Peter Sorel and Missy Weimer

00:01 My name is Peter Sorrell. I'm 80 years old and

00:08 Actually, I was 80 July 7th, which is last week. Today is the 14th.

00:15 VR in Chicago

00:19 I am big interviewed by a very old friend.

00:26 Twilight color

00:28 And my name is Missy Weimer. I'm 39 years old. Today is July 14th, 2018 in Chicago with my dear friend and Mentor Peter Sorel.

00:45 Peter thank you so much for joining me today.

00:49 You mentioned something in the lobby.

00:52 I just now and I hope you can tell me more about it. We were looking at pictures of my son. And you said that when you were a kid, you did not have a lot of interaction with other kids your age and it made you shy I was surprised to hear you describe yourself as shy.

01:17 I was I was born in 1938 just

01:21 Literally a couple of months before World War II broke out. So my childhood in Hungary. It was not a happy one. I was not ever is a kindergarten or preschool or anything like that. I was in basements hiding the best people and parsley from the bombs falling and at times from Russians at Genesis. Let me be I had a very colorful try to but I would say not very happy one and my memories aren't other children and toys but that's soldiers and things like that. So,

02:19 I grew up. I'm not saying I'm not social involved with somebody. Of course, I open up but generally I remember even in high school. Times painfully. Shy girls it's not enough that given because because I got and I did not tell her I was surrounded by other kids my age of both sexes.

02:57 That's the difficult. So you're a photographer and you've had a 50 plus year career in photography, but I don't know how you entered photography or how photography entered your life.

03:21 German camera codes for slander Rich doesn't anybody know how it is and I fell in love with.

03:35 Who is taking pictures at a high? I was always interested in in doing something. If I had that I found out quickly at that. I was really not talented enjoying your painting or some people could make little statuettes from wax or what-have-you. I couldn't I have no talent to that and this photography and it was instantaneous and I really never went to school.

04:13 Astrophotography Wisconsin to self educate that and I learned relief from other people's work at Night Long by doing what I love that I look for my mistakes are planning to give you the camera was your dad an artist. She was a housewife as a United Family absolutely. Nobody was artistic. I was thinking on the way over. That I remember to go into Reserves.

04:50 What my life but I never mess with my parents. I've been through school or by myself or my dad didn't drag me to let's go see Peyton Stakes or things like that that fascinates me and you have such a deep and sincere passion for the Arts. Not just photography, but plays movies painting and

05:23 It sounds like it was always inside of you after.

05:31 I've been reading when I started taking pictures. I will take pictures of fancy Iver railing going to be able to order the building it so I can take pictures of people. I absolutely was not too interested. I was I was interested in a beautiful building and it really

05:56 Not surprising to me. That's after the after the city of the h30 when I started making money if it might work in the movie business, which is only people right completely stopped then I retired from movies in 2011.

06:28 I am very happily. I must say I decided that automatically I've done riding back to exactly what I was thinking that I was 13 years old. I sought to take a pictures again of the lake and buildings when you were doing photography and hungry. You were 13 and hungry when you got your first camera, was it difficult or expensive to buy your film or have it processed shooting so little it wasn't and you know, everything that I remember about 6 months. I stopped taking pictures because it's so happened as I was taking a picture of the

07:17 A Parliament building in Budapest and 1/2 came not soldiers but let's go security people had dragged me in there and yelled at me a lot and I wanted to know who I taken. Who am I taking the pictures for a little kid and who is my father and varies my father and you know, don't I know that you cannot take pictures of official buildings and if you cannot take pictures of bridges as I said, no, I have no idea just take my camera of you, but I knew video open the camera to defeat them out.

08:10 Sexual safilo. Wow, and that was my introduction to the political system at the time and the politics of all this was about what is permissible.

08:28 So you stop taking pictures at a Revolution and the identities Austrian over I lived for a little over three years in a refugee camp. I saved up enough money to buy a Russian copy of a Leica camera cold sore.

08:59 Like it is. He's from I believe the 1938 version of like an old one and old rangefinder camera for taking pictures immediately. Did you think that this would be

09:20 Your livelihood or your career at the house that had no idea. I was pretty immature. I was 18 years old and I left Hungary and I really didn't know I just started University.

