Madeline Mayes and Sharona Nagamuthu

00:02 Hi, my name is Madeline. I'm 16. And today is February June 11th. 2021. I'm located in Brooklyn, New York. And my partner's name is Sharona and we're both involved in this organization called Next Generation politics. And I'll pass it on to her.

00:22 Hi everyone. I'm sure Robin my age. I'm 17 years old. The date is Friday, June 11th, 2021. I'm located in Queens, New York, and I'm here with Madeline and we're all. So we're both and involved in organization called Next Gen.

00:40 Yeah, so I actually am really curious like when did you end up joining and you pee and like why did you come like I just joined in last summer. So I don't know if you joined on the same time.

00:56 I joined the semester right after you. So I joined in the fall. And the way that I got involved is actually my school Center of last email of like progress and opportunities, but they had four students and including the email was, and you as well at their partner organization. Why vote? So I applied for both of them and I got involved starting in the fall. So around like the election time.

01:25 Oh I was so I actually got involved in a similar way. I think I've always considered myself to be passionate about politics. And so when that mass email came Center from my school or why do initially I would like yeah. I'm into this I'm signing up for this and so boom, summer. I joined. What is like about why vote particularly is that like it allows for such reform conversations, like the one that we're having right now about politics and not something that's not necessarily on the minds of like other teenagers. And so I'm really quite great that we've been able to connect through that.

02:08 Yeah, I definitely agree. I know that like one of the main reasons why I got involved in this because I like similar to you. I was also like is typically engaged in like in and interested in politics in Civics, but I never had an environment to express that and why don't you have just given me a place to get sick more specifically engaged and talk to other people that share similar beliefs as me or even sometimes people that are different beliefs, but I really enjoy the fact that we can have this place to discuss that. But it's also an environment that's respectful and people understand that different beliefs is okay and we embrace them for that.

02:55 Yeah, actually actually have a question about that. So what like, what do you think? Like the political climate is in like the community that you're in, like where you are located physically or like the people that you surround yourselves and like that among students like people our age?

03:18 It's hard to say like a specific thing because like Chris, we might school is very diverse. And there's like people from all over different boroughs if you were from Queens and like, they're so Brooklyn. So considering like the political climate is like people from two different sides of the scale. So tension can Arise at times but like that's just in my school environment, but in my home environment, I live in Queen, so that's like it's a very

03:52 Liberal, I guess Democratic Progressive area of Queens. So there is that. But then there's also other side of queens that are exact opposite scale.

04:04 But like, within why, though? And Angie P, even though we can't have people that are on different scales, there were able to come to a consensus and we're able to respect each other and have these conversations. Even if people don't have the same beliefs.

04:23 Yeah, so just to clarify, like, and GPU. Next-generation politics is like, the main organization that why boat is underneath. And it basically Works to bridge to buy between political differences, among Youth and to inspire them to have cross price and dialogue. And why I don't particularly focuses on the activism behind you. The Boating, which has been absent up pretty much the past few years until this, this previous election. So, that has been a really, really great for me in particular, because I think, definitely like it in my community in Brooklyn. Like I definitely experiencing very similar and I think that's for New York City as a whole like, it tends to clean, very liberal and there are definitely more bright minded people. I think personally I have seen so many more liberals that it just kind of like drains the voice of right-wing today.

05:23 I personally don't really like to identify in a bipartisan manner. I guess you could call me a moderate Democrat, but I feel like I'm open to different political beliefs regardless of like the term left or the term, right? And I think that's actually given me a pretty interesting Outlet on politics of the whole. I'm wondering, like, is there any experience that you've had weather in? Angie P or in whatever political Youth Organization organization, but Community outside of NGP like have you ever had has like

06:06 An experience just like talking about Civics that has like really like either shocked you from what you expect use dialogue to be like or like has changed the way you perceived like youth dialogue as a whole.

