Miguel Solis and Corbett Smith

Recorded October 15, 2019 Archived November 5, 2019 40:28 minutes
0:00 / 0:00
Id: mby019374


Friends Miguel Solis (33) and Corbett Smith (43) talk about how they met their wives, how Corbett became a journalist, and Miguel's child's heart transplant.

Subject Log / Time Code

MS remembers meeting his wife in middle school.
MS remembers returning to Texas after having moved away.
CS talks about working with his wife and how they met.
CS describes how he became involved in journalism.
MS remembers his wife getting pregnant for the first time and having a miscarriage.
MS describes the series of events that proceeded to reveal his child was born with a heart defect.
MS remembers being told that his child needed a heart transplant.
MS describes meeting the family of his child's heart donor.


  • Miguel Solis
  • Corbett Smith

Recording Locations

Dallas Public Library: North Oak Cliff Branch


Partnership Type



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00:06 My name is Miguel Solis. I am 33 years old. Today is Tuesday, October 15th, 2019. We are in Dallas, Texas and I am currently being interviewed and going to participate in my own interviewing of Dallas Morning News journalist and great friend, Corbett Smith.

00:29 And I'm Corbett Smith. I'm 43 years old Miguel is my colleague not necessarily colleague but more of a source and a person that I've have worked with in the past and we've developed a friendly relationship is great guy. So hopefully hopefully this conversation without recognizing my lights in in the intention of this is also to remain friends after this process Edition should be should be one that is amiable and hopefully enlightening and so on and so forth, but I've made fun of you today for wearing your Harvard University tie and I'd like to talk about that here in a little bit happy to but let's start with your children. Tell Ty

01:23 Yeah, your ear lapel pin Children's Health.

01:29 The story of your your daughter's Journey. That's a lot of folks. And so I'd kind of like to

01:37 Get that get that on tape, but I just want to talk to you first about you and your wife Jacqueline Wortman you guys grew up in the same town and Port Arthur.

01:57 How did you meet her and how did y'all end up coming together in and decide to make a family Jacqueline's family for the most part came to Port Arthur Texas as immigrants from Monterrey Mexico as best as I know. My family grandparents came from o cuales Jalisco in Leon Guanajuato Mexico as immigrants in the early nineteen hundreds, both of those families ended up in Port Arthur.

02:27 And as if I've altimate Lee found out ended up living not too far from each other in the city of Port Arthur has a fairly small City, but it's still like in the grand scheme of cities within Texas a large or small City. So the fact that these two families would be living in close proximity to each other. It's just sort of like an interesting fact, but the point is Jacqueline and I both grew up in Port Arthur Texas and that we would ultimately end up going to a meeting each other at st. Catharines Elementary Middle School, which is a pre-k through 8th Catholic school. Now, you guys are the same age. She's a year younger than I am and the funny story about how Jacqueline and I met is that I didn't even know who Jacqueline nortman was until my brother fell in love with her. My brother is a year younger than I am and he's in Jacqueline's grade. So it was by him falling in love with her.

03:22 And then me realizing that it was highly unlikely that that was ever going to manifest into anything seeing a unique opportunity to potentially get to know Jacqueline. Nortman better writing her a very explicit love note in 7th grade. She was a 6th grade that specifically stated.

03:41 If you like me Circle yes or no.

03:45 She circled. Yes and our lives were forever changed, but had you guys like kind of just passed in the hallway at at at class? Did you know her did your brother invite her over to the house to she was never invited her. She was never invited over to the house. It is sort of the first interaction that we had which was the only interaction prior to the writing of the note because that you know, when I know that I have there something in my life, I think you recognized it when I know there's something I want. I'm pretty quick to begin to act on that. You've always been that way. I guess I have you I mean it goes all the way to me. This is it just another example, right? But but but predating the stuff that you see me do ya we were at her friend was my cousin her best friend is my cousin and I was eating at a Luby's with my cousin who came up with the idea cuz she knew that I like Jacqueline of inviting Jacqueline over to watch the movie Aladdin.

04:42 Such a romantic movie. So I tagged along and that's whenever we had our first interaction and we we fill smitten with each other and then that generated the note funny though because we there multiple notes that were created an exchange after the initial note and we use code names in case the nose ever got was your coat in Aladdin. You want to get so hers was it was it that the female character in The LAD? Was that Triton Jasmine Jasmine? So for years, we would go by Aladdin and Jasmine sort of like in a playful way after you have grew up. You still have the actress played a little role in like are getting married and in any way so but the point is we met I was in seventh grade she was in sixth grade and

05:29 We stayed together if up until my junior year of high school. I move to Colorado dad found out. I got a promotion and it didn't put him in Colorado. I came back to go to Lamar University in Beaumont, Texas. So why did you come back?

