Moosy Graffiti on the B-Line & Mentors and the Legacy of Graffiti Art

00:05 Welcome to Bloomington stories preserving the oral history of bloomington, Indiana, and surrounding communities. Thank you so much. We're here in Bloomington, Indiana, on a beautiful, beautiful summer day. It's like 90 degrees. The birds are chirping, and the sun is beaming. We're here at the hop salon, and we're interviewing an amazing artist that I got to stumble upon on the B-Line It was about a month ago, and this artist's name is Moosie. So welcome, moosie. Hi.

00:47 It's a pleasure to be here. I'm really excited to share my story a little bit more and just be able to talk.

00:52 Yeah. I am so glad you're here. It's just nice to be able to talk about art and artists in Bloomington and find out more about your art. And when you came to Bloomington, when did you come to Bloomington?

01:07 Oh, yeah. So I actually came to Bloomington for iU. I came here to be able to do a design degree. And so that design degree is actually comprehensive design, which is the idea of design. So I'm able to apply that to building houses, to designing phones, and to mural art, which I'm doing right now, which is really fun.

01:24 Oh, excellent. So you stay at the comp. You stay at the design phase. So the problem solution. Yeah, basically a lot going on there.

01:32 Yeah, yeah. It's about always, like, how do you solve a problem that, like, if there's a problem, how are you gonna sign? How are you gonna design around it? I should say excellent.

01:40 Excellent. One of the things I've always been fascinated with is universal design. I worked with Bob Smith, with the Wallenberg hall at Stanford University, and they were just coming into this concept of universal design.

01:55 Oh, yeah, it's fun. It's like, that's when it started. Now it's actually starting to grow. Cause, like, my design field, like, there's, like, last year, like, 20 students in there, and now it's already doubled. Like, it's becoming a huge thing, and it's gonna be a huge thing in the future, hopefully.

02:08 Yeah. And I think it advocated through people just saying, hey, we all wanna have easy access, and we want grandma to come, too, and our friend who's disabled or somebody who has a vision impairment, or anyone. Universal design is really about designing for all to have access.

02:27 It's the idea of access that access deserves to be to everyone. And that's also why I pursue mural art. Like, mural art is not confined by museum walls. It's not confined by monetary value. I had to buy a ticket to go see it. It's like everyday art. It's art. You walk by. It's art. You see. Just going to go get lunch with your family. It's art meant by the people, for the people. I'm sorry? Art made by the people, for the people.

02:49 Oh, I love that. Art made by the people, for the people. Yeah. I did my own little mural, as you saw.

02:57 I loved it. It was a great intro to this scene. It's an amazing scene, by the way.

03:01 It really made a difference, I have to say. I was really inspired by Lucas Nelson and promise of the real. Who's Willie Nelson's son?

03:10 Oh, yeah. Yeah.

03:11 And he has a song. Turn off the news and build a garden.

03:14 Oh, nice.

03:15 So I decided I'd do a mural around my garden and it's gotten a lot of reception and it's built a lot of community just in my neighborhood. So you've been building community here in Bloomington?

03:27 Oh, yeah.

03:27 With your free, beautiful art.

03:30 Thank you.

03:32 So where can people come and go and see some of the pieces that you're sharing with our beautiful town?

03:38 Of course. I actually have pieces all around Bloomington. Some of my main pieces are actually at the warehouse, which is open to the public. Free place for kids to go and play, to skate, to learn different activities, play soccer. Super fun area. And it's been so fun working with them. But it's right along the B-Line trail. So if you walk the B-Line trail, you can't really miss it. It's a giant purple mural along with another portrait next to it.

04:02 Excellent. Yes, it's right on the B-Line at Switchyard Park.

04:06 Switchyard park, correct. And I actually just got done doing one as well with Banneker Community center, which has been really fun to be able to help out those kids as well.

04:14 Nice. The Banneker center. Oh, my gosh. Wow. That's fascinating. Do you know Banneker? He did all this research on cicadas.

04:23 No way. Really?

04:24 Yeah, way back. That is his history. And he's an african american man.

04:27 Oh, super cool. Yeah.

04:28 And he did all this written book about the different types of cicadas. I just wanted to share that with you because I would love to see some awareness into our natural world and murals. I'm really in advocate for wildlife and my next mural is going to have chipmunks and squirrels and things.

04:49 Super cool. You know, this is like part of the garden vibe.

04:51 Right, right. And we. We did witness the. That ex brood of the cicadas was quite an experience.

04:58 It was wild. You couldn't look one direction out seeing like, a thousand cicadas in that one direction. You're looking like. It was so sad seeing the cicadas in their back. Like, dying, like, screaming for life. Like, that was one of the hardest things, I think. And they were just everywhere. And I couldn't help myself with the pencil, like, helping them flip over each. Everywhere I went, I'm like, ahh. Probably a natural selection, but I'm gonna go help out a little bit.

05:19 Right? Exactly. I know, I know. Someone was teasing me, going, oh, yeah, well, you'll be stepping on a cicada. I never did, because that's hard.

05:27 All right.

05:27 It's an intention, you know? And I really enjoyed them. I enjoyed their whole vibe of their energy, you know? Okay, yeah, they're two weeks just working on mating.

05:37 Yeah.

