Margaert Ellis and Addie Ellis

00:04 Hello, I'm Doctor Addie Lucille Ellis. I am 46 years of age. Today is September 30th 2015 and I'm here in Sacramento, California today. I am sitting with my mother.

00:22 My name is Margaret and Ellis. I'm 69 years of age. Today is September 30th, 2015. I live in Sacramento, California.

00:37 And I'm here with my daughter doctor Eddie Ellis.

00:43 So Mom, thank you so much for coming in today and having this conversation with me. I look forward to learning more about you. So first tell me about Bristow Oklahoma where you grew up what type of place is that? Just a small town. It was a town of perhaps at the time when I was growing up about seven thousand people there were not a whole lot of diversity, but we did have sections where we call the country and the part where we called the city and I'm having to live in the part where we lived in the country, which meant that we would have to

01:33 Have a means of transportation as far as traveling into what was called the city. So it was a little town in and all we were pretty well contented. We went to a school called Rosenwald is Rosenwald school and the teachers it would be you would go up to at least six grades in the the elementary school. And then there was a section where there was a junior high part and that part was called the Lincoln Lincoln High School and we never I never got to go to the the high school part because at probably about 1959 1960. We did what we

02:33 Call an integration and then we went to the public school called Aristo high school until that was where I was in the seventh grade. And so it was in the Bristol Junior High School that we went there. And it was really really very interesting. Now. It was I wasn't I was an easy learner, which me at that school wasn't that difficult for me and reading my mother was really specific on us having an education and reading was perhaps one of our strongest suit. So as far as understanding what was being presented and to that part that was a easy easy part, so I'm going to go back to Roseanne wall.

03:33 So was that the all-black school or that was an all-black school. It was and went to the sixth grade and we had at least six different teachers the teachers it was to me. I could not picture of that happening nowadays because the teachers would walk from one room to another and just visit with each other and the children would be left in the classroom. And we would just do our own thing. We would continue to do my homework and do I work but that you know, you wouldn't probably find that today and I'll bet we'd they they did that and I remember having one male teacher and he that was doing the 6th grade and we thought that he was such a handsome guy and all the girls in and all my friends. We were just kind of gather around and talk about how handsome he was.

04:33 And this type of thing, but then there were course the teachers also, perhaps they thought that he was quite handsome because they visited his room quite often and also they would come in and out of the room, but it was it was a joy though. It was it was it was contentment time. We didn't have a lot of bites in case we all remember that playing on the playground. We we didn't have traditional types of toys and things because as a little girl, I I remember I was about 8 years old and we didn't have a bat so there was a makeshift board, but this board happened to have a nail in it.

05:21 And that was standing behind I guess I was a catcher or something. I was standing behind the bed and the person who was hitting the ball Swang the board back and the nail caught me in the side of my eye. Well, there was a big blood spurt and all of that but I don't remember it fortunately and the star of course is still there today. So that's been quite a few years ago, but fortunately and for being blessed I did not have any eye problems and didn't get the I didn't hit me in the eye, but that's something that I could still remember this standing there behind they're going to catch the ball and these were all makeshift things that we you know it just whatever we had we used and it just happened that we had this board and this boy just happen to have a nail. I guess the teacher didn't

06:21 Notice it or whatever during school and they would you know, we had the ball but we did have the bet so that was whatever we could find on the ground. So that was what we found was aboard in the boards. Are you just happen to have a nail in it. I'm having this image of the nail side of the face. I mean, I know this Garth I remember always saying it grow it up. But what did they do to treat it? I mean stitches are they taking the last we had no stitches. All I remember is that we went in and there's a little peroxide. We washed it off first and low peroxide the bleeding stopped. Apparently it wasn't a deep.

07:15 Wounds. So it was just a lot of blood at one time and then the bleeding stopped and you know, it's just compressed and I think we put a little download Band-Aid to put on there and that was it. That's how I went home with an old Band-Aid or probably really didn't think I don't even remember crying that much really I die. I just really don't it's just added it. I know that it hurt to probably at that time, but it just wasn't that I just oh, okay. Let There with Rosenwald school and being at the I'm going to use the vernacular the time that the color is cool with everyone there. It sounded tell me about like you were saying it goes closeness or I will say that we didn't have a lot of

08:15 The confusion that I can figure as confusion as to your better than me or I'm better than you type of thing. I don't recall that is much. Although there was that no distinction because the the children that lived in town. Do you have that little Affinity that they were a little bit more progress than those of us that lived in the country. So because most of us that lived in the country did not have the running water did not have it the indoor facility and so they they were a little bit more progressed in that particular way. So I think that although they did, you know, we just didn't make a whole lot of difference and we didn't really

09:15 Talk about you know, those type of things in and all of that. We just played we just was having a good time playing together when we were time for us to go into school. We went into school and we did at work and we were they didn't have those.

