Susan Moinester, Arielle Moinester, and Margot Moinester

00:05 My name is Susan monister. I am 56 years old today is July 21st, 2010. We are in Lacrosse Wisconsin and I am the proud mother of Margo and Ariel.

00:20 And my name is Arielle monister. I'm 30 years old. Today's date is July 21st, 2010. We are in Lacrosse Wisconsin and I am the sister of Margo and daughter of Susan. My name is Margo morning sister. I am 22 today's date is July Twenty One 2010. We are in Lacrosse Wisconsin and I am also the daughter of Susan in the sister of Arielle.

00:49 And I wanted to know Mom about where you grew up and what your childhood was like.

00:56 I grew up in Brooklyn, New York.

00:59 Basically my memories of my childhood have really limited and that's a real source of pain to me cuz I have such bad memory, which is nothing to do with any illness. Just have a really bad memory, but I remember growing up.

01:20 With one sister Helen and as you know, my parents were concentration camp survivors and I feel really fortunate. Where is a lot of the children of survivors had a lot of emotional stress in their life. I don't remember that as being a real problem for us. I remember having a lot of friends and playing outside and being really fortunate to have grown up in New York City with a lot of freedom, and I know lot of love

01:55 Do you want more information? Can you have Grandma and Grandpa, you know did what daily life was like and things of that sort? Well, Grandpa was although he was really well educated in Poland before the war most of his education was religious and not secular which didn't translate to life in the United States. So he his Uncle Louie was the one that sponsored my parents to come to the United States and he had a linen store and sell my father learn the business from Uncle Louie and then eventually my father was able to open his own store with a partner and that is a real source of sadness to me and Helen my sister because

02:51 You know, Grandpa Daddy was so smart. And so well-educated and a lot of concentration camp survivors came to the US and became professors and that really would have been his calling but because he is education.

03:10 What's a Jewish religious education and he was the principal of the school in Poland before the war? It didn't afford him the opportunity to teach a university setting and I don't think he was ever a very religious man in his heart. Although he was raised.

03:33 Being up to be a religious person and he was not interested in pursuing a vocation in religion. So he went into the trades and I think he was never happy with it. And even though he didn't complain about it. We all knew that he wasn't happy that he was unfulfilled professionally, but my parents had a loving wonderful relationship and I think that's why you girls have grown up with so much love in your life. My parents never fought and never yelled at each other and we're really even though this was my father's second marriage cuz he lost his

04:19 Wife and child baby during the war they were really and they were so different from one another my father being an intellectual and my mother being a fun party girl who read romance novels that my father read all of my textbooks from high school and college. They truly loved and cherished each other.

04:45 Because I love the story so much. Can we retell the story of how they met please? Yes.

04:52 I love the story too. And that's why I started the tradition that we've finally know as Yom, hashoah Yom, hashoah being the international Remembrance Day of the Holocaust but you don't have shua is our little play on that of the day that my parents met.

05:14 They met the day that they were liberated from concentration camp, which was from durations. And my mother was too sick to leave the barracks. So my Aunt Jean

05:30 Left and as soon as they were liberated by the Russians went looking for food cuz they obviously were starving and they and Jean ran into a man that she knew from before the war. He was a neighbor was quite an amazing coincidence. And that was your uncle Abie and he was with a man that he had spent the whole War West which was a remarkable coincidences. Well, and that was your grandfather Huda and who became known as Leo in the US and they were searching for food and clothing cuz some it was May 9th, but they were very cold and they were without shoes and they found some potatoes and some shoes because people had left their homes and we're afraid of the allies and they just abandon their homes and they ran and today.

06:30 Brought food and shoes back to my mother who was still in the barracks and sell the pair of shoes in the potatoes was the first thing that my father ever get to my mother. So that's why every May 9th. We all eat potatoes and get a new pair of shoes and loving remembrance of the day that my parents met and the day that they truly survived.

07:06 And I guess

07:07 You know, I always felt remember from a young age with Grandma being in Memphis for so much of it that I always had this, you know felt like my identity was intertwined with their survival of the Holocaust. I just I can't really remember being young without sort of seeing my own life through that lens of their own Survival and being a second generation Holocaust Survivor, I guess in myself. And so I'm just wondering I guess it's you have any recollection of when that became part of your consciousness.

