Karla Pacheco and Francesca de Vera

[00:06] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Good afternoon. My name is Francesca de Vera. Today's date is May 15, 2024. We're on location at the San Diego Central Library in San Diego, California. The name of my interview partner is Carla, and the relationship to myself is. She is my coworker.

[00:27] CARLA PACHECO: Hi, my name is Carla. Today's date is May 15, 2024. We are currently located at the Central Branch Library here in downtown San Diego. My interview partner is Francesca, who is my colleague backslash friend. So, Francesca, do you kind of remember, like, the first time we met or how we met?

[00:57] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I think I did see you, like, around at, like, meetings or, like. Like, different YSL meetings, maybe. I know, especially when you join Laura's team, but definitely since I've changed roles at the youth and engagement coordinator here at Central in that we work together, but mostly I feel like we got really super connected this year, especially our work on our spring and esteem initiative. And so here at Central Library, and so it's been awesome.

[01:29] CARLA PACHECO: I think so, too. I think it was kind of one of those things, too, where we just kind of knew each other from meetings or from emails, because that's how we kind of really get to know each other, through emails. Like, okay, so when I finally got the face, you know, to see Francesca, and it just really happened when I got here to central and then kind of meeting you in person and talking to you, and I think we just. We do have this great relationship, you know, outside of work. So I really have enjoyed it getting to know you, not only as my colleague, but as a friend. So it's been really fun getting into trouble.

[02:01] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Yeah. Let's say I would consider you part of my support network here at Central, at Centerpool, but also my friend and I do enjoy our coffee runs.

[02:10] CARLA PACHECO: Yes.

[02:11] FRANCESCA DE VERA: We don't go every day if anyone's.

[02:12] CARLA PACHECO: Listening, but only sometimes, once in a great while. When we need coffee, that's when we go get it.

[02:19] FRANCESCA DE VERA: We need it every day.

[02:20] CARLA PACHECO: But it's been great. So I think that's probably one of my favorite things, doing with you and just having those memories of going, getting our coffee runs and just talking about stuff outside of work. So it's great. It's been great.

[02:33] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I say so, too. Let's get into these questions.

[02:36] CARLA PACHECO: Yes.

[02:37] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Curious. Do you all have any first impressions of each other? Do you remember?

[02:42] CARLA PACHECO: I think for me, Francesca, it was like, how do I approach her? You know, is she going to be kind of mean or. So I think it was just maybe not knowing how to approach you because I'm just really that person that just. Well, I think you kind of know how I am already. I just want to go up to someone, say, hey, hi, how are you? So I was just kind of like, okay, can I approach her that way, or do I have to kind of be like, hi, I'm so and so, but I don't even think we started off that way anyway. Right. It was just kind of like we knew each other from the gate. Right.

[03:16] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I think I really like instant, like, rapport. Yeah. Because I think we do have similar backgrounds.

[03:20] CARLA PACHECO: Yeah.

[03:21] FRANCESCA DE VERA: You know, and then for you, my first impressions of you, Carla, super friendly. I do think there's more than meets the eye that people don't know about how passionate you are, how knowledgeable, especially for librarianship. And so I'm really happy you're in library school, because you're going to make an awesome librarian one day.

[03:41] CARLA PACHECO: I hope so. Thank you. See, this is why we're friends, because they're going to help me through it.

[03:47] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I'll help you.

[03:49] CARLA PACHECO: So let's talk a little bit about, like, where you grew up and a little bit about your childhood.

