George Ozburn and Conor Miles

[00:04] CONNOR: I'm Connor. My age is 34. Today is December 7. We're in Fresno, California. I'm here with George, who I just met. Okay.

[00:22] GEORGE OSBORNE: My name is George Osborne. I'm 46. Today is December 7. We're in Fresno, California. I'm here with Connor, and our interviewer is Sonia.

[00:38] CONNOR: So, the kickoff question that we ask each other is, what made you want to do this interview today?

[00:46] GEORGE OSBORNE: Oh, wow. That's kind of interesting. I met Sonia at the rotary, and she was giving a speech. I had never heard of the program before, and so it was really neat to hear about what it was. And the cool thing, actually, was I missed a portion of it because I had to take a phone call. And when I came back, I went to apologize to Sonia and was like, I'm sorry. I had to get up during, because I was, like, right in the middle, in front of everybody, and I had to make the stupid scene, but you got houses to sell and deals to do. And so I came back to apologize, and then she really introduced me to what more what it was, and I said, I missed the videos, which I guess they didn't play. And that's when we started up a real cool conversation with myself and another Rotarian that we kind of see a little different on some of the views, but that's what rotary is about. We're different people getting together for mutual good. And it just coincided that, you know, she said, hey, that's exactly what we're looking for. And I'm like, okay. She said, would you be interested? I said, well, let me look into it. And then I was really surprised to get chosen. To be honest, I hadn't thought that much about it, you know? I know. So it was really cool to be part of the process and hear how far it goes. I think it's something that's sorely needed in the world right now. Like, not just here, but the entire world. So I'm really excited to be part of it and to meet you and participate.

[02:08] CONNOR: Yeah, awesome.

[02:12] GEORGE OSBORNE: Do I ask the same question?

[02:14] CONNOR: Okay.

[02:15] GEORGE OSBORNE: Sorry. Or I interrupted. I already violated one of the rules.

[02:18] CONNOR: Oh, you're good.

[02:21] GEORGE OSBORNE: What made you. Connor, what made you want to do this interview today?

[02:26] CONNOR: I wanted to do this interview today because I also agree that there's a lot of divisiveness in the world. And I think if you get any two of us together, we definitely have more in common then we have different. Get down to the real basics of it and essentials. And I really wanted to hear from the other side, you know, and hear a face, not like a talking head or like, not some misrepresentation, like other, but a person at the time, I think there was, like, a lot, a lot of divisiveness, too, that made me, like, curious about the other side. I was super surprised to get picked because I just responded to a radio spot. I do feel lucky and privileged, too, to be a part of it. I feel like it's like a stamp in history, a document in time, if you will. And, yeah, how can you put price on that?

[03:51] GEORGE OSBORNE: And we could continue off this, correct?

[03:53] CONNOR: Yeah.

[03:54] GEORGE OSBORNE: Okay. I think it is very empowering to know because, you know, you have some polarity going on, but I think more than often than not, everybody's trying to do the right thing. And so when you can have two people come and sit and really talk together, you know, not get talked to, talk with each other, and take that moment to say, hey, you know, I want what's best. You want what's best? Let's get to the nitty gritty and just, you know, and talk about things, you know, I've seen a lot of different dynamics and work with a lot of different people. And so it's really important to know that majority of people, like I said, they were very kind and they're not trying to do something, rather motives. Most people just want to be happy and see other people happy, too. But I did notice we also are opposites, because you're parlier and I was Fowler. Those are huge rivals. I'm just saying, you know, it's kind of funny. It's a small town thing, and so, knowing small town people, we also see things sometimes a lot different than other people as well. Not that Fresno is huge, but what they call it, the biggest, smallest town. So it's very interesting, you know, and it'd be. It's going to be really neat to see how our circles interact and how much we do really have in common, you know?

[05:08] CONNOR: Yeah.

[05:08] GEORGE OSBORNE: Looking forward to that.

[05:09] CONNOR: Yeah, I taught in parlier, like, for a year, but I'm not there right now, so. So rest assured, ex pater, I saw.

[05:20] GEORGE OSBORNE: In your bio you've taught several years there or somewhere. It didn't say where, just said you taught junior high school.

[05:26] CONNOR: Yeah, I've taught around the valley. I did two years in Madeira and a semester in Selma, covering for a teacher on maternity leave and then a year in parlier at the high school.

[05:39] GEORGE OSBORNE: Nice.

[05:40] CONNOR: Yeah.

[05:41] GEORGE OSBORNE: So then we have a lot of concentric circles. I grew up mostly in Selma, small community, went through school there, you know, of course, played ball for Selma and then Fowler. And then, you know, we played against parlier, you know, and then when I went out to, I was in law enforcement, so I was patrolling, and so we patrolled the small towns as well. Didn't have to ever go out to parlier to do anything but parleyer automotive parts. My, my brother in law, he's more like my brother. They used to own that one.

[06:08] CONNOR: Oh.

[06:08] GEORGE OSBORNE: I used to go out there all the time to get my car fixed and worked on and stuff like that. So. Interesting communities, for sure.

[06:14] CONNOR: Yeah. And I was gonna say, right now I'm at Sutter Middle school in Fowler, California. So I bet that have a lot of concentric circles, probably with some of my students. If you've spent a long time there, it seems like a really great community. And it's definitely the best school district that I've ever worked for. So I got nothing but praise for a fowler.

