Christine Christopher and Lydia Boddie-Rice

00:02 Hello, my name is Lydia boddie-rice. I am 66 years old today is July 27th, 2021 and my location where I live is Rochester, New York, the name of my conversation partner is Christine Chris Christopher and the relationship I have with her is we are actually spiritual sisters. That is a tough act to follow, but my name is Christine Christopher. I am also 66 years old and Lydia. I have birthdays that are very close to each other. It's Tuesday, July 27th, 2021. I am also in Rochester, New York. The name of my conversation partner is Lydia boddie-rice and Lydia is my sister.

01:02 Friend, my creative partner, my partner in crime, and someone that I've worked on, not just many projects together, but also have lived many exciting life experiences together. Isn't that true? Love you? I can't wait to talk about your family, you come from a very esteemed family. When I think of your family of your father of you of your children, I think of people who open doors and do things that may be unexpected. So, tell me first about your father.

01:47 My father was the second black graduate of the University of Rochester Medical School. He was one of 14 surviving children, but there were 21 in his family. His parents died when he was young. So he was raised by his brothers and sisters. They were all Extraordinary first in onlys, in many cases. So come from a long, paternal Legacy experience myself? Quite an impression on this town.

02:26 Yes, I think so. He was known as the great black. Hope during the Riots of 64. His medical offices were on Joseph Avenue and they were untouched during that period, which, you know, is remarkable you having produced the film and Emmy award-winning film it that on July 64. So it was really my first indoctrination into social justice issues. We had many people at convene at our home, you know, in response to those riots in your home actually was also very special for its time, your parents married in the 1950s, your father's black and your mother's white. We didn't often see that and talk to me about what it was like to grow up in an interracial a mixed racial family at that particular time, right? On the cusp of the Civil Rights Movement.

03:27 Will for me, especially being in a household where there are? No biases. It wasn't apparent that they were pioneering. It was apparent that they were loving. It was apparent that they were inclusive and welcoming. We had all kinds of people in, and out of our home, my mother and father were incredibly social people. So it wasn't just that they were connected medically. My mother was a nurse my they met at Genesee Hospital. So even during the time of unrest, we were surrounded by like-minded people that you were United by a cops. And in fact, it said, although I never witnessed that that Martin Luther King was even in our home, by my parents, as a result of the relationship with my uncle Chuck, Charles Emerson body. Who was the pastor at Mount Olivet Baptist Church.

04:27 So, their loss is Carson and me, we could go through so many names. Chris, you probably remember more of them because of your film, but my father had relationships with all of them because it was a circle really of Community Connection in love. My mother was always well-received but I don't want it to appear as though it was without struggle. And remember my dad didn't have parents. So, you know literally his community was comprised of you know, my uncles and aunts to lived on, you know, when the third world war primarily the Corn Hill area and you know embrace them as it as a young couple, but my mother's family was not so welcoming. It took about 14 years for my parents, for my mother to actually enjoy the companionship. And do you know that?

05:27 Relationship with both of her parents. You told me a very poignant story about your grandfather and your father meeting for the first time. I think that's a really special story. Would you tell it again?

05:39 Sure, if you don't mind me, getting a little emotional about it. Thank you. I. Well, my, my grandfather, you, I mean, you know, my street German Trace back to the city and occurred. Very, very biased individual. It was not accepting it. All of my mother's marriage. And so, however, kind of the true up of the story is that I remember very clearly the day, my grandfather actually did not talk to my mother for 14 years, my grandmother, it took seven. So, imagine how that was for my mother, who is Raising four young children, not having the assistance of her mother. They lived nearby in Portageville. So it wasn't geographically, you, no insurmountable, and not having her father not being able to have that close.

06:39 Family unit. So my there came the day, 14 years later. It's incredible. How you can remember all ages and dates at certain periods of time in your life right now, you know, where my father was to meet my grandfather.

06:59 My father was a flappable. I mean, he always had the answer. He was always, he was the epitome of, you know, just this very, very confident, you know, well-spoken person.

