Tiara Evans and Asha John

[00:05] TIARA EVANS: Hi. My name is Tiara Evans. I'm 27 years old. Today's date is Wednesday, December 8, 2021. I am currently in Queens, New York. And today I'll be having a conversation with my friend Asha, who I've known over the course of ten plus years.

[00:27] ASHA JOHN: Okay. Hi, my name is Asha. As of today, I am 27 years old. Today is December 8, 2021. I'm currently also located in Queens, New York, and I'll be having a conversation with my childhood friend, Tiara.

[00:50] TIARA EVANS: Great. So I'll go ahead and kick us off. And my first question for you is, how did you gain confidence?

[01:00] ASHA JOHN: So, I would say I gained confidence by actually tuning other people out. So, growing up, you know, just like probably any other kid who got bullied or anything. So I was definitely bullied as a kid. Everyone was like a parent. This. You're not good enough. So I would definitely say once I kind of learned to tune other people out and find kind of just, like, the happiness in myself and found what I love about myself, I think the most important thing is to understand you have to love yourself first. And from loving myself and learning to love my body and everything, that's actually how I gain confidence. Yeah. So I will jump. Okay. So, Tiara, I'm going to go ahead and ask you the question. How did your upbringing shape who you are today?

[02:07] TIARA EVANS: Yeah. So that's a really tough question. And I think, for me, it's a mix between my physical environment, you know, as well as the people in my family or, you know, close loved ones who surround. Who surrounded me. In my time of growing up, I've always grown up in a neighborhood that was filled with poverty. I started off, know, kind of bouncing from house to house. At some point, me and my family went into a shelter. And then from that point, from my early childhood to my adulthood, I lived in public housing. So, in New York City, it's called New York City Housing Authority. A lot of people refer to it as the projects. And what it is is really a complex of buildings based on low income housing. And within that environment, there was a lot of violence that you can see, that you experience. And I think a lot of the atmosphere was kind of filled with fear. Over the years, it's gotten much better, especially with policing and patrolling and things like that. But that definitely shaped my childhood in terms of safety and psychological safety and physical safety. And it definitely gave me the will to push through and say, I have to find a way out to succeed, to get my family out of the situation. I'm 27, and I'm still in this circumstance, but I think I'm way better off in terms of mindset and kind of knowing how to maneuver and to really just go about my day in terms of my physical environment. But for me, it really helped me to focus on my education. For me, that was my way out, just making sure I always was in school, I did good. I got good grades. I was the first in my family to be a college graduate, to even go to college. So a lot of that really helped shape my thought around what I see as success. And I think in addition to that, growing up, I had a polish godfather who, I guess it kind of caused some controversy to people outside looking in. You know, you see this young african american family or, you know, this young female who has this six foot five male who's polish. And, you know, you can see the looks on people's faces where they're just like, what is happening here? What is going on? And I'm so grateful for that person being in my life to the fact that it brought in the conversation about race, and it brought in the conversation about how people feel uncomfortable and what matters and what doesn't matter. And, you know, there was a time when we went out to dinner and the table did not want to serve us because I was black and he was white, and he literally, you know, said, you know, a few not nice words to them, and he was in shock at the fact that that was still going on. And I think it might have been, like, 2003 or four. I remember I was, like, six or seven, maybe. And all throughout my life, he's been the most supportive father figure, and he always kept that message in my head to say, I'm no different from you. You are no different from me, no matter what our skin complexions are. And I think that really helps shape my understanding of what diversity is and just who people are. You know, the skin color really doesn't matter at the end of the day. So, you know, for me, a lot of that really shaped my upbringing.

[06:15] ASHA JOHN: That was absolutely amazing.

[06:18] TIARA EVANS: Thank you.

[06:22] ASHA JOHN: Real quick, just to interrupt, I'm getting a little bit of feedback. I could hear an echo for. From tiara. So, I don't know, maybe if there's a door open or. Okay, no problem. I can go further away. Sorry about that.

[06:42] TIARA EVANS: No, that one. I'll close the door.

[06:53] ASHA JOHN: Okay.

[06:55] TIARA EVANS: Is that better? Yes. Asha? Yep. Okay, great. Okay, so I'll go ahead and ask you the next question. This is a bit of a hard one.

[07:12] ASHA JOHN: Yes, it is.

