Oscar Wiley and Sparky Abraham

00:04 Okay, my name is Sparky Abraham. I am 28 years old today's date is June 25th, 2016. I'm in San Francisco, and I'm here with my friend and client Oscar Charles Wiley.

00:19 My name is Oscar Charles Wiley Jr. My age is 76 the date is 25th of June location San Francisco, and I'm here with my with my dear friend attorney.

00:35 All right, mr. Wylie, so we kind of came here specifically to talk about your experience in the pan Oceanic States, but I was hoping that we could start a little earlier and maybe you could tell me about unicorn Up In Harlem and then what brought you out to the West Coast?

00:53 I come out to the West Coast because

00:57 I wanted things to be a little slower in the Bay Area was that and your job market was a little better. How old were you?

01:09 When I came out here was twenty-three and two daughters.

01:16 What was the first job you got?

01:19 Driving limousines and taxicabs. I want you to that for football.

01:25 Couple of years 1960 from 63 to 65 and then I worked in the warehouse on the waterfront for about six or seven months and I decide I want to I wanted to go see cuz the Vietnam War started so in 67

01:46 I applied for emergency Miss documents in a passport.

01:53 And

01:58 September 29th

02:02 I was on this vessel the pan Oceanic State. I called in August, but it was loaded at Monsanto.

02:22 Company

02:25 Puppies Pittsburgh labor hall in Nitro phosphate is the fertilizer.

02:32 But you didn't get on it and Pittsburgh. You got it. I got it. I called in Oakland at the foot of Market Street.

02:41 Was that your first chippy were done? No. No. No. That was my second ship my first trip. We went around the world Vietnam Thailand, Indonesia, Singapore.

02:53 England France South America

02:59 And my time was up, so I got off another ship. This first ship was a government contract that ship.

03:07 Danville Cinema 8 in my ring

03:11 You become.

03:15 Government sailor because the merchant marines do the jobs that the Navy can't do and go where the Navy can go.

03:26 So this was so the pain is Chantix safe with your this is your second. That was my second boys. Yeah, after my two months. It's saying three months after my 27th birthday in July. So, what was your what was your position on the on the Pope Francis Seaman Apprentice Seaman? Is that kind of the lowest like deck level? Yes.

03:52 That's a that's a learning position.

03:57 You have no rank you on that to learn and to train.

04:04 And

04:08 At the time of

04:11 This mishap

04:14 We were

04:17 Up in the bearing seized after a stop in the illusion Islands

04:23 The captain wanted to get some

04:27 Additional navigation advice and to check out the boiler and condensers

04:36 And I was Hillary's.

04:39 With the engineer and we had steering problems on the bridge. What was the what was the cut was the atmosphere like on the ship when you guys first tell by the Oakland? I think I read that they may be didn't take on as much fuel as they were going to need maybe a little hurried. I don't know but when we left

05:04 And we got on the near the pie to station.

05:08 I didn't need the Golden Gate Bridge a chief cook.

05:14 He had been drinking a little bit and he got off with the pilot and he made the statement that I have to get off because This ship's going to sink and I'm standing by the Potter letter and he got off sea bag and all it took a gin with him. Yeah.

05:37 And

05:39 About six days later. We got up to.

05:45 The illusion Island Coast Guard Station

05:50 And we stayed there have got it in the morning. We left in the afternoon. So short say yeah and

06:00 About

06:04 Is 6 or 7th of out of October?

06:08 We run into we run into all kinds of seas 50 ft. The wind was blowing over 50 miles an hour in a 04 Schwinn. Was that a surprise. Did you guys expect that?

06:26 I didn't expect it because

06:30 And my first trip around the world we went through we went around the Cape of Good Hope off of Africa and

06:38 I was prepared for that.

06:41 That wasn't mine. That was a mind-blower. But this was the same kind of season the North Pacific. So I was just hanging on cuz it was rough.

06:55 And I was on Lookout that night and I seen the hatch cover.

07:04 Start flapping on number three hatch on a on the back side and we were sort of what is it, that we would Kilted a little bit to the starboard side cuz we're overloaded.

