39:34 Best things to velop tonight

39:38 I had my interest was the staying the night.

39:43 Follow through all of the the events.

39:59 If you could do anything now, what would you do?

40:06 Anything in what?

40:11 Whatever

40:16 I would like to travel I love him still.

40:22 Love to travel.

40:27 Let's do it.

40:33 Yeah, I would like to travel your daddy and I always say this with the whole family.

40:43 That's a little hard to drag everybody around but it's not impossible.

40:54 Is there anything that you've never told me that you told us that you would want to tell us now?

40:59 Check that off there. I can't think of anything fan.

41:06 Other than what you told us already told us.

41:09 But he never told us.

41:17 Good. Thank you Daddy. Thank you, Mom.

41:21 Thank you girls for giving us this opportunity. Happy birthday, Daddy.

41:28 Thank you 74.

41:31 Yep.