[03:56] FRANCESCA DE VERA: So I grew up in San Jose, California, in the San Francisco Bay area. Um, I'll say when I was born in the eighties, I won't say what year, but, um, I grew up. I'm very proud to be from east side, San Jose, which is a really strong latin neighborhood, working class immigrant. Um, my mom and dad, they married, like, when they were really young, in their early twenties. My mom's Mexicana and my dad's Filipino. Some biracial. Um, and it was. It's a really, like, um. It's really comparable, I want to say, to, like, any suburb in California. It's super quiet, like, I think, because it's east side, San Jose gets, like, a bad rap. But, I mean, it's just a really family oriented, community oriented place. It's really similar to, like, Logan Heights, to be honest. And so it was a really beautiful place to grow up. I grew up in the east foothills, so, like, you would drive your car and there's, like, deer. We grew up to one of the, close to one of the oldest state parks in the state called Ellen Rock park. And so. And also at our home on Lewis court. We were lucky enough, as I grew up across street from my Ebola, my mom's mom, Grandma Katie, and then my Aunt Audrey. So I really had three moms growing up, so it was hard not to, like, I think it was hard for my parents to, like, have discipline in order, because we were just going to grandma's house. And so I really loved growing up in San Jose.

[05:31] CARLA PACHECO: That's nice. So I visited San Jose once, and that was just to see the Winchester house. That was my visit to San Jose. That said, I've never really explored the city, so it's really nice to hear that there's a comparison right in the neighborhood you grew up into a neighborhood that I'm kind of familiar with, you know, barrio Logan, so it's kind of neat.

[05:52] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Yeah. San Jose is really similar to San Diego in the respect that we have, like, distinct neighborhoods with different, like, demographic levels. The fun thing, though, is, like, I lived in San Jose for 35 years and I've never been to the Winchester mystery house, so.

[06:06] CARLA PACHECO: How could you say that? Yeah, you need to try it. You've lived there.

[06:12] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I'm scared.

[06:12] CARLA PACHECO: No, it's fine. You're gonna have fun. So are you. Do you have any siblings?

[06:17] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I do. I have three sisters, one older and two younger, the oldest, and the babies, they still live in the Bay area. And then I have a sister who lives here now with her family.

[06:29] CARLA PACHECO: Lamisa, would you consider you guys being close or.

[06:33] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I think we're, like, typical siblings. Like, we fought a lot when we were a little, like, growing up, but for the most part, it's now, especially now that my mom passed away this year, so we're super close. And I know, like, my sisters always.

[06:49] CARLA PACHECO: Have my back, so I know you said you, like, grew up in San Jose and that's where you're from. So did you come to San Diego alone? Did you come with family?

[06:58] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I came here about, well, not alone because my third born sister, Kimberly, she did. She went to UC San Diego in, like, the mid two thousands. I don't know how they are, to be honest. But she came here first, and we would visit her, you know, like, summers, and I was like, ooh, San Diego is a really beautiful place, and I've always, like, wanted to live by, like, a beach. And so I did move here in March 2019, and I got a job here at San Diego Public Library. I'm a public librarian, so, yeah, that's how I came here. So my sister kind of, like, paved the road for me to get down here to southern California, but definitely very, so much a northern California girl at heart.

[07:43] CARLA PACHECO: Oh, no, you're in San Diego now.

[07:46] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I know. I'm still getting used to my roots here in San Diego. I definitely think it's more chill than the day, slower pace of life that I'm still getting used to, but I'm a lot more chill than I used to.

[07:59] CARLA PACHECO: Okay, I'm gonna track back a little bit, then we'll come back to, you know, your change. Coming here to San Diego. So you said you grew up well, you had three moms. Your mom, grandma. And was it an aunt?

[08:12] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Yeah, my Aunt Audrey.

[08:15] CARLA PACHECO: So would you say there were, like, all three of them were, like, your influences, or was it just one?

[08:21] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I would say definitely all three of them. Like, we definitely. Especially my sisters and I, we see our personalities from them. Like, my aunt was just. My aunt just. And then my aunt's the only one that's here with us now. So I tell her, you're kind of like my only mom now, now that my mom and my grandma have passed. But I just see little tidbits of, like, their strength, like, their courage, their hopes, and just their personality. Like, they were really strong. All three of them were really strong latino women, and so they had different humors and personalities. My grandma was actually a beauty queen in Colorado in the thirties, and then she got married during the war, world War two to my grandpa Tony. And so I just remember her always being super glamorous and wanting to put on makeup, even when she was nineties and had dementia. And so she was just. She was like the. Our center, like most families. She was our core, and she kept us together, and she kept the whole family afloat, especially in the sixties and seventies when they moved here from Colorado to San Jose. And so she was awesome.

