Meet Ukrainian Folk Artist & Educator, Mia Naumenko!

00:02 This is Leslie Scharrenbeck, folklife director of the Tuckerton Seaport, and I'm joined today by Mia Naumenko, who is the educational coordinator for the Ukrainian History and Education center in Somerset, New Jersey. We are meeting today at the center, and the date is Thursday, October 5. The Tuckerton seaport is excited to host Mia and her colleague Oksana on one of our virtual lunch and learn programs this month. Thank you so much for being here with me today, Mia.

00:28 Thank you for having me.

00:29 So, Mia, you're a descendant of ukrainian immigrants living in New Jersey, born and raised, and your uncle is a priest of ukrainian orthodox church. So can you tell us what was growing up in New Jersey like and what types of cultural traditions were around you in the home?

00:46 Absolutely. So we grew up in the diaspora population. So the people who immigrated here after World War two, my grandparents came here in the fifties. My grandmother, she was born just one year after, one year before the Holodomor started, which was the artificial genocide famine that Stalin created and starved seven to 11 million people, estimated just in Ukraine. So she came here. She went through various different DP camps and camps and stuff like that, came to America in New Jersey the whole time. My grandfather, he actually came on a plane, which was, for the 50th, a big deal, and he came here via England, actually. So he was eligible, as an 18 year old male, he was eligible for a program where you could go to England and work. And then he was able to get himself to the US. His family, actually, they came through as indentured servants. So there were people who sponsored them, and they had a contract to work their farm for x amount of time in, like, exchange for that sponsorship. So in our family, food was king. Food was everything. Food was the kind of central point of most of our celebrations and everything, food and the church. So our family was very close. We still are, thank God. But it was all about the church holidays and traditions, and that kind of made up our family calendar of what we did in the home. Ukrainian language was spoken. We say that broken English was our first language, so we did that. We spoke Ukrainian, the home. We went to a ukrainian orthodox church in Sunday school. We went on Saturdays to ukrainian school in New York City. And we were part of a ukrainian youth association. So the Ukrainian American Youth association, also known as Sum, we were all part of that scouting organization. We were in ukrainian dance. We came to this cultural center at South Boundbrook to do different activities. And so basically it was just a lot of, a lot of holidays and family and being together. And I it was mostly just about spending that time, like, preparing for holidays and stuff like that, and really just all about maintaining those recipes and getting the house ready, getting the food ready. Like, all those preparations and stuff like that were really, like, the center and the core of our family's experience, I guess you would say.

03:38 Yeah. And when you're talking about the traditions of food ways and preparing the food, is there one in particular that sticks out to you, like one for a holiday or one food way where you were like, oh, it's my favorite, or maybe this is like, oh, the most daunting.

03:55 Yeah.

03:55 Or it could be both.

03:56 Baba did everything herself, and it was always baba, why do we do it this way? Because that's how my babta did it. You know, it was kind of that kind of conversation where especially because when she was born, she was born a year before the famine started.

04:12 So I was your grandmother, a baba.

04:13 My babtia, my grandmother. So to their family, food was sacred. It was something to be really revered. And the fact that we even had the opportunity to prepare our cultural foods was a huge deal. I mean, she was almost eaten as a child, if you can imagine. So this is peak of the famine. She's 18 months old, and in Ukrainian, there's a word for a suckling pig called podasia. And there were people in her misto not village, so city, not village that were so starving that they turned cannibalism. And that obviously does things to the human mind that we're not prepared for. So they hallucinated that she was outside in the yard, and they hallucinated that she was a porusia, or a suckling pig. So they kidnapped her, and my great grandfather saved her before they were able to actually butcher her. But can you imagine having that experience as, like, one of your main core memories? And so a lot of our families, I don't know how to explain it. Like, basically, food was everything to us. And just having the abundance that we have here in the US, even as, like, a new immigrant family, just having the opportunity to express ourselves that way, that was very much how my baptism expressed herself, how she expressed her love and how she expressed her culture and what she was able to hold onto. Like, nobody could take that from her remembering the way that her grandmother or her mother prepared things. So for me, probably her borscht, which is her beet soup, we prepared it without meat for Christmas Eve every year. And to this day, I still make it. And anytime I make it, I think about her and, like, you know, think about how I wasn't cutting the onions just right or if they weren't even or, you know, just doing things, taking the time to really do things the way that her baba did them or her mother did them as a way of, you know, remembering what we had, what we didn't have, what we gave up, what was taken from us. Like, I guess the food ways, for me, is the biggest way that I connect with my family. So.

