Paulina Roberts and Cori Stern

[00:01] CORI STERN: My name is Cori Stern. I am 44 years old. Today is Saturday, June 4, 2022, and I am in Missoula, Montana, and I am interviewing Paulina Roberts. And I was Paulina's court appointed special advocate. So like a. She is like a mentee to me nine years ago.

[00:27] PAULINA ROBERTS: My name is Paulina Roberts. I'm 23. And today's date is Saturday, June 4, 2022. We're in Missoula, Montana, and I am interviewing Cori Stern, which was my former Casa court appointed special advocate and mentor friend.

[00:49] CORI STERN: So, yeah, yeah. And Paulina, we met, it was nine years ago. I just was kind of looking over some of the old notes last night. We met on February 1, 2013.

[01:01] PAULINA ROBERTS: Wow.

[01:02] CORI STERN: I know, it's crazy. And I had moved to Missoula the fall before from Chicago and decided to volunteer as a court appointed special advocate. My background is in addiction counseling and education, and I always worked with children. I was an adolescent substance abuse counselor. I also worked with the women's shelter in Chicago, advocating for moms and their children. And I also worked with children in a refugee program in Chicago. So I came here looking for something, working with children specifically, I wanted to work with teenagers because I love teenagers. And so I found Casa of Missoula and did the training. We are volunteers from the community. We do about 30 hours of training, and we advocate for kids in the judicial system who are placed there because of abuse and neglect. So we are advocates who work in the best interest of the child, and we are sort of the eyes and ears of the judge. So we report everything to the judge, what is going on with the child? Because, unfortunately, a lot of kids can get lost in the system. You have one case worker, and that caseworker might have 30 to 40 children in their care. And then there's attorneys who have maybe 30 to 50 children in their care, and then you have the group homes and then the different schools and counselors. So the child does have a lot of support. But the goal of the CASA is you work with one child at a time and really follow that. And so I was lucky that I got you. And I'll never forget when I first met you in that February, and you were twelve years old, and you were living in a group home, and you go into these cases and you read the file, and they're always pretty horrific for a child to be removed from a home and taken. The circumstances have to be pretty dire for that to happen. And I was really nervous to meet you. I wasn't sure it was one of my first cases. And I wasn't exactly sure what to say. And I walked in and you were just a young girl and you were so sweet and you were so loving, and you were so open, and you were so excited to meet me.

[03:42] PAULINA ROBERTS: Someone different than group home staff and the girls that I was always around.

[03:48] CORI STERN: Exactly. I mean, you were excited about it, and I think we clicked right away. It was easy. It was really easy. And, you know, we met for the first time and I sort of introduced myself and talked about my role. And then, you know, I left and I got into my car and I actually cried because, you know, you were dealing with your world was very challenging and unfair, and yet you were still so sweet and so upbeat, and there was just a light in you. I mean, you walked into the room and you just lit up. And despite the circumstances that you were going through, you were still so sweet and positive, and I just thought, this is so unfair, and how am I going to help this young girl? And our relationship sort of started from there, and here we are nine years later, and we're friends and we have a beautiful, beautiful friendship, and we've been through a lot together, but I'm just really proud of you.

[04:54] PAULINA ROBERTS: Well, thank you. Yeah, I wouldn't have because, yeah, getting, like, I never got lost too much in the system because I had you and I went through, instead of having my case manager not have too much time, I had that and then seemed like I went through, like, five different ones, I think. I don't know.

[05:14] CORI STERN: I think you went through about four or five caseworkers, 30 placements maybe, at least.

[05:21] PAULINA ROBERTS: I don't know. Sometimes it was just, you know, little places there.

[05:24] CORI STERN: Little places. But between, like, hospitals, group homes, therapeutic homes, foster families, it was. I think it was about 30 over. I was your advocate for five and a half years, and I think it was about 20 to 30 placements. But I never lost you. I mean, I always kept track of where you were. I attended every single meeting. That was, you know, the hope with Casa and with children that get removed from their home. The goal is always reunification. That's the number one goal. And it's very rare. I think I read maybe like, 80% of kids get reunified in Montana, maybe 85%. And unfortunately, you were the 15 that that wasn't going to happen.

[06:07] PAULINA ROBERTS: You were special that way.