07:43 That's a good question when I was growing up. Unfortunately, you know within the 50s and 60s and people didn't celebrate their Heritage back then it was really important to be part of the Melting Pot of America. And I remember my parents being very ashamed of being immigrants being polish immigrants and truly America did not welcome.

08:13 The refugees with open arms at that time and and I guess we still don't know which is the real source of pain and I knew you had to have somebody that's sponsored you to come to the United States which is why Aunt Jean and Uncle AP who were married under the same Flippa. It was Triple marriage actually on August 19th, 1945 my mother and my dad and Aunt Jane and Uncle maybe in another a couple of friends of their two are both deceased and they had emigrated to Australia after the war. That's so answering and I'm glad he didn't have anybody to sponsor them. So that's why they went to Canada cuz that was open to all survivors. But anyway, my father spoke perfect blue in English before the war because he spoke 6 languages and English.

09:13 One of them and so he was able to integrate well, but my mother talked to you know, when I was in college, I guess she told me how embarrassed she had been because she didn't speak English and people she felt even in my family's house Uncle Abby's house look down upon her because she was an immigrant and so there was a great focus on trying to learn English.

09:46 As well and as quickly as possible and my parents never taught me you dish or polish because my father always said we're Americans speak English and they were very very proud to be Americans and we always hung up American flags on American holidays and my mother's favorite holiday was Thanksgiving.

10:13 That was much more important to her than the Jewish holiday since she loved Thanksgiving because that was a real American holiday with no.

10:24 Religious overtones and it was a day for us all to celebrate. What did you guys do for Thanksgiving every other always come to Turkey and I don't remember the fixings. They were probably potatoes and some sort which was her favorite food that she left Thanksgiving and I guess that's lived on to our a love of Thanksgiving Ann Arbor Mountain celebration too. So I'm back to your question. I want to really answer it fully and I grew up being embarrassed that my parents were concentration camp survivors and I was embarrassed not that they survived but that we were

11:06 Immigrants and I was embarrassed that I didn't have any grandparents and I did feel sorry for myself that I didn't have grandparents because I remember all the Kids on the Block doing things with their grandparents and their grandparents buying them things and taking them places. And the only family that we had was Aunt Jane and Uncle Abie and their two children and Toronto and we would only see them once or twice a year. So that was kind of lonely and my parents had an extended network of friends who were also all survivors.

11:41 Okay from different countries, but they just became their own Community. I guess in a way like we formed our own community of friends in Memphis, you know being from New York and being liberal Jewish Democrats finding a home in Memphis, Tennessee in 1978. We formed our own community of liberal friends of all different backgrounds there and I guess that's the way that my parents.

12:11 From their Network as well. But anyways, so I feel that was painful and that was hard and we all really wanted to assimilate and I know that Helen went through school through high school with one skirt.

12:29 And a couple of changes of blouses and that we were really poor but by the time I came along and six and a half years younger things were much better and although my mother never worked and she was a full-time mom. I never felt

12:49 I'm not really poor immune. I remember only having enough money for an ice cream cone. Whereas other kids like and shorty Barbara would get malteds and milkshakes. They only had money for an ice cream cone. But other than that, I don't remember feeling really disadvantage. So when I was in college, which was 72-74, that's when I remember people first starting to talk about being second generation. So I'm second generation. You are 3rd generation and books started being published written by 2nd generation children about

13:31 Growing up as children of concentration camp survivors.

13:38 So that's only started talking about it a little bit more and I my mother was always eager to talk about it. My father was very reluctant and he suffered his first heart attack when I was five and he became really fragile and it was real serious disability at that time on like the way it is now, so we didn't talk about emotional things in front of my father. My mother always said that Daddy didn't sleep one night through of their life together without having a nightmare of the Holocaust and I think his wife and his child, but he's suffered a lot of that in silence and other than trying to protect him from our squabbles and I me and Helen and

14:30 The stress of our lives or whatever my mother tried to absorb and handle all of that herself. I remember the one time I think you know the story. I really don't know my code as you know, I used to working and you'll point store when I was in college. And so I used to like sew my own clothes and do a lot of needlepoint & knitting and thank the night I had dropped a sewing needle in my Shih Tzu shed carpet and I couldn't find it and I ended up stepping on it and I don't know actually if this is true, I guess I should ask Daddy being a podiatrist, but there is a

15:15 Thought that it took travels through your body. So my mother was really scared and really wanted me to take me to the emergency room, but it happened right before my father was going to come home and she was very afraid that he was going to be so upset about it. So she made me just get into bed and she told my father that I was sick and she kept my foot totally level until my father the next day and then we went to the emergency room where they had to actually dig well into the heel of my foot towards my ankle to find it. So I guess it had travel to little bit. So we tried to protect him from stress like that.

