Mylene Middleton Rucker and Peryna Washington

00:02 Good morning. My name is Mylene Middleton Rucker. I'm 71 years old African American female. Today's date is Sunday, February 23rd. 2020. I'm in Fresno, California. My interview partner is my sister Purina Washington, and we've known each other all our lives.

00:27 My name is praveena, Washington. I'm here with my sister.

00:33 Mylene Rucker, I'm a 69 year old African American woman and today Sunday, February 23rd, and we're in Fresno, California, and I'm glad to be here with my sister today.

00:48 So I've been trying to write a book for years and I thought of it is almost middle class. I remember living in Santa Monica and going to the beach everyday and having the Danish furniture and I really haven't quite an interesting life and dad was a chemist at first. My mom was a stay-at-home mom, and then she went back to college and got her graduate degree, and I remember

01:20 Living in Los Angeles and appreciating the weather the warm weather and I remember going to college at the University of Kansas. And the first time was snow I told I worked at the library. I told the lady I said, well I can't come to work because it's snowing and she said lady is going to be snowing for the next 3 or 4 months. You get some books and come to work. So I thought it was a really interesting interesting at that. It was nice that you and I from Karina and I went to college together pretty graduated early. So we had partners that college. We went to the University of Kansas because my dad and mom had gone to the University of Kansas.

02:05 I had an interesting my life and my second year of college. I was very Progressive and into back to Africa and free black people at I just thought it was appalling that they would sic a dog on a person that want to drink in a drinking fountain was a white person. I am group in California where that wasn't the case. So this just sounds like oh I need to leave this place. These people have lost their ever-loving mind. So I went to Africa and I went on a summer program on when I got there. I stayed there I was like, you know what I like this black people in the money by people in the TV so cool that I met an African American man.

02:48 And came back

02:51 In the meantime, my sister went to pharmacy school.

02:56 And I'll let her tell her how she got to the Central Valley.

03:03 Yeah, I remember when we were young live in California.

03:09 And then I move to San Luis Obispo after I became a pharmacist being a pharmacist was a good job and plenty of money and stuff, but I wanted more money. I was greedy.

03:24 Album we went to school before we went to college remember going to Europe. Yeah. I remember the hitchhiking all the way. They were all over your nice. Nobody tried to rape us if anything goes wrong. It was really nice with something. You wouldn't even think of doing it on the United States. I thought we did hitchhike sometimes around their way. Yeah. I'm trying to go to the beach with that cousin play Staffing. We spent a lot of summers in Bakersfield.

03:59 You know it but going to college and finishing school and I guess once we we got up adults.

04:10 You know you lived up.

04:13 You lived in my car though. Yeah, you'll it's much further away. We didn't we weren't able to spend much time together until you came back to Los Angeles.

04:24 Yeah, I was happy for that cuz I missed you being so far and I was kind of strange my husband got a job with Argonne National Labs and move to Chicago. I didn't have a cold winter. I had on that one of those see-through kind of things. I was there for about 7 years and my husband alcoholic medically diagnosed and he used to spend up all the money and

04:56 I just decided what we separated and I had eye surgery.

05:02 And then they cut the heat off in my house was one of the coldest winters in Chicago and 75 or 6 and we had a

05:16 We had a barbecue grill to keep us warm in the kids slept in their snowsuits and I thought it was fun. Mom just quite a unique lady with all of her training and teaching it. Yeah, but she could still make do with what you have. That's so true following her Guru all over the world and I'm going to that acts from what he was so you think I think that the things she taught us about the world made us have a much be much more open-minded than you seeing a lot of African American people because you know a lot of African American people

05:58 They know Christianity. They know not going to church with it. You don't know anything much about the way other people in the world left. Right? Right. I think Mom traveling on Chapman College World campus afloat really opened up her eyes to a lot of stuff but I think both dad and mom, you know what they both had degrees back in the early fifties was very unusual for African American and they taught us to be open-minded. I remember we've had Jewish friends and they had a Hanukkah tree and we had a Christmas tree and they said well, they celebrate something to maybe different than ours and we were brought up to be open-minded in thinking out for ourselves.

06:38 Phantom and 76th after that cold when I that during that covid-19 have to do a cut a plane ticket to go back to California took six blockers and my two kids they were like 5 and 6 flew back to California. Stay with my dad for about three weeks and got myself an apartment.