07:19 And I brought this to the captain's attention and I explained to him that I wanted to go to him to turn the ship into the wind on the least side. So I could go out and secure that hacked cuz I seen that hatch coaming flipped up and I saw the the board cover and that was a whiz to fix it on. It could have took no more than 5 minutes, but the captain refused to let me out on Deck was that cuz it was dangerous to go out there. That's fine.

07:55 I never I never worried about the date is all I all I wanted was to get that hat covered cuz that the Seas were going to get down in the hatch. That was my main concern and the knowledge that I have fertilizers Nitro phosphate is a fertilizer that will explode if it gets wet not there but wet and those are my main concern cuz it was 40. It was 48% and crew.

08:27 And

08:30 On the 9th day early in the morning when it sank.

08:35 Did Captain?

08:39 Call all hands on deck and we would bail and Watergirl the seeds come up at that took off this metal. Do I never seen a seat take doors still door? Was that what?

08:53 Lockdown butt hinges and just take them completely off Bishop.

08:59 And I thought that myself well.

09:03 This is going to happen. So I better prepare myself mentally cuz I was just Junior lifeguard. Also, I went to swimming pools in the summer with kids so I had no field War.

09:16 And I come from a a family of seafarers my uncles.

09:23 Cousins they were fishermen. They work they worked on the military ships. So I had knowledge of the Waterfront that it really didn't bother me.

09:36 But what bothered me was.

09:39 Did Captain didn't want me to go on that cuz I knew I could help.

09:48 Keep that water from getting in the house and to this day. I'll always believe that.

09:54 And on the night when she 2nd 1 in the afternoon.

10:04 We had these old style lifeboats that you had to crank pan Franco decide they want motorized and just as if I were to ship.

10:17 Went flat like this.

10:21 It threw us out of the Lifeboat.

10:24 I read that in the report that they did so you guys have put some people in the Lifeboat how to get the wait 2 to push it off the rack, right? Yeah where you one of the people that was in the Lifeboat? Yeah. Oh, yeah that was on that song on on the port side of the ship the left side of the ship.

10:41 And

10:44 When that happened

10:47 The ship this is the peel of the ship here. So that way to say I was right there by the kill so they can to the ship is almost laying sideways on the starboard and a Lifeboat was on the port side. Like this until you fell is when the ship was sinking you were kind of down by the by the water level and

11:10 As luck would have it on a man of stay ice would have it.

11:17 The engine blew and a ship stop thinking for a minute and I shot up.

11:26 To the top of the ocean and I sat up so fast. I had to spread eagle to keep my ears from popping and when I got to the top of a hat board covers and everything else.

11:42 But my Shipmates will all the sailors and they had some of them had their Cheetos in their hands. They want I had to put some up on light bulb covers has covers anything I could get to make sure they were all right and the coast guard drop that low light rail and I had to swim about a quarter of a mile to get it sometimes like you were kind of using your lifeguard skills. Try to help people get on to some of my cold.

12:19 That was my second shift, but those with some of the greatest human beings and sailors that I have ever sailed with in my life and I put 33 years at Sea. And those are some of the greatest men I've ever been around.

12:38 And they were all New Yorkers right? I was the only one besides the chief cook that got off at the pilot station. So let's back up for a minute. Right? So like I think he said that so in the morning, he calls kind of all hands, right because all has morning about 3 for a call log has the Weaver bail and water or warm water.

13:14 And sounds like at that point you guys were probably on the way down already well.

13:20 She had a starboard list. That's where the ship tilts to the right.

13:26 And

13:30 Had he not been so hard-headed.

13:35 We could we could wait the storm out because all it took was for him to turn the ship.

13:43 To the least side and let the breeze.

13:46 Come this way instead of coming straight ahead. Turn it this way. And you got it a safe passage that hacked was right in front of the house of the 22 headship. And the third that was the third hatch and

14:06 I could have done something with it and I knew I could but hey, so is it I mean, I'm trying to understand what you mean. You mean like so he's pointing the bow into the weather. Yeah, and the half is up in the front or is it that three hatches in front of the house? So if you point me the weather every time ice welcomes over the bow, all that water is going into the hatch.

14:28 And the tops of flapping and see like I was afraid because he liked a short too much in Pittsburgh, but

14:42 I stayed on the. I stood my watch and I always used to.

