Merril (Mutt) Murray and Samuel D. Schropp

Recorded August 17, 2007 Archived August 17, 2007 39:18 minutes
0:00 / 0:00
Id: MBY003117


Mutt Murray talks to his neighbor Sam Schropp about growing up with horses, farming with his family, and learning to fly small planes.

Subject Log / Time Code

Seeing the first plane into Cache Valley ever
Riding a horse as a kid that got to know him so well that the horse would learn its neck down and let him clamber on, then raise its neck so Mutt would slide down to its back.
Family always had good workhorses - Sam concurs, he’d heard that said.
Spending a week each summer up at Tony Grove, staying with a sheep herder there.
Getting thrown on a horse, so high in the air, that Mutt decided to learn how to fly while up in the air.
Buzzing a neighbor with his plane, scaring the dickens out of him.


  • Merril (Mutt) Murray
  • Samuel D. Schropp


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00:03 Good morning. My name is Sam. Schropp. I'm 40 50 years old. Today's date is August 17th. 2007. We're in Logan, Utah and I'll be talking with my partner McMurray Merle Marie. How old are you today? Well today I'm 94 years old. I think I cheated a 450k. Where where were you born Wellsville? When was that? That was in 1914?

00:39 And you live in the Cache Valley and Utah all your life. I've lived in this Valley all my life.

00:48 So why you were telling me stories earlier about you saw an airplane the first airplane to come into the Cache Valley? And what was that? And do you remember that? Well, yeah, maybe the pilot was that loot that a lieutenant mounted coming flew in the Wellsville for a funeral now, I don't know what funeral was it was as a grandmother is have to be a grandmother an elderly person cuz he was in the service then and then he lived in the field just

01:22 West End and north of the town of Wellsville, okay in an old army to ring airplane army airplane and that was the first airplane to come into the cat. That was the first airplane that ever hit the valley so that would have been what do you think you're maybe six or eight years old is about o odd say I was about 8 years old somewhere along in that bad 1922 then.

01:51 So where the mini cars in Wellsville at that time? If I remember right there they were three Model T Fords in Wellsville at that time.

02:02 So that was a long about the time you were herding cattle. Well, yeah. Well, I herded cattle for Harry Parker 4 years.

02:12 Well, I'd said years but it at least I started that you were just a little boy that is only about 8 years old take those cattle out them what they called Bob's Sterling in that they called the place. So I'm kind of a bush or something. They called it out there but it was out between Wells healing well Forum in Wellsville where I'd the place was so that was kind of northeast of where you were living then yes and did Harry give you a horse. Yeah. I had an old do you always choose a nice little brown Bay mare topside Road. I just kidding. She was a nice little horse. So did he give you a saddle or do you write home about I never had a sad you just rode bareback airbag? How'd you get up on that horse? I'd usually wait till the cheese store to eat. Then I have thrown a leg up over head and she'd raise your head in and out of slide down her head hit on that was

03:12 Most quickest way to get on was just the ticket on her neck and let her slide your back onto your Mac is that field has a big field and you couldn't leave him over the fence or somewhere to get on. Haha, but I got in the habit of doing that and she got to the point where she knew what I wanted to do, and she'd help me get on something.

03:35 So did you take the cows out everyday and bring them back to Wellsville or just watch over him all day and leave them there or take them out in the mornings and bring them back at night and where they milk cows are beef cows milk cows. So you had to take him out after the morning milking. Yeah and bring them back for evening. That's right. How much did you get paid for that dollar a day? No, wait a minute is 50 spot a $0.50 a day that I got fifty cents a day, haha.

04:06 Did you take lunch with you?

04:09 Now that I I think so, but I don't I wouldn't have made the bet money on it.

04:17 So you told me what you did with your first paycheck from that man first paycheck. I got with it. I give to my mother and she wouldn't me but went and bought me my clothes to start the school at 4. Remember how much that check was there somewhere around about eight $9 or something like that was very much. So there were some other guys down there that used to go visit while you're attending those cattle. Yeah. Well when they cause it's settled down and chords in the afternoon ride used to go for a little ride and there was some families that lived up in Mountain Sterling and there's submitting boys up there that I got acquainted with and they were especially one time and I can't think of his name right now.