[06:08] CORI STERN: You weren't special that way. No. But, you know, and then the goal is long term placement or adoption. And, you know, going into it, I didn't think I made much of a difference because you had gone through all these placements, and you weren't adopted, and you didn't go back home. And I thought, what am I doing here? And in the moment, you don't know the difference that you make, and then it. Sometimes it comes out years later. Yeah, yeah. What is. What is your first memory of me?

[06:39] PAULINA ROBERTS: You know, I can't quite remember, you know, when we first met. I do remember, like, being really happy and that we met in the group home and stuff, you know, there's a lot of them, a lot of memories, walking through the mall when. Because we lived. I. My group home was so close to the mall, so I was like, let's go hang out at the mall. And we walked there, and he'd buy me food. We'd always eat lunch on stuff, having conversations, and, like, when we would have leftovers or bought candy or something, that was like, I was a teenager. I was worried, oh, my gosh, there's so many other teenagers around. They're gonna see me and they think I'm fat or something, and.

[07:22] CORI STERN: And I would carry your food for you. I carry your food for you.

[07:25] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[07:26] CORI STERN: All the leftovers. That's funny. That's a teenage thing.

[07:28] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[07:29] CORI STERN: And we would see your friends at the mall and stuff like that.

[07:31] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah. And sometimes whenever we ran into someone, like. Or I saw someone I didn't want to see, I'm like, let's turn around. Hide me.

[07:38] CORI STERN: Yes, yes, yes. And then we would go and make stories about people and what their lives were and.

[07:44] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[07:44] CORI STERN: And have a good laugh. And we had. We had some good. We had some good times. But you are amazing, Paulina. I mean, you got through that, and you came out, you know, creating a completely different life for yourself and your family. I mean, you're a mom now with a three year old, and I. You're pregnant, seven months pregnant with your second on the way. You have completely changed paths, and you broke that cycle of why you were removed in the first place. And you're living a beautiful life, and you were going to college and taking classes, and you did really well with that. You're amazing. You're amazing.

[08:29] PAULINA ROBERTS: I wouldn't have been able to do a lot of support from. You were the one person that was consistent past 18. Like, there was. I can't tell you how many people are like, oh, yeah, well, I'll still try and have a relationship or keep touch with you afterwards, but, like, they never did. Like, for, like, couple days, maybe, but never, like you did. You knew where, you know, we can. I know that I can call you. If I ever needed anything like before, you know, when I aged out of the system, I, you know, it was a little rough of a start for me. Being newly 18, the first time I get 100% freedom since like, you know, being twelve years. Yeah, yeah. And being able to do whatever and that's like rough being just kind of like, poof, gotta do that. And I know there was a few sticky situations I got in and you, I called you and you helped me and took me somewhere safe. And I didn't even really have to tell you anything.

[09:28] CORI STERN: No, we didn't talk about it. I just. And I mean, for me, that was. I was really touched that you called me, because that's what you deserve. I mean, you deserve that. That whole time is somebody who's gonna love you unconditionally, who's gonna be there for you unconditionally, who's not gonna judge, who's not gonna get angry at you, somebody that you trust. And you grew up in a house where trust was broken a lot, and there was a lot of broken promises and there was punishment that wasn't healthy types of labs and consequences, it was more punishment. And so I just sort of wanted to be that unconditional person for you that always saw the good in you. And I've always had high hopes for you and saw the best in you, and I was glad you called me in some of those situations and we could get you safe. And you had a lot to be angry about. You had a lot to. I mean, I understand why you made some of the decisions you made.

[10:26] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[10:27] CORI STERN: At that time, I mean, you were angry and, you know, and your situation being removed from your parents, you got the bad end of the stick.

[10:35] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah. That was what was really like, helpful like you did. You were more understanding than like, you know, social workers and the group home staff and therapists and stuff, they always just kind of, you know, went on assumptions and whatnot. That, you know, you had even said that you stuck up for me and stuff. And I believe it, you know. Cause you, I wouldn't be here if you didn't stick up for me. Cause like, you and Bob was my attorney.

[11:06] CORI STERN: He was great. Bob was a good one. He's a good one. I mean, he was there all the time too. I mean, he, you know, he was your legal counsel, but he was always there when I had questions. He attended all of your meetings? Yeah, you know, I didn't know him.