09:36 I packed up and left then if it's so important to other people and I did not know what I want. I really was and I didn't even know after that. I came to the states three years later. I came here because I fell in love with a girl with a brother it in Los Angeles in and she wanted to go to go to America. I said Okay. So let's go. The only reason I have no ambition to come here to the United States. I had no idea. I actually liked Austria a lot. But nothing you know why I was still sitting in this is a refugee camp is horribly boring.

10:37 I'm so glad to hear I have always wondered how you ended up in Los Angeles. Did you speak English at the time when you came to the United States because I was 21 when I came to Los Angeles and the United States a little late to start learning a language.

11:00 At Louis lose an accent

11:04 Paint a picture of what La would like to you walking into LA because it doesn't have to be in major European cities. It look pretty. Provincial. It's just you know.

11:24 I was not enamored and I never actually I lived there on and off for the next five decades that I didn't get used to it. So I moved to Chicago for the only reason that I love Chicago as a city and

11:42 MP right happily. So how long between Landing in Los Angeles? Was it before you started working in film?

11:54 Well, I thought I got 12 Los Angeles in 59 and I think the first time I was on the film sets if you can call it said it was probably 63. So about 4 years later and this where I put the next decades I worked in other job. So big was the boys do to your name. It's about the motion and then I graduate this to baby pictures and really but I decided I liked hurting laps is a very very very good.

12:37 Photo lab, four professional photographers and I are imprinted other peoples pictures, which is actually very educational diversity man. That's a good printer and I didn't think that I can I ever make a living that totally buy lock my two best friends vert cinematographers. And one day one of them said, you know, we are doing this little tiny yellow bugs that nothing movie. Why don't you come. Take a few pictures there's a photographer there, but he never takes pictures of the crew is the actors. So I said sure and I went down and that was the Dave and Jack Kennedy was killed and I was just

13:36 I was working in the lab and I remember at noon just came on the news that JFK was shot and and pretty well everybody in the city of Santa but this is why I was just whatever you want but not the movie set alarm to 8 in the evening sometime late in the evening and shut a few pictures of diamond the script supervisor and so on and then we sat down and to drink coffee and

14:18 And the commiserated about yeah.

14:31 Well, so it was at the then the first film that you took pictures up and then how do you do make a movie where you don't have money to pay to your crew than you do it on the weekend then but you're free and I did a few like that and that eventually

14:58 Did some bigger low-budget films with you or maybe 2-3 weeks but with good actors, so I ever two people like Jack Nicholson play before he got no. No, I mean in the early sixties motorcycle movies, like this are all completely independently shot for like shoe strings.

15:30 Well, then you worked on what has become the most iconic motorcycle movie ever made Easy Rider. You see right there because cuz you had a few people knew me who are in death circle of filmmakers and they hire me and plus I knew right then I knew Jack and and the kids over to other films with him and that produces are always interested. If you is a photographer who has some kind of a good relationship with the actors you're going to be photographed many actors sure and I'm sure some have I wanted to ask talk a little more about Easy Rider and what the set was like how much creative control you

16:30 Add or didn't have as a photographer started in the morning.

16:46 Beautiful and I had a couple of Puffs and then it and then we started on the road on the station wagon and many times. I was laying on top of the station wagon races following the bikes or leading the bike today because of safety for sure, sir.

17:17 Looking back on it is phenomenal.

17:27 Maybe a little too much drugs are on your I wasn't evolves really.

17:34 Visit us this far. I'm in the end and it seems like the actors but they are something what the pictures that you took on that film have because I'm really a cultural Touchstone and they seem to help you're very welcome. They seem to have represented a shift that movie seems to have driven.

18:01 Some momentum into the seventies it started like this counterculture movement. And when I look at it, you know 1969 Robert Franks book The Americans came out only 10 years previous and those pictures which are also a cultural Touchstone are so different from your movie. I mean that the change in just 10 years that happen is just a standing and I wanted to know if you had seen his pictures at that time if you have been looking at his work and then he poops as soon as I had enough money to buy.

18:41 So it's just it's so amazing. Now when I I'm surprised by an image of Easy Rider on a t-shirt or just randomly either like a county fair or in like Urban Outfitters, and and I think like Peter took that photo and then I think back to yeah how I know what was your camera? Like, what was the situation like in so, you know you're describing being on the station wagon? And I mean, it just it's so incredible that you're responsible for these pictures that are so American just a few you don't let 10 years less than ten years after arriving in the United States and learning English. And yeah, how do you feel when you see images of Easy Rider now?