06:37 Yeah, that's beautiful. So when did you first take an interest in ukrainian folk arts? So you're growing up in this home. You're having to go to the dance lessons. You're going to the Saturday school. You're in the youth program, the scouting program. So when did you take such an interest? And just, was it something that was always there, or did you start finding that you were leaning more towards, you know, appreciation as you grew older?

07:06 So I've actually always been an artsy kind of kid. That's just my thing. I always said that I wanted to be a famous artist who traveled the world with my mother. That was my. My number one thing, you know? Fortunately, that didn't happen. But in the home itself, because of the way that they immigrated and their camps that they went through and stuff, they didn't have many things from home. So the art that was on the walls, these are all things that were purchased at festivals or in the diaspora once they came here. So the art aspect didn't really come to me in terms of ukrainian folk arts until we got into ukrainian school and we're doing these kinds of things. My grandfather did play the bandura, and he sang, so there was always a lot of singing and food. Those were, like, our two things, but in terms of the actual fine arts or folk arts or learning about piss on k, we did them as kids, but only when we learned them in ukrainian school and stuff like that. Art itself was not something that was necessarily big in the home.

08:10 Interesting. And so how did you come about getting involved, then, in the ukrainian history and education center? And what's your role here?

08:18 So I am the assistant education coordinator. My primary role is that I put together educational programming, so workshops. We did a summer camp this year, which was super cool, putting that kind of stuff together. I got here basically just starting off volunteering. So we've come to this community for a long time. My family, for over 60 years, has been a part of this whole south Boundbrook church community. My uncle's a priest, as you said, so I'm grateful to have that, but I just started volunteering here as a favor to Oksana, and it just kind of organically came from there. I realized how much passion I actually had for it, and I was just grateful to be given the opportunity to be able to put that to work.

09:07 Yeah. So what types of educational classes and programming do you provide for students? Because you have a very robust programming schedule here in summer camps and everything we do.

09:17 So the summer camp, that was new this year, Oksana and I put that together. We're actually, right now, this winter, we're launching our first, like, asynchronous learning option. So it'll be a subscription box you'll get in the mail. You'll get the box with everything you need to complete three crafts. And there's a QR code for a video where you can watch a presentation with information and then a hands on, like, instruction on how to do it. So, like, that's a pretty cool one that we're just starting.

09:46 What are the three crafts that they were going to learn?

09:49 That's a surprise. We haven't launched it yet, so. But we will launch it in December. So December 1. That'll come out.

09:54 So stay tuned.

09:56 Yes. So with the adult programming this year, we're really looking to get into more along the foodways line of work and connecting that to some of the things in our collection. Everything that we do ultimately gets brought back to something in our collection, something in our library, something that we have. So we do a lot of piss unco workshops, which we did those with you guys. We do all different folk arts. We've done paint and sips, focusing on Maria Primachenko, who's a very famous ukrainian artist. We just try to bring attention to all different facets and aspects of our culture. So we do in person workshops, virtual workshops. We do lectures. We have a genealogy program, which is super interesting. And it's not just limited to Ukrainians. We also have resources for anybody in eastern Europe. So, like, that's kind of cool. Cool. What else? We have the kids programs. We do learning also for all ages. So from kindergarten all the way through continued learning, we have a lot of our elderly people who like to come and do, like, our wreath making workshop. And so that's. We got a little something for everybody, I'd like to think.

11:08 Yeah, that's really interesting. So now that you're on the other side of the fence, the student that became the teacher. Right. What do you see as trends in learning for ukrainian students about their culture and heritage? Are there certain folk arts that they tend to gravitate more towards, or is it a good mix?

11:26 I think it's a pretty good mix. I think that's why it's so important that we have, like you say, that robust amount of options just because different people gravitate towards different things, or for me, what I think, and this is just my own opinion, this is not a UATC opinion, but for me, what I think is that just like in my family, the thing that we always associated with, our experience with food, I think depending on, because Ukraine is such a big country, and depending on where you are in the country, your experience with a war, with just anything that happens in that country is so drastically different. So I think that depending on where your family's from, what you had, what you lacked, what was available to you, what wasn't available to you, in my experience, impacts what you're interested in. So if you were somebody who didn't have a lot of exposure to, let's say, fiber arts, so whether that's weaving or embroidery, that might be something that you find curious, because you don't have a lot of exposure or knowledge, and that's kind of what happened with me, at least. So I can only really speak to my own experience.