[11:21] PAULINA ROBERTS: Very well, you know, because, you know, he was working more so with you because you were my advocate. So, like, that was really helpful, like you would speak for me and that sort of thing, that I didn't feel like some, you know, social workers that should have or what not didn't, so.

[11:39] CORI STERN: And when you go from placement to placement, some of your story or your life gets not forgotten, but little pieces stay in billings or little pieces stay in Helena, all the different places that you were at. And I think hopefully what I did was I was able to keep your story straight because I knew you.

[12:03] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[12:03] CORI STERN: And I knew what you had been through. And so I was able to say, you know, well, Paulina, for example, like with your dad, I mean, that was so mature of you. I remember when you were 14 and you said, I can't live with my dad. It's not safe. He is a good person, he is a loving father, but he's not capable of taking care of me, and I can't go home. And there was a caseworker who I think you had run away, and the caseworker said, oh, we gotta cut off communication with her dad, because she runs away when she talks to him. And I kind of laughed and I said, it has nothing to do with her father. She would have run away anyway. This was probably planned, like having your dad in your life during those five years, even though the parental rights were terminated or he relinquished his parental rights, he's still your dad. He still loves you. It doesn't mean that he couldn't be there for you in a different way. And so I think I was there. I think I was an advocate for that, for your father. And just, like, know it is important, because that's all Paulina has. She has her father and that's it. That was the only family member you were talking to at the time, and it was important that he was involved, even if he couldn't give you some of the emotional support, you know, he was. He was there. And he always called me and checked.

[13:19] PAULINA ROBERTS: The fact that he was always. So I don't have to worry about calling him, because I know to this.

[13:23] CORI STERN: Day he still calls me.

[13:26] PAULINA ROBERTS: He's getting pretty old, so sometimes, you know, he'll forget that he, like, even called me, because he'll call and say goodnight, you know, he likes to do that. And then sometimes he'll call an hour later and say it too. I'm like, uh, I was kind of asleep because we already talked.

[13:42] CORI STERN: Yeah, yeah, I know he's funny, but. But, you know, I think if you didn't, if, you know, if you don't have a casa, sometimes those are the things that, like, caseworkers make assumptions. I like, oh, her behavior is because of this, and.

[13:55] PAULINA ROBERTS: Oh, yeah, they're so.

[13:58] CORI STERN: You told me, I was looking at some of the notes last night when you were 13 years old, you said to me, please tell the judge that I never want to return home to my mom's house. You knew. You knew. And that's hard, because no matter what, you do love your parents. To this day, I think you love both your mom and dad, for sure.

[14:19] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah. I would say, you know, I'm trying to, you know, build that relationship with my mom and kind of just because, you know, she is my family and, you know, I did love her. I remember as a child, I really loved my mom. You know, I just. I was. Wanted to be around my mom a lot of the time. More than my dad, actually, just because my dad was worse of a drunk at that time.

[14:46] CORI STERN: Right, right.

[14:47] PAULINA ROBERTS: But he did, you know, when I said something about his drinking, he did stop, like. Cause I said, I don't want to talk to you. And so he did eventually, you know, stop. And he's been sober since pretty much around the same time that we've met. Yeah.

[15:03] CORI STERN: Yeah. Because he had been sober for a year or two. Yeah, at that time. Yeah, when I met you, maybe a year. So he's been sober this whole time. But, you know, it's for a 13 year old to have that insight on the family dynamics and your situation. I mean, a lot of kids just. They just want to go home no matter what.

[15:21] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah. In fact, my mom says I'm kind of like a role model to her, you know, because I've been, you know, and she, you know, she does throw pity party stuff. And so I tried to get her off of that track, and I'm like, no, let's just, you know, talk about something different. But she says, you know, she can admit that she was, you know, not so good of a mom, and that's something that probably takes a lot of courage to admit, you know, because I can understand. She, you know, fought for me, and so she didn't want to admit for the longest time and be honest with herself, you know, I'm not capable. And that could have, like, saved a relationship early on, you know, because we still were better now, you know, now that I have kids, you know, I'll have one on the way. But I already have a three year old, and so he. When he gets old enough, he can make the choice if he wants to see grandma, you know? But right now, I don't feel like that's. She's. Whenever she's there, she's, you know, I'm always there.