06:59 And I just had a college degree and I was working some when I feel like they weren't doing what was right and I was telling him about it. They're like a so what are you going to do it so I could then I realize I was a single mother didn't have any way to earn money and I don't want to quit this it too bad. We hired so I went to PA School physician assistant in

07:23 I was really enjoying that and but then I wanted to be a doctor not always said I wanted to be that guy was just kind of this thing. I said whenever I said if he's at all that's so cute. So I would be in the doctor was but I went to be a doctor and with the two kids was really hard on them. Now looking back there. I think they're still resentful in their forties of the amount of time and energy I took cuz they were in elementary school and my daughter was gifted in was supposed to go to all these gifted programs, but I was so busy doing my career. Then she can get the attention. She needn't she didn't have her dad here. He was still Chicago.

08:03 So I was a wild time and then I got a job is a doctrine that was supposed to be the Glorious thing have money life is going to be easy. All the struggles were over when I start working for these hmos making good money hundred thousand. But they were treated the patience mean and I was like, okay this doesn't work for me. This was a career. I love career of to care for people in and do the right thing and heal people and this thing people want you roller skate on Wheels just give him a pill and get them out the door. I trust them fight and argue got fired from only thing that saved me for thinking I was absolutely out of my mind was that movie sicko when I saw that and I saw the doctor said they made me do this or that they didn't make me do it. I quit. I did not cheat people. Other than the way I wanted to be treated.

09:00 And so I was actually unemployed. I got laid off at a job in Valencia, and there was a job application to come to

09:11 Visalia and work in the Visalia Medical Clinic, it's it's not come and work in the Sequoias and I thought I like the mountains come to find out that's in the valleys and you couldn't even live in the mountains cuz you had to live 20 minutes from the hospital. So I was a big but I was glad Purina lived here in Fresno was only 30 miles from her. And since we hadn't spent a lot of time around each other I got well, this is a good time to come and I actually came as a locums Mina part-time doctor just to visit and then I'm my nephew Jeremiah was born and he was addicted to crack they were going to put him in a special home in San Francisco. Where is born it? So why can't we have him wear his family and they were seeing what he needs special cuz I'm a doctor. My sister's a pharmacist. What is wrong with you? My mother was a social worker at that particular who she was like, we've got everything the vaal the Specialties that you need to raise him that we have it in our family.

10:11 So what's up? Is she I think bandage around and a few people and then we took him back here and then we had to go to court and we thought they were going to take him away from us, but they didn't we had a picture of all of us in the same color T-shirt. We take it to the judge and we're family and they that's one good thing about the valley. They really in the family a lot here. And so they let me keep Jeremiah and life is a good place to raise a kid and then his mother Robin moved here to she went into recovery from drugs and

10:48 We had a nice daycares lady and I should take Jeremiah to the hospital with me at Kaweah Delta X on my doctor friend said what what happened that little boy I used to bring with you on rounds at the hospital so long. That's how I got to the Central Valley. Yeah, I came here from

11:09 San Luis Obispo and I had no idea what I was getting into. I thought I wanted a car I want to do to be able to buy a home. I wanted more money, but I didn't realize the problems that they had in the Central Valley. I thought it was a nice quiet town.

11:27 I didn't know that there's so many drugs and alcohol, you know, it's funny cuz we both married alcoholics. I guess. I guess we're just used to him and we didn't really notice that till after we had a couple of alcoholic.

11:52 But you know because I know my son he has just

11:59 Didn't really infected with the alcohol if I remember when he was 16, he went to a liquor store and the man told me. Well, he's 44 years old. I said this child does not look like he's 44 years old. I went there cuz he bought a cashier's check in the mail would a money order men wouldn't take it back. I told him he was going out of town. Come go to the bank and get Travelers checks and he didn't know the difference. And so I told him and you better give me my money back, but I didn't know it then so my son alcohol and even when he was that young he had started drinking which was a family Disease by that time. I realized it was a family disease, but I didn't know that when I first married my husband and not even when I first found out he was an alcoholic and he went to treatment and stuff. I didn't realize that that alcohol himself was so genetically

12:57 You know complicated so, you know and it just seems like so many young man and our generation, you know, they had gone to Vietnam. A lot of them got killed the ones who came back with a little squirrely, you know, and because I know Anthony my children's father he died from alcoholism and my great-granddaughter her grandfather died from a drug overdose and all of these scars that now they're talking about it. You know, you're 20 years ago will when you know, we were trying to get some help they were like, oh, well PTSD isn't something really real you just for making this stuff up and now they're recognizing that it is more real. I think it's good. I can remember lady cussing me out because my Anthony got into a drug program at the VA and she cussed me out. She was white boy.