16:00 Turn Down for What used to make grandpa happy

16:04 A good joke

16:07 Yeah, I mean he really loved us and he loved grandma and a good joke a good book. He was afraid sjes reader, but I remember Friday nights. We used to watch wrestling together and they always loved that phony.

16:30 Wrestling and

16:33 I got some of my Fondest Memories cuz we didn't have a car and my father wasn't allowed to drive after he had his first heart attack and

16:44 So he was right in the middle of learning how to drive and my mother didn't know how to drive so we never had a car but we would walk to Canarsie pier and we would rent a rowboat on Sunday Sunday with the only day my dad didn't work. So I'll four of us would go and we would rent a rowboat and daddy always rode the rowboat and then we would stop and grab Steve's Deli on the way home for a corned beef or pastrami sandwich and then come home and that was her perfect sun setting in that.

17:19 Made my father happy and Peter, you know Aunt Helen had Peter when Daddy was still alive and Peter was three when Daddy died and he loved Peter. That was a great great source of joy for him.

17:37 There was a lot of joy in his life.

17:41 He made us feel like there was a lot of joy in his life.

17:45 From the stories that you tell about their lives and pulling it sounds like they had so much.

17:51 Did you ever feel like they resented?

17:56 What happened to them the war and having obviously a lot of pain, but did you ever feel a sense of resentment like

18:07 They were living a life that they didn't deserve no remark about you. That's why that we have grown up. So unscathed the violence in their life and just feel the loss of family and but you know Grandma was

18:31 I really am a fun-loving person and she believed that life goes on and it's remarkable to me. I just can't imagine how I could have survived what they survive and go on to have.

18:50 A normal, you know so-called normal life without looking into the past and thinking about everything that was lost. So even though my father was much more introspective. I never ever ever felt that they feel lost.

19:14 Scarred by that or resentment anger. They both became much less religious, but I think that was because they were not really religious people to begin with. I know my mother was the least observant and her family and that she like to go out and party and Dan sent them she grew up in lunch and watch her father was a clothing manufacturer and they even as she lost her mother when she was 2 or 4 and was that from appendicitis. She had lung cancer, although she never smoked so they miss her very much and they grew up with a nanny and felt that lost but my mother loved to get tossed out then to go out with her friends and to walk through town and

20:14 She just enjoyed.

20:16 Being alive and being with people and music she love to dance and I remember she would always go to Broadway show. She thought every show on Broadway see you in a friend would go on Wednesday when they had the Wednesday matinees and they would stand because they couldn't afford the seats but they had the money for standing room and they saw every play on Broadway that way so she just took advantage of everything life has to offer wish I had a little more of that in me that I think I inherited the more serious side of my father, but do you remember when you were Grandma was sick in the hospital with cancer and you were supposed to leave and go on March of the living?

21:05 And you didn't want to leave cuz you were afraid something was going to happen to her and she told you go have a good time YouTube.

21:16 So it was a wonderful attitude then it's to look forward and not look back.

21:22 We talking about Grandpa's life in Poland before.

21:26 I don't know very much about the

21:29 I guess that's the downside of not looking back and not being nostalgic and not preserving the family history. I know so little bit about that in most of what I know I learned when I went to your cousin.

21:49 Alana's wedding and I met the brother of the third person that was married into the Harbour.

21:58 I'm with Grandma Grandpa and Aunt Jane and Uncle Abie and he was the one who told me how special Daddy was in terms of how well-educated he was and how highly regarded he was and he had his wife was an arranged marriage. He had been hand picked by the father of that woman whose name I don't even know because my father was such a distinguished scholar.