[16:20] CORI STERN: Yeah.

[16:21] PAULINA ROBERTS: Or have another adult.

[16:22] CORI STERN: Yeah, you're protective of him.

[16:23] PAULINA ROBERTS: So, like, that's one thing that, like, we can still have relationship, but, like, I put strict boundaries on that, and I wouldn't have learned that stuff if I stayed with my mom.

[16:31] CORI STERN: Right.

[16:32] PAULINA ROBERTS: That's one thing that was a benefit of, you know, being in group homes and foster homes and everything. You know, I do think it did help me be better. So I think it's kind of like a gift in a way, that it was taken. That it was taken. So I think I started to look at that more that way when I got to be a mom, and I just. A lot of views changed, and my, you know, I wanted to change and be a better mom. I didn't. I learned. I know what to do now because I look at her and it's the. Everything's the example from my mom and dad to be the exact opposite. So they show me what not to do, so it's. It helps. And I feel like, you know, I have them days, and I'm like. I feel like a bad mom and whatnot, but I know when I talk to you, you're like, explain. You know, I have three kids. My kids are crazy. Don't even feel bad. You know, not bad crazy, but, you know, like, you know, all kids are kind of hectic and you go crazy.

[17:36] CORI STERN: Yeah. And toddlers are hard. Toddlers are hard.

[17:39] PAULINA ROBERTS: It's good that they won't be like that forever, you know?

[17:41] CORI STERN: But it gets better.

[17:42] PAULINA ROBERTS: You gotta have a lot of.

[17:43] CORI STERN: Keep telling myself that. I keep telling myself that. Yeah, but, Paulina, you're a wonderful mom, and I'll never forget. Like, I think one of my favorite memories of you was when I got to meet Jonathan at the hospital. It was maybe 24 hours old.

[17:58] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah. And he had a haled meconium, which is the baby's first poo, and.

[18:04] CORI STERN: Yep.

[18:04] PAULINA ROBERTS: So he was in the NICU for three days, and it was, like, so hard. But I. You know, you even had said, like, I had handled it pretty good, but I was impressed with myself. Like, my motherly instincts kicked in.

[18:18] CORI STERN: I mean, you were a natural mother from, like, the second you were pregnant, I found out you were pregnant. And when he was born, and I remember walking in, and you were just so calm. Like, you were just holding on. Like, I got this. You were so calm, and I was just. I was just really proud of you. And I knew, like, I knew. I knew you knew what to do, you know?

[18:40] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah, well, and I could tell because.

[18:42] CORI STERN: You were so natural.

[18:43] PAULINA ROBERTS: My boyfriend Cori which is funny, ironic. Cori and Cory, I know. It didn't mean to happen that way. You know, it just happened. But he was more so the stressed out one because, you know, it was. He had previous stuff with, you know, previous relationship and a kiddo, so. Yeah, I'm not gonna talk about that. But he was more nervous. Yeah, he was more nervous because it's like, you know, and I get it. So I felt like probably had to. One of us had to, like, keep it common together because he was, you know, a little stressed out. And, you know, I can tell when he's more stressed about certain things, and I understood, so.

[19:27] CORI STERN: Yeah.

[19:27] PAULINA ROBERTS: But I had to be there for him as well.

[19:31] CORI STERN: His calm and Jonathan's calm. But it's been cool because when we first met, I was not a mom. You were a teenager. And here we are today, almost ten years later.

[19:44] PAULINA ROBERTS: I can't believe it's like, ten years. It makes me feel old even though I'm not even.

[19:48] CORI STERN: And I have three children. Yeah, and you have one and one on the way. And it's really cool because our relationship has gone from this casa to advocate mentee type relationship to, like, we're friends and we are mom friends. Like, we call each other and talk about our challenges of the day with, like, screaming toddlers, temper tantrums, driving me crazy. I always just try to, like, normalize things for you because you're doing so well, and we all have our bad days and we all get upset with our kids, and you're doing great. You're doing great. But it's really fun because now we have. We both have. We're 22 years apart, I think. Isn't that crazy? We're 22 years apart and we both have three year olds.

[20:34] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[20:35] CORI STERN: Yeah, yeah.

