Bill Van Parys and R Bromley

00:01 My name is Scott Bromley.

00:04 I'm

00:06 On my 83rd trip around the Sun.

00:11 Today's date is September.

00:15 20.

00:18 We are in beautiful, Fire Island Pines.

00:23 My interviewer is my good pal.

00:31 And my name is Bill van parys and I'm 61. And today's date is Saturday, September 18th.

00:43 Fire Island Pines and I'm interviewing Scott Bromley and he is my partner in crime.

00:57 Alright. Hi Scott. Hi Bill. Nice to see you today. Always.

01:04 I'm nervous. I'm a little nervous to I had a little frightful evening. I'm just thinking about all this stuff. The memories are devastating. So let's just start. Okay. Well, let's let's open it up and I'd love to get your your picture of Fire Island. The first time you came here. Well, the first time I came here was 1964, but I really came to the Grove. I came with an old boyfriend from New York after Montreal, and we were staying at Larry Stouffer's apartment or house, which I think was the that he was part of the the frozen food. Yes family. Right. And it was on the bay and it was a beautiful house. And but the first thing I noticed was the beauty, you know, I'm into pulchritude I thought

02:04 The place was incredible and we had dinner and then we went dancing dancing at the ice palace. And that was really interesting because we are all dancing in line and there seemed to be one girl in the middle of the line so that it was kind of legal today. It's with other men and the strangest part was coming home after dancing because they were men everywhere on the boardwalk and then it's just like touch you and feel you and your hair and everything. And I was this green kid from Canada, you know, I was very strange-looking. I was about twenty-eight years old and I had salt and pepper white hair and I was six foot three and, you know, Blazing Green Eyes and so I don't know why I guess I was a magnet, but I had no idea about that and

03:04 I was the only off-putting part of coming to Fire Island. The next time I came. I was a houseboy.

03:15 And I could cook a little bit and this older gentleman was a lawyer. He couldn't cook for shit. And so he said, would you come out? You can stay in the house. You don't have free all. Is you need to do is make breakfast, lunch and dinner.

03:33 And you're free anytime, right? So this was the first time I came to the Pines in 1968 and it was just as wonderful as every member did 1964 and the Sun, and the sand, and the ocean, and the trees and the architecture, you know, I was a baby architected. So I was like fascinated by all these homes done by Horace Gifford and it was a wonderful experience. I used to walk down to the, to the meat market and Pete was there and the original. Original paper. And so I was in there one day and and nobody else was in there. And I was looking at the cases, you know, I think it was the first time I went in there and I was looking at the cases and I kept

04:26 Walking back and forth in whatever and then pfund he said to me chicken I said, oh no, no, no, I weigh over 21. But anyway, so we got to be great Pals until the time that you know, he passed on. So my memories of the Pines are just delightful. It was after dinner that I do the dishes and walk down to the Sandpiper and we could dance and you know, and you went home about 1:00 and do not like you started to go like today, you go at 1 and come home at 7. So it went at was a wonderful time in this happened year year year year year after year and I fuck. Excuse me. I finally bought a house in 1980 with my business partner, Robin Jacobson, and

05:25 I was just thrilled to be here and then I thought I would have to give back. I bought a house here. I have to give back to the community. And so I joined the fire department. And and now I'm a life member. I think I've been there. I know 40 years. Well, congratulations. That's great. What what would you how would you describe the spirit of Fire Island? At that moment in time? It was very free. You know you would get on the ferry and all of a sudden your cares would just melt away and by the time you got off the ferry 20 minutes later and Fire Island, Pond, it was Heaven, you know, I'm still call this place heaven.

06:21 You know, when the new president Henry, Robin came into being being the president. He asked my darling, Tony and pavido. My married man, to make a make a film about the essence of the Pines and, and Tony did, and it was broadcast everybody. But I named it Heaven, because that's what it is to me. Beautiful. Beautiful. How did Fire Island exude, sex appeal, in those days? Would you say everything? Everything was sexy? I was liking it. As I said before, I meant to talk with you. I'm into Beauty. I'm into the beauty of the nature, the beauty of the boardwalk, the boardwalks, when you look at them. They are just magical, have a tilt, and go up and down and War.