13:57 My husband's dad cuz he died of alcoholism and he could get into the program. Why should your husband get in there? Yeah. Yeah.

14:11 The treatments are you know Ashley that scares, you know how they say. We're a really rich country and we have all this stuff and yet, you know, we have people go out and risk their lives for this country and I can't get treatment.

14:26 That's unfortunate. I think one of the things for me coming to this Valley that was interesting was the class issues and the race issues. I go to Point Mugu Carpenter the doctor come in here and the class issues are mostly Mexican and white and farmers and ranchers and farm hands and a lot of the black people that are been here generationally are farmhands. So you come here as a black middle-class person. They don't know how to hand you they think that you

15:03 You know from the class of people that work on agriculture and when you expect you know that you can go into a diner as a doctor expect that you can be treated a certain way. Then it doesn't happen that way and that was problematic for me. That was a really a problematic. I know Jeremiah Was bullied at school. He went to an ER Mitchell and it really affected him. He's 21. Now what these things? Do, you know the bullying affected him and actually the Visalia school district has been sued successfully twice one for being rude to African American kids and one for being rude to gay and lesbian kids how you know teacher assistant prejudice.

15:51 And I know my daughter she was very unhappy. She took some classes and she was living with me. And I said why don't you stay down here and teach they need teachers, but she said that the teachers were two races for her. So she was in the Bay Area in Oakland now, I know I used to go to Bible study and I don't think they think they're racist. They just say the kids are dirty or the kids or dishonor. I really don't like them and I don't really believe she'll be teaching people. If you don't think about them as a kind human beings that need to be raised up in the right way to be

16:30 Dumb citizens that can support us in our old age. That's right. And I find that that's so true of the teachers in this Valley the way they treat the children. I remember when my daughter was in high school and the calculus teacher said he wouldn't answer any of her questions cuz she was just going to get pregnant and never graduate from high school and she graduated from Tuskegee and got honest for playing the piano, you know, and she was a valedictorian at the Hoover High School right now and then that but but they just assume that because you're black did you can't do anything and it's worse for African American young men, you know your kids will I don't when we adults we came in, you know, but. I had to take my son out of the high school and put him in a private school because he just was not going to make it through a public school because they just I mean I just

17:31 I couldn't deal with it, you know, I was trying to work and they wanted me to come to school every day, or will he did this he did that you do and you know, I mean this little things that you do kids. Do you know that their kids are not you know, they're not as he wasn't in any gangs. Yeah. It wasn't shooting anybody. Yeah. He didn't have any weapons or anything but maybe talk bad. I meant as one time Jason. He's a friend of ours. He should come to our house and kids would eat together, but they would call each other names and Jason will call him in Niger and he would call Jason and I mean and I used to tell them, you know, you shouldn't do that. Will they went to school and did it but the teacher never heard with Jason said to pick I didn't hear it. I didn't hear it. And I know one time a kid's us stuck pairing with a pencil and grammar school and cut his skin and the teacher said you don't because he's dark-skinned. She said I can't see it see the hole in his pants.

18:31 Well, you didn't go through and you know it is that kind of stuff that you know, I just said what you're not at that time. I was making so much money. I just said I'll put him in private school, but when they talk about black people having a financial Legacy that they can leave to their families, all of these things are things that take out of that Legacy, you know, we have to pay for

18:58 You know what attorneys and you have to pay for you know private school and you know other people they're putting that money and the Banking & saving it so that their family wealth is growing and said me being able to put that money aside for his college. I'm you know, I'm paying these other people and and you know it having to go and work on really hard jobs like working retail, you know, which is what finally got me in the end. It made me sick because at that time they didn't give pharmacist breaks you couldn't eat lunch. You couldn't have a drink water. You can even go to the toilet and maybe you got so sick you fell out at the pharmacy. That's right passed out. They had to take her to the house. I had to go to the hospital and thank goodness. You were there because I think if you hadn't been that, you know, a lot of things that were done for me they would not