[06:41] GEORGE OSBORNE: Yeah. Two of my nieces work there. They're both teachers there. Oh, yeah.

[06:44] CONNOR: Awesome.

[06:45] GEORGE OSBORNE: Yeah.

[06:45] CONNOR: Wow.

[06:45] GEORGE OSBORNE: Most of my family's there that's left.

[06:47] CONNOR: Okay. Gotcha.

[06:48] GEORGE OSBORNE: Yeah.

[06:49] CONNOR: Very cool. Like, they teach in the district. Okay.

[06:52] GEORGE OSBORNE: One teaches at the junior high, and then I think the other one's at the elementary marshall.

[06:57] CONNOR: Okay.

[06:57] GEORGE OSBORNE: I can't remember exactly which one she's in now.

[07:00] CONNOR: Very cool.

[07:01] GEORGE OSBORNE: It's neat. Small world.

[07:03] CONNOR: Yeah, small town. Right. So, kickoff question two. Read your partner's bio aloud exactly as written in first person. What detail in the bio would you like to know more about?

[07:30] GEORGE OSBORNE: Okay. Do you want me to read it? Does he read it? Yeah. Okay. All right.

[07:34] CONNOR: Oh, sorry.

[07:35] GEORGE OSBORNE: I didn't know if we were supposed to go all the way through.

[07:37] CONNOR: That's right. Yeah.

[07:38] GEORGE OSBORNE: Okay, I'll read.

[07:39] CONNOR: Okay.

[07:40] GEORGE OSBORNE: This is Connor's bio. I was born and raised in Fresno and graduated from Bullard in 2005. My dad is an attorney and my mom was a midwife before she fell ill with fibromyalgia. They've been married for nearly 40 years and are the most supportive people I know. I have taught math in middle or high school for the last four years. My next semester of school is my last for my program. My dog and my girlfriend are the brightest lights of my life. I recently finished my confirmation and volunteer at my church on Sundays. That's awesome. So my girlfriend is part of a big part of my life, and her dog is her biggest part of her life. I know the hierarchy. The dog than me. That's interesting. So what are you finishing on your program? What are you trying to do?

[08:25] CONNOR: I've been an intern for the last three semesters, and Covid kind of, like, threw everything, like, in a spike. So I was able to get a waiver and pick up kind of from where I left off before. And so, yeah, I go to Tulare county for classes at night, and that was been, like, twice a week in all my assignments, and the school district and them worked together and me all worked together in the program to get a credential, and so I'm getting my credential.

[09:05] GEORGE OSBORNE: Are you wanting to continue with math?

[09:07] CONNOR: Yeah.

[09:08] GEORGE OSBORNE: Your preferred?

[09:09] CONNOR: Yeah.

[09:10] GEORGE OSBORNE: Okay.

[09:11] CONNOR: Yeah, no, there's a. There's a math phobia epidemic, I think, kind of going on where, I don't know, people think that math isn't for them or that they can't think about math if they're not solving an equation. But there's a lot of ways we think about math that we don't even know with grouping and thinking about, like, with logic or reason. What is your premise? What is your conclusion? All of that is applied math. And I try to tell my students that mathematics wasn't invented. It was discovered, and it's just all around us. And other things have discovered math, too. You know, like ants. Ants moving stuff. Like, they need to know a lot of math kind of thing. And I don't know. It's like a language for languages, if you will.

[10:10] GEORGE OSBORNE: I really enjoyed math growing up, and in high school, I was picked to take the chemistry, the trigonometry, and the geometry test for the golden state scholarship awards.

[10:23] CONNOR: Oh, yeah.

[10:24] GEORGE OSBORNE: So I finished in the top 10% in chemistry. I don't know what happened because I was really good at trigonometry. I just barely placed. And then the other one, I scored geometry. I was. Scored the top 20. So I used to love it. And now I look at some of the things I used to have. I'm like, what the hell language is this? I'm like, I don't even understand this anymore. Because you don't use it. But I think it's something that, you know, that it definitely needs to be taught. And numbers don't lie. They're straightforward, and that's what's pure about it, I think. I love science, and I stuff like that inside. I'm a huge geek outside, too. So let's see, what else I also wanted to know. So you have a dog. What kind of dog is that?

[11:08] CONNOR: She's an american bully. I actually finally got a DNA tested. I said, I want to do it for years, but I finally caved in, and she. Yeah, came back 100% american bully. She looks like a Staffordshire terrier. So like a small, small pit bull, kind of with a boxy head. She's a blue nose. And I found her at the pound when she was, like, less than eight weeks. They said she was eight weeks, but I think she was less in her own poop. Like, sad, alone, like, without her litter. And I've loved her ever since, and she's loved me. She's taught me more than I ever thought.

[11:47] GEORGE OSBORNE: Well, see, then we have that in common, too. German shepherd from the pound. And when I got her, she was so thin that her bones were popping out, and her hind legs would give out. They'd collapse because she was so malnourished. And I talked.

[12:00] CONNOR: I have bad hips, too.

[12:03] GEORGE OSBORNE: And now she's fat as can be and happy. She runs around. She's like a bull in the china shop. She'll knock you over. But everybody always thinks she's the mean one because my girlfriend has an australian shepherd, and he looks so happy, like, no, you don't mess with that one. That's the one that'll bite you in the butt. Mine that looks mean and looks like she's, you know, a canine. If you throw the ball, give her a bean burrito or something. She loves everybody.

