Katie Andraski and Debra Clinton

KA and DC share memories from their childhoods and recall both of their families being more Republican leaning. DC recalls her mother working with a Democratic senator on Long Island. They recall the assassination of John F. Kennedy.

DC recalls Black students at her middle school following the Civil Rights and Black Power movements, and admits she felt scared of it at the time. KA speaks about being sheltered and not knowing many Black people until she taught at a Junior College. KA recalls writing an "ugly" opinion article about Black men for a major outlet, but thankfully having it rejected.

KA recalls teaching at a predominantly Black school during the early days of the Black Lives Matter movement in Ferguson. DC shares a memory of being beat up by a Black student at school in 7th grade, processing that trauma, and moving schools. DC notes that her children have called her out for not paying enough attention to racial inequality.

KA recalls feeling lonely in school before finding a Bible Study group. DC recalls moving to a more diverse neighborhood after the incident in 7th grade.

DC recalls going to college and beginning to recognize her privilege. KA remembers going to graduate school for poetry and being in an essentially all White school. DC speaks about moving to New York City after college and "growing up."

KA speaks about her husband being a "Bleeding Heart Liberal" and opening her to more empathy. KA speaks about White Privilege and guilt.

KA discusses feeling troubled by polarization in the US, and her view that "people are deeper than their politics." KA recalls bonding with her students and trying to nurture their development.

KA and DC discuss some of their teaching methods, and reflect on "beginner's mind."

KA speaks about missing her students and thinking of them during recent riots. They close with gratitude to each other.