Nick Probst and Cari Rerat

00:01 Am I a e? R a i am 41 years old today is August 4th 2021. I am in my office in Pryor, Oklahoma. I'm talking to Nick who is my one small step partner?

00:17 Yeah, and I'm Nick Probst and I am by I live in Tulsa and Oklahoma. And today is they trying to remember what I'm supposed to say. I'm sorry.

00:33 Senior age, if you want.

00:46 Where are you speaking to you. Are you getting any? Like I said, I would be I'm in. I am in Mobile, Alabama.

01:05 I want to talk people with suitcases behind you. So I wanted to find a quiet place and just go ahead and keep this appointment.

01:26 This is what you'll ask end. And then Nick after she asks, you then you'll just all right. Now, I'm somehow not able to see that but I have but I can't now.

01:43 So Nick what made you want to do this conversation today?

01:47 Well, I was driving down the road and I had NPR on the way. I had the Oklahoma City or one of them. I don't know where I was, but I heard it her to come over and describe what early. I had just been telling someone that this is the way that conversations need to happen between people and regardless of their political views. And so when I heard it advertised that way, I just felt I needed to go ahead and do what I said need to happen and that was

02:20 Very cool.

02:23 Nick, you'll ask her the same quadri, I'm going to put what made you feel like you wanted me to talk to each other and get to know each other as people are more personal background. I had a conversation about a year ago, with a close family member, who disagrees, very much with my political stance. And he made all kinds of assumptions. Just based on the word Democrat and the word liberal, and I feel like we're a lot closer in our political and like moral beliefs than he thinks we are. So that was part of my reason for wanting you wanting to do this.

03:11 Alright, then.

03:15 Next bio also and the message, it's know what you'll do is your read his bio and then ask any questions you have so around private and public schools, some college than entrepreneurship. I married in a racially, traveled internationally and domestically, first of three daughters was born, seven years into marriage. We raised our three daughters together and live in Tulsa Midtown. Since about 2005. I've been politically active as a Republican and civically as nonpartisan serving as a commissioner on the Housing Authority at cetera. I am open to different perspectives.

03:55 So,

03:58 I'm really curious about your work with the housing authority. And what if anything you learned while you were working with the Housing Authority?

04:10 Yeah, that was an interesting project that came through. I was usually volunteering for one thing or another civically and just brought brought me in one day and said, there's a position opening on the housing authority and I'd like you to think about serving up there and it really wasn't something that was on my list of things to do. So I said, but immediately, I just said, alright, I can do that. And I so I went in and started getting my hand arms around this, whole situation, with housing authority, meaning of providing public housing for people in and also had baucher sis belcher's for people.

05:07 You on March Lane comes and what we you know, it was it was interesting for me because it was sort of an area of government that I had always a position that it was necessary forms of government. I can't say, I disagree.

05:27 All together. I'm not sure my position really changed off of that. It's probably providing services that are beyond what I needed. That could possibly be be handled. In other ways. However, what I did was I just approached it and said, here's the circumstance. We have, we have this, this piece of government. We have these people who need it and they're in some way relying on this. And so, we have to understand it, understand how to, to best administer, what we have already. And so I just approached it the way I do everything and I just went and started trying to read everything I could on the subject matter. And then I started looking at, you know, what, what had worked. What was the butthead? How did this situation come about in the first place?

06:25 From a meeting. How did we get into a place where we have massive amounts of public housing? And what purpose does it continue to serve? How's the best administered? And so I read everything. I could get my hands on at the time in the end. Then. I looked at other cities that were doing it. Well, just understand it. There was already in a rolling organization here that have been in place for many, many years, and was quite successful in doing quite well in in a number of ways. And so, but I just needed to understand what I could about it. And so I spent my tenure there doing that and looking at that what other, what other organizations like this and around us, the United States and in other countries were doing right where came to providing public housing and public assistance and housing in MN. We just

07:22 Consistently try to make ourselves as good as it could be. That resulted in hiring another. What do you mean by doing it? Right? Like what? Is that? What did that look like for you?

