Sylvia Camp Svarzbein and Peter Svarzbein

[00:00] PETER SVARZBEIN: My name is Peter Svarzbein We're here in El Paso, Texas. I am 42 years old, and today is January 29, 2023. And I am interviewing Sylvia Camp Svarzbein who is my mother by choice. And we're very excited to be here today.

[00:22] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: My name is Sylvia Camp Svarzbein I'm 76 years old. My interview partner is Peter Svarzbein who is my eldest son, her best son.

[00:35] PETER SVARZBEIN: She forgot to mention that. Behind us are a couple flags. One is of the flag of Argentina, and the other is of the Philadelphia Eagles. My mother, Sylvia Svarzbein what do these flags mean to you?

[00:52] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Well, I have been an Eagles fan for 50 years or so. I lived in, I was raised in Atlantic City, and I spent many years in Philadelphia. So I brought that with me to El Paso, which is Dallas country, so I like to rag em by it.

[01:20] PETER SVARZBEIN: And what does the Argentina flag mean to you?

[01:25] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: That was, my husband was born and raised in Argentina, and he was passionate about soccer. And this year, Argentina won its third world cup championship on the day of my son's wedding, December 18, 2022.

[01:47] PETER SVARZBEIN: It's a pretty good day.

[01:48] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Yeah, great day.

[01:49] PETER SVARZBEIN: I don't think I'll ever forget my anniversary. Right?

[01:52] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Better not.

[01:54] PETER SVARZBEIN: So you said that you grew up in Atlantic City, but when and where were you born?

[02:00] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I was born in Montauban in France on March 8, 1946.

[02:08] PETER SVARZBEIN: Okay. And what were your parents like, and who were your parents?

[02:13] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: My mother was Cecilia Friedman Campello. She shortened it to camp when she became a citizen of the United States. She was a refugee Holocaust survivor. She had been born in Czechoslovakia, and before the war, she was in Belgium. And then during the war, she spent time in Belgium and then in France and in a camp, a work camp or prisoner camp or something like that, which she escaped. And my father rescued her outside that camp and then brought her back to his village in France. His name was Pedro Campello, and he was Spanish. He had fought in the spanish civil war on the losing side. So he had to leave Spain and ended up in a spanish emigre village in southern France and enjoyed the french underground, which is why he ended up being in the forest saving her. He died in August of 1949, when I was three. He died during surgery on his back. I'm not sure whether it was kidney or spine or whatever, but after that, my mother applied to come to the United States because her only surviving sister of twelve was in Philadelphia at the time. So she applied, and we had to wait. And I think two, two years, a little over two years to get here, but we did we took a ship called the General Stewart out of Bremerhofen and crossed the ocean and entered the United States and then went to Philadelphia to live.

[04:32] PETER SVARZBEIN: What was it like during that time when my grandfather was alive? I mean, I'm named after him, right? Pedro Campo. So what memories do you have of Bubby and him? And when he passed away and you had those two years, was there any idea that Bubby had about going to any other places, or was it always going to be Philly? And what did you guys do in between that time of him passing and.

[05:00] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Then getting to Philly? Don't remember much. You know, I was under five. I remember the texture of the silly things, the texture of the side of. In these small towns in France at the time, they. There were no washers or dryers or anything like that. And everybody had a communal. You had these stone vats where people would come and wash their clothes on one side, and on the other side they would rinse them. And one time, a little boy and I played and we slid down the vat because it was soapy, so it was nice and slippery, and they couldn't find us for about 12 hours, so because we couldn't get out, because it was so slippery. So I remember the texture of the wall. I don't know why I remember that, but I remember. I remember someone in white. My mother says it was the hospital, and the doctor was telling her that. That my dad had passed. And I remember her crying. That's about it. I don't remember anything.

[06:31] PETER SVARZBEIN: And so what was it like growing up? Once you came to the states, was there a specific way that you guys were able to qualify to come into the States? What was that process like?

