Joel Larsen and Jennifer Larsen

00:07 My name is Jennifer Larson. I'm 42 and 1/2 and its August 12th. 2006 were in Burlington Vermont and I'm here to hear some stories from my father.

00:22 I am Joe Larson. It's Joel in the last name is Larsen and my age is very close to 77. Today's date is August 12th, 2006. Where in Burlington Vermont and I'm being interviewed by my daughter Jennifer.

00:45 I didn't realize you were that all so you said you were you're almost 77. Is there a reason for that is because my birthday will be in 2 weeks on what day the 1st of September.

01:04 UPS

01:08 So what can you tell me that where were you born born Ogden Utah and 1929 and I have to be Hospital in Ogden Utah where I have a sister you're older and a sister. You're younger. So all three of us were born there. My mother was 19 when I was in far as she was only eighteen when I was smart. And so by the time she was 20 shed three children at that point 3-2 in one and so are reserved for I guess we've gone and I we live there and we live with my grandfather. This was my father's father. And then later on we moved in with my mother's father and where the macleans where you living on a farm with your did your father's parents live on an alarm. We lived in in a town. I thought it was a big toe.

02:08 Until I came back to it when I was about 20 years old and I thought it was a funeral long walk but turned out I could walk from one end of the Town together in 15 minutes. So it wasn't as big as I thought it was when I was young and both his parents were deaf you my father's parents from scarlet fever. Yeah. That was my grandmother and my grandfather had measles and so they were both deaf and they he worked in a deaf school. There are not and Todd Carpenter and he was a skilled Carpenter and they my father didn't

02:54 Well, they had very little guidance or very little Direction. So when he was 16, he quit school and there went down to California to work. So we worked in.

03:05 Anyways working for the rail run down in California doing repairs. Not a big thing on the run during repairs on engines. So he got injured that is one of the piece of equipment fell on his hand and he was injured so it in the Redwood could employ him at that particular point so they gave me free real to go back to Ogden and on coming up through Salt Lake and then into Ogden Gardens about 30 miles north of Salt Lake City. And so he got on the what they called in those days the bamberger. It was a single train the ran between the two cities and the store we picked up a newspaper off the seat and read of the death of his mother the train while he was on the train and because she got appendicitis and

04:00 Sperry usual in Utah the church ladies took care of her, but they couldn't talk to her because she was definitely so they never understood what I was wrong with their hands or appendix burst and she died from it. So that left my grandfather by himself and Hrithik except the three of us lost my mother and father staying there. This was 1929 and it was a very very difficult time, of course with the depression. So my father had two goals in mind one is education in a totally believed in education, even though at this particular point. It did not reach high school degree. So he

04:51 Went to school and learn stano typing which is for the court reporters the small machine that did he learn bookkeeping he worked in the bank. He dug ditches. I worked on the streetcars. It worked on the railroad. It would take whatever job he could find so he was often away from home or working long hours so that I left my mother with the three children that led you all to live in some very interesting places didn't it will not until my father in his process of Education decided to take a civil service exam and they're still the biggest employer in the world. And so we took a civil service exam and got offered a job in Yellowstone Park, so he would left my mother with staying with her parents and he went off to Yellowstone Park to go to work and he was there for six months before he was able to finance.

05:51 My mother and the three children's movement to Yellowstone Park. So I was five years old when we moved Yellowstone. We got on the train rode the train up to I think it was Billings Montana and they and then my father borrowed a car. He didn't have a car in those days. He borrowed a car and drove the car down to Billings to pick us up at the railroad station. My Christ is Transworld is automatically on time in those days and this happened to be middle of winter. So Mom didn't have a place to stay and they finally arranged for her and her three children at least a crime that story she chose to stay overnight in the only place. They can find to stay with a house of prostitution. So there's my mother and three children staying in the house of prostitution in Billings Montana. So my father bought a car drove down and on the way back boat ramp to the park the

06:51 He's driving headlights on and there's a moose in the middle of the road. That's not ready yet unusual thing in Yellowstone, but the most to look at him and my father took a look at the most and the most sat down on the fender. So his the area has a borrowed car that he's returning with a damaged fender.