05:02 They're all I used to like to go out and talk to him and I were they your age or where they always know they were older than me and they farmed up in there. They had to put my I think you're still living there. I'm not sure but I think they're still living there. I'd like to go see him. I will get down there visiting. So how many were in your family in my family? Yeah. They was eight boys three girls

05:30 And your mom and dad used to load everybody up go to Brigham to pick peaches didn't they? Yeah, but mom and dad used to go through Brigham City that darn near every fall and they'd hook up team up to an old white top buggy and drive over to Brigham and we used to go it was funny. We have to go to the road. That's where is it is now that's the new road now used to be the old row the old way of getting over in the brig so you didn't go over and back in one day. That's a pretty white over and stayed over overnight then come back the next morning and you just took blankets and and slept in Orchard slept on the ground.

06:12 I guess I was kind of a picnic for your family or bowling buddy your age. Anyway, well that sometimes we would make the trip in one day really lots of flies off. We didn't we'd stay overnight. And so were you picking peaches for yourselves or forever? Well, and I don't know if we used to bring back. Oh, I don't know how many bush look pieces up into maybe 20 bushels. I don't know. Haha. I was just a kid and I wasn't interested in how many peaches was in a so, I don't know but that's what we go over there where you go there and pick and load the speeches and bring them back mother at the door. She put up peaches.

06:56 She maybe she put them all up herself. I don't know so she put them up in jars or in bottles.

07:09 All of the end no matter what it was they bought on it so I can let gooseberries and you name is violet your name, didn't they put it up in bottles? Well, that was your winners food there. Well that was for food and saw you had a big garden and you can't every week we had a big garden and we had always had the car over to maybe two cows to milk for milk and

07:41 So you moved up the Richmond, Utah then?

07:44 Or did you go to Rexburg first? Well, we went to Rexburg first and we went up there for it was up there for two years on a big week for him up there. I don't know how many acres you're working for somebody else of the orcas. And what the Joe Parkinson, haha.

08:04 And you couldn't make what and when we ply we could make one round around that field in one day so that be in the full sections or quarter sections the I don't know. I just a boy and I didn't know what was going on in that way. I know we went up there and we was up there for 2 years.

08:25 On that red big farm up there and saw your brothers and your dad worked at Ames then and yeah mom and dad and my brothers and that wasn't there.

08:37 I don't remember the name of the place is up there. There's as Canyon Canyon Creek that and that was another thing we had to hold her own drinking water and the water that we you'd even for our hearts and we had to hook a team up and take a tanker.

08:55 I can go to this River and pump the full thing full of water and haul it back to have water to drink in the water our horses. So it was dry. Land farm. Well, it's it was they were the wheel on it, but I don't see girls putting out too much water. So

09:17 So your brothers worked at and then they brought in Steam threshing machines. I guess they run those tracks in those old traction engines to do the thing up there. Haha. They was pulled by horses. I remember right now my memory. I'm just a kid then denied. It seems to me like I heard my brother and dad and I'm talking about one of them. They had to have somewhere around seven or eight head horses to pull it. Yeah, that's a big and that's what they pulled him with both. They had to have one is bigger than the other one where I want you to rap more horses than the other one bullet.

09:58 And they could make one round today on that for me. Was that big? Isn't that something isn't that something? So then you move back down to Richmond? Yeah. I wouldn't we move back down Richmond. Well, if we hadn't grandmother had to get us kids back to start to school. So the old steam train from Rexburg to Wellsville.

10:22 So when you moved into Richmond, he moved into that farm at Mendenhall turn on the south side of town yet. When we moved it. That was we moved up here in 1926. And that's where we ended up is there on that course in form?

10:40 So you had a deal working with the banker there? Yeah. We was dealing with the bank I found out after.

10:48 That that

10:50 We're going to have the bank wanted to rent it for a while to get some of the money out of it. Cuz they I guess it was in debt pretty bad. Yeah, and so they wanted to rent it out for cash rent till I got seven other money back and we took my Dad and brothers and the deal that the bank put up that we pay cash rent for so long for some of that money was paid off right? I was only kidding then you see and that's why I didn't get mixed up in.