22:27 I'm really handsome and come came from such a good family and my father's family were all outside X they came from a small community outside of crock out when they were the religious and secular leaders of the state of the Jewish community. And my father was the one that was picked to follow in those footsteps, but he wanted to teach instead and what I guess would today be considered a modern Jewish school because he believed in secular education as well as religious education. So that's what he did. He was the director.

23:11 Of that school

23:13 Do you know how about how he got involved after the war with the Zionist movement?

23:18 I I don't tell him except that in The Liberation camp and Austria after my parents were liberated. They both while I know my mother went back to large to see if anybody was left. I don't know if my father did when I guess they went together, I think so. I mean I seem to recall that she did and

23:49 But then they went to

23:53 Cabinda missile. It was called to the resettlement camp that DP Camp displaced persons camp.

24:02 And Lentz Austria and actually Peter visited that town and that's where Aunt Helen was born. And that's where we have all those nice pictures with a 19 and Uncle EB together and they live there I guess until 47.

24:21 2 years or so 18 months and my father was one of the heads of the Zionist movement and they were actively involved in resettling juice and Palestine. Am I guess they were there actually till 48 when the war broke out and they were supposed to go to Israel and that was else on that was their dream but then when the war broke out, my father said to my mother that I don't think I can survive Another War and so that's when they decided to go to New York instead and my mother for probably five ten years after they settled in New York would occasionally run into somebody that she knew from the displaced persons camp with same manner. What are you doing here? You was supposed to be in Israel. So

25:15 I guess it's just a matter of a few months timing. Otherwise, I would have been born in Israel. And so would you

25:22 Have you survived?

25:26 I thought he was involved in the movement before the Warriors. Why don't I don't think so. I think all the pictures that we have speaking of him speaking more in in the DP camp.

25:38 With the Simon wiesenthal they were good friends.

25:44 What did your parents look like? Can you?

25:46 Describe

25:47 Picture

25:50 Oh, my father died when I was 19, so unfortunately, well he knew that so I was dating dad and I just wish you girls could have met him up. He when he was young. He had a full head of dark hair and steel blue eyes like grey blue eyes, but when I knew him, he was already bald with just the Fringe of hair and he was five five really sweet beautiful soft features.

26:30 And Grandma was five 1 and I guess she was naturally her coloring was strawberry blond cuz she was very freckled, but you don't know I think her natural hair color was like brown, but she was always she always dyed her hair blond and her features were she was petite and that her features were her eyes were Hazel and

27:04 I don't think I don't remember any distinctive features about Grandma other than two of us just really well proportions, and she has really nice legs and nice legs and she had a beautiful beautiful hands right big hands at Grandma's.

27:27 Long fingers and nail beds and Grandma see how strong bones. Yes, big bones, I guess big hands and you and Marco both have her hands and her nails beautiful. Big nail beds unlike me.

27:44 People say you look more like Grandma or Grandpa.

27:49 I think I'm a combination of them. And then thank you. I'm Paul look more like me. Although some people disagree or is Margo is definitely in my Nestor in terms of your coloring and before pictures. You look more like you're more Nestor cousins. Although your freckled Ness probably has my mother and when you were born with red hair, both grandmother is claimed you as being on their side because apparently dad said he died when he was 12. His father was a redhead and my mother's father was a redhead which you when we went to Israel you saw your cousins who have similar coloring to so figured that where that came from.

28:41 I was wondering how your life has been different than you had imagined on your growing up.

28:48 No Menses definitely wasn't in the picture.

28:54 Well, I never thought I would have children. I was never even know that I never liked children. I never like to babysit. I always felt uncomfortable with children and I just couldn't imagine myself having children. I didn't think that I would be a good mother and I

29:23 I guess having three children was just a big wonderful surprise and when Dad and I decided to have Arielle it was just kind of because we thought it was the right time and we've been married for six years and thought that it was time. We should start a family a pressure from the grandmother's and then one sorry I was born we realize how much we love being parents. So that was probably the biggest surprise of my life. And so having three children has turned out to be the biggest surprise and the greatest joy cuz you know, you guys are up the best friends in the best thing we've ever done.

30:07 And

30:10 I don't remember if I had strong feelings about a profession. My father always wanted me to be a lawyer when I when I was growing up girl became if you were lucky enough to go to college and smart enough. You became a teacher or nurse.

