Sharon Downs and Rikki Turner

00:00 I'm Sharon and downs. And I'm 53 years old. Today is Friday, April 2nd 2021, and I'm in Bryant Arkansas and I am with my dear friend, Rikki Turner.

00:17 Relationship my dear friend.

00:21 That's fine. I'm Rikki Turner. I am 36 probably. And today's date is Friday. April 2nd 2021. I'm in Bryant Arkansas, and I'm with my dear friend Sharon Downs.

00:40 So Sharon, we are here to talk to you about your dad and the life. He lived in your relationship with him. So I guess started out with just tell us a little bit about what your dad was like growing up. My dad. His name was Archie Eugene. He hated both names. So everyone has always called him. But he was so when you hear bug and everything, but with quotation marks around it, which I never really got that part, but he was fun Dad out. He really was, he works.

01:20 At the plants at Reynolds plant, so when I was growing up, he did shift work.

01:25 So I do very much. Remember, when he was on the overnight shift. Our lives were turned upside down because we couldn't get in the house cuz I can't sleep during the day, so it would be in the yard, but we can make noise. We wait. Until then when he was working days, things felt more like normal. So it was a, it was strange in that regard. Every week was a different schedule with meals and with just getting to see Dad. And, but, but yeah, he was, he was definitely the stronger of the parents in terms of being stripped. And but he was always loving about it. My parents both believed in corporal punishment, which has not carried on to it, how we raised our son, and I don't resent them at all for it. That's just going to have things were, but I always got the feeling that it broke his heart.

02:25 Sad about it than I was seeing. Now. I've had the privilege of being. I got to meet your dad and the family and everything. And while we were there, you told this wonderful story about the house that you were raised in. Can you tell us about how you were, how that house is built and expanded through, with all of your siblings, talk about the size of the family and what your dad did for your home. So yeah. So the house was is interesting. We called the old barn. It's all done drafting. My parents bought it in 1968. When my twin sister and I were 6 months old, we moved in that house was owned by our neighbor. Mr. Brooks. And the house was originally built somewhere else and it was actually picked up and moved and put their on a foundation.

03:25 Yeah, but it was a small house. So I guess that's how they were able to do it.

03:30 So I'm the fourths of four kids, they only wanted three kids, but the 4th, so the house was not built for that many people at all. It pretty much have one bedroom, one bath kitchen and a living area and that's it. So as the family grew, I'm sorry. I asked as my sister might got older no longer fit in the bassinet, then they had to get very creative but where to put people so that my brother got because he was sharing a room with her sister, but then you get old and you don't want to do that anymore. So they built this little hook inside the in the kitchen where you just basically draw a curtain and that was his bedroom, and it was the size of a twin bed, plus a few min.

04:30 Because there was no other place and then dad put up some walls and built a room for my older sister and then for Karen and me to share. And then my brother got older and it got to be kind of ridiculous that you were sleeping, pretty much all. So Dad decided to add on to the house when you wanted something like that, done, did it? You don't hire people to do it. So my dad laid out some concrete and started building and so he added on four bedrooms and we thought we were in high cotton. There was the out, the toilet was outdoors and so my dad because there's no room in doors for a bathroom until he remodel. So my dad had built the hallway from the back door.

05:30 To the bathroom roof to concrete path and then you were in the bathroom and I never thought that was weird because that was just weird. It's definitely weird now and I remember we had a great claw tub clawfoot bathtub, but it was creepy as heck like at night time, going out there. There was just like this one, long light bulbs, hanging bear. It was a little more than we really thought. We were just the richest people in the world. So to clarify, there were four children and two adults at one point living in a one-bedroom.

06:22 How I felt with one bed. One bedroom, one kitchen, one living room and one with a bathroom.

06:33 Yeah. Wow, so do you have memories of when it was like that before there were add-ons and everything? I do? I do I remember my brothers. Are you more than anything? Because yeah, keep me awake because he was right there right next to the table. I don't know what triggered it. But at some point they're like this is not going to work if the kids are getting. So I'm really curious about this. So it were the BET like what were the sleeping Arrangements. Never like? How did how did the family function in that small of a space with that many people.

