Ana Cortez, Robert Steiner, and Robert Steiner

00:03 My name is Ana Cortez and I'm 49 years old. Today's date is January 7th. 2016 in we are at the San Francisco Public Library. I am here with my son Robert in with my husband Bob.

00:19 Gaming name is Bob Steiner. My age is 59.

00:26 The date is January 7th. 2016. A location is San Francisco library.

00:33 And I'm right here today with my wife on night and our son is going to interview with Robert.

00:40 All right. My name is Robert Steiner. I'm 18 19 and 8 days. It's January 7th 2016 at the San Francisco Public Library. I am here with my mom Anna and my dad Bob. Okay. So I like I said on the way over I was mulling over a couple of different topics and I decide to go with the first one. I thought of actually them just a little context back in May. I did a project where I interviewed strangers and people on the street about the 2008 recession. Just what they experienced their stories involving it stuff like that. And since it was Focus Graylyn strangers, I didn't really talk to people I know but I thought I should take you out to dinner now to talk to you guys about it being that.

01:37 Really you guys would know a thing or two about the recession as least as far as I remember and we probably you probably approach to different ways of seeing as I was 12 back then so I'm just going to basically use the questions that used back then and we'll see how far we get. So just to start off. What are you guys do for your jobs and currently working for the city of West Sacramento where I manage Administration and finances, but if I'm going back to your question or the context of your question, which is 2008 at that point, I was a project manager for the Redevelopment agency in the city of Richmond.

02:24 Okay, Dad. I work for University of California, Berkeley.

02:32 And I'm one of the people that have been there the whole time then unlike on a Hulu switches around a lot of jobs over her career. I've I've stayed at the same place I graduated from there.

02:44 Had my BS degree in chemistry. I just ended up staying into the apartments and now I set up all the chemistry Labs her other undergrad organic chemistry lab students, which is everybody's favorite class and my been there. It's been it's been quite a ride. I've been there 34 years.

03:06 And I'm retiring next year and it's a bit scary, but I'm looking forward to it and I can remember the times when you were little boy coming into my lab rooms and playing into your drawings and you have a great place to be and you and your sister too so I can I have pictures of your drawing tonight in my office at night and the storeroom and I have memories of when you were a little boy in the

03:31 The students that work for me the route, you know underground chemistry majors in the university and stuff. Remember they would be help you with your homework and stuff like that. Yeah. Yeah. It was a good resource lot of fun. So anyway, okay. Yeah, I'll start off with the question. So when you think back to see what's usually the first thing that comes to mind whether that be news reports headlines the stock market things like that 2008 was rough. We had a. In California that was rough for everybody. But I think that where it was remarkable for people like me who are government employees. Is that for the longest time the government was considered almost like a sacred cow our sessions would hit and you know for the most part you could that you can make it through without too much drama 2009 was

04:31 The perfect storm in California, we had a governor who decided to eliminate Redevelopment for decades Redevelopment have been probably the most effective tool of combating poverty in California. And we had a Democratic governor of all people who would come in actually eliminated which was a surprise to all of us. He did. So in the state of two an MTX address to the to the state as soon as he got elected and so it was it was a major shock. Of course, we knew that that anybody in the field was going to be working together to try to get that to be thrown out in court and if so from 2009 to about 2010, I think that we were all under the notion that the right legal team would be able to to to help us survive the attack from Governor Brown. We figured that, you know, the large corporations that had

05:31 The past abuse Redevelopment and that has so much to gain by the fact that you'll survive this between those powers in the capital coming in that we would be able to actually make it alive and we were wrong and we were on the governor was definitely serious about eliminating Redevelopment, even though when he was mayor in the city of Oakland, he had very very effectively use the tool to improve the city, but I guess he wanted to deny that has that ability to do the rest of the state and that's why you have that going on then at the same time. I was working Redevelopment and Housing and for housing folks the bread-and-butter usually comes from HUD and it had we had changes in region 9. So we lost a leadership in region 9 and we ended up with individuals who were very narrow-minded and quite frankly simply not competent to do the job that they were assigned to do.