07:14 We lived in Yellowstone for 5 years. It's was a very unusual existence is for our children are concerned that we had their there is not a city. We lived in the headquarters, which is my mother. So the parents got together and hired a school teacher and the other night you'd have to leave the park to go to school. And so they hired a school teacher name is Miss. Right? And so she came and the National Park Service provided a room for the school. It was there were nine children in it. As far as I remember. And of course, I have a sister older sister younger. So we made up one-third of the school. And as I tell the story they

08:05 I when we got chicken pox. They closed the school think is one third as a school night classes are out. Now we live there and I never remember it ever being cold as far as a child is concerned. Wait, I wasn't sad. I think now of course we were only I'll probably 50 yards from the back door of our house into the school system. Now they and I remember I was in fourth grade and they were there was one other child are his name was Lewis Howard and Lou and I only reason I remember is cuz Joe Louis and it was not remedies first name because of Joe lowest was a boxer at that particular point of time, but we after fourth grade are you had to transfer out of the school system. So my father started looking for another job and again, he's looking through civil service.

09:03 So he applied and got a job and Rawlins, Wyoming which is in the center of Wyoming down at the bottom estate just across the border from Colorado.

09:15 All his

09:17 Job was with a grazing service which contract land for cattle people to go and use the government land for grazing their cattle. It's really open range in in Wyoming. There are no people there just their cattle in Antelope. Those are the two things there that was good until the war came along and a my father was not getting drafted because in Rawlins while we were there they had two more children. So I have a sister that is exactly 10 years younger than I am not exactly 10 years younger and I have a brother that is 11 years younger. So now we got five children. So at that point the Draft rules where they didn't draft somebody with five children so a my father didn't get drafted, but now I kind of lost in the war and what are you going to do? Will he continue with the government?

10:17 And apply for a job at 2 with the war relocation Authority and skulls WRA. And this was the agency that the government set up to move the Japanese from the West Coast into the mid middle of the country away from the coastline and they set up a

10:43 Area called Heart Mountain and Heart Mountain was in the desert of Wyoming. The only thing out there was Sagebrush and so they we didn't live there at Heart Mountain. This is why they put the Japanese but it was 15 miles from Cody Wyoming and 15 miles from Powell, Wyoming to is halfway in between these two are the Japanese were interned. I mean, they were there this I don't know if you called prisoners or not, but they weren't allowed out except where things some of them volunteer for the service and went into the army and served over in Italy. They also had quite a few activities, but what they lived in where barracks and they have the multi families in it and a Barracks never spent 20 of these Barak type houses out there.

11:41 I was out there two or three times. I went out with the Boy Scouts. I was in the Boy Scouts in Powell, Wyoming. And so and they also had the Boy Scouts at Heart Mountain a formed a drum and bugle Corps Japanese drum and bugle Corps, which was fantastic. One of my fond memories of the place is went out there. I'm sitting with these Boy Scouts and they bring out a bowl of rice while it was just plain rice. It was nothing else and the Japanese get said to me since he says I've heard other people have raisins and milk with rice and that's the way I usually had it but I didn't say anything because right reister's them their main dish now because we're renting a house and Powell you first went there.

12:33 My parents found a better house after years staying in Powell, Wyoming and then they moved to Cody Wyoming. Well, this was Major upset for my sister who is a year older cuz now she's in high school and tree it was her freshman year. Was it powwow me? And then we moved in her sophomore year was a Cody, Wyoming. Well, the two high schools had a bitter rivalry and my sister never accepted this whole thing and rebelled against it for the rest of her life. So but we went to Cody Wyoming and of course now comes as the war continues on to things were happening. When is a war round down my father continue with a war relocation and he was

13:26 Given a job to disband all the camps. They were all over the west states in California like a memory, Arizona. They were camps all as long as they are away from the coast. So he worked at that. I would think probably a year traveling around these camps and closing them up and and selling whatever is necessary to be sold in that type of thing. So typical what do you do at that particular Point still a big big government that what's the newest thing in the government its atomic energy. So my father decide applying got a job with atomic energy commission. Well now we come to a big move cuz now a Tomic energy is located in downtown Washington in the Old Navy building which is better built in the world war one and of course all agencies have to find their own location. So we applied for the job and got the job and I don't have any idea what

14:26 His job was but it was accounting type of things accounting and budget work for the government now during this. Of time while we were in school and we left our one-room schoolhouse. We went to Rawlins, Wyoming and you think well going through a one-room schoolhouse, it may hinder your education and when we got to Rawlins, Wyoming my older sister Nancy and my younger sister Carol and myself were all entered in the school in Rawlins, Wyoming and that year all three of us were the top of our class. So the one room School houses is an excellent education.

