Timm Mettler and David Bewley

00:05 My name is David Malcolm bewley. I am 56 years old today's date is December 14th 2008 where in Tampa Florida and I am a teacher Mentor Father Figure. Copy. And friend to my partner here.

00:24 My name is Timothy Aaron Butler. My age of 26 today's date is December 14th. 2008 location is Tampa, Florida and relationship to my partner is teacher Mentor confidence fellow artists and

00:46 All the Above

00:51 Okay, we're talkin because Tim and I have an unusual relationship that's been talked about a little bit and I we thought we would share our journey together 10 years ago. I was Tim's teacher in an art history class and he drove me absolutely crazy. We didn't hit it off right away immediately, but now we're bonded and he's kind of like a member of my family as a result of our interaction with the years. Basically we've been on a journey of two artists. We began a conversation about art 10 years ago. We still are having that conversation. In fact, before we arrive tonight. We were talking about Tim's latest painting I start out at his teacher that turn into a mentoring relationship. Once he graduated from high school, upon the death of his father. He asked if I would to fill part of the role of needing a kind of a male role model and we've kept in touch over the years to riding in

01:51 To Arden through many conversations

01:56 These are all absolutely true things.

02:03 One of the things I think that is important to know is that

02:08 We've been talking about the same subject for 10 years, even though we've been separated by continents and thousands of miles and lots of time are the conversation began with questions. He asked in an art history class. They continued as he developed as a painter and one of the things I realize is that Tim is not necessarily the brightest student I've ever taught or the most talented student I've ever taught but he is the student and which I see evidence of great creative genius, especially in his numerous sketch books and journals and other documentation that he has of his journey to the art world.

02:58 You want to talk about how you just messing with? Ya I guess I do.

03:06 Well, I don't know how to begin if this is me getting a little.

03:11 Nostalgic little frightened arnaud

03:19 Started off a long time ago long time ago. I can't remember the date.

03:29 I don't remember too much about high school like you sent him a lot about high school, but it comes and goes there are some pretty incredible things about about their history class.

03:40 I remember that day. I almost have him a skateboard with me and remember like you're fidgeting all the time in class and then the confrontation.

03:50 Intake tub didn't seem like it's weird to think I found that I didn't seem like it was like I was I don't I'm so big now. I don't really see the word that can be free to an incident that happened in our class. So I'm kind of embarrassed to talk about it in one way and another way that it's sort of funny. He did bring a skateboard to class. He was sitting in class and kind of making a disturbance in it. Swerve got to the point where I had to give him a warning and he sort of challenged me and what happened the definitely had well, I was just I was being bullheaded and I wouldn't stop being annoying and he told me to stop and

04:36 You said make me send me pictures of you and your desk up and took you to the door and took you out into the hallway. And I spoke with you for a few minutes instead. Please give me 5 minutes to finish my class and then we'll talk and I think that that's where the talking began was that Dad solutely certainly seems like just been one large continuation of just all these talking's connecting and cuz I have to honestly admit I had to be completely on.

05:05 Lately, I've lost myself in. I don't know how you spell so different after that day with some of the weird feeling.

05:12 Well, I think that that part of it was that I really obviously cared about you and I think that I tried to show that even though I was in this kind of upset state of mind because I was really bothered that you wouldn't give me the respect to let me finish what I was trying to make a point of in the classroom and when we started talking about that suddenly, we sort of had this connection between us that we've kept the whole time. It wasn't just that a teacher and a student. It was like two people trying to understand each other and I trying to work out a problem and we had a great vehicle for because we haven't we had art and yet I think that was the first time I ever looked at one of your sketchbooks. I was trying to find out any more about you is very early in the school term and I was stunned by what I saw on your books the great sense of this creative mine, eternally erupting out these ideas hundreds of them at a time when most students could barely

06:12 The one assignment to do each week and one of the great things I think about about how it all began was was in that particular kind of supportive framework of the school system that kind of placard in this idea of of having a particular mentor and a very I have a say those were real person classes. I mean the way that they were set up and partitions and even help teachers kind of worked with the students cuz there's a lot of intimate feedback. The one went on one on one and sometimes people mashed and sometimes people, you know and braced it and sometimes feel pushed away, but I thought it was particularly interesting. Is that the next year? I think it went right into your class. So it wasn't until I think semester to Summertime to write to your classes. So there was really that that was started office, but I think they're from the friendship was the Embrace of just awareness of the space. That one needs are to grow. I thought that like having a perception is this is one of the one of the reasons why I think that it's continue

