Stephanie Schamess and Rebecca Flowers Schamess

00:04 My name is Rebecca flowers Sheamus. I am 42 today is September 15th 2008 and where in Springfield Mass and I am talking to my mother-in-law stuffy and my name is Steffy Sheamus and I'm 72 and today is September 15th 2008. We're in Springfield Mass. And I am talking to my daughter and Rebecca flowers Sheamus.

00:32 So I have always love to hear stories about your childhood because you kind of had this childhood that I only read about in books of which I read many when I was the cat. It's about these big family. Is that all live together and I will just want to hear about that. Where did you grow up? First of all? Well, I grew up in Hartford Connecticut. I was actually born in New York City my parents were musicians and my father had grown up in Hartford, but when he got married, he and my mother lived in New York went to Juilliard and then when I was born when I was about 6 months old, my father got very very ill with what was later. Diagnosed is Crohn's Disease by dr. Krohn. He was one of dr. Crowns original research patients and but he became very ill and so my grandparents who were still in Hartford took my mother and me to live with them while my father

01:32 Is in the hospital in New Haven, so we moved in with them and it was during the second World War II world war broke out shortly afterwards and my father was the oldest of six siblings and they not all of them. But various times at least some of them were living in the house with us and my favorite swear his twin sisters. The youngest two are 17 when I was born. So I grew up in this house with a somewhat changing cast of characters, but always a large cast of characters of aunts and uncles and I was the first grandchild. So for a couple of years, I was the only little child in the house and my grandparents I felt as though I had you know, multiple parents my grandmother really took a lot of the chores out of raising me because my mother was right preoccupied with my father and his illness he was in the hospital for several months and those days you could be in a hospital.

02:32 I wouldn't happen to know know so she was commuting to New Haven. So I was raised by you know, my mother and my grandmother my uncle's my aunt. I was raised by whatever adults happen to be around 10 available at the time and I don't want to idealize the good old days or this kind of growing up but I think there was a lot to be said for it. Okay. So here's my questions that I thought of while you were talking what musical instruments did your parents play? My mother was a Pianist to my father was a violin and how did they meet? I think they were both going to Juilliard and my mother had kind of I'd my father and thought he was very cute then Dash and rice and she sort of arranged one day to be at the subway stops you figured out how he was getting to school everyday in the rain should be at the same subway stop and start up a conversation.

03:32 Him and then after that they were very young. They married at 19 and after that, you know, they started going together and then they they were ready a piano violin Duo team. They played a lot of concerts together and it was during the Depression that was very hard to find work everything. I find interesting. It's not like they were from affluent families either of them. Right? I mean both both of their parents sets of parents are immigrants that right? Yes, my mother's father.

04:08 Really? I never knew him he died before I was born I gather he was a very imaginative and kind of vibrant an interesting guy who had all these business games. None of which ever worked out. So her fortunes her family's fortunes went up and down and up and down. My father's father. My grandfather was actually became quite well-to-do he had been initially when he came to this country. He was on a blacksmith and steel worker and he did ornamental steel work and in fact and hard for their a lot of I think there's it was like the Gate of the cemetery where my grandparents are buried he made that gate. He was very talented Artisan, but then he gradually expanded his business and when the second world war broke out, he got some work contracts and he went into the steel business and ended up owning a steel factory. So he was very well off now.

05:08 Is a very white middle-class Suburban, you know childhood. It's how I was raised. Like I didn't know anyone who went to Juilliard. I mean that to me something you never tried to make a living as a musician. I just assumed that that was something for like, you know wealthy people in New York or something. So I think the fact that they both have sort of immigrant backgrounds is really and it's interesting to me. Well my mother I kiss had some talent for

05:34 Piano playing when she was quite young and I remember her telling me that when she was a teenager. She played again on all days of the silent movies. They have piano accompaniment of right and she had a job at a movie theater be playing piano coming in for the silent movies and she also started giving piano lessons that quieted early age because they needed the money in my father's case. His father had known.