[07:15] TIARA EVANS: What's the childhood memory that if given the choice now, as an adult, you would have sheltered your younger self from.

[07:27] ASHA JOHN: Okay, so the reason why that is a little hard for me to answer, because I cannot. Because similar to your upbringing, I experienced a lot of the same things as in, you know, getting kicked out. I actually was not born here in this country. I was actually born in Dominica. And then I moved my family slowly moved to this country in with my aunt, my mother's sister, and because of her husband, now ex husband, thankfully, but because of her husband at the time, who did not care for us, she agreed with him and made the difficult choice to kick us out of her home. So it was my mom and six kids and my grandmother all had to move into a shelter. So I. So at that age, I didn't necessarily know what was going on, but I think that was probably, like, the most, I guess, perspective changing memory of my childhood of people and others. But to say that I would have sheltered my younger self from that experience, I wouldn't say I can pinpoint that as ever an experience I would have ever sheltered myself from. I wish, as a child, and, like, even with growing up with my brothers and sisters, that all the things that we, you know, went through, going through living in a shelter and living in public housing as well, that honestly, like, shaped who we are now. And you have to work harder, you have to be stronger, you have to just overall be better. And it's just a testament to the person that I am today. So I don't honestly think that there is necessarily any negative memory that I have that I regret seeing or would ever shelter my younger self from.

[09:55] TIARA EVANS: Thanks, Asha. That's insightful. I think a lot of our experiences, right, we kind of know what's going to help shape us and what's not, and what we want to shelter ourselves from or forget or kind of push back into the back of our minds. But I completely agree with you. I think those type of experiences definitely set you up to figure out what life is and what life. Yeah, early on, yes.

[10:24] ASHA JOHN: So as much as it was not so much fun having those experiences, I don't regret or wish that I had any different of a childhood. Like, I still enjoyed growing up in public housing. A lot of my friends were there as well. I still enjoyed just the person that I became now. And I'm pretty proud of myself from all that I have and all that I've done to be a better person today. So I don't regret anything. Even if anything was out of my hands, I don't regret it.

[11:03] TIARA EVANS: Okay, great.

[11:06] ASHA JOHN: So we're going to dive right into the next question. And, Tiara, I'll ask you, what's the one thing you would have told your younger self when no one else would?

[11:19] TIARA EVANS: Hmm. Um, let me see. I think it's more of a cliche one, right? Like, when people try to put their perceptions onto you to say, you'll never be this and you'll never be that, and you're not capable of doing this. And I think as a child, you kind of take those words to heart with you. And I think now, being an adult and growing into myself, something that I would definitely tell my younger self is that don't believe in the statistics that they say is stacked against you, and always believe in yourself and your thoughts and your perspectives and do what they say you couldn't do, because I feel like I've done that. You know, I was told, you know, I'll never go to college. You know, I would never be successful in. A lot of those statements are shaped in the perception of the person saying them, and a lot of the time, the person that is saying them is experiencing that in their own fear, and they're projecting their fears onto you. So I think just being persistent and moving forward and just staying true to yourself is the one thing that I would have told myself that no one else told me when I was still in my childhood, that is.

[13:05] ASHA JOHN: I totally agree. I definitely think a lot of it does come from other people's perception of you and themselves and their own fears. So I completely agree with you on that one.

[13:19] TIARA EVANS: Thanks. Thanks. Okay, so for my next question for you, Asha, is, did you have a period in your life when you didn't feel like yourself, and how did you come back from that?