19:32 Obviously thought it took some of you know, we are photographers on films are obligated to turn down the material over to the company you wish you were pretty good boy on bus. I signed on I did right and eventually I started shooting stuff for myself on the side so I can have something.

20:11 Because simply you photography on the actor.

20:26 I don't actually you know you you

20:31 Can I develop a relationship with that the best actor doesn't matter how big a start if it's Marlon Brando or somebody I know and it doesn't make any difference and then you can ask them, you know, you can tell them that you would like to set up something for yourself and I would say 90% of the time I got what I want who is the most satisfying relationship in that regard that you could continue to photograph off the set or on the set for yourself?

21:09 I don't know why I even more Speed Most actresses were very Cooperative, you know, women are much easier to photograph them and strangely enough enough. Strangely at least as much as you had a long relationship with Jack Nicholson. And you also photographed him in One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest and some very famous photographs. Can you tell me about that set? You read the book previously and then we don't okay movie much later based off of a book Lolita.

22:09 And how about that? What was it like to non-english white gold Adrian line and I think the his version of Lolita was better than Kubrick's image. It's just say that Kubrick's when nothing is true to the book produced by a French company and they left Adrian do whatever you want to do. So he was a very very true to the vision of Never Comes original book.

23:08 This is hard to understand but some people think is is pornography Candice. It's ridiculous a part of our lives.

23:22 Nothing wrong with this customer uncensored art is the best kind. So I also I have to ask you, you know, you're not on Instagram, but I am and I searched for you on various platforms from time to time I search your name and when I searched for you on Instagram, I find a lot of pictures of Madonna from Dick Tracy a little more about that. We can talk after the interview and I wanted to show you some of that stuff. But what was it like the photograph Madonna? Yes. Yes, I do know.

24:14 For example, you know why I could get a loan easily. If it is that have famously difficult woman like her she s number lost her top. So I did not take a picture of it and I made a point to let her know not to worry. There is no picture. This will go out because it's not even the photographer by the first air filters in the material to the studio and release it from Provo Utah off the name, and of course, I'm not that too, but she liked the idea of it. I looked out for her.

25:07 That's one of the studios. Yeah, I mean you have a lot of freedom on the set actually for swimsuits well access on some sets episodes of neck fat people yet. So in that sense, you do have a lot of power and then you you kind of act we ask the power once you hand your pictures over so it has there ever been a time where you were unhappy with how your work was presented.

25:43 Did not had the tables have an editor who has absolutely no idea about photography and very interested in you know, the star lets, you know, if you need pictures of the start doing something right and they would put together about the color press kit, which is I don't know maybe a few dozen maybe two dozen.

26:13 Pictures representing the film and these choices are so bad that you know when you know about you have you don't you want to pull out your hair so I can do that because I don't have

26:32 So you work on I know I know one example that had a difficult that which you might say, which is Life of Pi. I could've stay in the film business for another 5 years, maybe 10 years, but the new technology for I would say it was started up around Gurnee to thousands of using blue screen and green screen 2.

27:15 To shoot that guest rather than build a set and then later electronically on the computer you put in the background. So this is the life of a photographer said really miserable because all you can shoot is unusable pictures Giant in this case and a green screen write everyday 360u00b0 completely green screen. So I will shoot from like top of a 16 foot step ladder so I can shoot against the water or you so tight that you could not see about that.

27:56 You know, I wonder how can I go so tiger for today continuing that visits if you have talent that you should express it as if you cannot because of the technical aspects at the house already difficult. I want to talk to you about that. You don't you have had so much longevity in your career longer than really I can't think of another position.

28:31 Or another person whose work so long in film. I also got to get on the happy.

28:50 Well, I think it's because I can I could always do something else on the side for myself and that's kept me happy enough and I was making a lot of money to let me enjoy my hobby and the most of my life and from at least it almost 50 years. I did was I really like so that's

29:25 That's exceptionally lucky. Can you think of another way besides the way that technology changed set building that movie making in filmmaking have changed most of us got used to that having first. It was. Very poor quality, but now it's absolutely no not a problem. It's so much so that even for myself I stopped using feeling because digital is going to be easier, but it comes to print Printing and I can print at home lab

30:15 Do you love you need space because it's really stink up your apartment and to go to commercial Labs note is no longer possible because there are only Digital Labs make sure there's one very good. I mean really terrific first last lab, but they don't do any feel like, you know photochemical initially ortho.

