Kara Doan and Marian Hatcher

Recorded June 11, 2021 Archived June 10, 2021 53:47 minutes
0:00 / 0:00
Id: ddv000869

Description

Marian Hatcher [no age given] shares with her friend Kara Doan (46) details of her journey within the anti-trafficking movement and how she made incredible use of a second chance after being a victim of domestic violence and trafficking abuse.

Subject Log / Time Code

MH shares how they met through their work and the formation of their friendship. She discusses family, upbringing, and abuse at the age of 7. She describes her mother's struggles with dissociative identity disorder, strides in spite of mental health, and her role as a mentor.
MH shares her great influences and dreams as a child and eventual pathway.
MH shares about a time in her life as a victim of domestic violence and how it can function as a gateway into prostitution and substance abuse. She describes how law enforcement became involved and served as "angels with handcuffs." She talks about the concept of structural violence and the failure of service agencies to intervene even with knowledge of abuse/violence/endangerment. And she explains how her work connects to the lack of services provided to her throughout an abusive situation.
MH shares the impact on family post-trafficking. She shares the significance of Cook County and details her journey as an inmate to being an integral part of coordinating sex trafficking stings to impacting public policy on human trafficking as a UN ambassador.
MH shares what she would tell those looking to make a difference and what encourages the continued involvement in the anti-trafficking movement

Participants

  • Kara Doan
  • Marian Hatcher

Recording Location

Virtual Recording

Partnership

Partnership Type

Fee for Service

Initiatives


Transcript

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00:02 My name is Kara Doan and I am 46 years old. I am recording in Chicago, Illinois today on June 11th, 2021. I'll be speaking with Mary and her and we are very good friends.

00:20 I'm Reverend doctor Marian Hatcher and I'm recording in Chicago, Illinois as well and have privilege of being interviewed by my very good friend and colleague, Kara Doan.

00:36 Hey Marion, I am so glad to have this opportunity today. We're going to jump right in and I just want to go back to can you talk about religious the significant moment that we met and kind of was that look like for us to transition from just colleagues to being friends and and how that has changed changed our walk together.

01:06 Well, you know, we had the privilege of meeting through our work or are you I think the newly hired Outreach coordinator for an organization here responsible for Midwest. Although there were more than that and my work at the Sheriff's Office brought me into many many areas with human trafficking. The first let me know. The first one that comes to mind corpse will be victims services and the

01:51 Giving women what they need in emergency situations and helping them in it through their Journey, but also that

02:02 That part of my journey also includes a great deal of public speaking and in a lot of accolades and it was a lot when we first met they were happened to be quite a few. I think most of them were far away, like little Journeys hour-and-a-half junkets of big engagement and we have the opportunity to with others, but then eventually just the two of us to be in a car together and going to either for me to be speaking. I think I think we might have been going to Rockford. One time for me to speak with congressman and some others.

02:50 And then, I think the last one that is most poignant. I was being honored by Senator Dick Durbin. One of my Senators here.

03:04 At the University of Chicago, and

03:08 We just had a really important moment where it just morphed from colleague to friend, but also realizing that we were going to have it very special journey together and walk this this thing called, you know, helping others and ministering to these women in a very special way, which was really important because I had, you know, had health issues, but they were going to become more prevalent and I needed someone who could help me and understand, you know, how to support me with that as well as the work and you are just a blessing. You're my angel, you are my destiny helpers I call you.

04:01 Oh, and what a journey. We have been able to have together. I love it. It's been precious to me. And I'll I was sharing earlier that I would not be where I am today if

04:20 You don't you and I had not walked this out and I have been the recipient of

04:26 Being able to walk in the privilege of what you've established over the last 20 years and what would have taken me a lifetime of work to do? Which something? It's taking you a lifetime of work to do, I get to reap the benefit of that. And I'm just like, always so very grateful. And so, let's let's go back for a minute. I had the privilege of meeting your family and, and seeing the people that I've loved you tell me what it was like for you as a child.

05:00 What a loving and caring family on my whole life.