05:48 I purely because

05:52 I was 16 years old. I was a 16 year old male full of testosterone who was ripped out of the community that raised him move to a foreign community of Denver Colorado win from one of the smallest schools in Texas to the largest Public School in Colorado. And I was so Furious about that experience that the second that I can get out of my house proper and go back to my home that raised me. I was going to do it and it just so happened that my dad was was able to provide me a choice you either go to work because I told him I was going to drop out of high school. So you either go to or and not go to college either go to work to make money or I'll kick you out of the house or you think education seriously and you go to school. He took me to work for 2 weeks, which was sweeping floors and pressure washing grocery stores, and I said, no, I don't think imma do that. They want to go to college.

06:52 Syfy the only school that made sense to me to get back home, which was Lamar University, which is in Beaumont, Texas, which is 10 minutes away from the city that I grew up in you a lot of family still living in Beaumont in that area and basically all my family and all of Jacqueline family was there so one of the reasons I wanted to go back was because there was this little bit of you know, I still love Jacqueline, right? So there was a romantic element to it, but I can't buy any means hit that was the deciding like a driving force that said went to Lamar at the end of my freshman year. I wrote Jacqueline another note and I got a friend to give it to her. She was a senior now in high school and I found at the Jacqueline was going to be going to the new University of Detroit Mercy softball full-ride scholarship to study biochemistry, and I was like if I let her go

07:39 Someone is going to immediately realize the mistake that I made they will fall in love with her and I'll never be able to have another chance at being with her dude. You feel some hesitation coming back to college and dating a high school senior. So you hadn't immediately can reconnect it know it was she had a boyfriend.

07:58 And

08:00 I'd gone through this experience already once recognizing that there was someone who like Jacqueline and then I realized that kind of wasn't going to work out. So that was sort of the same experience happening again. I know that sounds dark that I keep going back to back my brother being in love with Jacqueline and then it not working out but I mean like in this or any other yeah. Yeah, you know, he's been a great uncle brother-in-law. So yeah so weak. We she read the note we found love again and then our story's been what it is. When did you guys decide to have a family or was that always in the in the mix if you disguise assume that you were going to have kids we knew we were going to have children we knew we didn't want to rush into the decision.

08:45 We didn't want to rush into actually signing. We're going to have the baby but we wanted to be very prudent about the thought making that would go into making the decision and ended specifically be financially stable.

08:59 So it was a very calculated decision.

09:02 And thank God it was because everything that has manifest since Olivia into this world.

09:14 Was made exponentially easier if I can use that term in her experience because of how thoughtful we were right where you were in your careers your status. Absolutely you change the game.

09:31 So hold on we'll go to Olivia. Who are you married to?

09:37 Give me to am I married who you married married to Nicole Stockton? What is an exacto? She's the digital director of the Dallas Morning News. So you work with my wife with your wife intentionally intentionally. Okay, let's let's break that down for that, I am not a particularly great journalists. I am a work at a journalist and I've gotten into this industry largely to be able to be able to have lunch with my spouse interesting kid. So very calculate like that's that's the I enjoy work. I enjoy spending time with my wife and how did y'all meet so we met in college so we met in

10:14 I had

10:16 Applied late to the University of Kansas have a very peripatetic college career was there just one year.

10:24 I'm in applying late admission for their dorms was only.

10:33 I ended up getting the all male dorm and I ended up getting the international dorm size put on a wing with a lot of really interesting fellows my my roommate Fabio or cream of it. What's up of Jewish descent, but from Italy and played in the 3rd division in Italian soccer in his coming for his graduate degree and was every bit a handsome Italian man that people swooned over he'd wake up I'd wake up in the morning. He be doing crunches in the middle of the floor exercise has such a mean dick. Sorry Hank. See I'm still friends with you now lives in Hong Kong and so we've talked to them about tables and architecture school. So a lot of interesting people

11:20 The very fact that it was an international dorm meant that people weren't necessarily familiar with the idea of student government. Somebody else on the hall was the student was the hall president and he said I need a vice president and I think the only good luck man. Looks like it's going to be tough to find he's not my bag. He's shoehorn me into going. So I agreed to go on a trip to Fargo North Dakota was a student body Summit where they were taking the these college elected officials, which why I was not my wife was for her dorm was a vice-president my wife very much someone who is being sued in politics and we met up there and started talking indie rock and that was that was it and so first off, I think it's it's so romantic that you both.