07:16 However, that day, he was not, he was a mess and to remember that at 14 years old, how nervous he was, you know, is still very much a part of, you know, my memories. And so we made the trip to Portageville and what if I can't recall all the details, what actually happened in how they interacted with each other, but I know after that day, when I speak of the true up, my grandfather would have no other doctor. He embraced my father so much so that when my father died prematurely at 66 years old, they did not tell my grandfather who had begun to suffer from dementia because they were that close. They just did not know how he would respond, you know, and close to his 90s at that time.

08:14 So to know that there was 14 years of loss.

08:20 You know, that just was able to be healed and such a profound way that I can remember my grandfather not with all that racist. You know what, he did to my mother and my parents, but as someone who was an, avid a card player, someone who would hold her hand at the dinner table and wouldn't let go by, Grace is over, you know, just, he embraced and loved us as children, and I only have regrets that we didn't have him for the first 14 years. I'm sure he had a lot of regrets to once. He went over that bridge. You don't people think of New York and Ithaca New York City, they think of rock and they know that we are the city of Susan, B, Anthony and Frederick Douglass. So there is an idea of that everywhere you go in New York. It's very Progressive. And in fact, Portageville is about an hour and a half.

09:20 South of Rochester. It's an extremely remote and rural area more Farmland heavily, Republican. Not at all Progressive. So, that was a pretty big divide for your grandfather to have to cross, but in the end of Hart wins, right? It just, you know, my grandmother and grandfather was such a significant part of our Lives, you know, going there, even to stay overnight and weekends and visit. I learn to embroider from my grandmother, all the extra work and my love of fabric actually, you know comes from my mother's side and fam, you know, definitely my grandmother, those all those textile skills come from her guard cooking. Oh my goodness, you know, they grew up in the depression. So my grandmother could make potatoes 55 different ways.

10:20 You never got tired of potatoes. She knew how to stretch a potato and I know. And that is really, you know, again, I think where I get the ethic of you make do with what you have, your love of textiles, L later on in our conversation, but I really do want to go back to your childhood days because you not only grew up in a family that was different from most of your friends families, make you from all of your friends. Family has you went to a suburban school where you were not surrounded with other people of color. Isn't that true?

11:02 Oh, absolutely. We were the only family to attend pittsfordschools at that time. It was Pittsford Sutherland in Pittsford. The Mandan junior high school. So I started in 6th grade would you know is tough for anyone idea. And however, I always had this in and I had to this day. These Transcendent experience is the connect me with people who Propel me forward despite the adversity. And you know, I had, you know, the extraordinary gift of meeting Eileen Birnbaum, who is Davis blonde? Who recently passed away his wife. So I leaned

12:02 And I actually look quite a bit of like, so, for me, I think, my experience was, well, if I look like her, then why you no kind of is there racism ever, there's worries about what my ethnicity was and mostly Chris. It was, people didn't know what I was supposed to with my name being Lydia. So in Rochester, my experiences is your black your Latino or you're quite that, was it on like, in Rhode Island, where I live 12 years and there's all kinds of derivations of whose black who's not black, you know, that they knows weren't even in play at that time. So, you know, it was something that I just didn't understand. And again remember coming from a home where you know, you know, my ethnicity wasn't really part of who you know, I was

13:02 Where I am.

13:04 So after going to Pittsford, and just for the sake of our listeners have such a, there's a famous statistic that we sighted here in Rochester. The Rochester, city school district, has the lowest graduation rate for African-American males in the country and Pittsford is in the top 10 districts in the country. And the driving time between the two of them is about 10 minutes, which released this a lot about our city. But what I really want. Then after you left this road, you went on to an Ivy League college, and you became enamored of certain Sports and things that we're outside of your world of studies. What would those have been Lydia?

13:47 Well, I was for whatever reason, I love the water. I've always left the water, and I was attracted to Growing to accrue. I really wanted to participate. I was a quasi athlete in any way, but, and the only thing that kept me from actually, trying out for the team or my classes were scheduled so early that I couldn't make the practices. Cuz you know, if you know it anything about rowing which I know you do Chris, you've been joined at the hip with me on it. I mean you're up at the crack of dawn. So you have to actually, you know be engaged in a very physically dominant Sport and brown. Also, you know, which I didn't know at the time. I didn't know much about rowing at all. You do it if they were, you know, Class A Class above its so I probably would have

14:47 Is it up with the workout before I had classes? But I used to go and I used to watch, you know, the sport just because I was transfixed by it. I'm back here in Rochester where you and the reason you and I were connected on this is because my daughter is a coxon and went to roll. So we were already friends and then we found this other thing that kind of sodas together, but you actually went on and did something that broke a national barrier by starting a Rowing Club here, call crosscurrents.

