Marcus McDuffie, Jeff Vigil, and Naomi Love

[00:00] JEFFREY VIGIL: Hello. My name is Jeffrey Vigil. My age is 47 years old. Today is January 22, 2023. I'm in El Paso, Texas, and I'm here with my friend Naomi. Hi, my name is Naomi Love.

[00:10] NAOMI LOVE: I'm 27 years old. Today is January 22, 2023.

[00:14] JEFFREY VIGIL: We're in El Paso, Texas, and I'm.

[00:16] NAOMI LOVE: Here with my new friend, Jeff.

[00:18] JEFFREY VIGIL: Hello. Hi.

[00:19] NAOMI LOVE: So I know you wanted to talk about kind of your experience with brazilian jiu jitsu. I'm curious how you first got involved with it.

[00:28] JEFFREY VIGIL: So I started brazilian jiu jitsu when I was 26 years old. And honestly, I was in a really weird time in my personal life with my relationship and just everything that was going on in my life. I was in just an odd place, and I happened to just bump into jiu jitsu. I was living in Santa Fe, New Mexico, at the time, and I happened to drive by this building, and there was a sign that says Santa Fe brazilian jiu jitsu. And I was like, huh, I wonder what that is. So I just kept driving by. I seen it a few other times, and I had mentioned it to my wife girlfriend at the time that I had seen this place, and just the odd stuff in my life just kept going on and going on. And then I finally decided to pull the trigger and go see what this San Faber zones jitsu was about, and it wasn't there no more. So I was like, hmm, okay, whatever. So I just, you know, just kept going on my life, living life. Like. I said a lot of weird stuff going on. You mean, like nothing major, but, like, small stuff, in and out of jail, and I was in trouble with the law. Something was always up. My wife, girlfriend at the time, was driving by this other building, and she was like, hey, she called me. She was like, hey, this. That place that you were talking about, it's down over here at this other place. I was like, oh, okay. So I, like, almost automatically went over there when I walked in the door coming up, and just, like, I've always been, like, a huge fan of martial arts and movies and stuff like that. And the only martial art that I knew that was brazilian was capoeira.

[01:58] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah, yeah.

[01:59] JEFFREY VIGIL: So when I walked in the door, I actually thought I was walking into a capoeira school, and boy, was I not in a capoeira school. They, at the time, I was pretty big. I was probably weighing about 250 pounds, 200, 4250, just depending on what was going on. That day, I showed up to the class. The owner of the school was named Alberto Crane. He walked me in had me do an intro class. He fitted me into a uniform, and then he put me with this woman that was, I don't know, maybe 115 pounds. And me walking into the place, I thought I was a tough guy. I'm from the streets. I didn't gang banging and all this. All this other bull crap coming through my life. So I thought. I thought, this is like, I'm gonna hurt this young woman. She beat the shit out of me. She beat me so bad that I. I just couldn't figure out exactly what was going on. So I continued to. Alberto Crane is like a mentor in my career. So I still, to this day, I still have connections with him. I remember going back in after the class and he asked me, he was like, would you try it? Would like to try it for a week? And my exact words were like, actually, no, I want to sign up and I'm going to own a school one day. Wow. Like, I just knew that this is what I needed to change my life, and I just took it and I ran with it. I just kept going, kept going for the longest. I was, I guess what we call it is wearing a shirt. Like, I was just, like, a part of the group. I wasn't really, like, actually, like, hardcore into the art, like, where I am today. And so I just kept going, kept going. And eventually I started running classes and I continued going to the ranks. And then I then eventually received my black ballot, and then I moved to El Paso and I opened the school here in El Paso.

[03:47] NAOMI LOVE: Wow.

[03:47] JEFFREY VIGIL: So you made it happen. I sure did. I sure did. And I guess I still keep my. I still have my connection with Alberto Crane. So he's in California now. He's no longer in Santa Fe, New Mexico. So whenever I'm in California, I go stop by just to talk to him and just see what he's up to business wise nowadays. Yeah. And he always reminds me of that conversation of Tommy. Do you remember when you said you're going to own a school one day? And I was like, yeah. Yeah. I was serious about it.

[04:11] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah.

[04:11] JEFFREY VIGIL: Now it's like, next time I get to go see him, I haven't seen him in a while. I can tell him that I just don't own one school now. I own two schools.

[04:17] NAOMI LOVE: Wow.

[04:18] JEFFREY VIGIL: So it's definitely, like, you mean. And he's, like I said, he was always, like, my mentor business wise, just because the fact that the way he did business, I mean, like, I really, really looked up to that. Absolutely. No, that mentorship is so important.

[04:29] NAOMI LOVE: Do you feel like, there are other teachers and mentors that have helped you along the way, whether it's with Jiu Jitsu or other things in life.