06:28 I think most of my experiences that have altered my perception of how you kind of discuss politics is, mainly, has mainly been in NGP. I know with a book NeNe. I, I feel like a most School communities. They often shy away from discussing politics, just because it can get touchy subject. But I think an NG pH Embrace that and they accept that the only way that you can get rid of this uncomfortable as is, if you bring people from different points of life and different political beliefs, come to this environment. Able to discuss open late. And one thing that it really enjoy is that the fact that I was able to have these discussions with people that have different political beliefs with me, but there's ever any like tension or any I guess like something completely call it the money out just because they believe something different from them.

07:28 And I think that's something that you don't really experienced outside of NGP. Usually, when you see someone with a different political boat, if it's always like constantly, oh, we're at the head and like, it's just like you're wrong and completely don't want to listen to you stuff like that. But in n g. It's always an accepting environment, even if somebody doesn't believe the same thing, they're able to open to listening and they're open to discussing and saying, oh, I believe this, but I understand where you're coming from. However, I think this stuff like that. So, that's one thing that I really appreciate it with an ntp because I know that outside of, I haven't really experienced many Civic discussions where people are open to actually had activate discussion. I mean it I couldn't agree. It was I think that like,

08:24 Outside of ngpg. I've experienced Civic dialogue in the form of screaming matches or arguments around the dinner table or something along those lines. And always makes me very uncomfortable and it makes me uncomfortable to be to talk about who I am an identity when it comes to politics and it also makes me uncomfortable hearing what they have to say and I feel like that just makes dialogue. If you can even call screaming matches dialogue. It just makes it so counterproductive. And I see that like largely as a problem all throughout New York City. It could be like a larger movement outside of the city, but honestly, I haven't really experienced Civics for politics outside of NYC. So I wouldn't really know and I feel like our climate is in New York City. Of course, is becoming more and more like polarized.

09:24 Cause of that, but at the same time, there are more and more opportunities for you to actually seek out the Civic dialogues like we're talking about. So it's kind of like this contrast, the stark contrast between like, society as a whole becoming more unwilling to listen to other people and then you particularly becoming more accepting of varying opinions and I just like really really hope that that means for our community that were becoming were becoming more inclusive of others and becoming more not necessarily like minded because you don't need to think the same things to agree, but I guess inclusive was all right.

10:16 I totally agree. I think that like what we've experienced an NG or where we have these sessions or people are accepting. A few said, inclusive are definitely something that I would like to see more. But like you said, because of the screaming matches like is there is definitely like extremes that was in New York or people are like, oh I'm all the way on the left. All the way in the right and it's kind of like the people that are in the middle. It's kind of confusing because people on the right or people on the last would be like, but you're right in the middle your but it's just confusing for a certain people because it's just like a like you said polarizing and how Angie P discussions happen while we used to be in person. But because of the pain. We are currently online. So we have our discussions mean.

11:16 Resume. And considering like who's invited is mainly youth, that are part of NGP and aren't interested in having these discussions. And what we can do is we kind of have a structured agenda, but then you kind of choose which breakout room you'd like to go to and what type of you discuss? Like around election day. We're going to discussing like oh what's going on with the election? Did it? Recently were disgusting vaccines and how rollout is going with them. So you kind of get to pick what were you like to discuss. You just get to discuss with people that

11:56 Are like-minded and also are passionate and interested in the same things that are that you're interested in.

12:05 And what I love about Angie PSI. So multifaceted like you have an addition to the Civic forms, which one is mainly talking about. Its you can also have like I'm personally part of the podcast. There's also a Blog. They have a social Cinema Club and in all of these different platforms. Give you two were interested, the opportunity to seek out different viewpoints and to have these conversations. I love being on the podcast, and every single week. I interview someone different, and we talked about current events and things, and it's been a really, really just lightning. And I think that anyone that you talk to, that is involved at next-gen, mostly call it, like, in lightning, to an extent because you just really likes to search for yourself throughout the whole process. I don't know, maybe I'm glorifying it a little bit, but it's really impacted me to a crazy accent.

13:03 My involvement and NGP is like how I realize that. Hey, it's okay. I did not think that you're one where it's okay to have different political views than your family or your friend. It's okay to not be interested in even using a label to describe your political identity. And that's not something I ever would have considered if not joining a GPS. So that's pretty cool.