05:38 I mean, they're buzzing around like nobody's business. It's just like the whole town buzzes. Be interesting to see if that could be incorporated. Not that I'm planting any seeds, but you know how I plant seeds. All right, so back to this wonderful interview. So let's talk about these two murals that grace the bee line, the one I walked on. And I was like, wow, what a beautiful, beautiful person looking down on the B-Line And it really gave me pause to reflect on our society and why I'm doing Bloomington stories, you know, because that mural really spoke to me in lifting the veil, if you will, and peeking through and seeing the truth. I'm all about truth and justice, personally, and Bloomington stories is a vehicle for our town and for our community to not only bridge the digital divide by sharing stories, but also to share truth and understanding and build community through stories. So I just. I just really touched by that. Can you tell us a little bit more about that mural?

06:45 Of course. I'm so glad that the mural made you reflect, because that's actually one of the main concepts I'm trying to push through. I want the people to look at and reflect back into their own lives. It's really trying to pursue the idea of control. Like, what is control? Is it the breakfast I ate this morning? Is the ad I watched last night? Is it me? Is it a higher power? Is it the person I'm with? And just all those little strings are kind of pushing you to do what you do, right? And honestly, I actually also added the neon in the background, which is making her purple. The glowing neon are actually all doodles she did herself. So those are doodles she, like, drew down or wrote, like, on a sketchbook and gave to me. I was able to put those on the wall. So it's kind of like her ideas that reflecting onto her, oh, my gosh.

07:32 How integrated, how beautifully. Wow, what a nice way to do art. I mean, that's just so symbolic and so personal and added so much depth to it. I remember there's a butterfly in it.

07:47 Oh, you saw the butterfly? Oh, yeah.

07:49 Because, you know, when I learned digital art and design by my teacher, oh, Pat Watson, we didn't like each other at first. And then he fell in love with me, and I fell in love with him as friends. As friends, you know, as respectful teacher, teacher. Because I really balked against him in some ways. But he taught me a lot about digital art and design, and I taught him about compassion and who I was. And that was a good balance. We became really good friends. He'd come to my house for Christmas and stuff for dinner.

08:23 That's so cool. That's so awesome. To be able to have, like, different opinions, but able to still learn from each other. That's what we really need.

08:29 And, you know, the thing he taught me was another universal design principle.

08:32 Interesting.

08:33 And that is symbols. Symbols back to the Native Americans. The symbols from the Native Americans, from the hylogrphics.

08:43 Yeah.

08:45 Hey, we'll talk about us being dyslexic here in a second, because that's why we can't say it. But we love pictures. And pictures for someone who's dyslexic, like both of us are, moosey and Jen Morin here, myself, confessed, we are both dyslexic, and we find it a cherishing trait in that we are problem solvers. We think out of the box, and we see things differently. So we see things instead of reading one letter at a time, we see the whole word. We see things. That's why we're visual artists. That's why we're different. And it's okay. I mean, it takes all different types of rivers and lakes to go to the sea, to make that sea salty. Doesn't just happen by one type. So being dyslexic can be a really good, a good opportunity to evolve and transcend and do different design that reaches the whole audience. So you'll see a lot of trends right now with symbols, right?

09:48 Oh, yeah. Yeah.

09:49 How do you, how can you tell everybody to wash their hands?

09:53 You don't do through words. You do through symbols. It's like the, please wash your hands before you, like, the employees must wash your hands.

09:58 Everybody can see. And that became, isn't that in everybody's vision? Right?

10:03 Now, because of now, especially with, like, how focused we are in, like, medical and, like, how we need to stay healthy. And symbols are a great way to pursue the idea of, like, it's a great way as advertisement or a great way as propaganda.

10:16 Right. Did you see the mural over here at 222 to West second?

10:20 Oh, yes.

10:21 You're actually right next to Brian, right? Yeah, it's the soap. And that was done from COVID right?

10:26 Oh, my goodness. Yeah.

10:27 So it's fun to see the voice of the people through the symbols, through the graffiti. And so back to that piece that you created that has the symbols on it. How amazing that you're able to not only make it a personal and integrated piece between two people sharing, it's just. It's just touching. I mean, do you. Do you get a lot of people seeing it? And isn't there one with an alien, too?

10:56 Yeah, the little aliens. The spaceship, like, getting sucked up into the spaceship. Oh, yeah. That's a little fun. Just out of the blue to have a little fun, but, yeah, no, I think it's so fun working on those murals and be on that B-Line trail. It's already such a highly populated area where people are walking back and forth all the time. I had so such an opportunity to be able to connect with the public and be able to talk to strangers who walk by and want to talk and even listen to the story. I talk to them a little bit more, and you learn. You understand so much more about a community once you're in the community, and people just from all different walks of that community come to talk to you, and they're able to be like, oh, this art's so fun. Thank you for doing this. And I feel so blessed I'm able to help, be able to bring a little bit more creative and bring a little bit more color into Bloomington and make us have more pride in our community.

11:41 Oh, wonderful. Well, I just thank you for it. And I know people are probably interested in the art community. Like, what are some of your tools? Like, what are your tools, the trade that you would, you know, recommend for somebody or just share a little bit?