09:30 Real hard discipline problems. I think I I don't recall seeing those that had the discipline problem. They may have to go sit in the but they called the corner, sit in the corner. And that was what was different when you went to Bristol High School one of the integrated when we went to British store High School where we went to the junior high there was a lot more as far as I can see the progressive we did have to do more of what we called homework book report stand.

10:16 Checking out books. We didn't really have a library that I remember from the Rosenwald school. We didn't really have a library. We had a library there which was really just just phenomenal because that was the library and then the teachers the teacher said I had

10:42 They were okay. They were going through probably what was calling the adjustment. Also, I would stay as far as teaching in someone else of color because they hadn't had that experience either and there was during the time when you know, African Americans are not perceived as been very enlightening very bright and then they saw that many of us had more to give a more to In-N-Out of learning we could grass just as quickly or more quickly than their counterparts. So that was I think it was like a learning experience for them as well as for us and you know, we had a little groups where we you know it talk about

11:42 The different teachers that maybe it would have a little Edge I would say to them that they would do, you know try to make you feel that you were not quite as much as quite so so that was you know, the type of being so so you went through Bristow high and you went through this adjustment. With the teachers, how are the students? Did you all make friends or how was that accident? That's the students were there were lots of students that were quite freely that were some and then I think the girls on the most part where the most friendly there was some like really some girls that were Rough Around the Edges that

12:32 Seem to be sorry. I was saving using the term now gangster and they were nothing they would want to say some few things. And I remember once if it's a friend of mine, her name is Betty and we were having sort of a little Uprising. It was not so much a Verizon is that we would go to this. It was one place where we would go to eat and all the children with were in there and this the group of white students in a group of African-American students. We had ordered something there. It's something and I think I always was was being a little delayed and stuffing my friend Betty. I remember she was just about to bristle. Let me talk to this great big.

13:24 White girl and I said, okay Bennett, let's not bite off more than we can chew. So anyway. We got a cool, you know that we just get this chill here for a minute. And so we got our food we wish we still had to make adjustments as for us where we got our food. Our food was not served at the front of the building out of food with most is served at the back of the building. So if we wanted to Hamburger certain hamburger, we have to go walk to the building go to the back and get the hamburger at the back of the building the hamburgers were we thought they tasted good? But I remember the last time I ate a hamburger at that one and one place. I never had another been there. I got so sick. I was so sick. I don't know. What was in the hamburger. I don't know what happened to the hamburger.

14:23 But I remember getting sick and I remember that I never ordered another hamburger from from that place and I don't think I ate a hamburger for a long long time except for the ones we took their home. So we will get the ones that we checked at home. But it was it was a it was a shame. We didn't have a really a whole lot of we had our friends. We did have a life as any other place you just progressed in your own groups. We stayed in you know in groups. We had lots of laughter and fun and you know talk about the things we like the newest artist the newest songs that where that were out at that time and was an artist that was out at that time that you really thought was just all that.

15:13 It was The Temptations popular actually right at this moment what price is really that was a way back there, but the Lord price and the Wilson Pickett and

15:34 00 Sam Cooke in

15:38 Just

15:42 And as some of you now I've just forgotten just but they were you know, those were the happening songs and they were the ones that we were you know that we were dancing to it. So it was it was really really interested. So you said to Bristol had the city in the country and the country country folks have their own little thing. Where did you guys to go out? Like when you were teenagers? Where did you go? Oh, no, we were teenagers is Bristow from the country. I was when I had you not had a little low friends little male friends. That would come that had there a car and would come out pick me up and are even when my sister's they were all grown and when they will come back home to visit with us.