[04:35] JEFFREY VIGIL: I definitely have this one in Jiu jitsu, we call the black wild professor. I have this one professor named Raphael de Fretas. They call him Barata. It means cockroach in Portuguese. And he's just this little, tiny, 125 pound 5456. And he's not big man at all. And just, he's the monster. A monster. He would verbally and physically beat the crap out of me every time, every chance that he got. And with me, the way, in order for me to pick something up, I need tough love. And he gave me all the tough love that I needed to get me where I needed to get today. He definitely showed me what Jiu Jitsu is about. Taught me so many different things, how to really run a class and how to really present yourself and what we call the Jiu Jitsu Lifestyle. And so definitely, I'd say Rafael de Fretas is huge in that. For the jiu Jitsu aspect of it, I would say Rafael de Fretas, but the Business part of it, I definitely always go back to Alberto Crane, for sure. Gotcha. And how would you describe that jujitsu.

[05:46] NAOMI LOVE: Lifestyle for somebody that didn't really know about it?

[05:49] JEFFREY VIGIL: Just someone that just gets up in the morning and it's Jujitsu all day. All day. You, you go, you get up in the morning, you eat a nice little breakfast, you do your meditations or your stretches, and then go do a lunch class, come home, eat a little bit of lunch, whatever. Maybe take a nap, and then go home and go back in the evening. And then again, jujitsu all night. And then just, just over and over and over and over. And it's just, that's the life. I mean, it's like, there's really no time for, like, partying. Yeah. I mean, like, there's always, we always get out and let our hair loose. But if you, if you really focus on trying to add party into that lifestyle, the training is hard. Yeah. It would be hard on your body. Yes, because the training is already hard on your body. So definitely the jujitsu lifestyle is just definitely living jujitsu. Like, really, really just going there and just going full force and living it to the fullest. And it's in. The number one part about living to the fullest is training. Training as much as possible. Always, like, trying to be a sponge and absorb as much as you can to, to get to that next level. I mean, and that's definitely what I did. You mean, like, I I'll say no matter what rank you are, you were a wipeout, and that's the beginning. Belt, you mean? So we all have been there at one point, so we definitely know, like, you mean that. Sick. It's doable. It's doable to get to the black belt level, not to just the black belt level, to the part where you're. You can become an entrepreneur and living off of Jiu jitsu. Yeah. And it sounds like it's obviously a.

[07:18] NAOMI LOVE: Really big part of your life at this point. What have you learned from Jiu jitsu? Like, what lessons do you feel like or what some ways that your life has changed, maybe.

[07:28] JEFFREY VIGIL: Definitely taught me how to treat people, 100% taught me how to be a leader. Like, you mean what? Like, to be a real leader, not someone just that you follow. I mean, I actually. Someone that you like, you'll fall into the. To a fire pit, you mean? Definitely show me how to be a. A great leader, for sure. And what about your life has changed.

[07:50] NAOMI LOVE: Or what's different now that you found Jiu jitsu compared to before?

[07:54] JEFFREY VIGIL: My eating habits, what I eat, the drinking, 100% the drinking, my relationship with now my wife, like, just the way it was, very verbally and sometimes physically abusive with the relationship on both sides. And just through Jiu jitsu, it just, like, it totally changed. Like, honestly, my life was like when I started Jiu jitsu in 2002, my life, like I said, it was weird. I was always up to something no good. And after I kind of started living the jiu jitsu lifestyle, my life changed. I came from a life of closed doors to now having nothing but open doors. Every path I go through now is, like, there's always an open door, an open wall into someone's home or into someone's family or with the people that I'm involved with. I've always been wanting to be running from the police, and now I have programs that I work with the FBI, with the border patrol, police officers. These are my students, and I interact with them. They're my friends. So it's definitely got that out of it. Yeah. And what's it like teaching? Teaching is. It's fun, but it's hard. It's definitely takes a toll on the body. I mean, it takes a toll on your mind. You give so much energy to the students that, like, it's exhausting. It's really, really exhausting. Like, there's some. Especially, like, the way I do it, I'm the energy that I put is the same in every class. So you show up to one class, some kind of, like, I guess, like a McDonald's meal. Yeah. You know, when you go to McDonald's, what you're gonna get if you show up to learn jiu jitsu and you see that I'm the one teaching the class, you already know you're gonna get 10,000% of what I have to offer and nothing but the best. The world class. I mean, I've definitely learned how to bring world class brazilian jiu jitsu to my teaching skills and to anybody that's under me. And that's just what it's all about, that world class jiu jitsu. And is there anything in particular that.

[10:05] NAOMI LOVE: You'Ve brought from classes you took, maybe with Raphael to your own teaching style?

[10:12] JEFFREY VIGIL: I picked up a lot of different stuff. You mean, like, I would never say the dry comedy that I've got from defertas. I catch with him. He always has, like, these weird noises he would make in these hand gestures that he always did. I catch myself always making the weird noises and the hand gestures, but I. But it's because I would see the reaction that people would give him with those hand gestures and those noises and stuff. So it's something I picked up. And throughout the. Throughout time, I've made, started my own noises, so I don't use his same noises, but it's as a Houston attitude from him. And I see it that the people definitely catch on like it, and they see it, and it keeps them coming back. Gotcha. And what is the or your jujitsu.

[11:02] NAOMI LOVE: Community here in El Paso?