[13:38] ASHA JOHN: Okay, this time in my life that I'm actually experiencing right now. So I can answer the first half of the question, but the second half of the question, I'm still, like, going through it, so it's going to be a little difficult. Um, a point in my life, I didn't feel like myself. So I would say that's now. This is the very first time in my career, since I finished college back in 2016, that I wasn't working full time in my career. And it's been really difficult on me. It sounds silly because, like, oh, if you know you're not working full time, that's totally fine, that's normal. It happens. But for me, being the person that I am thinking about, like, my responsibilities, thinking about, oh, I have to do this. And adding all of those pressures on myself has stressed myself out to rewind. The reason all of this is kind of happening about August, I would say July, August 2020. I started feeling a lot of pain in my arms, in my shoulders, in my hands, and everyone's just like, oh, you're probably just writing too much. Probably just need to relax, probably to do this. And it just progressively got much, much worse to a point where, you know, by September, I couldn't even pick up a water bottle. It was so bad. I was in so much pain. And during that time, it was Covid. Along with so many others, I was another person who was unfortunate enough to lose their job. So imagine now you lost your job in Covid, and now you can't work because your body's killing you, and, like, you can't even, you know, you can't really go to the doctor. Cause now you lost your job, and now you don't even have insurance. So it's kind of just a problem that it was just so difficult for me to kind of get out of. And when I finally was able to, thankfully, get health insurance, I was able to see the doctor. And doctor's like, no, you're fine. You don't have any problems with your arms, and you're too young for these problems. And it turns out all the problem was in my neck. So I went through so many tests, I had so many scans, neurologists, orthopedic doctors, you name it, under the sun. I've seen the doctor to try to figure out what's wrong with me. And what made it kind of worse, ironically enough, was the fact that every doctor kind of told me, oh, you know, you just have, like, a little inflammation that's normal. Just take some aspirin, like an autol or something. You're too young for these problems. And for me to still, on the ongoing basis, feel like every single day, I'm in, like, excruciating pain that, and then I can't work. And I'm the main provider of my household because it's just me and my boyfriend. So it's kind of like to be the main provider, to not really be able to provide, to wake up every day and be, like, in excruciating pain. And it just takes a. Such a. Such a big toll on your mental health. It was the worst I've ever felt. Like, on top of being physically hurting, mentally hurting, I think, also does contribute to a lot of your physical pain. So it kind of, like, manifests and your body attacks itself when you're, you know, when you're like, depressed or sad or miserable. So it kind of made that, like, even worse. So now, although it's almost a year later, I'm still not completely healed from, like, the neck inflammation and everything. So I'm still battling that kind of, like, journey in my life to kind of, like, get back to the person that I was. But overall, it's been so much better because I do things physically, like, go to the gym all the time and completely change my diet to make sure a lot of the things that I'm putting in my body are healthy and good for me and, you know, fight inflammation in my body. But that's still, like, an ongoing process. And there's days, of course, that are way, way worse than others. But overall, between the physical things that I'm doing to try to better myself, better my health, I'm also doing that, trying to get my mental back in order. So it's like, not trying to tell myself that things are going to be okay to, like, convince myself, but more so taking the proper steps. Like, I'm currently seeing a heart coach, which is, in a way, it's like a hard coach, life coach, therapist all in one. So I'm currently doing that now, and my hard coach has been absolutely amazing and helping me with my mental journey to then just be able to wake up every day and not and just kind of, like, live in gratitude rather than think about all the things that's wrong with me. So that's been, like, ridiculously helpful. So I've been living. Of course, there's days that are harder than others, but definitely just being able to wake up every day and just, like, not beat myself up for what I'm going through, because you go through things for a reason. So I'm still making it to the other side, but right now, I'm still in the process of it and growing every day, so, yeah.

[19:36] TIARA EVANS: Yeah. I mean, I can definitely attest to that. I think when we are tested in these ways where we feel like, how could this happen to me? Like, I have, like, the world on my back, like, how am I gonna get through this? You kind of see, like, the light at the end of the tunnel to say, well, look at all the pros that came from this happening to you. Right?

[19:59] ASHA JOHN: Yeah.

[19:59] TIARA EVANS: Look at how far you pushed yourself. Look how much you invested in yourself in this moment. Right? So it really shows your dedication and self love to you.

[20:11] ASHA JOHN: It's true. That's. That's a very important, those are important words that self love, because it was just, it's literally a process of me, like, learning to love myself all over again.

[20:26] TIARA EVANS: Yeah. Yeah. That's deep.

[20:28] ASHA JOHN: Yeah. So, Tiara, I'm going to ask you, when growing up and becoming, what was the most difficult part of yourself to say goodbye to?