15:13 Sony on now, we're leaving Cody Wyoming that is taking a job in Washington DC. And this was 1945. I think it's just about the end of the war and atomic energy act courses the noise thing going. So at this point now my father has a car. I know it's for many years. We didn't have a car. Did you drive from Wyoming to Washington? We there were five of us for my gosh and a regular what we call a regular car today. It was a four-door in with two seats now. Luckily. The front seat was a bench seat out buckets in and so my mother and father my father did all the driving wherever in the front seat and there were five of us in the backseat except we drew lots and one of us was able to sit in the middle in front and we had a good seat or backseat.

16:13 Nervous. You got to say good morning went so then we had a small child's chair in the back. So three of his son on the back seat and one of his sat on the child's chair and we would all rotate through now are we traveled from Cody, Wyoming and went through? I don't remember all the trip, except I do remember Missouri and I was always fascinated the of the new things that I never seen before now, it's a well here I am Lucy. I was probably 14 by this point.

16:54 They knew things that I noticed two things are different from the West in the East one more brick streets. I never seen a Brick Street in my life until we hit misery and that we had been there all kinds of brick and stone streets think why would people do this second thing I noticed was angle parking in the west. Everything was angle parking and when we got the Missouri, everything was parallel parking that is the streets weren't wide enough to do regular parking. The other thing I missed probably more than anything where the alleys and wearing in the west. You always got in the middle of your block. You got an hour between the houses on one street and I was on another again back and that's where the garbage was. That's how you got to your garage and things like that before you get back. He's no such things as allies. I mean if you have allergies people build on them.

17:52 Let me go back a minute because they just do a little bit of work experience before we had, Washington.

18:03 My first job was

18:07 Selling newspapers at liberty cap, which is in the middle of Yellowstone Park Mammoth, and I was I sold them from these papers to the chores. They came up there in the summer time. So the Billings Gazette and I was 8 years old at that particular point and that was my first job. I worked from that's as I say my first job and I worked from that point on it was never anything in my life. It was such a thing as an allowance. I've never heard of an allowance that is if I wanted money I work for it. And so the other things I did were as we got to Rawlins, Wyoming. I did a newspaper route around the town and then we got to Powell and Cody Wyoming does empowering. I got a job with a baker and he was opening a store and downtown and he wanted somebody to the bacon will I would go in at 4 in the morning and fry donuts.

19:07 I was probably at 11 at that point and he taught me to drive the car that he had to deliver things. But I'd work till about 8 or 9 in the morning and then pick up a couple loaves of bread that was just fresh out of the oven and take him with me home and but the guy wanted me to quit school and become a baker. For some reason I didn't I don't know if I think part of it to go back to the beginning. There's my father had a great great belief in education and he himself took courses with a correspondence.

19:47 School call LaSalle Institute out of Philadelphia and he was always taking these courses. So every time he came up for another job. He was ahead and able to add to his resume that here are new courses. He's taking his things that he has done and he indoctrinated those kids to be the same way. I mean, we we worked and we got educated. Those are the things we did.

20:12 So we could we drove across the country now strangely at that particular point.

20:20 This was right. The end of War. There was no housing Washington DC at the beginning of the war in 1941 just exploded and so everybody moved in though. There's a military the civilians all thing all war effort. I got pushed a lot of people into Washington DC. So they were these lot of people there's no place to live. So we drove into Washington DC. My father called up his friend Joe Brent and Joe says and my father said to Joyce's we're in town. We looked around to find someplace we can just as well. Come on live with us when that Joe brand and his wife live about 20 miles outside of Washington in Maryland towards Annapolis, and they had a small house that do children's are there were four. I'm in the house now and the seven of us moved in with at 4, and we moved into this house.

21:20 Washington well media thing to do was where do you go to school with an hour in Maryland? So are we go to the nearest for some reason? I don't really know the things the district schools are better than the American schools. So we went to the district to go to school. I was a nice older sister and myself started in the high school there and we we were far enough out of the city that the only transportation to getting back and forth. The home was Greyhound bus the Greyhound bus was going to Annapolis and it would pick us up. There was our school was on the main thoroughfare going towards Annapolis so we could wave it down in the evening and take it and then go into school or back and forth from school when I tell her I learned to hitchhike and so I was let's see, how old was probably 14 15 something and

22:20 They then that's because that's the way the transportation ran it that particular one. So my father and his

22:31 Planning or is he found a lot to build a house in Arlington, Virginia and a place called Dominion Hills. So he contracted on where you got the money from Buddy. He contracted to get this house built. It was in development.