[11:04] JEFFREY VIGIL: Like, it's tough. We have a bunch of tough, tough students, but we have a little bit of everybody. We have a little bit of everybody. You know, we got your a lot of, like, just, like, regular moms, just, like, desk working dads or students. And then we had a lot of border patrol and then. But we do have to have, like, a lot of, like, people that are, like, right now I have a student that's on the east side who's an ex ranger, and he's definitely came from a pretty hardcore military background where he's done a lot of tours for battle, and he's dealing with a lot of, like, that stuff in his life. And the jiu jitsu is just so changing him. It's like giving him a place to release. I mean, he don't just have all this stuff built up in him. He goes up there and he trains, and when he gets off my hemispheres. He just feels like. Like he left it all out there.

[12:07] NAOMI LOVE: Kind of a way to maybe process.

[12:08] JEFFREY VIGIL: Things or get that energy out there. Yeah, yeah. Or even the situation. Like, I mean, he's so. He's so used to combat, I. So instead of just sitting at home or at work, just going crazy about combat, because he's not in combat no more, it's like giving him that kind of another sense to go into combat. That's kind of what it's kind of like when you go in there, we practice our techniques, but when it comes down to actual. Our sparring, it's like full on sparring, where we're fighting to either choke each other out unconsciously or gently manipulate a joint. And I call it gently because that's what we're supposed to. We're supposed to be gently choking each other, gently manipulate joints, because if you go full force, you could snap someone's arm or their leg or something. So we learned how to, like, you know, definitely gently manipulate those joints.

[12:56] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah, no, that would be important.

[13:00] JEFFREY VIGIL: And so when did you come to El Paso? Because I know you mentioned before that you were in Santa Fe, right? Yeah. Well, I started in Santa Fe, but I always lived in Albuquerque, so I was in Santa Fe there for a couple of years. I was also working down there. And then the Albuquerque school opened, and then that's. That's when I actually got the chance to. To stay instead of, like, traveling down to San Francisco. I really made Albuquerque, like. Like home base. I got a job there and Albuquerque and everything, so I stayed there. And then also when the. The Albuquerque school opened, that during that time, Alberto Crane had just signed to the UFC, so he moved to Glendale, California, to go be with his wife, because at the time, his wife was in Glendale also, so he was, like, doing this long distance relationship thing. So he officially moved to California, and with instructors that he had there, he sold the schools there. So I made the transition to Albuquerque, training in Albuquerque. I got my black belt May 5, 2012. And then May 15, 2012, I opened the school here.

[14:04] NAOMI LOVE: Wow.

[14:04] JEFFREY VIGIL: I was already just. I just. I had never been to El Paso. No, no, I came, like, years ago, I came through, but we came to Juarez to do it, the teenage party thing in water, so we definitely there. But now, I had never been to El Paso, and when it came down to me opening the school, I had three options. I had a Baldwin Park, California, Fairfax, Virginia, and El Paso, Texas. And I just had to decide which one I wanted to. To go with. And it came down to El Paso, Texas, when I was originally gonna start, decide that this is where I was gonna be. So there was some Jiu Jitsu schools here. So I came down and I acted like I didn't know Jiu Jitsu, and I went and tried the classes just to see what they had to offer, and I was like, I'm gonna blow these guys out of the water. Basically, I decided that El Paso is gonna be where I'm gonna come. And I was like, I could have opened a school there in Albuquerque, but I definitely feel I would have, like, possibly gave some trouble to the school I came from, just because the fact is, like, so I'm the part of the team I'm part of is Gracie. BAJA is the name of it. We're a worldwide organization. We have over a thousand schools throughout the world. Just in the Albuquerque area, there's four Gracie Bahas, and they're all owned by my professor, thus ROberto Alan Carr. And so I figured if I open a school there, it's just. It's Gonna. I'm not gonna be able to shine the way I want to shine. So I chose the next closest city next to them so I can still be by them, but still be further enough away. Further enough away from them so I can kind of start, like I said, start my own team, start my own legacy, you mean. That's why I got into this. I really wanted to be a leader one day and have my own team and have my own group of soldiers that I could. We can go to battle with. Yeah. And so what does being a leader mean to you?

[15:55] NAOMI LOVE: Like, what kind of a leader do you want to be, if you could think of an ideal way?

[15:59] JEFFREY VIGIL: I guess just the bear for me, I feel the best leader is to be is to definitely practice what I preach, you mean? So, like, whatever. I'm telling you, I be, like, a. Like a fake. Everything that I say, I definitely. I live by it or I do it. I mean, I don't. I don't recommend something unless I've tried it or I definitely, like, try to live that life, you mean? Definitely. Like I said, I don't ever want to get caught in that situation where people were saying, oh, well, your professor is saying this or that, but I saw him over here at the bar at this or that. So definitely a leader, to me, means definitely lead by example. 100% lead by example. And so you mentioned that the kind.

[16:45] NAOMI LOVE: Of jiu jitsu that you do or the kind of movement that you're with is Gracie baha. You said what makes it different from other kinds of jiu jitsu.