[06:42] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: It was probably, you know, it was. I was sponsored. We were sponsored by my great uncle. It was my mother's uncle, Uncle Joe's wife's brother. He owned a couple shoe store outside of Pittsburgh, and he was the only family member of the cousins and aunts and uncles that had enough money that could, you know, say he would have. Make sure we weren't on the public dole. Not that there was that much available back then. It wasn't like now where there's, you know, services available. It was very little. But when we got here within, my mother got a job as a live in help in the house, a housekeeper for a family that had a. The mother had Alzheimer's or some kind of debilitating disease. So my mom was kind of like her caretaker and housekeeper. And it was one of the few places where I could stay with her. They allowed me to be with her, and it was only two blocks away from my aunt, so it was ideal. You know, we were close to family, but yet I, you know, independent of.

[08:07] PETER SVARZBEIN: Sorts, and I went to school, and so what. So you said you grew up in Atlantic City. So when did you. Or how did you guys move over there? And what was life like? What was it like growing up there in Atlantic City? What were some of your favorite memories or not so favorite memories of childhood growing up?

[08:33] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: When I was about seven or eight, the lady that my mom was taken care of passed away, so they didn't need her anymore, so we moved to another. We lived with another gentleman. He was a single older man in a wheelchair. I remember he was blind, and my mom took care of him. And again, I was, you know, I was in the house with her, but then my aunt, her sister, my aunt Helen moved with her husband to Atlantic City, and their three kids and my uncle had what they called a tap room, which was a bar, you know, and they really liked it there. And they said to my mom, why don't you come here? You can always find a job doing the same thing here, and you have the ocean and, you know, and so we did, and she got a job with the Klein family again, that the mother was, you know, was an elderly woman, and they needed help. So we lived in Margate, New Jersey, which is, you know, like, kind of upper crust. It was a little tough going to school when most of the other kids were all well off and they had nice clothes and, you know, I was in hand me downs, basically. But then again, she died, so we moved into Atlantic City itself, and for about a week, we lived in a hotel, very shabby hotel, until my mom found what they called their rooming houses. I don't know if they have them here, but basically, you rent a room and you have access to a bathroom. And we were there about a month, and then she found this apartment around the corner, and we moved in there, and she worked in a factory making pajamas. Cake. Heron factory, it was called. And I was going to school back then in Atlantic City. They had. And I'm talking about, like, 1955, they had what we call de facto segregation. In other words, there was no law that said blacks had to live in a certain place. But redlining, whatever it was.

[11:11] PETER SVARZBEIN: Yeah, they wouldn't rent, they wouldn't sell.

[11:14] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: To different groups at a certain part, so. And back then in the fifties, they were either called colored people or Negroes. They weren't African Americans or blacks. And they lived north of Atlantic Avenue. We lived half a block south of Atlantic Avenue. But the closest school to where we lived on Kentucky Avenue was Pennsylvania Avenue school. It was like four blocks. And for an eight year old, eight, nine year old to walk to school and walk back. And back then we didn't. Kids that age were walking to school. It was not unheard of. So my mom didn't want to send me to, quote unquote, the white school, which would have been Massachusetts Avenue. Cause that was like 15 blocks away. So at first, they wouldn't let me go to Pennsylvania Avenue school because it was an all black school.

[12:19] PETER SVARZBEIN: These streets sound familiar because they're all featured on Monopoly.

[12:22] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Monopoly, yeah. And she had to literally, you know, go before the school board and say, you know, hardship, please let her go to that school. And kids at that time would go home for lunch. There was no, you know, for grammar school or grade school. There was no cafeteria or anything like that. So my mother would pack my lunch, and then I would. They arranged for me to go home with. At lunchtime with another little girl who was in the class with me, whose father was a preacher. And I would go home to their house and take my sandwich and we'd eat together. And then he'd walk us back to school. And I was there for a year. And then that school stopped at fourth grade, so I couldn't go there anymore. So then I went to Massachusetts Avenue school. And I walked. I would walk. When I was ten, I would walk there. Or I could take a jitney for a nickel, or I could walk and pocket the nickel and get an ice cream after school.

[13:34] PETER SVARZBEIN: So what was. Describe a perfect day when you were young? What would that look like?

[13:40] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I liked school. I liked going to school, so I would go to school in the morning. And being an only child, you like being with other kids because they're not. You don't have them. We had no tv, so it wasn't like I went home and tv scamming.