07:12 And has gone for so long until the reasons why I I I I I always come back that's for sure. You've always said that's one of the things I think that helped cement. The relationship is that you kept returning even after I was no longer your teacher your senior year in a school for the Arts where they were small classes in the focus was on the Fine Arts. You still would come back to me for critiques. You come back to me to borrow books, which I think you're still doing. I think it's in here and I have a help make your library larger continuing alive when I move to the condo to cuz we developed a relationship where we did was we would send postcards back and forth to each other so we can switch it up a notch me changed it specifically from mentoring one-on-one and in the chili in the studio setting to

08:12 What does that mean water smell one more removed. I'm not intangible but like ideas of how to work and things were happening in my mind to you and you would turn around and encouraged me to other work in a different way or see something else or go see an art show or just so there was Rosa Parks a male that went back and forth and I think that that was like ping pong balls idea of circling back to the idea of growing up the mentorship. I think was also really important. I think I have a good quote to one of the guidance counselors at the school for the Arts said to me one time you don't get to choose who you meant or sometimes they choose you to be their mentor and I think that in the situation that was very very true. I don't think that I would have sole

09:12 Did you the first day that I met you but at the same time, it seems it seems inevitable that our paths and Lacrosse but that all of our webs got tangled up in together and dad that we would that we that we have stayed in each other's lives for 4 this whole 10 years makes me wonder if because I'll just straight-up openly admit that that whenever artists were very close to each other their their what was important to them or their style or their issues. They're dressing kind of rub off even if it's not intent intentionally and I wonder if you'd be interested in car painting sex with each other to see kind of similarities and color palette menace to the composition is color palette. The other thing that I think is interesting is that you've convinced me to experiment with painting. I just am watching cuz I was more of a 3D kind of guy working with sculpture haha working three-dimensionally and you know from the Tinder conversation about painting that I've had.

10:12 Now that I retired I'm pursuing painting in my own and I think would be interesting to see the work together cuz I know that that what happened basically is we we build a community of artists. Yeah, it's not just us it's their other individuals are not necessarily geographically in the same place, but there are still corresponding with others. There is ice more than just a two-way conversation at this point is to become Liz Webb people who are creative another way fans disciplinary Riders exactly exactly exactly really good cooks and I think the I think another another important part of our journey has been

11:12 Me tired of being a guide for you and introduce you to people that would help you go on with your artistic career and expand at introducing you two people who could help you with your talents take you for the places that I couldn't take you that's getting you back in the college and focused on your part of the family. Is that what it is just being wet in a certain groups, but I want to come groups. It seems too impersonal. Just exactly it's bad for the pocket. It's being loaded into that type of people fantastic. I think of Clans of people we are running down the hill if you want to talk about also all your first are showing the suspect. Oh, yeah. Well weird.

12:12 That was suppose you trying to work out the back of paintings that were in that show. We're done. I'll guess I should we talk about it almost like the same and talk about this. Okay, so the name of the show with call the shape of space to come and it was at the studio at 6:20 about 1 year and go home at 6 21st Avenue South St. Petersburg, Florida, and it was my first real solo show and there is an incredible amount of work for it and there wasn't an incredible amount of flushing out how that work would kind of congeal within the space. Although the work has been started almost was that 2007 was number 14th 2011 yet and it wasn't so much work that we was really as you're cutting it down. I'm going to remember something how many paintings there were but

13:04 Geez, I calculate it one time. It was like it was like 50 something and it wasn't working because that was very impressed that you sold the majority of the canvases almost all of the larger ones. In fact about that. Is that because because that happened I think that that but my idea of how people people look at his kind of changed a little bit what I think is important because that's something that said right back into the cycle of our artistic roundabouts are Gracenote just are socially striking a chord between two of us consistently, you know, I'm because I mean we frequently have conversations about painting and the penis in history. I can't think of any of them on top of my head right now cuz I'm a little talking about it, but

14:01 Water bath. Can I think of someone that is absolutely absolutely or thinking about Howard Hodgkin that's also another one American and Englishmen. But yeah, that was really successful which enabled me to make more work is matter of fact, which knows our recycling in for that sure is kind of like your curator and you're the only person in the studio singing Timmy must get more work done. Absolutely much are some of the stuff that happened over the course of like four years has a four-year it for your country had and they ended up with these incredible Works in a in your show as an emerging artists very successful not like commercially, but I think aesthetically and I think that we worked as a team the United Tire time the entire time is very close collaboration almost in fact, I kept a journal of it.