06:31 So we had major changes at the federal level. We are huge changes in the state of California and then add to that the fact that we have wear under a recession. So the seat of Richmond rely heavily like both cities on taxes and with the recession what ended up happening is the state of California rated the counties in the counties in turn rated the cities and so cities like Richmond ended up with major deficit add to that the fact that we had incompetent leadership in the city of Richmond from the city council to the city manager to managers. And so it was The Perfect Storm from 2008 to 2014. I would say was a good word for very very very difficult years. I knew that my job was on the line in 2008 by 2009. It was saved simply because my supervisor instead of laying me off decided to retire by her retirement. You basically gave me life so that I could continue. However

07:31 Because Redevelopment was coming to an end. We knew that the department was going to be eliminated. So any worse we went from 37 people to about 5. So I was one of the lucky ones or unlucky. I'm not sure but anybody that could retired retired and those of us who stayed stayed and we learn to basically be quiet whatever working your way you accepted and that was that in I think those were very difficult times because I wanted to go to a different job, you know, there was there was no way I was going to succeed doing the work of five people. It was impossible and not having the leadership that was needed in order to get anything done and the attacks from the from the federal government through hard. So it was just a very bad situation and I try to leave I would say that from 2010.

08:22 224 to 2815 2014 those were four years in which I was constantly looking for work and I remember being very very very defeated and frustrated by my inability to to find a different job when I have never had that problem as your dad stated, you know, I've never really stayed in the job for more than two to three years and here you know, you were so Radiohead been there for and I was trying to leave and I couldn't leave what I noticed was that there were no jobs in the state of California. The other thing the other element that happened was everybody else and Redevelopment was getting laid off. So you had all these people who worked in Redevelopment and Housing who were not laid off we're also looking for work. And so when you guys were small so it's not like I was going to look for work in another state and another city, which eventually that's what I did at that point in time. You guys were small. So I feel that I needed to stay as much as I could.

09:21 In the city of Richmond and I you know, I try to milk that has for as long as I could but those were difficult times. I mean, I do remember being concerned about money.

09:33 Is the recession was it was funny because he was very hard.

09:37 It was very hard on the on my work as a government employee, but I had an easy time getting my own my own gigs through my consulting firm. So, you know, I've always had my job and government but I've always been a consultant as well partly because government salary doesn't cover all the expenses attached to private schools in all that good stuff and partly because I needed a distraction away from government government is too rigid for my taste is so the only way to stay sane was for me to have this other thing going on for years. So what was interesting is that during those harsh the hard years. I did not have a difficult time at all getting contracts. So I was quite busy. I was working really hard. I was working a lot and maybe because of the Consulting I didn't feel as

10:32 Unstable as I probably should have but I didn't you know me. I remember talking to people about the fact that I was laid off and then asking me oh my gosh, what are you going to do and me telling them for the time being nothing because probably the layoff will take several years and he did, you know, basically took four years before it kicked in and in that time, you know, I I was able to have money we were able to pay bills. I mean I done like being housing, of course, I was painfully aware of the Foreclosure crisis. That was one of the main things that I was dealing with him Richmond, the number foreclosures in the city the fact that people work when got themselves into Lowe's and they could have never afforded the fact that we had a banking industry that was criminal the fact that we had a you know, the federal government who basically said people love the fact that we have the state of the state government basically saying you're on your own kid, you know, the thing that makes were very painful and in the bottom line those years. Is that the one percent got rich

11:32 And there's no doubt about that the 99% Kapoor in the Gap increased and

11:40 Animus, it's very interesting to see how the systems that were created supposedly to protect people from such prices didn't work didn't work. And I for one do believe the people knew it was a setup from the get-go in. So anyway those that it was a very very difficult time and I think being in government gave gave certainly gave me a certain inside almost like front seat really does sound like you really had the opportunity to see it firsthand not largest from one aspect like from the news and how most people perceive the recession but also you were in a deep cracks Lisa was happening in the city during this time. There's going to be like Richmond. I imagine it was hit particularly hard and we had the big the big fire at the finery.

12:40 The fire World afire suffice in America problem. Forget that for a second what the fire created was it the property prices at the property values in the city went down because any city that has that level of pollution will not be able to keep property values at the same rate when the property values went down during the recession. So people already down and out. Now the property values go even further down. So before a house could be a source of income because of equity at this point low income families Working Families just about lost every penny they had an equity. I mean, we certainly did, you know one point I think our house is upside down lucky for us, you know, we never got into a dead that we couldn't handle so regardless of that we were paying it was not a problem, but for some folks they got into debt that I probably shouldn't and as the equity went away. They have no money.

