Ahmed Flex Omar and Khalil Ayed

00:02 Hello, my name is Ahmed Flex Omar. I am 38 years old today's date is

00:12 June 10th, and we're in Chicago. I'm in Chicago, Illinois, and I'm here with my friend and colleague.

00:24 Hello, my name is Khalil. I had 25 years old. And today is June the dance 2020 and I'm in Clifton, New Jersey. I'm here with my friend and colleague likes armor.

00:46 I'll thank you so much for joining us today. Where does your story began we can start with? Where were you born?

00:56 I was bored and actually in the capital and Tunisia, which is in Los Africa, but I didn't live there. So I I always say I was born and raised in pantalon in the middle of Stillness, which is the fourth Islamic capital in the world. I had the chance to go out there and look there for for at least 21 years old until I'm 21 years old and then they move to the United States Islamic. Can you explain a little bit what you meant by that part? Sure. So the first Islamic capital in North Africa is my city which game to North Africa and he started his mission to you know, share and educate.

01:56 Old are about Islam. So he started from my city and he built his first military bases in and you start like from there a build a huge moths called the mosque of aqua. And yeah, it's actually actually came after I guess bug. Medina Saudi Arabia and early childhood memories. Would it be in later one?

02:37 Guess my childhood memories. Yeah, I actually looked into the middle of the city.

02:55 Our our house was actually the first house wasn't the middle middle of the city. So it's like 15 minutes away from the mosque 15 minutes away from the souk, which is the market 15 minutes away from another actually mosque in this most was the actually did the guy who made it was the friend of the Prophet Muhammad. That's how what the what the history says. So I grew up in a very conservative family. We really believe in manicures and and we really make sure that are the kids I mean and I'm one of them should go to the mosque and learn how to recite Quran.

03:50 That's the first step that you should do and then you should respect the elders. You should learn how to live in your neighborhood help everyone visit everyone weekly or sometimes daily. You have to celebrate now all the holidays with your family. And also you have to knock doors door-to-door, you know, if neighborhood of neighbors and you know that it's or happy holidays. You have to check in on them like every time I'm so I grew up in another very like friendly and I guess then that the neighborhood was like a family for us. So yeah.

04:43 Oh, that's great, sir for the person that's not familiar with Tunisia. That's listening right now. How would you describe you know Tunisia because it's a very unique place. It's in North Africa. So I tell us a little bit about your personal irritation to your identity and you know, and also, you know what makes you know, where you come from truly unique. Absolutely.

05:12 So this is a like a funny a funny or or tricky question for me because when I came to the US I figured like that are you don't have a like a specific identity and they need to find what so I called myself Tunisian because

05:33 Back home. We're just Univision. We're not there. I guess when I go to the air Community, I'm not just Arab. I'm North African and I'm African. And also I'm mixed with a French culture because of the colonization. So I'm always like how I see it is aware mix where a mix of different cultures of languages. They have the native Native people like a pair of Africa Shazam Aziz, they have their own culture in an in and language and we definitely, you know still have those

06:15 Historical events or even like you know that the culture itself and when the French people came when they they kept a lot of culture there we do have even people from Angelo's in staying when they came to North Africa and they start building mosques and they grabbed a lot of culture with the church people where they came from Turkish. And before all of that we do have cartridge which is you know, and end the end the end the war that happened in Tunis between the cartridge in the and the Roman and and and all that, you know Heritage and culture made, you know a special I guess with

07:02 Because in our language we use different languages like in in one language. We have Spanish language Arabic French sometimes English. So it's it's a mosaic.

07:18 Yeah, it definitely sounds like what they call, you know, the dish jambalaya, you know, so you got a lot going in there, but it's interesting you touch the phone in a cart at Carthage, you know, and for people that are not familiar, you know, what the cards. Can you tell us just a little bit about that.

07:40 I guess what I said, what I will say is it's a huge Empire that was built in an in soon as I'm back in the days by female Lisa and she came in. I guess she's XR Finnick definition. Thank you. So, yeah, and she she was like, you know how she build Empire and there is a story of her starting turn fire into an us and she actually got a cow leather. I like that.