07:39 Well for me, it was never just woke W. Here is as good as it gets, no matter how long it's been done. That way. I wanted to understand.

07:53 If the goal is to to reach people and provide the best housing weekend in the most efficient manner, at the in, and do it on a

08:06 From the standpoint that is you know, just just inappropriate and every way from a, from a society standpoint and from the cities and states and the federal government standpoint. So we will look at that their work. With their it turned out. There were there were changes that need to be to be made. And what I learned about that subject was that there was a problem that had been created, not it. One of the problems that we have seen in public housing, so did broaden, my my perspective on public housing and people who may need it from time to time. And that was that what we typically do? See in public housing. There's a lot of it concentrated in one area and in areas where people are already economically depressed. And so what we did was

09:06 What I, what I looked at was to try to find ways to, you know, are we are, we are we to proud of existing facilities, or are there better ways to provide housing for people in ways that don't perpetuate poverty? And some of those ways were too. Yeah. It turns out, it's, it's far better not to have not to artificially, you know, assemble poverty. In in certain unattractive, areas was really the policy that that led to the current state of public housing in most communities. And that was you take cheap land out where nobody wants it or near things that nobody wants to live by. And you, you could have a lot of public housing as many as you can. In that area, sometimes are isolated from it, you know, what food deserts or in the transportation or ability. And so, and then Deezer

10:06 The other day in Midtown, I don't live in an area, but I do have a lot of conveniences for living in Midtown Tulsa and I saw a an ambulance followed by perhaps employees and whatever. They were coming from a direction where I knew, there were no hospitals for quite a ways. And I just said to myself. Well, if something happened to me, I have three hospitals, equal, driving distance from me, and the ambulance would probably just go to the least busy one. In this case. I have to go quite a ways for 4. And so that's, that's something that you begin to see when you're dealing with this sort of problem. And then what I began to what I what I found out was that they were policies that stayed at the local at the federal level which incentivised these sores.

11:06 We might see us is really I consider the problems that are not naturally occurring. There are problems that we would that we built in. So then I begin to stay policy was the government policies, this institution, created a lot of these problems and I'm not tied to any of those prior solutions that are creating these unintended consequences now regardless of the state of the facilities. My policy was to try to move toward better solutions to me. It did not matter what the cost was as long as they were feasible in with him current budgets to to start moving those Solutions in the better better once in a minute. And then what that open my eyes to is that government does not always have to do.

12:05 The does not have to run like a business.

12:09 And that is the business. Usually always does the most profitable thing. But in this case, we we really needed to what I do when I considered writing a wrong which was to start making choices that were necessary. Seriously the best business choices from a you know, if you have a profit loss statement on those in those cases, you you move things in the in the best ethical direction to provide the best Solutions and might look like less concentrated in mixed-income areas in the future. That will be result of looking at the problem that way.

12:51 All right, Nick, I put carries bio in the chat. And so I'll have you read that out loud and ask any questions you have about that.

13:00 Yeah, so so you said I'm a mother of two 9 and 6 years and

13:08 A librarian course, I love libraries. I was born and raised in Northeast Oklahoma, and then I moved to Joplin Missouri in 2005 to live with my husband while studying with my for my email is

13:28 We lost everything in the Joplin tornado and I was

13:34 Team service librarian for 10 years in Joplin before coming home to Northeast Oklahoma and to be a librarian director, that are important to be a Freedom of Information and veteran services. Two brothers were combat, veterans and affordable and abundant child care.

14:03 Access to mental health and understanding bias and racism.

14:10 Yeah, first time I already commented that I love Librarians, they call me the Mobis guy at the

14:22 Because I'm constantly ordering ordering stuff in my system. But so. I understand there's a science of Library science of Library degree that I was out or something, something like that. In his first time I ever understood, there was a fire at library. Yeah, that's what an alliance stands for. Honestly. I kind of stumbled into librarianship. I graduated from Oklahoma State in 2002, and then found a job at a credit union where I was in the real estate department.