07:17 Well, there was a schedule for showers for sure, and I don't remember a whole lot about much else about the arrangement. I know that Karen and I shared a bed in one part of what is now, the living room and my sister was across the way. Okay. Okay. Yeah, that's really interesting. So he built all this, just did he have experience with that? Or did he just how did how did he find the mains? And the abilities to do that on his own is one of those people who just figure things out, you know, when I say he built that he wasn't the best builder at all, but he was created, he would ask questions in this way before Google and YouTube videos. I think the only part he hired out was the Electric electrical part, which were all very grateful for.

08:17 Contracted out that part. But yeah, he's always been

08:25 Always making things. Okay, after we had our son, he started making little wooden toys for Harrison, and we still got all of those poison people like stickers on the truck. So I know you. I know that, you know, you and your three, siblings all have different ideologies and you grew up in very different. You became adults with different political, ideologies, and social ideologies, and things of that nature. So what what part of that do you think can be attributed to your dad? Like what what role did does your dad and his parenting have and how all that played out?

09:16 You know, it's interesting because we didn't talk about politics growing up much at all. I think I diverges from the whole family.

09:27 Because I went to college my parents and other one finished high school and you are going to college it just opens up the whole world to you and my siblings didn't go to college, my brother ended up later, and he's the genius in the family. So I have the most formal education, but he's by far the smartest person in the family. So what was interesting is a big thing that pushed it is after Karen and I moved out the whole family started going to a Pentecostal church. I mean random cuz we were you brought up as as nothing Karen. And I used to walk down to the Baptist Church, which is just down the road just before the fellowship, just hanging out with the kids and I never went to church. Siblings, never went to church. They talked about how we pray, but, but they never went to church. Well then suddenly, they all decided we're going to be

10:25 And you're Ben. And I were married at that point, living in Little Rock and we're just thinking for real. So their politics and my sisters, and her family. And mine was trending. Very liberal because of the people, I was hanging around with, like, you and, and other people at the universe again, so it caused a lot of work for a long time. And then,

10:54 I don't know, at some point with this last Administration with Trump.

11:00 At some point, they just switched like the the switch just flipped for that. Cuz we used to never talk about politics because it would be uncomfortable. I didn't fly clusters avoid the hard topics that has dad got older. He just he just he could not stand that man and and he was frustrated that the rest of the family other than myself and my brother were just so in line with all of his politics and ideology and they were overlooking all of his

11:27 Wake me up at traits and he hated him. We would go over and and that brought us closer. Certainly because there was so much to say on that topic for years. And then we had that in common kind of as opposed to the rest of the family who he would not talk politics with them. And I don't know that they knew that he hated he didn't want problems. You didn't want dad had the pleasure of meeting him and he just always struck me as so kind. He was just the kind of man who is a bear of a man, but he was

12:16 Just so gentle and so kind. And I often think a 10 when I refer to you outside of it, when you're not around, always refer to you as arguably the kindest person. I know. So my question for you is other than the kindness, like what do you feel like your dad really passed on to you?

12:38 Work ethic for sure. I'm a very strong work ethic and dad was just amazing in that regard.

12:46 He was a gentle soul, and I always related to him growing up at more than, to my mom related to my mom, but I don't know Dad and I always had a special connection.

13:00 I don't know the value of cuddling, I got from my dad cuz he was a Smuggler, he would let me snuggle on his lap and when I got too old for that, he let me on the couch next to him. And just, you know, put my ice chest rub my arms around his bare, chest is bear. Just not as he didn't have any of that. Toxic masculinity asking one of these. So he was Raising a Son and three daughters, correct?

13:43 How did that? How did that?

13:48 Did his parents differently based on Ginger's or like how how is his parenting Style with that dynamic in a small house? I don't know if it was because of gender or personality, but my dad and my brother with his butt heads, but my brother is one of the most stubborn people you will ever meet in your life. And so they would but heads all the time. So I don't know if it was gender-related or just his personality. Okay? Okay, it's hard to say, okay, but he was three daughters yet. Okay. Okay,. Thank you or daddy's little girl. Okay. Now what makes you think that describe describe that? What makes you think that?