[09:33] CARLA PACHECO: I can relate a little bit to that. Like, my mom's mother, she held the family together, so I was very sad when she passed away because, you know, the family broke apart. But I can relate to that. Having my grandma just keeping us together and having us have that bond. So going back to that, to your aunt, your mom and your grandma, were there any specific lessons that you took from them or maybe some things that kind of molded you to who you are today that you got from them?

[10:09] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Oh, yeah, definitely. I mean, grew up with. I'm not practicing. I'm more of, like, agnostic now, but grew up catholic, like, most, like, Latinas, Filipinos. And so just even though I don't agree with, like, a lot of the stuff from the catholic church, I do still really appreciate the rituals, like, the principles. I mean, especially my grandma and my mom, they taught me, like, the value of service, like, reaching out, being a service to your fellow man. I remember my mom. She was just. She was just very, like, welcoming and, like, loving, and she would just, like anyone who's struggling, she would give you the shirt off her back. I think in our town, like, if she saw someone that was in the house, she was like, try to get them food or clothes. And she was like, she was awesome. So she really taught me the value of, like, appreciating, like, the simple things in life and also being grateful for what you. You have, but also if you can give and you can be of service to others. And so I think that's what I take, especially now as a public librarian, is, like, now that I have this position where I can be of service to others. Like, I take a lot of those values growing up have helped me, shape me, who I am today. Does that make sense?

[11:28] CARLA PACHECO: It does. And, you know, you said, your mom said, you know, helping and giving a hand, and I know my mom was always big on that, too. And my mom's saying was always, you don't deny a taco to anybody. So if someone asks you for something, you should be there to be able to help them. So, I don't know, maybe that's a culture thing because, you know, your mom's.

[11:53] FRANCESCA DE VERA: It could be because my grandma. My brother was the same way. She would make. I remember she would make flour tortillas, because when we came up to school, but then she would make food for, like, the neighbors, and then they would share, like, vegetables or fruit or food. And so it could be like, a.

[12:10] CARLA PACHECO: Like, a culture thing. Right? Because, I mean, I'm. Well, I don't. Well, I don't. And I think we had this conversation before, but I don't consider myself Latina Latino. I'm Mexican American. So, you know, I grew up in a mexican family, so I know that was really big on us, that we were always there to help each other. So you saying that about your mom? I'm just like, oh, that's like my mom. But I'm just wondering, maybe it's just a culture thing.

[12:33] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Yeah, I say so, especially on the filipino side, we're very. Also very giving people. It's a very giving culture. So I just remember when my Lola's grandma and Filipino Tagalog, so she would come stay with us as well, and her. My grandma Katie and my grandma Feliza were like, go Madresen, and they would go to church together. And then they instilled very similar values in us, especially being a service and especially creating family and community around food and giving and sharing.

[13:09] CARLA PACHECO: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I've been to filipino parties. My mom had a really good friend. She was Filipino, and her parties were just like, ours. It was like you felt at home. And I think that's. We do share a lot of similarities, you know, the mexican culture with the Filipino culture, including our language. Right. Like, some of our spanish words are kind of, like, similar to one another, so it's cool. See, that's why we get along so good. Okay, so any challenges? Did you face any challenges growing up? Anything that you had to overcome?

[13:44] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Yeah, I would say, like, a lot of challenges. I'm a career trans person, so I just remember also, I just remember from a really young age, just being really cognizant that I was different than others. And so I always like. Which was hard, too, for my dad today. I accepted, like, my parents did the best they could with what they knew then they didn't know how to take care of a child like me in the sense of what I needed for who I was. But I just remember my mom would always make space for who I was. And so from, like, a really young age, like, you know, like those home movies, like, back in the day, she would, like, have, like, a curler, curlers in my hair, like, those pink ones, and then, like, I had a neon purse. And then I just remember when I was, like, four and five, I really liked my little ponies. Do you remember those?