08:30 And then she carved into small till I like long pieces and she traced like a huge circle and she said I will get this for free, you know, like so they they told her whatever you got from that Circle yet that you cannot Trace with a cow other or mother is going to be yours. So she got it in the long short long small pieces and and she started her on fire from that be self yard or absolutely. You know the history of you know aspect as it relates to your childhood specifically do you have are there remnants, you know of that culture and Heritage where you were born. Are you able to see that?

09:31 Yes, because the first things that we learn in school history and the impact that those stories only Captain me huge huge and I guess my my today was built by those stories in fight it by that history and then when I travel in Tunisia and you mean a lot of places and you find a lot of places with with those Memorial now areas where you have like the Roman and Carthage building old buildings over old a castles or it's really impressive that means I'm in a huge impact on me by by those stories that we are in school.

10:37 Flex can you ask you talked about coming to the US without a specific identity and I wonder if he what would he ended up?

10:46 Creating or thinking of himself with an identity as if you were not going to get to that. It's just something that came to my mind.

10:54 I'll have to exit apps that only you can answer that when you came to the United States Anthony, you know, I mean to me it's complex, but for you it's natural because it's set up like, you know Fabric and I would like it's into woven, you know into you, you know it since part of your DNA right and then you come to the United States and your look looking in at how things operate up here and you're supposed to check a box.

11:41 So what what box do you check? And also where where did you see yourself when you first landed and where do you see yourself now, you know in terms of you know your identity.

11:54 As I said when I came here, I identify myself with into African people or they are people or I'm not definitely not your opinion. So even like when it when I try to check those boxes, this was funny cuz I asked the clerk there. I was like, what should I do here? And he was like boot other and with white I was like, I'm not white but I was like, I don't have any other choices for you or options, but when I came here, I guess I figured that I don't really need the specific identity. I'm human and that's what what kept me going. I guess that's how we describe like how I identify myself today cuz I'm a human.

12:48 Human with huge and mix your background and Heritage because when I think about the airport, they have the entire Middle East and when I think about the French part, you know, I could be in Europe. You know, I enjoy that culture the cuisine the food when I like when I'm in North Africa and then and I'm in the Africa, I feel comfortable because that's my my home. And so I guess today I'm more into like I'm a human without like any specific identity.

13:29 I don't want to like put a label for myself, I guess today, you know Spanish Heritage, you know the in one of you even mentioned she came from a present-day Lebanon, you know, so all these beautiful, you know cultures and this is a great Segway as you know, you're also an artist rate does any of that impact your work?

14:08 Absolutely. I mean since I started I guess what since I like I was like five or six years old. I started like painting in the right to the right and definitely the first things that I started was Coraline and Allah Muhammad those, you know, beautiful words that I was seeing and textures that I will see you in an hour mosques in our book of Quran or even when you open the history book and it when I was a kid that was seeing those pictures of Alyssa word.

14:47 Or even on your ball or like all those you know a historical note.

14:53 I guess characters and I was trying to do them like you portrayed and and and and I guess my what I'm doing today as a calligrapher or a graphic designer. It's because of those, you know, because of that Heritage and then using that as a source of inspiration, I guess.

15:15 So can you tell us a little bit about your style, you know, if all right, you know, every artist has a style. Can you tell us a little bit about you know you or your work specifically?

15:32 Sure, so I thought I wasn't choice.

15:38 When I start growing back home.

15:42 I actually got a lot of commands. It's not it's it's it's I guess forbidden to draw it's it's forbidden to draw the the portrait or faces because of the religion and it's really hard for me to continue drawing. Even when I say it is a lot of people start locking especially in my family. They're like now we encourage you but they're like some comments that really got the huge impact on me. So

16:17 I went to a cousin of mine and you start teaching me calligraphy how to write.