22:50 And it was so far out of Washington on the other side in the Virginia side that again there was no transportation. That is the bus line ended approximately two miles from where we lived this whole area now has been hugely developed with shopping malls and many many many houses at this point. So we moved from the branch house out to here while I was in school over the other side. So I stayed in that schooling and I headed for graduation at that particular point.

23:27 But how do I get there around my father drove into the City and so he would drive in the city and let me out I would get on the streetcar that we call them.

23:40 In Washington and ride the streetcar in to Washington now typically well, how am I going to get home? Well, that was my own problem that is learn to ride the streetcars and I learned all sorts of tricks on me know of that is all I got to know all the streetcar lines where they went and how to ride them on Student Bus tickets for a nickel or something like that. So I got to know all the buses in the street cars are on the Run Washington, but I still had to get from out of Washington out to this place at the end of the line by the bus has been running all night, but a lot of nights I would end up getting back home at 10 or 11 at night. I mean after going to school and now checking I knew nobody that is the school I went to is typical of high school where you've got

24:36 Three or four junior high schools in elementary schools are feeding into the same high school. So all the kids do each other. I didn't know any of these kids and which brings back another little piece to my life as let's go back to where I was in 4th grade Will Lewis Howard and I were in fourth grade.

24:55 Is it back of Yellowstone back in Yellowstone? Let's see. Do we play football? I had never seen a football in my life. Do we spend just two of us? There wasn't much can't get much of a team going no professional teams in like the Yankees or wherever they were a giant. We didn't pay attention to sports at all even within the newspaper. We don't we can get newspapers or my father was never an athlete or anything like that. So they I do remember is Luis and I never would never played with a ball at all. I just wasn't the thing we did so I get back to Washington and one kid says, we'll come on out to my house. I was living in a row 5 miles away or something like that and we started playing catch. I've never caught a box. I'm in 15 years old. I'd never caught a ball in my life that I ever remember and I couldn't catch it now. So I mean it

25:55 So it wasn't something to turn me on but it always also pointed out how

26:01 Sheltered and different a life that I had lived. Second thing is I think my father was very much for education. But my father gave us zero counseling. I only remember one piece of advice and all the time I did but he was my father he used to when I was a senior in high school. He'd let me take the car and I could have the car all day. So I drove into school and I know how he got back to first. Let me take the car. So senior year. I had the car quite a bit and at that point he gave me the one piece of advice. He said I don't care what time you come home. He says he says as long as the car is in the driveway at 11:00 at night. That was the only requirement that I ever had.

26:53 It was it was really a different existence. Of course Washington was a very bustling City in that point.

27:03 But again, I had the experiences that I have never ran into before one was black people. There were no black people in Wyoming. They just did not because anybody was against when they didn't I just didn't live there much is a Vermont is today almost so when I get back to Washington, well Washington was probably a 1/3 black but that point haha. That is I never saw a black person evening Washington. Why because they had 16 high schools in Washington DC and a time when writing a term or black total segregation and more segregation. Then you didn't find in a southern city because not only

27:49 They were segregated by the school system, but there's segregated where they live where they worked and what they could do so 7th Avenue with all black so you never went there and you wouldn't ride that streetcar. There was this kind of the rules for the game, but there was that was a lesson I had to learn cuz I didn't mean anything to me and these other kids had all been brought up with the blocks, but you could go almost any place in Washington using all blacks at. All right after the war I think it was Truman or one of the president's The Truman did the military the blacks in the military, but at that point the federal government started hiring blocks and no they became very good jobs for the black people. And of course in those days are gone colored, but I mean it. They were good jobs. So the federal government today has a large population of federal employees that are black they poured in from the south.

28:49 Turn from their farms and some of the factories, but they

28:54 So today they still have 16 high schools in Washington and they have 16 black high schools. They all the white kids have moved out of the center of the city. Can I interrupting get you to tell about when you hitchhiked from DC to New York City on VJ Day got to hitchhike in because when we lived out towards the nose called Bethesda.

29:25 Waynesburg, sorry Bladensburg towards Annapolis that I hitchhike home a lot. And then as I got into Virginia, I still hitchhike home in the middle of the night and I didn't and I could hitchhike any place. I found it was a very simple way to get around in those days. It was great feasible. So when V-J Day came, which I think was in September 45, I think.