11:23 Stuff like that has heard it around the table. If so what so you had you had what were you raising on that farm? You name it? And we raised and we race car and we raised peas. We raised beans Sugar Beach was our main Weezer age 50 acres of sugar beets. Every year sugar base was a cash crop. Yeah that that that's what we paid the cash. We had to pay cash rent and that's where we got the money to pay that cash rent is out of those Sugar Beach. Well, I think you got in on that farm so quick cuz the beach needed to be send didn't I? Well we moved up in there on the 26th day of May and we had 50 acres of Sugar Beach to thin. Yeah, and we send them a little late in the season to be at you was

12:14 So

12:17 You work that place with horses or is that I have talked to you. I've drove more good horses and most people's ever seen you had each one of my brothers. They was just see their car oil and red.

12:35 Brandon Roy and Jim and Dad we had five match teams and horses and what I mean mashed horses, we loved horses. Yeah, and we all had a good match team. That's what I heard. The Murrays always had good horses. We had always had good horses. What were they like heavy draft horses like belgians or or were they just took a good stout work or work horses? I don't know. I didn't know what draft horse from a draft cow in them days. My I was too young and I was interested in the air, but they were good horses Goodwill mashed or so now you and you work somebody else's team. Then when they took a break for an hour in the fall of the year, that was my job to take a one of the teams and follow the flash tits the Dasher and Hall and whatever.

13:35 The grain to The Thrasher to crash and I always drove a team.

13:42 I like to drive horses. You were telling me that when you walked along and you worked in the field out there in the dust you got boils.

13:51 Well for some reason or another.

13:56 I can remember I have some many bought boils on my arms and you couldn't stick a pin in between them and it seemed like we got it once a year. Yeah, and mother used to go to the hills and get Sagebrush. I mix a t o boy, it was bitter and she give us Sagebrush tea and that is clear them boil dried up. Isn't that something? I don't know. Why what it was or whether I know it was staged called and Sage brush teeth. Yeah, you had to hold your nose to choke it down. It was bitter. It was bitter.

14:33 So, how do you start off your day? What should give you for breakfast?

14:38 Just a regular old big old bowl of what the what was that that they used to cook all the time. I had porridge or oatmeal. Oh, well told me is that my mother used to cook for a we'd all sit around the table?

14:56 And we had a big bowl of this year prepared oatmeal or whatever. She Cooks Forest. Now you're made or whatever. It was a lot of Mourning Never argued about what we got to eat if we knew mother was doing the best she could and so you had

15:14 Milk, and and Brad a lot to do that was bread and milk of a Knight alive eat a lot of bread and milk in my day. Was that homemade bread at home at that one used to love for bread mother baby. She'd make 12 Loaves and bacon and how many days a week would she do that to remember? Maybe she did but she probably make the bread maybe once or twice a week or how I don't know if being a kid, I didn't keep track of that. But yeah mother have made a lot of bread and her day and so the milk that you went out Milk The Cow, so you had good whole milk and they just we had good milk and

15:59 And then used to ride your bicycle to school. I used to I used to like to build things and I went and got some porch my built me a bike. And I rode that bike the end of Smithfield school media day form into Smithfield and self that's about six or seven miles. I guess get a ride down a gravel road. Well is that

16:27 Well, no, I think they had I think they had to hard surface Road when we moved you after Richmond. I can remember when they put it through the Wellsville. Smear road. Yeah, I can remember what

16:42 And the hell was the contract Olaf Olaf Nelson, I believe haha was the one that put the first event Road in Wellsville. Isn't that something?

16:53 So used to go up every summer to Tony Grove didn't you? Yeah, they was or where we lived there. Was that changed the annals the Murrays the spackman's McDonald's and the Aldi's that was just like a little town of the wrong and that's boys chase together all of us and what we all the boys used to like to pack a pack horse motor grab a night on and go up and stay after Tony Grove. Yeah, every Slumber is the reason was there was a sheet for him and his boy always heard it cheap in there in the summer and we go there and stay with him for a whole week.

17:40 Cuz he'd make it where they call it the Dutch oven bread. Haha. And then he took care of the end of the Father the other boy, you know when it's too bad. I can't remember his name. It may come to you ain't that so you guys used to pack a pack horse. Did you ride a saddle horse or we had to pay course then we had two satellites that we were old and did you go up? Where'd you go out Cherry Creek or hiker? Well sometimes live when we went up Cherry Creek, we were in that Smithfield Canyon and we went right up over what they calls City Creek from where I lived up over the mountains that way to Tony Grove. Yeah.