[14:01] PETER SVARZBEIN: At that time.

[14:05] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Fairly. You know, we had the little black and white ones. Once a week we would go to a friend's house and watch the Ed Sullivan show on Sunday nights. That was a big deal. My mother didn't get a television till after I graduated from high school, till I was gone. They were fairly common, but it wasn't unheard of not to have one, you know. So I'd go to school. I'd come home from school and either go to hebrew school, which was right after. So I would come home, drop off my books, and then walk to hebrew school. And I would be there for a couple hours, and then I would walk home. If I didn't have hebrew school, I would go to, I would go to the library, which was right around the corner, and I would spend a couple hours at the library because I like to read encyclopedias.

[15:08] PETER SVARZBEIN: Do you remember any stories that bubbie or Aunt Helen used to tell you about what life traditions in Europe? Europe and whatever?

[15:24] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Well, they, they were not, you know.

[15:25] PETER SVARZBEIN: Traditions do you think have been passed down to our family recipes?

[15:30] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Probably food more than anything. You know, my, my, there was a kind of a, you know, they were the only two left from a family of twelve, and yet they managed to fight all the time. Not fight, but, you know, just have discussions on which way was better. I'll give you an example. Latkes. Latkes are potato pancakes, which are normally eaten at Hanukkah, which is a holiday in the winter celebrating something where you.

[16:06] PETER SVARZBEIN: Eat some holiday where they tried to kill the Jews. They didn't do it.

[16:10] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: So let's eat. Yeah. My mother would make latkes that were kind of a little on the thick side, like latkes are known today. They're thick, they're brownish, and they taste very good. My aunt Helen used to really grate the hell out of the potatoes and hers would come out skinny and dark and greasy and crispy and they were delicious. And she put lots of onions in them. And I loved her a lot because my mother would say, she doesn't do it right, you know, it's not the way. And I said, but I like them. And she said, it's not the way, you know, you have to make it the way I tell you to make them. And anyway, so go on. But that was one example of one doing one way. And I had three first cousins and they grew up. I mean, it was only a few years that we were together, but my oldest cousin Jack ended up graduating. He graduated Atlantic City High school and then he went into the army. He ended up being, when he got out of the army, he opened up a pizza shop in Glassboro, New Jersey, and he did very well for himself. Now he's retired in Cherry Hill. My cousin Faye is now living in Florida. She's ill, so she stays with her daughter in Florida, and her other daughter is in New Jersey. And my youngest cousin David, which he was my age, ended up going to a yeshiva when he was twelve, and he has become, he is now an orthodox rabbi in Brookline, Massachusetts. He has a congregation there, and he has six kids and 36 grandchildren. And I think he's got great grandchildren. I don't know. He has been fruitful and multiplied. The rest of the family that we have is mostly like second cousins or great aunts. The grates are no longer there. I used to go. One of my mother's aunts on her mother's side lived in freehold, New Jersey, and she had a chicken farm. So a few summers I would go up there and spend a month and clean chicken eggs. And she had a television, and I remember watching a movie there on television. The bachelor in the Bobby socks are with Cary Grant. That was a good movie. Anyway, I fell out of a tree and ripped a hole in my chest while I was there. You imagine me in a tree.

[19:10] PETER SVARZBEIN: You ripped a hole in your chest.

[19:12] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: It was just a scratch, but it felt like a hole.

[19:21] PETER SVARZBEIN: One of the things that also is a big part of your life is you coming to El Paso and starting a family. So can you talk about how you met dad?

[19:40] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Yeah.

[19:41] PETER SVARZBEIN: And how you got here to El Paso?

[19:48] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I was working in Philadelphia at Einstein. I was the head nurse of the operating room, and he was an intern. When he came from Argentina, he was a surgical intern. So my office was like a command post where I could see the patients waiting for surgery. And the, you know, I had the rows where the operating rooms were. And so people come and drop things off or pick things up or ask questions. Doctors got their schedules. Anyway, he would go home to his apartment, which was on the campus every day. He would go at lunchtime and pick up his mail, and he would come and sit in a corner of my. It was big. It was, you know, it was about ten by six, the space, and he would sit in the corner and open his mail and read the letters. He got letters every single day from his family, whether his father, mother, sister.