[20:36] PAULINA ROBERTS: But that's okay. I mean, it would be good to hang out.

[20:38] CORI STERN: No, it's. But it's really fun. And now we have our little three year olds that play together, and that's really fun. And I'm excited for number two to come this summer.

[20:50] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah, me too. He's kicking and stuff, so he knows we're talking about him. He's moving around.

[20:59] CORI STERN: What advice do you have for today and in the future? Like, what advice do you have for kids in your situation? Like, what would you tell your 13 year old self today? What advice do you have for kids that are struggling because your situation was rare that you aged out at 18? What advice do you have to hang in there?

[21:28] PAULINA ROBERTS: You know, it's really hard. It's kind of easier said than done a lot of times, because I know my mindset as a teenager was completely different, and I had all these people that were saying, you know, you can do it, you got it, and pushing forward, and then I would always end up, like, kind of self sabotaging. And so I felt like I just had doubted myself or something. And I didn't listen to some people, you know, that I look back on. On some advice that they had given me, and it was like, if you don't like it here, you want to go somewhere, the sooner you, like, behave and just deal with the rules as much as they suck, you know, it's not going to be forever. And I did listen, you know, towards the end, and I ended up. It came true, you know, was able to leave faster and go somewhere, you know, different to, like, foster home or something. And so that, you know, I would, you know, give advice to just, you know, kind of keep an more open mind because. And remember, like, if you get bullied at school, I got bullied at school a lot. And, like, if you're having troubles with other kids and they, like, you know, say this or that, just, you know, remember, I'm actually kind of a little bit stronger than, like, what you're going through, you know, because, you know, I'm dealing with all this, and so. But you don't think about that in the moment. You're just like, oh, but that was your reality.

[23:06] CORI STERN: That was your reality. You know, I think when you're young, that's all you. That's all, you know, you probably thought I was, you know, like, normal.

[23:12] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah, yeah. And it's true.

[23:15] CORI STERN: Like, you should have graduated with high honors because of your life experience. Like, the. When you graduated from high school, you know, not only did you get your degree, but you have a life story that most kids didn't experience. And the fact that you graduated, you know, with. Under that pressure and under those circumstances is extraordinary.

[23:37] PAULINA ROBERTS: It was scary, you know, like, I didn't know if I was gonna graduate or not, just cause. Yeah, well, you're getting so close to.

[23:44] CORI STERN: 18, and you had moved so many times, you know. Yeah. You had been so many to so many different schools, it was hard to get all your credits together and.

[23:52] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[23:52] CORI STERN: And everything.

[23:53] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah, yeah. And that's like, you know, just, I would also say, you know, do more schoolwork. I regret not, you know, paying attention to school and getting in trouble and skipping class. I really do regret that. I wish I. That I wouldn't have.

[24:09] CORI STERN: But when you applied yourself, you did really well.

[24:11] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah, because I did, like, super well in school. If I just very well. And, like, the only reason why I was, did my grades looked bad was because I just didn't do anything and.

[24:22] CORI STERN: Do the work or skip school.

[24:24] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah. And I would say kind of, I probably would have done better and not had so many behavioral issues if I had just kind of focused and distracted with schoolwork. And it's easier said than done, of course, you know, not perfect, but I would, you know, I could go on and on about advice, but I know that having someone in your life that's consistent like you were with me, would, you know, help a lot if there's like, you know, I'll give some advice to casas real quick if or anything.

[25:02] CORI STERN: Yeah, that was my next question is, what do you have? What advice do you have for casas? Caseworkers, adults working with kids, I would.

[25:08] PAULINA ROBERTS: Say, you know, and I get the case workers. You might have big caseloads, but to really, you know, fight for them to have a casa or something and, oh, I lost my train. It's hot. Sorry. But to fight. Yeah, fight for them because having that consistency really, you know, will help. And if they're, depending on how they're there, I mean, don't have to be there past 18 or anything, but trying to do that where there is something like consistency, try to, you know, it's volunteer and kind of like that. The big brother big sister program kind of, you know, but just stay. And that's because that's kind of what I, like, always looked at you was either, like, you know, a female role model or like a bigger sister.

[25:56] CORI STERN: A big sister. We always said that we were. You're kind of like my little sister as youre a big sister.