05:05 You know, my mom and dad divorced. So I was kind of funny, but loving caring, family, love, and caring, extended, family, uncles, and cousins, grew up with them. And my cousin does my brothers and sisters. And so it was

05:25 It was in that vein, you know, very special, but

05:31 You know, there were some experiences that kind of scarred me and you don't changed me for later in life friend. Since I was molested at the age of seven, by one of my cousins and not realizing that he would, you know, that was addressed by my father, you know, the Mississippi way, with the, with the whip, and the whip in it, but in all that type of thing, not me, not realizing that, that is forever. Perverted my sense of intimacy and down the road, it would

06:11 Make it seem okay in certain situations for an unwanted, touch to be becoming normal thing. And this is way past some healthy relationship and you know, and down the road in the world and I didn't realize it's of course until I was in therapy later that, you know, that one experience of molestation just completely scarred me and changed my view of sexual intimacy forever.

06:56 But basically, we were just the really, I mean, I had my mother, I was always expected to overachieve. My mother was an overachiever very bright woman out. But she had mental health issues, you suffering from dissociative identity disorder and had over 30 personality. So you never know what personality was. My mother is also quite brilliant and some very successful until the mental health issues kind of forced her out of that Arena, but, you know, even though things were weird, and I always miss you love me, and that was most important. I always knew she loved me. And that in the end for me, as well as you, we know love is, is, is going to always bring you back to fulfill and get if you allow, if you let Jesus in, you know, I'm going to bring you back to

07:54 A whole a whole or a more wholesome more, you know, you'll feel in relationship. Even if things got bad and down the road that has been the story of my life and I've been able to

08:08 Connect the dots and have some really bad situations, even to my abuser and my domestic violence situation, you know, things can get better even when they look like. There's no deposit via it. Be impossible for people who have harmed you too for you too forgiving to move on and spend with my mom with her mental health issues, you know, one of my best buddies on the planet just like you

08:48 I don't see how people who loves you as well as trauma mixed in with your childhood. When you think back to your childhood who were some of the greatest influences in your life.

09:05 That's a really good question.

09:09 So, my mother

09:13 Definitely.

09:19 My mother definitely is one of the greatest influences in my life because not only did she overcome the day did but she she accomplished a lot. She's never. She's never given up and she said a lot of health challenges or so. And

09:40 Down the road. It was really important for me to be able to see how she approached her multiple health challenges and surgeries knee Replacements, and eventually her right leg knee Replacements failed, so she has what they call a fused me, so she has a ride from her hip to hurt her ankle, her knee. Doesn't that there is no need for the bench, and I just saw her go through so many many challenges and help wise and just come out on top and just going to be diligent and never lose hope and just constantly just calling God. And that just what I needed that type of

10:25 Hope the person to look look for to give me that kind of hope. I don't have to look far because I had seen her do it my whole life. So when I started having challenges, which went from

10:39 The obvious ones from, you know that came from in recovering from the drug use and going to jail, but eventually I had fibromyalgia being a teenager but you know in the last OCT 2011, mm eight, the onset of multiple sclerosis 2011. It was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis and all kinds of things went well with my body, but then there's no subsequently all these things. You know, I don't like there's a certain blindness that I had, you know is pain and there's all these things that go wrong. And so, you know, she always kept going and so I did too until that doesn't mean because you have these physical issues or

11:31 Compounded physical issues being too many many, chronic health issues doesn't mean that you can't help up is cuz there's always someone that's worse off than you that you that wish that they could have the mobility or the, you know, ability be activity or the, the, the resources that you would have. And so have always been able to put it into perspective and keep moving and keep helping others. A week ago. I had a pulmonary embolism as, you know, life-threatening situation, but God brought me through it, as he always does.

12:12 And I have many people praying for me. Many people supporting me and loving me including you and that one for one moment that I think God given up on me and I just said, okay. Well, it isn't some work to the testimony, you know, and that, you know, we would be able to have this conversation this week.

12:36 Yes, and your mother is a an incredible woman and I think it's weak dive into your story that you're just just hearing that impact of that. And you will see that will be true in so many ways that implies that she had and that she continues to have when you are a child and you thought about growing up. What did you think you would be when you grew up? What was that? Childhood picture of you as an adult. Look like

13:14 I wanted to be an astronomer or a nuclear physicist, that that was the things that I early on, and as I got older, I realized that that might not necessarily go along with my, my moral fabric to be building nuclear bombs and stuff like that, and move them to, you know, Nuclear Physics. It's just stuff in on any eventual, e, you know, the only thing I knew for sure that I wanted to go to Loyola because my mother met her master's degree at Loyola. And I knew I wanted to go. But you know, when you first go to college, you don't know what the heck. I ended up going into business. I started to think about pre-law for a minute, but ended up

14:08 Doing business going out doing a business and it was a really good fit for me.