13:29 Something else actually want to talk about that. You talk that you mentioned before was like political climate in schools and recently, so I'm taking AP World History and I just had my exam like last week. So we're finally slowing down. But recently, we were talking about current events and buy current events. I mean, from the year, 919 hundred on not so current, but that's what the curriculum thinks its current. So, we were talking about, like, the Cold War and the origins of the palestinian-israeli conflict. And I thought, what a great opportunity for my teacher to talk about current issues, and to have students raised their voices about their beliefs and have a productive conversation because you hardly get that any of that in public school that I attend.

14:28 And it's just been lacking all year for me.

14:32 And I was so disheartened. When my teacher basically completely brushed off the topic. She's like, here's a video for you to watch after class. You can watch it on your own time. Here's some questions. You can answer if you so choose to we didn't talk about it once in class and just the fact that I was so excited to have this conversation with my peers and then she just completely brushed it off. I was so disappointed and so upset by that and I was just like, why is why are schools just unwilling to let students have a voice in any Outlet at all. Just frustrated me to the maximum. Yeah. That's what came to mind when you talk about school.

15:22 Yeah, I definitely will. Personally. I'm remote. So I don't have the opportunity to like, go into school. And I know that some of my friends that are Blended and going to school full-time. Had some opportunities to discuss like current events, but I think that's just because of the teacher that we happened. She's very for the students, and she knows what the students want suck, because they have an opportunity. They were kind of, I kind of got to express themselves about the same time and other classes. Like the cops that I'm in. I'm also I also took AP World History, it's it's kind of like even though we want to talk about current events of me want to talk about what's going on in our society. They're kind of like, oh no. That's too touchy of a topic and they shy. But in reality, I think that we have to have these discussions. If he will continuously shy away from this discussion when we get old, it's even harder to have these discussions and that's what may

16:22 High Society. So polarized and five people are always like, oh, like some people are like, oh, I don't care about politics. I don't identify like with a. I understand you do. I identify with a political party? But, I mean, like, some people are just like O+ impact me, but at the end of the day, I think of politics impact, literally, every single aspect of your life. So it's just ridiculous. And I feel like it's just a sense of privilege of people refuse to acknowledge politics and refuse to have discussions around politics because at the end of the day, it's saying that like like I don't care what impacts mean and the fact that were not able to have those discussions and school is just really disheartening.

17:09 I think the reason why are not the reason why. But I think because of the absence of political discourse in schools. I think a lot of Youth just turned to social media then. And I guess this can be a controversial idea, but I personally don't think that social media activism is true activism. I think that a lot of kids will call themselves like a political person or an activist because they re share post on social media and they reach our people stories of just liked Instagram, post that you just flipped through and slide through and a lot of the times that's happening without people, actually reading what's on there or where I'm going to pin in about what's on there or actually making or actually like having some sort of critical thinking attached to the post and it becomes empty.

18:09 It becomes counterproductive and it can even be misinforming to people. And I just ate angriest me so much because then people will go on to say things like your silence. We hear your silence, or your silence is violence, and things like that. And personally, I'm probably not to brag, but like, probably like the most political person in my friend group, but then you have these people reposting, these, these post, and they're like, aren't you supposed to be the political one? Why aren't you sharing this? And I'm like, well, I don't think that this is productive. You need to talk about politics on the way that can mean like what we're doing right here, right? I'll take the something that's, like, not just words on your phone. It's actually affect the human being. And I think that because it affects the he

19:09 It needs to be discussed, human being to human being, so I don't know what you, but you're still wearing.

19:19 I'll take no like a, I don't know what your perception is of like, social media politics. I know that a lot of people think that it is productive, so I could be wrong in that sense, but I don't know.