12:00 Oh, definitely. So I like to connect to technology here. So before I even start a mural, I have my iPhone out, and I'm taking pictures of different walls, different places. I want to be, like, before I even talk to those business owners or talk to the.

12:13 So you scouted out. Everybody knows what a scout is, right? We love scout.

12:20 That's great. You guys know what's going on. Yeah. So, you know, I'm able to use technology in my iPhone just to take a bunch of different pictures of random walls I want to do. And if I go back home later that night and I'm just in my chair thinking about different ideas I want to pursue, and I can look back through those different walls, and if I find a wall that really speaks to me and talks to me, I'm able then to use that photo and put it into Photoshop, like Adobe Photoshop. I'm able to use that one photo to be able to draw onto that wall, to create a mock up, to be able to create, like, the idea of my head before it's even on the wall, you know, be able to see it, see it, be there without it actually being there is such a powerful tool, because this is just helping you plan better. And if you have a good plan, you can do anything.

12:59 Yes, very wonderful. So then after you spec a place and you feel it out and you've got your design and you've gone into Photoshop and you've done some layers, and you've got your composition done, you're kind of like, hey, I'm ready to go slap this up on the wall now. Now then, do you go to the shop owner with the mock up?

13:23 Yeah. So when I first started and before I had any major pieces to like, before I was able to prove myself, I'm able to do these pieces, I had to make the mock up before I showed them. But nowadays, since I am a little bit more matured in my art, I'm able to be, they're able to reach out to me. I'm able to talk to them and, like, show them past pieces and then design it instead of having to design a bunch of random pieces, which takes hours and hours of work to show these people. But, yeah, that's what I used to do back then. I used to just create the piece, show the piece, and like, hey, this could be be on your wall if you wanted to be. But, yeah, now it's really fun. But even, yeah, after you're even done designing the piece on the technology, technology is used even further within the mural. So what I do to create the mural as well is I do this process called a doodle grid. So this doodle grid is a bunch of random doodles I throw onto the wall. I do circles, I do spaceships, I do stars, I do whatever. I'm just feeling it's like, just fun little stuff to put up there. And that doodle grid is actually what's going to keep me in perspective. So now, after I have my mock up, which I already designed in Photoshop, I'm able to have that doodles on the wall, and I'm able to overlay those images. So I have the doodles and the image I'm painting overlaid over those doodles. Like, let's say it's 70%. Like, 70%. I'm sorry. Opacity. Dyslexia.

14:35 Opacity. Yeah. I got the word. I got the seat. Together we can do it.

14:42 But, yeah, no, so I'm able to then have the doodles see through that.

14:47 Now, how do you make an opacity? With your spray? Yeah, like, you know, spray cans. Who knows what kind you have to use?

14:53 Oh, definitely. Well, there's. So you can definitely get your stuff from Walmart, the Krylon, all that kind of stuff. But it's just that it's such high pressure and just kind of not well made pigments that it just drips automatically. Like, you get close to the wall, it's gonna drip. So what you want to do is you want to go to websites like sprayplanet, Montana, and use, like, really mural grade cans, which aren't out of the reach. They are a little bit more expensive. They're in, like, the $6.50 range per can. But it's honestly such a difference. And with those.

15:23 Wow, how exciting. This is fun. I'm getting turned into a mural, and I didn't even mean it. I was just using house paint over here on this wall, and it was fun. But, no, this is exciting.

15:36 I love paint, and that's a great meal medium to use. But you just don't have the speed with spray paint. You're not able to just spray over a surface. You have to get in the cracks with a brush, and, like, in the cracks of the brush, and you don't.

15:45 Get, like, a shading or opacity, like you're talking about. I mean, there's no way I could have done that.

15:51 Oh, yeah.

15:52 Mine's kinder care looking, and that's fine. I have style of art. Don't even go there, people. You can drive by. It's over here in Bloomington, says uprising, worldwide uprising for. For truth and justice.

16:05 That's a great way to look at it, but, yeah, no, yeah. With these spray cans, I'm able to do a lot more than I am with the regular Walmart Krylon can. I'm able to have a better control of the pressure I'm using. I'm also able to control the caps. I'm using. So there's a bunch of different array of caps you can use. There's, like, New York fat crab caps. There's skinny caps. There's.

16:26 And caps are the tips that give you the certain amount of paint that comes onto the wall. I'm just helping people who may be going like, whoa, what's that? Caps. I don't need that. Don't shoot me in the butt. No.

16:38 Just joking. But, yeah, no, these calves are able to show how you are, is able to control the spray you're putting onto the wall. So after able now. So these new cans, they're able to control how much gets going on the wall, the pressure that's going onto the wall. And you're also able to have more control with drippage. There's no drippage with these cans. These cans are very hard to drip. The only way to drip them is you do it purposely.

17:03 Yeah. If it's a style you're trying to get right. And sometimes that might be the effect. Oh, sometimes it is, but not when you're not wanting.

17:12 Yeah.

17:14 The tools. It really is important.

17:18 And going back technology now. So once I get my doodle grid up there, I have the image I'm using to print on the image with the doodle grids, I'm able. Then after I get this sketch done, I'm able to go back to my phone, take another picture of the wall, then overlay my mock up on the sketchup I did already and see how accurate to that mock up I am. And if I see places where I need to change a quick little curve, it's too curved there. I can do a 90 degree instead of, like, 80 degree. I know. Like, all those little minute details. And allow me, the technology has allowed me to see those little minute details that we weren't able to see 30 years ago.