[14:40] CARLA PACHECO: Yes.

[14:40] FRANCESCA DE VERA: And so she would buy me a. We would go toys r us. Toys R us is a toy store for you kids who don't know what that is, which is awesome. And I had, like, a collection of hundreds of my little ponies. And so my mom was always, like, she always, like, she was great with sunset. She always made space and, like, accepted and loved me for who I was, and she kind of knew who I. When I would come out at 18, she would tell me, I always knew who you were. And she said, I love you for your, which was awesome. My dad took a little longer to adjust. I mean, it's the same as, like, mexican culture very much, yes. Like, my uncle, his older brother had seven boys, and then I was, you know, I was his only son at the time now daughter. And so it took a long time for him to come to terms with that, but now he's really cool. I'm super accepting and super proud of me. But just growing up, I remember in, like, elementary school, in middle school, just being super isolated. I feel like I was super aware of who I was since the first or second grade, and kids were super aware of who I was, too. And I would get those derogatory f words, and I would be bullied, and I feel isolated. And so I knew that there was a lot of great shame and not. I had to hide who I wanted to become, so. Or I needed to hide who I was, which I think was super detrimental to, like, my well being and my mental health. And so how far back do we go?

[16:24] CARLA PACHECO: I just want to say that you're great. So your parents did an amazing job with you. You're a beautiful, amazing person. They should know, and they should be so proud of you. Like, I just. It's tough. I can't say that I know what she went through. Cause I don't. But it's very sad and unfortunate because we are who we are, and people can't take that from us. And it's sad that we have to be given labels and names that really don't pertain to our identity or who we are. We live in a cruel world. Some members of society are still. I don't know what to call them. Angry, you know? But you're so great, and you're wonderful, and parents should absolutely be proud of you, and they should be proud of themselves. It is tough, you know, just. I'll share just a quick story with me. My son, he wanted to play with, I'm gonna grow toys. And one of his doctor appointments with a pediatrician, I was like, he picked up a girl toy. And I know that now at my age. And after talking to the doctor, I know there's no. We don't label toys, but at that point, you know, I was like, no, you don't play with a girl toy. And his pediatrician said, what? What do you mean he can't play with a girl? I said, that's a girl toy. Well, what makes it a girl toy? It's a baby. A doll. Men don't have babies. And I said, oh, yeah, they absolutely do. She goes, so why is it a girl toy? He should be able to play with whatever he wants. And part of that just came with, how is my son going to identify himself with, and what do I have to prepare ourselves with? I knew if he were to come out of, um, you know, liking that opposite sex, that we would face some challenges. And I think I just wanted to prepare ourselves with that. But the pediatrician was great and talking to me, explaining to me, like, he can be. He can play with a doll, because men have babies, too, so it's tough. It's tough. I'm sure your parents, you know, they were kind of probably confused and didn't know, but they did great. You're such an awesome human being.