06:05 I forget I think maybe Michelle and some famous violinist and had this idea that his first born son would be, you know, a famous violinists so heavily and my father did show a great love and talent for playing neo-soviet. That's how they ended up at Juilliard, but it wasn't the way to make a living Sylvia and Pauline and you tell us about the will they were Seventeen when I was born and they were in my memory. They're Hell on Wheels now, I mean Pauline is calling is going to be 90 years old in March and she still going strong as you know for her 85th birthday. She decided to take up skydiving we have the video and I can only imagine what she was like at 17. Well, they were a lot of fun at 17 and well, I guess I didn't just maybe then but I remember them in their early twenties.

07:05 Because of the war all the men were away so they were not married at a time yet out a different time. Probably they would have already married by 21 22, but they weren't and Sylvia and worked for Pratt & Whitney aircraft making airplane engines and calling was a nurse's aide. What I remember about them was that they would let me play with their lipstick and they perfume and their high heels on a rainy day. I would go into the closet and they had many many pairs of high heels and I would parade around the house and they're high heels and they were very casual about it and they taught me really important things like how to shave my legs when your favorite memory of Paulina. Sylvia is that they used to take me to the movies because I'm at my guess is that you know, my mother was getting careless. She's busy that they've started baby sad for me a lot.

08:06 I also would guess that my mother said okay, you can take her with you, but don't let her see any of the scary parts are you know any two parts that are not appropriate for a little kid, so we would go to see movies all the war movies. We went to see things like and you won't know about these but these were very daring movies for their time The Postman Always Rings 12 call Mildred Pierce my right elected movies. Of course, I guess. Well, I'm going to watch them not a child appropriate not yet. So what happens they would take me and every time something came on the screen that they thought I shouldn't see they would say duck and they make me get under the seat and they told me down until they've seen was over.

08:46 Very Vivid memories of all these movies kindred spirits and you know a little scene in Insurance under the floor under the seat and then two months were moving in 10 minutes, but I love them so much I would do anything and I always remember that very very funny that you got to go back and watch those movies now so you can actually piece them together exactly what happened that is very cute that they were a lot of fun. And then the other thing about growing up in this extended family network was that they were always sort of interesting things going on and in my family. What was my maiden name was Crassus. I'm going to talk about the krasner family in the krasnoe family.

09:28 Your people talk about functional and dysfunctional families. I'm going to say that an individual basis one could say that some of the crassness. We're not the most highly functional people, you know about Uncle Bob who is married five times their number had heartbreak before it became very friendly and what they had in common was Uncle Bob the cat right sisera traumas, they were tears they were arguments but as a family unit, they were highly functional because no matter what was going on in any way anyone's individual life when the family came together and they always did they rallied and they also knew how to have a good time. They knew how to put on a great party for a great celebration.

10:28 When Bob Bob was in the Navy during the war and he was stationed in Argentina with some point and met an Argentinian Woman married. Well through space. She was the first non-jew to be brought into the family and my grandparents were very very upset as Jewish families in those days tended to be about the idea of an Interfaith marriage, but when Bob brought her back with him from Argentina, she instantly Charmed the entire family and we just adored her so she was just absorb into this family unit and she actually learn to speak Yiddish as well as she spoke English, which was not very well, but she spoke as wonderful mixture sort of Yiddish English because my grandparents talk to you to show this wonderful mixture of get Ash English and Spanish. I was very very funny, but she was a real charmer. However that marriage wife number was she

11:26 I think she guess he was number to where he was number two, and they had a son and she ended up after many years later. We kind of lost track of her but many years later living in my think is Boston and with her son and that was when my phone number for somehow tracked her down and went to visit her and maybe came back for and cellarius. Do you remember any celebrations in particular party or I wouldn't do you have a composite child in memory of that?

12:01 I think probably the best jewelry in my most vivid memory is when Jerry and I got married.

12:11 My grandparents had a big summer Cottage and Long Island Sound in Westbrook, Connecticut and the family gathered there all the time in the summer and it had many many bedrooms and some of the bedrooms had me no carts in twin beds and all the cousins of which I was the oldest with sleeping then instead of the kids room, even though some of us were no longer kids. Well the first timer after Jerry and I got married we came and all of a sudden it was clear that we couldn't sleep in the kids room.