14:17 Inside out.

14:20 Royal is an amazing school and graduate from Loyola is certainly an accomplishment. Can you tell me what was one of the happiest moment of your life?

14:37 Well.

14:40 At school or just you do graduation graduation from high school, graduation from college, but you have accomplished much in your life. What has been one of those happiest and most satisfying? Satisfying accomplishments.

15:00 Some, you don't appreciate it until years later, of course.

15:09 I really appreciate now. I didn't think of it, you know, you know, it was kind of just something that you were doing was having children, but I appreciate it becoming a mother after I became a grandmother. It's really weird. You know, I really appreciated having my children and my grandchildren.

15:28 After I became a grandmother, I realized the importance of

15:33 And you know and also, you know, felt kind of bad because I didn't necessarily give them what they needed because my first drug before I lost my mind, on crack cocaine, and alcohol was work. And I did, you know, I was raised to buy my mom to achieve and do well and, you know, it's straight days and all of that. But the work was the most important thing. And that didn't always, I didn't necessarily I wasn't well-rounded when it came down to, knowing how to move. You take care of myself, get a self-care 10 to myself.

16:18 Spiritually 10 to myself and, you know, give it more time. Always be on my mom. She helped me with my kids or stuff like that. So, yeah, but

16:33 Outside of the family Dynamic, with my children and grandchildren.

16:41 I would say that.

16:44 Rich evening because I had achieved a lot, you know, when it came down to 17 years of corporate sector had gotten a degree at Loyola, has 17 years of corporate sector, you know, even though they were bumps in the road because of some poor decision-making in terms of my partners are husband, is not the first one, but the the one that became my abuser.

17:13 I did achieve a lot in that first life, but in the second life, so speak after everything went to heck in a handbasket and I was missing for two years and my youngest daughter.

17:35 Because it was basically domestic violence. Domestic violence.

17:41 Then the drugs domestic domestic violence and drugs, the running from the domestic violence ending up in prostitution in in traffic.

17:53 A lot of things, you know, we're lost there, but being able to get a Gob sheet Min at the Cook County Sheriff's Office and eventually get to the point where they trusted me enough to not only, you know, give me what I needed as an inmate, but also, I went back and volunteer for

18:18 I got out on a Friday and because of someone who is my big sister, Lisa Cunningham who had met while I was in treatment and custody and I went back. I forgot out on the Friday, you know, I went back on that Monday and I never left the sheriff's office until I remember.

18:45 If my last day of work, but yeah, my last day of work was December 13th, 2019, because of getting knee Replacements, and then other things with the progress with my house, so, I'm still on medical leave. But when they came and told me that they, I was being considered for moving out of that, what you would expect pure coordinator position, which made sense, you know, it was a very forward-thinking Sheriff's Office. It made sense to

19:16 Have if you really believe that and Rehabilitation to have on staff, people who had been through, you know, who have been victims, who had survived, not only there prostitution, but we're more at that point focused on being the incarceration, experience, and coming back from that experience. And all the rest of the counter floor. Flowered after that tone. Again, on the exploitation down, the road on the sheriff dark cuz I was hired under former share sharing.

19:49 But,

19:51 When they came and told me that they were serious.

19:55 Seriously going to promote me from a pure coordinator position to be assistant to the executive director of the program, which was at times called the Department of Human Services.

20:07 There was extreme fear because what if you guys are lying is like, no way cuz if I'm 13 years later I did was granted executive expungement, Governor Rauner, but

20:24 It was like I was given this second chance in terms of my professional life. I've been given a second chance in a lot of ways, but that was that was huge because you know that in order for that to happen, that required a great deal of trust.

20:45 And now that was what she told me, Terry McDermott, who was executive director. She said, you know, we know yet the skillset, but the reason that we are, the reason that, you know, I suggested, you know, went to, they had to go to the undersheriff, had to go to the sheriff and he's like, well, this is what we're about if you believe in her and she said, the most important thing was that I was stressed it. And that was a big deal for someone who had ended up in jail, and was facing three to seven years in the penitentiary, fortunately, at drug court. And now we had to do a hundred and twenty days.

21:25 In.