14:51 Talk to the longshoreman at the people in the factory that loaded this.

14:56 Disc gets fertilizer and they always emphasize that

15:04 You have to keep it dry cuz it's starting to rain one night and they shut down operations closed up all the hatches and we had to close up all the doors on the ship the exits.

15:19 And it was pretty it was pretty hectic there for a while being confined to ship.

15:27 But the song come up and

15:31 We got we would be able to leave so so just kind of take it slowly through the timeline, right? So you guys are the morning. He calls made a time when it's clear the ships going down you're trying to get the Lifeboat off and that like that like whatever quite like whenever came off, right?

15:51 The cable broke when when she sang like this.

15:57 And the fall with cable, it had two cables running on the front and one on the back and the morning on the front broken tilted the boat forward and it through everybody out of everybody just drop her in the water. And so the life raft that you made it to that was one of the ones that the Coast Guard dropped. Yeah one of 616 but not all of them inflated today. No David's the only one inflated and I helped to get 13 people aboard the life raft. I was the 14th and I got to see anchor caught around my ankle.

16:36 And I had to get out of the boat into the water. Hang on to everyone in such a sea. Anchor is loose then crawl back into the life and the secret account hold a life raft in one place right is but if you hadn't cut that out what you would have been able to.

16:57 We would have been bouncing all over the all over the ocean at night.

17:03 What about what time was it? Do you think when you made Slifer opposite still day out? It's just going to get one in the afternoon and by

17:19 Between 3 and 5.

17:23 I had called I had thought the life raft swim for it and when darkness came and we got everybody in the life raft.

17:38 All the teams people including myself. I never saw the rest of my Shipmates now during the night.

17:48 Are Russian fishing vessel picked up?

17:54 Two guys a Japanese ship picked up one and it was two of us in the Life breath when they picked us up the next month only out of 40 people on the two of us was alive and one of the

18:12 The sailors in the boat wanted me to throw everybody out and I refuse and if he if he had a start throwing them out.

18:23 It was nothing I could have done because

18:27 I have sprayed my muscles in my back and I couldn't move when it was I when you fell off the boat. Yeah. Yeah the first time when I fell off a life boat and

18:42 Overnight

18:44 Had a canopy on this life grab an overnight. You could see in the distance the lights from ships. They were Far Far and Away and we were blowing here and I will blowing out whistles.

18:58 That was Anna the life jackets, but they didn't hear is the wind still blowing stop and how it how then blue and the Seas blue until sun up the next morning and it's Norwegian Bessel come alongside and picked up the whole life raft with all of us in it.

19:28 And just when it looked just went and

19:35 When

19:39 We were the last two to take out because they took all of the sea sells out first.

19:45 And when they put us in a bed.

19:48 They gave

19:50 Did the able-seaman a bottle of Scotch?

19:55 They gave me a bottle of Cognac and I'll tell you.

20:00 They had to pry it out of my hands. I was thirsty. I've never been that Thursday and

20:12 They took us down the Long Beach.

20:15 And

20:18 I have

20:20 A picture

20:22 Hear of

20:25 My wife at me when they picked us up.

20:30 And

20:32 If

20:35 You want to send this to?

20:40 B

20:42 Smithsonian you have my blessing. Okay. Thank you so hard to talk about but can you say love it more about what it was like that night. I mean that's a really long time you're talking about. You know, you guys get summoned for 5 in the morning call goes out for help at morning. And then and then you're still on your own for another almost 24 hours between the ship sinking and then you being in the Lifeboat all night. I must been really difficult. You know what?

21:18 Once I thought I got that life breath.

21:23 And I knew I was going to live.

21:26 The only only thing I could think of was getting a sure take it off those two sets of wet clothes. I had my passport. I had my discharges and I think I had some money but all I could think of was getting ashore with those people.

21:50 And having a drink and relaxing and seeing my kids because my wife and family didn't even know I was alive didn't even know the ship shape and

22:05 Some members of the family her cousins came by and told her that the ship is sick.

22:14 And

22:18 I think

22:20 The pastor in my church at the time he found out about it, but

22:27 When I got a sure.

22:31 I got the family.

22:34 This was in the front page of the newspapers and all of that.

22:40 But when I went to church that Sunday

22:46 They my pastor.