16:26 In a beautiful way so I can use that as a way to escaping or to escape those questions or those commands that I got when I start drawing so I I learn calligraphy and then after like, I guess, you know, I like an amount of time. I'm something new which is the graffiti and I tried to mix the calligraphy with a graffiti and start young put in my art out there on walls doors stable sell my style today, I guess is a calligraphy calligraphy as a calligraphy. The artist is a modern art with a very complex it our a complex or

17:17 Mixed Heritage, I guess or Islamic Heritage. Let me put it that way.

17:22 That's very interesting because just like how you have a fluid identity, you know, you can see the fluidity in your are and you're expressing after that. You're me and there is you know, when we think about graffiti we think about street art.

17:45 You know, so how has the street are you no influence your work.

17:55 Freedom that's the word. That's the word. I guess that sweetheart gave to me he gave me freedom and he gave me the right two broke doors classic and traditional rules on the art that I was to it.

18:15 So when I met the graffiti word, I got amazed. I mean I was like I can do this and that with any color that I want on any things that I won't like walls or doors are tables doesn't matter when matter is you putting out your art out there. So I guess Freedom. That's that's the thing that graffiti gave to me.

18:42 Why specifically that word? Why did that word come to your cuz he didn't hesitate. That's the first word that came to mind.

18:53 Yes.

18:57 It's it's related to a lot of other topics religion taboos community and I guess gated communities. They were very hard on me. I guess or I didn't really understand those classic rules that they wear their.

19:27 So in those different perspective, I found out please. Thing which is not specific like a graffiti but art itself as a way to escape all of that.

19:41 And it helps me really even thinking about those other topics or taboos in an artistic way, so

19:52 Yeah, that's I guess the answer.

19:57 No access to a Lily that's awesome the clarification when you said it's forbidden to draw the portrait or faces with that portrait or faces of any person or the historical religious characters you originally drawn to

20:15 No, I need any faces because you can yeah, I guess any faces.

20:24 In this religion, we're not allowed to draw faces.

20:30 So now Kaleo

20:34 Tell us a little bit about you know, your journey to America, like what was the reason, you know, every immigrant has a different story. But what's your story like why and why America white East Coast in a little bit about that?

20:54 So

20:56 2011 Revolution happened in Indonesia

21:03 And all those old habits and rules and laws and

21:10 Oven pulled out of 23 years of

21:17 Dictador dictatorship, I guess that's so.

21:23 It's just me dress like noise that I'm hearing.

21:27 Amy we can hear a bunch of noise put in the message that we could hear the paper to

21:38 I'm not allowed to mute my mic if they put it on three separate channels.

21:43 I know you're hearing is the paper when I when I'm writing.

21:56 If I hear my cats, too, I'm not hearing anything on your microphones. So hopefully your sound is clean. I will stop them from

22:08 Miller and no worries. I'll continue when the revolution happened in 2011 with the end of 2010 all those, you know, I said the rules and laws old fall down and they eat people started to build their own country how they train the other like the new Tunisia and by that time

22:45 I was like one of those young people on the streets now with the spray color spray and you know, if you don't put on some message out there and and from there I learned all those skills and and

23:04 So when that happened why I guess my personality and my Arts became stronger. And in the meantime, I got involved in a lot of organize organizations and nonprofits for human rights or even four letters for leadership. I know project management and all that stuff that came after the revolution to kind of learn and in the meantime share with the New York people do on how to deal with the new Tunisia and

23:45 When that started after the first election, there are like

23:52 There's like an Islamic part got time to Rolling in Indonesia. And it looks like my home or my house or look like my family like in. Entire country. If you know what I mean is like starts to pick it became like harder to live there because you can express your art again. And again without having that command of the more forbidden or is not allowed or instead of doing that to go to pray or learn more Quran or how do you store and a lot of young people you don't love that and I I didn't to be honest. I I was hoping more into like a democratic liberal.

24:52 Country more than

24:56 Conservative country or not the slamic but conservative country and then and then

25:09 My my city itself became the I guess the leader of all these movements and and

25:24 The Story begins there are when when the first meeting of and sociology there are the there like a professor or the supporters of sharia. That's how they call themselves beginning and like came to my city and they did their first meeting and they're like hundreds of thousands of people over there willing to kill anyone.