15:17 And it was fine, but I was not, there was no passion there. I'm not, I'm not a finance person. Like that's not what I'm going to do for the rest of my life. So I started looking for more education because my bachelor's degree is in English and my advisor at the time when I was choosing that as my major told me that an English degree is a face degree and you have faith that you'll get a job somewhere. So I figured, I probably needed more education to get a job that could actually, you know, be fulfilling and help me pay my bills. And I was talking to my mom and we were talking about the things that I lied about working at the credit union and honestly, it was

16:02 My favorite part was when a member of the credit union would call and ask for Education about their mortgage. So I got to teach them, you know how it is working. However, the station schedules working, all of that stuff and I don't really care about the mortgage card or the, you know, the math part. It was just the teaching part and the information part. So so then I started looking at library and got my first Library gig. I'm about three days before. I started my master's degree program and have been doing it ever since.

16:36 Wow, how interesting and so you worked at the Joplin library and now you're in a, are you, did you move to a larger library system? Work on a no-sew Joplin, the town of dropping us about 50,000 people, and that library is considered a medium sized Library. They have at the time when I was there about 100,000 items in her collection. Now, it's bigger than a bigger building that they, that they built, but the library where I am now, it's the Pryor, public library, and I'm glad you're here. So Pryor's population is less than ten thousand in our collection. Size is about thirty thousand items, but I wanted to be

17:25 After many years of saying, I didn't want to be an administrator. I wanted to move from you. No kind of Frontline staff to administrative role and help steer a library in the back with the vision that I have for a library should do for their communities and I'm curious how you, how you feel about that. What do you feel like the library should Library should operate and what services should they provide?

17:55 Modern libraries are connectors. What we do is connect people to information that they need recreational reading or movies or, you know, material that they need. We are one of the last places in America that you can go and just be a human without the expectation that need money. We offer connectivity for the internet, which is, especially with the pandemic. We've learned that internet is vital for our society and when you don't have it, it's a big deal. So that's one of the things we got Wi-Fi here, twenty-four hours a day, and then we have some computers in our building. To the people can can use another pretty standard. That's pretty standard for libraries. It's kind of what we do.

18:46 So that's the best. Basically, you know, somebody has a need and they need to figure out, you know, how to how to satisfy that need and the library serves as a connector. Maybe not to answer the question, but to get them to the point where I can get that question answers that make sense.

19:01 Right. It's interesting. And in, when you see, I know it a big deal at the library's, I just made it into your, your really ride that place where sometimes kids just come in. And, and, after school, and that's there. That's where they do their activities on the computer. So, take that a lot and at your prior Library.

19:33 Across the street from where we are, so we get a lot of traffic after school, but we have story time to instill. Some early early literacy skills. We do teen night every month. You know, we just trying to be a cool, not cool. Cuz sometimes we can't be cool. But a welcoming place for kids and their families to come.

19:55 See, I've always thought at a library as and you think about the great libraries of the world, and I think of them as an edifice of knowledge and it's like it, it should be beautiful. It should be just a, you just should just be you like you walk in and you're totally intimidated by the books. Yeah. That's not what?

20:24 Well, I think that's what a library should be. Just

20:27 Well then.

20:31 No, no, no, it it, it, it created a proper appreciation for knowledge. I think in a minute, in a desire to to look into it that thing.

20:42 That maybe that doesn't make sense. Sorry. Sorry. So you guys could ask you ask Carrie. I put the next require question in the chat for you to ask Nick, Nick who has been the most influential person in your life. And what did they teach you?

21:06 Oh, I shouldn't. You know what? I think. I think it because he died I think to a year or two before I was born and it it in the reason he was I thinking for lunch was 4 when he raced my father. It was also influential and it was my grandfather who I inherited his books is Library which consisted of maybe a hundred bucks or so. And they were all subject matter, you know, religion and history and I was in. So as I had a lot of recordings of the end and as as I released, studied his life by and and listen to something.