12:20 I assumed we were to meet each other for the first time in Fargo North Dakota. No, we actually met in the the four-year of Ellsworth Hall in Kansas part of the trip because we everybody was carpooling and she was really loud and it was about 6:30 in the morning and I was like it was the same noxious person. So my initial thought of my wife was not a kind one, but the years have have shown my initial response to be wrong. So I am I continue to remain intrigued by the idea of you and your wife both not only being journalists but working at the same journalistic institution. How did that first off? Why journalism and I think one of the reasons why I wanted you to be in in this interview was because I believe strongly in a

13:15 Supported and strong fourth estate. I know that sounds crazy coming from an elected official who in some in some ways, you know, our institution is wired in a way to maybe not have made maybe not have the best relationship with your nose. And because we are often the targets of the practice of journalism mean in a particular way, but I think that accept is coming because of the storied relationship that is sure that between public affairs in the fourth estate. The point is

13:50 I believe in a strong for the state and I believe that it's essential to the health of our democracy. And I also believe that the fourth estate is being challenged in a way that I'm not quite sure we have seen to date in the American experiment which brings me to say you couldn't have predicted that we couldn't have predicted it but we saw the signs when you see first will be before you go into that though. Did you see the signs when you were deciding? I want to be a journalist. Like what what what came and did why did you want to become a drink there? A lot of people who come into that through high school and that we have had experience with high school paper. I did not I came I grew up in a small South Texas school Funk at the high school. Shout out to the Bulldog to my knowledge. They didn't have high school paper. I think we had your book and I was it so I did not have any experience there.

14:40 Did not go to college and did not eventually graduate from college with the journalist degree did it because I was good at it. My wife said you should try that and I tried it and people to like you can do that. So in a short-order, I I went from writing a story to be in the sports editor of the Wichita State paper covered their basketball team. And that was that was the big news on Town and then I got a freelancing job with their local newspapers Wichita Eagle and turn that into a kind of a part-time job that Joanna Chadwick was there a shed to prep Rogers at the time and she got pregnant and went on maternity leave and I filled into that spot. So within about six months. I went from have never written a an article at all to being able to fill a part-time role at a local newspaper where I was riding through four times a week and being a Ford faced. So it was a natural fit for me early, but then I stepped away from it.

15:40 Once we move to Dallas my wife moved from the Wichita Eagle to the Dallas Morning News as a copy editor. I stepped away from it for about a year and then I reached out to one of the sports editors here in town and said yeah I can freelance for y'all and I put my toe back in the water when I got out of law school. My wife was pregnant with our first child and I did not want to practice law.

16:09 Keith Campbell who is now the managing editor of the paper said and we'd like to bring you on a contract work because we like what you've done as a freelancer I did and I have made my way to something that I'm naturally good at. It does it's not something that I had a lifelong aspirations. If anything that would have been like being a high school football coach. That's what my dad was when I grew up. That's what I grew up around and I never really had aspirations of that once I went to college but that was probably the thing that I would dream about that as a child what I wanted to be and where I expected to be. It wasn't a journalist. My wife was a totally different story. She was somebody who grew up writing for the school paper and with college on a journalism scholarship, and it's a lot more.

16:57 You're ingrained in her and I'm just following her coattails Miguel have one one final question on this piece. And then and then if you want me to go to the story of Olivia, but it sounds to me in in you can correct me hear if I'm wrong, perhaps that your love of the above telling the story of sports may have been a big Catalyst for your ultimate desire to become a journalist, or was it just your love of telling stories in your ability Your Capacity to lose you to write organizationally. I think that kind of thing. I think that is a undersold point of being a journalist now there a lot of journalists who are aspiring fiction writers. That is not me. I have no interest in it. So this is the question that I've got for you.

17:48 Do you Nicole disagree about what journalism should be your elements of Journalism or like how do you and does that does your philosophy around the telling of a story in her philosophy on the television. Is that every class has and if that if it's the dancers, yes, or that their elements of the answer that are yes, do you ever see that manifests in like your personal relationship with her like does that does work play into y'all's relationship work?