[12:27] CONNOR: I hear with, like, australian shepherds and, like, border collies that you gotta keep those guys, like, so entertained and so, like, trained and, like, on it. And he talks. Otherwise, they'll train you. Like, it's, like, kind of. And that's my dog, too. My dog totally trains me.

[12:45] GEORGE OSBORNE: When new people come to the house, we have to watch him because he'll want to nip them in the butt to make them sit down. He doesn't like him walking around his house. So we're like, no, no, no. So he's got it.

[12:53] CONNOR: You're not cheap.

[12:54] GEORGE OSBORNE: Yeah. And then it says here that you just finished your confirmation of volunteer at your church. Which church do you attend?

[13:02] CONNOR: St. Paul Newman center. It's the catholic church next to Fresno estate.

[13:08] GEORGE OSBORNE: Nice.

[13:08] CONNOR: Yeah. They don't even know it's a catholic church. I think most people going by it, it's got really big, like, cement blocks kind of on the outside, so it kind of looks more like a bunker than a church, but it is beautiful inside with a stained glass and.

[13:31] GEORGE OSBORNE: Yeah, I was primarily. I had an interesting childhood. I was raised. This sounds weird. Half catholic and then half pentecostal. How you had those two mixes, that's like two opposite things. I was good. One week, I'd go to stay and kneel. And the other time we were dancing around on the floor. So it's just, it was kind of interesting growing up. So I used to attend St. Anthony's, which was over off Moreau and Boulder, and now I do a non denominational as of. Of. Oh, gosh. Going on probably like, I'd say about 15 years or so. And so I go to cross city now. That's my girlfriend's church. She prefers to go there. So before that it was people. So I do love my faith and I don't.

[14:13] CONNOR: I don't.

[14:13] GEORGE OSBORNE: I'm faith centered. So, you know, so we do have some things, a lot of things in common, I think so. That's cool.

[14:20] CONNOR: Awesome. Okay. Alright, so. Grew up in a small, economically poor town, my family struggled. I was small and picked on. Growing up, I still felt the need to stand up for people. My dream was to become a police officer. I achieved my goal and was proudly pinned as deputy sheriff. At 22 years old, I loved my job and the excitement. At about the age of 27, my wife left me and I found myself raising three kids 100% by myself. In 2009, I was shot in the line of duty. My whole life took another drastic turn. So I actually had the chance to read this before in the email. And I want to first ask, what were you picked on for? And I'm sorry that happened to you. So that's the worst, of course, you.

[15:23] GEORGE OSBORNE: Know, Selma is predominantly a hispanic area. I'm mixed, but I don't look, and I look like my dad. And so when I would go to school and stuff like that, I was kind of stuck out, you know, and I was very thin. I was hyper thin. People thought there was something wrong with me, so thin, and it was just bony. And so I got picked on again because of my knowledge. I was extremely smart. I was testing really high. I was getting picked on because I was thin. I was picked it on, in essence, because I was white. And then when I'd say, well, my mom's hispanic, they say, well, you're trying to be that. And so I couldn't win for the life of me. And every time I turned around, there was something going on. And some was a pretty rough score district to begin with. So a lot of those things happened. And I also had issues where if I saw somebody else being picked on, I. Even at the earliest age, I don't. I hate bullies. Not bully dogs, but bully bullies. And so when I see somebody picking up on somebody or picking on them, I will step up. I won't be quiet. I just can't. There's something inside me that cares about people and the unfair advantage that somebody, just because they're larger, does or decides to take out on them. So I'd stick up for people, and sometimes the next thing I know, the person who would be the person getting beat up left. And I was there getting beat up. So I fought a lot. Sometimes it was just obvious. And my dad just, he told me one day, he says, you know, it doesn't matter if there's one or four, as long as when they're stuck with, if you lose, if they're hurting, when it's over and done with, then eventually they'll stop picking on you. And it finally got to the point that that's just kind of the way it was. I didn't look for the fights, but I wasn't going to let somebody do something to me or just can pick on me or push me into a wall. And I stuck up for a lot of people. And consequently, I ended up making a lot of friends. And all different from backgrounds, socioeconomical. I mean, people thought, oh, because I have faith that I couldn't. I wouldn't be against somebody who would, let's say, was gay or something, but then I'd have gay friends or if somebody was of a different ethnicity. I found, quote unquote, the Miff misfits, because I was a misfit. And people look at me now and they say, you were never a misfit. But that's all I was. I just was in a different area. And so we were very poor. You know, I wore the same thing every day, every year. I got two pairs of pants and five shirts, and people picked on me for it. You know, I just had to rotate those things. So a lot of the things, when people I said, like, they say, look at me now, they don't know what was under there. And I truly believe everybody is an iceberg. You only see the top 20%. You didn't see the 80% that's under. That made them who they are today. And so, see, and then I always looked at law enforcement as being respected and they help people. And then they also got to drive fast. I mean, that's cool. So I love that stuff about it. And even though people told me I was small and I was weak and I'd never achieve, I said, no, I will. And my parents really instilled that in me. Like I said, we were very poor. They couldn't give me things financially, but they could spend time with me. And there were many times my dad wasn't working. We didn't have enough money to run the propane in our house, so I slept in a sleeping bag, and I'd wake up with frost on my face. I was very sickly. And those type of things just kind of happened. People are like, why are you always sick? Why is this? Why is that? And then as I grew, I think it made me stronger. It made it so that I do look after other people a lot. And to this day, even when I drive down the street, my girlfriend never knows where I'm going. Stop the car and help somebody, because that's what I do. That's just who I am.