18:30 Now you had a a pack horse fall with you one time didn't know it was going up and we had a one of the old horses loaded with her back. You had the grill all the crap and the old stay in the center of the Earth.

18:48 Narrow passage was up around then mountains. You always walk on the outage and he stepped off and he rolled down a hill and scattered all of our grab all the way down to the bottom of the hill. So we quit packing it on him and we put the road here and put the pack on one of the other horse. Well, that's just what you wanted to put his to ride a horse that falls off the trailer, but we enjoyed it. That was a good summer vacation. So how old a boy were you then? Oh, I'd say I was right about you now Mateen somewhere. Maybe you really 13-14 somewhere along These are nice George working.

19:30 Full time on the farm when I was big enough. Yeah, and I used to drive a team of horses practically everyday doing plowing hollandaise or whatever ride. So how how old were and how how far did you go in school?

19:46 Well, I only went to

19:51 I don't know what they called him.

19:55 It was in the Smithfield and it was a they had a Junior High in Smithfield. And I think I went to one year to that Junior High cuz I was getting old if I'd had to work instead of learn right they needed every hand on the farm. They needed all the hands on the farming and all the money I could make to the side.

20:20 So sugar beets were a big thing in the calf old man, Sugar Beach was one of the biggest things in the Cache Valley sugar beets corn peas cabbage. You name it and cash value used to grow it and they grow good crops cuz I know cuz I hold a lot of that stuff the Divine reason to the places where they were used to haul I have to haul them like a Franklin and where they took the cabbage and

20:56 Smithfield they took peas and beans. Well there was calories and all those places where the sun in the winter time than you you fed beep. Bop after they squeeze the sugar out of the beats. The pulp was left. Well, yeah with GI Beach went to

21:15 Well, I Beach went to Whitney for a while then they started I don't know what happened that you are just changing their anyway are pulpwood into Smith are in the Lewiston.

21:32 I know I used to haul go go get a load of pop twice a week out of Lewiston and I used to hook up a team of horses and go to Lewiston and get a big blow to pop and bring it back twice a week NYC cabs in a wagon in the wagon and we used to all the Beast has to beat them. I hold talk to the cows. I guess. I think that's about 14 or 15 miles to Lewiston know I'd say is about

22:02 347 it up very far is not too bad. Now. I see that was very far from Richmond. So you did that summer and winter alcohol at we start in the fall of the year after the beach Harvest resolved then that's when we started Holland talk to the Cavs and it was usually and the job always seemed like it fell to me to haul that pulp. Yeah. So even in the bitter cold when they beat that icicles hanging on them horses noses be I'll bet you I bet you be 20, they've been 20 in long it'll be cold and I get off and run along the side of the

22:54 The horses they just walk, you know, there was a training and then I could just walk to run to the side of the road. Just a warm to say warm. Yeah, so you're out there harnessing up those horses and milking cows before they break so you could get a good early start.

23:12 Can you get up there to Lewiston?

23:15 And you had to drive that that team in that wagon down in the pit the other with the powerfulest dinosaur. That is if you got more the hall that the deeper the pick got cuz it was on his angle, haha.

23:28 Sure, there's a lot of popping that fit so we get down in the pit and you load that by hand. No, we had to shovel. Haha. We show it on and it was a scoop shovel and shovel it off for the scoop shovel. Gotcha.

23:42 And so then come time to come up out of there in the winter time. It's all I see you nasty. It was slick then planks should be dampened.

23:53 I'll tell you you couldn't be a dumbbell and drive a team of horses down in there. Hahaha, cuz you had to have sense enough to know how to handle a horse. It wants them horses start a deal with that and they was pulling up by a hill right at Slippery. I load that beatboxes just as much on it as you could put on and it had be pretty good to look upon them. And if you didn't know what you was doing, sometimes it seemed to have a quiet time.

24:26 So there was a bunch of old guys up there thought of kid wasn't going to get that up out of their didn't they ever forget that if they was arguing as I was loading my they were nervous and that guy that they wouldn't stand still horses and I just said talk to him, you know, and then when I got ready to pull up why I thought I started Epping I got to just about halfway.

24:51 They said they couldn't pull it and so I had the back all the way down and I can remember.