15:01 And said that you would look at it see how much how much work you actually did to put the show together it would ya The Daily Journal of everything we did for the Show Fez initial conversation with bottom. That is a pretty incredible piece of artwork, by the way to stop by itself think I was inspired by you. I think I have in fact a couple of times shown at the certain select people people that I knew would understand exactly what kind of time and energy and spirit actually goes into making such an interesting. I was just weren't home, but I really shouldn't use the word Tome but it's this huge archive and they're all just so wonderfully bound. It's come to your talk to yours twice. I think I've told you this the end, it's it just an actual Incredible Journey II.

15:51 Has sometimes has a hard time looking at it. It's that I've been that one. That one was pretty credible. The one the one that really strikes me is the one that you made after I brought you that large sack of almost the end and in the end a 10-piece had just a photo envelope that had some gloves stuff and it was just the most brilliantly made book because there was no regard for the actual C&S of the of the of the of the things that you bounce together. It was just they were all patients anything that you found was Pages. It was it was it was such an interactive thing and I think that was always been that way. It's almost like you in like touching from a distance that kind of been tried in between there's an intangible quality to add something to a simmer all about objects that artist collecting Tim brought to my classroom one day a box of things. He couldn't part with when he was leaving for Chicago. He didn't he just couldn't part with them so he thought

16:51 I would make good use of them in what it is that put them together into a book for him. And I didn't know what Memories the objects had for him or why he collected them or why he responded to them but I put them together with my own kind of aesthetic and then gave it to him the next time I saw him to kind of let him know that he was still in my thoughts. And you know, I wanted to document kind of his journey as an artist and I think in a lot of ways, I swear to become your archivist and biographer I get when you become famous, I'll have a guaranteed career absolutely car collection Coarsegold extra is the ability to just walk around the garden. I find that there's just too much Tranquility. Just whenever I'm around your spaces.

17:50 I think that's probably one of the things I've always admired about the work that I've seen like the old sculptures. I remember looking at some of those and thinking of just how everything was kind of perfectly put together almost like the calcium kind of in Sola fide into until 2 ish. Shall that was been made for one particular animal. I thought you have a really sensitive eye for those kind of space has always looked after that. I think you also see the garden and the house kind of as a refuge places where you come when you need to write your papers already a quiet you spent I don't know how many hours drawing everything in the garden in almost everything in the house you come there when you have needs to be comforted or when you need to be alone when it when you need Solitude. I always thought that that I didn't draw enough for I always thought that we weren't doing quite enough away.

18:48 Are you I think it's an artist you have doubts all the time you that you always not quite sure what's happening next. What do I think and also I think that's what's a large part of being able to recognize they will we don't know what's going on. This is a rough time. Hey, what are you up to? You know, so it's great that was kind of have that sort of like Harley with back and forth between talking about some artwork and also supporting each other in other ways as well. I mean, you know that I'm I I tried to give you support when you're having a great difficult time in your life and you return that much later when I was having a difficult time as well. I think that's what it took us Beyond The MENTOR student relationship with the teacher-student relationship in in and took more to a level of being in a copied on since supporters and finding out that we're really on the same wavelength in a lot of ways, aesthetically

19:47 It is a fantastic day. That's what it is. I just don't see I don't see any young and he stopped at about if I come with you future.