19:33 I asked really agree with you. I think that we've got those born this culture where people are like, oh, just let me post me on my social media story and call it a day. That's a, that's my activism for the day. And I feel like a lot of people, the reason why people think that that's activism is because other people the ones that like even do anything regarding politics Civics, anything they're kind of the ones that make fun of this activism and Sao like, you totally think you're going to change the world with one instagram story at the guy. I understand that. But I feel like because people up late so much there is that reason why people feel like this is activism when in reality it's it's not much that you're doing and I totally agree with what you were saying about. Like, how about somebody may come up to you and be like, oh, you're so sweet. So, political, why are you posting stuff like this?

20:33 Completely greatest, Austin counterproductive and I know that like, it's some people won't take the time out of your day to read, what your posting like over the majority. So I would rather send people that I know will take the time to read, what? I'm sending that one actually to them. Instead of just posting on my store and calling it a day. And I know I prefer to get, do more stuff behind the scenes. Like how her, if you said, how we're having these discussions. I'd rather have that then just post something and then just call it a day even though people won't look at it or maybe even I won't look at it after I post it, like, it's counterproductive and I don't really think it. It's just after this sends, people are weird. People think that this is enough when in reality it takes a lot more than that. And because we fostered them.

21:26 Idea mentality, people think that social media activism is the biggest form of activism that they're possibly can be our society. When, in reality, it's not

21:40 I'm wondering I'm kind of like thinking about this while you're talking and I'm thinking about how social media activism is increasing as well as like the rise of Youth participation things like protest. But I'm not sure if voting is increasing at the same rate will certainly not increasing at the same rate as social media activism. It is increasing, which is fantastic, but I don't think that's what your rates are matching up. And I'm wondering like do you think like our generation is going to consider voting like as of less importance than like posting on social media? Like is this going to become like the new wave of activism like just in our future?

22:27 Honestly, that's a really good question. I think that because I feel like activism activism not solely, social media activism and voting are definitely tied in. And I know that some people like they kind of just posts, like, I'll get out and vote on their social media sort, but then won't actually go and vote themselves. So, it's like I said before, counterproductive, but at the same time, I feel like our generation like how we're doing right now. We're sitting down in these discussions. So, of course, that doesn't mean that everyone is going to do the same, but I feel like because it's more people are doing this. More people are going to see the impact that it plays within our society and will be convinced to go because I know that a lot of like the younger generation like mainly like our generation, even though we're not able to vote, we're pushing other people to go and vote like, I know and

23:27 Repeat recently. I was part of the lowering, the voting age like a group. We did a CAT project which is the Civic Action project. So we didn't revolve lowering, the voting age and what we saw was kind of a little bit of mixed reviews somewhere, like, no, like, people aren't educated at this age at 16, people. Just going to go with whatever their parents decide what other people are, like, we need this to happen. Like people know what they're doing. People at 16, 16 years, 16 years old, or more specifically gauge, then people that are 24 years old. So there's no reason for them not to be able to vote. So it's kind of just like a mix between people and I feel like more often than not, the people that are saying, no are only saying no out of fear that people will not take this seriously and that, they'll just go in and do ridiculous things. And how like,

24:27 2016 election, people rope around his name on the ballot and that's just messed up the whole action. So people are just scared that things like that will continue to happen, especially with the younger generation, but because of that fear, it's just, it's just, we won't get anywhere because of that. People are always just going to be reluctant to do expanding the youthful ways and taking the youth seriously.

24:54 Yeah, I think so. Personally. I definitely do have that fear. But I think that we need to lower the voting age. Personally, if given the proper opportunities to allow students to do. So unlike take boating as an example, like smart. We talkin about voting or government as a whole in schools at a young age. Like I remember I'm part of the leadership program at my school and we actually host events like the same days or you have to like dress up, we can do this over exams. We've been trying to figure out ways to engage kids. So like let's say today is pink day for breast cancer awareness or something like that. And then you post pictures of yourselves and they make a collage out of it and social media. So, when is election day was rolling around. I told the advisor. Hey, why don't we have something like wear a shirt that has like the American flag?

25:54 Boat on it or some sort of like, voting apparel to do so. And cuz I noticed that there wasn't anything there around election day and I was pretty taken back and my advisor looked at me and he said our students don't bow. Maybe if you're a senior and you're 18, you vote, but most of the kids are both, so don't both. So, why would we do that?