14:34 Well, Dad's way of showing love was teasing, which is a whole conversation, but he went. He used to tease me a lot and just such a loving man or not a cruel manner at all.

14:49 And so I don't know. I just always felt it. Yeah, and he had a special name for me. He called me sweet pea. I don't remember. He may have had nicknames for them, but I don't remember them. But I always feel very connected to gacha to my dad and I called him daddy until it's probably knows. What about a case of growing up? What were your teen years? Like, with your dad? Where's are there any fun stories of rebellious Antics or anything like that? And you and your dad know because I have a twin sister and she would get caught doing things. She wasn't supposed to do and I never got caught but you were doing them. Yes.

15:43 Yes, absolutely. All right, always got always got caught and so that's where they would look, right.

15:56 For anyone breaking the rules, I would look look look to her and expect it from her but not expected for me. So I I don't you catch your devil horns, varnished. Yeah, sure things seem silly to do. So. Now when did you meet your husband? Ben? I was 16. Okay. He was 20 living in Little Rock and my parents were members and they didn't meet him for a while, but they remember him because we were just very good friends, but we talked on the phone every night for hours and is long distance.

16:56 Break one of their washing, my bedroom and they come through and my dad would say are you talking to Ben again? Okay, Dad, I will. And so then he would go back. And then the next commercial break, if you like. We're rabbit it up. I promise. I promise. I just, we talked, we would talk all night. If we could two years in three years, after three years, after we became best friends, we started dating, and then and then he met my parents. And we were already living together, when he met them, which made him a little terrified of my dad.

17:50 Oh, but Dad was dead was great. He he he he always made them feel comfortable. Always ribbed him as well. Okay, always, ripped him, funny stories to go over there and play Canasta with Mom and Dad all the time. And you guys against girls and your dad's just such a sweetheart and kind and funny. And then I've been through down a card and my dad stood up and tossed his cards down said, damn then, and that is like the line in the family. Every time does anything wrong, the whole family and chorus goes beyond.

18:27 How to use a bidet?

18:34 Oh good, but they loved him. I used to I used to tell him. I think they look so there. Any do you have a story about your dad on your wedding day? How was he might remember more than the wedding rehearsal because I was so excited to marry this man. So excited and I knew it made the right decision like, for my life and that has worn itself out. But I remember the rehearsal for the back of the church and the music starts playing. And I put my arms, your dad's, and we start walking and then I just broke down sobbing and she's like, are you okay, is this what you want to do?

19:15 And I said, no. I'm just getting married and I just had all the feelings. Yeah, just swarm over me. Yeah, that's so sweet. You want to get out right now until we see your dad doing that, to even if it has been more than he loves you, I can see him. So you get married, and then how was the transition for him?

19:56 You're out of the house. You're now married. And I want to be grandparents and all that. Well, with the four of us coming out of luck. They would come over to our house for a cookout. So we can go over there. We play poker Canasta. Oh, I'm sorry. So yeah, we come over and play poker and just, you know, have high balls and just have the best time and they just love them. But there was always his underlying question of. When are y'all going to have kids? When it's been, like 2 years. It's been 5 years. Sharon, has been 10 years. So every time and I told him, I want to get my Master's Degree and have a house and then we'll have kids. That's the order of things because I sent too many couples do things in the wrong order, and then they can never go back to school.

20:59 You're not happy. So my dad every time we come over he say are you pregnant yet? Are you pregnant yet? I just got my Master's every lucky I got. Are you pregnant yet? So Mom said, but stop asking her that she's going to. She's not going to come over here anymore.

21:20 So then we were actively trying to get pregnant. Didn't tell them. We got pregnant first month and it was July 4th. We went over their house for a cookout and I just told Ben I'm going to wait my husband. I'm going to wait until Dad asks all the family was there, we ate. We had fun and I said and he said your mother said, I can't because I'm making you mad, ask me.