16:39 They would I could go along with them and they would drop me off at the teenage place. There was a little there was little it wasn't like a club but we have what was called that you bought and you put a quarter in and you got about 5 songs that that would play after you put your quarter in and then you were just dancing guys would come over and ask you to dance you dance after the dance you go back in the girls will be talking to Kevin and their little groups in the boys would be talking in their groups. And so it was always when the slow song came up who you going to dance with who was going to come over and ask you first, you know, if it's a slow song and all with the fast song it didn't much matter cuz you were but we still use you made contact you if you held hands then when you were dancing

17:39 You know even what was called a fast dance you were still holding hands and doing what they call the screen. I guess that's what you would call it now, but that's you know, that's how we did it for you. Somebody didn't like dancing. I did enjoy dancing was really it was a lot of fun. Then you didn't grab my mother. I guess we

18:12 Didn't we didn't play we we could play the radio the radios and stuff over there at the Bandstand dance and was really popular and we danced and came on. I remember. Oh, we could hardly wait to get off the school bus because it came on at 4 in the evening. And so when the bus pulled up with dashian get to the TV so we can watch American Bandstand. That was really The Happening thing because here we can see these people dancing and these were Caucasian people who could dance and so we were really kind of amazed it that you know, you didn't see that. Mostly they didn't have a whole lot of Rhythm and I'll bet that these people we freaked out that they can really dance and solo and end in Dick Clark.

19:12 Then you got a chance to see the actual artist that the that the records that you were listening to and all that you could actually see the artist because the Dick Clark would have you know the artist I know how it is your night on every so often and also that was those with your sister.

19:32 It's great. So you were saying you had no one and water and no indoor facilities. Would you had a TV or when did that change?

19:42 Actually, the indoor facility because we pretty much did not get indoor facilities and everyone was pretty much grown. We had all we're all grown and was probably away from home when my mother finally got the indoor facility and and so as force of running water we had what was called a well and you would let a rope down into that was like the better thing a whole you would let the Rope or chain or whatever it was with a bucket on the end of it and you let it all the way down and then you were here like this little bubble beautiful.

20:36 And then you would know that it was filled up. So then you would take your pulley and pull it up again and you would take it inside you had another container that you put it in and that was your water and when you wanted to heat it up you would take the water and you would put it on the stove. You would either use a tea kettle or pot or whatever was available at that time and you would heat the water on the stove and I have to time you have to bear in mind that.

21:09 You didn't turn the gas off. You had wood that you put inside of a stove and when you put the wood inside the stove this in turn you could set your pants on top. There was a stove for cooking and there was a stove for heating.

21:34 The heating was in the living room area. The cooking one was in the kitchen area and somewhere you put this wood in there. My mother made the best cakes that came out of this this Evan and weak as I say we heated the water on this this stove and wash the dishes when we needed to take a bath with heated the water put it in what was called the number 3 tub and we heated the water and drove enough water to have the water that was hot and made it this way was warm enough and that's where we took a bath and the little area where we had to take the bath and all that. We stayed clean that way when when it was time to wash clothes.

22:29 We had what was called a pot. It was a big round pot do with the pot. I still have to this day.

22:39 The pot now House Flowers, but during that time it we were put the water in there and you build it was outside in the yard and you put them would a panda bear and that was heat the water you would take the water out of the pot take it over to the washing machine and then just know that you know, this is a washing machine. This washing machine had was called what you had a ringer you put the clothes in there and it had the educated it would wash the clothes didn't have an electric car in on it at the time you had to put gas in the in the little pump.

23:23 Can you put gas in there and you have to step on the pedal? So I don't like you would pull in the levy of a lawnmower sort of like like that, but you would put the the clothes in there and the agitator would start and it would wash then you would take the clothes and you put them through what was called a ringer that you put them through the wringer. You would put them down into another big tub. And then you would rinse them there one time and then you would put them in another Tab and then you would reach them there and you would reach them out two times. And then after you rinse them out those many times and you would they were ready to go on the clothesline. So you asked me how to say with the washing machine. You couldn't put him in there and walk away. You wasn't there at the time you you were washing you and doing stuff and I mean

24:23 You were actually working. I mean everything was had to be was sort of hand song is it's not like now where you can leave things and put them in the microwave oven come back in a couple of seconds later or whatever you you know, even though the stove I remember my auntie because they had been away in the city for quite some time and they had forgotten that my mom still if we still have the wood stove and they were there visiting with us. This is my auntie my auntie Beulah and my auntie Annie and they were there visiting and they had forgotten that they had put something on the stove but they're forgotten to put the wood in there. And so then I heard them talk to all we forgot. Oh, so they may remember that. You know that Mama had that we had to put the the wood in the stove in order for them to finish cooking there.

