Patrice Greene and Stan Greene

00:01 Would like Elsa.

00:05 My name is Patrice Greene.

00:10 M54

00:13 Today's date is Sunday, August 25th.

00:19 Where in Flint, Michigan?

00:27 Stan Greene is my interview partner, and he's my husband.

00:34 My name is Stan Greene. I'm 59 years old today's date of Sunday, August 25th, 2019. And we're in Flint Michigan. My interview partner is Patrice Greene. She's the sweet queen and she is my bride.

00:54 So

00:55 Queen we're here today because we want to talk about Frances Norman. So what do you want people to know about Francis Norman?

01:05 Francis turbine with my mom

01:09 The first thing I want people to know is you'd never went to color Francis. She went by Pat. She was born Frances Elaine poem. She's born in Flint, Michigan on Maple Road. She was born in her house.

01:26 Her mom and dad were Hilda and Guthrie poem.

01:32 And you called her Pat instead of Francis because she as a little girl couldn't say her ass so she couldn't say Francis and her birthday was July 5th, but she would say July the piss. So everybody started calling her pants this instead of Francis. And then that kind of morphed into her being Nona spat. It just stuck. She hated the name Francis.

02:02 She had a sister Mary and a sister Virginia and a Sister Barbara. She was the youngest of four girls and she had a little brother. He she married my dad in 1955. They went to Angola, Indiana to elope.

02:23 They drove all the way there the year before and they chickened out and decided to drive home a year later. They went and got married. My sister was born in 1956. My brother was born in 1962. I was born in 1965.

02:43 When my mom said she was pregnant with me she found out she had cancer and after I was born she had a hysterectomy and she always said I saved her life quite a gift to give your mom.

02:59 So we've talked about this before and I've never thought about it this way in that that gift of saving her life your mom found a way to pay that gift forward cuz you really created a happy home. And I know you've talked about how your friends enjoyed being around her and enjoyed being at your house to tell me. What about that?

03:20 My friend Chris was just visiting me. She's been my best friend since the eighth grade and I asked her what she remembered about my mom and she said she remembered my mom was always laughing and smiling and how happy my mom was all the time and my friend Chris didn't like going to church. So on Sundays she came over to our house and bed and my dad went to church every Sunday and my mom would steal my dad's church bulletin and send it home with my friend Chris. So her mom and dad thought that she went to church.

03:55 That's pretty funny. I never heard that before.

04:01 So, you know your mom created this house that your friends liked, but it was a refuge and a safe place for you to from what I understood from you. We what it what are some things you remember about the the way she watched out for you. I went to Flint Holy Rosary. I went to a Catholic school and I made friends in the summer with a neighborhood girl who went to Kearsley to the public school and the first day of school. She made a new friend and suddenly didn't want to be my friend anymore when we were really little and so they started calling my house prank phone calling me and this was before caller ID. So no one knew who it was, but I knew their voices and knew that they were calling.

04:47 So they hurt my feelings and would call a lot and my Mom finally called them and said she was with Michigan Bell Telephone Company and the huge amount of prank phone calls have been reported coming from their phone number and that a report was going to be filed with the police department. And after my mom did that they never bothered me anymore. I took care of the problem for sure what her love for you really shows through their I know though that that love flowed both ways. So what were some of the ways that you can remember that you helped your mom out?

05:22 My mom was five-foot-tall probably 90 lb. I'm 5 ft 8 and I'm not 90 lb everybody always said I was tall and big like my dad. And from the first time I can remember my earliest memories. My job was always I was the reacher I had to get the Bulls down out of the upper shelves or the shirt or the Linens down off of a high closet shelf. One time. I came home from high school and my mom for years would stand on a plastic Hamburg hamper in the hallway and use it like a ladder and I came home and she was falling into the hamper holding all the China that we had out for Thanksgiving and she had all the dishes stacked under her neck and was falling down into the hamper. And I said, what do I do? What do I do? And she said save the dishes?

06:17 So I got all the dishes out from under her neck can save the dishes and then I helped her out of the camper.

06:24 But my dad was always to reach for the tall things. We've got lots of dishes, but I know when we went to her house, one of the things we did was we found some of the serving pieces from that set. So is that the same set of dishes at home? Because we had so many dishes. I just kept some special pieces. We brought home some bowls and platters that we have with us now still save the dishes. I saved the dishes. That's great. That's great.

06:57 So I've heard you describe your mom is at a rock star or a Powerhouse. So don't tell me about her career and her life outside of the home.

07:07 My mom started right after high school at 17 working for General Motors. She worked for Buick motor division or Buick Motor Company and she started as a secretary by the time she retired she ran a whole claims department in the late 70s early 80s, she made over $100,000 which I never thought anything of until later in life, but she really wasn't working Pioneer. She worked at a time where once you had children the expectation was you kind of stayed home and took care of your kids. She really liked your job. So she had a long career almost 50 years with General Motors wonderful. Wonderful. So what are some of the things you remember about that time of her appointment at General Motors?