[19:14] CONNOR: I think my mom has that in her, too. Like, my dad would sometimes get to speeding up just because that's the worst when you're kind of isolated in that way and put, when you really don't have any power over how big we are or what color your skin is. And it always sucks feeling like you're not in or, like, have that outsider kind of thing. Was it always like that? Like, through middle school and high school.

[20:09] GEORGE OSBORNE: All the way up until about my junior year. And then I grew, like, three inches and put on 20 pounds and started playing football. I, you know, people by that time started knowing, oh, you can't go and think you're going to push George, because. And lock you in the head. You know, that just was the school. And as that went, you know, the next thing I knew, I was able to make friends with the gang members and stuff. I know that sounds really weird, but I went to bulldog gang parties and stuff like that because I was invited. They'd say, hey, Osborne I say, que quettas way, which means goat. But in their language, it's something completely different. Probably. I probably violated another one of the rules there, but it was one of those things. And then I was able to counterbalance with humor and could get into people, and they learned more about me. You know, I had moved around a lot as kids, so I always felt like the new kid. I was always ostracized. And then finally, once, like I said, I transferred into Fowler. Things got easier as things progressed, and, you know, you get that more confidence about yourself, that it's okay to be different. But it was a long process. And, you know, a lot of decisions I had to make on my own. I had to decide who I wanted in and out of my life, who was healthy, who wasn't at a younger age than a lot of people did. But I was. I had a goal of what I wanted to do, you know? Yeah, I just. I was laser focused. And I've been told my whole life, people have never seen somebody at such a young age laser focused to do something, man.

[21:45] CONNOR: And I think. I think I have a lot of friends or people in my life who haven't been able to achieve what they wanted, or it's always been like a dream deferred or it was put on the back burner or something like that, to have that privilege and have that power. It sounds like a beautiful story.

[22:13] GEORGE OSBORNE: It was. Thank you. That means a lot to me because it was a struggle and it took a long way to get there and a lot of mind focus. And I still continue to grow so much that even the past few years, I've grown even more since the shooting that I never even thought I would. And I think I'm at the point in my life where I truly believe I know absolutely nothing. And I'm going to continue to know nothing, because as long as I keep searching for new answers and new quests that, you know, I'll keep achieving, you know, there's a hunger there to learn and meet people and see people, even through the PTSD. Once I finally got through that portion, I found it's easier for me to connect with people. People, you know, I want to be genuine. I want to learn about them. I want them to learn about me. And there's nothing really to hide. I think at a younger age, I was hiding everything. I didn't want people to know I liked Star Wars. I don't want people to know that I was a Sci-Fi geek or that I cuddled up on the couch with my mom. You know, both my parents now passed away, and I don't get that opportunity.

[23:18] CONNOR: You know, they probably did, too, also. Yeah. Yeah. I wanted to ask and thank you for sharing about your struggle with PTSD, because I was going to ask if my life took a drastic turn. Was there other disabilities after that you've dealt with or are still dealing with?

[23:56] GEORGE OSBORNE: Yeah. So immediately after the shooting, you basically have euphoria. I'm alive. You know what I mean? And you're like, I made it. And people asked me if I was afraid during the shooting. I wasn't. My adrenaline was pumping. I had already been in four shootings that month, and this time I got hurt. I took two rounds of close range from a 223, which is AR 15, and I was very lucky to still have my arm. And they said I probably wouldn't get used to my arm back, and I said I would, and I tried like heck to go back. I got diagnosed early on with PTSD. They asked me if I would go back to work. I said, stitch me up, and I'll go back right now. Because that's what you were taught, was, you just keep pushing forward. You just add more on, you ignore it and go. Ignore it and go, well, that's not the most healthiest thing that I've come to find out. And so I look at PTSD as all the traumas that are in your life are like water behind a dam, and you have this dam, and everything's fine as long as the water's behind it. A normal person, when they, for lack of better terms, normal person, when they get too much, the water spills, overdose, and they might cry, they might have an emotional letdown. PTSD is like a traumatic injury that causes a crack in your dam that the water seeps through even when you don't want it to, even when nothing's going on. And you have these triggers that would then come out, and I couldn't talk to people, and I became closed off. And if it hadn't been for a few friends that truly believed in that person, who I was, they wouldn't give up on me. When I said, no, go away, I don't want to see you guys anymore. No, I'm a failure. No, I've lost everything. No, I'm going to do this.

[25:42] CONNOR: That.

[25:42] GEORGE OSBORNE: It was very difficult. And, you know, you go through a lot of mental rehab and different psychologists, and at the time, I used to call them rat doctors, until I finally met somebody that actually generally cared.

[25:57] CONNOR: Rat doctors?

[25:58] GEORGE OSBORNE: Yeah, because I said they'd make me spin on the wheel like a rat over and over and over again.

[26:04] CONNOR: Head shrink.