24:59 One of the guys there he says I know I just make that up there. So I just make him a team back down and got to let him get situated. You know, we're winning when I get up on him and I was always taught. My dad was a good Horseman. You said it's when you're driving a team of horses keep playing until I got on that there and I get my Ryan's tight and spoke to the team and they took off so I said they walked right up there not of that never lived anymore, haha.

25:37 You've got to know what you're doing and I had some good teachers. I'll tell you now those those hold those horses in the winter times that they were cock shoes.

25:48 Got the shoes you had on those horses in the winter. They had corks on them. Well, we usually pull them shoes off in the fall of the when we got through with it. We pull up shoes off and put them back on in the spring. So those were Barefoot horses you trying to get that slippery slope. Oh well know they had shoes on they had cork shoes on the one who he's working. We kept a team in to clean the barn at all at all winter long and we kept one team to do that with weed. I had that feed cattle outside, you know, when almond or during the winter and we kept one team for that and we kept shoes on them. Yeah.

26:30 Well, let's see how much you had what 10 horses.

26:35 You have five boys and a team for each we always had every one of us always been. Well, I didn't but my brother I always had a good match team horses. So you had at least 10 horses and horses about how many acres were you working?

26:55 Order sexy exist big form here around where the Bourne is then we had 40 acres down.

27:03 All the way from there to on its way to the river then we had.

27:09 Oh, I'd say 42 and fit maybe 50 acres down on the river bottoms at the reformed. Yes. I was almost a quarter section. You're almost almost a hundred and sixty Acres you we had we had then that's a pretty good piece of ground around the barn. I took a lot of that just to feed the horses. So will we feed the horses you feed the cows and the couch most of the stands, you know what they had leaves on lady them but we take the what the guys would need. We feed their horses and that kept them horses in good shape all the wrong, but we always fed the horses a little bit of green.

27:50 Well after the bank done you dirty you decided not to farm anymore. Well most I did I said I'm not going to anymore and I never did they stayed on the Jim bought it for him. Haha and my brother Roy went on a form and my brother ran went on the farm and my brother Roy every one of them went on the form, but I went to work for a service station that belong to

28:24 Bagley Mary bagley's has been right and what was his name Grant Bagley and while I was working for him. I went down to the factory and put my name in down there. So is it for nobody never come up? I could go to work down there and it was like what happened? I got under the faction, but I have to go in to the factory to work it on the cleanup. Yeah, and I don't I wouldn't have to go to work till about 3:34 in the afternoon. Yeah, but I'd work to the service station and if there's time to go down there and then I'd be down there and working cuz I was running I'd working for 222 far is there for quite some time. So now that was a seagull milk at that time.

29:11 Went to work there and it changed to pet milk and when it was Pat milk, that's they shipped milk all over for World War II didn't they or they ship milk you name it night. I'll tell you they used to ship milk all over the world. I believe right out of the Cache Valley right out of Cache Valley and we used to have to be just wrap it or water them cases to

29:39 I'm so you picked up milk and Idaho Falls and well when I went to work down there I was on the cleanup.

29:48 And while I was on the cleanup why I'd be working and and we had some big machines running there all the time and if they did work right, I'd go fix them. My daddy in-laws want to run one of those machines and I was helping him as well as the sales price for some reason or another the ruling Merrill. Who's the boss says I've been watching you.

30:20 He says you see me pretty well-acquainted with Mechanicals work and I swell I like it. I like to do it. He's just how would you like to go to work for Ivan? Ivan was ahead Christensen elementary students with head man on the repair crew time to spare time when I was working in the kitchen and you know where there's can condense in the milk or that or I had to go in the shop and work so I got that's how I got mixed up with the repair work. Well, that's how you got mixed up with Ivan Christian Wood Richmond riders that lets see for some reason or another.

31:05 I don't know what's up. There was going to change me and put me somewhere and I haven't spoke at Mission Ultra says he wanted in the shop with him and I don't know how it worked out. Anyway, I got into the shop. So you started the Richmond Riders you and I well I was a spirit head to that. She gave my name is Melvin Johnson was the Steve spearheads to start up Richmond Riding Club at the Richmond. Right? And it ended up they were we had 53 members that you wrote in parades. We wrote in ever prayed you'd ever we rode in Franklin Preston Dayton in Ogden.

31:56 Logan harm in Salt Lake City to running anyway, and we rode in the one in Salt Lake City.