21:54 And he said, are you pregnant? And I said, yes, and my mom practically pushed him aside.

22:03 Ran to me and grabbed both my arms. Instead and she left bruises where all her fingers and my dad, we waited 13 years, but they said they couldn't hear it.

22:27 So help, what was it? Like watching your dad become or be a grandparent to your child?

22:35 Pretty remarkable when that little person that you've been connected to, for. All those months comes out. And then the person you've looked up to your whole life is holding that little dog sugar. My mom used to call my dad. So just adore him. So, what's a, what's a story of with him and Harrison?

23:09 Titan. Did they do? Do they have a special bond over something? And well, what Dad would do is he would get his hit, a riding lawn mower, and a trailer attached to it. And so, he would put Harrison in the trailer that had a plastic all around the yard and Harrison, and he can barely talk, but he go up to dad. My dad sick. Papa Chuchu. It's like, okay, I do remember we had we had a lot of conflict, raising Harrison our son because we did not believe in corporal punishment and my parents are convinced. They were going to be spoiled brat American dentist. And so, but I learned how to parent from our oldest friends, who had kids were four and eight years older than Harrison's of weed.

24:09 Co-parenting with some sort of. So we used the more Progressive way of parenting. So we, we never thanked and I do, I remember at some point. My parents said, we just have something to tell you. We were so wrong. We were so incredibly wrong. Your your son is the sweetest of all the grandkids. Don't tell the others was well-behaved and he was not as sweet as that they came to me. I would have never said, see, I was right, but they did that. And I thought that was really big, really big dipper Kenmore Progressive, which is not

25:09 You carry on and he's he's become this amazing grandfather with Harrison. What was it? What was it? Like when it correct me if I'm wrong, but your mom.

25:26 Was he her caretaker for a while, for some of her illnesses, my dad? Yeah, so tell us about that. Mom has several illnesses. The probably the worst one in terms of how it affects our daily life with fibromyalgia. And so my dad just don't, he's always doted on her. Oh my gosh. I used to grow up saying we were poor, but then later, I realized we were Poor Dad made good money. He just blew it all and stuff.

26:02 Because she just didn't feel well enough to do a lot of things. So he just really did everything. He always paid all the bills would let her touch any of that and just we'll get on to her for doing too much and had to go take a nap. And do you have your pain pills and stuff a role reversal and my mom to her credit? Really stepped up her illnesses. Did not go away.

26:33 But then suddenly she was the caregiver and she said it was for longer than any of us realized. At one point dad was sent to the ER three times because he couldn't breathe COPD and we knew that that he was going to the hospital but there was apparently a lot of things. They didn't want to tell us kids that have been getting. So after three times in one month, then we sat down and had a very hard conversation about what needs to happen next because he was so uncomfortable in the hospital. He said for hours in the in the yard to be so much more comfortable at home.

27:13 So, we started talking about hospice and

27:17 I had just gone through the hospice, experience with my father-in-law who had died the year before an amazing experience with hospice. I never really understood what houses was. It was amazing. And so I called Becky the woman who headed up, my father-in-law Steam and said my dad needs to go to hospice. Can we pull the team back together? Cuz I knew all the people she said, no, she said we only do the residential facilities, your dad, staying at home. So they said we made an exception. We love you guys. And so, so they took care of amazing care of dad and gave Mom. A lot of support that she needed. And so it was that it was a huge role reversal, but mom is like, she just went a hundred miles an hour trying to take care of him. It almost felt like a panicky.

28:17 Work hard enough. He'll be okay,, but I started really to take care of her more and more and then his COPD became so bad that they were Scrolls say yes, though. She's in a wheelchair helping to take care of him. And then when he got too much to stand up and just to walk to the bathroom, he couldn't go more than 10 feet and he'd have to stop and sit down and catch his breath. And so are they won't let us help. They won't let us have anyone come into? Hell. No. No. No, we can't ask your kids to do anything even though we're offering.

29:06 But hospice made it very hospice made of

29:10 Was your dad?

29:13 How did your dad come to accept that he was in hospice and that he was passing?