07:17 And the architecture horse Gifford's, you know, he was my hero and it was beautiful. And the body's everybody, you know, something, you know, when you get into the sun, sometimes you just didn't want to take all your clothes off, you know, so the bodies and the, and the people, and everybody was so friendly, people would say hi passing on the boardwalk, you know, and people dressed, you know, incredibly strangely and beautifully. And, you know, you'd see people in caftans and flowing scarves. And then you'd see naked people. You know, it always beautiful to me.

07:59 Scott, you're famous for having done Studio 54, which was sexier Fire Island or Studio 54 Fire Island has to be everything. You know, when I'm being away on vacation like in Italy or France or England and I'm away for like 45 days. I keep thinking to myself and I'm crazy. Why are you at the beach?

08:26 And so, you know, you can't say anything bad about Fire Island to me that's great in terms of our culture.

08:35 End the 70s early 80s. Would you have considered Fire Island a cultural Mecca in terms of fashion architecture? Yes, as I said before, everything was beautiful everything, there was so much talent here. I mean there was a Calvin, Klein was here and then Chester Weinberg and many, many design.

09:06 Mega people were here, you know, and it was really, really, it was kind of like like Gertrude Stein in the thirties, you know, all of these wonderful people of all sorts of arts and crafts and, and artistic all sort of hanging out together.

09:26 Amazing. Amazing did life on Fire Island, seemed Limitless at that stage. Sure. Did you could do anything you wanted?

09:39 So do you remember where you were and what you were doing the first time you heard about AIDS? I don't remember that exact moment, but I believe it started to appear that.

09:56 People were getting sick. And then there was Larry Kramer at the at the dock, you know, blasting away. We've got some sort of plague here. We have to do something. You know, we have to write our Congressman, we have to go to the mayor. We have to do something because this is getting serious. So it's kind of just crept up on in in my life is away. But, you know, but it would got to be just devastating. You know, I, I had two boyfriends died in my arms. I have to imagine that's really traumatic.

10:40 And then my business partner and my office manager died within one year.

10:49 I can only say it have devastating, it was, but, you know, I'm a fighter. And I started joined every little group that you could join to tulip remote to education, about AIDS and and, and donate time and money to research and whatever. So, I was, you know, I've always been a kind of a Pollyanna guy, you know, I was always

11:20 Nothing could put me down so far that I couldn't get up and carry on.

11:27 WOW.

11:30 What?

11:32 You mentioned, you started joining organizations and the like and and you know in Fire Island and in New York in the gay community, it was the political activities that that kind of carried the day. Would you, would you have considered yourself political before braids or did that, you know, I think.

12:01 I was non-political before 8, but then I got onto the back way bandwagon. You know, I helped Paul popping with gmhc the boyfriend at the time was an act up and yeah, it was very involved. You know, people were falling left and right and I was determined, I would could do the best whatever I could to, to promote education and research and whatever. I even I was not getting sick and it was really playing on me a little bit, like why not me. And I actually went to donate my blood to several.

12:52 Hospitals. And they said,

12:55 Thank you for coming in. But we have

12:59 We don't need your blood. We have too many volunteers that are in the same boat as you which was very encouraging to me that you know that there was not everybody was going to get this.

13:18 Scott, you mentioned the painful memory of of lovers dying in your arms. What?

13:26 What year are we talkin about roughly? Okay. So ACP ACP name was ASA. Philip. Patrick. He was

13:39 As tall as I am, bigger that I am black and an ex-marine and an ex-cop and he died in my arms in 1985.

13:57 And then Mark cigarettes key long time.

14:02 Lover of mine and partner, he died in 95.

14:08 So there was 10 years of like tragic tragic, tragic, you know, and then my partner, who we were great Pals with a knife who I bought the house and Porgy walk with, he died in 86. And then the guy that I did Studio 54, rondout. He died in 83 That 80's were

14:32 Jamaal Charles, you seem to be going to a memorial service every fucking day, you know, it was just

14:45 Mind-boggling.

14:47 What?

14:50 If you could, how would you describe the the feeling of the Pines in favor from you? Mention 1983 was that when things really started to hit here or had it head out early 80s, I think about 1979, Nick Rock and started to become ill and, you know, they were calling it all sorts of things like cat scratch fever and grid. And, you know, the board AIDS. I don't remember when it came out, but I think it was in the 80s and I think it was President Reagan.

