Justin Spencer and Emily Spencer

[00:00] JUSTIN SPENCER: Yeah. My name is Justin Spencer. I am 33 years old. Today's date is June 2 of 2023, and the location is Fort Williams State Park, Maine. The name of my interview partner is Emily Spencer, and she is my beautiful wife.

[00:24] EMILY SPENCER: My name is Emily Spencer. I am 32 years old. Today's day is June 2, 2023, located at Fort Williams State Park, Maine. I am interviewing Justin Spencer, and he is my lovely husband. Justin, how did you tell your family and friends that you were joining the military?

[00:49] JUSTIN SPENCER: So I had informed my family. I informed after I had joined and enlisted in the army. I enlisted and found out I was going to be going to Missouri for basic in November of 2029. And when I had made that decision final. Can we edit that or just back up and re ask? Okay. Just re ask. What did you say?

[01:17] EMILY SPENCER: You said 2029.

[01:19] JUSTIN SPENCER: Whatever. Okay. Restart. Just regal.

[01:23] EMILY SPENCER: Okay. Justin, how did you tell your family and friends that you were joining the military?

[01:29] JUSTIN SPENCER: So I told my family that I was joining the army as soon as I had gone through the process of figuring out what it was that I wanted to do in the army, and that was in 2009. And when I found out that I was going to be going to basic, I, in November, I had informed my family about July of my intent to join the military. My friends were kind of part of the process. I had some people that kind of wanted to enlist with me and then others that were just actively asking me how that process was going.

[02:05] EMILY SPENCER: So, yeah, how did you imagine military life before you had joined, and did your perception change after the fact?

[02:15] JUSTIN SPENCER: I think you need to ask what I did before you go to that.

[02:22] EMILY SPENCER: Which one?

[02:23] JUSTIN SPENCER: You need to ask what it was. I even enlisted in.

[02:25] EMILY SPENCER: Oh, what did you enlist in?

[02:29] JUSTIN SPENCER: So I joined the US army in 2009 and went to basic in Missouri at Fort Leonard Wood as a combat engineer, and I enlisted as a combat engineer. And my whole time in the military, I served as a combat engineer.

[02:49] EMILY SPENCER: How did you imagine military life before you had joined, and did your perception change after the fact?

[02:55] JUSTIN SPENCER: I really didn't know what to anticipate before joining as a kid, we've all seen those war movies, and at the time of growing up, there was all the video games and the military was all the raves, so there was that outlook theory of it. But in hindsight, it was nothing like those movies or any of those things that you could imagine. It was a life changing experience. Just learning about the way of life of a soldier and the things that you needed to do to become a soldier was really eye opening.

[03:34] EMILY SPENCER: What are some of the things that you remember about adapting to military life.

[03:39] JUSTIN SPENCER: So when joining, it was really clear that you needed to operate as a team. And so, like being part of sports team in high school and things like that and that nature, that was kind of easy to adapt, to know that you had to operate as a team, but all those people needed to be on the same page and to work together to achieve that goal. So.

[04:07] EMILY SPENCER: Yeah, let's talk about how we met.

[04:12] JUSTIN SPENCER: So how we met. We knew each other, of each other in high school, but I did not have the courage to approach you. So once I joined the military, I became a little bit more confident and knew I really wanted to talk to you and communicate with you. And that's when we started talking and we really started to hit it off. And 13 years and three kids later, here we are.

[04:43] EMILY SPENCER: First impressions.

[04:46] JUSTIN SPENCER: I was absolutely, and still am absolutely just crazy and in the air for you. It was when we first met, it just really felt like right from the get go that you were the one that I could do and take all this challenge on with and really knew and understood that you were going to be that person that had my back and my support network for me and our future family. And what was your impression of me?

[05:21] EMILY SPENCER: Well, after only two weeks of talking back and forth and texting, suddenly I got a phone call that said, hey, I'm going to fly you out to Texas so you can come and spend some time with me. And I was like, oh, my God, this guy is kind of ballsy. But you miss 100% of the chances that you don't take. So I decided to take that chance, and it was the best decision I'd ever made in my life. So let's talk about some of the best times of our relationship, and some are the most difficult as well, during your time in the military.