13:34 Or anyting and show it again, you know a fire Perfect Storm a who would have thought that there was going to be a Refinery fire station Alliance of government then Dad I was curious actually being that you work at not only at education but at UC Berkeley as we know the UC system have had some trouble past couple years with tuition hikes and things of that nature. So did you notice any of that happening above with your job or just things around campus? Like what was kind of atmosphere during the time? I was very noticeable. That was the worst.

14:15 Like an over the 30 years that I've been there it was the it was the environment was just very they got to the point where I was getting stressful cuz that

14:25 This is the first time I ever remember they were actually furloughing people in the Department's and I didn't get fertile because the you know the kind to keep the chemistry class is going but it is a lot of The Office Depot in the financial people were affected and in like the president of the University of kept making announcements how the we had to make budget cuts and I was actually totally not have to order to keep the classic going for 1500 students and I was actually told I have to make cuts and but at the same time that kept increasing enrollment and stuff like that, it's all stuffed it with you. It didn't make sense and then I felt sorry for the students Costa.

15:06 Tuition hikes kept going up and Adam maintenance being over the buildings and everything was going down. It was kind of obvious in a

15:15 It was a it was bad. I didn't know.

15:19 And then I noticed that when they were hiring a birthday change the retirement system for like new people see I'm grandfathered in that's why I stayed all these years but new people that would go to the room near the university now. I'm not sure if it's worth it for the retirement cuz they pretty much kind of back a lot of the benefits. Basically I care for what I'm going to get when I'm outside.

15:42 And in the past you. Today is it when I get my first started 1982 the University was the California school system looks like the top in the country the public schools in the University system. And now it's I mean Publix gowise of California is rated as one of the worst and do you want to see if they're hanging on and you know, they lose a lot of her top professors go to Ivy League schools and

16:07 Like Stanford and you know Harvard and Yale a lot of the people from my department go there. They just take their whole research Griffin leave, but now I think it's getting better.

16:19 But it's been a slow process but

16:22 You know chemistry Department in Berkeley with you is still you know, it's considered one of the best in the world.

16:29 The fact that I'm there I can see you know what the underground is where I work. So that's where I got that cuts go but research, you know that I'm sure it's good. They hang in there for graduate school has to get a lot of money.

16:40 But for undergrad tell me, you know, my little third-floor that are 11 600 that I just have to keep everything going and I've been waiting and waiting to get the room Dream On on the funny story is a remodeled every floor is the final Bella has eight floors. They remodeled every 4 in the building except my third floor and I have like over 1500 students and we still have the same labrum that I had when I went to school there in the 70s, but I think before they finish the whole floor, but we'll see how that goes. I think that it's supposed to but now we're dealing with the aftermath so, you know, for example for the University of California if I'm fascinating that at least UC Davis is bringing thousands of new students on campus for international students.

17:40 The University of California spends resources to recruit students abroad why they get their pay the larger the higher tuition, which if it was a private institution that wouldn't be having this conversation. But I think the summer we forgot that is supposed to educate the taxpayers of the State of California for government. You know, I do going back to Redevelopment. We no longer have Redevelopment so we can no longer use tax increment to help low-income communities. So we're back to hoping for charity in order to make changes in low-income communities winning back. We had a tool a very powerful too. So the aftermath I think we're still kind of getting a sense of what's going to happen. But what I'm seeing and going back to this notion is that it was great for the rich and continues to be great for the Ridge and it's low income communities that continue like always

18:31 They kicked when they're down and the residual maybe over but the aftermath when I was looking pretty good let you know do Asians going up at the University of California and they say well financial aid is better. If you're if you're low income. You know, I guess I have different believe I think it's better with Mom and Dad have these and sell everything you leaving Addison community so you don't have to rely on charity. So, okay. Well then then all kind of leads to the next question. I want to ask a lot of the people I talked to that when I first did this project a lot of what they said usually involve the sort of that can't happen to me mentality. Like they would first hear it in the news it would read in the papers and you know, it's almost kind of a natural impulse to kind of say that can happen to me. I'm a lot safer than they were they took risks, but then they would say like, you know, my dad's business had to close or I lost my job or my

19:31 Bosses 50 years was fired. So I was just wondering was their kind of a moment like that for you guys were the recession not only became real but it became personal.