25:23 They're me or what they wanted to check it out, but it was it was sent to me. I can remember your life being uncomplicated. I can't imagine that for some it may have been difficult. But for me, it wasn't a complicated type of life it was.

25:44 We had what we had maybe a whole lot of people didn't have a whole lot more. So what we had and maybe could have been considered that we we had more than some and then maybe less than some of the others but we found our own equal balance would be had we we found that we we enjoyed what we had. We enjoyed each other really mostly as a family. We enjoyed each other and we could we could have storytelling it was a lots of us of his cousins that our house was always filled with people that would come to sit and visit even when we didn't have TV we had the radio and we would listen to the radio. Listen to The Lone Ranger we had

26:40 Oh and it was just so excited just sitting there listen to the radio and hi ho silver and and then we start the first time on TV. We were just amazing. And so those types of things with you had the radio before we had the TV and we didn't have the TV until once when my father the local Guy where we had before was called the VFW. I mean not BFW BFGoodrich store and we had this is where we bought our first real refrigerator because it first you meant we didn't have the real refrigerator either we had was called the icebox and there would be a a truck that will come around locally out there in the in the country and they would have blocks of ice that would have 510 up to 25 lbs of a grape.

27:39 Block of ice that they would sell and they use these tongues that they would use to pick this up in order to bring it into the the house. And that was what we had for a long time. It was we had this icebox until my father and mother decided that we really got a real refrigerator and the real refrigerator was got it the local BFGoodrich store. And so then one time that the salesperson Raymond be doing bad name I said well, then you should get the TV you don't for your family. So anyway, and you persuaded him to get the TV and the TV that we had was a little round screen TV. It had around screen. I've never seen another TV like it and I've never seen enough work but to us it was like the 64 in that you would have now days because that little round

28:39 TV was just everything and when we had to have an antenna because we were out in the country and when we were coming home and the kids on the bus all that we had an antenna. Oh they were just in the old you can caddy TV and they are and before we got off the bus we flew in the house and cheering up that was his little round TV and it was on this showed us how to do it and how to adjust to know that and know that night all the cousins came the friends from all over the walk to the house and they came because our house was always like the house where people gathered in and we just had the people would come over and visit there. And so we always had that kind of

29:34 A house that I think that people just enjoy enjoy being there and cuz my mother was a was a great cook and so she always had big meals and things to cook so well it was it was always, you know, just a really happy thing. So what type of mom was granny? Yes. She was really just such a sweet Mom that she wasn't that time. Maybe that was Huggy feeling, but she was just

30:09 11 to me. I thought I guess because

30:13 I loved her so much and I was she was older when I was born. So that's why I think that I was always so much more close to her because my friends their mothers was in their thirties when my mother was well into her fifties and at that time you Associated age, of course with Dad. I mean the older you got you were going to die. I thought that my mother was going to not be there and all and I wasn't going to have a mother, you know, because like I said my friends when we were talking about their mothers was still young and and my mother was already well into her, you know late 50s by that time and and Staffing so I just felt

31:08 Close to her and she was you know, maybe didn't give a whole lot of husband. She gave a whole lot of love in her actions and it her way of being and and just I just by being Mom and in as I say just by being mama and I'll cuz even as I was a teenager and after my father had died and it was just the two of us and I never I didn't want to go out when someone wanted to load guys would come out with the little car to you know to take me and we go to the Moon teenage place today at I didn't want to leave her out in the country by yourself. So I had an aunt male who had the time to she was by herself. So if Aunt May Fail came over and spent the night with her it was okay. I felt them that I would get you out and all but other than that, I didn't feel that I really needed to go out because I can stay there with me.

32:08 And all I didn't want to leave her in the country by yourself. So what made you move away from Bristow?

32:17 Well who wasn't moving away from Bristow. It was it was just that at that time. I've been involved with the with someone and so is they say My Sister Wives yet to get it at that time too, but I would probably need it to to be away because it was like an appeal.

32:43 Part that we just didn't need to get stuck in because the person wasn't working and wasn't really doing anything. So I went to live in I went to Vandenberg to be with my my brother. My brother James said Vandenberg and so I went to live with her and Vandenberg Air Force Base and soul.

33:14 It was it was it was there that everything changed. So what changed when you went to Vandenberg? What was good about Vandenberg Air Force Base and Air Force Base in my things and people that never seen before and all and of course it at this time. I've been you know, how young girl with that with that guesses. You would say. Yes.