[18:51] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Thank you. Yeah, it was different. Definitely 80 things was a different time. And my mom was kind of really super progressive now that my sisters and I were talking about recently. It's like, she was, like, really progressive in that sense, that she let me explore my femininity and, like, womanhood, like, at a really young age. And so I think. So a turning point. I need to shout out my prima, leticia. She's always been, like, my. My homie of our cousins. And so I think I was in junior year, she said, are you, like, LGBT? Like, I'm just gonna ask you this one time, and if, like, you don't want to share that, I'm not gonna ask you ever again. And so then, so a cousin, my cousin Ernie, who's, like, a year younger than me, like, it was me, my sister Valerie, Ernie, and me, like, our little three musketeers. And so he did come out before me. So we can always say that as gay. So then I found courage in that from the support of my family to come out at 18. And so I connected with a high school, like, other queer people, especially ones who were super feminine. And so I thought I was, like, free and that I didn't have to hide my secret anymore. But what eventually happened was I. There was, like. I thought I was healed, but there was still a lot of that shame. I was carrying on from childhood and from my teenage years, and so I fell in with the wrong crowd. And so at a really, like, at the time, I had gone to Santa Lee State, and so I always know I wanted to do well and go to college, and so I always had, like, body image issues. So then there was one of my best friends who was now. She is now a trans woman, too. We don't talk anymore. But she said, if you want to lose weight, you could do this, which was a controlled substance. So from 18 to 20, I did, like, really battle with drug addiction, and so. And I went to rehab at 20. And so then here I was in rehab, first time away from home. I didn't know what to do, but I'm a people pleaser, and I could be what you want. So they would say addict. And I didn't know really what that meant. And then I came back home, I want to say, when I was 21, and then that same friend, she asked me, well, we never drank before, and so we just started drinking, and that just led to, like, a decade of. I mean, it was fun in the beginning, but then, like, going to San Francisco, but, I mean, today I'm an alcoholic, so I can't drink. So just, like, really progressively, like, progressive consequences with my addiction. So I'm proud to say, though, since actually last week, May 6, I celebrated eleven years of being sober.

[21:51] CARLA PACHECO: Super proud. Be proud of yourself. So I. I grew up seeing the addiction. So for me, it was seeing a. You know, my sister got involved in drugs very young. She was 13, so me seeing that, that was my. I'm not gonna do drugs because I would see her. You know, my sister's four or five years older than I am, so she was already 13 years old, you know, on crystal, on the streets. So when I would see my sister, it was around the neighborhood and unrecognizable. Right. Because I didn't. She looked older, she didn't look like a 13 year old. She looked like a grown woman. But she was, I guess, my inspiration, like, not to touch drugs. So you should be proud of yourself. My sister still struggles till this day. She'll stay clean for a little bit, and then she'll go back. So be very proud of yourself because it's a very, very bad, bad disease. So be very, very proud of yourself.

[22:54] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Thank you. And that's how, like, I kind of. I mean, it's a day by day thing, but how I killed, like, got sober was through recovery, and so. And I'm still in recovery. So I'm really grateful that there's these resources in the community which I can connect with, and there's a really strong LGBTQ, like, recovery community back in San Jose, but also here in San Diego that I'm starting to get more connected with. So I know that if I keep working on that, I get to live a really beautiful life today. And so. And then my life today is not perfect. I still struggle with being transgender. I still struggle with, like, mental health. But for the most part, I know that if I keep, like, finding a solution and doing healthier things and better choices for myself, I get to lead a really beautiful, like, life that I didn't even think I would imagine. Honestly, when I was younger, I didn't think I live past. And now I don't want to tell.

[23:51] CARLA PACHECO: You, I know your age, but I.

[23:54] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Just turned 40 years old, which is a blessing because I didn't think I was last 30. And I get to have purpose today and how I can inspire people and be a role model. And I was like, who is? And I was, like, ten, even eleven years ago. It's like, I didn't think this would have been possible for me.

[24:16] CARLA PACHECO: Well, yes. So you are a role model. Right. So let's talk about a little bit about that, but let's talk about how, because you're a role model here at the library, and like you said, you are partnered with a lot of organizations, the LGBTQ community. So you are an oral model for them and inspiration for them. So let's talk about how you got into your librarian work. Like, what I guess inspired you and made you come into this profession.

[24:46] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Work here. I was just curious. I know you talked about recovery, maybe for folks who haven't done that before but are struggling with addiction now, like, is there anything you could talk about in terms of recovery, what that looks like, or any advice you give people who may listen to this one day? I don't know, be able to hear.

[25:06] CARLA PACHECO: Something in terms of what you went through.