07:56 Being a head of a claims department. She must have business travel and some exciting story. She came home with

08:04 My mom would get to travel for work, but she couldn't drive on the expressway. So should we get company cars and the company car would sit in our driveway and my dad would drive her to the meeting. She had in Detroit. No one ever move it now. I never knew that just like she better be hungry or high heels like she drove herself there.

08:34 Well, so let's talk a little about that driving. I mean you said she didn't like to drive on the highway. You must have some family trips for something that you did. I remember as a little kid if you wanted McDonald and it involved a left turn against traffic. It was too bad for you got Burger King cuz it was on the right side of the road. She would never make a left turn out into traffic when your dad gets harder to drive. She learn to drive using two feet.

09:03 So she always had one foot on the gas one foot on the brake sheets trova automatic car with two feet her whole life. You have a story about her driving later in life though to yeah, because as you talk about that if she got a little bit more aggressive you remember we had that situation where she had a minor accident and her license was suspended and so I was driving back and forth to the east side of the state and I would typically stop in and see how she was doing and she had to go back in to be tested. And so that means she had to go to the Secretary of State's office and I thought will it be a good idea for me to just have some idea regardless of what the tester says of whether she really ought to be behind the wheel. So instead of me driving us to the Secretary of State's office. I gave her the keys I said Pat why don't you drive so I sat in the passenger seat or driving long to the Secretary of State's office and there was a narrow two-lane road in front of a school.

10:04 This was the middle of the afternoon right about the time that school was dismissing.

10:09 There was a small green pickup truck that was driving in front of us and he was obeying the law and driving 25 in front of the school as he should and your mom got really impatient with him and all of a sudden no turn signal. She just shifted to turn and pass the sky. And so we got oncoming traffic and I said pet what are you doing? He's just going to slow we've got to get there. I'm going to be late for my appointment six-pack get back over to get back over and finally when she got behind them. I said, I don't care what you do the back of that green truck is the only thing we're going to see until we get to the Secretary of State's office. So, you know very well I spent four years in the Army and I always tell my friends I've been in a helicopter and Hunter would my feet hanging out with a machine gun in my hands and that three mile drive to the Secretary of State's office to this day is the scariest travel I've ever

11:09 Done in my life worse than being in the jungles in a helicopter. So your mom got over her her fear of driving but that she put a little fear in the beach that day. That was bad bad news. She didn't get her license back that day. By the way. She never got her license back after it was suspended. I'll do the thing. I remember to about that day was when they finally sent the note back to her and they said I'm sorry, you didn't pass the test. Your license is still suspended. She always said if I just worn my Buick name tag with me, I had that name tag on they would have given me that license back. I know he should have seen that name tag if he'd known I work for a Buick so that was she believed that to the very end at least the difference.

12:06 So, you know the Buick name tag was obviously something that meant a lot to her and her time at Buick what were some of the other things that if you remember where some of your mom's favorite things my mom had a love of chocolate when she turned to 85 my brother a long time ago at work for Hershey The Chocolate Company he gave her 85 Hershey bars and she 885 chocolate Hershey bars in under 2 weeks. She loved food as you know, we talked about that a lot. She had a very hearty appetite but she loves chocolate. She had a mink coat that she bought was suggestion money from a suggestion that she received at work. She loved obsessively close anything. That was a designer label. She loved coach she loves Ralph Lauren. She at one point probably had almost a hundred Ralph Lauren sweater sheets.

13:06 Inverted a whole bedroom in her condo to a closet and she walked me through and say that's her elf. That's Ralph. That's her elf to everyone over Ralph Lauren sweaters. She shopped at the Vogue in downtown Flint. She shopped at Smith Bridgeman's in downtown flint. And then she loved Boutique that was called Jean carols and she would buy Pendleton wool suits and if she like this sweater, she'd buy the sweater and every color they had she loved cashmere clothes that were beautiful.

13:43 I'm so in her free time. What were some of the things that that she enjoyed doing? She like to shop shopping. Was there anything shopping list the main thing and I remember it was a kid. We would go to Eastland Mall. That's now Courtland Center and if ever we were going to buy anything should say let's go have a Coke item major decision. Let's go have a coke before we decide what we're going to do. We always go to the big boy in the mall and we'd always have a drink and then we do is go back and buy what we were getting. So it was kind of like a let me Ponder for a minute before I go spend the money and then the things always would stay in the trunk of the car and then after my dad fell asleep, she'd sneak them in the house.

14:30 You're one of the early memories that I have you don't have to you and I met and your mom would come and visit she would lay back on the couch and she always had a book with her. She loved to read didn't she did love to read and sometimes you see cute little old people and you assumed that they would love romances or happy uplifting books. My mom. My mom loves murder Gore blood crime mystery books. She had a garage sale at the kind of where she lived and everybody would come and get so excited to see all the paperback books for sale and then they would realize the type of books. They were in would look at her like she was just a terrible person.

15:12 And you said you took her to meet Sue Grafton write the author I did she got to see Sue Grafton and get a photo made with her and get her out of graph in the book. She read that whole series of books up to probably the letter T. You talked about her love of chocolate and I know your mom was Tiny.