[20:52] PETER SVARZBEIN: Where was this again?

[20:53] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: This was in Philadelphia.

[20:54] PETER SVARZBEIN: But this was. But what was this place?

[20:56] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: You would open them up at my office. It had a big plate glass window. It wasn't like a little office.

[21:02] PETER SVARZBEIN: So this is before y'all knew each other.

[21:05] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: This was. Yeah, I mean, this is when he first started working there. But it was a place in the operating room where he could sit, you know, kind of quiet, and he would read his letters. And then. And this went on for a year, you know, and then right before. And we were, you know, we were just friends. His English wasn't that great at the time. And then right before he got his. He was only going to be there a year. And then he went on to Einstein in New York for his residency, and I went to a party, and apparently he was invited to the party, too. And I remember we pulled up to the same traffic light. It was up in northeast Philly, near, oh, I forget where it was. Anyway, and he put his turn signal on to go left, and we were supposed to go straight, and I knocked on the window and beeped, and I told him, you're going the wrong way. And I said, carla's is straight ahead, assuming that he was going to the same place. And he goes, I'm not going there yet. I'm going to go visit a friend over here who lived in the same. I was very embarrassed, but it was my usual butting in where I shouldn't have. Anyway, we ended up at the same party, and we were talking, and he asked me to dance, and, you know, and then, so for two weeks, we were, you know, together going out, and then he left. He went to New York, and then he called me a few weeks later and said, you know, he wanted to come to Philly. Would I be interested in having dinner with him? And. Sure, why not? He wasn't working there anymore. It might have been a little uncomfortable working and dating, you know?

[23:16] PETER SVARZBEIN: And your position was what, head nurse.

[23:18] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Of the operating room? Yeah. So it was like the supervisory. Yeah, yeah, and then. Yeah, and then we, you know, we long distance dated for a couple years, and then I moved up to New York, so. But he lived in the Bronx, and I lived in that time. I was living in little Nick.

[23:42] PETER SVARZBEIN: So how would you get over there? There wasn't a train drive, Peter drive.

[23:47] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I drove.

[23:48] PETER SVARZBEIN: How far away was it?

[23:49] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: It was a good half hour, 45 minutes. Yeah. Over a bridge and depending on traffic. One time it took me 6 hours because there was an ice storm.

[23:58] PETER SVARZBEIN: About how long was it usually?

[24:00] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Huh?

[24:01] PETER SVARZBEIN: How long was it usually?

[24:02] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: About 45 minutes.

[24:03] PETER SVARZBEIN: What was. What was his apartment like?

[24:06] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: It was. The first one was just a studio. It was just.

[24:10] PETER SVARZBEIN: Well, back up. Where would you stay? Would you go more to his place? He would come over more to your place.

[24:16] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: When I was living in New York, whether he was on call or not, if he was on call, I would go to his place. Every once in a while, he would come to my place, but more the other way around.

[24:26] PETER SVARZBEIN: And so what was his apartment like?

[24:28] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: The first one was just a studio, very small. The second one was a one bedroom in the Bronx, in the middle of all these enormous buildings. But walking distance to everything. I mean, you had chinese restaurants. You had delis. You had. You know, it was. And it was at the hospital, so a lot of lot going on. A lot of sirens.

[24:56] PETER SVARZBEIN: What did you all like to do when you guys were getting. Were dating?

[25:00] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Eat. Obviously. That's the story of their family.

[25:06] PETER SVARZBEIN: Eat. That's a tradition.

[25:08] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: No, we went to movies. You know, we went dancing. Huh?

[25:12] PETER SVARZBEIN: Where did you dance?

[25:15] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Well, back then, remember, this was the. No, not studio 54, but, yeah, there were clubs, you know, that you could go dance.

[25:23] PETER SVARZBEIN: Which places?

[25:25] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I don't remember the names.

[25:27] PETER SVARZBEIN: Where did you guys go to eat? What was his favorite? What was your favorite?