29:53 Came home after School's Out Buckeye schools out. They so are you do well, I did everything to take them to do. So, I think somehow or another I went contacted my mother and told my mother that I'm going to hitchhike to New York City. And again, my mother's got four other kids to take care of and there was never any direct descendants you got and it's so my mother if my father never give me any advice. My mother gave us last letter couldn't she never told me what I could or couldn't do so I got out on the road and hitchhiked and I tried to Baltimore and and then up to Philadelphia than expressways didn't exist at that point and then went into New York. Now I had enough money. I had jobs I had money. I always had money and so I got New York.

30:53 Bumblebee into staying at the YMCA call the Sloan house and I think you could stay for about $3 a night or something like that. So I went got a room at this loan out. I walked around New York City. I had a wonderful time and I don't know what you know, I just thought well, I've seen the city on my own without any involvement. It's alright hitchhike out of the city through the Lincoln Tunnel get out the Lincoln Tunnel via that the New Jersey side of the Lincoln Tunnel. I'm hitchhiking and there was a chauffeured limousine stops and he said where you going I am going to Washington DC. I'm going to Atlantic City. As soon as I said, would you like to go there? I said what I've never been writing City I think would be great. So I I got a ride down to Atlantic City started hitchhiking from them to Washington. I must have been gone probably 10 days.

31:47 But it was always like I had checked all over even when I was in college. Well little bit better one was when they my last year of high school. They had very good friends and their parents were paying for him to go to Florida for spring vacation. And the I thought that was a good idea. They were going to take the bus down there. So I said why don't you go to so I came home talk to my father. He said he said I can't afford a bus to he said, I'll tell you what I'll do I'll give you $25 and you can go any place you want.

32:24 So I got to my friend of mine. It was in The Print Shop by Prince up signs going south going north, you know, it all kinds of cities everything. So this other guy in high hitchhike from Washington DC down to Miami, Florida and we still got just $25. We stayed in bus stations and train stations and every place like it's written care where we were and I we got down there we would go all-you-can-eat spaghetti we found this place. Well, that's our meal for the day right now for summer. I don't know how it went. We never did we even went to that alligator wrestling thing. We pay for something we go get we go get one and only with each other two guys and take the bus down and the two of us and hitchhike. So we stayed down there for about a week and then I hitchhike back I get into Richmond, Virginia and I

33:24 Add I'm at that point if I remember right a dime you could make a phone call. And so I didn't want them. I could make a phone call from Richmond. So I decided that it would continue on to Washington and just making it kind of thing. I use the time to call my parents and worst and say I'm in downtown Washington. This is my last dime. Can you pick me up and I did I never said yes. No, I'm not. I'm not movie on jump in the head in your life and now and ask you about when you met mom and how you knew that she was the one.

34:07 Nobody knows that.

34:09 She and I met through a another naval officer that died when I was in the Navy that he came into town and my mother at a wedding, but I was supposed to go but I didn't go to weddings in those days. I was working Chemical Bank at that point. So he said he'll meet me in the city that he was working in Poughkeepsie. So he's so I'll meet you guys is fine. I get off work five. He says well, I probably won't be in the city until maybe 9 maybe even 10. So I found a bar told my meeting there and it was about 11 or 12 when he showed up and I was pretty well Hanging On by my fingernails with that particular Twilight. So we had a few more drinks now, it's 2 in the morning and he says I met a girl that lives here in the city when we call her up and see if I can have breakfast 2:00 in the morning so he called up.

35:09 And so can we come over for breakfast? He says he will Bryce we bought some eggs and some bread and went up in the Dan Judy got up and cook breakfast for that's the first thing. I know I have a contact in the city, right? Well Pete has to go back to Poughkeepsie and we were doing a regular thing Friday Nights from where I work with all get together bunch of guys get together on Friday night. So it's so happened. When I first met your mother were five Friday nights within two weeks. You wouldn't believe it if it was Armistice Day of election day and we are holiday here in off as we are not every night Friday night for two weeks. I went down to the pain Cornell game and Philadelphia and then we're coming back and by this time I was broke. I was always broke and I told I told your mother I'd spent all my money on her on the way.

36:09 And so she would loan me enough money on Monday. So coming back up on the train. I had no place to go and no money. She said wants to stay on the train with me and come up to keep her up to Natick Massachusetts. I said, I sounds like a pretty good idea. So we did that's what I'm trying for. That was November there was Thanksgiving and then we dated, you know, probably four nights a week at that point until probably end of know, it's later than that in December sometime. So one night after turn bars and having a fun New Year. We did really enjoy New York. They were sitting on the front steps to her place and my question was what would you think about getting married?