[05:58] JUSTIN SPENCER: So during the military service, it was really great for us because we were in this unknown place that was new to both of us, and we got to take it all in together. We get to experience all those new things within an area that we just knew nothing of but had all the interest in the world of learning about it. So that experience of being together and learning all those things together, just each other and really having each other's back, going through the experiences, the ups and downs, it might have been challenging, but it was really rewarding to know all the things that we went through made us stronger. And some of the hardest times in the military was being away from family, and not just during deployments, but during training sessions. Or being in the field for months. And then during. Before my second deployment. Having our daughter born seven days before that deployment was a huge struggle and really big hurdle to overcome to just knowing that I was going to be leaving and leaving both of you behind to go and take on a bigger challenge. So it was really. It was a depressing time, and there was a lot of growing for us both, and we really. We made the best of it, and we really communicated really well. It wasn't easy, but we made it through, and it made us stronger. What would you say that some of the best moments for you would be? And the hard moments were?

[07:44] EMILY SPENCER: The best moments were when we got to spend time together. It seemed like the world slowed down when it was just you and me, and we could do our normal things of just walking around the base and going to the commissary to get our groceries and enjoying the mountains and the sunset, the stars. But then when you had to deploy or go off for training and in the field, it seemed like the world suddenly sped up. And it wasn't just us. It was everybody else around us. And I would also definitely agree that it was hard when you had to leave after our daughter was born. Honestly, I didn't know what to expect when you weren't going to be there, and it was just going to be her and I. But honestly, I felt like I became the person that I truly wanted to be being there with you. You say that you met me and upon our first impression, saw that you had a future together with me and all the things in it that you wanted. And I saw those things with you, but I truly knew that I had those things with you. When we got to New Mexico, all those things just came to life for me. You deployed overseas. What are some of the things that you remember about your deployments?

[09:25] JUSTIN SPENCER: So, during my two deployments, they were both very different. My first one was, I had no idea what to expect. Here I am in basic training, and when I was in basic, learned that when I got to my unit at White Sands missile range, that upon arrival, that we would be deploying right within that, say, month. So that was a big hurdle to take on, to know that within the same time of just going through all that training and making these connections with the people in basic that I was getting thrown into the fire and with people that had no idea who they were, not having any type of connection, no camaraderie yet. It was a really hard experience to handle, especially being in the situation that we were. There was a lot of different things that happened. And it made that process a lot harder of learning to trust those people in that unit just based on the experiences and the lack of a time to learn each other and know that you could count on one another. That was really hard. But another aspect would have been just communicating with family. It was hard because you never really knew when you were going to be able to touch base again. So you kind of just did it when you could. However, you could be satellite phone or email or just trying to make time to connect. It was hard there in that first deployment because we were on a lot of smaller fobs and forward units, so that made it hard. And then our second deployment, it was. I really enjoyed it. It was completely different from an experience of not feeling like you are ready for that. But at this time, being in a couple years, learning those people in the unit, building relationships, becoming part of a team, it made that whole experience a lot easier because you knew you could trust the person to your left and your right, and you knew that they were in it just as much as you were. And so that experience went really far. And it was. I enjoyed it. We got to do a lot of crazy things, things that not a lot of people get to do. And those experiences I'll remember for the rest of my life.

[11:59] EMILY SPENCER: And where did you serve during your deployments?

[12:02] JUSTIN SPENCER: So both my deployments were in Afghanistan. I deployed to the northern and western section of Afghanistan in 2010. And that was, like I said, a very interesting time of just learning how the military operates, but doing it in country and when there's live enemies and you don't know who it is that you can trust. Because at that time, there was a lot of incidents with afghan army turning against our forces or each other's forces. So there was a lot of that. What was the question again, they can edit this part out in the middle, so.

[12:54] EMILY SPENCER: Where you served.