17:49 Oh, my gosh. So you really do use the doodle grid like a grid.

17:54 Oh, yeah.

17:54 Oh, how powerful is that? Wow. You're so brilliant.

17:58 Thank you.

17:59 So awesome. Because I was thinking that, you know, I was a little school student who was in school, and you took and you made the squares on the newspaper or the magazine article, and then you drew each square.

18:10 Oh, yeah.

18:10 Yeah. To reproduce it. And that helps you to then reproduce it and have sense of place while you're painting something so huge.

18:18 Oh, of course.

18:18 Right.

18:19 It is like, when working with such a large surface, it's all about proportions, proportions, proportions, proportions. If you don't get those proportions right, pieces in a good turnout. Good.

18:27 No. And it's like it's like build. Okay, imagine. I think of it as, like a mosaic. You've got to have all your little, you know, your little tiles so that when you step back, it looks like what you created and not something that looks like a circle here, in a circle there, because you're, like, busy in this micro thing. You've got to keep that macro image effect. And so you're using that doodle grid as an actual tool.

18:56 Oh, yeah. It's super useful.

18:57 It's fascinating. Is that a common.

19:02 I learned through an art festival and a bunch of other artists around the world, they've been able to teach me through this art festival, like, different styles and different techniques, and they taught me this dual grid style. So it's a more new style, and it's gaining a lot of popularity. A bunch of new mural artists are starting to get really into using the dual grid. It's very helpful, very fun, and it's just. It's a very creative way to create a grid. You know, it's not just the common lines.

19:23 Yeah.

19:24 You do little creatures. You do little, like doodles. It's just so fun.

19:27 That is so awesome. Now, I was speaking of technology, and I don't know if you utilize this or not, but is there a technology where you can add something onto the image so that when they take a picture of it, they can get more information about it?

19:42 Yeah. Like QR codes or that kind of stuff? Yeah, yeah, I. So that's an interesting way to look at it. If, like, you were gonna put QR codes with the murals themselves and have interactive p's, like, all right.

19:53 And then maybe have a story with it, and then that could become an NFT. I know. Hey, hey, watch out. For those of you in the not not know, let me just tell. Tell you. Let me break it down. Let me break it down. Let me break it down. It's called non fungible tokens. It's called cryptocurrency. It's a new way. Lesh Lux, is he one of your guys you follow?

20:18 Oh, my goodness. He is. Yeah. He is a big inspiration for me. He's such a cool artist. He's such a cool artist because he's really taken, like, the meme culture, like, you know, like, 2010 Internet, like, and he's, like, put it onto walls, and he's created nft tokens with these. But he's. He's. He's not scared to express himself. He's not scared or limited by what people think of him. And he just wants to do the art that he wants to do, and that's so cool about it. And non fungible tokens have been able to give him a gateway. To be able to do that, which is so fun and exciting, and to see that be able to give him a gateway is so inspiring because that's able to give so many other people gateways if you just have to take the time and learn how to do it.

20:56 So powerful. It's like a new paradigm is happening in our world. And I'm just happy to be part of the rebuild, because it's like, from the goodness of your heart and your passion and your soul that you do what you do, and then the money will come because you're doing what you love, not because you're doing a job you hate, and you bring home a couple coins and you yell at your kids. Sorry to be so blunt, but it's a time of change where we need to enjoy what we do in our lives and show people the way of being able to do that. And I'm really excited about cryptocurrency, the possibilities of having. Having capacity be capacity without it being taxed and manipulated and controlled. So it's kind of interesting. John McAfee says it's not going back in the box.

21:49 He says, yeah, it's already been unleashed.

21:51 It's out there. Get in the program. So it's power of the people again, which I really like. And that's what you were talking harkening back to, to amuse art here is, you know, it's free. It's free for anyone to go and see. Take a walk down the B-Line and see it, because it's beautiful.

22:11 Oh, thank you. And yeah, no, like I said, since it is free to the public, it's something that really builds up the public. It's like, I came from a small town of Rensselaer, Indiana. It's about 30 minutes north of Lafayette. And within this town, it was dying off. Our college was already closed down. Like, our stores weren't there anymore. There was no main street. There's main street and just a bunch of empty buildings. It was super sad. It was super sad growing up in that environment a little bit when I was really young, and then I just didn't have pride for my community. I didn't want to live in Rensselaer I was older. I wanted to get out of there as soon as possible. But then these murals started coming in. These murals from people all across the world, decided to gather into this small town and just beautify this town and see how murals can change community. And it started out small, and it started out, and more businesses started to come in. There's more murals. People start talking about rents a little bit more. There's more murals right now. People realize it's right between Chicago and Indianapolis. It's a great place to go off the highway for a little rest, to see some cool things. And these murals really started helping me build a pride for my community. They really started helping me realize, well, maybe Rensselaer isn't such a bad place. It really, it really just. It's crazy how art and painting can just build a community, and it can build a pride for that community. And it's so fun to see that happen and see that after seeing that happen. That's what I want to do in Bloomington now. Bloomington's already really built a place. It already has that college town. It's already a great place. But why can't we built it, build it farther and build it better with more mural art everywhere? That's the thing I really want to push here. Mural art is something coming to Bloomington, hopefully soon. I just want to paint everywhere, paint every wall, and just beautify the town.