[25:35] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: There were two places that were near the apartment. One was chinese, and one was, like a jewish deli type thing where they had, like, a good matzo ball soup. And he ordered the chinese restaurant. He always ordered the same thing. Sweet and sour chicken. Sweet and sour chicken. Until one time we went to great neck and we ordered. I ordered because I would always order something new. I ordered mushu pork, and he would always try whatever I had. And he loved the mushu pork. So then we switched from sweet and sour chicken to mooshu pork. Till the day he died. That was mushu pork every time.

[26:18] PETER SVARZBEIN: Do you remember the names of these places?

[26:20] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Nah.

[26:22] PETER SVARZBEIN: So talk a little bit about how. So you said the letters, and I actually think I have a couple boxes full of letters of his.

[26:39] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: You're as much of a pack rat as he was.

[26:42] PETER SVARZBEIN: Well, that's why I was asking about the apartments was, like, they were small apartments, but they were, like, minimalist or they were, like, chaotic. Like, what was.

[26:50] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Oh, they were small, you know? But he didn't have as much. He didn't have much stuff back then. You know, he wasn't.

[26:57] PETER SVARZBEIN: The telltale signs weren't there? Talk about. Cause one of the stories about you guys coming into El Paso is the cars that you drove. So tell me. I know his mach one mustang or mach three. Mach one or mach one.

[27:15] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Mach one.

[27:15] PETER SVARZBEIN: Mach one mustang. Because I barely remember. 1011 years old, driving around the block with it on live oak. But most of my memories of that mustang is it sitting in the garage with various items packed up and alongside it and on top of it. So help me understand how. What it was like when he got it. If you were in his life when he bought it. And then what was it like with your guy's relationship and that mach one mustang?

[27:52] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: He bought it the first year he bought it in Philadelphia. And he. I think it was $3,500. I mean, that he saved to get it. And he just loved it, you know, I mean, that was the epitome for in Argentina, that was considered like, you know, like a Maserati, you know, it was just the end all, be all. It was the hardest thing to get in and out of, even back then, you know, even being younger. But as we got older, of course, it became harder. But he loved that car. He would never give it up. I was trying to get him to trade it in, you know, or sell it because it got to be fairly valuable. Now. He was going to keep it till the day he died, and he did. Yeah, but we went, you know, he went everywhere. And living in New York, you know, when he was in philly, that was fine. Everybody had cars, but New York, in the Bronx, you know, he had a garage space, so it was safe. But, like, if you lived in Manhattan, you'd be paying a fortune for parking, you know? And then when he finished his residency and he went to outside of Trenton, Lawrenceville, New Jersey, he was in practice there for a year, and there he needed the car. I mean, Jersey is like, you know, you have to have a cardinal. And then we drove it to El Paso. We drove his car first to El Paso, and then the second trip we took after we got married, we drove my car, which was air conditioned. His wasn't air conditioned. So when we got to El Paso in January of 79, it was fine. You know, we didn't need air conditioning. It was cold. Come may, all of a sudden, it was like that flashy electric blue with a black interior. I mean, it was hell to be in that car in the summer. So he took my car, and I ended up with a mustang. And he had never let me drive it before, but, you know, it was. He couldn't. He couldn't drive it. It was impossible to have a car.

[30:22] PETER SVARZBEIN: Without washing condition on the weekends.

[30:26] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: No, no, he just. He just adored now he would take it to get washed. He wouldn't wash it. He was not, you know, he was not a hands on car person. He just liked to watch it.

[30:39] PETER SVARZBEIN: What, um, explain how you, y'all got to El Paso, and what was El Paso like for you?

[30:46] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: We got to El Paso in January of 79. We came first in November, and we had our civil ceremony here because we were going to have our religious ceremony in Argentina for wedding. And population was about 300,000, 350,000. The city. The city actually stopped at. There was not much after Mesa going on I ten, the mesa exit. There was not much after. There was no red road. There was, you know, Trans Mountain, I think was the next one. And going east, there was not much after Yarborough. You know, it was like Lee Trevino was just starting, and there was no Georgia. There was nothing until you got to horizon. And in the northeast, everything stopped at just about Trans Mountain, except for, you know, it was farm country or cows. So it was small. And coming from New York, it was just like, you know, coming to a small town. But the one thing that was very impressive and still is about El Paso is a very friendly city. Everybody is welcome. People treat new people warmly. They help them. It's really a very warm and friendly place. My Spanish was very limited at that time. I had taken a quick Iberlitz course, so I really didn't speak much Spanish. Living here over the years and having my in laws come, I can pretty much say now I'm bilingual. So that's one thing. El Paso is about, I think, 85% hispanic. And, and even the other cultures, the ethnic groups that come here, you have a lot of ethnic groups that come from Mexico that are part of other ethnic groups. So you have a nice, big melting pot here. Very much like New York in that sense, but safe. You always feel safe. At least I did. I always felt like I could walk anywhere, not worry.