[12:55] JUSTIN SPENCER: And then my second tour was in the central part of Afghanistan, and we went west and south quite a bit. And those, the atmosphere was a lot of the same from the northern region of Afghanistan, but everything kind of blends together as a desert. And it was really interesting. It was got to do a lot of cool things. A lot of the missions that I was part of, I was either in the lead truck as the gunner or the driver, and that was the vehicle for all of our explosives to detonate ieds. We did a lot of route clearance, and that involved removing ieds with other explosives or using our interrogation tools and equipment and vehicles to interrogate ieds to either make it so they can't go off or destroying them. So it was really cool being able to use all the different technologies and weapons and just different systems that get utilized all around the world. It was really cool to be part of that.

[14:11] EMILY SPENCER: How did deploying change you?

[14:16] JUSTIN SPENCER: I would say deploying changed me because after the deployment, I really noticed that I really didn't experience much before that. And to see how other worlds and other countries, how they live and how some of those places that might seem like a third world country used to have a very similar civilization and not used to live in fear like they currently do. So it was a real big experience in the aspect of, like, coming from America to going to a third world country in general, you see a lot of different things. You see how people are treated. You see how people interact with one another. You have people that are in favor of you being there, and then you have people that aren't in favor. So some things I will never look at the same, and that could be in reference to seeing a pile of rocks. It's one of those things that will never look the same to me or a kite in the sky. And it's as simple as a thing as those small tactics that enemies would use against you to utilize and reach out to other additional enemies that would give your location away. So there's times where there's little things that kind of trigger memories about that kind of stuff where doing a lot of route clearance thing, a lot of route clearance operations. You were always suspecting trash on the side of the road wouldn't be anything, but then at the same time, you literally had to check it. And then, lo and behold, it has an explosive in it. And so there was a lot of turning. When coming back to America, there was a lot of things that you had to remember aren't the same from one country to another. And so there was times where you were unaware of those effects. Like my example is driving. I never realized how hard I would grab the steering wheel when driving. And those reactions to seeing simple little things like a pile of rocks on the road that someone just piled up just because they think is entertaining, which it is, but in that same stance, there's things like that that some of us remember just because you didn't think about those things. And once you experience some of those things that have that reaction to your psyche, it's one of those things that you think about quite a bit. So I would say it changed me in the aspect of you think about things in life differently. You take. You don't take things for granted like a lot of other people do. I've seen a lot of different things within the realm of how just people have to live their everyday life in fear, and they have kids and they have families, and they are always worried. So to know that sometimes those interactions that we had with those nationals in country was that a lot of them knew that we were there to help win. Win for them and do those things for them, to eliminate terrorists. But there's a lot of different aspects of that war that are just not known, so that's fine.

[18:25] EMILY SPENCER: So what has been really difficult for you to talk about with me or your family?

[18:31] JUSTIN SPENCER: I would say at first there was a lot of hesitation on opening up, especially upon, like, coming back from country. It was kind of one of those things you really didn't know what you could talk about or what you really wanted to talk about. Like, you don't know what you want to tell people, because sometimes some of the things that you see and you go through are going to be looked at and heard differently than what they're being told. So learning how to explain what I went through took a little bit of time, but I really learned by talking to other veterans to really just allow that openness, to let people in, to share your experience with not just family, but with friends and other people that just want to know in general. I look at it as I don't take offense to any question. I'm really open to that now. And I really enjoy talking to people that want to know about my service and what I did, because I personally do really think some of the things I did was really cool. It was really fun. I got to do some things that a lot of people will never even get to fathom. There's things that just to some people would seem absolutely crazy, but to me, some of the aspects of that job were absolutely exhilarating and part of the reason why I wanted to do it my whole life. I always wanted to be a soldier. I played soldier growing up. So knowing what I wanted to do my whole life, when it came to that time and being able to share those experiences are really important to me. And we have three children that I plan to let them know about all my experiences, good and bad, the ins and outs of it. I want them to have an appreciation for not just the things that I did, but for all our soldiers and all our veterans. I want them to understand the importance of the sacrifice that those people make and the time that they dedicate to a greater cause. And that they should appreciate those people, and that those people do hold a different type of respect compared just to a normal person. These people dedicated their lives, their time, the years and time of their families. There's a lot of dedication from the military and those supporting casts. So I really want to share that story with any of those people, including my family, friends, my kids. I'm really open to that. So.