30:31 So I really hated Bludso's nursing was definitely out and I didn't want it to school cuz I didn't like kids and feel comfortable in front of with children. Why do you think Grandpa wants you to be a liar? Because he thought I was really smart and I had a really logical brain. I'm so much better student than an Helen and I came home with a 98 instead of a hundred my father used to say what happened to the other two points, but I didn't feel pressure. I was really smart and I I was studious I'd loved studying again. So I guess I thought I would go into some sort of Academia and I wanted to go for a pH will first I was a Latin and Greek major and I wanted to teach and translate the classics.

31:26 And then I

31:28 Became a Psychology major and I want to go for a PhD but when Dad and I got married and we didn't have enough money for both of us to go to school. That's when

31:39 I decided to work and go for a masters instead. So I feel like I didn't have a master plan and that was great because I've done so many things and one thing has morphed into another and the best thing I've ever done is my master mattress, and we've done together a nonprofit organization.

32:06 When you marry dad, did you tell him that you didn't want to have kids?

32:11 When we had always talked about not having kids but you always just deal with that later, you know wasn't like a serious thing. I just couldn't imagine myself being a mother know some girls just can't wait to be pregnant and be mothers and they love babies and I was just not like that. I was always more comfortable with adults.

32:34 Diana children and you guys never like this.

32:40 Reminder, did you ever babysit I didn't like it, but I did it.

32:53 So I know you said before that you think you're more like your father and you didn't get your mother's light-heartedness, I guess but one thing I've always respected from you since a really young age is your ability to adjust when things came up when things changed when Dad's job kept us in Memphis, even though yours moved to New Jersey and you just started something new you've always had that ability to look ahead. I don't know if you don't see it in yourself, but I've always seen that any of that positive energy at least you respected enough to instill it in US you always telling me to look ahead and you positive you really I think and still did Nazis amazing skills of looking forward and always finding the next opportunity and remaining positive throughout it all and that's just something I wanted to say. I really respect about you as part of their life. I don't know where that came from or when I changed but it it I wasn't always like that.

33:53 And you know, I really didn't want to stay in Memphis. I really wanted to leave and it was really hard to get a job in Memphis, even though I had a master's degree in social work from Penn and so many high honours and that the dean of the School of Social Work said that with my New York accent, I would never find a job and it was really grandma that helped me through that first summer in Memphis when it was so hot and Daddy was so happy in his internship and I was so unhappy and I guess that's why I had to create my first two jobs. And I don't know I guess it's that that adage now when life throws you lemons make lemonade and I see the difference between my location and Anna and almonds and I think a lot of it is just really working at making the best of your situation and taking advantage of opportunities.

34:52 That come your way and making friends along the way and not having any regrets. I see here that that's one of the questions, you know, what's your regret biggest regret in life. I don't know. You know, what tomorrow is going to hold or even later today and I don't want to ever feel that I regretted anything that I didn't tell people. I love that. I love them that I didn't take advantage of opportunities that I didn't travel that anything. I have the opportunity to control and that's what I just really want to live each day to the fullest but still have a mind to the future. I just think that the majority of people in our life from all your friends and your children and everyone else they really see that is one of the most amazing strength and qualities.

35:44 I really think that all of your friends really admire you for that.

35:49 Thanks. I've wondered why people think I'm special.

35:58 I maybe that isn't thank you. So you're really strong.

36:03 Thank you. I'm surviving the scoliosis and everything else. You just really one of the strongest people I know.

36:10 Thanks. There are some days. I just want to stay in bed and Nick, but I know I'll have a lot of time to do that in the future. Maybe I will so just want to keep moving.

36:22 Right now I'm keep looking forward and I want to take this opportunity to tell you how much you all have enriched our lives and you know, Dad and I have invested a lot of money in your education all three of you and in soccer and all sorts of things and you have given back to us a million times more than we have invested in you as we continue to grow because you believe in our capacity to grow and to continue to be part of your lives and we have always felt loved by each and every one of you even though Ariel was sometimes embarrassed by us. It would make us drop her off around the corner from Junior High School that lasted just a short while and you've always made us feel like we were important parts of your alive.