21:28 In our program inside the jail. And then there it was an 18-month probation. When I'm done, is an over cheaper. Of course, I graduated programming in months, but

21:44 It was just like you got to be kidding me. You know, you're going to literally like make me like the issues. Like now you're telling me that I'm going to be her assistant. And so and that's what happened. I became her administrative assistant and that meant that I had to, to deal with the not only the undersheriff in the sheriff but also the County Commissioners and learned that she was under the old structure. She was one of the top 10 Sheriff's Sheriff's director in the Cook County and it was a lot of responsibility.

22:26 It was like being in boot camp. Went up until she retired, you know, but it got me ready to do some pretty cool things down the road, that was very much. It was preparing me for the. It have any idea what's going to happen down the road? In terms of representing the Sheriff's Office and shared our, local State national and eventually internationally before I went on medical leave.

23:03 Thank you. And so just say it had the opportunity to bring Clarity because you have the Sheriff's Office of your healing. I'd like to go back to something. You said you're a lowly graduate and we're working in the corporate sector for 17 years and had significant success there and then ended up being a victim of human trafficking.

23:38 To share anything about that Journey that you'd like to share before we go into all the accomplishments you've had since then.

23:49 Well, the domestic violence.

23:54 That kind of the precursor to all the spiral down.

24:01 Is important, because

24:04 It's not uncommon that women end up on the street with your women, do women. Typically, you know, they stay in the home. They deal with the abuse. They they don't try to protect the children.

24:21 But when they, when they run them in, where do you go? If you can't go to other relatives because you're taking him they're going to find you there or they're going to they're going to come there and cause you no violence and wherever you go until you don't go to family. Now. I had a full-blown.

24:41 Addiction going at the same time as the violence at that point. And so,

24:49 The.

24:52 Domestic violence.

24:55 And so certain, you know, things that happened brought bcfs into the situation, but they even though they saw me with the black and I are so you know, I look like a raccoon is my skin color. He would hit me like right in the middle of my head, but

25:13 There was

25:16 I will let you know. You've heard me talk about this and presentation that you know, we've done and I'll structural violence.

25:24 It is something that I know very well. In terms of agencies, not being able to meet their mission. And and in my personal experiences if beat Department children, Family Services had been able to really help me. They knew I was a victim of domestic violence. They saw it and ended up in court. And then they've even talked about it, you know, years down the road that they knew I was a victim of domestic violence that have been properly addressed in my family brought to safety at that point.

25:58 I would never have ended up running and ending up in prostitution and ending up traffic. If at that intersect if it had been properly addressed and proper intervention, it taken place in the proper service, you know, options existed. And I mean, I don't blame the case managers that mean they're working, but then things are working out for some years later. You know, I know the barriers and I know what was missing this training. There's a, you know, the ability to is it something that that agency was prepared to address?

26:40 But down the road that intersect, you know, that proper intervention for myself, and my family did not take place and I ended up.

26:51 Running from the violence.

26:56 And,

26:58 Eventually, when you run to the street, the street, the street rope welcomes, you

27:05 More drugs and ways to eventually, you know, what you need to do with stay numb, since you have to deal with what you left, who you left, the mistakes you made is when I left.

27:22 My mother had had surgery.

27:27 The left, when I left the last time because, you know, now the addiction takes over in and I had gotten cleaned and and then but you know, if you really don't understand that alcohol is a drug, which I did not take it. Seriously. I have one glass of wine and you know, I was gone for 2 years.

27:44 And you're almost 2 years. And what I had started working on rebuilding the Don because I have one glass of wine and not did not realize. That alcohol is indeed a drug and two years later. Now. I've lost custody of the youngest daughter because I couldn't work the DCFS service, plan and everything. And I know it's just like, there's so much that unraveled just because

28:15 There was not a cohesive and integrated approach to the intervention that I needed which is going to deal with substance abuse mental health, the trauma from the domestic violence all together as well as the family Dynamics down the road that became something that I had to build the Sheriff's Office to make sure that service provision look like what I didn't get.

28:46 And, of course, you were a great deal of that for our human trafficking victim, but when you hit the street like that,

28:56 A lot of times there's different ways of trafficking, manifesting and the

29:03 The pimp Dynamic try to pull me in but I was not a heroin user has a crack user and there's a huge difference in the compliance, those who used heroin and the theory.

29:23 And tweaking and needing out of a crack user and sell them. So I was not one of those people that was going to end up with your your what people think of with the, you know, the kind of pimp is going to use heroin or some type of, you know, of Oprah opioid to. I have women kept in compliance in the traffic situation, but I did end up in a situation with who I thought was more like the boyfriend, Persona 4, 5 years, you know, there were two of them. I thought they were, like, you were boyfriend, you know.