12:46 And so there was hope not rest. Well, so evil about who has claimed to which room and making a space for us. It should have upset the applecart. So my grandmother by that time I grandfather who died. My grandmother was kind of failing you could no longer rule with an iron hand sew and it feels you know, it sounds very Petty but it really was who have a place in the family, you know, there's a lot of sibling rivalry who's going to get the good bedroom. And what do we do with it? And he has got to be a big arguing about it mean while one of my uncles that had a big fight with his wife over something else. She was off in her bedroom crying.

13:31 And I know there was some other things going on. I don't even remember all the details. Anyhow, this is Jerry's first experience that side of the actual wedding that the whole family came through with the krasnoe family. Now, we were there that we can for my parents 30th wedding anniversary and it was supposed to be you the next day we were going to do something and Jerry said we'll just go home. Like I don't know way and he said we will go to a motel or something between me and let's just get out of here. And I said no no, it'll be fine. We'll eventually they found a place for us to sleep. Somehow things got settled, but he was just thinking you know, what everybody was stalking off. Nobody was speaking to anyone else tears have been shed. This party isn't going to happen yet he ready to go, but we'll just leave first thing the next morning and then yeah, he was saying I said, it'll be fine got up the next morning and it was as if it never happened my Uncle Al went out and bought some some help.

14:31 Some antique shop that sold old clothing. So he was have clothes for people to dress like it was a 1920s when we got married and my grandmother cook this huge meal with the help from all four daughters and and there was a huge celebration and it was very very funny out my uncle out pretended to be a rabbi Amry performed the wedding and it was just an enormous fun and everybody joked and laughed and hugs and kissed and it was the best 30th wedding anniversary imaginable and Jerry couldn't believe it and he said yesterday. Nobody was talking to anybody and today they all love one another in that was that sums up the family.

15:16 You know the other now the Legacy that I've learned as a Seamus is the performance aspect of your parties where she gets her done and plays and songs and entire musicals from what I can see and you know video tapes. How did that start? Was that something that the crassness did was were there or was there a lot of performing at the parties with your know your sister and your cousin were a little performing at night, but no. No, I'm there was a lot of that was not a crass. I think that's a shame. Is that the same as they came later parties, you know, I can help you be doing the wedding ceremony my parents and people telling stories about family stories. And you know, I mean I come from a family of exhibition.

16:13 I don't mean that in a bad way. I mean that in a good way so that there was some quality of that but the actual doing skips that came from the same as family that was bad. She was in the ocean and the family story is I mean, they're impressive and it's it's amazing that you remember all of them. I mean, you know, I think all families have some stories but yours are quite elaborate and detailed and it's almost tribal, you know, the way that you carry the stories on, you know, is there is there like a favorite family story that the cries knows, you know?

16:55 Loved in particular

17:00 I can't say that there was a favorite family story. They were many many families injuries. Some of them were a little raunchy I bet and I'm not going to repeat them here. If you don't feel your grandchildren should have held on Sunday in the Library of Congress and he's very very funny stories people like to tease one another they're funny stories that people tell about one another one of the stories that I heard.

17:36 If I was going up with him about my father as a kid, he and all his siblings decided. I think it was the end of cereal box or something like that. There was something that you could send away for a little movie thing. We have something that you could show. I don't know how they did it to me like a magic lantern show me been in those days. I don't know and my father is saved up his panties or whatever his cereal top and box tops, whatever it was. He was saving and he got it.

18:12 This this thing and he decided to have a show in my parents my grandparents garage and invite all the neighborhood kids.