26:20 And I'm like, I'm sorry. I don't, you want you like the worst part is is that he's a government teacher like, he teaches government to seniors. So like

26:33 Why is there this culture? That's just preventing kids from learning. And I think the same people that are preventing kids from learning about politics, and government are the same people who are saying no, don't lower the voting age. So why don't you give us the opportunities to learn so we can make educated decisions so that we can. But when were 16, because that's a privilege that we need to have to have our voices represented in democracy. So, I mean, it's such a complex. I like the idea of lowering the voting age and that's why I love to your project so much. I remember thinking like, wow, they did so much like you're doing, like presentations of Kohl's on social media, like all of these events left, and right. Can you like talk about that more? Like, what was that experience? Like, I just remember I like. Wow, what? Their project is. So great.

27:29 Well the project like the idea of lowering the wedding itself is one that I like necessarily wasn't extremely like familiar and I know there wasn't much even though hardly what we did research me, realize that there are many different you oryx like pushing for this. It's one that I haven't really had much support on and I feel like that's one of the reasons why a lot of people are also reluctant because there isn't much support, but I didn't learn like a tremendous about lowering, the voting age within the project. One of the first things that we said was we kind of collaborated with others from I'm pretty sure it was

28:15 I'm totally blanking on which state right now, but other youth across the country, we were collaborating with them about. I just had a discussion about what we've done to raise awareness, on the rain, the voting age and how that's being accepted within our communities. And then and we all studly. I know what color your kind of talking backwards kind of product on social. Media activism were focused on collecting data and collecting polls about what people think of social media and how that could be impacted by what we posed to be, just remade poles. And we were talking about, like, oh, do you support the voting age? If not, why? And we collected a lot of that. It through social media. And I was just interesting to see the differing views and additionally, we reached out to a representative is actually

29:15 Emails but sadly, many of us didn't really get any responses. We kind of just got our automatic, forwarding email responses and it's kind of disheartening to see you because we take the time to reach out of the way out to the representatives, many. Really? I know some do and I commemorate them from that, but a lot of them don't see the youth as much more than a, I guess a part of their policy to gain support, will be like, oh, I'll totally support the youth but then when the time comes, they kind of push us away and ignore us, so that was one thing that is really disheartening to see but overall the project. It was like a really great learning experience, especially for me and I think forever going on a sleigh. We got to learn more about lowering, the voting age and especially how lowering the voting age has impacted.

30:15 Community has, and in different countries, even we were talking about, like, the UK and like, how lowering the voting age has impacted their. So, because we've done this research, and we seen all this, it's kind of just like, why is it being impact in their own communities? And it's kind of just like, I understand how people are reluctant, but it's we've seen the progress, it has made and we've understood how these nuts can be debunked, but people just refuse to listen. And that's one thing that's just really upsetting.

30:52 I think like for the people who refuse to listen, like I imagined like, if the voting age was lowered and let's just say like in an example, like maybe not across the whole state, or across the whole country but like in one particular community and they realize, like all of the people are voting for someone ridiculous, like all the kids six year olds for going in her own bed, as you said it, like something like that. Maybe that would just serve as a slap in the face to them. That there's something that they're doing that's wrong in terms of Education about voting and maybe that's what we need to make progress. It seems kind of harsh. But if that's like the stands you need to take on it and maybe that's the stands that we actually have to take. Because if the education isn't going to come first before, it's actually done maybe than education will have to come after.

31:52 And that's an interesting thing, but I've actually never thought of before until discussing this right now, but I think I could actually be productive.

32:01 I agree. I honestly, I feel like our society and its up what a lot of. Like, a lot of issues. We don't realize their importance that we don't pay attention to them until it's too late or until change needs to happen instantly. And it's, It's upsetting. But it's honestly, if we're talking about lowering, the voting age, I understand how you can only happen, like once people realize the importance and realize that instantly needs to occur. So, of course, that's an incident where change what has to occur instantly. So like you said, even though it's it's kind of harsh and it's a slap in the face. It's if they could have listened beforehand and people understand what the youth are trying to say before, and it would totally be avoidable. But in the case that they don't listen to Youth is usually the case.