[26:05] GEORGE OSBORNE: And I was the rat. Yeah. I was just running around on a treadmill and getting nowhere, not knowing what to do. And then somebody, and I believe my faith, intervened and said, this chiropractor, of all people, is going to find you the help. And I didn't know that I was slowly dying because I had an infection, because I was at worker's comp, and the doctors didn't know when they went in there, he said, you have severe staph. It's through your body. It's systematic. And the last person they had died two months later. So they put me on liquid iv's, wouldn't let me leave. I had a quarantine for a long time, and when you're going through those processes, you're already quarantining yourself because you're shutting the world off. It gets worse. When I tell people, you go to a dark place and people say, why hit bottom? The scary part is when you realize there is no bottom and you start realizing you're just falling free. And if it hadn't been for certain people that reached out and would not stop, like I said and my faith, things could have been a lot different for me. And so I now do reach out for other people, and I help people with life stressors, PTSD. I belong to a program called code nine that I'm trying to get off the ground. I joined Rotary because I truly believe that I have a servant's heart. It's a little different. And I want to help everybody I can, because if I can save one person, then my pain and my suffering meant something. And I truly believe God put me in that test to serve as his testimony. And that's my faith, and that's how I carry it forward and try to honor it. Especially because shortly after I was shot, a friend of mine, he saw my interview, and he told me how well I did on the interview. He was very proud of me, and he was a very close friend of mine. Three months later, he was killed in line of duty, and I had huge survivors guilt, because I was like, why did I survive and not him? He's a better man than me. So I believe it's in part to help honor him, too, and all the other friends I lost. So it's just a little different that a lot of times people don't realize. And my children saw it, and I had to. I had three kids by myself, and they're watching their dad here, you know? And people asked me how I did it. I said, well, they helped me. You know, they gave me that extra. I couldn't fail, you know? And now they see me, and they're like, you taught us so much. Much. I know I made mistakes. I've even apologized to them already. And they're like, you did everything you could. So, like I said, it's a huge dynamic. A lot of. A lot of stuff, a lot of suffering that I went through, but I truly believe it all did have a purpose. And now I can finally see it. So my heart is much more lighter now.

[28:57] CONNOR: Man, that's really amazing. And I think that's the power of healing when you commit to it and when you have people in your life who are willing to go that extra step. Yeah. Yeah. That's really awesome, George.

[29:25] GEORGE OSBORNE: Thank you.

[29:30] CONNOR: To third one. Tell me about one or two people in your life who have had the biggest influence on you.

[29:44] GEORGE OSBORNE: Let's see. I'm going to talk about them as number one. I'll talk about my parents together. They both have passed. The biggest thing I think they taught me was they couldn't teach me a lot about finances and stuff like that because they didn't do too well with that part. But what they did tell me about was how if you stuck together with that one person, it didn't matter what was going on. I learned that they had one of the most dysfunctional, functional relationships I've ever seen. And it's comical, but the end result is that, sorry, my dad got to go out the way he wanted to. He made his choice that he was going to hospice, and my mom supported him. She held his hand all the way through, and even at the end, before he passed, he was smoking a cigar and having a miller high life and eating pizza. He was like, I am done with this diabetes. I'm done with this stuff. I'm gonna watch a football game. I'm gonna have a beer, and I got to take him out for his last drink. My mom, who lasted two more years, told me that, you know, it was hard for her when dad was sick, but she would love to have him back. And she told me one thing. She said, george, inside, I'm still 23. She fell, and so she was in a wheelchair. I was kind of a mixed blessing disguise because I was going through a divorce. I had gotten married again, and I had nowhere to go. So I went to live with my mom. And when she fell, I got to be with her at the end of her life and take care of her. So they taught me about a lot about the dynamic of life and to not wait and to go seize the day because you just. You're never promised tomorrow. And they taught me to let things go that you don't need to hold on to forgiveness people, and just be the best you you can be. But don't live in fear. I think that's the biggest thing, and that's, like, my motto for my life now, is, I won't live in fear. I won't live in fear of something else happening or meeting somebody and being afraid that they might not like me or live in fear that, oh, my gosh, people are judging me or live in fear because I have anxiety or live in fear of that. I think we give it too much power. And so one of the reasons I did this was I didn't want to live in fear. Of what if somebody disagrees with me and they take this against me because I'm here? Well, I'm here because I want to meet in the middle. I want to meet somebody. I want to build that friendship across whatever distance there may be, because I don't think there's enough distance that if good people can't join together to have common ground, I just. I don't believe it anymore. So I think they're part of the people that taught me that. Okay, so now I'm gonna ask you. Tell me about one or two people in your life who have had the biggest influence on you, and what did they teach you?