[21:18] EMILY SPENCER: Can you describe how it was coming home from deployment?

[21:24] JUSTIN SPENCER: Yeah, my first tour, it was really interesting. You really didn't know what to expect. You're showing up, and it's, like three in the morning. Am I right? Was it three in the morning?

[21:35] EMILY SPENCER: It was very early.

[21:35] JUSTIN SPENCER: It was very early in the morning. So, for me, I had a one year old, almost one year old daughter that had.

[21:43] EMILY SPENCER: No. Not yet. No. From first appointment.

[21:47] JUSTIN SPENCER: Oh, okay.

[21:47] EMILY SPENCER: Coming home from first deployment.

[21:49] JUSTIN SPENCER: So. Okay, back up. Ask that question again.

[21:52] EMILY SPENCER: Can you describe the feeling of coming home from deployment, from your first deployment? Let's start there.

[21:59] JUSTIN SPENCER: Yeah. So, that first deployment, it was really interesting coming home. You really didn't know what to expect, because I really had, like, nothing to come home to. I was gonna be coming to New Mexico by myself at that time because you weren't there yet. We haven't even had our house over in white Sands missile range yet. So I had gotten back, and I did my redeployment entry of coming back, going through all that process, the many things, the many trainings that we had to attend for a whole month before we were ready and allowed to go and take vacation and things like that. So that was a very interesting time, but we made it work, and we got our housing situated, and then I came back to Maine and saw the family, and we packed up everything we owned, and we drove across country to New Mexico. So it was a big change within a whole couple months of redeploying back to the United States with going through all that by myself and then going from being with just a bunch of soldiers for a year to now coming back and having a house with just you, it was a really big change. So there was a lot of learning in that whole process of learning how to live together and just become each other. Exactly.

[23:28] EMILY SPENCER: So we were still practically strangers when we moved in together. We spent all of the equivalent of a week together when we.

[23:36] JUSTIN SPENCER: Physically.

[23:37] EMILY SPENCER: Yeah, yeah, physically. A week before you were deployed, and we got married, and you left again, and now you're coming back, and you were gonna pack up all of our things in our truck and our u haul drive to New Mexico, which took us all of two whole days, 40 hours straight record. And, yeah, now we have a house and we're married and trying to get used to each other, all while you're in the army and constantly having to be at PT or learn that lifestyle, the field.

[24:07] JUSTIN SPENCER: And then the second time, it was a lot different because didn't know what to expect. Because this time I'm coming home to our daughter who isn't even a year old and trying to make amends with her and let her learn who I am because we've talked on video chats and this and that.

[24:29] EMILY SPENCER: Oh, the video did not work.

[24:30] JUSTIN SPENCER: The video did not work.

[24:31] EMILY SPENCER: Just the audio worked. But. But I showed her pictures every day of you and reminding her that she did have a daddy. And I made her that daddy superhero book and read that to her every day.

[24:43] JUSTIN SPENCER: Daddy doll.

[24:44] EMILY SPENCER: Daddy doll. Yeah.

[24:45] JUSTIN SPENCER: But nonetheless, she still absolutely hated me. When I first got home at three.

[24:49] EMILY SPENCER: In the morning, she had a really nice. No, she had a really nice smile.

[24:54] JUSTIN SPENCER: She smiled once, and then she didn't want nothing to do with me, but it took her.

[24:57] EMILY SPENCER: She was like, hang on, wait a minute. You're in the same bed. No, this isn't going to work.

[25:03] JUSTIN SPENCER: Yeah. So it was a learning process, but it was one of the funnest challenges that I got to face when I got back was learning how to fit into both of your lifestyles and that way of life and just becoming that father figure and husband, and that was really fun. It was a really great experience.

[25:28] EMILY SPENCER: What is your best memory being in the military? Funny moment that you have or a special story that you'd like to tell about?