[25:09] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Just know that there's a lot of. A lot of really good community resources around mental health and recovery, more so in big cities like San Diego. But for the most part, I think with the pandemic, and there's a lot of recovery groups, a lot of really good twelve step programs. There's also. And I'm just speaking about myself. I don't represent any organization, just want to state that. But there's a lot of really good twelve step fellowships, like AACMA, Narcotics Anonymous. There's different ones, too, if you have different struggles. And so if you are struggling with your addiction, just know. Sometimes the first thing to do is ask for help is the hardest thing to do. But I do implore that if you are struggling, that you reach out, go online, look up Alcoholics Anonymous, or just reach out to a friend or family who can help you, or reach out to her at the public library, where we connect you with different community resources. I mean, that's basically how my journey started, is my mom helped me find recovery, and so. And then from there, I found a really, like, really core group of. And there's a lot of. For people who are queer, there are really good lgbt organizations, top step organizations out there who can help you and just go there for information. Don't be like, I know a lot of people get like, well, that sounds really religious and stuff. Like, I mean, I felt the same way, but, like, it's really just other. It's really just other alcoholics or addicts helping each other like this peer support. And for the most part, in my experience, everyone just wants you to do well and do better. So if you are struggling, to really implore you to ask for help.

[27:01] CARLA PACHECO: Yes. And even though, you know, just speaking from someone seeing the addiction, your family might say, I'm tired of helping you. I'm not gonna help you. But that is not true. Your family will always be there, regardless. Till this day, my parents are still there for my sister, you know, trying to help her. So, yes, just like Francesca said, reach out, ask for help, friends, family. Even though family says, we're not going to help you, we are going to help you because we're family and we want you guys all to. We want you to be well at the end of the day. So don't think that you don't have the help because there is the help.

[27:42] FRANCESCA DE VERA: And then, yeah, if you'd like to answer that question about what brought you to the library. So even though my twenties are supernova, like I just talked about, I've always valued my dad, like, immigrant filipino man, always, like, stressing education, my aunt stressing education, and I love school, so. Plus, I'm really compartmentalized, like, back then. Like, I'm really good at school. I wasn't really good at life, but, like, I knew I wanted and I didn't tell you, but I did get kicked out of San Jose State my first year. Oh, very plunked out. Cause I was just battling my addiction. Battling, like, not. I wasn't mature enough, but I worked really hard and I got a job at Borders books, if you remember that. And so. But other than that, I went back to community college eventually and I didn't really know what I wanted to do. And I was just taking class and this took a long time, but I said, like, I really love history, so actually, I should have picked computer science.

[28:39] CARLA PACHECO: But no, you're great.

[28:41] FRANCESCA DE VERA: As I did history, and then I finally got back to San Jose State. It took me kind of six years to finish my ba and I didn't want to grow up. So then I got a master's in american history, and then I didn't want to grow up too. And I didn't want to teach, I thought. But then I saw a poster for the high school, which is the online master's in library information science. So I said, oh, cool, that looks fine. Can push off adulthood another two years, two or three years, which my parents didn't really like at the time. But I think it was the best decision I ever made because I feel like all my experiences led me up to being a librarian. Always loved stories. I really love reading. My mom would always take us to the public library in our neighborhood back in San Jose. So I went through the program and then I had my first job. Like, we were coming out of that recession of 2008, and I finally, I got my. They were, like, spanning hours in San Jose Public library, and they're hiring, like, 40 new librarians. And so I kind of, like, sometimes it's all about timing, but it's all about networking. So I found my first half time librarian position as a children's librarian in San Jose at one of the, called the East San Jose Carnegie Library, which is one of the beautiful Carnegie libraries that Andrew Carnegie built in the turn of the century. So it's greek columns, and it was just. It was, like, down the street from my house, like five minutes.

[30:00] CARLA PACHECO: But that library is not as pretty as this one, right?