18:23 And I don't know why I know this never was part of the story, but for some reason he decided that she was crying to charge them clothes pins and he knew nobody had any money but that they have to buy their tickets with clothespins. I think my grandmother had complained about not having enough clothes pins one day or something. So he just took it into his head that it was it was he needed to provide clothes been through with family. So all these kids and he was telling me bring 10 clothespins 20 questions or where they're hung out their clothes. Yeah, there were no dryers in those days. You hang your clothes at Winona sings if they were missing a lot of clothes pins and my grandmother was meanwhile noticing this mysterious accumulation of clothespins in a bin in the garage and to finally it was a cassia have to do for us all about why these kids are coming Bring me clothes pins and he told her and he was just trying to help out. You know, I'm just trying to prove

19:23 Add her with his wedding I needed it. Right. Can you go through hockey siblings again? Right? He was the oldest. Okay, and that was your father father father was a hit on the right and actually his real name was Herman and she somehow acquired a nickname package stuck in. Well, that was his Hebrew name. Okay, and they got call Teka younes. It's stuck. So he was known that address in Fresno, right? And then his next brother who is 15 months younger was Al and then after what seemed Bob and I think it was less than two years space between all of these kids and then after biking Helen and then came the Twins playing Sofia the babies the babies for a night and now you want to talk about your father's career a little bit. I mean

20:16 For the record for the record. Okay, because Judy as you know has done this entire by we don't need another book about him, but my father didn't work as a violinist for many years and then when the war came and pulled while his illness put a stop to that for quite a while and is he recovered somewhat from his illness and he went back to teaching violin between the war came and my grandfather expanded his business. He hired my father my father and my Uncle Al went to work for him and at the end of the war my father decided to resume his career. He had gotten interested in children's records and working with my uncle my aunt Helen's husband Phil. Are you keeping track of its tail light number three for a girl and she was married to something you feel? Okay, but at the time she was married to him and feeling my father we're doing some children's records together.

21:16 Just writing those songs and they were recording them with music crafts, which was an old old old recording company. And anyhow, he decided to leave Hartford go to New York and try and resume a career in music shuffle time to we are at the end of the war for me. This was terrible. The end of the war was not a good time for me because my whole is whole extended family scattered my tutu on the twins went to California. We went to New York and another Uncle subsidal subsequently went to California. They just went away and I was very heartbroken and I was twelve at the time and it just seemed to me that everybody was abandoning me people for my head and loved years. I'm getting sidetracked but I want to say this any have years later. I was in college and I was reading a sociology text demography.

22:11 And it talked about how at the end of the second world war. There was a huge demographic shift in the country and that the jobs were in California. The jobs are in New York, you know that people who have lived in small towns with here there wherever we're moving elsewhere when the soldiers Wenatchee ice came back. They were just these enormous economic and demographic shifts in the country. And I remember it was a real experience because they weren't abandoning me what people did in those days was go where the money was where the jobs were anybody explain that to you at the time. I know they didn't they can sit down and say we are undergoing a great demographic shift, but you know, they have a job in California. They have to go I mean, you know. Yeah. Yeah, I mean nobody and it's still emotionally felt to me like a kind of Amanda Matheny of rational didn't know that they were going for other reasons, but emotionally it felt like an abandoned but there was something about reading this to the larger context. It was in that it happened obviously to us.

23:11 People that wasn't just your family right right now, I'm right. But anyhow, so my father went to New York and he got a job with Columbia Records as the head of their Children's Division and well it Columbia Records. He was approached by a songwriter named Johnny marks who had this song that he had been unable to sell to any other recording companies and he thought maybe it would do is a children's record and the song was Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer and my father said, oh, well, we could record that on the children's label and he got Gene Autry to do it and I don't think I need to say to anyone what happened to Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer. So why are we living off those because we use around the salary. He wasn't leave the song writer write wouldn't it be nice, you know as well as the errors of Rudolph you think we should be no living off the fat of the land. Yes, you know, we got four.

24:12 Fruit of the month club for a year

24:15 How many or how to prepare a relay a lot of pears and apples thanks Johnny, but I have it was my father's claim. I'm going to bring up the mess incendiary. I think claim in the book Judy's Book your sister wrote a book about all this claims that she was drunk when he made the report and she claims. I don't know that we've been seeing for this year. We are Bible for your your sisters claims in her book name is he dead? I don't know I wasn't doing so.