22:06 Do I could have course seen so much of that his mannerisms and his ethics in my father and it cost me to really contemplating kind of our purpose here as humans in as as people and how we have Generations matter how we influence those that are coming directions, should be should I waste, for instance? My grandfather's efforts at it caused me to think geographically and and why am I in this part of the country? How did I end up here? What's the path of my ancestors? That Led Led me here or that? That put me here. And I gained a lot of appreciation from that. A lot of understanding of inherit much of how I think from people, I can my ancestors. And so, I think just the contemplation of my grandfather has drastically improved in on my on my father's side. My

23:06 Ukulele.

23:10 You know, that's my grandpa.

23:21 And yes, so I'm curious to know. I also think, genealogical you generationally, but I'm going to go the other way and see my children and honestly.

23:44 I am not one who feels like my life is fulfilled because I am a mother. I definitely understand why people choose not to have children there. Lots of doctors and so does not. Kind of feeling like I don't feel like I was always meant to be a mom and, and that kind of thing, but

24:06 Having my kids has taught me so much about empathy and my own assumptions about life and about people. And you know, watching my kids as they grow up and discover things for the first time and that, you know, the world is still very magical to them. And that has that has been, I think probably the most influential thing as far as like, people teaching me things. This is my kids.

24:39 Yeah, I meant. That is interesting. I didn't notice in in the bayou. Are they boys or girls?

24:49 Okay. I apologize, It wasn't in there.

24:57 I'm going to put this next question in there for you.

25:03 So could you briefly describe in your own words, your personal political values?

25:10 Okay, then, you know my political values her or that I feel like we have to do.

25:22 We have to preserve people's people's right to choose and, and how they spend their life and and protect what they built, what what they make of it. You might say, it's the pursuit of happiness, that the founders have so liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, and ethics, and morality or a large part of that.

26:04 And so,

26:06 I think I look at that as a way as, you know, the government has has these roles. And in some cases that, that becomes something that we provide what we can't really provide.

26:23 Individually, you were at the local level. Your thing starts. We provide what we can and elope, most local level. That means. If I can provide it in my household or my household. I don't need the state, or the federal government, or anyone else doing that for me. I can do it myself. And then the question becomes, and I'm sorry if this is not the size, but then the question becomes what, you know, can also provide those things for themselves, and I don't know if that's a pragmatic approach to to government, but maybe I'll just stop there.

27:09 NN so remind myself what the question was values. Their similar, my values are that people are important, and kind of like what you said, it's the government's job to

27:37 Help the vulnerable and give us all equal footing. And I think hear you when you were talking about your work with the Housing Authority, a lot of the assumptions that we made or the biases that we had in the past, have affected so many people and made them more vulnerable. Now, like, you know, putting all of the the project 8 housing together and then you're basically setting that neighborhood up for failure because they're not close to anything that could help them. And I think that is a, is I think that's a failure on government like you were talking about, like, they made assumptions and they made him business decisions or whatever and, and perpetuated, the those people to be vulnerable. So I think that part of it is to the government needs to make sure we all have a fair shot.

28:38 Yeah, that's that's interesting. And I think I wonder what your solution would be, for some things like that. That's what comes to my mind right now. Like you say, you you sick.

28:54 Your approach to a problem where the government has maybe through good intentions of some programs that created problems. Now and now you know, what are the solutions to deal with those problems as they exist and how do we make it less of a problem or maybe make the problem? Go away.

29:18 Acknowledging that there's a problem and that past decisions. Cause that problem, you know that there's a lot of hubris in the government of like all well though. He's done it this way or you know never saying that they were wrong or whatever like things change and information changes and data changes. And so

29:44 Yeah, government is is very slow to roll with those changes.

29:49 People in my, in my side of the island, me personally, I could have just said, I don't think of him. It is a solution to the problem is well, but the government has to be part of the solution to

30:08 Yeah.