25:56 That is not following them and I guess they're the idea of Isis and and all that all those issues that happening now is they started from there? Because a lot of leaders from there. It's and a lot of young people to travel to Syria or to Libby hour and by that time I met my wife and we started a club on our in our city jakeeno's got those young people to learn Arts Theater and enter a project called psychodrama, which is basically a therapy through ART and

26:47 We became Kanis.

26:50 And now I'm at versuri. All right, I think is Target and it's it's it's more into competition is like we can beat with those people who's going to get more young people. They sign either to teach him how to live or teach you how to die. So and spring is what you're referring to in and it started in to meet you and then dictate a relaxed and in the vacuum of trying to figure out what the new Tunisia is.

27:31 CERN groups filled at vacuum and in started in a pushing force Sharia law in a darkened rating, you know young, you know people to be more, you know conservative and what you said was it's was basically the birth of you know, Isis in a sense because a lot of people did not know where it all originated from and so that that's that's very that's that's that's very interesting and you said that you met your wife. What year was that? First of all?

28:07 So I was confused in this moment from 2011 to 2014 iMac my my life.

28:16 Okay, so you met your wife you started the theater in a gives the youth an outlet and also, you know keep them away from extremism. Yes to that. Correct? Yes. So my my wife she was already teaching there in the in the in a college there and she started like she just started the project and I got involved in it because the game like a couple and and yeah, so that vacuum that you were talking about like was filled by those people that they were pushing for Cheryl oia odds. That's the best I guess the word but in the meantime, it was felt to buy these

29:06 Strong young people that they're pushing for human rights and that's the like that's where the the fight begin I guess or began. I guess, you know, it's more into like mental fight Than Physical one. It was like I was going to do more project was going to recruit more used to and I as I said that or is this like either teaching about to live or how how to die. So yeah, when we we were doing that project we got hundreds of kids in we were even

29:46 Play in those theater plays all over the country.

29:56 That's right. That's right. It's very inspiring, you know, so there's a lot of emotion, you know involved if you need to take time to get a breather, you know, please please do so. What was the moment that you decided in a enough is enough and I'm want to come to the United States. Would you remember that particular moment? I didn't actually

30:33 My wife

30:37 She was like let's it's it's it's not safer here. I mean, it's not safe anymore. I'm dying. I got to actually bitten and a bunch of times with a even attacked our house. We're living together.

30:54 It was really hard to live there. But in the meantime, I didn't want it to leave the country and also.

31:03 My wife she was like let's let's find a place that's find another place and it was like, okay, let's let's just see that the map and they remember even opening that the ward map the words map and see which country we can go to without a boat stralia, but we don't have an embassy in Tunis. So we have to go to my Roku is full of process. We thought about Europe but you need a lot of money in insurance is to go to Europe is not easy. So we said let's try America and by that time my wife's sister.

31:40 Lives here

31:42 In York, so

31:46 I was like, no, I'm not calling. I mean, I know I mean all what I know in English is Hi. How are you? Or thank you. That's it. How how am I going to live there longer that you are? Well, I know it's New York having but it's New York. I mean it's not it's not fair. I could like me came in for a coming from a small City to deliver that it's going to be hard but

32:15 She actually pushed me to at least get the visa and then think about it.

32:23 So we got the Visa and the day that I got the passport with those Visa. I finished all the preparation in one week.

32:34 And I got the ticket everything and weekend to New York. I wasn't a choice actually wasn't like plant. It's and it looks like we're Aunt you know.

32:47 What was your first memory Landing in August in New York? Yeah. I came to JFK JFK. I went to the coffee shop on on the on the airport to get coffee and I asked her for a coffee.

33:10 And she gave me a straight black coffee, but I burned my mouth with it. So I couldn't taste anything for the rest of like 3 days I guess but when I went outside to smoke a cigarette with my wife I start crying because I didn't believe it. I mean

33:31 I know that I'm not going back soon.

33:35 But I still have to find a way how to live in New York.

33:43 And I fall in love the moment that I put my likes. You don't like I just loved it.