[16:54] JEFFREY VIGIL: Well, so the only other jiu jitsu there is is japanese jiu jitsu. So, I mean, so japanese jiu jitsu is the art where it's mainly. It's. It's a standing arc. So the second the fight hits the ground, it stops, and they stand him up. Brazilian jiu jitsu, the fight doesn't even start till it hits the ground. So you mean there's, like, so many jiu jitsu schools everywhere? Everywhere. Especially here in El Paso. Are you now, they're all similar. I mean, we're all teaching brazilian jiu jitsu. We're all teaching the joint manipulations. But it's just the way some of us approach it. Some of us take it, like, really to the point where this is our life. I mean, we're gonna live for the jiu jitsu lifestyle. And some people do it just to say. I mean, just to get. To get, like, the likes on social media or wearing the shirt. So people come and say, oh, that's a cool shirt. Where'd you get it? Oh, I trained jiu jitsu in this nebula. It's not really like that. It's not really like that. Some of these. It's a lot easier to talk about it than really be about it.

[17:55] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah.

[17:56] JEFFREY VIGIL: And what was it like for you.

[17:58] NAOMI LOVE: Coming from Albuquerque to El Paso? Like, what has life in El Paso been like?

[18:05] JEFFREY VIGIL: It's very similar that the number one thing that I say that is different here is the crime. Albuquerque is bad. The crime is bad. Like, you. There's. They break in your. Everything. They steal everything. You see the drugs everywhere in the streets, and it's not like neighborhoods. You have one side of town that's nice and one side of the neighborhood. It's bad. It's bad everywhere over there. So the number one thing when I moved here was the crime. I noticed that there was. There's. There's crime, but not really like that so much. It's so much safer here. But the. The people, the El Paso community, it's. They're very. It's just like New Mexico, you mean. I would definitely say the only difference is the accents are different because New Mexico has, like, its own accent. El Paso has own accent. Like El Paso. El Paso, you get a lot more accent as in Mexico, because Mexico's right there. So many people, they have. They're connected in New Mexico. We're like our own breed over there. We consider ourselves New Mexicans. So, like I said, we have our own language. Basically in everything, but it's. Yeah, so that's. Yeah. And did you grow up in Albuquerque? Yeah, I actually was born in New Mexico, but I grew. I grew up in Arizona. I grew up in Phoenix. Yeah. So my elementary high school years, I lived there. And then when I turned about 19, I came back to New Mexico. Like I said, I had a real rough growing up. Gangs, a lot of gang stuff going on. When I was probably, I just turned 18. One of my younger brothers got shot on the head two times with an sks. And that definitely kind of, like, made me and my other brother realize that we needed to get out of Phoenix, because if not, it was going to be one of us next to get shot or possibly even one of our younger brothers or our mom, just because it was just so bad. It was just so bad. And then we came back to New Mexico, and we'd been here ever since.

[20:13] NAOMI LOVE: Kind of. How is your life different than what you might have envisioned it would be when you were maybe ten years old, let's say.

[20:20] JEFFREY VIGIL: Or maybe similar. I don't know. When I was that young, like, we. This is when we were living in Phoenix. The gangs were bad. Yeah, they were bad. So we definitely. That's already at ten years old, we were involved with the gangs and we were doing the stuff that the gangs are doing. I mean, the small drugs, you mean the petty crimes. I mean, we were in the situations where we weren't actually doing the drive bys, but we were in the cars where the drive bys were being done and stuff like that. I mean, so let's definitely say that's. Yeah, that's got a lot of that. Yeah.

[20:57] NAOMI LOVE: And I guess, what advice would you give to kids going through a similar thing now?

[21:03] JEFFREY VIGIL: Believe. Believe that there's a way out. You mean no matter how bad it is, there's a way out? You could think like, man, there's no future for me. This is all I have. Generation after generation. This is what we've gone through, and there's a way out. I mean, the number one thing is just, you gotta believe in yourself. You gotta know that you gotta be the one to do it. No one else is gonna do it for you. You gotta be the one that can do it.

[21:32] NAOMI LOVE: Hmm.

[21:34] JEFFREY VIGIL: And let me see some of these questions we've got here.

[21:39] NAOMI LOVE: What are you proudest of in your life at this point?

[21:43] JEFFREY VIGIL: I'm definitely proud of the man that I've become, especially because, like, you mean, where I came from, I've seen so much violence and just all these different things that I've gone through in my life, and I definitely, like, I'm nothing where I thought I would be. And I'm very, very proud of that. I'm very, very proud of the leader that I became. The hard work that I've put into creating these teams that I've created here in El Paso. I'm very proud that, man, I'm going on 27 years of being with my wife. I'm very proud of that because you get a lot of people nowadays, they don't last that long in relationships, and it's a lot different. Lot different. I'm definitely very proud of that.

[22:28] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah.

[22:29] JEFFREY VIGIL: How'd you meet your wife? Just when I came back from New Mexico, from Arizona to New Mexico, I was just out there in New Mexico. We call it living the Vida Loca.

[22:39] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah.

[22:39] JEFFREY VIGIL: So we were out there just like I came from Arizona. You mean, there was, it was gang banking, a lot of gang banging. And when I got to New Mexico, it was different. It was more like, like selling dope and being involved in that world there. And so I basically, they came from the same world from Arizona and jumped right back into the same scene in New Mexico, but it was a little different. And just out there partying and being in the streets, I ran into my. To, to Rachel. That's my girlfriend. It was my girlfriend at the time, and just, we just, it just hit it off and we just stayed together. We just stayed together and just kept going. And then we just, we, through the both of us, you just kept changing and kept changing. And then she's actually a court reporter for the federal government.