19:59 Naples truck me

20:13 You're going to thank me for all those icanvas as I gave you. It's so weird cuz you know, I don't know what they're like everything. I've done everything. I stretched myself with some something that you taught me how to do it when your classes which is why you were somebody like Celeste Simon for some free print like really cute when I got more so it's like it's a I don't know. It's almost been necessary Serendipity. That's kind of been running through what uses connection that you wanted to be a painter of you didn't have the money for supplies. And so I think the universe kind of forgot to happens and we need we need stuff for Tim to paint with

20:57 Cheese

20:59 I was going to say something about being able to be there for you all when I painted the kitchen. So so are my chances to always run about in the help you out I was going to do it is for the sake of family. That's why I didn't turn my back and still I forgot about that trait that can be rough know. Well, you know how long I've ever do I did the roofs the house. That was really fun.

21:33 Put

21:36 I know that but what do you think is going to go to training thing about Journey's is that if you don't worry about the destination, you can enjoy the trip more now and I think that's kind of where we all right. I can't Envision it so it back. So worried about where I'm going so frequently and see just open a lot of what's been going on how to calm me down.

22:05 I think that there are fears you have his young adult and anxieties that you have and I've already experienced them in the know that you do survive them and that you do keep on going and I have great hopes for you and I want you to finish school. I want you to graduate school and then I want you to be the artist that you can't help but be

22:27 Wow. Thank you.

22:31 Geez, why? I think that's the secret here. You can't not be an artist there that then I've already honored that you can get with the only thing that you're suited for. Yeah, it's what's in your spirit in your mind in your heart. And I think I can guess what that's one of the things has been exciting for me about the journey. Is that here? Is this this person who can't be anything, but an artist what gauge wire for an art teacher

22:59 Well

23:05 I'm stuck if you want to keep going. Okay, and I remember from speech class. That's not good. What don't worry about that. Just no speak what's on your mind talk about other other experiences are other things that you remember.

23:26 I fear that is all the times. When I recall memories of of things we talked about. It's almost like the things are talking about art images that we saw somewhere else cuz we really free play talking about painting. So I'm almost always thinking that you think of pictures we can talk and pictures so I'm thinking other things when I'm talking to you like for example those James Michael's painting, but she know we talked about all the time we talked about the Rivera Rivera talked about a lot of contemporary things that are going on the Bay Area to Cali with the painters that we know who our painting for the part of collections leaves me. Can we try to like kind of synthesize that in just dialogue boy? I think I think that we have the same attitude of you you look at a painting not only for the image that it sent over the content of it. But also how in the heck did he get that pain on the first place?

24:25 I mean when we walk through a museum and we talked about works at find another we drive everybody around us crazy. He exactly because we're up close and painting looking at the brushstrokes and looking at is do you think this is a Vermilion he used or is that really a cadmium in one small corner of red on the penny? We was Green Camaro. It was feel like I never would have caught that but yeah, you you are the visual detective well, and I'm trying to teach that to you. I mean, that's one of my goals is that maybe your gift or curse or whatever being an artist isn't being a visual person. It's really good to share it with somebody else and then to pass it on as well.

25:16 Wow.

25:29 Particular pain The Weave we talked a lot about that. You don't know how I've done to you to know that I've done that we've had to come from the show me and we have great conversations about most of those along the way absolute the one that stands out of my mind are the the two large yellow ones. Okay, because I like yellow and the orange I like the techniques that you would use with them the ones that were like almost feel like large Seas of brush Strokes beautiful just sees a brush vs. A good description of them made that painting was with large five by five for canvas. And I remember the colors that were anywhere blues and greens and then there are large Strokes of a purple-red and there was a lot of yellow resident resident everywhere, but it didn't so make him from a direct source was like, this is solid bar under painting with the Violet and decorating with lavender tones with the greens in the

26:29 I created his own sense of light coming from within the painting job, even when it have a spotlight on it. It's still had this glow or illumination to it. When I think that's part of the magic of painting is that when you can make it look like a tomato blight rather than the skin of oily pigment stuck in a piece of fabric. I know there's something magical about that money you owe me that the other day when I was thinking about that when I saw it again in the book the central idea about is making light come from within the painting our own. I think that yeah, we're definitely working towards that

27:02 I think that's why we both like from here absolutely assistive light and that that's in his work is a different kind of fight then the other painters painted with

27:12 I think I'm one of the other thing with your penis isn't this incredible obsessive layering. Oh, yeah layers and layers and layers of paint to change a color rather than mixing in a pallet you can I ship the black to a green by covering with yellow or shipped a green towards a more neutral color by turning it down with red. When you have a real good skill with that. I sometimes feel like it's not enough that I sent them to you like bananas. I don't know process isn't enough. Maybe we can do some of the more critical plug-in vehicle you still need to do you still have a lot more reading to do and a lot more experienced seamen to do I would really like to see you be able to travel and go to some of the museums and see the pieces up have clothes like when you and I visited Museum how we see them cuz I think that's the next step and I'd like to see you in graduate school. Maybe study abroad for a year. I think that would be enough to shoot for that.