19:49 That they would not have done, you know, a lot of times, you know African Americans we always get

19:57 Message treatment than what they have health cares what they calling that I had you two to go ahead and make sure I got the appropriate treatment without having tubes like sue somebody or you know, it's writing somebody are or even get hurt. You know, that is so true. Even I'm a doctor in my son was taser gun by the police. In fact, we finally got through police report after the time of the year. The police report said police abuse in Walnut Creek the police report. He was laying back that he was drunk or high or whatever but he wasn't do anything but just laying there and they said hey and he still up to run and a taser gun M-16 times and they put him in a four-point restraints and give him IV Haldol know I'm a physician. I know you can give Haldol 1 or

20:57 Do when people are crazy and it was only my sister is a pharmacist and she called are pharmacist and said hey, you cannot be giving people IV Haldol, you know that he's going to kill him and change his brain and I was the hardest thing was if I do the lady that was hmos when I said that everybody was doing today. Want to do an MRI and I hate going to my Master's in public health after MD and the lady was on the phone was arguing saying he didn't need it was something has gone to school with and it's just like it's just black. So what can I wipe? It was a what is a whole thing of keep the cost down keep the cost down. I have insurance. I was working at the University at Charles Drew University and they didn't want to do that and then we did try to sue them cuz I figured it was telling police abuse and we finally got a lawyer my girlfriend who's Allah, you looked around and around and finally got a lawyer filled out the form.

21:57 And then the guy said I can't take it because I was told by the police academy police Union that if I take this case, I will never make judge in California. They fight all of the people that Sue the police and keep them from their careers from going where they need to go. And so then after that he turned 21, and they said well and he was out of it. He couldn't even function.

22:26 So I quit my job and they got mad at me for quitting cuz I'm supposed to give me to talk about poverty and stuff. I said my son's in the ICU. I'm sorry people like, you know.

22:35 And you do now find out with a minimal brain injury or brain shearing from that. The best thing is to do just get the workings going back with us a ways to walk. You know, I'm just do things together just to remind him how to get back to functioning and then I really think him getting a job as a car wash that I believe mine body, you know the movie in the body helped him and so now he's a carpenter and so that he gets to move his body a lot when he is an alcoholic. I mean from morning till night. I tried to give him now tracks and he's been in Teen Challenge and Victory Outreach and he likes it when he's sober but getting him to get sober is challenging. I'm still working on it. That's why I was in my book almost middle-class seem like to fix your cat it made you know, I had then stuff happens and you just trying to survive, you know, yeah, and I always think of

23:35 Book The Good Earth, you know how they had the opm's dance and stuff that they made in China to to take away their rights in there even their interest in owning anything, you know, and I I see this in our African American Community, you know where people they don't want anything like the young man who lives with me. I keep Thomas it you don't even need to go to school. You need to get an education. You know, you you need to go to college and try to steal a librarian put in your head. You'll always have it these other things you just spending your money getting nothing for you. No, but you're at or fortunate that we have trained we have let our children be trained that way and I think a lot of it has to do with Gladys music they listen to the

24:35 They think oh, yeah. Well, you can just do this and just do that and just do the other but they don't talk about how many people have died and how many people didn't make it and how many people are

24:50 I just got what they could be if they had been, you know, if they have been educated and sent in into a productive Society, you know.

25:03 Have a nice things about Perry your son. You sent him to a private college down in Tuskegee with it aware about he went to school at up.

25:15 Don't forget. I'm at the Adventist college and Tony went to Tuskegee and Perry went to.

25:24 Oakwood Oakwood College in and he was in Alabama.

25:30 For three years and he was going to be a theologian I now but he let you know what the things that I've been way to Bible studies and different things and and and listening to people but when did things is, you know, even though I brought him up in church in the Methodist Church and he decide to go Adventist. He didn't realize how much hypocrisy was in the church and once he ran up against that hypocracy. He like he lost his faith. It was like where this you know, Christianity isn't real and it's really unfortunate because I never prepared him for that for that side. And I I I didn't know much about the Adventist. Anyway, I knew a little bit only that they worshipped on Saturday. Although mom did tell you know that she knew about everybody. She said don't get mixed up with those Adventist people and I never knew why she she never believe gave me.