[23:25] NAOMI LOVE: Oh, wonderful.

[23:25] JEFFREY VIGIL: So as soon as she finished school, she right away started taking internships. So she's done a lot of work in Massachusetts. She's done a lot of work in Washington, DC. Now. We've been living. So I live part time in El Paso and part time in Boston.

[23:40] NAOMI LOVE: Okay.

[23:40] JEFFREY VIGIL: So for the past eight years, she's been there full time in Boston, and then I've been going back and forth. Forth? Yeah. For the past eight years. Gotcha.

[23:48] NAOMI LOVE: What has it been like going back and forth? That's a long time to be going back between two places.

[23:53] JEFFREY VIGIL: Yeah. Well, we've been doing the long distance thing now. Twelve years. Wow. It's how long? We do the long distance thing now. And it's. It's lonely sometimes, but. But I definitely say that I get to be me.

[24:08] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah.

[24:08] JEFFREY VIGIL: I mean, like, I. And I have to really, really like, like take care of myself. You? Yeah. I'm all by myself. I'm hungry. I need to cook. Yeah, I need to go get some groceries. You mean I need to get up and go run errands for the business, you mean? It's kind of like, I gotta go. I gotta go. Yeah.

[24:27] NAOMI LOVE: And I feel like it makes you, at least in my experience, like, makes you more present in the moments that you are together. You're appreciating that more.

[24:33] JEFFREY VIGIL: We definitely miss each other. For reals, you mean, it's not like you get, like, you know, like, I see you in the morning, and I wake up next to you, I go to work, and I come back after work. Did you miss me? Yeah. It's, like, fake. And maybe you do generally do miss. Sure, but it's kind of like I just saw you a few hours ago. Yeah, you were drama is what I said. Yeah. So it's definitely. It's. The missing is genuine. For sure. For sure. That makes sense. Well, I so appreciate you sharing your.

[25:03] NAOMI LOVE: Story with me a little bit today.

[25:04] JEFFREY VIGIL: Thank you. I appreciate you for having me. I definitely got glad I got you, like, you know, tell a little bit of my story. I have so much that I've gone through, but this is definitely a huge part of it that's made me who I am today. Yeah.

[25:22] NAOMI LOVE: It's Marcus McDuffie. I'm 37 years old. Today's date is January 22, 2023. We're in El Paso, Texas. I'm here with Professor Jeff Vigil, who is my professor and friend.

[25:34] JEFFREY VIGIL: Good. Hello, Marcus. How are you doing?

[25:37] NAOMI LOVE: So I wanted to take this opportunity to sit down with you, because I know you have a really interesting story. And whenever I sit down, I talk with you, I'm always inspired, and I wanted a chance to, one, get that on the record, and two, if we can get that to more people, I think that would be just such a beautiful thing. So let's start with the way that I know you as my jiu jitsu professor. How did you get started in jujitsu?

[26:02] JEFFREY VIGIL: Man, just. I was in a really weird time in my life, and it was more likely it was going to be either death or jail if I didn't change the path that I was going. And it just fell in my lap. It just fell in my lap. I drove by this building that said, santa Fe, brazil, and jiu jitsu. I kind of was like, huh, I wonder what that is. I went back a few weeks. Maybe a month later, it was gone. It was no longer there. A little bit of time went by, and then my wife, who was my girlfriend, at the time, Rachel, she drove by this building, and the sign was there at this other building. She sent me over there. I went over there, and I walked in the door, and there was a woman there, probably about 115 pounds, 120 pounds, who they paired me up with as my partner. And she beat the Crap out of me. And I just knew from that day that this is me right here. This is what I need to go as a career and my life.

[27:03] NAOMI LOVE: Also, two things stand out to me. Right. The way that you described your life before jujitsu is obviously that you face adversity. And then even at the very beginning of your jiu jitsu career, adversity. What stood out to you in the very beginning that made you even want to go back and find another school?

[27:25] JEFFREY VIGIL: You know what? It's just the goal. Like, when I originally came, moved to El Paso to open the school, my plan before I even got here was three schools in El Paso. So I've always been on that mission to have multiple schools in the El Paso area. I mean, I figured that once I can accomplish the third school in El Paso, then I can possibly go and be a school wherever my wife is located, because my wife is always moving all over the east coast, and my reason, I want to be with my wife, but I'm kind of, like, still on this mission where I need my three schools to set me up. So when I go to do the school, wherever she's at, I know I'm good. And it's always that no matter what, I will always be part. Whenever that does happen, I will always be strong roots in the El Paso area, but it's always time to take another adventures into life.

[28:21] NAOMI LOVE: So right now, you have two schools in El Paso?

[28:23] JEFFREY VIGIL: Yep.

[28:24] NAOMI LOVE: At what point did you realize that this would be a lifelong passion and pursuit for you?

[28:29] JEFFREY VIGIL: My first class.