29:19 I think it was us three emergency room visits in a month. Okay. He was miserable is absolutely miserable and I was telling them about the hospice experience that I had with my father-in-law.

29:32 And that I said, they're only focus is for you to be comfortable. That's it for you to be comfortable and not to not to have to keep going to the emergency room when the emergency room is not able to do anything to help you. Anyway, and so y'all he was he was very open to the idea of mom. Mom has some trouble accepting it, but once he was in hospice and they were able to change his medication and just focus on him being comfortable, his calling like, when it was so good that it for well over six months. And usually, the doctor signs a hospice order, when they think the person's going to pass within six months, he was doing so well until he wasn't. So it in June, he started to really slow down. I go and visit and all of his continued to visit even during covid.

30:32 Because we're not going to not see her parents special, and Dad's doing so poorly. But we would like almost Hazmat up. Yeah. And stay not getting anywhere near them and I would note every place anybody touching on my way out. I would like all the circus.

30:59 So yeah, I didn't I didn't know when my last time to hug and would be and I've kind of missed it cuz he went down and at that point happened pretty pretty fast.

31:18 And and I remember telling, Mary, I remember telling you all the gals your damn covid. I wish I could give my dad a hug and Mary said, go hug. It will hug him and I didn't cuz I was so afraid of getting covid.

31:39 But that's so when he passed.

31:45 What would like do you have any like what were your last words with him or anything like that? Do you remember? Well, as last meal that he ate, I helped him with that day, was the first day. He wasn't able to get out of bed. And that's when we knew he was starting to go downhill pretty quickly. So I brought dinner and he set up on the side of the bed and would not let me help him at all except to, you know, get the napkin out and all that. And he would try to talk but he just couldn't catch his breath enough to talk much. So I just talk while he ate and

32:25 Ann. And yeah. By that time I was in his face, give him a kiss, but he was just too. He was too exhausted from not being able to get enough air to hug it hurts. So, so yeah, and then the next day is, when he passed we were all over there except for my brother and your the hospital told us. We got these medications in them in the refrigerator morphine and Ativan and that you just squeeze it. Put it under the tongue If he if he needs it. So I was in there laying next to Dad at this point. He was not responsive. You would, I would talk to him and he would just say what what in this really strange, deep garbely voice, speak until nothing was really registered. So I was laying there with my head on his chest tomorrow.

33:25 Ridiculous, so I called the hospice nurse and told her what it was. I think it was 45 really, really high. I'm sorry. He was breathing. So talk to the hospice nurse and she said 30 minutes later is not any better until I called her and she said,

33:55 I want to do the morphine, but I don't know if he's going to. I don't know if he's going to make it. This might push him over the edge and I said he's in obvious distress. So it's like what would you do? And she said, I can, I give him the morphine. I went to the fridge and gave her the morphine and talk to him.

34:19 And then my mom came in cuz we could tell it was getting close. My son came in, and I don't know how long it was after that second shot, but it wasn't long. It was his breathing calm down, which was such a relief for me. Cuz, yeah, he looked like he was just really suffering something here and then he gave us one agonal breath.

34:53 And then he was gone.

34:56 And my mom who's tough curled up in the bed next to him and and was crying. Don't leave me, but don't leave me. I can't make it without you which she was so embarrassed about later. She said, of course, I want to know is that I just in the moment. I just couldn't place it.

35:19 So,

35:21 I didn't realize until last month as several months after he died that. I never, I never told Mom about giving him the meds cuz she didn't want to be involved in any of that. She just said, I trust you to do what's necessary. So, last month. I was talking to her and I went back and was reading her the text messages between me and Other Woman at hospice and leading up to that day and up to that day. And and I was filling in our phone conversation. So then I called her and she told me to do with the dangerous at Watson and I just realized I never told you that and she said, I'm so glad that you did that. I would not have been strong enough to do that, to give him that might kill him.

36:12 Just so relieved that she was received since she was a little scared of what she would say. Yeah. She was great.