26:28 What would you call it like a real clear recently, but she she said, you know don't mess with them.

26:36 You know and I was like and now I see why now I can look back and I can see why she might save it. But at the time, you know that the school was good. He got good education. They got him to do a lot of things like learn to type learn to read. Well, you know, and he did do well in school because he did. Well, he he knows Greek and he knows Latin and he has all that education, but he

27:04 He got caught up with a you do with the drugs and now his mind doesn't forget. I think it could go back cuz when he gets sober he called me up the other day. He's been in jail. After 6 months and he's sober.

27:19 And now he was saying you don't want me never heard me preach and he preached to me for about 15 minutes on the phone. I said you're not wish I would have been able to hear him preach, but he was so far away. I couldn't get back there, you know what he was doing there.

27:34 But it is it's it's a shame that this alcoholism and drugs have taken racism racism. Yeah, because you know now I look back you remember to chill my boyfriend.

27:53 Fairy tales me now all those fights. They had Cooper trunks. I didn't renew that. I thought they fought cuz he didn't like each other and you know and

28:07 Ed and maybe that's why when Perry went to college this year left was it mostly weed? I don't know what they were doing. Did you know? I don't know what they would do it, but he told me one day you said yeah, we're really fighting over drugs. Actually, I just about fell out. I was just so sure that they were they they just hated each other to the core. I know when I'm Perry went down to Alabama the police stopped when he had the weed and he's so I'm going to be a preacher in the police would let him go there was a time in every time sometimes there's a nice thing, you know the police do to yeah, I know but the whole thing, I think they don't realize when something like what happened to my son it affected my daughter. She was a model and like she is a different person now after seeing what happened to her brother. She's

29:04 Cuz it would like black people who are supposed to say Let Me Marry white guy. Let me live in the way they were going to do. I know you people. I don't know. I can't remember if I know you're not with your daughter with her master's degree and everything on her brother got put in jail. She just kind of really lost it. Yeah. Well, well that was because he was accused of that arts and that he he did you know it and you know, five years later sure they say, oh, well, we're going to drop all the charges and we're going to take the strike off your name and everything but the damage has been done. The damage has been better to go back and give a little history of what happened cuz you just say arson like everybody know. Oh, oh, yeah. Well my house burned down in 2011 and and after house burned down.

29:53 We re built it my kids. It said just take the money and run. I said no. No, no it we're going to go or we're going to build a house that we went. Well leave our message.

30:02 He went to

30:07 The house burned down two years later after House was built we move back in before we moved in the kids down the street. They cussed me out and said you blank e blank in word. You better not move back in my neighborhood. We don't want you here and the arson people came around and said what we don't know what has happened. You don't we all know what happened. So then two years later another police came by and they said that my son did it and they sent him to jail for it. It wouldn't even look at anybody else. So you said I don't know your son did it cuz he hates you.

30:44 And I said he we may argue but he doesn't hate me. You don't hate me like that. Now I could people would tell me don't move back in the neighborhood.

30:55 So I mean, you know and I only say this once again, you know, it affects the wealth of the family because I had to pay for attorneys and I had to do all this stuff then go see him in jail and you know that he was in jail for 5 years. And then I took him that long to do the appeal and then Antonia spend a lot of time. She had a degree in business and she had training in Veterinary plus her undergraduate degree, and she just kind of lost her ability to function. You know, she fought these cases and she went around and file so many applications and files in file that I even try to help I try to call them and talk to them to find out what was going on with him cuz apparently he was abused there and I used to work at the Fresno County jail and the nurses remembered me and they try to you know, see what was going on. We wasn't math. I mean these kind of things have a ripple effect these kind of things.

31:52 And I think that was one of the reasons I wanted to come to storycorps is it I don't think people hear about this stuff. They don't hear about how people you know, you try to do the right thing you go to school and get your degree you get another degree you work hard and we I have helped so many people and I retire I mean so many white black Mexican. Thank you for helping me you two as a pharmacist helped so many people we have given and given and given and then our lives get impacted and there's not a system we can hold on to something to swing like Tarzan out of it. We're stuck in the mire and you know, it's a sad case is a sad case of events and we're survivors and I'm sure African Americans had worse. They've been lynched and castrated and everything. But you know, we're not out of the woods when I die. I know they try to visit people try to make it seem like, you know, things are so much better now and no it's not so much physical as it is mental.