22:50 They wanted to treat me like a hero, but I wouldn't have it because to me.

22:57 I went to see so I could take care of my family and that's all I was interested in. I was young, but I was 27.

23:10 Missy July, this is October's 3 months.

23:15 Fremont Pharmacy after my 27th birthday and I had been wrong or what I was happy.

23:23 But I didn't want my children to be.

23:28 Afraid that's what was on my mind when I got to steal.

23:34 And I wanted my wife.

23:37 To know

23:40 When she seen this picture she almost she almost.

23:46 Come apart at the seams.

23:49 At her cousin was there with her and we were trying to calm her down because she was about to come unglued. This is when she when you and her first met after you had the Yeah Yeah Yeahs when they when they brought the ship was a tanker.

24:09 And they had to bring her a cousin a boy. She liked your head of it. This was stolen the Norwegian ship. Yeah.

24:23 They were very nice sales. Very nice.

24:28 And I learned a thing or two.

24:33 About rescue

24:36 Etsy

24:38 It happened to me a couple of times. I had to rescue some Filipinos at 6 Filipino fishermen.

24:45 These guys got caught in a typhoon in the South China Sea.

24:50 In the mid-eighties

24:53 And

24:56 They caught some fish but they ate and they got hungry and they would cannibalize in each other when we pick them up. They take care of the ship's captain.

25:07 This was a catamaran and it must have been 15 people on that ship it will all Filipino.

25:16 So I learned something about rescue at Sea. It was kind of rough.

25:21 But they made it home when we hit Singapore.

25:27 You said earlier that when you were in the Lifeboat, you knew you knew what you were going to say. You knew you were going to survive. So then your thoughts just turned to getting back. How did you know you were going to survive?

25:38 I said my prayers.

25:42 See

25:46 When You Believe in the man above

25:53 And you

25:57 Are Christian

25:59 Your beliefs don't waiver. No.

26:05 And see I come I come from a Christian family.

26:09 So how was taught?

26:12 And I knew that.

26:16 When you believe in God.

26:21 He'll never let you down and the words. I didn't say a prayer facing death in the face. I said these words if you make one step, I'll make two.

26:34 He may just one step and put in for the last 51 years come October 9th this year.

26:46 Once a month

26:49 I always make sure.

26:52 That somebody somewhere has something to eat.

26:58 And something nice said and done form.

27:03 That's what I do.

27:06 That was

27:08 The deal if you will that I made with the heavenly father and I look forward to the first Sunday so I can go out and take communion to the sick in the hospitals in the homes. These are the things that I do.

27:27 These are the things that keeps me grounded.

27:30 And having

27:36 The friendship

27:38 Have a man like you.

27:41 Is solidified my faith because it helps me do things. Sometimes that I

27:50 Let slip see cuz we're all human beings on this Earth and sometimes

27:58 We get caught up in the moment.

28:01 And we forget to do what we're supposed to do and and been having you in my life and makes all the difference in the world. Thank you.

28:13 So we're talking about 1967. You know, you're a 27 year old Apprentice Seaman and

28:25 I know before we came. I I looked at some pictures of some get-togethers of survivors from from the shipwreck in from other shipwrecks of the time to I think they kind of combined them and I noticed that they were all white and you know, you're black. What was it like as a young black man working on a Merchant Marine ship in 1967.

28:49 It was a challenge.

28:51 So to speak.

28:53 Because like

28:57 When I went to that ship.

29:02 My friendship I had been working in the galley.

29:06 Fixing food making up beds and stuff like that and end in those early years of seagoing career African Americans only worked in the stood Department that cooked and made beds and wash clothes and all of that.

29:28 The captain on my first ship

29:32 He told my union.

29:37 Representative that he wanted me to go on Deck.

29:42 Because we had to move the ship and there was no deck department on board and we moved it from a navy base and I pull in the booms and stuff and it was just like I had been working at all the time but what happened was I got that experience from working in the warehouse on the dock forklift moving cargo that kind of thing. So it really didn't bother me work didn't bother me. I enjoyed it.

30:15 And he was impressed.

30:18 That's how you ended up on deck for the next voyage.

30:22 Yep.