30:12 Don't grind, you can come to in this in this particular things.

30:17 Like where it's like the balance between too much and not enough government.

30:26 I'll let you go and I did kind of too broad of a question. Maybe do I work for the government? I work, my paycheck comes from the city of Pryor Creek and one of the goals that I have for my library is 21-day combine all five of the libraries in my County under a townie umbrella. So we would be our own entity, that collects part of property taxes to fund the library. It'll take her go to the people and it'll take a lot of work to do but it makes us independent of the city government for all the cities and then we have we are our own entity with puducherry board that would be approved or appointed by the County Commissioners. But so how that relates to this my biggest concern.

31:25 One of my biggest concerns as we build. The system is too much bureaucracy. Right now. My library is small. I have a staff of 13 6 or full-time or part-time and we can respond to changing information. And she induced it to waysons like a pandemic fairly quickly. And we don't have a lot of Hoops that we have to jump through, but as my organization gets bigger and it's similar with the government. There's a lot of bureaucracy that I think is unnecessary and a lot of, a lot of ways. So that, in that way, I think the government can get too big

32:10 Well, I'm out house ranking in my help in my organization. I don't need with just five libraries. I don't need like four people who are going to. I don't even know what the example is. But you know what? I mean? Like, I don't need a whole lot of layers between the director of the library and the managers who are at the branches and the people who are on the front lines, like I don't need a lot of, a lot of steps in there.

32:49 Right in. And it would be interesting to me that to have a lot more, you know, where the people of the community had a lot more say-so over what their libraries might look like, my feel like they might want to put into those libraries in those places and to me, libraries how to beat Central that should be up in the side of

33:20 I'm with you. Let's do it.

33:27 I want to ask you both how you guys came to be on, like be a Republican or be a Democrat. Like if there's like one standout thing in your life. That's like, no like this. I absolutely agree with that soar. Like an instance in your life that made you want to identify that way.

33:46 Well, let's all go. I'll take that first and the just cuz I went last last time.

33:58 The for me, it was just a saturation thing as I grew up in a house with a dad who was politically interested in the conversations around the house were constantly political and then inspired me to read a lot and political founding documents that the founders of their writings in Federalist Papers, and then I listen to a lot of talk radio, which we probably talk radio is we did just the community of adults and in the family basically just talking politics, a lot, really hashing things out.

34:45 And so I think it was just it was really that, that culture of being interested in that and it wasn't, you know, it. Mmm so much debate. I mean, it's not like people of like Minds get together and they just all agree on everything. I think we disagree on everything and we discuss it and sometimes. So sometimes it was funny. I learned something about conversations. There's a wide yelling at each other.

35:26 Yeah, how about you?

35:31 I think that it was.

35:36 More.

35:39 Not necessarily an attraction to I will say I'm not completely happy with all the things that the Democratic party does it sort of like I'm not a republican. So therefore the next best thing that makes sense but as far as not being more conservative and not being a republican, I think it was some of the rhetoric that I would hear especially in high school and in college from people, I knew were conservative and people I knew where were Republicans, was just not didn't feel right to me. As far as like a human.

36:23 People are important. Kind of message is a lot of it is. I know that it's not, you know, throughout the entire party, but there's a lot of US versus them and Amanda happens on the Democratic side, for sure, but it felt more inclusive to be part of

36:44 The democratic party or the more liberal side.

36:49 I'm curious. Do you feel say less listen to or misunderstood? And when you get around your more conservative friends.

37:02 Do I feel more misunderstood? Is that what you mean? Yeah. Yeah, with you.

37:17 Well, they say it's sort of like the conversation. I had with my family member. There are a lot of assumption being made and

37:26 And that part makes me uncomfortable and I don't really enjoy the bait. I don't want to, I'm going to tell you what I think and I think that and then you're going to tell me what you think and why you think that and then great. So these are the ways that we think and awesome. Like I don't I don't feel the need to try and persuade someone to my point of view, but I do want to feel like I've been heard. Is that make sense?