15:26 Tell us about crosscurrents and why I just framed it as being a national groundbreaking endeavor.

15:35 It grew into a national groundbreaking Endeavor. I don't think I knew that at the time I knew it was under represented a friend of mine and asked, if I would help to diversify the program. He was a former Rochester Gas & Electric where I worked retiree Avid Sportsman. Just a really wonderful gift and inclusive person. And wanted to diversify the facility. We were right in the middle of the city and he didn't see enough people of color in the water or around the water. So, you know, he had a little bit of government money and I said, look, I'll support anybody that you can recruit to train. So I just grabbed a bunch of people I knew.

16:25 And said, hey, would you like that, you know, try this out and it wasn't until we really

16:35 You know, showed up at practice that we realize we were the only ones we really are the only ones here.

16:42 And then you went on your roots group is well. Yeah, it's well, you know, what ended up happening is that there was just so much interest in fostering, you know, the awareness about the sport and, you know, my natural PR and marketing ability took over that was, you know, my profession that you know, what are Genies. So I really, you know, ended up growing the initiative and something that we could then offer to Youth. And so the youth program is actually what became nationally known. We became part of a national movement by us rowing to create America Rose and we were one of the founding cities and throwing how do they even find out about you? One of my school? Remember after?

17:42 You're just love the sport and he was really my development director. He was recruited. He was incredible. He should. Actually, he should be credited with getting us to National prominence, but he reached out to us rowing and the diversity director. He was brand-new and that was Richard Butler, and the relationship blossomed and we became the focus for actually initiating, a lot of their groundbreaking programs and initiatives. We became the model so much. So that Richard asked if we would host a nationally sanctioned race, which became the university, Regatta we did that for three years.

18:40 And I which was wonderful. It was how did you come up with the name? Crosscurrents?

18:46 Actually, the very first season of Lydia Cruz. So another Lydia, but you know, is it's pretty unusual name. So, she was one of our rowers and we just after practice, if we got to have a name at that time. We didn't even have equipment or have boats, but we just felt we needed to unite around a name and a brand on because I think I'm starting to get a sense. Chris, that we were.

19:16 We were destined to be something bigger than just a quasi ragtag team of wannabe rowers.

19:26 So it but it wasn't always smooth. Sailing wasn't no. I think that my disappointment is that we were founded on the basis of diversity and inclusion initiatives. That would introduce the sport Foster awareness, and just gained participation of underrepresented groups.

19:52 So, we were highly successful at that, and but what we were not successful at was getting the program to transcend, the initial training that we provided. And at that time, we didn't have coaches of color. We didn't have, you know, even rowers more or less. We actually had to populate our boats, which is why I always said we were inclusive, Hot Seat them with rewards from other communities, but it's very difficult to get any of our competent rulers in the seats of other clubs.

20:33 And that was what the initial idea was is that we would begin to diversify other programs, not running Diversity Program, where everybody's and people of color to us. What's the point of that? We did have a flying fantasy that okay. If this is what people are going to see us as then we will try to become as technically competent as possible and compete and that we would be and it back, Richard Butler just in from to me, I think about 3 months ago that we are the only Bike Park.

21:10 Cheap nationally, we were the only by POC Diversity Program, which is remarkable. I did not know that until he told me there were African-American, you know, groups that were lucky, no groups. But bypass we were, we were the first, and I believe the only by pack found a team so that but it was hard, especially on our kids. We had an incident think I shared with you Pittsford my alma mater. So understand how I am. How disappointed I am. There was a thoughtless, made by one of their rollers to our kits. It was over her and one of our kids, it was very insensitive and I won't repeat it. But as a result of that,

22:10 As many were angry. I was hurt. I felt kind of betrayed and responsible, but I really took that experience as a teaching moment. I got I have a responsibility to make sure that we can turn this into a positive learning opportunity on both sides of the aisle. So with one of the folks that you connected me with, I was able to

22:46 Turn that around. So that it was not as

22:56 Earth shattering in negative is it could have been but it shocked me. I was not ready. Remember here. I was in Pittsford in 1968 and 1972. I graduated and I would hardly have believed that years later that I would have to be faced with, you know, that incense incense tippity.