12:37 Yeah. So the wide variety of programs that you offer to students in part of outreach, one of the things that you bring to your students are folk dolls, which are unique to Ukraine and to the boat culture. So can you talk a little bit about the tradition of these dolls and why they are so important and what they're called as well?

12:56 Yes, absolutely. So it's called alka motanka or a motanka. The ones that you're talking about, where they have the crosses on the face, this is actually something that's been done in Ukraine or in that region since the fifth and 6th century bc. So you're talking about thousands of years, and it's called the tripillian cucuteni culture, and they've been doing it since then. The doll itself is a symbol of female empowerment and of the female power and form. And the dolls in the center there usually has a little sachet, and what you would put in there would depend on what your intention was with making the doll. So these dolls are amulets, they're talismans. They're meant for protection. They have a purpose. They're not just something to play with. They're always wrapped, which is motanka comes from the word motate, which means to wrap or to reel. So these dolls, you will never use scissors or anything to, like, pierce it or pinch it, because they say that that lets the power go. So whatever you put in the satchel, you use scraps of fiber and fabric, typically speaking. I mean, this is backpack. You would do it with whatever is locally available. So depending on your intention in making the doll, you would use different materials. Also with those dolls, you would never put a face on it. So you would never, ever put a face on it, because they say that a soul can inhabit it if it has a face, and that's not what these are here for. These have a purpose, and usually it's protection. So you would never want to allow any kind of spirit or anything to inhabit that doll. So the reason you never pierce it and you do the wrapping and the reeling is because you don't want it to lose its power. So, yeah. I don't know if you have any other questions.

14:52 No, that's just really interesting. So they're not. So they're different than ordinary dolls or what we think of as an ordinary doll. Is there a special place that you're to put them?

15:02 So, again, it depends on the intention. There are typically four different purposes for a motunka. One is for protection. So to ward off or keep away any kind of, like, evil or illness. Illness, especially motunke, were often used. If a child was sick, you would make them a motanka and place it in the. In the crib or the bed with them, and it's supposed to take the illness away from the child. Another thing is you would make one. It's also a symbol of, like, generational love and, like, the thread between generations. So if you were getting married, you would often make a matanka. And then before you had your first child, you would put it in the. In the crib. So they're put to work. They're used for protection. They're used to bring in, like, good harvest or, like, good luck for the new year and. Or. Yeah, cleaning. So removing an evil spirit or something that's there. I. So, depending on what the purpose of the motunka is, again, you would use different materials. Ultimately, they kind of morphed into something that was a little bit more decorative and a little bit more. I don't know how to explain it, but they morphed into something a little bit different. But the core of what a motanka is, is she's a protectress. She's a protectress. She is a symbol of female power. And the threads between generations in the family.

16:35 Cool. What is. So we talked. When we had the egg workshop, we talked a lot about the folklore that's behind the eggs. So what is your favorite piece of ukrainian folklore? Perhaps a legend or story you were told growing up or something that, you know, if and when you maybe have kids, you would pass that down to them.

16:58 So my babusha or my babta, she always would tell us Kazuki, which are like. Like fairy tales, you know, ukrainian fairy tales, a lot of them focused around Baba Yaga, who is like an infamous slavic, you know, creature, I guess you could say, because she's not officially human. But what I love about her is that there's so many variations and so many different ways that you can look at her originally and back. Back. She was considered to be like, an oracle or somebody who was, like, a person of wisdom. She didn't start off as somebody to fear. The fear came in if you tried to trick her or didn't heed her warnings, and that when people in the stories would really find you could, say, harm, or, like, the negative aspects of her really only came in when the person themselves did something. So I love. I love stories about her. She's a little trickster, and there's many different ways that she's described, and, you know, but really, she's a sage. She's with, she's wisdom. She's a person who gives you advice, and if you don't take it, that's up to you kind of thing. So I love her. I love learning about all little folk creatures. So, like, we have one called the Lisavec, and he's like, the spirit of the forest. They say that he looks like this giant tree, and, like, you have to really catch him, and if you see him, he wanted you to see him. So, like, there's all these little, like, creatures and myths, and I love all of that.

18:37 That's really interesting. What, what do you think is your favorite folk art of Ukraine to practice or take part in? Are there, you mentioned your grandmother a lot, so are there personal cultural traditions that are tied to it? I know you mentioned cooking and that for sure as a food way, but is there something else that you like to practice as well?