23:53 I am so excited. I am so delighted and excited, and I want to help support that. And Bloomington stories and tech heroes wants to support that. So we'll be working with you on amplifying that, because I think it's important to, you know, share some of the things I was talking about, how we could connect with boys and girls club and get you involved in some of the tech stuff you're doing. And Rensselaer sounds like a fabulous town. I really want to check it out.

24:19 Oh, if you ever had a chance to, I highly recommend it. Like, there's one. South Korean is one of their most favorite mural artists. Royal dog actually came and did a piece there. He did two pieces in Rensselaer. People from San Francisco, Cameron won, and mister amazing artists came in, did these great pieces. Cobra like, from Argentina. 40,000 followers Instagram. He did this piece in a small town, and it's not something you expect to see in a small town. It really takes you off guard to realize that communities to see a small town building, because that's what the problem is right now. Small towns are starting to die off. That's something happening in America. Corporations are starting to take over. Local businesses dying out.

24:56 Yes.

24:57 And it's really hurting these small communities. And I feel like these small communities can really take advantage of mural art and use that as a way to build up more pride in the community in which will help build their community just in general.

25:08 I am so delighted. Let's go to Delaware street, where I grew up in Indianapolis. It's getting pretty hit over there. Some places are a little more built up, but then there's sections, you know? So it's interesting. Not that we need to do that right away, but I have vision for you. I do, because I think you have the passion and the vision to make a change and to pass that concept and those visions on. And all it takes is continued pushing, and people start learning and getting more aware and doing workshops and things like that, and it's bloom where you're planted. You know that concept.

25:48 Oh, definitely.

25:49 So you really did that where you were at in your tone in your hometown, you know, because you could have just said, I'm just leaving.

25:56 Yeah. Oh, definitely.

25:57 And you left some murals in your town?

25:59 Oh, yeah.

25:59 Came to college.

26:00 That was one of the coolest things is that these artists I worked at the mural art for since I was 15, I was part of that mural art work, and these wilderness artists taught me everything. Like little things.

26:09 So you had world class mural artists as your mentor in Indiana?

26:15 In Indiana. Small town in Indiana. You don't expect it.

26:17 It's not just corn, baby. Now, Moosey, where were we at? We were talking about the mentors in your community of Rensselaer, which is just outside of Chicago.

26:33 Yeah. Honestly, it's actually an hour, 20 hours 40 from Chicago. It's so cool living in Rensselaer. I was able to go travel to Chicago a lot. Like, I would drive up to Gary and take the train from Gary to Chicago. It's so fun. But, yeah, no, those. Those mentors and those people just taught me so much about mirror art. Just be able to watch them create these massive pieces, and just looking at the different techniques each one of them uses and how I'm able to apply that to my own heart now. It's been so awesome. But, yeah, no, since they've been able to train me and I've been able to become better mural artists and be able to create some really beautiful pieces, I was able to give back to that community, back to my hometown, which gave so much to me, which gave me the passion to paint, and it's been so great to just paint as many walls I can there and be able to do. I think I have around four murals there right now, actually.

27:16 Four murals there. And now. Is there going to be a festival there, you said?

27:19 Yeah. So, actually, every July, there's this. It's called Ren art walk. So it's r E N. And then there's this art. There's wlk for the walk. Ren art walk. And it's such a cool little festival that happens, and just all these amazing artists come out and I just do these amazing pieces. But yeah, no, if you have a chance, I would highly recommend checking out the small town, maybe looking it up on instagram. It's a really great thing to be able to support and build.

27:48 Do they foster? I'm just trying to see how we could make that happen in Bloomington. You know, how can we have a bloom art walk?

27:56 Yeah, for sure. Definitely. Honestly, it just starts. That first mural, it starts with that idea of what people walking by, seeing it, talking about, how do you see that? You're on the B-Line trail. That's pretty cool. Maybe we could put the other places. And then if people find an interest in it, that's when you start having the back, the ability to back up this art walk, to be able to do it. So, yeah, for Ren art walk, it started out with one mural, and that mural just multiplied and multiplied and multiplied.

28:22 Excellent. Now, I love maps. That's one of my favorite things. And I love creating maps. I think it's, again, the visual artist in me and that symbols. Right? So do they have a visual map of the Ren walk?

28:36 They do, actually. There's a whole website for. You can check it out. You probably just Google Ren Art walk real quick and see the different pieces in there and the different places. But honestly, I'm going to say it's more of the most confined places of some of the best artists in our country, like Chicago. They have been using murals, but they're not so confined in one area. This whole art walk consisted of four alleys, and these alleys are right next to each other, full walking distance. It's very easily easy to get an ice cream cone and be able to go with your family to see each other.

29:03 I love it. Oh, so fun. See? And I love the intergenerational, because Bloomington stories is one of the main concepts, is to the proverb that says, when an elder dies, the library burns. And not that we're elders, but we are wise ones, aren't we, that have something to say and something to share. So I think it's really empowering to have this cross generational visual art experience. It sounds like somebody who's older in there, who's still ambulatory, or maybe even in a wheelchair, would be able to access this festival and be fully able to be able to participate in all aspects of it.