19:43 Certainly. I mean, I think that I Knew Too Many people that lost their homes. Okay. I'll get very close to losing their homes. I had, you know, very beautiful to work very close to us who were filing bankruptcy. And now let's take the position of well, obviously, they need to know how to handle their Finance it she may be there were spending too much money. I think that may be true but I think the bottom line is that the recession what he did is that you felt like you were in a dead-end I think that up to that point good or bad people felt that there was always a way out in what I saw with those individuals were closer to us who've you know, what's more familiar with their situation is that they truly felt that they were at a at a dead end.

20:30 Like I said, you know, so I was technically laid off in 2010, but I knew that it was going to take years before the later. Can I never doubted that I will get a job. However

20:45 I was very frustrated and even depressed when for the first time I filled that I wasn't going to get what I want it where I wanted in the change. In fact, I had to adjust, you know at the end I ended up in West Sacramento ended up in the Central Valley. I apply to jobs in Colorado as you may recall. I was really hoping to make a move the boulder. I apply to jobs in Washington and Oregon and Texas, Idaho Youth in Nevada in so I was open Washington DC New Jersey Chicago. I was open to go in just about anywhere because I bought that point the layoff was a minute it was going to happen and I didn't have anything in so I ended up taking a plan C wasn't even a plan B. I ended up on a plan C just so that I would be able to leave.

21:40 Richmond with another job that was still in the retirement system. So for government folks, I think that we are for those of us workout purse.

21:50 We're so much pain to the system. I mean it is whenever possible you try to stay with it regardless of what the job regardless of the title regardless of the salary. You try to stay in the system. Is it for me with imperative to lease Richmond to get into another job that was in the system, even if it wasn't the right job and that's how I ended up in Sacramento in the wrong job doing the wrong things but in the system and it gave me the in time to find the right job the right title the right everything and lucky for me. It took only four months once I was in the valley I was able to get this other job with West Sacramento, but you know, we was a reality check it was I felt that if I had been 35 years old. I probably would have gotten another job silly was I think the first time that it occurred to me that it's harder to get a job the older you get and so I became very

22:47 Concern and making sure that I got another job before my 50th birthday cuz then I feel that if I got to be 50 enrichment I was going to stay there and I'll be stuck.

22:59 Remember it was getting stressful for you cuz of your interviews and at some point we give us getting to the point where it seemed like you were getting interviews. It's because of your ethnicity. Are you remember that? Remember those Boulder interviews? I was like everybody's favorite interview person to interview, but they would never offer me any way to remember that one interviewer that said you were like, oh, yeah. Yeah. I remember telling everybody that my senses do legal.

23:47 But cheating on your mom is tough and she kept going, but I tried to give her a pep talk to and I can't cuz she was getting a bit depressed.

23:55 And you know as far as me, it's just you know, I don't think I was worried about getting laid off cuz the class is going but you know, I just I was worried maybe about the retirement at talking about making tots and they did but I didn't affect me fortunately in

24:10 I mean, I've never really gotten a pay raise in many years because that's just you. That happened in the University, but

24:17 But you know, it's just that you know that I'm hanging in there just for the retirement system. So but you know, you mentioned being around the young students and now they're the funny thing is when I met, you know, I met your mom and she was taking chemistry and you know, I would actually look like this dude and I started my job, but now they look so young because they're like you're in their kids like your age and I have to tell him, you know, when you get a real job, you're going to actually have to do better about calling in and not check if I Heart Memphis up like that because I tend to give him a break, you know, cuz if they're studying and stuff so

25:03 But it's been a good Adventure or not.

25:06 You know, like I said, I have the memories off of you guys basically growing up there you and your sister.

25:17 If I mean, it was such an interesting. Because at work, I was facing all these challenges, you know, when the reality of government changing the reality of revenue streams drying up until it's over. But if you think about it those were the years in which we were at Branson, we were part of the Branson community. So so we were in both worlds. We were in the world where everything is grey. There is no doubt about that. I'm exclusive private school in Marin County with a lot of 1% family sedan engine wonderful day is almost was Unreal. I'm anyways because there was no recession. I never had a conversation about G. Are you okay at work because folks

26:17 Even comprehend that some people actually work for a living and that we get laid off and when things and when you get laid off, you lose your home in that that was such an unreal conversation that there was reading never none of that until I have to navigate this happy-go-lucky, you know, everything is great at school. And then my reality of oh my gosh, you know, the tax base is decreasing. I mean I can tell you guys that being there especially the the first couple years, you know, the difference definitely was evidence and it was really for lack of a better way to describe it a culture shock. It was it was weird because you know, it's not that far from your house is less than a half-hour away, but it really felt like another world but like, you know different conversation points in different like just different everything like what you wore. Are you ate like you did with your friends like