18:15 Is always a constant discussion point in our relationship, but never of conflict mean we've been together for

18:26 What is going on twenty-four years 23 years after I came back from that trip? We were dating and some form or fashion apart for a long time. But that mean that was that was it. Like I found somebody to 2 to go with a night. I went with it and lots of kids that three kids now. So I mean it's it is a is a talking point. I don't think we disagree fundamentally about the the tenets of Journalism in and I think we're both concerned about the future of Journalism, especially as it relates to small-town. I think the Dallas Morning News will be able to weather in some fashion and maybe not with the staff that has now but in some fashion it'll be able to weather the the change in the economics of Journalism, but small towns already.

19:15 The loan source of local news be choked out and that's that's terrible sight to see and I don't see that changing anytime soon. I don't I think it was a prescient story that came out New York Times wrote it about a small town in Maine where everybody was lamenting the fact that the local paper was closing the superintendent schools was tearing his hair out the like that the mayor was upset. And neither of them had a subscription to the little favor. They were they were tore up about it and worried what would happen without the journalistic arm in their Town neither of them some scratch out of a skin in the game. No skin.

19:57 Yeah, that is how we met and that's why we're still together. So getting back to you will get it.

20:08 You guys get pregnant does that fairly easy process will take you know, what get pregnant pretty quick the get pregnant pretty quick element of the process. Yes. I've actually never share this we tried a time for and were successful.

20:28 And then I had to deliver a

20:34 A blanket on the word the speech at a funeral eulogy eulogy. I deliver the eulogy for my uncle in Houston. And so I get there or I deliver the eulogy and leave the funeral go to my aunt's house and Jacqueline comes up to me and tears and she said, you know, I'm having an episode that is extremely concerning we found out that she was pregnant. I think five or six weeks prior had gone so far as to go in and you know it determine a crisis right now.

21:11 And she ended up losing the baby. So we had been through that experience and it was it was a lot to it. But at the same time because it was so quick it was from I think it's I don't have any other way to put it other than it didn't hit me as hard as it hit her. Absolutely. My wife and I had the miscarriage the first time we had a we attempted to be pregnant and we had a late waited late. And so we got pregnant by six weeks in very similar story and she was devastated and I was like kind of a deer in the headlights like what what has happened and what is this mean for like our future family and I will never come into it thinking I was expecting kids. Like I did not have that expectation. Did you have expectations of having a larger family not necessarily about having a larger family having a child absolutely like that because we had been in this relationship.

22:11 So long it it almost was we were we were bought into the notion of a ROM the Romanticism of a relationship that it's most archetypical like, you know manifestation. So, of course you get married and then you know, you have a child and you'd have your you know home and you had it right, you know like so it caught me off-guard but at the same time

22:42 German experiences in my life and this is really cold to say but like I lost my best friend to cancer at the age of 13 right before that. I lost my favorite coach to a heart attack on the track field as I am running a race. I lost my dad at the age of 23 to cancer six months prior to that. I lost my grandfather 2 to terminal cancer a ice cream experience so much loss at a personal visceral level that that this was sort of like that it was devastating but it was something that I quickly rebounded from very different experience for Jacqueline and rightfully so like that. So the point is

23:25 Quick to pregnancy, but the second go-around is fraught with concern totally right and stay with us so you can now imagine because we had had that prior experience and the second go-around was fraught with concern that believing that everything was fine this go around and then you immediately be hit with another set of existential circumstances.

23:50 There are consequences of all of that still linger today 19 months into the life of Olivia to did that second pregnancy go. Well. Was it smooth? It went nearly flawlessly in the only reason it didn't is the very reason why my you and I are talking and my daughter is still alive Jacqueline was set to give birth in the month of March.

24:20 I can't remember that first trimester second trimester third trimester is either the 2nd or the beginning of the third trimester. She was diagnosed with a form of diabetes. I'm thinking on the Station to Station by then. You got man you got a lot of just stational diabetes. So that was so that was the only complication in the process and it didn't really

24:44 Show up too much in the pregnancy is self. It was like yeah, you have it but you kind of made me like almost don't have it. So it's okay. But because she had that Olivia who during the process there was no identification of anything wrong with her heart. She was Jacqueline was told that she was going to need to have the baby a little early, but at the appropriate time I saw it wasn't early in a scientific CF exactly, February 22nd babies born

25:17 And when the baby arrives her blood pressure, her blood sugar is very low.