28:12 Yeah, maybe the next big step that you would need to take so I should do definitely.

28:23 What about your collages Ono? Well, I remember I remember coming back from Chicago and being completely bum bum on a lock and having a really hard time getting anything done doing my life. There was like this huge stagnation real static feeling and I came to you in this state is real Gruff State and I talked to you almost I almost tried to like ask you for an assignment. I did ask you for not so you have to fast for an assignment. And yeah, and you told me to wash my paint or paint heart collage, but I was after I'd already come and brought you to come and bring you know, I think you sent was initially to make 10 postcards and have them framed by the end of this month.

29:23 I was dating to look at Starbucks at the time and I got a show in Starbucks. It was really kind of them don't like talking about it. Now. That's a promise to buy things in any way, you know, but it was a great thing about it was that those classes are really intense and I'm still trying to work with that. I've told me some of that teacher that I used to paint the same and I'm like, I'm still experimenting. I'm still I still haven't figured it out. It kind of seems like it comes in large blocks of obsessing over one particular kind of way of working. Well, that's how you learn. I call it Focus the people called obsessing that's probably the same thing but I think with your work is it you were coming to me ask me for ideas and I was looking at your sketch books and admiring the the plenitude of your ideas. But yeah me ideas you had and I said

30:23 Why don't you use these as a series of studies for 10 I think was 10 or 30 collage of 10, but all the same size and work through them very quickly. Yeah react to color react to texture a reactive peeling paper off or whatever and then when you came back with us, you said whatever your next really want to paint. I don't want to paint. I said paint these and I think you started off with one and then the painting just exploded into a sign Direction following format.

30:56 I was so interesting cuz I think that's one of the things that come come up against it accurate to say idea for Matt and because of that and I have come to you so much for help with my academic papers. And how much help for life is to being there as many bounce or mirror ideas off of that. I don't I mean I have a hard time going to be able to strip asking them for for for help like that. I mean, I feel like I've received so much of that from you along this journey that like I don't know ever wants to do to repay. You want to repay me for it you have to do what I'm doing. I'm repaying a debt that I owe to a teacher who took me aside and mentored me in my first year in college and without him I wouldn't be the artist that I am the day. His name is Joe Fleming and the only way I can pay him back is to give his gift Ford and so I think of all the students that I've had to receive some of that gift, but I think that you have that kind of

31:56 Receive more cuz you're kind of attached yourself like a barnacle to my life and where it where is sort of together now for the rest of the journey artistically and friendship. I wonder

32:10 She's just thinking about how that's interesting that idea of having to repay this debt because I sometimes feel that whenever I'm working at the studio that I'm feeling some kind of Public Service to the community and helping everybody kind of get their time you are you because I don't want to stay there 15 minutes that sounds bad. But you know like it or exposure it such a way to make things more accessible to the my think that that's that's Exemplar in the show that we're going to do with you. Use Justice idea of being that I have an idea. We should all pay attention to this will your your your educational facet which is what you do you're an important part of the Arts Community now in the Tampa Bay area and you you are giving of your time in yourself through other ways.

33:10 Other than just making aren't you know, you're also helping to produce that you're getting it on an atmosphere. You're encouraging other artists who are also emerging just bring those kind of attitude you hahaha. And because what I don't I don't use when very young when she can pain in your are cute or nice or supervision word Haka. The pain

33:41 Well, jeez, I did weird in there so many memories there there are and I sometimes you know, my members of the memories are different from your memories of the memories and it's my voice right looks like I'm being right. I love you, man.

34:12 When you've had relied on each other for something outside of our something personal.