27:18 You know everyone the big social Trend was getting the new iPhone and I still had my flip phone from them. You know, I like it so I can tell you that personally. That's what I sort of realized. There is a difference here. There is something different going on here is when I really came to Branson and when I saw that for that just firsthand and that was kind of my this can't happen to me a moment where I was like, you know, they so this is the one percent this is what everyone has been talking about and that they definitely was interesting to see and it also gave me perspective of what you guys were dealing with it home like Mom. I certainly remember you going out to find this job interviews and it just I think with the benefit of hindsight now, I realize just how stressful that actually was and actually was wondering a little bit about it, but I'm

28:10 So like how did you guys how did the recession kind of make you guys think about how you were going to help me and you and Gabby just keep our lives going, you know his school and Gabby was doing volleyball. I was doing guitar at this point. So like well, I mean my main my main concern was not to interrupt your lifestyle. And anyway, you know, you failed that if if push came to shove us and I needed to ask for more financial aid from the school. I was positive that I was going to get it. So I was never concerned with the fact that we had to pull you out of breath.. Never really crossed my mind and that I think it was the benefit of being part of a community like that and the fact that both of you were an asset to the school you were not troublemakers so that I never lost sleep over that asked for volleyball. Yeah. I mean, I guess that's why I have to get those. You know that the Consulting that the Consulting was always necessary for the volleyball in for the music government/civil.

29:10 People don't put their kids into stuff like that that's expensive hobbies and it requires another job. And so that's and like I said fortunately for me, even though I work was hard the business wasn't in so fortunately for you. It was never disruptive and your mom gets most of the credit cuz you know, she she's pretty much put you guys into every activity possible when you were live on until something stuck. Remember you did to come kick in your name all the things you've done baseball soccer volleyball stuff. You really hate everybody know I hate the most like for Gabrielle your sister.

30:07 Mentor High School with the state championship in and she was a she got actually scholarship offers, but she ended up going, you know, the Stanford cuz she's also very smart and then you and then your music I mean music is your life and that's the most important thing to you and it started with if I have a mommy forced you to do and you hated when you and let you know, I have these These Memories.

30:30 That I always remember cuz you know mom was out with Gabriella and volleyball practice and weekends at my job on Sunday was to take you to your Youth Orchestra. Crazy conductor guy. The wrestling guy said he was like really good. It was like the guy from the movie is he could play, you know any violin and it was fun and then but this whole experience in my job was to like sort of like coaches make and keep make sure your practice then and I remember you had recitals and you'd be nervous and you had to do this memorizing of the music and everything, but I think all that helped you.

31:10 Develop how you are now. You're like you switch to guitar because you know, you can take violin anymore. But you kind of yourself. Yourself the guitar and then you ended up getting lessons.

31:21 And now you're like a great musician and this is your life. You're going to be a music industry major and your Northeastern in Boston.

31:28 You know, you're like, how did you how you how you you've developed yourself? But I think of that was the foundation of this this little boy back to think about in remember and help you with how you're performing now and everything and a lot of that is enough. Thanks your mom pushing you into the all the activities and stuff and some credit to the community when you came home asking for privates for guitar. It was not in my budget, you know, and then so I come to a point where you know, how much more can you take right until I was already working two jobs practically and then you come and ask for private lessons and I remember telling you I can't cuz I was thinking okay. I got to pay for the SAT preparations. I got to pay for your PSAT preparation. There's no way I can do that. But then the community Nebraska Community turns around and gives you the scholarships to receive the private lessons on a weekly basis, so

32:27 I think that even I think our own reality was benefited we benefited from the fact that we were in the very very affluent community that could have forgiven you the free of private my music instructions that have we been in a public school would have been out of the question. So I think that even our own ass I'm having this conversation. We're having this conversation is the maybe I don't feel that everything was easy cuz he wasn't but he wasn't painful either no one during the maybe because we were in this other community my meet maybe that made it a little bit easier.