[33:14] CONNOR: I'll tell you about my mom first as well. My mom first got sick when I was about twelve or 13. I remember kind of like asking. Well, I remember her working so hard before that as a midwife and as a singer in all women's blues bandhouse that she took us on tour with and had so many great experiences. Now I see kids at shows, or my friends like kids at shows. It's like, that's me. That was me right there. She has the biggest heart and is a big servant, as you put it. And she's kind of taught me to fight for whatever you want. Like, she would. She would not really take no for an answer with anything. She would try to finagle anybody and anyone and leave as many messages or call as many people to find the person who could, who could actually change it and who would. And I think she just had understanding of not just how the world works, but how to work the world that I think is invaluable to have in your back pocket as a skill. And I think I get my big heart from her, too, like, where I can't not care kind of thing, it's hard. And I would say, yeah, my dad, too, has had a huge influence on my life. Him being with my mom, them being together. Their relationship, I think, is a rare thing. They kind of are the opposites. Attracted and after. And it took me a long time to see other friends as parents and to see other friends as Homer, to hear, to know how lucky I am and how cool my parents are. And so my dad and my mom both instilled with me that your mind is your money and to work hard in school and that you could do what you wanted if you applied yourself to it. And I just have a lot of students who I don't think have that in their lives. And so I think all those things that they taught me and just being by being them too. And through practice, you know, the things that I learned that they didn't even know they were teaching that are good that their parents may taught them kind of thing. All of that, I think has had the biggest influence on me.

[37:02] GEORGE OSBORNE: Strong foundation. Yeah, that's awesome. And the support. So that's cool that we do share some of that in common too. It's nice.

[37:11] CONNOR: Yeah.

[37:12] GEORGE OSBORNE: I mean, 40 years, that's amazing. It really is. Because I read your bible for and I tried to make sure I made mental note of things. My dad wanted to make it to 50, so he made it just to 50 before he passed. So that was. That was awesome because you just, nowadays you don't hear it, you know, so congratulations.

[37:30] CONNOR: They're awesome. They are awesome. My girlfriend too, her parents are together and I think my longest lasting relationships, I don't even know if we're conscious of it, but I think it really does help you to have a model relationship in your life growing up. And I don't think we always know how lucky we are. I can take it for granted very easily.

[38:02] GEORGE OSBORNE: I think sometimes we all do at some point. And I think you constantly have to re emphasize that gratitude that you have to have. I'm really about that. Like every morning I try and say my one thing I learned, you know, a lot of the books that I started reading and stuff and working on my mind was that every morning you can't control your day, but you can control your morning and your night, so you just control your end caps. So every night, every night I make sure, you know, I'm grateful for what I have. And every morning when I wake up, I think about two or three things at least that I'm grateful for. What does your girlfriend do?

[38:35] CONNOR: She's also in education. Well, she wants to go into education. She's into speech pathology, so she's getting her master's to be a SLP. Nice speech language pathologist. Yeah.

[38:49] GEORGE OSBORNE: So my girlfriend is a special ed teacher over at Buchanan and she, her nephew was autistic so that's how she ended up finding that. And I know a lot of times that speak pathology. Let me try and say that ten times fast that that sometimes commingles so that they can identify those things and work with the autistic kids as well.

[39:09] CONNOR: Yeah. Yeah. Sped teachers are the best man. You can learn so much from a sped teacher.

[39:16] GEORGE OSBORNE: I figured that's way that patience for me.

[39:21] CONNOR: Special education teachers. Yeah, like all those like, things that you teach kindergarteners to do and like, we can do it too. We need it, too. It works for us, too. It's funny. Yeah.

[39:35] GEORGE OSBORNE: How did you guys meet?

[39:40] CONNOR: Her sister was really good friends with me and my friends way back in high school, so I kind of always knew her since back then, but we started dating, like, three, four years ago about. Yeah, she always had a boyfriend after college until she did it. And that was nice opportunity.

[40:13] GEORGE OSBORNE: Yes.

[40:15] CONNOR: Gotta strike while that aren't shoot you a shot. We're coming up 150 minutes.

[40:23] GEORGE OSBORNE: So who goes? Who goes? Four? All right. Could you briefly describe, in your own words, your personal political values?

[40:37] CONNOR: Um, I think I told, uh, Sonia, a social libertarian, which I don't think she had heard of before. A socially liberal libertarian is how I would describe myself. I want to put, like, like, I don't even need half of the military's budget, really. I don't even need half. Just a 10th of the military's budget into education, I think, would do a world of difference. It would actually triple, like, our budget. And so shifting our priorities to domestic, I think, are so, so, so important. And we really, really need to stop focusing on, I don't know, crime from immigrants or, or, like, abortions and how bad they are, because it's kind of taken us back. And I think those are, those both can be really, really bad things. I'm sure there was one immigrant who was a rapist. You know, there was sure one. But we cannot, like, like, run our world like that. That's like running in fear, in a way. And with the other thing is just public health kind of issues. I think we have a lot of, kind of tragic statistics, like, in this country. Like, with how many toddlers, like, die from gunshots, like, from their brothers and sisters or by accident. It's awful. It's awful. It's despicable, really. Like, it makes me cringe. And I thought it drive into work. Like, what if somebody brings in today, and it's like, how many teachers, how many generations have been thinking that or had to worry about that on the list of things? Um, my politics is so personal. It's so, so, so personal. It goes down to my heart. I think the. They say, uh, I think they say, no, politics is personal, but I think all politics is personal. It gets down to these relationships that we have with our own family and with our neighbors, with our local officials up all the way. And I think a lot of this kind of, like, bureaucratic, like, triangle like, idea where one holds, like, the power and there is an, like, really shared, isn't adaptable to our world. It can't like function, it actually resists change. I think most of the time that hold, I think military also call it like a shuttlecock idea where we're all going like fins of a shuttlecock down into one or a military terminal. I really want us to not have to talk about those things or to. I think a lot of times we really do need to talk about roads and try to find stuff that we have in common. More music, food are all really great things that I think should be more invested in, in our country and in our culture, I suppose, as opposed to, I don't know, sex, guns, and drugs, which can all be fun, admittedly.