[30:03] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Oh, no. But we did have a beautiful Carnegie library here at the turn of the century that was damaged, but. But I really, um. I really learned about. I don't know if the school really prepared me, if I'm gonna be honest, but basically. So you work on the San Jose state. But basically I learned about what kind of why go. And I wanted to be an academic librarian. So it was kind of my battle because I didn't really, like, go on the. You can go different paths, you know, Carl, you could go different paths and take different classes because librarianship is so broad, and there's, like, academics, special libraries, school, public library. So I feel like I learned a lot of on the job experience, and I kind of learned about what a librarian is. And it's more than just books now. It's about being a community space. It's about being. We wear so many hats here at the library, as you probably, like, figure it out by now. I know you've been here a while, too, so, like, I learned. But for me, being, like, a community advocate, being a community connector, being a welcoming. Creating a welcoming space for everyone, especially people, especially our vulnerable communities, our underserved communities, like the lgbt community. And so I always say, like, I just happened upon librarianship. I happened upon becoming a public librarian. But I think it was the best decision I make. I think everything was aligning for me to become one. So I really love being a librarian.

[31:32] CARLA PACHECO: I agree. And I think one of your, I guess, quotes, your personal quote is, like, we all have a story, and you have your story and you're sharing it. So that's great. So I am glad you are here in the library system, and I'm glad that you are able to share your story with the partnerships that you. That you have. So it's really. It's really good to have you. Good thing you chose this. This path. So what led you here to San Diego? Because, again, you grew up in San Jose. You're from San Jose. So what brought you to San Diego?

[32:05] FRANCESCA DE VERA: And before I talk about that real quick, I'll just say, and that's what I bring as a mentor is, like, you may struggle upon your life path, but know that. Always move forward. And there's always light at the end of the tunnel. So the light at the tunnel kind of led me here to San Diego. I always wanted to live by the beach. I mean, mostly, like, who doesn't live with their parents in California? So I lived with my parents till I was thirties, and so at the time, I was doing research for rent, too. It was like, rent was cheaper here in San Diego. I don't know if it's anymore, but like I said before, I used to visit my little sister Kimberly, who went to UC San Diego, and so I always thought it was really a fun city. I know there's the Hillcrest LGBTQ district that I really loved, and I love Balboa park, and I always wanted to live by the beach.

[32:55] CARLA PACHECO: Yes.

[32:56] FRANCESCA DE VERA: And so special places I really love are, like, ocean beach, Mission beach. It's. All the beaches here are really pretty, and I feel like the ocean helps, like, center me. And so that's how I made it. And then I got. And how I was able to live here is I got a job, actually, a few. Not to, like, toot my own horn, but a few. A few library assistants that hire me, but I did choose San Diego Public Library.

[33:19] CARLA PACHECO: They get you so fancy getting all these offers. So I know you grew up in San Jose. So at what age did you leave San Jose to come to San Diego?

[33:31] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I left at 35.

[33:34] CARLA PACHECO: Okay.

[33:34] FRANCESCA DE VERA: So kind of late, right? I. So for the first time, march of 2019, I moved down here. I just filled up my red Honda with everything I owned, and then I head down to San Diego. So I think it was the best decision I made.

[33:52] CARLA PACHECO: So life would have been different there and here. Just because, you know, you spent the majority of your life there before coming here.

[34:01] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Yeah, I think it'd be. I still. I'm pretty connected with my friends in my recovery group back in San Jose who are, like, my best friends. And so I think that's what I miss most about San Jose. Honestly, though, like, san Jose is really similar to San Diego. It's just you're by the beach.

[34:17] CARLA PACHECO: Okay.

[34:17] FRANCESCA DE VERA: In my opinion, we have the same weather. I would say, like, the same demographics, but I don't know how different my life would be if I stayed in San Jose. And I'm not sure if I'll go back there one day. Probably not now. Rent's too expensive in the Bay Area, isn't it?

[34:36] CARLA PACHECO: So much more expensive here in San Diego?

[34:39] FRANCESCA DE VERA: It's really comparable now. Okay, but we don't have the beach up there. I was just living by the beach.

[34:46] CARLA PACHECO: All right.