30:49 It because in those days the little cameras are more like a toy. I mean, I was amazing how you can shoot. I never thought that the answer will be refined on it. Then Canon and Nikon to go where I think most of us didn't think it's a viable to for the first two years. It seems like your ability to stay in industry is also been or we can distribute to your ability to embrace new technologies. You're the only person I know over 80 who knows so many of the things that you know about pop culture and understand things that are happening online, even if you're not participating in social media and I think

31:49 I expect it's pretty amazing to me that you turned 80 recently because

31:56 You managed to stay connected to you know, theater and music and all these like foundational Arts as well as staying up with what's happening now. So do you feel like you're retired? I feel like I don't think that I return to exactly doing the same thing, but I was doing when I was first youngboy taking pictures you sent still lives and I take pictures of fruits and vegetables and the coathangers make little statues of cool things in the desert.

32:46 Is it's almost like playing about tying. It's exactly how I started. When I was 13, nothing not even taking pictures of my friends at all.

32:59 In your home, what are the pictures in my home? I have a pretty good collection. I have and everything pan. I have some wonderful French photographers.

33:13 Lucy Eichler Google

33:20 Oh and you know what that woman photography is beautiful Nudes on the West Coast.

33:29 I'm not sure.

33:32 She said she's like a sister that is on 90 something or hundred unfortunately.

33:44 What do you like about those photographs? Well, I'm indebted to lie. It's pieces of art that it's it's not there is nothing commercial it completely and artistic achievement. I'm using it in the museum and you know if I can have three or four photographs. I'm not shocked by me. This is Richard museum-quality. Have a pretty great.

34:17 But I have been through so I have little drive so I might my house is full of art icing and hard books.

34:27 Nothing nothing Surly about photography either.

34:34 So you was at the Museum's a lot here in Chicago, which is probably one of the reasons.

34:40 But you love it here is world-class me a lot about artist that you don't like but what about I mean, we also talked about artists you admire we talked about a lot. But what is a painting at the Art Institute for instance that you go back to or look for again and again?

35:12 Sara Bareilles for American Artist, Georgia O'Keeffe

35:28 And I'm eating all the French paintings in museum impressionist collection, and they have wonderful stuff.

35:45 So Peter when you retired you decided to leave Los Angeles, I know you worked a little bit after you came to Chicago but

35:56 When you left La I feel like you were trying and maybe you correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like you were trying to leave Hollywood behind. So tell me about that. What?

36:12 Is it support if only city if you live there? It's everybody wants to be an actor or I mean the you know, the guy who Parks your car have to have this is not the healthy and the environment and you know people talk about nothing else. I mean very very I have

36:50 I have more friends in 10 years in Chicago.

36:55 That I had been in decades of Los Angeles simply because I didn't want to have friends only from the movie industry. And that's all that's the only only only people who I met here. I know doctors and Brokers and attorneys and normal people.

37:24 I really like the people here and also the Midwest mentality so much more normal than the Los Angeles. I don't want to give us courts because like that but living in in Los Angeles.

37:44 He'll at least since it's not that that it's a company's down but there really is nothing else except for the do you think for the same reasons you're you're reluctant to talk about some of the relationships you've had with really famous people or things. I resent don't discuss in a very good relationship with certain actors.

38:15 Pretty rotten ones with some others, but neither one is the Public's business for the interview. Are you sure if you feel. You should write a book you have all those stories.

38:39 Woman you've ever photographed

38:44 Probably

38:47 Nicole Kidman

38:50 And Emma Thompson. I love them even though she was such a beautiful person that makes you beautiful.

39:05 So what picture nickel is just as if any of your own are hanging in your house?

39:16 Pictures of Utah

39:18 The only the third the girl from Lolita

39:22 The great shot

39:26 Teresa Bond of Sting

39:31 And I think

39:33 That that's it might be.

39:37 How many pictures do you think you've taken over his girlfriend that she's not identifying? No, no, no. No. No. Okay fair enough is enough. I've seen some of those photos are very beautiful. So how many pictures do you think you've taken?

40:12 My life. Yeah, I'm sure it's around a hundred thousand or more.