[44:54] GEORGE OSBORNE: I agree.

[44:54] CONNOR: Admittedly, I got to say that right now because, I mean, I do say shake my fist at capitalism and this whole, like, monopoly idea you call fair competition. Well, why? How did all the media get broken up to, like, Pac Bell and Eastbo? And now we're all back to one or two again. I think it's the haves and the have nots. I think more often than not, we live in a caste system here in America, where I was born middle class, so I can stay middle class. And if you're born poor, you learn how to stay poor, and you learn how to live poor and survive poor. I have this great ten things to know. How to live through poverty, how to live through middle class kind of thing, and how to live as a rich person, like knowing what the highest end fashion to buy to keep up with the Joneses, as they say, or all these skills that you actually learn if you are in that class and you have to abide by those rules. And none of those kids learn how not to get their laundry stolen at the laundromat, you know, like, that's survival. And we all, I think, are surviving. But. But the whole irony, I think, of our democracy is that we support the rich, that they get away with it, and the rich have gotten richer and the poor have gotten poorer. And they say that the poorest people in the world used to live on a quarter a day, and then now they're living on two, and look at progress. Isn't that great kind of thing? But it's like, no, no, no. We still have homeless people camping on the streets, and we say they chose it, but surviving, and we can't argue with that. You can't say they're not surviving. And we make it able for them to survive, and I think we should make it easier. Thank you. Yes. Thank you very much, Sonia. I could go on and on and on. So, George, please please tell me about your own personal political values.

[47:58] GEORGE OSBORNE: Well, I guess if you have to put a label on it, a lot of people might label me more of a conservative, but I think I'm getting where I progressively been more towards the middle. I can understand a lot of what you were saying. I do believe that there is an inherent in the system that has led us to believe that, and it really polarizes us, not only politically, but also financially. But I still believe that the United States is the best country in the world as far as opportunity. And I speak from personal experience, from being where I was very underprivileged and came from an underprivileged community and didn't have a place to live, and my parents lived. We had to go move in my aunt's garage because we had nowhere to live. My mother before me and her family grew up in Yuma, Arizona, and they used to pick in the fields and they lived under a tree for a long time. My dad and his mom or his mom used to pick cotton until they moved to Fresno. And I've seen that you can achieve a lot if you don't continue to look for reasons to not succeed and you can make your way. I do believe it's difficult, and some people may appear to have more advantages than us, that's for sure. I agree with you that politics has created a huge issue in the fact that I don't believe funds are going to where they should. But I also believe that for, say, why are we spending money on a study to learn if taking selfies may makes people happy? There's so much waste in the bureaucracy. Like you said, being in the sheriff's department and seeing it at firsthand. The sheriff's department was offered I don't remember how many tens of thousands of dollars to have a bicycle unit. We don't use bicycles, but if they didn't use it, they wouldn't get when they needed money next year. So then they bought a bunch of bicycles that sat in a warehouse. That's government waste. And I truly believe that we have way too much government. But I don't just put it on the military. I put it on government as a whole. I believe we do need to protect ourselves and the borders and secure things and make things appropriate. There needs to be discipline. It doesn't matter whether you're an immigrant or just a citizen. Everybody should abide by at least common rules that we agree on. I don't necessarily agree with all the rules or even what they've written into law, but since it was voted on. I have to follow it, and I do. So I don't see there should be any reason why we can't continue to agree on that path, because for right now, it is the best path that there has been for hundreds of years since our government has been in place. I do think that, like you said, there's huge monopolies. So we agree on that 100%. And I often say the same exact words, you, how the heck did? And we split everything up to find it all back together again. So I do 100% agree with that. And I think that does cause a lot of issues. But I think there's a lot of government waste, a lot of waste of money. And I'm more about efficiency. If you want to take $10 from me, why is $9 of it going to something else instead of what it was supposed to go to? If I said, hey, here's dollar ten, nine of it should at least go to education, and $1 can go to whatever you want. I realize that there's other things, red tape that it gets caught up in, but it seems to be the other way. $9, it goes to red tape, and only $1 goes to education. In California, I know we spend more than anybody per student on education, yet we have some of the lowest test scores ever. It's insane. So I agree there's a lot of issues, but again, I think it more falls back to inefficiencies in the systems that are at place. But I would be happy to think that there's a way that we can delve into it more and then hold the people who are in place more accountable to it. I mean, it seems lately like anybody can make a promise about anything. I could say, by the end of this, I'm going to give you this paper, and then I don't give you the paper, and I leave, and it's okay. And nobody stands by their word anymore. Politicians on both sides of the aisle. And I just think that, that somehow there has to be more accountability. And I think at a grassroots, it's people like you and me being able to say, hey, we both agree this isn't right. We both agree that there's certain monies that are getting wasted. And if we can get rid of that little stuff, the bigger stuff, we can start tackling one at a time. Because I think, you know, our country is extremely wealthy. Think about it. Before COVID how much money they kept saying we didn't have, and now we're giving money out like it's imprinting money like there's no tomorrow. So I think, like I said, I think that, you know, there's a lot of inefficiencies in the system. I think instead of things like a high speed rail, they definitely should have worked on the roads. I think instead, we could have done better building a dam with water so we have more food to make food easier for and less expensive for people to get without the water. It doesn't make sense. And for some reason, we're still shipping water. I think Arrowhead gets their water from us, and a couple other bottle places get the water from the one place that doesn't have water. Doesn't make sense. And when I see those things, I'm like, these are things that are just laying there in front of everybody. Nobody questions them. Nobody says, why is this continuing to happen? And so, you know, I. I think, you know, we do have issues, but at the same time, I do think that if we have concerned people like you, concerned people like me, and if we meet, continue to meet like this, we can see that dynamic, and we can get stuff done and figure out a way.