32:12 I don't know how many years we were invited down there to ride. I rode my horse from that eagle gate there and where they sell that guesses. Do you wear that Eagles overhead? We showed out there and we go south and I don't know how far south we tried that we had to do it to you and you went to that famous Preston night Rodeo everywhere with every time we had no like in Salt Lake we put that deal on and down to the fairgrounds. We'd end up down to the fairgrounds and we put that deal on their thing. Every time we went down there. They said they'd asked some of the cleverest if they had a few. No, I'm good.

33:01 Clubs, and they had some damn good things set up, you know to do entertainment for people when Ivan Christensen had a Mary bought off the reservation know that was a

33:16 I don't I don't know whatever happened to Ivan horse. He had a Ivan always had a good horse and he bought this black hole. He was a beautiful heart like Body Face talking for the horse, but he wasn't broke.

33:35 I rode that horse. He used to tie that Horst of that little horse of mine to the horn and I'd get on that horse. And I rode that. I don't know how many times did and I got him. So as I could ride get on him and he wouldn't it back or do anything and I wrote him for I don't know how many times he live just north of where my boy lives now we're Carol is at least come along there and I was riding him and Ivan was on my little horse and I would reach Jordans is all you beautiful than slap. That's harsh on the neck. Is it all you're a beautiful thing?

34:20 And then we're for some reason to be so darn high in the sky.

34:27 Well, I don't know how many feet is in the anyway while I was up there floating around. I look down in the Oilers beautiful down below. The bird was flying around and I thought I'd George. I'm going to take up fly it and I did so that's how you got going with the Civil Air Patrol. That's how I got tangled up by when joined the Civil Air Patrol and I belong to them and they furnish to see airplanes. Yeah, and then you bought a and old trainer some point is I like flying and in the lab Rhonda the club down to

35:08 I don't know what they called him. Whether we had a civil air patrol Club there and that belong to the Air Force right anyway.

35:18 You bought that Old World War II trainer did they? Well, I think raped livre that he married. My wife's sister Ray Gilbert seen this ad in the paper where this airplane wheelers for sale in Salt Lake and Ray and I

35:39 Flew down there and he took his up for a ride.

35:45 And I thought. And I bought it remember what that was as long as the job leave. Bt15 or bt14 somewhere about World War II training plan it what it was and I used to fly around the Valley of the evening. Well, I'll tell you what if you ever get flying in your blood and you fly ever check and after every time I've had the day's work I go down and getting that old are planning on flying up around about a clear up around down and down the other side and make that Loop. When are you scared? Some of these filled one? Well, I'll never forget to take off one day and

36:27 Albert Hill is that Brown. Behind? What they call Round Hill and that's up. Just right west of me in your and I can see Albert down there plowing. So I banked and went up the hill a ways and that airplane. I had it that had their what they call a low PH too high. You put that in high picture and all that. It just sound like you had instead of dry fly in one plain. You sound like you were flying 2000 it would Roar and I got right over the top and I said that old shot in the head.

37:09 I don't know I took off for you knowing that nice at the Albert seen me in town and he came up to me and each other why you dirty son of he says I had to go home and change all of my clothes. Did you learn out all of this life? What did you learn out at 9. I enjoyed it. I'll tell you.

37:42 The very few nights that I didn't go home from working in the factory that I didn't get in that airplane and take a little ride, or I'd throw this out on one of my horses and take a little ride to relax. I'll never forget it. I run into an old fellow from Salt Lake down to the airport one day.

38:03 And I got quite a few quite it with you. And now it's just I've noticed you come up here a lot and he's rarely said I'll tell you he was a doctor. He says there's nothing more relaxation and then there is to get in that little airplane and take a little ride yet it you should so I do that to get my mind off from my work what I'm doing all day. Yeah, relax me.

38:27 12 day weather forecast for relaxation there ever was a heck of a deal you come from horses to airplane and I used to see a lots of deers when that fly into the I just fly these lower heels round in it. I enjoyed every bit of it.

38:46 Thanks a lot. My thanks for telling me those stories what I'll tell you I'm not set.

38:52 I've not been one time that I've done something that I was ashamed. It's stay or not sad of I enjoyed my life all the way through life everything I've done. I've always liked to go in the Hills it deer time at Deer take my family we grew up there and stay a whole week.