37:58 Yeah.

38:01 Youth. Do you have like that kind of? Do you ever get uncomfortable talking to people on the other side? I mean, yeah, they don't really make a lot of assumptions about me because there's tradition for one thing, but that's not all the fundamentals of a republic of having a Republican party of all the way back to Lincoln and Beyond, are important to me that the, the arguments that they made for why the party was founded and why they call Republicans. And if you look at the Democrats, had an alternative you and and the reasons why they were founded in,

39:00 I had no idea they were around. And I think those ideas ultimately have at its core that a

39:19 The Republic is in, this isn't talked about a whole lot. Either a most beautiful problem in the Republican Party. Probably don't think about it like this. I just do a republic in all of its facets are better than a direct democracy or a demonic then say you can call it my bro. That's why. And so that the more we get that the last checks and balances we have between just the the absolute majority ruling in something can and policy happening as a result of the more dangerous society yet. And in that means sweet. You, you tend to make those choices faster that end up having detrimental effects later on, and I'm in favor of more checks and balances throughout the system. So that everyone that so that equality gets Spread spread out, in invoices, get her things, get well thought out in

40:19 Process before they become policy and I feel like that's the results and that's why that's that's at the core and if you look at things and in so we can maybe get in at maybe I could explain how I think that's playing out but that's why I'm Republican the the conversation that, you know, there are lots of assumptions that get made in the end so I can counter people on the other side that you're just angry at me that make assumptions that I'm not for human Improvement or even thriving. I'm somehow this type, the ology that that is just squash it the week and get some shirts made in the conversation, gets to a point where it just doesn't really happen that well.

41:18 Do the very same thing and I think that's not helpful. Do you feel like you have

41:31 Yes, as a as a whole, as an active member of the Republican party and so on in it, and it's

41:50 You know, you have the parties just doing things that parties weren't really meant to do and

41:59 If you do, you have these things really, really thick platforms on both sides that just get into every facet of life. And I don't think that's what everyone is looking for. Not saying the system self-serving the population I'm saying it's it's it's really run by a few people. The parties are in in what the parties are supposed to do is get a few good ideas and try to get people behind them that they think will be progress in moving things forward. And so, those few ideas in the original Republican party, were to eliminate slavery and to build a railroad across the country and one or two other things, but I think they're only really three main points to really work on these three things. And one was preserving the Union.

42:59 States working together as under one nation. And so, those were the fundamental things that few good ideas. And I think that if a party is functioning at its best, when it really distills down a few good ideas and tries to get people behind those and those are usually good ideas that people can get behind and that's what United the first parties. And then, you can really talk about this, this differences between the parties, but now it's just like every single thing, like mask-wearing get adopted into a political platform and it's just, it's in. It's really insane where everything that happens gets drawn into a political football, right? We should not be listening to politicians. We should be listening to science.

43:59 And doctors and all of those things, not the people who plisat politicize all of it.

44:06 And I think that,

44:09 I don't know. I feel like the US versus them of politics now is

44:18 I think that that is probably the biggest weakness of our nation is that we are not United under any kind of platform. We have, you know, this.

44:29 This feeling of, you know,

44:33 People are encroaching on our rights or just completely believe the total opposite of what I believe. And so therefore, they are the enemy and I don't think we're going to make any progress doing anything. And maybe, maybe it's because

44:54 That maybe it's because there are there is a desire and I can just, you know, really just blame the Democrat Party for this and they just think the government should do too much. And so, then what ends up happening is because they take this on and say we should do, you know, the federal government should plant flower beds in front of your house. Will then the Republican party goes? We'll wait. No, we shouldn't do that, and that's not a real thing. It's just an example, really happens. You know, one of the founders said this to begin with was he said that once people find, they can vote themselves benefit from the public purse.

45:46 And it seems like that might.