33:15 Because it started with your sister, you know, she's just really was such a hard worker and I think she set the standard for you and he said I've got I have to keep up with her and then now

33:25 And then and then you came on, you know, we have the teacher evaluations of how they talked about both of you back. We're so proud of you about how hard workers you both were and then in your case how you developed when you became like a class later and then music department and everything and you came into your own and and they gave you a pic of your sister and you what they call the Branson cop was like they only give those to like four people out of the whole graduating class in both you and your sister got that cup. So let me know anything very proud of but it was because of your hard work and we appreciate how hard you're working. And now you have a merit scholarship in your college program. So it's all hard work that you guys have done. So we we want you to know how proud We Are of you.

34:13 Even though I didn't exactly know what was going on back in 2008 let you know I was not old enough to really follow the news but I do remember like when I picked up guitar, I was aware of the struggles that was happening at home and especially with your job Mom and that thing's going out of UC Berkeley dad. So and I remember thinking like, you know, they're really busting it out for me. So I think I can figure out this music thing without a teacher so that like that kind of put everything into play. I feel like, you know, I sat watching YouTube videos and listening to music and just trying to figure it out and then that really kind of shapes.

35:00 Early, I feel like a tattoo. I became just extremely motivated always kind of trying to find a way to get it done. And honestly, I don't think I would have happened if I hadn't watched you guys look out for me and Gabby and just work really really hard to make sure we had a comfortable life cuz even though even though the struggles were there and never felt scary and I haven't said it before I really can't thank you guys enough for that. Like it felt like a normal household, even though I saw around us. It wasn't and like like you said that allowed me to keep doing my music and to keep doing what I loved. And yeah, I'm very thankful for that you guys so I feel like that

35:48 When I put you guys first, I don't know if you remember me how hard it was in our neighborhood to see house after house after house with a for sale sign, you know, and then I record for whatever reason or Court did not go through that. I want house out of 1 2 3 4 5 6 only one home turned over because of the Foreclosure. So, you know, I mean, we had a little of their stable Court among a very unstable neighborhood. We're keeping three mortgages. So it wasn't just one more guess you was through mortgages and and the Lord knows that I we talked about walking away from at least one of them and quite frankly, I think at the end we didn't because we feel that college loans were right around the corner and we couldn't have a bad a bad score in our in our history and we kept it kept it in and things stabilized.

36:48 Has Lessons Learned I guess going back to this house would be there really don't ever over at the stand, you know, only only buy what you can afford and that we have we bought three mortgages that we could afford even under the worst of circumstances. We were able to manage your money, you know life goes on.

37:08 Great antibiotic things are you know, I think we made it through the worst of first that goes and we're looking forward to the future and you know, you're getting through collagen.

37:20 And getting on your life going and happy and then

37:24 You know, and I know we're getting our plan is to always help you finish your college. We don't want you to get stuff for college loans and your sister too and

37:33 But again, you know, it's a lot of it is because of your hard work you guys have gotten

37:39 Is my child of the college experience in the financial aid with wouldn't have got what you got if you wouldn't work so hard to do not to be appreciate.

37:49 You know, we love you guys and we're happy that your gear on the right path. I really can't thank you guys enough for being so supportive in that regard. I mean it it really is a nice feeling to know that you guys are doing everything you can to not make money a barrier. And yeah, I like I said, I'm very thankful for that. I know it was it was a man still has a hard time, you know, folks talk about us being us out of the recession. I mean, yes, there are more jobs out there. But the best as your dad said, you know for young person coming to government now, when you see the prince that aren't the type of pension that they're going to get in comparison to my generation in comparison to Dad's generation. Why would anybody going through government? I only went into government because it made Financial sense as far as you know, the pension I wanted to be in public service and so on and so forth, but the reality is

38:49 Salaries are not what's going to keep competent people in government. The only thing keeping them was pensions and now that's not even the case. So, you know why I think we're like I said, I'm not sure we're out of the recession, but we aren't in only time will tell if we level if we go back to having some Ghana leveling factor that that brings the restore the force, I guess who you a way of putting it is right now, it's it's in disarray still Korean.

39:26 And then there's always this. So I always have this fantasy of you becoming famous rock start taking care of your old dad, but you don't have to go that way and we just you know, I think is keep on the path. You're going you're going to be fine and Adventure your young guys would be good. Just keep going out to visit from you guys. I got to say like she always a nice feeling you and your sister are going to be I would say be a pessimist like when it comes to money because that way you'll never need anything. You want a lot of things but you'll never need anyting cuz I know you and your sister a lot of things you wanted, but you never needed any

40:14 I need to get your iPhone ring.