[20:42] TIARA EVANS: I think there's a lot of things, like when you're getting into your adulthood and you're growing up, like, you have to let go of. I'm gonna. I think for this one, I'm gonna say the most difficult part of myself that I had to say goodbye to was my depression. And the reason why I'm choosing to select that out of all the possible things I could have said goodbye to is because depression runs deep. Like, it runs truly, truly deep, to the point where you're in such a dark space, you become so numb. And I've seen this happen to my friends. I've seen this happen to my family. And it's just. It's really hard to see someone go through that, especially when it gets to a point where you're questioning if you're. You're meant to be in this life, if you're meant to do certain things in this life, what your calling is, you really start to question everything. And even though I was so young, going through a depressive state, and, you know, then you have the perspectives of doctors to say, oh, you're not really depressed because you don't have a, b, and c symptoms, or you don't think this and this and that, or you don't do this. And it's like, if you see how difficult it is for me to get out of bed every day or to take a shower or to put. Brush my teeth and do my hair, whatever, then you. It's no way you could possibly think this, right?

[22:14] ASHA JOHN: Yeah.

[22:15] TIARA EVANS: And I think it's so it's the one thing that's underestimated and overlooked in terms of, oh, they'll just be okay, or, I don't need to check on them. They're doing just fine. They're always smiling. Right. It's always the perception on the outside. So I think, for me, I came to the point where I'm like, nobody's coming, tiara. Like, nobody is going to pull you out of this. You have to pull yourself out of this. And for some people, you even get to the point where it's like, I don't want help. I don't want anyone to help me. I don't want to stop feeling like this, because at this point, I don't feel anything. So I really had to sit there and have a conversation with myself as young as I was to say, we got to get up, girl. We got to get the ball rolling. We have to do this. Let's move forward. Let's figure it out. But no one's coming for you. And even though I had to say goodbye to that part of myself, which is a good thing, it really helped me to figure out my independence as an adult to realize that, yes, it's okay to rely on certain people, you know, but at the end of the day, you have to make sure that you are good. You have to check in with yourself. So that's the thing that I would choose. That was the most difficult to say goodbye to.

[23:36] ASHA JOHN: Yes, I completely agree with that. And, you know, looking back, I'm so, so surprised to actually hear that you went through that. So that's difficult for me to hear. As your friend right now, I feel bad, you know, so. Wow. But I'm very proud of you, and a lot of things that you said, which is just relying on you, but also the fact that you were strong enough to get through that. So I'm really proud of you.

[24:12] TIARA EVANS: Thank you, Asha. Guys had about.

[24:20] ASHA JOHN: You're about halfway through, just so you know. Sure.

[24:23] TIARA EVANS: Great. Thanks, Asha. I completely lost my place. Is it your go? Is it my go?

[24:32] ASHA JOHN: It's your turn to ask me.

[24:35] TIARA EVANS: Okay. Yeah. That one was a tough one. Yes. Okay. What is the one thing you've been told all your life that you believe is completely false?

[24:50] ASHA JOHN: I would say the one thing that I've learned is there's actually two things I'm gonna go over. The one that's a little more light hearted, I guess, that adults know how to adult. You know, when you're. When you're younger and people are just like, you know, you have to listen to the adults. Like, you look to adults as, you know, the safe haven, and if something is wrong and if something's happening, you would literally try to find an adult if you're a child. Right. And right now, being an adult and looking at other adults and looking at, I guess, each other and our peers and things like that, it's kind of like, wow, adults do not have their shit together at all. I'm not saying, like, they don't know what to do if, in case there was, like, a fire as opposed to child. But I feel like that is a common misconception about adulthood, that everyone knows what they're doing, everyone has figured life out, and I feel like that has also led to a lot of depression in people that are our age. I read a study that people that are in their twenties are actually the most depressed and stressed out. That's the most stressed out age group. And it's because you're now transist, transitioning from being a child, teenager, whatever into now being an adult. And you just assume because of life pressures that everyone told you, like, you're an adult, you should be working, you should be in your career, you should have relationships figured out, you should have everything kind of like figured out or kind of have a general sense of what your next steps are in life. And I feel like that is kind of completely false. Whether it may be true for one person may not be true for the other. So I kind of wish they would kind of put less pressure on kids because now they grew, they grow up into their, they're in their twenties and things like that, and they're just like, man, I'm instant thought I'm fucking up. You know, excuse my language, but that's the instant thought of a lot of people. It's just you're in your twenties and everyone's just like, damn, I really need to get up and move, you know, do what I have to do. And you feel like you're constantly falling short and this could happen in somebody's twenties, somebody's thirties, somebody's forties. You know, you wake up and it's just like, holy crap, I'm 40. What did I do with my life? What am I going to leave behind? What did I accomplish? So I just feel like people need to be comfortable with the time that it takes you to learn. You figure out who you are and just tell people that, you know, you may not get it together right away. Just because you hit 21 or 18 does not mean you have it together. So I just wish as like younger people would just kind of tell people that, that take the time to figure who you are out. So, yes, that is definitely a common misconception I've always had that people always told us as growing in my life, growing up, and now as an adult, I'm like, wow, okay, so we're all kind of like in this figuring things out boat. So that's definitely something that I've learned. Something that else that I learned that was completely false, that I grew up learning, which was that men have to be masculine. And I think that's kind of been a lot of the downfalls in our own society because men feel like they can't express it themselves and it actually leads to more suicide rates in men, depression in men, and the fact that they feel like they have to be this archaic man that's supposed to be the provider and supposed to do this and supposed to do that. And then when they fail themselves, it's not necessarily themselves failing themselves. It's more so the perception that society has put on them to be this certain person. So I definitely learned that. I'm grateful to learn that, especially through my boyfriend and what he's going through, that men don't necessarily have to be masculine. And one of the things that define like masculinity is like, being strong and not, you know, sharing your feelings. And that can be one of the people's biggest downfall. Because if you have your walls up, you know, how can you ever, how can anyone know or come in, you know? So, yeah.