40:19 Craigslist, where are your archives? I give every single stuff to the motion picture Academy's Library.

40:31 And so they have a Peter Sorrell archive at the library in Los Angeles.

40:39 Is there a film crew like students or the writers can go in and look at it or do research and their delicate difficult?

40:59 Only because a good pictures photography change the artistic direction of the film for the cinematography about

41:21 I wanted to ask you about the pictures on Frida. Can you tell me a little bit about those pictures where the Lost Boys movie I ever saw. Okay, and I probably need another 10 projects after that, please. The end of the movies nowadays. That's $3. That was no blue screen music.

41:48 Just what about you? So you completely unbelievable. I'm you set them on you.

42:06 A lot of people in Mexico City who are really really good like that it up designer the cinematographer.

42:15 Incredibly talented young people. So I think you've done a lot more projects than 10 since Frieda. How many projects do you think you've worked on? How many films you're you are a workaholic you done at least roughly three films a year since you started I mean if or or more

42:53 It's just unbelievable that you were able to keep up that pace for so long. I mean, I have just like astounded at your work at the dentist while maybe they love their work was the question if you're retired yes or no, and I think you circled yes and

43:28 I feel like if I was some photographers to retire I didn't and I don't intend to you know, I still every morning. I am up there on the unlocked as I get up so early but if I wake up around 5 5:30 is my first thing is I go to my living room in and check out the sky because it might be a beautiful picture and sometimes it is and that it's pretty good then will the series of the lake Skype. This is soul Michigan Avenue N and then the sky I mean, Michigan Lake Michigan and the never ending possibilities think so. I probably took

44:21 Above the lake easily three 4,000 pictures no change wait for the weather to see who could call you tomorrow and get you on a film set. You're done.

44:51 Absolutely not. How do they call you do that? Very few people started saying no more calls for you doing a book about sword sword relaxing use a picture and reviews of your photograph of yours. Then of course, when is the last time you visited Budapest?

45:28 Oh and

45:32 I think 1996.

45:37 I actually was invited and flown over but by the government of the same country which which I left happily, you know, because right the deck pulley puller take me to her like a leader Alderman a democracy or try to be yeah, you know after the Russian Empire collapse and actually the dumbest only

46:06 I think

46:09 70 hungarians from abroad very invited and we all have to go to the parliaments and the Prime Minister and Y mentirosa famous people some scientists and people like Tony Curtis suit. This is it was Hungarian people.

46:45 And some other people my my cinematographer friend Smurf.

46:55 But then I've been back since then to do a film.

47:00 And that was a horrible experience I had with never because the Hungarian production people not not the crew The Americans.

47:31 The things you said that

47:36 Do another job that I wasn't the end of it.

47:43 In hi.

47:44 Has turned you off of

47:49 Taking photographs of people or when or do you have you ever had interest in taking photographs of the people that were important to you in your life. I still have to take pictures of that. But you know, I I truly feel embarrassed you and I I I mean, for example la

48:15 If you go out on the street, and there's some very colorful homeless people I would never have the nerve. You know, I just think he's so rude and a to take a picture with all tasks. You can ask and I think most of you to say I give you $10 or I don't know but some people don't mind. I remember I was on the job in Peru and they have the most beautiful in the Villages. You see this gorgeous little peasant kids.

48:56 And Ivy and you can have what you want to take pictures. It's like, you know National Geography in front of you and and I noticed that like the mothers really didn't like it at all. You know it and I think it's such an imposition without getting some of us permission to take a picture. So I have nothing street photography have your time and your photographic ethics. The big conversation today about that.

49:36 Val Raptors

49:38 Got the stuff is this a few cultures left my time, but we did take a selfie together last week.

49:50 Well, is there anything that you want to talk about that I haven't asked you about other than I really realized the dust photography can be and a heart early enough that I think my tubes to the museum and and even today. I mean, it's Vanilla Ice have published that little book by Mark rothko. I mean I did not.

50:31 Consciously stupid pictures to steal the idea from from a great painter, but it just came out that some of them are very similar. I'm in this not the same any baby, but it's similar and the idea is the same here. You know, he killed himself. I didn't know that. Yeah, well, I hope this is not our last interview together, but I really want to thank you for sharing all this with me today, and you answered a lot of my questions, but you gave me some more questions to ask you, so I'm okay. Thank you. Thank you.