23:21 Which was painful. Richard sivak called change makers where they focused on a wide group of women who had done remarkable things in our city, over the ages. And they did make it 7 about the body family and cross currents. And now you're crosscurrent. Archive is actually in a museum and here we are talking about it on storycorps. So what was it like to walk into that Museum and see all of those things and after having taken a pause from this for a while. How did that make you feel?

24:07 I think that the first feeling I had was, I didn't feel worthy. You know, it or suspended, Chris, you know. To be able to see an exhibition that's built around. The equipment that you struggled to raise money for, you know, to be able to share a story that you never thought would be told, you know, I was the target of a lot of heated criticism, you know, during those programmatic days and then it was ten years of you know, defining moments, not only for me and my own personal character, but just the people that, you know, I was surrounded by, I mean to have a diversity Invitational that literally we were hosting and presenting ourselves. It wasn't until the third year. We are, we actually had folks that were starting to embrace the initiative, Amy McCoy.

25:07 It was amazing. They were just, you know, stepping up to the plate. But before then it was really, really very, very difficult. But to see the story in the legacy of rowing in Rochester. In the Diversity Program in Rochester being, you know, position for a perpetuity as really, like I said, there's so many other people that including yourself who worked with me to really make this all, you know, together for, you know, the future of the sport for me to I absolutely loved working on it. It wasn't just watching Zoey as your cocks and my daughter is your coxal, but I love this in his, you know, I don't have, I've got a many competitive bones in my body, but I don't have any athletic Talent whatsoever. So to be a rolling superfan and to be

26:07 Able to help you bring that forward into watch the ways that I could with the writing graphic design and a little bit of PR here. And there, that was really a great time for me to go. And I was really, really happy to be part of it. Really clean. Your daughter. Chris recipient was just a few know. So it was just such a perfect moment. You know, what would you you might have done so many things together. We're in similar lines of work. We have our creative energy has intercepted over many projects, not just crosscurrents. I could take off probably 20 of them without even thinking too hard about it. And after working with you all of these years and knowing you all of these years.

27:05 You have entered into a new phase, another new phase that astounds me that absolutely astounds me. You would always kind of said, oh Chris. I'm an artist. Do you know? Oh, yeah. I'm an artist. I didn't realize until you have come forth in your Renaissance, in your sixties that you are an artist with a capital, A doing beautiful, beautiful textile work. Collage textile work, melting images. I hope that within the context of storycorps there is a place to show some of this work because it is just beautiful beyond measure. I own a great deal of it and not just because I'm your friend, I own it because it's really, really good because I really, really love it. So about how

28:05 This portion of yourself has blossomed in the way that it has in her sixties and you're 60. It won't, you know, I think that there is something transformational about, allowing you to come back to your heart space in the center of who you are. And so, you know, I've been working with artists as, you know, for probably, for most of my career, most of it being quiet when I was in corporate life, but it is, you know, that I always came through, not only in philanthropy, but it came through in how things were designed for a company or, you know, when I managed and arts organization, it was, I could everything. I mean, I did The Branding, I dined the, you know, the campaigns and working with you actually helped me to be

29:05 I'm more creative. And I believe, you know, that was the beginning of starting to tap into. We'll wait a minute. You know, I've always been a creative, you know, I suppressed it because, you know, I was a single parent for 14 years and raised, you know, my children and and expose them to new and exciting. You know, things is well, there in non-traditional a sports themselves. So, you know, for me, returning to Art was just really where I had to recognize that that's where I've always been. That's, that's really the core of Lydia. Boddie-rice is and that's how I use art to solve.

29:56 You know, the problems of the universe.