[33:26] PETER SVARZBEIN: What has been some of the happiest moments in your life?

[33:29] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: The birth of my first child.

[33:33] PETER SVARZBEIN: Do you remember what was going through your head when you first saw me?

[33:36] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: You were so small and so hairy. You only weighed about five, five pounds, five and a half pounds. You were so tiny and the most beautiful thing I'd ever seen. That was when I recovered from having the seizure that you caused me.

[33:56] PETER SVARZBEIN: Do you remember any of the songs you used to sing to me?

[34:00] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: It'sy bitsy spider. You know, you can sing it. No, I'm not gonna sing it.

[34:06] PETER SVARZBEIN: How do you wake me up?

[34:07] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: How did I. Good morning. Good morning. It's time to say good morning. Good morning. Good morning to you.

[34:15] PETER SVARZBEIN: What was I like as a baby and as a.

[34:18] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: As an infant? You were. As an infant, other than for a couple weeks of college, you were wonderful. You slept through the night. You knew your mother doesn't like to wake up at night, and you slept through the night. I think you were about six weeks old. You were sleeping five, six, 7 hours at a time, ate like a little pig, really doubled your weight. You just grew exponentially, you know, from being so small. And you were a healthy baby, and you were kind of as, when you were about, we had what they called playpens back in the day. I don't know, if they still have. If they still have playpens. But if I was. If I had to go do something, I'd stick in the playpen and you would just play by yourself and, you know, or if I put Winnie the pooh on you would, you know, be mesmerized. And you like me to read to you. You didn't talk until you were almost. You were about two, a little over two, and you were just saying, like, one word. You weren't a big talker. And then when your brother came along, that was trauma for you at first. The idea of having a little brother was exciting to you because you'd have a playmate. And then you realize he was just like a lump. Didn't do anything. So you would poke him just to do things, but he wouldn't do it. But then you became good friends.

[36:00] PETER SVARZBEIN: If you could do everything again, would you raise me differently?

[36:08] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I don't know. You know, I thought I did everything right. Maybe I could have been a little. Could have instilled. But see, you know, you're. No offense, Peter, but you're not the most organized, neat person in the world. So I would say, okay, so it was my fault. Definitely your father, because he wasn't either. But yet Jonathan has become this neat freak. And I raised you both the same way, so I don't know how that happens. That must be a gene thing.

[36:44] PETER SVARZBEIN: What advice would you give me for raising my own kids?

[36:48] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Love them. I think that's the most important thing you can do, is just love your children and it comes automatically. You don't even have to, you know, it's just you see them and you fall in love. It's that easy.

[37:03] PETER SVARZBEIN: What are the most important lessons you've learned in your life?

[37:11] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I don't think I learned them. I should learn not to say everything that comes to my head. And I haven't learned that yet, so I think I can't complain. I think I've lived a good life. I've been a nurse. I'm still working at 76. So, you know, I feel like I've done good as far as helping people. And I treated my mother well, I treated my in laws well. I think, you know, I mean, they never complained. I like people. I like helping people. And you two came out okay, you know, you have wonderful wives and what can I tell you? I lived the american dream. Came here with nothing and been blessed, married a good man, was able to support me in his style, which I have become accustomed to. I still travel, like to go to Vegas going on my Star Trek cruise in a couple weeks, and I hope I'm remembered in a kindly way.

[38:44] PETER SVARZBEIN: For generations listening to this years from now, is there any wisdom you'd want to pass to them? Anything you'd want them to know?

[38:50] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Just, you know, the golden rule. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Respect your fellow human being. What can I tell you?

[39:06] PETER SVARZBEIN: How do you think we're alike? And how do you think we are different?