30:01 Prasinos. They were crack users. And so took me about five years into working at the sheriff's office for me to eat to be healthy enough to realize that those were indeed, and they were in the trafficking me. When we would be up where I've been up, as long as three weeks smoking, crack cocaine, and having all kinds of what can only be described. As, you know, Hardee's orgies with men women who ever came through there. And then the whole idea was to just stay high for me to feel the pain of the loss.

30:41 And,

30:43 He would give me more extra drugs on like Mother's Day to try to keep me here, Cuz those are days. He's thinking I might run away and if you know me, I'm thinking I let me smoke enough to blow my heart up cuz I don't want to let you know, face the pain, you might as well just die. But that God has something better for me, and he wouldn't let me die. And so, you know eventually

31:11 That of exploitation and trafficking couldn't last forever because

31:22 You know, it's just a lifestyle, you're going to end up running into law enforcement to get this. If it's going to happen, you're going to run it. And I was already a fugitive because I had not finished. I had gotten drunk and all I had to do was finish treatment.

31:43 And I did not do that because I had not, you know, taking it seriously that I was an addict and it alcohol was drugged, and all that goes with that. And So eventually they got get on the caught up with me and fortunately

32:00 I was rescued in my opinion By Angels with handcuffs and I was delivered to my new life at the Cook County Department of Corrections and Department, women's test the services and given an opportunity. That one would never imagine which was to

32:18 Renew my relationship with my family to renew. My relationship with the Lord and two.

32:28 Become a new person to be able to bring my education and skill set back once I get home to get that part together. But initially I was happy to stuffing envelopes when I got out November 19th 2004. I was happy just going in the office with Lisa and stuffing flyers and you know, I'm mailing out flyers, whatever. Cuz I was very fragile, you know, it's a fragile bird and things that have things that changed. One of the things that people don't realize it and I tell the ladies is that life doesn't stop because we went through something. When I while I was gone yet. I came back and they had self checkout at the grocery store. But was that was that about, you know, and then there were buildings where there had been vacant Lots in my life, kept going my children kept growing.

33:22 And I,

33:24 You know, I missed two.

33:29 I miss both my oldest girls, 8th grade graduations. My dad and I made sure they had a nice eighth grade graduation, but I'm not in those pictures, you know, and I lost custody of the youngest daughter but my aunt, you know, stepped in to my children, will taking care of, you know, the village Terrace my Village early to take care of them and they continue to thrive, even though, of course, there was

33:56 Medford. Each one are some different level of trauma and difficulty for them. But today, you know, we forgive each other for what they were giving me. But, you know, over the overtime when I first came home trying to come step back in the mother old wasn't necessarily that they really wanted to to accept it first and so kind of ugly. So but over the over the over the years it's grown into a beautiful relationship again, and we know with my mom and my dad and

34:36 And my children and Yahoo, the blessing of grandchildren and it's pretty good. And I'm but that that Dynamic is the really important point to see how domestic violence can be for many women. The launching pad for ending up in prostitution and eventually being trafficked and sometimes they're not traffic. Just press to just becomes a matter of survival. And so family, family that supported you for you and kind of trauma to abuse an early age, and then you were successful graduated through your domestic violence.

35:27 Situation then ended up in a situation where you were experiencing exploitation and became a victim of human trafficking. You went into the justice system and then out of that will recognize it by somebody in the sheriff's office has said, this is a woman who we really didn't, we'd like to bring her in a different capacity as he started out as an administrative assistant at the Cook County, Sheriff's Office.

35:54 But that was just a launching pad for you. And now you know, you don't recognize as Her Excellency. Yeah, it was with the first name. Natalie is your title rev. Dr. Marian Hatcher, but I've actually been acknowledged as Her Excellency for some of the advisory role as you have been able to be in as an ambassador. And so I would love for you to just share how that happened that you could have. You could have stayed as a, as a peer advisor is an administrative assistant in yet. Your platform has grown and the reach that you have an implant you have and directing public policy and public speaking is impacts our nation.

36:49 How how did that occur? And what were some important moments in that?

36:57 Will again, you know the sheriff darts.