36:22 And you said that, you said that your dad would be really proud of her, and how she's handled things since he's gone. Yet. My mom is an extremely stubborn person, and she's always said, I'm not leaving this house. Now. We're going to have to be first out of this house. Of course, then after she had her leg amputated, she would say that. So, you mean football.

36:52 So we did some estate planning with them. You were kind enough to come over and and my sister was telling Mom. There's no way you can stay in this house after dad's,, you just can't and I'm just thinking. If you want Mom to not do something, don't tell her she can't someone is going to do. So anyway, so we put things in place convinced that I finally hired a housekeeper. So she wouldn't have to do that and signed up for meals-on-wheels. Cuz she's looking down on us for four meals. And

37:33 Expensive. June 23rd is when he passed in. This is this is April and she's living on her own and she's doing for the most part completely fine. It's like she's bound to strengthen herself that she told me she didn't know that. She had his dad always pampered her and just did for her and so went once she was on her own. I think everyone thought she won't be able to manage the life. My sister takes care of all the financial stuff paying the bills. Other than that, she's doing surprisingly. Well, she's managing her pain. I gave her an iPad and so they never had internet their house, Amazon Prime and it is transformed, her outlook on media.

38:33 The media diet. So she's really enjoying kind of Expanding Horizons in in that way and us watching shows together and being able to have conversations about the plot and the person that's been actually really fun. My brother goes over every Saturday to make breakfast for her and I go every Sunday and make breakfast and kind of become a competition. If you can do this, who can do the breakfast that she's going to guess the most of the rest of the family with my Carnitas and mushrooms and spinach omelette. Do that was the one that made candy pecans and crush them up. And so, blueberry pancakes with candy. Pecan sprinkles on Top butter and syrup and you can bring those over anytime you want.

39:33 When do Aldo to everybody who will win?

39:37 She said, I think I need a nap after this.

39:41 Give me both this afternoon and she was thrilled to get it.

39:56 Others in my family who are still very conservative or not getting back from dated. And so I feel bad for them because I can go hang out at mom's now without us wearing masks.

40:08 And that's been such a blessing. I can hug her anytime I want to, so I can kiss you anytime. I want to. I asked her stand-up to get me hugs. So it feels like, you know, my mom, when he first died she put up. This is almost like a memorial in the living room and it is have photos and and love notes that they had written to each other. Over the years. I lots of luck with the little, the little heart and key lock it that your mom wear the heart and he wear the key when he was in the Army, all of this. But all of that is like the all the cards. And then she said it kind of feels like a stone.

40:59 To reclaim that space. And so I, I helped her got some pictures blown up for her to put in the house cuz they didn't have pictures of themselves and we have pictures of the kids and grandkids and great-grandkids. So, I got some great pictures of mom and dad at all stages of their life and and got them blown up and framed and put in her bedroom that used to be dad's bedroom in all redecorated. And it feels like hers now and and it's just been really nice. And she loves having those all the time.

41:37 You know, his last figures. He was just he had that seat at the table at the kitchen table. So we always was always always. And so you were sitting at the table and I just feel like I should be able to reach over.

41:57 Sounds beautiful. Thank you for sharing about your dad special.

42:04 I'm really glad that my son got to know ya and that he has happy memories with. Yeah. Yeah, that's probably my best friend.

42:15 Yeah, I left him. He left me. That was so apparent.

42:22 Yeah, that night. I was feeding him his last dinner. He did call me sweet pea.

42:34 That was sweet. Still have a, have a bottle of his Old Spice aftershave at home.

42:44 And for a while, every morning when I was getting ready to smell it because it just that's dad and my eulogy, I said it. I made a reference to every Old Spice infused memory. So I've got that. And I've got some pictures of them of the house and I saved all the Roses rose petals from his funeral and made little sachets of potpourri for everybody in the family with a little note in its flowers, from dad's funeral.

43:15 Okay, but the real mementos are just our memories. We have so many wonderful man.

43:22 Thank you for.

43:24 Spending this time with me birthday, of course at 11 my pleasure. And I'm glad you got some special.

43:34 Did we hit our time?