33:52 Even the first time I'm going to the house that I don't know.

33:58 I love the Delights the buildings all that stuff. So yeah, that's that's the first memory other one thing. I'll tell you just keep your hand away from your mouth left your community. You left your home and now you're in New York. You're in the Big Apple. Did you find a new community?

34:30 Yeah, I I guess.

34:36 New York is my community and that's I guess the good things that I did when I came here I didn't I didn't choose like a specific Community to live with him.

34:48 I meant friends from all over the world and the house and the way how it called New York now is the resume of the entire world. That's it's actually I mean, I meant a lot of people from different cultures different Heritage different languages religions. So I guess today when I look to my friend list all the list of friends, that's just a mosaic. I don't have a specific Community, but that's my community today. It's

35:20 I guess my my community today.

35:25 Is the diversity, you know, you can connect with different identities, you know, basically your new family has that changed you as an artist at all or it just, you know, reinforced and revalidated. You know what you felt from the beginning.

35:58 Yes, and it's it's changing the way how I do art every day because every day I'm learning a new culture and your language new words history to the History Channel American history. I'm looking into the Venezuelan history of my friends like it's it's in Richmond. Why aren't everything is changing my heart everyday?

36:29 Absolutely, that's incredible now.

36:35 Gary rasskazy, you're only a family here is your wife, right? And your wife's sister? Yes. How big is the Tunisian community in New York? I guess the Asian diaspora.

36:53 How about

36:56 What I know is I I so about like 500 people.

37:00 How about it? I believe there more but Tunisian people are more into just business and knowing you people.

37:11 So we don't we don't stick together. What do you mean by that? I mean, I don't need to be with Tunisian to feel comfortable. I need to find new people because I'm not into need you anymore need to find a new friends new people and in the meantime, you know business or doing what I need to do to work.

37:35 Apps apps apps absolutely. And with that being said and said of living in the giant Metropolis, you know in the New York that you're connecting with people from all over the world different cultures. What message do you have? You know young people right now because of everything that's happening right? We're right now in 20/20 Miller pandemic, you know kids graduating today, you know, I worried about you know their future. I think it's really important for them to hear from someone like you in even though you're 25 years of age. You've seen, you know more than most

38:28 So with that being said, what would be your message for young people when you when you when you are in your own home or country? You're you're the angle how you see your things in the 40 degrees or 45 degrees. But when you travel and meet new people that angle became like, you know, I was going to become bigger. So basically travel learn new things and try everything.

39:08 And be safe.

39:11 Tai Sao travel meet new people from different cultures from cultures from different cultures be open open-minded the last thing I want to quickly ask you if you can answer in 30 seconds. Why is Art important?

39:34 That's that's the fuel. I guess that's my fuel. That's why I kept kicking me going and waking up everyday because I believe one day I will be doing that as a full-time job, I guess.

39:49 That's so far is your oxygen as well? And I really appreciate your sharing your story with us today, and I know it wasn't easy because you had to relive certain moments, you know, that traumatic, you know, but know that someone listening to your stories going to be, you know inspired and you're going to impact someone's life and you already doing it. So just being who you are and also through, you know, your your heart and just continue being who you are and thank you for joining us today. Thank you for loving me. Thank you.

40:37 I just wondering what year did you come to the United States? And was it difficult to get the paperwork?

40:45 What year what year did you come over to the United States? And was it difficult to get the paperwork which is the election night, by the way, and I guess it wasn't easy to get the paper. But I guess it was easy to find the right people to help you get the paper.

41:11 Don't forget later.

41:15 What do you think would have happened? Do you have friends who tried after that for me? Yeah.

41:23 I'm back home. I I know a lot of people that they traveled already but a lot of people wants to travel now and they they couldn't they just going to

41:35 The following Flex the timing of this is to set it up. I meant will do a second cuz I was very fascinating and I don't think he sees, you know the full version of right now and so we definitely want to bring him, you know back and I think it would be all so, you know interesting, you know for him to interview his wife.

42:12 I agree. I have a 2-hour interview of my wife.