29:50 Oh, yeah.

29:51 I.

29:51 It's like I said, it's open to the public. It's not confined by walls. It's on the street. You just walk up to it, and that is the art walk. It's not. You don't have to pay money for it. You can't do it to go up, like, stairs for it. It's very accessible to the public, and it's very accessible just for everyday life.

30:07 I just love the concept of being able to build community around that. Now, we already, we have a gallery walk here, but I think this would be a nice addition to our community, and I hope that we get to hear more about that and see that get developed here in Bloomington, for sure.

30:24 I'm really excited to be on the forefront of creating public artworks in Bloomington and just me able to have public artworks. Just every corner you look like, not, like, confined to one area, it just has to be everywhere. And one of the ways we can do that is just to contact the city himself and just be able to express your feelings and like, hey, maybe you would like to have more art in this community, and maybe they can take back less laws and basically not allowing public works to art to go onto walls, because there's a lot of people in our downtown.

30:57 No, that's okay. I'm going to talk about that helicopter here in a second, because we're going to talk about one of the next projects you're going to be probably involved in.

31:05 Oh, okay.

31:06 So that helicopter came from the hospital across the street that's gonna be redeveloped.

31:13 Oh, interesting. Yes.

31:14 So I. There's a commission for the redevelopment of the hospital space across the street here in Bloomington. Right now we're hearing a helicopter that's going in, taking a med helicopter into the hospital rooftop here across the street. So. But that is going to be closing and there's a new hospital.

31:32 Oh, really?

31:33 In the next few years while you're here?

31:35 Of course.

31:36 I always love the power of audio and the time stamping of things, because I can predict you're probably going to be involved with that project because I'm going to make sure you are.

31:47 Oh, thank you. So we're predicting the future already? Yes, but, yeah, no, actually, my.

31:54 There's a commission, you know, and we have, you know, there's a development, so I can share with you the website on that redevelopment. But in that is an opportunity for the complete concept of Bloom walk. You know, bloom art walk, because you could have your artists, you could be the one to kind of lead it up and have the. The graffiti artists revamp that space when it's ready to be redeveloped, so that you can do specific murals for the different activities and help people have a visual aspect. And then, boom, you would then have an open gallery.

32:33 Oh, it'd be super fun. And that open gallery is open to the public.

32:35 And you see how many walls there are over there.

32:37 Huge. Amazing. Oh, my gosh. I've looked.

32:39 Can you imagine that building being painted with murals?

32:42 So great?

32:43 I can't, I can't, I can. We're planting the seed now, people. This is gonna happen.

32:48 But, yeah, no, if you might be going back a little bit, actually. So a lot of business owners are looking at creating murals within, like, businesses in downtown Bloomington. But a lot of things that are scaring them off is the permits. Getting the permits is very hard. It's a difficult process to go through, and, like, I understand people don't want vulgar pieces on their wall, and that's not something that can help the public, but also, it limits the public to be able to get those art pieces. It limits people to be able to create those works of art on those walls. And I would really like to see Bloomington change their perspective a little bit and be a little bit more open to the concept of mural art and be a little bit more. Be a little bit more open to having it be easier for mural art to be able to come into the city.

33:30 Right. Because this program is about digital equity at the core.

33:35 Oh, yeah.

33:36 Digital equity now is art in mural art is huge.

33:41 Look at lush luck.

33:42 I mean, talk about digital equity. I mean, you could. If you became a lush lux, you could give us all free Internet and not even be a problem. But we still want free Internet for everyone in the whole United States, and equity across that, I think. And then also digital equity in having, you know, the opportunity to develop and create a mural art program in our community. Really look at it. And so, yeah, let's look at other communities that are doing it, like Rensselaer. What you do is you go and you get their model, you find their bylaws they did to get the city to approve it. And you take that and you. You say, hi. Hi, commissioners. My name is Moosey. You may have seen some of my art. This is where I'm from, this is the town, and this is what I'd like to do here in Bloomington. Let's talk about changing some of these restrictions and how we can work together. These are some of the things that I find are not working. And then do a petition and then keep going.

34:45 Oh, definitely. Well, like, one of the best parts about having that mural, like, walk in a small town is the city's not involved as much with those. Like, like those private businesses. Those private businesses are right. To be able. Like, I want this, my wall. I mean, more freedom. That's what it is.

34:59 Right? Like, I could do it on the garage next to my neighbors, because I really. I mean, after the George Floyd incident, I wanted to do something. So I was listening to Bob Marley, and I decided to do his album cover in my own way.

35:12 That's awesome. Yeah.

35:13 Which was, you know, worldwide uprising for truth and justice. And so it is really important. I mean, we're looking at a freedom of speech here and the opportunity to do that. And so working with different people, private or companies to do that. And I saw that you had done some for people. Like, I know there a business owner who did woodwork and metalwork. I saw the two garage pieces. You did really fabulous stuff. So it's not just, you know, there's different reasons, you know, and I think that's the beauty in your art, is you found that balance between creating a living and still staying true to your art and having the opportunity to still have your art canvases out there, for sure.