33:01 Have to deal with the repercussions, which is is it's tough to say, but that's it's the common occurrence within our society. So I feel like it's not something that's so

33:16 Out of the blue pill.

33:20 Yeah, I agree. And I think like also has like those people who are unwilling to listen or unwilling to change are like kind of the same people. Also, I hate to make generalizations generate my gosh generalizations, but I feel like pattern. Why's, it could be like the same people who thinks that like these protests and rallies are actually doing more harm than good. And since they're typically very heavily new sled. I think that like if like, I feel like you use are taking other lenses of activism because I can't vote and if they think that protests are so bad and give us the right to vote so that we can have our ideas Express in otherwise, if you don't like us protesting or Marching In the Streets or whatever, so like just give us the opportunities and we can actually like work together instead of like,

34:20 Consoling. Bashing each other. I don't know. Why is that such a wild idea?

34:27 Just like disconnect and I feel like the disconnect can be connected so easily, but it's people just don't listen and I feel like a lot of people just have these.

34:43 I guess bad perception of the Year, especially if you were saying how people viewed these processes bad and do more harm than good because of these perceptions. That's why we can't have this connection. And of course, the user like, oh these people don't want to listen to me. So it's just refueling disconnection and it's it's really hard and I'm curious as for you. How do you think we can go about like, just kind of acting this way hard question because like I feel like this is typically a gap that we're seeing General, General, Lee, generationally generationally, and so it's not like you can reach out necessarily to a whole generation on like social media or in just like have a conversation with an entire generation at 1 that's pretty hard.

35:43 I feel like this is also a terrible thing to say, but I think that through just like time going by that generation is just going to phase out and this might be taking like too long. This might be like a slow process, but just to prove the natural way of life like it's going to be a world where

36:06 There is more acceptance because Tennessee will be majority of the population. Will I'm sure trying to feed already most of the population. Pretty sure like that's true but like as adults in power because we have to be adults to have power for some reason. So I think that just like naturally will fade out like that. But if anything I feel like just like having like just sitting down and having conversation just like a normal human being conversation, not trying to like jump at each others, throat or cut people off just like

36:44 It could be hard but like sit down at the dinner table and just just try to have a conversation about like, your beliefs Weatherby about voting or not. I'm sure maybe the first time you do it. It's a crazy screaming match in the house. Just shaking me the second time you do it, it'll still be screaming match the third time, you do it, it'll be less of a screaming match and more of a conversation and by the hundredth time that you do it, it'll be a conversation for sure. So as many screaming matches that it takes to get to the conversation will be worth it because people are going to eventually get used to hearing opinions that they don't want to hear. And sometimes, that's what I like. That's what we're at right now, like maybe the screaming matches are kind of necessary at times, but I think that if you just tried act like human beings and remember that the other person on the other side of the AR.

37:44 It is also a human being that that Gap would be closed and will become like more cookie, seven lessons.

37:56 Totally. I definitely think that we were saying earlier we kind of just need to accept the uncomfortableness and we need to have these discussions. Like we're having right now and just accept that and realize that this is what needs to happen. And even though a lot of people don't want to accept that these discussions are uncomfortable. It's what we need to accept in order for change to occur. And we just need to Foster more compassion environment. I think it works that thing environment, and like you said, it will take time, but I'll get there eventually.

38:35 Yes, if I could Lake wish, say something to like every single in New York, City residents like out there that the whole lot of people. But if I could, I would just say, like, passionate how compassion, I'm stealing your word, because it's such a great word. But especially, like, coming up with the election mayoral elections, like just have compassion for each other. Like, I'm sure that there are tons of families having arguments around the dinner table about Merrick and it, it's just have compassion.

39:10 So I really see that we're close on time. So I just wanted to thank you for being able to sit down with me and have this conversation. I really enjoyed it. Me to Leah.