[39:11] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I think we're both alike in our sense of humor. I think in our relationship with people, we both like people and like to be with people and like to talk to people. I don't know. We both have brown eyes. I'm not as hairy as you are.

[39:36] PETER SVARZBEIN: How do you think I'm alike or different than dad?

[39:39] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Oh, I think you're the. I think you're the spitting image.

[39:46] PETER SVARZBEIN: How so?

[39:47] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: But you both pack rats again, sense it. But one thing that daddy and I had in common was both had a good sense of humor, and I think that came out in both of you. He loved to tell jokes. Same joke over and over again, but new audience.

[40:06] PETER SVARZBEIN: What joke is that?

[40:08] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Iceberg Goldberg.

[40:15] PETER SVARZBEIN: Who has been the biggest influence in your life?

[40:17] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: My mother, without a doubt.

[40:20] PETER SVARZBEIN: And what lessons did she teach you?

[40:22] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: She taught me to be cheap, save for a rainy day, be kind to people. She always helped other people. She had what a little. She had, she would share, survive. She loved you. She loved you guys. You know, she was just. You were the. You were the apple of her eye, and you were the first, so she loved you very much. And hopefully my grandchildren will get that from me.

[41:02] PETER SVARZBEIN: Last question. How has your life been different than what you imagined it to be?

[41:10] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I never imagined. I never imagined anything. I mean, when I was a kid, I wanted to be an archaeologist or a detective. I ended up being a nurse, which is kind of combination of the two, I guess. But I never. I never. I always dreamed about Prince Charming, but I never really thought about who I would marry and, you know, have kids. I always wanted six kids. Didn't make it. But I never imagined who, you know, I mean, yeah, let's face it. I could have married Sheldon, you know?

[41:49] PETER SVARZBEIN: Well, you grew up, your father was a hispanic man, and you ended up spoke Spanish as his main language, and then you ended up marrying somebody like that. Did you ever. Did you ever think about your daughter?

[42:01] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Oh, not only that, I married my husband. My father died on an operating room table after surgery, on his back, and I married a neurosurgeon. I mean, how freaky. Can you get. You know, I've thought about that. Yeah.

[42:19] PETER SVARZBEIN: We need your 10 seconds of Zen. All right.

[42:23] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Thank you very much, Peter. I enjoyed this conversation.

[42:26] PETER SVARZBEIN: You're very welcome, Sylvia.

[42:28] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Don't call me Sylvia. I'm your mom.

[42:30] PETER SVARZBEIN: I love you very much, mom.

[42:31] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I love you, too. I love Jonathan more.

[42:35] PETER SVARZBEIN: That's not true. That's not one of the questions here. One of the questions. The saddest moment of your life, and I can tell you, is when I just heard you say that you love Jonathan more than me. Do you even have a saddest. What's your saddest moment?

[42:51] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Saddest. You know, I kind of blurred through when Bubbie died. I kind of blurred through when daddy died because it was such a progression with daddy. I mean, it was like a month that, you know, literally was dying. Saddest. Wow.

[43:13] PETER SVARZBEIN: Sorry.

[43:16] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Either of those would probably be the saddest, I guess. I don't. Saddest? I don't know.

[43:33] PETER SVARZBEIN: Are you proud of me?

[43:35] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Of course I am. Are you kidding me?

[43:37] PETER SVARZBEIN: One of the questions.

[43:39] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Are we still on?

[43:40] PETER SVARZBEIN: Yeah. She was angry really bad, but I'm just.

[43:43] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Okay. Yes, of course I'm proud of you. How could I not be?

[43:47] PETER SVARZBEIN: What's the proudest thing you're. What's the thing you're most proud of? Me?

[43:56] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: Your accomplishments, you know, I mean, you're a photographer, and look at all you've done. You know, mayor of protem, city council rep, Adl rep. You know, masters. With all the mishegas you went through, you're still alive.

[44:20] PETER SVARZBEIN: Mishegas?

[44:23] SYLVIA CAMP SVARZBEIN: I'm not going to say anything.

[44:25] PETER SVARZBEIN: I don't know what she's talking about. All right, we got to be quiet for 10 seconds. It.