[28:30] NAOMI LOVE: First class.

[28:31] JEFFREY VIGIL: My first class. Like, I literally. I remember that day that that woman beat the crap out of me. I walked into the office to speak with Alberto Crane, who was the black belt owner of the school that I was training, the Santa Fe brazilian jiu jitsu. And he tried to offer me a week, a week trial. My exact words to him were, no, I want to sign up right now, and I'm gonna own a school one day. I continue to have this relationship with Alberto Crane, and I see him quite often, and a lot of the time I see him, he reminds me of that conversation. And right now, I haven't seen him, and I haven't seen him over a year. And the next time I see him. I can't wait to tell them that I have two schools now.

[29:09] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah. And that's really impressive. I think you're the only person in the area with more than one academy. And to be part of such an outstanding network and even within that network be, you know, a shining star, that's. I think that's super impressive. Before you got to the black belt level and became Professor Jeff, what was your journey like going from white BELt up until that POINT of being a black beLt?

[29:42] JEFFREY VIGIL: I would definitely say my white belt to purple beLt. I was still. I was still a troublemaker. I was still always parTying, always getting into fights in the bars, abusive and verbally and physically on both sides. With my girlfriend, wife, now girlfriend at the time, it was just a lot of trouble. A lot of trouble. And then. And then when I. When I got the purple belt, I started to, like, really realize. I mean, like I said, this is what. This was my goal, what I wanted, but I kind of started to really realize that, you mean what I needed to change if I really wanted to make this happen. And then after the Purple Bows, when I really, really started taking Jiu Jitsu really seriously, and that's when I really, really started to, like, I guess, really see the benefits, what Jiu Jitsu had to offer.

[30:36] NAOMI LOVE: How old were you when you got your purple belt.

[30:41] JEFFREY VIGIL: Man? That's a good one. Probably about 31, 32.

[30:50] NAOMI LOVE: 31.

[30:51] JEFFREY VIGIL: Yep. 31, 32.

[30:52] NAOMI LOVE: Saw a lot of growth in development.

[30:54] JEFFREY VIGIL: Yep, yep, a lot. A lot.

[30:57] NAOMI LOVE: And then once that switch flipped for you. Right. And it's, I can't do the things I'm doing and be where I want to be. Like, were there certain things that changed for you?

[31:11] JEFFREY VIGIL: There was a lot that changed for me. There was a lot that changed for me. I mean, like, definitely the parting stopped. The way I dressed changed. That completely changed. I just. I definitely. The way I thought changed. The way I drove down the street, with the way I would respond to someone cutting me off or the way I would respond to just the way I would treat people. There's so many different things that they changed in my life. I mean, the number one thing I think, that really, really changed is my relationship. I definitely started to see the verbally and physically abuse that we would put each other through that completely stopped. Completely stopped. And they would say, oh, like, wow. Wow, I like this. This is cool. It's comfortable.

[32:06] NAOMI LOVE: It kind of sounds like as you progress and you develop more discipline within the martial art and you matured as a person, you start to not only value yourself more in the way that you pretty much did everything in your life but also valued your partner more. How's your relationship with your partner affected your jujitsu journey?

[32:33] JEFFREY VIGIL: I think that my. It took it to the next level because she basically let me take my career to the fullest. She never once, when I got my brown belt, she finished school as a court reporter and she right away took a bunch of internships, so she right away started traveling to the east coast. So it's kind of like I was never gonna say, try and stop her from living her dreams in her career. And she did the exact same for me. So she really, really let me grow, like, grow to, like. Like, I can't even believe how much she let me grow. To me, she was like, this is what you want to do, so. All right, live it to the fullest and do it to the fullest. And I definitely was able to do that.

[33:19] NAOMI LOVE: That mutual support is equally parts beautiful and just so uncommon, right. To have two people that are going to support each other and just say, I want what's best for you, and we're both willing to make the sacrifices so that we can advance in the lives that we want and then also still be able to come back together and have a beautiful life together, for sure. When did you open your first academy in El Paso?

[33:49] JEFFREY VIGIL: First academy was open May 15, 2012.

[33:52] NAOMI LOVE: 2012.

[33:52] JEFFREY VIGIL: This is when I opened the school.

[33:54] NAOMI LOVE: So almost.

[33:56] JEFFREY VIGIL: Almost eleven years ago.

[33:57] NAOMI LOVE: Almost eleven years.

[33:57] JEFFREY VIGIL: Almost eleven years ago.

[33:59] NAOMI LOVE: And what was that like in the beginning?

[34:00] JEFFREY VIGIL: It was scary. It was really scary. I, out of the. Out of the three schools that I was approached with to open, this was probably the worst one, business plan wise. So I came out here and just. The school wasn't set up like the way I thought it was. We had zero students. So I basically went out there and just grinded footwork. Footwork. I was. For the first two years, I was on the base doing PT every day. Every day I was over there.

[34:33] NAOMI LOVE: What base?