37:04 Beliefs and vision that people can surely change and that they should not be held back. I was not held back. I was allowed to, to get the help that I needed. And then, you know, they gave me went to jail to Jayla gave me a job and then they said, okay, go be all you can be. And so I went from being inmate to volunteer to Pure coordinator and contractual basis. Then, like I said, you know, to be surprised to be promoted to administrative assistant, to the executive director of women's chests. Has then, to be executive assistant, then special, projects coordinator. Because, you know, with my business background, I could do lots of stuff. And so I was not only doing the requirements for the executive director, but I started working on grants cuz we were very, we were a national model and we just can, you know, that I became a part of that.

38:04 And then became project coordinator. I'm in for a project manager, and senior project manager, and then eventually moved to the office of public policy. And went from being senior, senior project manager to policy analyst and victim Advocate, which is my current title, but

38:28 Through all of that. I had the opportunity, not only to coordinate and grow and develop.

38:37 Become centered services for thousands of women that came through the jail, but also, because we're such a large deal. We got a lot. We had to help a lot of women in a lot of places. I became a national speaker & public, figure representing the sheriff in myself and not just with the victim Center service, service side, not just the victim side. I also on behalf of the sheriff, coordinate, the largest expire sting operation in the country and it will actually use anywhere. But in a salon suppression initiative over 19 sting operations, I coordinated 1 through 18 before I went on disability and

39:25 They coordinated the last one the 19th last year and we've arrested over 10,000 6 buyers, trying to buy adults and children in those 19 sting operations with that hundreds of relationships, law enforcement, and nonprofits, and philanthropist. And, you know, I do a lot with the federal government.

39:47 Providing a lot of technical support. Seth technical assistance.

39:53 You know being njsi Nashville. The first initiative is a best practice and have worked on many many different models of what it looks like for systemic collaboration. And

40:10 Have been asked to represent, you know, the sheriff, local State, national International.

40:18 On many different things, but I'm considered an expert in demand because of coordinating this large-scale sex by her sting operation. The most important thing that I think comes that comes out of that is the fact that they're this business model. That is human trafficking.

40:38 That is not a victimless crime, but it is also connected to, you know, there's so many other criminal acts that are going on with the Corcoran crime that the demand for buying sex.

40:54 Has, you know, tentacles that deal with thousands of charges? Weapons charges narcotics, child endangerment evading, eluding, law, enforcement murder, attempted murder, all of these things that people don't connect the dots when they think of a, a sex sex buying sting. And so I guess it would be, you know, one of the

41:23 The best things that I can leave, as a legacy for this work to have had the privilege of coordinating that I would also bringing, you know, more of a hybrid. Looking at, you know, what happens with the victim. What happens with the the, the exploit of the emperor, trafficker, what happens when it comes down to the brothel owners, what happens when it going to want to looking at the, the driving force, which is demand in the buyer. And I had the privilege of being able to

41:59 On the highest, you know, I guess. So, you know from from congressional Hill the White House United Nations as an ambassador-at-large to the UN be able to bring attention to it. And, you know, it's act legislation to try to help the problem and bring more attention to the reality that

42:23 Women should not be held accountable for their own victimization and exploitation. Even if there is no pimp involved that, you know, Society has failed and it a bit, becomes the, the exploit. But that this is something that the buyer, the brothel owner, the pimp of traffickers should be held accountable and for us that is the quality model and when women are ready to exit it will Services have to be ready to receive them and not short-term but long-term and comprehensive.

43:02 Marian. If you could look back at yourself now and you could, what would you say to?

43:12 To the child to the child Marion.

43:17 I would say to the child Marian that don't try to do this without God. It doesn't work without God leading.

43:28 Whatever it is that you feel he wants you to to.

43:34 Accomplish in life. Don't try to do it without God. When I tried to do it without God is the head of my life and use them in selected, almost killed me. And so that's what I would, I would say to the to the young child.

43:48 The devil girl, don't try to do it without that won't work. And if you could like 50 years ahead into the future to use Society to kill a generation that hasn't yet, been born. What would you speak to them?

44:13 I want it, I think it back with my grandchildren. I want them to know a life that does not have prostitution and sexual exploitation as an issue as a human rights violation. Any longer that that's been addressed that they are Priceless, that their bodies are special.

44:40 God did not intend for them to meet their basic needs by being sold and that

44:48 Young, men and young, women should respect each other and and have a life that dignity and respect is at the Forefront for them, and that their basic needs and all beer. There once

45:07 I was working for and that someone is responsible for helping them do that in a dignified and whole and healthy way. And nothing less is acceptable. So good. I have had the privilege of being mentored by Marian Hatcher but not everybody has that privilege.