33:50 Not a whole lot to do, you know graduated from high school? I had graduated from high school with a graduating from high school.

34:02 That time really it was just

34:11 Something that was was different. We just we just went to you know, I was just there with my brother in Vandenberg. Is that where you met? Dad Yes, Man. Fanny Berry was where I met your father and I was so how did you guys meet we met officially at a little Club in Lompoc, California and officially at this little Club in Lompoc, California.

34:41 My sister-in-law he used to come into the cafeteria. Where she work.

34:47 And she agreed always telling me that I have a sister that's coming and you have to meet her and so we were at the little Club, but he happened to be there and so my sister-in-law one day she called him over and told this is my sister. I told you that was coming to stay with us and you know, so she introduced us and he had a scotch and milk in his hand at that time and we were talking and so he asked me did I want to taste it's catching me up. Well being pushed from the country in this I really wasn't familiar with a lot of drinks in knowing about a whole lot of drinks in and really wasn't used to maybe I had tasted beer before.

35:43 But wasn't used to a whole lot of drinks. So I tasted a scotch and milk and really from that time on really I'll probably really never hard enough to each other. We were pretty much compatible and I know but I did work at a little cafeteria there too. And he used to watch me come out of the cafeteria and I would go and sit down said real hard on that bitch. And so he would like he had a 65 Mustang blue Mustang beautiful car and he drove up the car the Mustang and we come to pick me up from the bus stop and then we just started going out and we just went to the movie we're taking long drives together, and we just got to know each other.

36:43 We just said he I always told him that he never actually asked me to marry him. He always told me that we were getting married and I just accepted that and also we are getting married. And so I think I did set the date but he never really officially I told him he never officially but before he left this Earth You officially asked me to marry him so that it was just that we were just just together and even though I just just knew that he was the one because when I had gotten there I had there was another two other young men. Why was in the medical worked at the hospital and another one worked at the air police?

37:39 But those two people they never affected me the way that your dad did. I mean he was just his even the way he talked at that time just sounded different it was different. His mannerisms was different and he was a loving type of person not that these other people maybe weren't in that way, but it was just that he was just a different. He just it was just all your stall him. They was Robert Robert Eugene Allen and he was he was the one that died and I think that was the first and the last and they only love that probably is that I would ever ever because even to the day that

38:30 He passed away before we were able to really he always said that we were just going to have that we were going to grow together and we were just going to have that no rocking chair and be sitting also will be on that little porch and we are sitting there on the overlooking and he yelling and you know, we are going to travel the world first and all so that's what I miss doing is I travel but I miss that presents that he's not there to travel with me. So even though today yet I travel with my sisters and my daughter and

39:14 We go different places probably every year but I still could always just picture what if he was still alive and what if he was we were traveling together the way we did said that we were going to do and does he always said it when he was in the military or don't worry so we'll get a chance to travel and so will be able to even maybe catch a hop and go places sometimes our go overseas and and this type of thing but we we didn't get a chance to do that. So that was what that I missed that we didn't get a chance to do. I don't feel like you've had this really rich life and more of it and yet to come what is right. Now one of your window things you're most proud of

40:08 Well, I'm really very proud that I had my two children. I always enjoyed my babies when they were little when they were this little babies my son and he was 6 lb baby 6lbs 14oz and my daughter she was 6 lb and 10 oz and so they grew up to be good people and when they were growing up, I enjoyed having them as as kid, they weren't the average problem kiss. They had little things like my son went into the girls bathroom. I think when he's around in 7th grade and stuff my daughter she had her little known issues to where she

40:55 Who's going to walk out of the store with something run time that they weren't your average get in trouble type of kids my daughter. She always add you always like to read and & Beyond in Injustice that way and so learning was always a big thing in your repertoire and even to the point to where when she was a little girl in my son was read. I would have to read out loud and he would read he was slightly dyslexic and he would get the word was it's all mixed up but by the context of the sentence in by the contact of how he was reading my daughter would always know which the which word is supposed to be with it going to be worth. It was going to be saw that my son would struggle with that and so she would always blurt it out and then that would upset him and make him get on his nerves that she

41:55 It's just a little Susie upstart do that. But my two children do very much make me proud. They have chosen good careers and they've did good work. No one is sun is in the law enforcement part my daughter's in education. So I'm very proud of them plus my grandchildren. Thank you so much Mom for the time. I appreciated it went really fast because it's you know this history all alone.