[26:00] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah, well, I, because I'm taller than you, so I think I took the credit for the big sisters today. You wore heels.

[26:07] CORI STERN: I wore heels that were the same height. We're the same height. It works today, but, yeah, and, you know, today, you know, I recently heard from a caseworker at Child Family services that they're short, you know, eight caseworkers right now and that a lot of kids aren't getting casas. You know, it's really hard right now. I think after Covid, everything kind of got disoriented, and a lot of kids.

[26:36] PAULINA ROBERTS: Don'T, which they like, kiddos that I'm, you know, it would have been harder for me if, like, Covid had happened at that time.

[26:46] CORI STERN: Yes. Yeah.

[26:46] PAULINA ROBERTS: So, like, I. You know, kiddos that are doing good and actually getting through that, dealing with the COVID Yeah. Two years of that stuff, and you have to be in that group. Oh, my God. I couldn't imagine, like, being in the.

[27:00] CORI STERN: Group home like that. It's hard. Yeah.

[27:02] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah. Cuz, like, I'm sure that they were even more strict.

[27:04] CORI STERN: Yeah.

[27:05] PAULINA ROBERTS: About. Yeah. Would like, let you go out in the yard and I know yards probably aren't that big, but.

[27:13] CORI STERN: Yeah, I think the system is just sort of seeing the ripple effect of COVID now, and. And a lot of kids aren't. Don't have advocates, and caseworkers are really busy. And it's unfortunate, I would say something.

[27:26] PAULINA ROBERTS: That would be really helpful for, like, the foster kids and stuff that get moved around a lot to get. Use some funding to get them a suitcase set or something. Because when I turned 18, there was so many things that got lost. And I get it now. As an adult, there are so many kids, it's hard to keep things, you know, organized. And you got so many of them to deal with.

[27:52] CORI STERN: Yep. But they. They do. They give. They give the children trash bags.

[27:57] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[27:58] CORI STERN: When they move from placement to placement.

[27:59] PAULINA ROBERTS: Or boxes or boxes.

[28:01] CORI STERN: Boxes or garbage bags. And that's. And that's their belongings, that's their life. That's their history.

[28:07] PAULINA ROBERTS: I don't know how much bags and.

[28:09] CORI STERN: Things get shuffled around. And there was. It was two years ago when I got a phone call from one of the caseworkers on your case, and they had gone. They were going through all the storage at child family services, and there were two black, huge black garbage bags with your name on it, and they didn't know who to call.

[28:30] PAULINA ROBERTS: And I remember getting that stuff, and a lot of it wasn't even mine.

[28:35] CORI STERN: Yeah, I'm sure. Yep.

[28:36] PAULINA ROBERTS: And, like, I felt bad. I'm like, I don't know how to give it back. I just donated it to Goodwill, or.

[28:42] CORI STERN: I can't remember, but there was some notebooks that were yours in high school and stuff. But a lot of the kids, they age out, and they don't have any pieces of their childhood. They don't have photos, they don't have diplomas or my Social Security card had.

[28:59] PAULINA ROBERTS: Gotten, I guess, two weeks before I'd even turned 18. And I'm like, what the heck?

[29:05] CORI STERN: But it was exciting when I got the call, because I'm like, yes, I know where Paulina is. We're still in contact. Said, I will pick up the garbage bag. I thought maybe it would be a little bit of a piece of your.

[29:15] PAULINA ROBERTS: I was hoping for that photo album. I just. I don't get how they did that.

[29:20] CORI STERN: I know we lost a photo of him that your dad made of like his family and everything.

[29:26] PAULINA ROBERTS: And I wish I would have like used like, asked you for help more to like, advocate. Hey, my stuff. Can you make sure that, like, important things.

[29:34] CORI STERN: All right. There was stuff from one foster family and. Helena, I had a box of your stuff I kept in the garage for a long time. Yeah, but yeah, I mean, things get. Things get lost and that's somebody's.

[29:47] PAULINA ROBERTS: That's.

[29:47] CORI STERN: That's somebody's story.

[29:49] PAULINA ROBERTS: That's just the reality of things. But I do feel like, you know, getting suitcase sets that can get, you know, the names that's like on there, the tags or whatever. And so like, you know, it's set for that. But, you know, who knows? Hopefully maybe that can happen. Or I'll donate some money, I'll start a program or something. I don't know. We'll get in on that.