[25:38] JUSTIN SPENCER: There's too many of those. But memorable memories in the military would have to be just that camaraderie of being part of a little family, a band of brothers, and being part of a team and just kind of having that ability to shoot the shit with each other, give each other hell, and really just build relationships and being part of a team that was that dedicated to an effort. It was really enjoyable. It's something that I have been looking for within the job workforce now because it's hard to come by when you want to work as a team. But I definitely appreciated that. The camaraderie, the dedication, that family feeling. It's definitely one of those things that is missed. There was a lot of great. Well, at times, there was good structure in place, but, yeah, there was a lot of good memories, a lot of funny stories that happened, but I would say just living with those soldiers and learning each other and becoming friends and still connecting with those people today.

[26:59] EMILY SPENCER: So you spent from 2009 to 2014 in the military. What was the transition like, getting out of the military?

[27:08] JUSTIN SPENCER: So transitioning out of the military, it kind of pissed me off, because at the same time of getting out, I didn't want to get out. It was a situation when they were doing the drawdowns in 2014 timeframe, and I had just re enlisted during my second tour in Afghanistan, and they wanted me to re enlist within that same year again, to be able to relocate, because our unit was leaving white Sands missile range and being split up amongst a couple different units. So that was really frustrating.

[27:52] EMILY SPENCER: Transitioning.

[27:53] JUSTIN SPENCER: So, like, when, like, when kind of like, being forced to get out, it was, what am I going to do after this? And we made the decision that college is probably going to be the best thing. That way, we can get those. Use those benefits that we know about. And so within the process of knowing when I was going to get out, it was trying to make the right connections, make going to all those required trainings of the out process. Learning the transition from military to the civilian, that was a really important aspect. And then we made that decision to go to college. I went to college for four years and got my degree, bachelor of science, conservation, law enforcement, and, yeah, so the transition at first was really hard, because at first, you go from doing something every day in the active army as a combat arms, you're always training or just staying busy. But that lull of three months, well, only a couple months of when getting out to when college started, it was a really big change, and there was a lot of struggles because you really. We were going through trying to find housing and trying to figure out our regular situations for living for the two of us and our child, one child at that time. So just trying to create a great atmosphere, and for a successful attempt at this, it was, uh. It was some struggles at first with trying to have a figure out a purpose of those days when I first got out, having the daily lull of like, well, what am I doing today? That was really hard because you just didn't know what was going on and waiting for school to start. And so that transition was a little hard, but once college started, it was a lot easier to just stay busy, focus on college and family, and that was a really nice change, was utilizing that time as well, to focus on family while in school and utilizing those VA benefits for the education.

[30:07] EMILY SPENCER: So what kind of advice would you give to people who are transitioning out.

[30:12] JUSTIN SPENCER: Of the military for those that are transitioning out of the military. I would say it's really important. I would say it's really important to really focus on when you're out processing, to take advantage of the things that all those people are saying. When you're acapping, you really need to focus on all those benefits and resources that they're throwing at you. And if you don't take them in there, that's not going to be useful. But there's a lot of different people out there to help. If you get all your ducks in a row and talk with a VA representative, it's really going to benefit your experience when you're getting out. If you have all those things in line, it makes getting into the VA system and into those healthcare providers for those veterans. It makes that whole process a lot easier. So I took advantage and I asked a lot of questions when I was getting out because I really wanted to be successful after the military. I wanted to utilize my education benefits. I knew that I wanted to go to college and get a degree. So, like, you really just have to have a plan when you're getting out and you really need to utilize the resources that are there for veterans. Between employment services and education services, there's all kinds of things out there that really need to be utilized.

[31:30] EMILY SPENCER: What are some of the things that you wish that civilians understood about military life?

[31:41] JUSTIN SPENCER: I wish that a lot of people could understand that. How much dedication it takes from somebody to be willing to do such an honorable service to this country. I feel like there's not as much pride as there used to be as being an american. And to me that's upsetting because when I grew up, it was like, I want to serve my country because I love my country. And that's just to me, it sounded like the right thing to do. It sounded like the honorable thing to do, and it's just going to set you up for success in the future. But there's a lot of people that don't know about military. They don't understand it. They don't understand the veterans or the soldiers. Those people are really dedicated to a craft, and I really appreciate working and talking with other veterans because of their dedication. And I wish that the general public would understand how much those veterans went through and what they sacrificed for our country to create and maintain what it is that we have within the world of freedom. Because a lot of people don't understand that these rights that we have are not just given in, that they were earned and they were fought for. And the things that everybody in our past went through within the military in trying to create a safer world. There's a lot of dedication to that, and they do deserve respect. They gave their time. They gave their families time to be part of something better and bigger and. Yeah.