37:02 I was mistake all hell broke loose at that point decline to three flights of stairs wakes her two roommates and ounces that we're getting married. And from then on I was out of control what she says that she said back to you. Are you asking me if you're if we want to get married. So at that point we got married on June 2nd in 1956 and I want to ask you about one more thing is we only have a couple minutes and now and so this one's about Peter and it's 33 years ago our family experienced the death of Peter from cancer when he was 14 years old and he was the oldest of the three kids in our family my only brother your only son in the first child in the whole experience of his illness and death is one of the most formative events in my life and I want to know what that loss was like for you it was horrible. I'm in the course. We had two daughters at the same time and I was working full time. So the and so red the bird and Bee.

38:02 With your mother ready to take care of Peter. I mean that is two things in taken care of when he was home one thing and then was in the hospital the other but we did a lot of commuting back and forth to New York to the because you were Sloan-Kettering hospital and most of Burden fell on Judy, but they I was working for the Boy Scouts at that particular point and they gave me almost unlimited freedom to be our way in and things like that, but it was

38:37 Not only a tragedy of his death but also a tragedy of with Judy with the two daughters. Everybody was so involved that you know, is it really hard to keep all of us saying almost done because we were really an effect on the road all the time. We were doing something connected with us, but it only lasted for a short time and then it was like everything's activates but it was only like three months three months and like that and so we got an awful lot of support from the church. We have an awful lot of support from that Community, which I've always been very thankful. But as you know, your mother is the key to it. She makes friends and very good friends wherever we go. So it's always been which has been a wonderful thing for us.

39:35 And I I guess I want to just how much more time do we have just that?

39:42 I guess it's their well, what how would you describe what the most important lessons are that you've learned in life. You've had a lot of experiences obviously.

39:57 Most important lessons

40:03 As I told you I got no counseling when I stepped off the train and Cornell University. There was the first college I've ever seen. I had never seen another calling neither. My parents have been to college and I got no counseling us as such a what I should be looking for. And what I shouldn't be looking for 4 years of college for me was waste of time. I was having a ball and I did I had a wonderful time wherever I went. I had a wonderful time and just that was my life. I've always done that but the counseling

40:42 Is so important and it's got to start early. That's the thing but I never had that is in our day. We didn't have high school counselors. It wasn't such a position and I didn't have parent counselors that they didn't do that and but I had no guidance and so everything I did had to be stumbling Along on her own and I'm pretty well independently is when I was out of the Navy and I'm looking for a job. I had dropped in the middle of New York and New nobody so it's up to me to find things and do so counseling I find would be the thing that is really needed an important in life. I think secondly, I wouldn't let anybody into college at age 17. What year was I would put them in the service for 2 years oldest daughter went to college at age 17

41:41 My mistake I do find that it's so important. And so I thought of a my Independence has caused me all the problems in the world and I can go anywhere and do anything and I don't depend upon anybody else which is a very poor thing in life in a way. So it has to be before we close. Is there anything else we didn't talk about that? You want to add more time?

42:18 I wanted to ask you one more thing in this as your youngest daughter. I came out as a lesbian over 23 years ago, and I wanted to know how being the father of a lesbian is changed your view of the world. Well, it just like everything else is new experience for me. So I've never had any experience with with gay lesbian anything. So that's a whole new thing for me. I'm very proud of my daughter because she's gone through this and done it and then on her own and then again through tough. I think it'd be easier today than it was five years ago when you started and then I don't know start. I don't know if there's any particular day or me. Anyting is not like me asking your mother to marry. It doesn't happen it is

43:07 You handle a very very well and we're very proud of you. It's not a man. That hasn't been a problem. In fact both Judy and I think you are.

43:17 Turn thing at the right time. I'm going to call a gay supporters at this particular point. That is we understand and we hope at least and no question. It's difficult. But we everybody where we live understand that we have a gay daughter and she has a partner and nobody said and it turns out nowadays. Well, that's interesting because I have the same thing. We have probably my guess is a relative closer relative of 250 people. We probably have 30 to 40 of them that have gay daughter's son's nothing like the world is changing and I think it's good for the good ending is women's lib. I think we don't we

44:06 Current work ahead and go backwards and jerk ahead and go back with that is make it right or wrong, but I'm very much in favor women's lib. I'm very much in favor of gay marriage. I think it's the best thing around the world. Isn't that way? So in fact when I was at the fair the other day, I signed a petition for a department of peace. I was a great. Well, I hope I can learn with it. Thank you so much for being willing to come out and do this with me. That was the intent.