[30:13] CORI STERN: We'll get in on that. We'll start a program. We can track people's stuff. Yeah. Where do you see yourself in ten years? I mean, you've made all this progress. You're doing amazing today. Where do you see yourself? What do you want to.

[30:32] PAULINA ROBERTS: Well, I don't know. I'm hoping to, you know, when I go back to school and finish my degree, I'm not sure if I'm going to go into social work and have that in my major. I might change it just because of a lot of it. I don't know, it's. I get too emotionally invested and it might be a little unhealthy. So I don't know if I will do that. But I don't know, I might do some more volunteering when, you know, the kids are older. I might end up having. I want to try for a girl, but if I have, you know, four kids and no girl, then I'll wait for grandkids.

[31:13] CORI STERN: If you're done. You're gonna give her four?

[31:16] PAULINA ROBERTS: I hope not, man. I hope I don't get to four, but I don't know. But maybe. Hey, I've heard that is like the perfect number though for.

[31:23] CORI STERN: It is. That's what I readdeze for us to happy.

[31:26] PAULINA ROBERTS: So I might end up doing that just to be happier.

[31:29] CORI STERN: But it's fun. I'm glad we have each other and, you know, this is a fun journey now as we're moms and we're parenting these little ones. But I'm proud of you for breaking the cycle, for being a safe, loving parent to Johnny. And you do it, and you do it so naturally.

[31:52] PAULINA ROBERTS: I feel like I've always just wanted to be a mom, and I think you knew it, too.

[31:55] CORI STERN: Like, you always wanted to be a mom.

[31:58] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah, since I was, like, 13, I think it was just. I don't know. I've always wanted to just be better parent, I guess, than what I had. I'd always thought of that, but I'm glad that I, like, waited and I didn't have teenage pregnancy, because then I would have been.

[32:12] CORI STERN: Me, too.

[32:14] PAULINA ROBERTS: It would have been so worse being, especially in the foster system and stuff. So, yeah, that would have not been good. And so I feel like some of my choices, you know, I wish I would have just, you know, realized, you know, I'm gonna be 18 faster than I think, because it came a lot faster. I remember in the time.

[32:33] CORI STERN: It's like it fell forever. I mean, you just kept saying, can I. Can I just age out now at 16? Can I age out at 17?

[32:41] PAULINA ROBERTS: Oh, and advice for kiddos that might end up now. Like, just don't be so excited to turn 18. I know that it just be, like, happy that you're. You don't have to worry about anything. You, no matter what, they will keep you fed, they will keep you closed. You have shelter. You know, once you're 18. They kind of. I mean, for me, anyways, I was kind of just felt, like, booted to the curb, and I really missed having that, you know, stability and, like, a bed to sleep in every night and shelter and food and clothes and that safety. So I will say when. Unless you have a strict plan to, like, be able to go into independent living. But not every kid gets to.

[33:33] CORI STERN: Not every kid gets to.

[33:35] PAULINA ROBERTS: And just because, you know, I had a little bit of anger issues, but I don't feel like any. It was mainly because no one really.

[33:41] CORI STERN: There's a lot to be angry about. Like, understanding your anger is valid. I mean, you had a lot to be angry about.

[33:47] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[33:47] CORI STERN: You know, I mean, all. I think teenagers were all hormonal and happy and then mad, but you had it a lot harder. So you have a lot to be angry about. Yeah, but I think a lot of kids, and correct me if. If you think this isn't true, but a lot of the kids that age out of the system, they really don't. They do offer some services for, like, a couple years. Yeah, they offer, like, some housing options, reduced housing. I think, and they will pay for some college, but a lot of the kids, they don't. By the time they've aged out of the system, they don't trust the system very much, and they're scared of it, and they feel like, oh, my gosh, now I'm still part of the system. I want to get out of the system. I don't want to be part of it. And so they don't seek out those services.

[34:37] PAULINA ROBERTS: That's, like, what kind of happened with me, because I, like, I was just done with it, you know, and I felt like I could do better on my own. And a lot of them even said, you know, you couldn't, blah, blah, blah, and, like, therapist and say and whatnot. I remember a lot of people had, like, doubted me, and, I don't know, maybe I slightly wanted to prove them wrong. I'm pretty good at that. You did people wrong.