[34:34] JEFFREY VIGIL: Fort bliss. I was all over Fort bliss. Every morning I was somewhere different. I'd get up at 04:00 in the morning, I'd drive over there and these guys walk in the PT and I had all these connections and the base, they would let me set up in a room and I'd have guys, hundreds of soldiers show up and I'd work them out. And just little by little started getting my name out there. And then as I'm doing this, I would see businesses opening and closing everywhere around me. And that was terrifying. That was terrifying. I was like, man, I did not want to fail. Like, I. I just didn't want him to fail. I wanted to prove to my wife, you mean, that I. That I wouldn't fail, you mean? She gave me the opportunity to really try and grow and do something with this. I didn't want to disappoint her. So I would just do everything I can to grind. I'd be out there. Date, I think I put about 3000 flyers on cars just to get out there. I remember one day I was putting flyers at the sea Vista mall, and the security guard came up to me and told me that I wasn't allowed to put the flyers on the car. So I had to go and take all the flyers off. So I was like, okay. I went and got my car and drove away. I wasn't about to do, there was a lot of flyers, but I never did that again. I started going to neighborhoods, and then at that time, also, I had this van that I, when I was in New Mexico, before I, full time jujitsu, I owned a mobile auto glass company. So when I moved over here, I had the van still, and I put a bunch of stickers all over the van. Then I would just go and park the van somewhere and just leave it there. I would leave it, like, in parking lots, and I'd go pick it up at the night. And again with that, people started, would call me, call me, and they show up. And the number one thing people here in El Paso is they wanted to test me. They wanted to see if I was real. So the first two years, I was definitely fighting. Every day I had someone showing up, and I had to have to smash to show them, let them know that I was real. I mean, because just the community in El Paso here is like, it's there. There is. And there was jujitsu here during that time, but it was just. It's basically a guy got a blue belt from one guy, and then, and then he opened a school, and he was running the school on his own. That he was, he never, like, really learned from, like, a legit person, like, like every day, like, going to class every day and having someone legit that he would learn from.

[37:04] NAOMI LOVE: So you are the first, like, legit brazilian jiu jitsu black belt who could trace the lineage of your black belt all the way up to the first. The person who started brazilian jiu jitsu, that was something you need. And then just the culture of the tradition of jiu jitsu is if you want to be a professor, you smash people. You have to actually show them that the martial art works. So, the same way in your first class, you went up against a female that was 115 pounds. Well, this obviously works because there's no way she's beating me if this martial art doesn't work.

[37:45] JEFFREY VIGIL: Yep.

[37:46] NAOMI LOVE: So. And I think that's important of note because you talk about, like, the aggressiveness and the fighting in your earlier life and then taking kind of that same aggressiveness and using it in a different culture and using it to be productive. And I think that just seeing that go full circle and, like, now smashing people for a purpose and, like, they're coming up and they're asking to be smashed, and then they're paying for me. Paying for me to smash them afterwards. Like, that's pretty awesome.

[38:19] JEFFREY VIGIL: It's super cool.

[38:23] NAOMI LOVE: You said that you were offered three schools, and El Paso was, the school wise, the least attractive option. Why'd you pick El Paso?

[38:36] JEFFREY VIGIL: The people, like. Like, I just knew. So. So, like. Like, right now, I'm, like, covered up, so you can't really see. But you see. You know what I mean? With all of my tattoos and the stuff I can. So I. I fit in here. The people here look like me. The tattoos in this area are very familiar to me. They're similar. I grew up in the southwest. This is a southwest city, so it was just so familiar. The people in El Paso call themselves Chucos. I felt that I could be a chuco one day, and I am.

[39:12] NAOMI LOVE: What does chuco mean?

[39:14] JEFFREY VIGIL: It's just. El Paso, Texas. That's just what they call El Paso, is home of the Pachuco. It's like the old school cholos, like, in the forties and fifties. And they started here in the El Paso area. So they. So they shorten pachuco, and they just use chuco. So that's, like, how it started in the El Paso area. And then, just like nowadays, like, everyone says, they're chucos, you know? So I always knew that I would be a chuco one day.

[39:39] NAOMI LOVE: Yeah. There's, like, this beautiful subculture here in the city, and it's something that I think the people that are from here are very proud of because it's something that's kind of like El Paso specific. So being kind of like a binational city, you have people that are from El Paso. You have people that are from Juarez. You have people like me that are from nowhere close to here. I'm from Philadelphia. I'm a long way from home. And it's the Chuco part, right? That's just El Paso. And you see it in the artwork, you see it in the culture, you see it in the cars, and that's something that's very recognizable. When did you start to feel successful?

[40:36] JEFFREY VIGIL: I would say I definitely, like, felt successful in the business part of it, man. He's probably five years into the business. I started seeing the numbers and the results and the people, the door not stopping, revolving. It just kept going. But I really think about it, just like, there's Always something to grow, there's Always something to learn. And I never, like, want to say, I'm successful or I made it. I always want to be like, there's another stair that I got to climb up to. I'm not happy here. I need to climb another stair. I need to climb Another mountain. I need to find another person tougher than me that I could choke just again to just prove that there's always more. Always more. I mean, that's why I think I found that with jiu jitsu so much, just because there's always so much to learn, there's always so much to grow with.