34:21 Yes, I I can I can do that. I have been sort of battling for several years now a serious depression and I think that I was frightened and letting him know that I was having this problem cuz he kind of looks up to me a little bit. And so I took him out one day for afternoon coffee. Can you think I was very honest with him more setting with anybody I've ever been about what the Depression was like and what it feels like in in my case. It's something that kind of has family roots and Tim was incredibly supportive at that moment and had the wisdom far beyond his 26 years of life would have given you he was comforting. He has been totally supportive. He is encouraged me in my own Artistic Endeavors as I switched from working three-dimensionally 2 2 2 2 2 2 dimensional work.

35:21 Dikeys her transition that he's been I think it's strong and helpful to me as I have been strong and helpful to him. And I think that we really are pierced. Our age doesn't matter now the generations that were from don't matter. He's really try to connect our souls. Our souls are can I have and that's why we're here because we need to do that. You know, I just think that like

35:49 That's the night. It's it's it's that it's that pull is that gravitational force towards somebody who?

35:58 Is like you yeah exactly. Thanks for filling it in my eye. And I really sometimes I get a trip up like that. I think the most important thing is that you know, we've used all these labels today like a mentor and teacher and student artists and things like that didn't really work that where we are. I think that it is so much more multi-dimensional than that. It's an ally allies because it's it's ice tea it is a long journey and that we path leads where it leads. We don't really know and you were just walking next to each other and I'm encouraged you to take a journey and you're encouraging me take a journey. I have both kind of pushing each other Ford and supporting each other at the same time. And that is that idea of being a mother flame for the person to swing without tree lighting that torch passing the cleanest part exactly.

36:52 And you know just being really happy to share the journey with somebody and having the opportunity to share the journey with someone who understands the journey and also show me. Imagine what I'd be that I didn't have you around to help me kind of ground some of my work in free floating off.

37:15 I think being involved with you is grounded me as well.

37:19 Thank you.

37:28 I I had the fortunate opportunity to be a mentor to other students before Tim. I already had some practice with it. I think that what happened though is that this mentoring moved into a personal realm that I have never gone to before entering students was part of the program that I was teaching with. It was a requirement that it was expected that you were a student Mentor for the four years that they were they are many students after going to college and come back and talk with me or chat with me or stay in touch with me through mail. But Tim is Tim is the one that the mentoring relationship we got muddled and went somewhere else to touch higher level and create creation in connection and understanding and compassion. I think that there's there's this absolute size.

38:25 Whenever he talked them and I have so many questions and it seems like you know, but you have to be careful who you really trust fantastic, but you gave me about no singing artist night like proclaimed be careful who you let into your studio and it's it's like it's really like you to be careful who you let in your life and we've been very cautious and you know, fortunately for us unfortunate for people like Van Gogh and Gauguin relationship didn't work out ours has yes, and we we we reaped the benefits that ideally they would have liked to sew

39:14 Cheese

39:23 That creative people are meant to be creative as many minutes of the day as they possibly can and I have been envious of Tim's ability to generate so much work and such a short amount of time and considering his his youth. You know, it's pretty amazing and blows me away. I was Gees. You should let me go first David has always been there for me whenever I've had her needed a safe place to go and very frequently I get myself in situations where I really need someone to talk to because I like to just hit my head really hard on walls and then wonder why it hurts. I'm learning lots of life lessons and that's a lot of pain and David's always been there to be able to ameliorate that pain and

40:20 Sometimes he's been there to show me this not that not that deep. You know, it's it's it's the only let it roll off your back and it's been a fantastic fantastic hero for me and he never been somebody who's needed to speak rain is always been a hero which is they really really admire. I think that's the nicest thing someone can say is that that you're their hero gas oven.

40:44 I really I really really I really like doing encaustic with you. I thought that was fantastic and members of being a real close quarters working on something real intimate that idea of that intimacy it and making work in conjunction with the Friendship is so pretty important to me to these the things that I think that I understand what I received from you and I can think of that we took to get back the good thing about companions in it is that you can work together and not being each other's way.

41:17 Hangouts guide

41:21 It's complicated.

41:24 But it's been good for both of us going to be a lot longer to I can do that much.

41:30 Large canvases to work on we haven't even had our blue. Yet.