[35:01] CORI STERN: You did prove them wrong. Prove him wrong. Yeah. Yeah.

[35:04] PAULINA ROBERTS: Look at you today, right? Like, I'm sure some people would be, like, shocked. I know. I ran into a staff member.

[35:11] CORI STERN: Yeah.

[35:11] PAULINA ROBERTS: Like, from when I was twice, I was at a park and she. I recognized her. I'm like, oh, hey, hey. And I wasn't doing good at that time, and I think she could tell. And then a year later, I was pregnant with Jonathan, and I was a lot healthier and doing a lot better, and she was just, like, surprised. I remember getting this feeling. Cause she saw that I was pregnant. She was like, oh, no, another kid going into the system or something. And I just got that vibe just because she was what happened to be one of the ones that always doubted me and stuff. So, you know, I just. I haven't seen her since, but that would be cool. I kind of want to run into some people and be like, oh, hey, brag about my life and be like, hey, I'm a completely different person. So. But, yeah, it was. It's nice to be more mature and to understand a little more and to get things, you know, through and. Yeah, just pretty much understand more. And I can cope a lot better, you know, just because I, you know, at the time in foster homes and group homes or I. Whatnot therapy, I wouldn't use my coping skills like I should have, and now I can low. I don't know.

[36:34] CORI STERN: You kept them. You kept them on this. Just a little toolbox on the side for when you were ready to open it, and you. And you had. And you. And you had those tools.

[36:43] PAULINA ROBERTS: And I do think wording is a thing, too. When you're like, telling kiddos to, like, you know, they should do this or that. Don't use the word should or, you know, just be more open and understanding. It's really hard, I'm sure, to probably put yourself in someone else's shoes. Unfortunately for me, I'm, like, very empathetic and very empathetic. I can put my. I can put myself in other people's shoes, which is why I would get too emotionally invested in some jobs, you know, for social work or something. So that's, like, where I don't want to, like, end up being, like, crossing boundary there. I don't want to risk that because I would get so emotionally invested.

[37:23] CORI STERN: You would be wonderful.

[37:24] PAULINA ROBERTS: So, you know, as hard as it is, just try to imagine yourself as a hormonal teenager that's going through all of this stuff. Like, wouldn't you feel kind of the same way and not to be so hard, and just because they make a mistake here or there, they get angry, you know, hit a wall or something. I mean, it's better than probably hitting the kids or the staff, which a lot of the time, that's why I chose to do that. Hit a wall, is because I wouldn't want to hit them. But it was, like, made such into a big deal. Like, I felt like the worst person ever for hitting a wall. And even if there wasn't even that much damage, they would take, like, allowance and stuff away, and it was. I get it. If there is damage, like, take it away, but if it's just, like, a little dentinal, like, what, are you gonna fix that? Right?

[38:16] CORI STERN: Right. Well, you're doing amazing.

[38:18] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[38:19] CORI STERN: I'm really proud of you.

[38:20] PAULINA ROBERTS: Yeah.

[38:21] CORI STERN: It's been an honor for me at this Casa journey, and I'm very thankful for. Lucky that I have you, that this is. It's just been an amazing relationship and friendship.

[38:32] PAULINA ROBERTS: Right. I'm glad that it blossomed into, like, a friendship. I know.

[38:35] CORI STERN: Very cool.

[38:36] PAULINA ROBERTS: I wouldn't even say friendship anymore. I'd say, like, your family. Yeah.

[38:40] CORI STERN: Family. We are family.

[38:41] PAULINA ROBERTS: Cause I know that, you know, I can count on you no matter what time or anything, and.

[38:48] CORI STERN: Yeah. Yes. Thank you, Paulina, for sharing with us. Yeah. Yeah.

[38:59] PAULINA ROBERTS: Well, yeah. I don't know. Anything else?

[39:02] CORI STERN: Nope. I love you, and I'm proud of you.

[39:05] PAULINA ROBERTS: Thank you. I'm proud of you, too, for dealing with me for all them years.

[39:09] CORI STERN: You're worth it. We are worth every second.

[39:11] PAULINA ROBERTS: Thanks.