37:18 And that we had something to contribute finding this has been a great partnership than I look forward to the next 57 years.

37:28 It's not uncommon that people ask me like I guess because I talk about you and Dad so frequently and so highly and also when people get to know.

37:40 Paul and Margot as well and see that you have three kids who I think girl.

37:48 Pretty incredible people really loving really

37:53 With a heart open to the world yet strong strong Souls, you know and when people ask me what did your parents do to create three such wonderful kids and I always feel like the best thing that you guys did for us was

38:15 Some of us is friends. I feel I have memories from being so young. I remember you and Dad asking me what I thought about things and just enjoying me and and taking me to do things and not telling me what to do or how to do it. But just to let us

38:33 Do it ourselves in and asking us how how we saw those experiences and and being interested in and how we saw the world wanting to know learning from that and being curious about us as people not just says kids that you had to control and and managed but really is as as like having birth your own friends something that is so unusual and I think that's why I work.

39:09 The way we are which your not the times are always good are easy, but

39:15 Such strong individuals. You think that's it. I've always thought you guys are my best friends sort of messed me up. Socially a Little Bit Hurts the first day, always my favorite people to be around. I know I never went through that phase of wanting to be away from the home. You know, it's just always my best friend both of you. I always like to think that you know, I'm so like Dad and that's why we're so close, but I just I am afraid that you guys are afraid of losing me.

39:59 I just don't know how to handle that to prepare you for that and hopefully it won't be for a long time.

40:06 But I think because we are so close and so interconnected that's going to be harder for you than most kids and I just want you to know I'm thinking about that a lot.

40:19 I don't know why but

40:23 For the time I was little I've been reading books about how to deal with death because I feel

40:29 You know, I don't know why but you in particular I think about it all the time.

40:35 It makes me really sad.

40:39 I love you. I love you. I miss on a positive note. I love you so much. And thank you both for

40:47 You are a weirdo.

41:02 For the record. Can you say your parents name for the tape?

41:07 Yehuda and miniature, my mother was born in a Bergman and my father was born Yehuda Charlie chaka chaka.

41:21 I'm not the trying to Trap God. Can I continue the trying to trap. Family name dyed? It means black hat in Polish and Margo and she turned 18. It was very sad to her that the name had died along with the family dying during the war and my father changing his name when he came to the port of Boston in 1949. So Margot took the name trying to talk guys her middle name so much to everybody's surprise The Only Living Boy. Mr.

42:05 I feel so grateful to have Grandpa's name. I think it makes me feel.

42:10 Special connection with him

42:14 And I'm wondering just one last question a question for Margo.

42:19 You ask your mom about what her experience of having her parents be survivors of the Holocaust was what how is your understanding of having your grandparents survived and lived through and met each other through through that event. How do you conceive of that or what does that mean for for you today? I just remembered from the youngest age being so proud of it. And I think that's partially due to the fact that growing up in Memphis. I always felt really different. So I clung to those parts of me that was really different from those around me and I think one of them was definitely the connection to the Holocaust and just really remembering feeling Pride for that and that furtive.

43:04 For me, I guess with you, you know, it was this constant desire to assimilate and fur or for your family and then for me it was really a desire to find ways in which I was different in to stand in awe apart from the crowd. And so for me, I was always so proud and loved one Grandma came to school and spoke to all a classic kids in my class about her experiences and things like that. And also going to Solomon Schechter school. I guess I'm much more open environment for that.

43:36 I feel really proud about it growing up.

43:41 But I also found that as I got older I felt.

43:46 I guess I felt guilty about it because

43:50 I didn't always identify 100% with don't just Judaism any organized religion and I began to see more and more.

44:01 That my spirituality didn't fit in completely in that box and you know started dating guys who weren't Jewish and or started dating guys and none of them are Jewish and I always wanted to make Grandma happy and make you guys happy but I also felt like the world is so much bigger. That's an arrow on myself down to defining myself. That way just didn't fit but yet, how could I do anything that wouldn't preserve what grandma and grandpa went through so I used to struggle with that maybe in a way I still two.

44:42 Any last words before we close this recording?

44:46 Surprised that probably could go on for 8 hours more. I thought it would be really hard, but you're awesome. All is wonderful. Thank you. Thank you.