[29:46] TIARA EVANS: Yeah, that's, that's to the core that that is definitely true. I can definitely relate when I say, like, the picture was painted for us in terms in our generation, I mean, at least to say, you go to college, you do this, this is going to happen for you. You do that, you're going to be successful in your twenties and thirties. And I'm like, I'm 27 and I have no idea what I'm doing, who I am, who I should be, or, you know, so it's such a huge misconception and, you know, even like, in actuality, right, where they say, okay, go to college, get your degree, you'll automatically get a job, that was not the case for us. Yes, that was not true in any capacity. Like, don't forget we had to be married, right?

[30:35] ASHA JOHN: We're supposed to be married, 2.5 kids and the dog by now at 27, this is what we're supposed to have.

[30:47] TIARA EVANS: Yeah, so, I mean, yeah, like, let's be real here. Like, let's talk about the reality of it all, but, yeah, I totally get it.

[30:56] ASHA JOHN: My question to you is, what is, this might hit, this might hit home, but what is the biggest mistake you have ever made in your life?

[31:08] TIARA EVANS: This one is actually not that hard for me because I don't believe that my biggest mistakes are in my actions specifically. I think they're in my beliefs that then inform my actions, if that makes sense for me. I think the biggest mistake I ever made in my life was not being selfish enough. And I think people have the idea, like, oh, it's so bad to be selfish. Like, why are you being selfish? That's so not. Okay. That's not the nice thing to do. Like, you're not a kind person. You're a terrible person for being selfish, but hear me out, right? So in being selfish, in a way, it's putting yourself first. It's doing what's best for you, and it's not putting yourself on the back burner for everyone else and everything they have going on to make you available for them and make yourself unavailable to you. So with that, I've learned that, yes, I want to be kind. I am genuinely a kind person, and I would love to help you and do all of these things for you to make you a better person. But at the end of the day, I'm neglecting myself. I'm neglecting my dreams, I'm neglecting my self care, my mental health, my spiritual journey. So I think a lot of the times, you know, it's okay to be selfish. It is perfectly okay to be selfish. And I think that's the message that has to come across sometimes, right? Because I think when we talk about being selfish, we always put it with a negative connotation, and it's just like, you're doing so much bad in this world, and it's like, well, what about me? You know what I mean? So, for me, that's my biggest mistake, not being selfish enough and not putting myself first in situations where I should have, which then put me in a terrible situation or two that I had to really dig myself out of. And, you know, I didn't have that same amount of support that I was giving out.

[33:16] ASHA JOHN: I completely. I completely agree. I am here for the selfishness. I completely agree with you on that part. And that's kind of like a tough lesson that needs to be learned. It's not even just, like, selfishness. It's just self love. At times, you just choose you, and that's the most important thing. That's definitely the most important thing, yeah.

[33:41] TIARA EVANS: Okay, asha, for you, what are your twenties like compared to what you heard they would be?