15:37 Man, could she eat? I remember we went to that cry Chris when they were going to get lunch. She doesn't want anything for lunch, but she not getting an ice cream sundae that I know it was every bit as big as her head. I mean she she would she could put the food away. I remember that day. She looked at the menu for all of a minute and said this place is awful. There's nothing good here for me to eat. I guess I'll just get some ice cream and then she polished off that whole Sunday, and I have a photo of her from that day holding out her spoon smiling from ear-to-ear. That's great.

16:17 So you used to always go to Applebee's that was one of her favorite places to go and visit right? I just hated thinking about Applebee's so because she was so little and she was so cute with her sassy clothes. Whoever would wait on us would always say your mom is just so cute and I proceeded to say watch this.

16:39 She would like the artichoke dip the fried green beans the rib basket with fries. My mom would eat all of that. And then she get a hot fudge sundae for dessert and the minute they brought the hot hot fudge sundae every time she got it should say my God. Is that beautiful? She talks about food like it was the most beautiful thing. She had ever seen and they were always surprised at how much food she put away.

17:08 So it sounds like you and your mom spent a lot of time and did some fun things together, but there had to have been something that you learned later in life. So what what's at least one thing that you learned about your mom but you never knew through all those years. My mom is she got older lived in a memory care unit at a facility and one day started playing the piano and I never knew as a child. She had had piano lessons. I was there. Maybe she did it more than once but one day I went to visit her and the piano was there in the kind of a common area and when she sat down I could tell by her posture and by the way, she placed her fingers on the keyboard that that she had she had had some experience with playing piano remember saying to you did your mom ever play piano was she a musician that and I think you talked to your aunt to learn more about that, right? My aunt is who told me that my mom is a child. It had piano lessons. It ain't never had known that.

18:10 So you mentioned the memory care unit later in your mom's life. You have things things declined. So tell me a bit about those last few years of her life. I'm with 85.

18:25 She really was a rockstar. She'd come over and visit us to spend time with us. And we take her out to microbreweries and should see my IPA beer and say that's so pretty. It's such a pretty color and I'd say here mom take a taste and she take a case to make an ugly face with their nose all scrunched up. She looked Miller Lite or very light beers.

18:49 So at 85 she was doing great at 86. She got techno us with vascular. Dementia.

18:57 Is that really very aggressively and quickly took a toll on her and her health and

19:06 She came to our house when she was 86 for Thanksgiving.

19:12 And she declined so rapidly she never went home again. She moved into a facility and I started getting calls while I was at work. Like I had the bad kid at daycare. She punched a worker there. She punched a probably six foot tall guy there. I actually like when she punched him because he wasn't very nice and get taken something away from her and I kind of had that she's holding her own in there. But ultimately she tried to climb a fence and leave the facility so they decided they didn't want her there anymore.

19:45 I remember talking to you and we decided to bring her home. So I quit working and brought her to our house.

19:55 And we had her at her house for a year.

20:00 And during that year there was still a lot of funny things besides see like if you and I were in the kitchen and I kissed you should roll her eyes, or I'd give her a little juice glass of beer in her eyes would kind of light up and Sparkle.

20:16 But I would see that decline over time with her right to the very end. You could tell sometimes they were that little glitter. I like I'm going to get into some trouble now and she give you that look. I remember telling the people at the memory care unit that. She's she's a tough customer. She holds her own. She knows what she wants she'll get into things if you can and down and that was true for the year that she lived with us as well.

20:49 That was a good year though.

20:51 It's difficult as it was Sunday night.

20:55 One of the things that strikes me as not everyone has that opportunity and

21:01 I don't know. I I feel like that was a good decision. How do you feel about that?

21:05 I think about that a lot because I remember.

21:09 It feeling scary. I remember when she got sick we talked about how neither of us had really any medical training or expertise when my mom was young. She say if I get old just put me in one of those places and then when she got old and she'd visit friends in those places should say I don't ever want to live in one of those places and she got her way because she didn't ever really want to live in one of those places and she was so naughty that she just wasn't a good fit and ultimately they kicked her out, but I always think about

21:49 How good that experience was and how thankful I am. I had that time with her during that last year.

21:57 I think a lot about how I would run into people and people would know she had dementia and even strangers a lot of times would say does she know who you are. Does she even know who you are. And at first if it was someone I didn't know I always thought it was such a rude question, but then I got where I would realize their nervous to leave their be them with their kids or their parents with them.

22:23 And I got very aware of thinking she doesn't know who I am, but I know who I am. I'm my mother's daughter.

22:37 You know, that's that's a story well told.

22:42 About a life well-lived and I'm glad we did this. Thank you. Thank you, too, cuz I appreciate the year. Are we headed with us?

22:56 I'm glad we did that.

22:59 And

23:01 It's important to say to cuz you said I'm your queen. You're my king.

23:07 And if I'm your bride you're my groom, and I love you.

23:13 And there's nothing more to say that maybe all you need to know.

23:19 Might be more than you needed to know. Thank you. Thank you.