24:55 It's not my fault. I should know that I don't know. But anyhow, he's either dead or whatever and we haven't got moved yet. She has not gotten well have been I don't know. Yeah, I do know that my parents visited the odd reason number of times but we've got to California and is part of my father's recording listen to buy Columbia to California to meet with lots of your whatever and since we had our family and half the family was there we would all go and we would stay with you that we can stay with Pauline Sylvia San Diego and my father and mother would stay and Lan do it they needed to do and my mother said she not to use Wi-Fi and I was very lovely remember it was very proud of their beautiful and big Beverly Hills house and would take my mother and tours of everything including Audrey's closet, which she said was as big as the entire house that we lived in my new WoW, right?

25:55 Eventbrite

25:58 Who is your raunchy is relative? Oh Polly and Sylvia for sure wasn't there?

26:10 Can somebody have this great or what hospital is she in the hospital with this your grandmother? No, no. No, you're making your makes a nasty. This is why I will never had a family story. Tell her I just I can't remember these but it's a lot of this isn't my metal. We got to get them all down. My mother's side. She had it and onto my great aunt Becky who have had a bit of a career in the Yiddish theater and was quite a lively and interesting person. She could have been a very well into that family so I can see why you confuse it and Becky and her deathbed and she was I think she was close to ninety when she died she been sick for a while and she was kind of in and out of Consciousness and she suddenly sat up and the family had gathered round there visiting her at the hospital except when she suddenly saying up a sad up and sang Hello Dolly and Yiddish at the top of her lungs and died now, I don't know if that's exactly accurate. That's a great story, but we cannot.

27:09 We're back at you standing there at my deathbed. Don't expect me to show that I'm not going to say Hello Dolly in Yiddish. I would like to learn how maybe I'll sing it to you. So what about Pauline and Sylvia any good stories about them that's fit for the children the children CD.

27:31 You know, I can't think of any specific stories right now except for the fact, you know things I've already said have I used to let me play dress up in their shoes and their clothes and they need the movies, but I'm going to ask you something now. Okay. Just what is it that intrigues you so much about his family. But like I said, it's like a book I would have read as a child, you know about the whole family of kids who grew up together. I'm trying to think it was it called The Saturdays there's a series of books called The Saturdays and then there was a series of books about Jewish girls living in the Lower East Side, you know on the twenties. I can't remember the name of the books. Jamie's reading them right now. There was Cheaper by the Dozen. I mean, there's water there's a lot of books for kids about big big family and that just sounded like heaven to me. I had one brother who was 12 months older than me. We couldn't have been more different. You know, he's a lifelong conservative. I'm a lifelong, you know tearjerker.

28:31 Liberal, we were totally, you know, just had nothing in common my parents both work during the day. So to me, it was like that real you know it when I kind of grew up and I'm you know, how to more larger unit larger view of things. I really was that Suburban existence. You know that I think it's certainly you understand how it came to be but we have no family around we had to come back to Massachusetts from Ohio to see our nearest relatives. So I felt very isolated as a kid and very sort of alone in the world. I mean I had my friends who were very important to me but I always had the sense that family was different and could be different. You know, there was certainly no big gatherings or no big, you know, Christmas was a pretty low-key Affair. So not only did I start to feel adopted by an alien family and you know that whole story the hell literally I thought I was about to buy it an alien family and I don't know that's too embarrassing.

29:31 Sitting like listen for communicate as you never really was quite convinced the aliens were going to come back from you at some point. I don't know why a bookish New York Jewish, you know, like I would marry into that kind of family like that's where I really belong to see funny that is open water the Ohio, but I had this whole like just the drawing toy that so yeah. It's like something out of you know, Woody Allen like wasn't one of the better Woody Allen movies. It's actually about family what Hannah and her sisters or something. You know, it just sounds like such a fascinating way to sounds comfy. It sounds warm, you know, it sounds like you always had someone who would pay attention to you or understood you I just didn't know anything about my family particularly and I should also say that my my mother's family there in Massachusetts. My father's family was mostly in Massachusetts a little bit in Pennsylvania, and the cousins were quite older than us.

30:30 So, I don't know it just felt very you know, but I think you're probably generational.

30:36 I don't mean that everyone in my generation grew up like I did because I mean I talk to people in my generation who find it quite intriguing also, but it's the notion of families at least living in the same area. I think is Jen are not living, you know in St. Marys generation. I think families are much more geographically scattered now even close-knit families.