32:52 And emotional killing, you know is it's like you can kill someone emotionally without laying a hand on them and end in the age that were in it seems like this is becoming more and more acceptable in our society where people aren't looking for it. And you know, it makes me want to like go out and try to help people with their campaigns and stuff, but it's just it so often people, you know, they can't pay attention and then soon as I get in office.

33:27 Don't know you anymore. I know I thought of 34 years if you want to go into African. I didn't really want to come back, but I'm married to African-American butt.

33:36 I've got heart disease and have got arthritis. I don't know if I can make it again. But if I get over that way again, I think I'll stay this time. It's sad, I mean, this is my home and do you know African Americans helped build it but nobody likes disrespect. We just pray for our country that do, you know with the storycorps and we're not the only ones that have suffered. I see more for white people and seeing how they suffered. I didn't know that they now lay, you know, we stick around black people when I was a white man's fault. I've seen more poor white people that are really I've had a hard time. I remember what you mean Carpet Gallery near tell me about the people up there and how the lack of Medical Care the lack of even you do stuff you do the things that we normally it's a lift out of the stuff they were

34:32 You know, they were in really bad shape, but it's is very interesting. They were talking today. I heard someone say it's just a people don't recognize that.

34:47 They're being hurt by the system, you know, and they think all the systems going to save me but it's the system this got their foot on their neck and it's killing them and so many people and they're blaming it on the immigrants to blame it on the black women of the whites that they blame it on. Yeah, but nobody talks about Wall Street, they don't talk about these people who are not in spend in a hundred years. I know and if they don't talk about the people who you know, don't pay back like Walmart who hires people and then the people on Obamacare because the company doesn't pay the to take care of them. We can Hope for Change and you know, I've had a decent life and I mean really everything hasn't gone completely. Okay, I appreciate the travel that I've had. I appreciate the open mind in this

35:47 The education I've had.

35:49 And you know it is what it is. You know, if I get a chance to get back to Africa that be wonderful if not call it all good. And so true because at this stage, we can't change anything that we can hope that our children will try to pick up the mountain and walk in the way that our forefathers did where they continue to fight or they can pin YouTube, you know say we can do better.

36:19 You know, but nowadays it just seems like all they want to do is get high and hope a few of the more. I think they need the history and I hope this storycorps helps and I hope that if I can write my book to do to help you but you know, you can go down and up and down but just never give up the resilient hanging in there to make do with what you got my Grandma's at a third-grade education, but she taught me a lot make do with what you got. Don't give up watch it close. If you don't have a change of clothes, you know, and I said hold your head a few know. Yeah, and I think the holding your hand is is what our children forget, you know, but you nobody experience is like being in prison other kinds of experience. It makes you hang your hair even if you don't want to and that's why they you do continued to abuse. Because he said I'm not going to buy that sometimes sometimes you have to do what's expedient, you know.

37:17 You know, but there are some portrait but I think that maybe the milk is coming up like Malena. Maybe they are.

37:29 Have a clear mind, but I only have to tell our stories because they don't remember they're jumping at the TV. They're looking at the video games and they don't remember the source story-telling is so important to get people to believe and have hope and understanding. Those are the things they they do forget, you know, and you know that all they care about is a little cell phones and stuff and they forget, you know, we walk to school. You know, what no buses, you know him and we

38:02 Did a lot of things to make sure that we could survive you knowing and they have to know that just because life is a struggle. You don't give up, you know, cuz that's why I keep telling Macy, you know, don't.

38:18 Quit struggling. Yeah, things are bad. But it's the struggle that makes you succeed if you just sit back and say well I didn't get what I want. I'll have what I want to hear. You're not going to succeed. Where is the toilet thing about a frog keeps failing to some milk and he was jumping out trying to keep jumping out and he kept swimming swimming swimming find he kept on until they turn to milk to butter and they got hard enough for him to jump out as we got to remember a guy. That's what we have to tell our children cuz sometimes they don't know those stories.

38:50 Well, thank you for storycorps. That's a wonderful.