[33:26] EMILY SPENCER: So what is your hope for the future?

[33:29] JUSTIN SPENCER: One of my hopes for the future is, as you know, we talk about the future a lot, especially with our children. And it's a scary situation with the world and how things are going and how soft people are nowadays. And I really hope that a lot of our military and veterans start taking more leadership roles within the country to help lead us back on a straight and narrow path and try to build back a country that has a backbone. And just. I want. I hope that in my time, in our kids time, that this country is led by actual leaders, people that have done things, experienced things, people that have had experiences with different cultures and people that can bring something to the table, leadership wise, and not just fall upon false words and fake words. And I'm really hopeful that our leadership can take a good change in that way.

[34:34] EMILY SPENCER: And what are some advice that you would give for military couples?

[34:38] JUSTIN SPENCER: So, for military couples, you got to really remember that you're in it together. It's nothing. Just one person. You're a team. There's a reason why they refer to the spouse of household six. It is a great system to have because you're in it as a team. You're working together, and it is really important to have good and clear communication with each other. I feel like that's a lot of where people fail is they lose that ability to communicate. And sometimes people go through experiences and maybe they close up, but it's really important for both sides to understand each other and to be there for each other. And for me, it's like, you got to remember that you're not in this alone. There's other people that have gone through the same thing. There's other people that are there that will help you, and you really just. You're not in it alone. You. You need to fight together. You need to talk. You need to tell each other about each other's day. You need to make an effort into being there for each other. And, like, my example for that would be, like, during deployments, we always, between the two of us, made sure we knew when I was going to try to reach out to you. Like, if he's going to call or he's going to send me an email, it's going to be this time. And so you knew to expect that. And you made an effort to adjust your day to accommodate that. And it meant a lot to me knowing that, like, you were there waiting for my phone call or to hear from me. And that meant a lot, knowing that when I called, you were going to be right there on the other end and ready for me. And that was a really big part of our success and why we are still together is communication.

[36:28] EMILY SPENCER: Absolutely.

[36:29] JUSTIN SPENCER: How do you feel about that? How do you feel like, what would you suggest to couples?

[36:34] EMILY SPENCER: 100% agree. Communication is always key to long term relationships. And also remembering that the other side has it just as hard. There is no green of grass on the other side. And once you both understand that, you are both in this together, and it's just as hard for the two of you, given the circumstances, and you are willing to accept that this person is struggling and just be there together during that struggle. It makes the world a difference just having that person there for you all the time. Absolutely agree.

[37:14] JUSTIN SPENCER: You got any more?

[37:17] EMILY SPENCER: No, I don't think so.

[37:21] JUSTIN SPENCER: Justin, I'm curious about how you feel your military service has informed your life since in civilian life, you spoke about the transition. But I'm curious what skills or influence that might have on your day to day now. So I feel my military experience, I really learned what it meant to be dedicated to a craft and to a cause. So throughout the rest of my life, I took that and I've utilized it every single day within all my experiences. I try to go in to all of them very open. And then whatever it is that I'm doing, I am dedicated to that. And that is my craft. I will become a professional at it. And that is my motivation is to continue just to be the best I can be. And I really like within my life now. I enjoy what I do work wise. So being able to put that effort and that dedication and apply those things that I learned in the military to what I'm doing now is very. It's very rewarding to know that just simple hard work goes a long ways. And if you bust your ass every day, that eventually something good is going to come of that. So just like hard work, dedication was some of the things I naturally learned and picked up through the military. Leadership was one of those things that came really easy after time progressed and learning just how to talk with people and knowing how to interact with those people. So leadership was another big thing that has set me up for success in any and all of the roles that I've done after the military. Thank you for sharing that. Absolutely all right.