18:59 I would love to say that I am skilled with embroidery, but I'm not. I'm trying. I'm trying to learn, but really, I love writing pesanke. I really, truly do. The east, the ukrainian Easter eggs. My cousins and I used to sit around leading up to Easter. So you typically do it for the whole season, and it's just a time where you sit and you just enjoy each other's company. Just like with the matanque, the intentions that you put into these eggs are supposed to be reflected in who you give them to. So you have to make sure that you're in a clean space. You have a clear mind, you have good intentions. And I think just those practices of not just sitting there and copying a design, but that you really get into the headspace of it, and you have to think about, okay, I'm giving this to somebody, like, what do I want to give them? Do I want to give them, you know, wisdom? Do I want to give them protection? Do I want to give them health? Do I want to give them. And I just love that, that trend, like, the translation of what you wish for a person, putting it onto something and gifting it to them, and, like, just that sharing of intention and space. So for me, that's what I really love.

20:12 What is your most rewarding part of your position here at ukrainian history and education center?

20:18 To date? It's been working with the kids, like, watching them. You know, one of the things that I think we do well here, that is a struggle in some other organizations, is that we do everything bilingual, mostly in English, though, which now that we're getting to, like, 3rd, 4th, 5th generation Ukrainians, a lot of the time, the culture tends to get, and I use the term watered down just in the sense that it's not as concentrated. You don't have as much focus on the ukrainian culture, the ukrainian language, going to ukrainian school, a lot of the times, people are moving into more. I say secular activity is not actually religious, but just in terms of outside of the culture. And for us, or for me personally this year, doing the summer camp and watching kids, I had one of my friend's daughters come in. She's not ukrainian at all, and she's learning about, they could point out all these cities on the map, and they're learning about artists and who they are and where they were born and what their experiences were, and learning the words and just watching those, like, light bulbs go off as they connect with the information. That, to me, is the best thing. And it doesn't matter whether it's a kid or it's somebody who's 80 and learning a new skill. We had somebody come for a piss uncle workshop, and I believe she was in her eighties and just watching her, you know, it's watching people connect with the information and the people who actually take it in and really want to, like, understand it and understand who we are and what we do and the appreciation of our culture that for me is, like, everything.

21:55 Yeah. So the role being new, but you've done a lot in your tenure here. What do you hope is the future of ukrainian history and education center?

22:07 Just more. I hope just more. More people, more involvement, more engagement, more spreading the word, especially now during the wartime, you know, with what's happening in Ukraine right now, I think it's more important than ever to really re anchor the people of our culture into their roots, but also to help spread the word of, like, what it is we're fighting for, you know, what we're fighting to protect.

22:35 And so that being said, what do you think are some challenges that the community, or even you face in regards to the preservation of folk arts in the ukrainian community?

22:45 I think it's. I think it's mostly just the way that people schedules are packed now. You know, I feel like anybody I know who has kids, and I don't personally have children right now, but I feel like anybody I know who has kids, they're always on the go. It's like a thousand different activities. They have so much going on. Even from, like, five and six years old, they start having all these activities and all these things. And I understand not everybody is going to dedicate their life to ukrainian culture. Of course, I don't expect that. But for us, I think part of the challenge is that people are already spread so thin. So where do we find our. How do we find a way to find a meaningful spot in their life? Right? Because I don't want it to be just a cursory whatever. Like, how do we make those meaningful connections? And once we have those meaningful connections, how do we help people just truly make it a part of their life? Because it's special. We're lucky, and it's special that we have this. And for me, that's like, you know, the biggest blessing and the biggest struggle is trying to make those connections and keep them.

23:53 Yeah. And so if you could teach listeners, and I asked Oxana this, too, as my last question, if you could teach listeners one word in Ukrainian, what would it be? Or it could be phrase, what would it be? And what does it mean?

24:08 So that one is definitely easy, especially right now, it's going to be slava, Ukraine. And that means glory to Ukraine. And that is a phrase that we use in solidarity with Ukrainian, the ukrainian state maintaining its independence. A phrase that when you say it to somebody who's ukrainian, their face lights up and they will respond to you and say, heroiam Slava, which means glory to our heroes. So that, to me, is everything wonderful.

24:44 Well, thank you so much for taking the time out today to meet with me.

24:47 Thank you for having me.