15:40 Who mention aids for the first time on April Fool's Day in the mid-80s unbelievable, but you know what? Got you a Christian do people left in droves. I mean people that would come and you know like Barbara Ross with her boat at the end the harbor, you know, she was this grand lady with huge wig and everything and she would wave at all the boys and and the girls and what whatever and she she just disappeared, you just disappeared and all of a sudden, you would realize George isn't here or Harry's not here.

16:27 But the one thing,

16:32 That I kept coming. I kept coming back. Here. I kept coming here because of really the beauty of the place and it was coming. I felt very calm here. I felt, I could do what I needed to do and I'm I just felt

16:51 Relaxed enough that I could carry on and fight.

16:57 Okay, when you mention people disappearing was it that you feared people maybe died. Was it that people just left and disassociated with themselves? I think both of those things, you know.

17:17 There was a party called the morning party which was kind of after the disco's finished in them in the 80s and I really

17:30 I really called it. Not the morning party morning. I called it the morning party mourning and I would go. I know that I think they've lasted up tonight 16 years, but I would go.

17:53 Every year.

17:58 To dance.

18:01 With the friends.

18:04 That I couldn't dance with again.

18:09 It was tough.

18:15 But you know what?

18:18 I remember I'm probably jumping ahead here. But I remembered that I knew the Pines had recovered completely. When Frank loberto.

18:32 And I had the idea that we should throw another party just for the community just for us kids. And of course it turned out to be the Clambake and it was 2015. So they've started and let's call it 1980. And 2015. We kindly find me.

18:57 Got it together and things were bright and cheery and you know, we even had France joli, Come and sing again and conductor. Dr. Ed said don't you know, she's passed said, she's not going to pull a crowd or whatever and I insisted that she come in, she Rock their socks off. You know, she she pulled it off and that party was a riot in my Tony and Nick and Richard and all the all the kind of artsy-fartsy people that were left all pitched in and Indiana was designed. So it looked like a clamshell at was like really started and it was just the ticket, you know, the last time we had done that with

19:57 Party that I designed called beach in 79. So there was a lot of time between that there was that is a very interesting and telling bookmark and I'm glad you brought up Beach because from what I've seen and read and heard beach scene to establish the template for a big outdoor, glorious, sexy fun party.

20:29 And earlier you mentioned the morning party and gmhc and how my understanding it started with friends at a house that moved to the beach and became a big run into became the Pines party. Yes, I do.

20:51 With that in mind. And I'm also you, you've mentioned the Pines residents who founded gmhc and the Pines residents who were instrumental in. Would you say that the Fire Island help to change the divorce of it? Certainly contributed I think.

21:16 Yes, because I remember that we went to, we went to the mayor's office and said you have to do something, you have to really do something here. And you know, we got laughed at, you know, it was it was debilitating. And yet we carried on and we finally one, you know, it wasn't until the to the to the drug cocktails that that there seemed to be a little light at the tunnel, you know, and people are still on Mad. Men are still living to this day. It was a little too late for my that Mark who died in my arms, but I was so happy that there was the little light at the tunnel.

22:04 Amen, Amen. To that my friend, but

22:09 Getting there from 1980, was it Relentless Relentless Relentless people were people were dropping like flies, you know, and all of a sudden, you know, of course the real estate people were going nuts because nobody was renting. Nobody wanted to be here and and everybody was afraid. Yes. We learned how to play safe and we had to

22:38 Had to, you know, kind of go by the rules. I was kind of blessed in a way because I was always, always seem to have a boyfriend and I always was a true kind of lover. I very seldom wandered and only in between boyfriend and I got my stuff in. But so I think that my sort of my personality and my general,

23:07 Look on life, really, help me, but I still believe that there was something in my makeup in my blood's that that I had that I was immune.

23:20 If you don't mind my asking, how has that been applied to other illnesses, you suffered, you've done experimental when we could, we don't have to go there. If I go ahead, do I mean, you survived and through a very, you know, you survived a Survivor. I'm a fighter. I had hepatitis hepatitis C right, which was the potentially deadly disease and I worked it out with my doctors that they were doing a regime where it was three times a week and then you were off of the weekend and then you didn't want to take this inject yourself again the next. So I said, you know, what? Why don't you just why don't we just make it? Make everybody just miserable all the time and do it every other day. So you don't get this little one day high where you

24:20 Oh, no, I'm not going to do it and people didn't sell. It was a fighter and I had I had to do it twice, but you know, I was not giving up, I was I had more to do on this planet.