31:03 So I think part of it is that and also I think I said before I don't want to idealize this. I mean there were you know, there were fights. They were traumas that were divorce is there were two years but even that song but but I do know I mean, yeah, it gives me certain kind of view of life it like happens and I kind of understanding that this too will pass. Right right and it's very interesting because Jerry grew up as an only child and for him the whole world revolves around him. So he's struggled with that all his life and pushing against that he hated that I have exactly the opposite which is that I had many many people who cared for me and loved me but I wasn't number one in anyone's persons in any one person's life. I was served at the first grandchild and the first child pretty privilege is very privileged. They had a very privileged position in the family, but everybody had their own lives very much that they were living so I was love but I wasn't so, you know, I wasn't the center of any I was in my I wasn't the same.

32:03 Do any one person's attention but I always had attention and kind of interesting psychological and your grandmother was very important to you. And I really think of her as my mother is much as I think of my own mother when she really did care for me when I had grandchildren. I mean just remember having this feeling first one was going but I've had it with each grandchild of you know, I know how to do I know how to be a grandma may I know you do absolutely and I think I said this about you once that you made every one of your grandchild feel like the the special one, you know, I just watching you with your grandchild. I thought that's your favorite know that's her favorite know that's her favorite, you know, you somehow make them each feel like the favourite, you know, they all are that's right. So precious wonders never said about my daughters-in-law also consider that I have two and they both my favorite. I know where you got lucky and Law Department.

33:03 Are there any final questions you want me to ask I had some I think we covered most of the ones I have but I guess I'm just going to get my one regret is that I couldn't provide the same kind of upbringing for my kids that I had because of times and situations and stuff worth on the other hand. Yeah, we certainly this family has across my family is Humane close. We've had a number of reunions over the years and I'm now on the things I'm finding completely fascinating is that everybody in your generation is connecting on Facebook. Isn't that only met once but you know, because now that you guys have got me on Facebook right which I'm still astounded ass.

33:56 An awesomely didn't know what they were doing weather is going to be wants to be your friend, you know, and then and you know, Rebecca Connolly and Rebecca Sheamus are friends. I mean, these are all the cousins that you'll see in March when we have our next it right now. I know and I feel much closer to them already who knew that Jennifer back nose hoop nose PHP coding. I'm so impressed when she was out on her status and who knows the PHP code explained it to you today. You look so I have to hand it to Facebook because it in Belgium so, you know them and I feel closer to her even through her blog, you know that I do some of the cousins here in Meredith on there. I sent them and nagging email but they haven't been responding though. I will work on them when Karen to ship should probably do that. Yeah, so we can just have constant family reunions on Facebook. And what's good. Are we going to do in February?

34:56 The next family reunions. Have you thought this out of them polymat yet? Married, we're going to do it take off on American Idol great. So everybody will get a chance to show their lack of talent. I get to be Paula. Okay, that's all I care about unless Jerry's already called that OK Google. I love you and I love your stories. And I'm so proud to be in this family. I hope I can I can carry the torch on where you are or I may not be the best Storyteller weekend here. You are published novelist cup. I don't remember anything of my mind. I probably do Stephanie just be true to leave the family, which is really love fun. They do love fine with him and ran right you are a great addition to the family and everybody agree.

35:56 Thank you. And I your part too wonderful Next Generation kids. I know I'm probably going to sleep for my children.. Saturday Rebecca. Absolutely not absolutely not love you even before you had children. Yeah, but it really increase my value unless I love it and I love you. Thank you. Love your husband to write. Oh, yeah. That's right. Andrew guy. Thank you for giving him to me bringing him into the world and thank you for doing this with me. And thank you so much. It's been just lovely and thank the storycorps people. I think this is a great pride is and it's been fun to do and I really hope other things I call the funders. Let's thank the funders of the fund record play wfcr Martin Miller my good friend who was such a nice cuz it is public radio.

36:53 What are they saying on PBS and all the people like you like you made this possible?

37:06 To NPR test Cialis

37:11 Is that a