[41:29] NAOMI LOVE: You know, it's interesting, and people won't be able to hear this, but I, like, I have to say it because they can't. They can't see it. When I said, when did you know you were successful? You gave me a look like, I'm not there yet. I said three schools, and I only got two, so I'm not successful yet. And without saying any of that and just seeing that in your eyes, it's like, there's a reason why you're going to have three schools, right? Because of the standard that you set for yourself. We talked about how jujitsu has affected your life and helped you change. And then you put yourself in position to have, what, hundreds, thousands of students?

[42:08] JEFFREY VIGIL: Over hundreds. Hundreds for sure. Over one day. Thousands, but definitely 100 for sure.

[42:16] NAOMI LOVE: A little over a decade. What changes have you seen in your students?

[42:25] JEFFREY VIGIL: I seen so much growth in all of them again. And some of them are coming in no matter what, what background they came from. Like, I've seen changes in all of their lives. Like, all of them. I've seen that, you know, some people come in, or even, for example, just. Just in the jiu jitsu in general, they come in and they can't even do a push up. They can't do a jumping jack. We have this move called the shrimp escape. You know what it is like, people don't even know, can't even move that part of their body, and then within time, they're doing that. We have this exercise where you all, you do just lean back and put your toes to the mat, you know, about the exercise, and there's people that. They can't even bring their toes. They're here, and before I know it, they're crouching over and they're holding themselves there. You've seen growth like that. Growth isn't as in fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters. You mean the way they grow through. And it comes through that jujitsu path. I mean, like, there's, there's, like so many people that they, they say, I tried this, I tried that, I've done this. I don't that. But this is what's really making me change. Like, you know, in all, all different paths, all different walks, it doesn't matter, you know, if it's in the relationship. Like I said, as a father, as a, as a mother, even as a, as a kid yourself, as a student, and it switches everything, the mindset. Cause it's like you can get caught in a bad situation and get hurt or get put to sleep. And that's very humbling. It's very humbling.

[43:54] NAOMI LOVE: It is. And I've been put to sleep by someone much smaller than me. And it's, like, so motivating, right? Like the competition that I was always seeking, I found that in jiu jitsu, in such a healthy outlet, and not just, like, mentally, but also physically, because the chances, like, the injuries are so much smaller than other things that I've enjoyed, like boxing or other striking sports, where I have to worry so much about TBI and things like that, like, just the gentleness of something so violent is very beautiful. Since you started your journey here in El Paso at the black belt level and as a instructor in the owners of school, what's the biggest personal challenge you faced?

[44:44] JEFFREY VIGIL: I say the biggest personal challenge I faced is a few years ago when I had to fight the cancer. That definitely was a different path in life.

[44:54] NAOMI LOVE: Did your lessons from Jiu jitsu help you with that?

[44:57] JEFFREY VIGIL: 100%. Also 100%. The mental toughness that they gave me, like, like, I never will forget the day that the doctor told me that I had cancer, I literally stood up and told the doctor, now I know what I got to do to win. I mean, at first I had no idea what was wrong with me. I had all these, all these things are going on with me, all these symptoms. I had no idea, and they told me what I had. I got up and I was like, yeah, I'm gonna kick its ass. Instead of doing what a lot of people do. And they tell you that you have the big circumental. They go down. They go down right there. And I did it. I just knew, okay, now I know what I got to do. And that came from Jiu jitsu. Even my wife says that if you wouldn't have never made it to the black belt, you wouldn't have taken it like that. My thought would have been different. I may have still killed it the way I did, but it wouldn't have been as easy. I made it look pretty easy the way I did. I don't think anybody has ever gained 30 pounds during chemotherapy. I'm, like, one of a handful.

[46:01] NAOMI LOVE: How long have you been training jiu jitsu?

[46:03] JEFFREY VIGIL: I've been training jiu jitsu going on a little over 21 years.

[46:06] NAOMI LOVE: 21 years. That's a long time. And just the perseverance to stick with something that's so physically demanding and as our bodies get older and still show up and still try to smash people, I know for me, having much more recently than you've been a white belt and just that first six months of trying to show up every day and be consistent and just knowing that I'm going to get smashed, knowing that I'm going to get beat up, not physically, but just dominated and wanting to come back and just knowing that I could do it. And I just feel like that part of the sport just makes you believe in yourself so much more. It makes you believe in your testicular fortitude or your ovarian fortitude to just be able to keep coming back and take more and know that you can deal with it and grow and find your areas of growth in challenging situations.

[47:11] JEFFREY VIGIL: Definitely, yes, for sure. I mean, it's definitely. It creates a mindset like no other. I mean, for everything you're saying, you're knowing, you know, you pull up into that parking lot and you see cars that belong to people, that just make your life miserable, but just say, let's go. Yeah, let's go. Because I can guarantee, I can promise you it's gonna change. It's gonna change no matter how hard it is. Eventually you'll move down the line and you'll become one of the big dogs. Eventually.

[47:44] NAOMI LOVE: And if there's anything that we all need, it's change and growth. I really appreciate you taking time to sit down and share about your story.

[47:54] JEFFREY VIGIL: Marcus, thank you very much. I appreciate you also for inviting me, and it was a great conversation.