[34:48] FRANCESCA DE VERA: It's a grounding place for you. I'm curious if that's a social place or if you go to the beaches here, you know, and use it as an opportunity to think, like, what is it about the beach that is so important to you? The beach is important to me. Like, I shared kind of. Like, I grew up Catholic. I'm more spiritual now and agnostic still. I feel like the universe connects me and grounds me. So I do. I don't have a big friend group here yet besides Carla and my sister, but I feel like I do use the beach as a place of, like. And I didn't know I would be like a crystal girly, like, now. I love crystals. I keep an open mind with spirituality now. And so my one friend in North park, she took me to a gong ceremony to first sound healing and then a new moon ceremony at her house. And so I'm pretty open minded to learning how to connect with the universe or God. And so I feel like the beast is somewhere where I can. I feel really peaceful. I could think I could connect with nature and just, like, life is pretty stressful still sometimes. So, like, just a place where, like, I can de stress.

[36:05] CARLA PACHECO: Yeah, it's kind of a feeling of being free.

[36:07] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Right?

[36:07] CARLA PACHECO: Like, growing up in. I grew up here in San Diego county, but the beach is not my favorite place. But I know. I know people are gonna hate me for saying this, but it is a place where you. I could feel free. And I don't know if it's the sound of the waves or just the calmness of it, but you absolutely feel that peace there again. I know. I just don't like the sand. But, yes, we are very lucky to have these beautiful beaches here in San Diego county. So I'm glad you're enjoying that, Francesca, because I'm not.

[36:39] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I'm enjoying my best life here. I mean, I keep visiting other, we travel a lot of librarians for conferences, professional conferences. So I get to visit other cities. I feel like that's how I usually travel. And I keep going to different cities. Like, I was in Portland, then I went back to Denver, kind of where my mom's family's from. And I'm like, oh, no, we have it really good here in San Diego. The weather is beautiful. We have the beaches.

[37:04] CARLA PACHECO: We're spoiled.

[37:04] FRANCESCA DE VERA: We have the best food, I think, too.

[37:06] CARLA PACHECO: Oh, yeah.

[37:06] FRANCESCA DE VERA: And so many events, like, events.

[37:10] CARLA PACHECO: All right, well, to wrap this up, what would you say you are the most proud of?

[37:20] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I would say most proud of, like, feeling empowered. Like, I finally feel like I have purpose. I know I. Knowledge of what I need to work on, and I have today. I know I have the tools, and I have the resources to become, like, the person that I want to become and who I want to be. And so that's what I'm really proud of, is, like, I'm finally at a place where I'm. I feel it's still, like, a work in progress, like, this journey of self love and healing. But I can definitely say, like, I'm definitely on that path that I wasn't on, like, when I was younger, and that I. And it's a really. So far, the journey has been awesome. And I know, like, despite what comes my way, that I'm gonna be okay.

[38:10] CARLA PACHECO: You are. You are so. You know, you already know how I feel about you. So, on behalf of the San Diego public library, we are proud of you and proud to have you here with us. And I'm so glad we crossed paths, and we're here as not only colleagues, but as friends, too. So I feel blessed, because you are awesome. You are great, and we just. We vibe. Thank you.

[38:32] FRANCESCA DE VERA: We just started a podcast.

[38:34] CARLA PACHECO: Maybe we have about a minute left.

[38:37] FRANCESCA DE VERA: I love that question you just asked. I'm curious if you want to share something.

[38:44] CARLA PACHECO: I think, for me is being a teen single mom. I had my son at 16 years old, so I raised them. I raised both of my kids as a single mom. I had my daughter by the time I was 20. So that is what I'm most proud of. To say that I raised my kids, and I raised them to be good kids. Actually, both of them work for the city of San Diego, as well, so they are my. They're my proudest. They're my proud. They're my life. They're my everything.

[39:15] FRANCESCA DE VERA: And Carla's gonna be our future youth services library.

[39:17] CARLA PACHECO: Yes. Fingers crossed it. Thank you.

[39:26] FRANCESCA DE VERA: Thank you.