25:24 Which is it concerning sign for any child, especially concerning sign for a gestational diabetes child because it can indicate a very significant attachment of the child to dependency on the medicine that Jacqueline was receiving. Thank God her blood sugar was low because almost immediately the baby was taken into the neonatal Intensive Care Unit the NICU

25:50 And we hook the baby up. I remember walking in and seeing one IV in her little hand it yet mean is the what you just reacted like that reaction was my reaction with tears cuz oh my God is a brand new baby. Did you did you just like holder right after we got to hold her right after delivery. So, you know when they like after you hold the baby they then place the baby on that weighing unit that warms him up yet. That's when we started to begin to realize it was something a little wrong with her blood sugar, but then we got to hold a little more and then we did a couple more tests and then we said, okay, let's bring it to the NICU.

26:26 And bring her to the NICU.

26:29 The doctor her pediatrician came into the hospital and said listen to her heart and said I hear a murmur which is not unusual for brand new babies. Sometimes they're both a little holes at clothes over the course of a day or two.

26:43 The next day she still in the NICU cuz they're still trying to regular blood sugar. The doctor comes in and he says that murmur is got a little louder more pronounced just to be safe before you leave. I'd like to order an echocardiogram which is a scan of the heart.

26:59 Echocardiogram comes in

27:01 And it produces a result. That is what we now know to be a devastating diagnosis, which is a bicuspid our unit cuspid valve aortic stenosis, which essentially is you and I and probably most people that are listening to this at any point in time in hidden in the future are born with an aortic valve that regulates blood flow that looks like a Mercedes-Benz sign right there three laps tricuspid there three flaps that open and shut Olivia only had one flap that was opening and it was barely opening. So it was putting tremendous pressure on her heart and that's not sustainable for a newborn past may be a few days had we have taken the baby home.

27:53 She would have passed away. Like there's no doubt in my mind that it would have almost been her passing away at home or bringing her to the emergency room in her heart being so weakened that it could not have survived any of the procedures that she would go through moving forward. She had a heart attack. She didn't have a heart attack know what what what ultimately happened is.

28:13 We diagnose the heart we knew that we would need to do almost immediate intervention, but that almost turned into waiting two days.

28:23 We were the process was a catheter process that alien plus balloon that went into the aortic valve to open it up. And what happened is it did too good of a job it open it up so much that blood rushed back down into our her ventricle and it stopped her heart. So the cardia. It with it that it was essentially like it was a heart attack, but it was it just a complete stopping of the heart and 63 minutes of CPR to keep her heart functioning enough to be able to place her on life support which was a surgery in and of itself in this life support machine that she was placed on was was developed for battlefields to keep soldiers who'd been on the battlefield alive on a helicopter to get them back for surgery. So that was the beginning of the

29:20 Epic

29:23 Episodes of Olivia story as a as a

29:28 Two-day-old add. Yeah one day old add to seeing your child.

29:35 Being compressed for an hour

29:43 The process has to be just absolutely terrifying.

29:47 Was it was it some numbing that it is? It was it was it was immediate Terror?

29:54 Although I will say it was so the good thing is and the bad thing is I actually didn't I wasn't in the catheter lab while they were doing the compressions. We were right outside the room knowing the compressions were being done which is a little more terrifying perhaps because you're like what to CPR on a baby. Like, how does that even in my baby that's happening right now.

30:20 The terror quickly turned into being numb because I'd already been conditioned for Terror because of what had happened with a diagnosis like that in and of it hurt being told that your daughter has a serious heart defect. It's going to require immediate intervention that begins to condition you to handle tear a little better. And so yes, it's what if did turn into immediate shock which turned into a numbness recognizing that my wife was in extreme pain and fear. So what that didn't manifest into was prayer.

31:03 And just like everybody me directing everybody to just let go of trying to be able to control the situation and just throw yourself into faith. And in in many ways that process guided us that that Devotion to Faith because of our inability to be able to control any of the circumstances despite all the education and all the experiences that we've had guided the rest of Olivia's journey in the hospital into a to a degree still guides how we approach living with her every day. Did you consider yourself Faithfully observant prior to that time on and off you remember at the beginning of conversation Jacqueline and I we went to Catholic school. So we were very we were conditioned at a very malleable stage in one's life to recognize the role that faith can play for you and as any, you know, good Catholic then we were going to church like every week.

32:04 That we move significantly from that. Have you moved back since. For the most part I can't say with to you that we are Faithfully going to what you're not going every weekend right but I mean like prayer is much more a part of our everyday experience and we wake up and we pray with Olivia and we pray for her donor. I in their family who we just met this past weekend. We'll talk about that before you get out of here and we can we close this. We're so fast forward a couple of different attempts and very surgeries help sustain, Olivia.