[53:43] CONNOR: I think if we have lawyers, we can get stuff done, or people like, that's what gets stuff done. Lobbyists like, lobbyists get stuff done that gets stuff moving. I mean, locally, we could work. You're right. We could work. We could run for our office, even. And isn't that great? And I do agree that that's great, but if you want to talk about good countries with great statistics, I mean, there's lots of examples that have. Take a lot better care of their people. Like, Japan's homeless rate is, like, less than, like, 0.01%, something like that. They have very, very few homeless people, and I know that that's exceptional. I just think that there are other ways to look outside of our country for other ways to live or apply government money for people. Really? And how do we get it to people and it doesn't get sucked up by rich people and their lawyers. So we've got five minutes left.

[55:09] GEORGE OSBORNE: And.

[55:09] CONNOR: I'll be giving you some clothing questions. I'll have you ask that first. Thank you.

[55:15] GEORGE OSBORNE: Is there anything you learned about me today that surprised you?

[55:20] CONNOR: Um, yeah. Yeah. Um, I I was really, really surprised to say that you struggled with PTSD, and. And I was pleasantly surprised because I think that it takes a lot of courage to face those things or to see that water coming through the crack. I know from personal experience, it takes one, no one. And so I myself deal with the oppression, and I think I see similar ways, that there's a lot of things we can't always control and we can be different than normal people. I think different is good, too, though, and I was surprise to hear you say that. I like hearing you say that. That difference is good. What are your hopes for the future, George?

[56:41] GEORGE OSBORNE: Oh, gosh. That's a very open ended question. Does that have to do with me.

[56:45] CONNOR: Or the world or what are your hopes for the future?

[56:49] GEORGE OSBORNE: Oh, wow.

[56:50] CONNOR: Oh, God.

[56:51] GEORGE OSBORNE: Let's say short term for me would be. My girlfriend and I have been together about three years. We just bought a house together. We're renting out two others. Sometimes I'm like, you know, it's so cool to say, you know, I lived in a garage and now I have three houses. I'd like to see that we continue to grow together and our faith grow together in our relationship and truly continue to motivate each other. I tell her all the time, she's my inspiration to achieve more because she makes me happier for the things that I do and do. I think in the future I'd love to see that, that continue and that I can grow to affect people. One of the other avenues was I had developed a group called life after the badge that I've been trying to get going, and it was recognized by the code nine project. And they actually offered to help me go national with it and to say that I could actually start from Fresno, even though I'm not a politician and could affect something that could cause ripples throughout an entire nation, however small. I don't care if it's one person per state, that's 50 people that I affected somehow, positively. I'll take it.

[57:58] CONNOR: Fresno has started plenty of great things. Taco truck, throw down.

[58:06] GEORGE OSBORNE: And I love the idea that I can really affect change, and I can see how I can. And I like the fact that I'd love to continue to do that. And like I said, help other people do the same thing for the positive. I'd love to see that, you know, eventually. My youngest is nine, and I want to see her grow up happy and be able to walk her down the aisle one day. I look forward to a time where I will move from California and do something different so I can go see more of the world. Those are my personal aspirations. Aspirations or things that I hope my hopes for the future, or that people like this project are able to come together and people start seeing more of the common things we have in place that we don't have to hurt each other to get things done that we can talk, and we know things aren't perfect, but if we make small adjustments, we can have that compound effect over the time to affect change for everybody. And I'd also like to say I hope that we'll start recognizing more mental health issues that are going on. I believe that's a huge problem in our society, especially with the homeless. Because of my first hand knowledge of dealing with the homeless people, one of my fellow friends, he's an actor that we met. It was shocking to find out he was homeless. So my girlfriend and I brought him into our house. We made sure he had Thanksgiving and Christmas, and thank God he went. He joined the military, and he now has a home. He's doing something with his life. He's being healthy, and he's in Bahrain right now. And I got a video of him singing with the choir in flip flops and brain on Facebook. And I'm like, that is awesome. And I told him, I'm always here. And like I said, even if I don't affect the world one or a million people at one shot, if I could do it one at a time, then I am changing my world, because that's my world, and I control that. So that's how.

[01:00:17] CONNOR: Very cool.

[01:00:18] GEORGE OSBORNE: Connor. Cool, dude. It was a pleasure meeting you. Really was.

[01:00:22] CONNOR: Yeah, you, too, George. I appreciate your time here.

[01:00:26] GEORGE OSBORNE: And I was just kind of nervous about this. I was like, oh, Sonia, what am I gonna do? Because I, you know, I didn't know a lot about the project, and the more I found out about it, I just think it's awesome that, you know, somebody is not sitting on the sidelines, that you're at least doing something or finding information about it to do it.