45:43 What would you say to those? Who say, I want to make a difference? I want to bring change. I want to influence the community around me.

45:54 How do I do that?

45:58 Well.

46:00 Just try to change one thing, you know, and don't let your

46:06 Personal circumstances, make you feel like you can't do it. You know, that I have a great deal of physical challenges that the enemy of my soul, try to use against me. But the one thing that I would say is that, if you can help just one.

46:26 It's worth it. You can help just one. It'll take the focus off of you who take the focus off of what you're going through to help just one person and when you help just one person that Morse, you know, and it's it it it becomes a way of life.

46:46 And your life becomes more fulfilling.

46:49 But start with just one.

46:55 Do you have one story or one experience that keeps you in this work? Because this can be really hard work. And all the times we see a lot more setbacks before we see the successes. Is there one story that you said? This is the thing that keeps me going.

47:18 Well.

47:22 I'll be honest with you. There's there's quite a few.

47:27 Stories like that, but

47:30 One of the young ladies that we both have in common.

47:35 She's very difficult to Mentor into

47:40 To help.

47:42 And,

47:45 It took months and months for her to be receptive and to be ready for us to help her, but I'll never forget when she was ready. She came to me.

48:00 And she did what we suggested.

48:05 And well, her life may not be what I think it should be today.

48:11 She is clean. She works.

48:15 She has relationships that she can be happy about she's with her family and

48:27 Leaving it surprises, even heard that she accomplished that. And so,

48:33 Just knowing that is difficult. Is it was the months and months of her. Do you know, sending an Uber and her not going inside the treatment facility, you know, just crazy stuff. Even after being brutalized by her trafficker and making decisions than they no sense to us. She eventually even got strong enough to testify a grand jury in a federal case and had her trafficker held accountable for human trafficking charges. That was a big deal for her and I just felt blessed that I could be a part of that and you eventually became a part of that as well. And

49:15 That would be for me. You know, I'm a very important situation never give up and that's why I we we get called years later, you know, you have to always be available and ready when they're ready because if they don't work on our time clock and let you know if I didn't work on anybody's time clock when I get myself together. Fortunately, for me, you know that the angel handcuffs help me my timeline but just be there be ready, be receptive and walk side-by-side, don't walk infront of walk-behind and Inlet let them. Let them know that they can do it. And this young lady has done it. She's not necessarily done it the way that I want to or you going there too, but she still doing it.

50:02 These years with many years later and she's accomplished a lot. And so is there anything that you would like included or anything? You would like to make sure is shared.

50:20 Will the last thing that I would say?

50:23 Is that you never know who is going to cross your path?

50:28 And I'm very grateful for.

50:33 God bringing you into my life because I would not have been able to help as many women and help help them in egg, you know, in a very strategic way and do the follow-up because you can only answer the phone so much and be there for some people. And you have made it impossible to help exponentially many more women than I was able to help on my own, and which actually added onegevity to my 10-year at the sheriff's office because of my help. And so, you know, God will get back away. It may not look like it is going to be easy, don't give up because he will bring people to help you. Just do your best to put your best foot forward with God will definitely

51:33 The way for you to accomplish what he stepped before you, but the main thing is, don't give up. Even when it looks like you have no clue how you're going to accomplish anything in life. Just hold on to God, you know, I'm a strong believer in the power of prayer, and I would not be alive today without the power of prayer and prayers of my family prayers with people like you in my life, but

52:03 You cannot give up and you can't do it alone. And that's one of the things you know that I I realized that, you know, we all need help and we will get the help if we reach out and ask God to send those people to help us carry out his

52:23 His purpose for us, in our lives. And that's what happened with me. And that's what happened with you and I love you very much.

52:31 Oh, I love you, too. I love you too. My dear friend. Thank you so much for letting me be part of this. Be part of your story and encapsulated. I am so excited that people who maybe can't show up at the conference to hear you or can't can't make the trip. Wherever can't will have access to hear your story and hear the things you've done. And and I truly believe that it will inspire others to to push forward and to do more and not be held back by things that they think would limit in. Because there has not been anything physically or in your past or the things that would normally live with other people. And I think I cannot do this because you have broken all of those barriers and and I am grateful for that. So, thank you. Thank you for staying.

53:33 Thank you for doing this with me. There was a person that I would have asked.