45:50 Be What's Happening, by the way, can you all hear me? The needle over to more and more individual representation in that is saying, as as a broader population begins to feel to vote. And, and, and then vote themselves directly about themselves benefits from government then.

46:19 You get into it, you get string in too many many things and I think you see that as I think about it. You see that reflected in the in the platforms of both parties. Basically, there's an action than the other side, has a reaction. And one of the things I've told people, you know, it's like,

46:40 You know, certainly is say Republicans in my, or I should say conservatives, cuz I know a lot of Democrats who say a lot of God's. But, you know, if you if you adopt a policy where it's just kind of belligerent and you're just like, okay, you can open carry and if your business, we want you to not to be able to not let people open carry a gun in your any restaurant that makes the other side who are fearful about guns.

47:14 I like these got this is crazy. And we need to pass laws against all these sort of your side makes waves about, you know, the other side to really, just digging to do that. You know, when you end up with sort of scorched-earth,

47:47 They act like toddlers throwing temper tantrums and you know, it's that it's a very childish way to react to other ideas. It really is childish. I think that everybody is too concerned with how they look and they are not willing to set ego an image of side to do what is best for our country. At this point, the other side stop talking about taking guns away. It's not it's not helpful, find better solutions to something right? Find a local solution. Do talk to me, can't you see that? You do not approach has been just like you see Idol kids on the street.

48:42 Do something that that you do. Maybe you can have some impact in your own community and, and give them something to to do or work with it. With some organization that makes a difference in their life. And that's probably a better way of effecting, a crime or poverty, then then going out and in deciding the government needs to bring a solution to this.

49:09 Yeah, I mean, I think that local Solutions are and even local elections are more impactful to Everett to people's day-to-day lives than a national election is, you know, it is the City councillors of Prior America, who decide whether or not, we haven't asked Mandy. So if people aren't engaged, in local Solutions, local politics, local organizations, like anything, then they're not going be able to effect as much change.

49:39 I want to let you guys know that we are at kind of closing time. So if you would could you please select one of the following or even like you know, you know something that you learn today if he didn't let the don't like one of these three know. Yeah, I do want to chance to ask Carrie about her experience with the Joplin tornado. If that's not if that's something she would talk about some other part of it being around in this area and later did some work up there as a result. But what was your experience? That sounds dramatic? Yes. It was traumatic.

50:32 And my experience and in what way?

50:36 Like, well you in your bio said that you just a lost everything and that result in you, you coming back to Northeast. Oklahoma, or did you come back here for the job later or but when you just lost everything, then were, how did you get back on your feet? Did you lose anybody in that tornado? Anyone at none of our friends died in the tornado, even our pets survived?

51:10 And I put that in my bio because when people see that I lived in Joplin they always act. And so I just walked out there and be like, yes, I was in the tornado. Yes. I lost everything. Yes, and then and that way, you know, if they want to ask about it, or they want to talk about it then it's it's already open and there's not the awkward. Yeah, but we you know, I

51:35 Feel like the tornado also changed.

51:39 Now that's not the right word it help to focus my feelings about people and about, you know at our base level. We are all the same. We all want the same things and I got to experience an event that showed a lot of disparities between

52:01 You know, the different people, there were people who had insurance. We were really lucky that we had Insurance on our house and that kind of put us in a better financial situation after the tornado. But they aren't. There are friends who, you know, we're renting, and they didn't have renter's insurance. So not only did they lose their home, but they lost all of their possessions and they didn't have any source of you no immediate income to replace those things. And, you know, we were weirdly enough we survived, which is the biggest black part. But we were a little bit lucky that our house was destroyed because going through the process of, if your house is only damaged and you only had, you know, if your roof was damaged, and you had water damage and all that stuff. So, going through the process of insurance claims and work and all of that.