[33:50] ASHA JOHN: So in your twenties, there's a lot of things that are similar and a few things that are difficult, that are different and difficult. I would say in my twenties, what I thought my twenties would be like would be, I would be in college and partying. And I'm thinking, and I realized, like, wait a second. After college is over, you're only like, usually, this is not the case with everyone, but you're usually, like, 21, 22 by this time. So I'm thinking a lot of my twenties was gonna be in college and partying. And then I quickly realized, wait a second, you're kind of, like, pretty much done with that by the time you're 22. Not the partying part, but I thought I would be out more, having fun, you know, late nights, early days, juggling internships, just kind of just like, doing way more and having way less responsibility. So I kind of thought that would kind of be like what my twenties would be like. Different boyfriends, relationships. Okay. Girl broke up with this, this guy. Bring over the ice cream and the liquor. We need to figure this out. And just, I kind of thought that was, like, one side of my twenties, in the early twenties, and then the other half of my twenties would be okay. I don't know. I have no idea how people expect for you to go from, like, a partying person who doesn't know what to do with themselves to, like, literally, like, flip a switch when you go into your late twenties and then all of a sudden have kids and a career. So I have no idea how people do it or expect people to do it, but that's kind of like what I was told my twenties were gonna be like, next 1 second, you don't know what you're doing, next second, you have your life together. So that's what I was told my twenties were going to be like. And my actual, my actual twenties, it's actually way more responsibility than I thought it would be. I felt like as soon as I finished college, I was 21 going on 22. I immediately moved out. I now had to be responsible not only for me, but my boyfriend as well. So we're kind of, like, trying to figure out life together. So it was just a lot of, it was just a lot of, like, more responsibility than I thought. I still got to go out. I still got to, you know, really enjoy myself and party and travel. But, you know, people think that people in their twenties have so much energy, and I'm 27 and I'm tired. I am very, very tired. So I don't think that it's going to get any better from here. I just feel like in my twenties, there was just way more responsibility and way, way, way more pressure and stress than I expected. So. Yes.

[37:05] TIARA EVANS: Okay.

[37:06] ASHA JOHN: So, Tiara, I'm going to ask you this one question here. How has your perspective and mindset on peace on your peace shifted now being in your late twenties.

[37:24] TIARA EVANS: Just protecting it. Just protecting your peace, I think that's such a major key in life. And as you grow up, you learn it's more and more, and I think your patience just, it just the dynamic of your patience just shifts. It's like, is this worth my energy? Is this actually worth me giving my energy to and it's just saying, I think that's more so in our generation of, I'm going to match your energy. And I have to question myself and then say, like, am I really going to match this person's energy? Like, they're angry, they're upset, they're miserable, and I'm like, why would I stoop down to match your energy instead of matching my own energy? Right. And that's like keeping yourself to a certain level. Right? And, you know, for some people, that may be, like, keeping your grace and keeping your composure, and for some people, that's just like, I'm cutting you off. Like, you're out of my life. I'm not engaging in this activity. This is not worth my time. You like, I value myself, and I know my own worth enough to know you don't deserve my energy. So with all of that, I think for me personally, I connect my peace to energies, and I'm just like, if you're not good for that, I'm not engaging in this. I'm not going to even respond. I'm just not. So protecting my peace is the ultimate shift in terms of, like, how I would define that now, being in my late twenties.

[38:59] ASHA JOHN: I completely agree. There's just a lot of people that, unfortunately, you kind of have to let go of because of that.

[39:08] TIARA EVANS: Yeah. So my question for you, Asha, is what's the one thing you hope to never forget?

[39:19] ASHA JOHN: Well, to kind of similarly touch base in what you said, for me, something that I will never forget is to choose myself, is sometimes you have to be a little selfish, and that's kind of like a hard lesson to learn, but being a little bit more selfish, and I've learned to do that in my life. Just when I have to juggle a million and one things, and now I have to think about somebody else, you know? So I have learned to protect my peace. I've learned to just choose me more often and say no. So that's one thing that I hope to never forget in my life.

[40:05] TIARA EVANS: Yeah, thanks.

[40:13] ASHA JOHN: Okay, guys, one thing that I forgot to mention is that we're just going to hold at the end here and get some silence, and I'll let you know when I turn the recording off. Okay, hold for about 10 seconds.