36:03 And it's so cool. Like, being a mural artist, I'm able to look at all these different walls. I'm able to look at buildings and I see a canvas and I just be able to look at the world and the eyes of a canvas and like, oh, I'm able to paint the world. This is such a fun outlook to have. It's such a fun opportunity to be able to just be able to talk to those business owners and be able to try to get projects going and just making our town a more colorful place.

36:27 Right? Yeah. And I see you can teach a lot of young people how to do this and how to navigate. This is an opportunity to express themselves and to be mural artists, because I see it as something that's going to become more of a. More of a. More awareness as we build community.

36:45 Oh, definitely. Yeah. Yeah. And just. It's a great place to start. Even building better pride for a community. It's a great place to start, and it's not hard to start it. It's pretty simple, actually. You just go find an artist and, like, I want this wall painted and the walls painted. And the only thing that gets more complicated is the permitting and all that kind of fun stuff. But it's a. It's something that should be simple, and it's something that can be simple. And I feel like we can push to that and get our own blue mart walking, you know?

37:11 Yeah, I love it. I love it. I'm excited about it. Now, we were talking about technology, and you were saying to me about some really deep technology that you're getting into, and I'm excited about, because I saw. Now, let's share with everybody your instagram, because I bet everybody's, like, sitting on their seats going, ah, where do I meet? Where do I get to see this guy? I gotta get to Bloomington. Well, if you want to see some of Moosie's work, you can check him out on Instagram, right at mooseygraffiti.

37:40 That's it. It's m o o s y. That's my moosey name. And then it's gonna be under dash graffiti. And it's kind of. It's kind of interesting. I use graffiti because I just like, I like the term I enjoy. It's like, it's like public art graffiti, but I'm more of a mural artist. I do a lot more mural pieces. So it's like more kind of like very high, like realism, detailed work.

38:01 Now, I saw, speaking of bridging the digital divide and everything, I saw a piece where you used a drone to videotape, and it starts out with, like, an old filament from a old light bulb, and then you come out and it talks about technology and how it's affected our lives, and it was really impactful the way you were able to use the drone technology.

38:26 Thank you.

38:26 Your piece. Can you tell us a little bit more about what's on the horizon for you?

38:31 Yeah, for sure, actually. So that was used with this drone just to be able to get those high shots, better angles the wall, because these walls are big walls, and it's hard to be able to get a nice picture of it while just standing on the ground. So drones are very helpful and capturing that piece in a better way. But I'm also trying to push drone technology in a different way right now with mural arts. So, as a competition printed design student, I've been able to learn a lot of 3d modeling programs. And these 3d modeling programs have allowed me to be in a position now where I'm able to design and create ideas of my own. And what I'm trying to pursue right now is actually a drone that's going to help me paint in the wall next to me.

39:09 So what I am like, what? Yeah, a painting assistant.

39:15 A painting assistant. Doctor Palo.

39:17 Every man needs made. Every mural artist needs a painting assistant. What's next? What's next? Okay, good. This is very fascinating. Tell us more.

39:28 Yeah, of course. So I am using. To create this drone. I'm able to use 3d printers now, actually, to print out the whole body of it in a very accurate proportion. I'm able to create simple parts that normally you have to go through manufacturers and, like, actual people who do, like, metalworking or, like, plastic notes and be able to make those parts custom. But now, having the power of a 3d printer in my room, I'm able to create these custom parts that's on the spot with my programs. I learned through my degree, such as Rhino, and that's been able to really help me, able to pursue this idea a little bit more. And with the power of YouTube and the power of just the Internet in general, has been really able to help me learn coding. It's been helped me learn the mechanical engineering behind it.

40:11 What's the coding that you're using?

40:12 Yeah, I'm actually. The program I'll be using is python. I feel like it's probably one of the best ways to pursue this project because it's very mechanical based. And to have that code work within my bot, I'm using a thing called a raspberry PI, which is basically a mini computer. It's such a little cool piece of technology. It's so funny.

40:32 Sounds wonderful.

40:35 Such a fun day.

40:35 Cutie pie, right?

40:38 But, yeah, now I'm able to use that mini computer, basically to tell with a motor hat, like, the motors, like, where to go, what to do, what timing, all that fun stuff. And I actually have it on a rope system. So there's a rope above it, and then there's a rope within the drone. So if it wants to, it knows to go right and up, like 2 meters by for 2 seconds. And it has a motor. It's actually allowed to put pressure on the can, different pressures on the can. It's able to control the distance from the wall, the cans at, to help create fades or clear lines. So, yeah, no, I'm hoping to keep this project going and really excited to get it fully up and running.

41:14 I see it going somewhere. Yeah, even deeper. Like, I feel like I could use your technology in the next five years or something that you create, to be able to create by feeling it or thinking it, and then it'll just kind of do it, because I feel like you might go to the point of, like.

41:36 You give this drone a feeling.

41:37 And that you can train it and that you could do, like, like, you could do a dance and it would do the thing for you. Like snap. Snap. Does this kind of spray at this level? Yeah, this does this. And then you can almost do like a dance and you're gonna go, okay, I'm gonna do the jig a wig. And it's like going to paint that.

41:53 Yeah.

41:53 Like, could you do that? Would that be so much fun? Right?