24:35 And I'm en route.

24:38 Happy to see you my friend. Yes, it's always good to chat. We don't usually chat about the subject know and I think we we heading into this nation. It took me years to even open any doors. And that said, how would you say surviving? The AIDS epidemic changed has it has it changed you? I'm sure certainly has. I'm more gentle person. I'm more tolerant. I listen. I don't bark.

25:24 You know, and I only fight, you know, fighting is a waste of time unless you're fighting for.

25:34 For purpose.

25:36 You know, and I'm just a strange kid. There's no two ways about it, but I'm, I'm a gentler person and I'm so much more tolerant of of.

25:51 Stupid stuff. How would you say AIDS change the Pines Community? Well, you got empty. First of all, there, wasn't anybody here. I mean, not many people people here and and and people were afraid and people were nervous and and it got down to be, you know,

26:22 I was maybe the two of them on my block of six houses, maybe two of us. We're here, you know, it just decimated the place but it didn't take away the beauty. And that was the one thing that made me keep coming back and made me fight. I said this place is going to come back and with a Vengeance and it has, that is good. That's good.

26:54 Did people's during the dark years, did people's behavior ever disappoint? You?

27:04 Not that I can say. I think the group that I hung out with was very sympathetic and pathetic, I think.

27:16 We all kind of understood what was happening and we had this Mutual Surah phone this, you know that you know Harry's not here and boy, was he a talent, you know?

27:32 I think we seem to be all in the same boat. I don't remember getting angry or disappointed in. Someone's reaction to like, you live in Fire Island, you know, isn't it for the eggs? And now I don't I don't read that. Doesn't ring a bell Bill. Okay, the flip side of that. Were there ever any just beautiful surprises from people? You would not have expected unexpected allies. I think the beautiful people started to come back. People realize listen if I'm safe and I behave well and whatever, I can still come here and enjoy the beauty of this place, you know, it was listen.

28:22 For years and years and years. It was sex drugs and rock and roll. It was it and people still come to the Pines for that exact reason today, but, you know when you're at Bango and then, you know five years later after we kind of recovered Bingo now we have covid real Riku from this to, you know, did covid trigger any AIDS PTSD and you

28:57 When?

29:02 When a group of sadness.

29:07 Takes over you think of them all. You know. Yes, I would go back and forth and sometimes I would be dreaming and I have to get up and get out and walk around.

29:20 The dreams sometimes for horrific and

29:27 But I was so lucky now. So lucky to be here because New York City was ravaged with covid. And I to the kids in the office said to me, you're too, old, you go and stay at the beach and so Tony. And I did stay at the beach for all winter long, you know, and it was interesting cuz people started to winterize their houses to and stay up to this community has grown in a way, that it is more an all-round Community than it used to be. I mean, you guys come out longer than you used to you in a way past, Doug's birthday or yes, and, you know, so and

30:13 I don't know. It's still gorgeous to me. It is. I'm done with you there, speaking from my own experience between you know.

30:25 Having survived AIDS in. I was in Berlin where things didn't hit as early as they did in New York and we almost felt a little guilty. They're feeling is so we were hiding and being selfish, but then it it hit. It really started to hit their 88-89 and then freedom, freedom, freedom. Oh, totally totally. But, you know, we had to hit the brakes, you know, as as you mentioned in the safe sex, and, you know, I think I could wear my my running buddy. In those days, went by the name of pleasure discipline steam room at the running around saying, make it safe boy's life.

31:25 Oh, you know it but I will just say you do for me.

31:36 At times you you you don't want to look too hard for a Redemptive quality because in in the tragedy because maybe there is none. Yes, that's true. But it looks similar to what you mention that it's made me more empathetic. Person more sympathetic person. But also Fire Island made me a much more sympathetic person. In both an understanding of Nature and Beauty and the friendship and the people that's true. All right. Yes.

32:16 How we doing on time? Think we have time for a margarita? Oh, I hope so. Thank you. Scott. It was great. Thank you, Bill.