30:01 I I actually think collages much is a visual representation of who I am, you know, it's like pieces of me that I place emotionally in my work. And so one of the things that I have kind of pushed around with you in terms of how I approach my art making is that it's a motion first and composition second and the integration of fabrics helps me to kind of tap into my own ancestry on and Claw. She actually is very much connected to the quilt, making experience my mother's quilts. And again, I mentioned before my grandmother, you know, that that I've always had a love of material and color and fabric but it also is on, you know, and a black experience.

31:01 Are black cohosh workout and that's something. I'm exploring more, but I actually like it most because what I've been doing is tapping into images that and people the people behind the image. So for instance, with the one that I did have Zoe Zoe, it was such a beautiful picture that I knew I had to do it and it was just a silhouette that I found first. So then to find another that I was actually able to integrate together to create an emotional piece, that I managed to a family of friends, but to also a young lady who just represented such, you know, incredible beauty of heart and spirit an accomplishment. It was easy, that piece came together, fast or pieces. Absolutely. Thank you.

32:01 Yeah, I had a good. I had a wonderful news. Well as only connected to you because of your great relationship together, but though it's the one thing that has just really astounded me is how I do. It just really feels like this is just blossomed forth from you and it now seems to be really the one of the, the key drivers of your life. I mean, your family, your children, your grandchildren, of course, are at the center of your mom of everything, but when it's just you, it's just you and the universe. It seems to be that this your art has just taken over your world in a way that I just find a beautiful.

32:49 Terrifying. Intimidating, gorgeous. All of the above. I'm really proud of you. I mean, it just makes me feel really proud of you that you move into this new episode.

33:07 And your husband is well, he is you know, it's a really great because at least it's different medium. So we we don't even have a shot at competing with each other, Although I have done some design work, you do for him and I'd like to learn to weld. But you know, we respect each other's mediums and, you know, it in each other's process. In also with having a studio and having a shot. We are understanding that we need our creative space separate from our home. We just need to be able to have the space to push out that emotional energy because back in college, actually, where I was the only black artist in my program, you know, I would work well until three 4 in the morning and still have to get up for classes. At me. Once you're on a creative roll. You just have to, you know,

34:07 I have push it until it's, and and I appreciate a studio to be able to do that. And so, I understand Greg's long hours. I understand, you know, kind of where you could start out with a concept and it doesn't end up where you want it to go. And, you know, we can really, you know, tap into each other's also, weaknesses and strengths. You know, how each other. I mean, when you talk about kind of being back in my creative space. I think it's been for me the way to heal.

34:41 You know, when you've lived 66 years and and you're full of gratitude. There is just something that's palpable about thanking, you know, the people places and things that have made up a part of, you know, accompany me on my journey. So, the artistic piece is that exploration, you know, that. Also, the way that I deal with grief, you know, I lost my brother last year and that was unexpected. It's just been a very cathartic way. I used one of the collages early classes that I did to deal with my father's death and you know, basically, you know that transition that. Of time.

35:33 You know what's so needed? It took me ten years to finish that piece. That's hanging in the studio. I did not finish my dad's peace quickly.

35:44 Lydia, we are coming to the end of our time together. So before we wrap this up, I want to ask you what you see as where you're going to move ahead with your art.

36:00 I really like the process of creating it, you know, I never anticipated it to be popular enough for appreciate enough to so, but now I'm thinking more seriously about that, that I really need to accept that people are including me as value-added in their home.

36:24 And that each piece that ends up in someone's home is a piece of my heart, you know? And love is for sharing, like my little of rocks. People give me money. You do for those, but I can give them away half the time, you know, on. So, I think that's really where it is Chris. I just wanted to share my heart and that's the tangible way that I can do that.

36:55 Well, let me say in conclusion, that you will always be part of our home and always part of our heart and we are certainly grateful for having you in our lives. Is there anything else that you want the world to know about Lydia boddie-rice Before We Say Goodbye?

37:16 I think you've done just such a magical time together. We always have these incredible conversations. So I appreciate very much you, Chris taking this on, you know, in a conversational way, that is sensitive. You know, that just has brought me into, you know, a deeper understanding of, you know, who I need to accept that I am.

37:44 And I thank you for that. Well, I was moved and honored for you to ask me to be part of this. So for all of the world's know, Chris and Lydia, so loud and kisses to the universe.

37:59 Sisters to the end.