41:57 And that's what art is.

41:58 So you could program it. So, like, all these things that you're programming into your drone, could you program. Because I'm a programmer, I don't know how to. I don't. I don't have the patience to code. Okay, but who isn't a programmer in their mind who doesn't want to create something? But I like, I like being able. I've always seen so much where we, using our bodies is that 3d thing. So could you, as you program all those things for it to do, could you then add that layer of what, having it be attached to an index finger to make that happen? Or this, or. And then if you did that, it would do these arrays of it.

42:34 Yeah, for sure.

42:36 Instead go, you know what I mean? You could do it, like, at some point you could actually do maybe your own sound thing to do your own spraying. Like, could you imagine? Oh, I'm gonna spray this with purple.

42:51 And just like a little tom hat.

42:53 You know, and the more sound is, the more that you're putting out, and then the little sounds would be the little pieces. I mean, you could really connect it to music. I'm sorry, I'm going love where. Where you're. Where your research and your, your seeking mind is going with a lot of your technology. So the drone is used as a painting helper.

43:17 Well, even going back to what you were saying, we live in a time where almost nothing is impossible. We been blessed to be in this time where we can get a 3d printer and make what we ever have in our mind. There's no other generation that was able to do this before us. And we just have so much power, and we have so much power through technology. And as much as it might hurt us, it benefits us just as much. And just how do we embrace that power? How do we embrace that technology? And how are we going to use that to our benefit rather than leading to our failure?

43:51 Right? I love that. I love that mission. You know, as a teacher of technology for most of my life, I've always wanted to inspire people, people to find what sparks their passion and then inspire them to see how technology can be leveraged as a tool. Oh, definitely not the end all. It's not something you sit on all day and, like, lose yourself.

44:16 Oh, my God, it's so easy.

44:17 It is. I'm susceptible, believe me. But, you know, try to make, there's a cost benefit to everything. Try to make it a benefit for what you're doing. So if you have a goal with what you're doing, the things that you're learning can be in alignment, and then you're focused more on that than draining yourself on. Like, I would tell students, I want you to learn how to program it as well as engage playing it on the other end. But I want you to be able to know how to do it. And I think that is our true power right now. In. As we evolve in any way, through any storms, through any triumphs, is to continue to have critical thinking, continue to have a research mind, and continue to want to be a part of the solution in your situation and to always educate and share with others as you learn something, share it with another, because we need more mentors our lives.

45:20 And just the power of growth, like, just growing in general, like, we are put on this planet. Do one thing, and that is to grow just like everything else. And plants made to grow and humans made to grow.

45:30 And when you spark passion in a young person in a small Indiana town who felt he had nothing. Right.

45:37 Oh, yeah.

45:38 And then these mural artists step in, and it's like you're, like, bloomed out with all this opportunity and aspiration to go and change the world.

45:48 Definitely did that. To me. It really is. It really just needs that spark. You need that spark and that once you have that passion, you just feel like you can do anything and like, to be able to use technology, pursue those passions now is such a powerful tool right now.

46:02 Do you know about Bufanofano?

46:04 I actually have not heard of him.

46:05 He's a San Francisco sculptor.

46:07 Okay.

46:08 And he did the big hand and san. In Oakland, and he did some other stuff in Oakland. And it's interesting, there was an elder I worked with who was Bufano's manager, and a young. Yeah. And a young high school student was working with him, helping him with technology. Right.

46:26 So cool. Yeah.

46:27 And it was Spence woods, and Spence woods was 96, and Spence was showing him about Bufano and the sculptor he worked with that used to hang out with Henry Miller in Big Sur with the bohemians. And so this high school students going, well, do you know who Banksy is? That was one of my favorite moments in my tech heroes moment. For me, that has to do with graffiti art and bridging the digital divide.

46:56 Oh, yeah.

46:58 Because it was so powerful, because it turned on this 96 year old. See that there is still this public art going on in a different way because that's what Bufana was about, was public art. And he has a lot of sculptures throughout. And so now sculpture has changed and evolved to kind of utilize the building as a piece of sculpture and then integrate it with a theme and with the paint. So it's really kind of a nice evolution. And that these are, the artists are seeing these towns that other people would see as lost or defunct or no longer viable. But seeing them as a canvas, definitely.

47:42 Anything's a canvas. The world's your canvas now. You know, like, any wall is paintable. Any wall is paintable. That's such a fun way to look at it. It's awesome. I'm glad you brought that up.

47:50 Yeah, it's cool. Well, I just see it and I'm excited to see what happens to in Bloomington. And I'm inspired to learn more about following you. And I'd like to get another story with you on site, just to add to it, just to have something so people could hear and see. And I'll take some pictures of that. And I'm just really grateful for this time we've had.

48:16 Oh, thank you for letting me on. It's been a great time.

48:19 You're welcome. If anyone wants to follow Moose, just check him out on instagramous graffiti and you can see what he's up to. And I'm sure you're going to see him evolve and do a lot more as we grow and bloom where we're planted here in Bloomington. I'm Jenny for Bloomington stories with Moosey saying, see you at the next mural.

48:43 See you at the next mural.

48:46 Bloomington stories, preserving the oral history of Bloomington, Indiana and surrounding communities.