32:45 But eventually you're you're you're giving the news you need a donor and she's 2 months at the time. She is. Yeah. She we are told that she we found a donor on her the day before her three-month birthday. We were we were told that we were likely going to have to pursue a heart transplant.

33:07 Basically within the first 20 days of Olivia's life, but when you're told that you're told about it in two different ways while you're told about like the immediate nature of needing a heart transplant in order for your daughter to survive that's going number one, right? She needs to continue to live the second piece though is all the complications that come with having a heart transplant which will stick with her for the rest of her life. And we don't quite know how long her life is going to be now. I don't know how long you're going to live Corbett. You don't know how long I'm going to live with her. That's a more pronounced forecasting and it's a it's a day today deal, right?

33:48 You get a heart transplant?

33:52 I talked to you interviewed you for a story.

33:56 The day after

34:01 Finding out that you have a donor heart is

34:07 From your expression to me seems as if it is the most joyful.

34:13 I've have a Lifeline for my daughter and in a way rueful you have recognized that.

34:22 Some child has lost his or her life in order to make that process happen last weekend. You meet with a donor family that had to be crazy experience for for you. At least it was very emotional.

34:40 And yet at the same time there was a little bit of surprise in that.

34:47 You know again, we have these ideas of sort of like the romantic archetypical way things work themselves out and I think like where you to paint a picture of what that would look like you would imagine, you know, two families coming around the corner with the baby to see each other and then listening to the baby's heart and then just tears of emotion that are that are happening our experience with a little different. There was still a ton of Joy to the hospital facility it do you transplant organization did did help to facilitate it? Yeah, cuz there's a ton of like further rules. But this shows you like at we're talking on August on October 15th 2019 for anyone listening to this in the future. You need to recognize that

35:34 Like social media and the way that stories can I connect across the world in a very quick way is so Dynamic that because we were very public with Olivia story during the process. Literally the day that Olivia's donor a little 18 month old boy by the name of Killian passed away.

35:59 And

36:01 The decisions that went into Killian being a donor the parents making that decision and the the fact that they knew that killing his heart had been accepted by a family.

36:17 But in that time frame the family that ultimately made the donation they knew about Olivia story. They knew that she was waiting for a heart. They knew that the day that they made the decision to donate his heart that she was told of news that she was going to get a heart. They had already piece together that Killian was going to save alivia's life.

36:42 So we met each other but we already had come to terms with the fact because of social media and journalism that he was her lifeline and they've been following her story ever since such great his life-saving donation. So it was sort of it was a more. Joyful like it's so great to finally meet you but there was still that romantic element of the mother and the father placing the stethoscope on Olivia's chest and knowing that there was little boy was in some way still alive through her and we gave them some and we gave them other a locket with Olivia's picture in Killian's picture and we gave the data picture of both of the babies swinging in separate instances in Olivia's looking a little to the severe left looking at Killian to this node to she's here having that same experience. He was having because of him.

37:42 So this is beautiful, but it was a different type of beautiful.

37:49 So we took the clothes because we don't have very much time.

37:55 What message do you want to impart for your child when she listens back on this interview? What do you want to tell her about?

38:08 You and your wife and about your relationship with her and you know.

38:14 Your perspectives as a parent now with her in your life. I think this conversation is going to be an extremely informative conversation for her.

38:28 I first and so that the first thing is like, you know, I want her to recognize that she is a product of a beautiful coming together.

38:43 A lifetime of coming together of two people who were very intentional about wanting to see her in this world and that that long process of coming together in some ways gave us the strength necessary to ensure that she could stay in this world when her life was literally at the most crucial point. The second thing I wanted to know actually is like the power of Journalism. There's a little bit of you being here as an example of like the Dynamics of

39:23 Telling a story and the power that that story can have in shaping the lives of people herself included. I love you. And the last thing I would want her to know is that because she's been given a second shot at life that she had their issues. It's sort of in comment on her now to live that life to the fullest and it's my hope that she'll leave this life and she'll leave this world having lived a life that has made a significant impact on the lives of others. So I would want her to embrace her story Embrace her narrative embrace the art. Maybe she becomes a journalist to tell these stories for other people. I've been about other people but to embrace the notion that she has a role to play in this world moving forward and shaping of us lives whether she knows it or not. She already has

40:20 So thank you. I appreciate that. This is funny great conversation.