52:57 And during that time, when you have a third of a community that was destroyed or damaged. I don't know that. I would have come out, staying on the other end of that bureaucratic nightmare of haggling with insurance companies and getting my house fixed because

53:15 I thought it sounded it. I mean, just the experience is that my friends went through just getting their lives back to normal because their house was damaged by a tornado. I feel like I was lucky that. Mine was just your wife because I just got to start over. All I had to do was pay for somebody to do the demo and haul it off and then and then I got a new phone. So

53:39 Yeah, I mean, it changed my perspective on a lot of things. I'm a lot of ways that we do not take care of each other. If we do not take care of the government, doesn't take care of his very well. And you know, we have built up these institutions for insurance and all that stuff and it's all about profit. It's not about people and I think that's that's not going to service well.

54:05 Yeah, but is I think she wants us to ask some of these final things, which you know, is there anything that you learned about me?

54:20 I was pleasantly surprised that you are more people focused and I thought you would be. You're also a lot younger than I thought you would be for whatever reason, in your bio. I felt like you were going to be like like your kids would be grown but Young.

54:38 Yeah, I mean I like it's like we said at the beginning, we're closer politically. We're in our, in our core feelings are formally. Then then the current rhetoric of the nation would would imply.

54:52 Yeah, I think I would.

54:57 Say, I don't know that I had any expectations about, I'd love to I would have loved to talk more about, really what you think because you talked about, you know, you you may not feel like either party really represent you. And I would be curious about how that really feels in in what you think the solution to that might be.

55:27 But that's a question. I don't think we have time yet to any that might might make the difference to make people feel more, welcome to to actually just come together for better Solutions. I'd like to be proud of them to be proud of the people that are representing me. And I don't feel that way often and that's part of the problem with a, I don't really want to identify as a Democrat because there are some really embarrassing Democrats out there. So but it was, there was I who you expected me to be.

56:15 You don't, you you are very much like I would expect it at library in the B.

56:22 I am not.

56:24 No, no, no, no. Just very approachable and very interested in those, in in how, how you might approach someone's ideas and how you can be of service, and it just seems like your personality. And I just think your community is very fortunate to have a view of the house.

56:48 If I'd love to, I'd love to come up and help you help you design a a library and do with the way. I feel like we should be represented if we become a county system and we have to build some new libraries, but my library is actually getting ready to go through an expansion projects of the design is already done.

57:08 Well, I'm glad to see someone with passion for that.

57:18 Listen, how are you feeling like after all of that?

57:22 I was nervous. Yeah. Yeah, I was afraid. Nick was going to be mean to me know.

57:32 Did you get that out of recording? I like to get little found by its like-for-like promos, you know, like, oh, yeah, you can definitely use that. Were you nervous coming into it? No. No, I wasn't really worried about about it. But maybe I would have liked something really stereotypical shrill liberal.

58:10 Do you guys? I actually am curious just like do you guys feel like you have conversations like these with somebody from the lake the other side of the aisle or even like a Libertarian cuz you know, Libertarians are in Oklahoma? These like you had these conversations often.

58:27 No, I do to a certain extent. Some of my staff are much more conservative than I am. But you getting a weird dynamic of publicly disagreeing with your boss. And so I can understand some hesitation on their part to discuss their political views with me. But, for the most part, I am very I'm super liberal for a lot of what prior.

58:53 The majority of what prior believes if that makes sense? What about you? Do you still like you? And I do that on purpose? I think I don't hesitate to use from people in my own political party. And you know, this is kind of the way there and that's the way the conversation goes. Try to communicate civilly and try to lie. And I find people receptive to that when that when they, when they realized

59:37 We're not really trying to argue over this issue. We're really just trying to understand each other.

59:45 I like that.

59:47 Yeah, I mean, it's fun to talk about the issues and to brainstorm ideas for how we can fix the problem because we all agree that there are problems.

59:58 And that's fun. But the part that makes me super hesitant to talk about my political beliefs one. I am a very public figure in my town and two, it almost always turns into a debate or, you know, somebody is accusing me of being emotional, and I should be logical or whatever and and that's not productive or fun. So, I just choose not to do that.

01:00:26 Okay, cool. Let me I'll go ahead.