30:25 Ticket to Paradise

30:27 So you had you had one trip in the galley and then your second trip was the pan Oceanic Faith which you know sank and lost the vast majority the crew would you say five survivors at a 40-40 and then you you kept going all the way until retirement?

30:47 And I just want to ask you about this this quote that you gave to the Long Beach Independent where that picture that you mentioned of your other wife. First meeting you where that appeared in the article. You said they ask you if you go back to see you again, and I think this was an only like 9 days after the crash which bus I meant only a couple days after you got back you said. Oh, yeah, if I got to go I'd rather go in the Deep six, but on a freeway someplace.

31:24 The money is good.

31:28 Thick atmosphere for young man is good, and don't forget.

31:33 67 was the year did Vietnam started and I had already been there and I didn't want to go back on Old Navy ship to Vietnam cuz it was too dangerous. They were raiding shift. They were robbed and semen and I didn't want that atmosphere.

31:52 So I would I did go back. I know how many how many how many voyages did you take total trailer Caribbean now?

32:01 No, I couldn't I didn't bring the discharges but I see a lot of a lot of ships in 33 years cuz I retire I had my time and by time I was by the age of 59. So I just woke up one day and I said this is it. I've had my fun. My kids are grown. My wife is retired.

32:28 And when I stopped sailing she start flying all over the world. She took a bunch of her friends to you. Ignorant Paris.

32:38 And they had built a tunnel and she took the ferry in the fog and call me. It's foggy outside. So what why didn't you take to the tunnels?

32:48 That didn't sit too well with her.

32:54 So after this whole thing happened up the coast guard and it seems like a bunch of authorities all did investigations what happened in issue reports trying to figure out you know, what was the cause of the shipwreck in all that today?

33:09 And did you have to do interviews with them that you spent a long time dealing with it afterwards?

33:16 The worst thing to me that could have happened in that hole.

33:25 What's to see the captain and the chief engineer standing on the wing of the bridge with two garbage bags and they both was made out of a alligator.

33:39 And

33:41 They chose to go down with the ship that explain what happened.

33:48 And and when I told that to the Ender Quarry

33:56 It it was a a sudden quietness and that Coast Guard.

34:03 The div offices at the table looked at me as if to say, how can you know all of this in this is his second trip to see all the second ship.

34:16 I might have been in The Apprentice.

34:19 But I'm I observe everything around me. That's how I was able to survive what what aspect cuz I didn't reason I didn't panic.

34:33 Everybody hit the panic button in my opinion.

34:37 They died.

34:39 And I knew it was coming. So.

34:43 Why should I panic?

34:46 I managed to bring back 13 men beside myself. It was $14 when they picked us up in that life grabs 08. I must have done something, right?

34:59 Here I am and that's the story.

35:12 I mentioned that you know, I thought I've seen at least a couple pictures reunions you ever talk the other survivors from the ship. No, I haven't. I haven't talked to him since 67cc inquiry.

35:27 Haven't seen

35:30 You are one of them went to be went on to get a captain's license.

35:36 One of them get a mace license.

35:41 And

35:43 We moved on.

35:46 Is it something you try not to think about this something you think about a lot?

35:51 I

35:55 Think about this every night when I go to sleep just a nightmare.

36:01 It's worse than Vietnam. It's worse than liberation of Kuwait Afghanistan. It's worse.

36:10 And it's worse because of the fact that

36:14 These men lost their lives.

36:18 Because

36:20 Of ignorance

36:24 It wasn't their fault.

36:27 And I felt like I could have done something more but

36:33 There was nothing I could do. I did the best I could with what I had.

36:39 But

36:42 This time

36:46 Talking about this, but I leave here today.

36:51 I will have some form of closure. I'll be able to sleep good tonight.

37:05 And with your help, I feel better when I leave. I'm certainly glad to hear that.

37:11 I think we're almost out of time. Anything else you want to know. I'm fine.

37:19 I'm just glad to get this out the way.

37:24 And I appreciate you giving me an Avenue to express this.

37:30 I appreciate your allowing me to participate with you. What I'm hoping is when

37:41 Some of the families stop by the Smithsonian DLC this

37:47 Especially this

37:50 And they'll be able.

37:52 To say well at least you thought of us.

37:59 Mr. Wylie, thank you.