Shaniah Williams and Amari Sanford

[00:10] AMARI SANFORD: Hi, my name is amari. I am 21 years old. Today's date is November 12, 2020. I'm in Atlanta, Georgia. I am with Shaniah and she is my wife.

[00:24] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Hi, my name is Shaniah I am 21 years old. Today's date is November 12, 2020. I'm in Atlanta, Georgia. I'm with Amari and she is my wife.

[00:41] AMARI SANFORD: Cool. Hi. So today I want to just have a conversation about, I guess, Tinder and dating apps and how they are for people in our generation and for us. So I. How did you end up using Tinder? Like, when was the first time that you used Tinder or were there other apps that you used before?

[01:07] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: I hadn't used any apps prior to Tinder. Well, I guess kind of like, I used other social media, but I didn't use anything to try to, like, connect with people directly in the form of like a swipe or something like that. And so I think the first time I used Tinder was like my senior year of high school. And I just got on there because I was bored and I wanted some friends, I wanted to talk to some new people. And then after that, I just kept using it, like, periodically on and off. And, yeah, that's kind of what brought me to Tinder.

[01:51] AMARI SANFORD: I had a similar experience. I think I used Tinder for the first time my senior year of high school as well. I distinctly remember downloading the app, setting up my profile, and then going to, like, someone's party, and then at the party, I matched with somebody on Tinder, and then I went and watched movies. I left the party, went and watched movies at their apartment instead, as that was like, oh, this is a cool way to make friends. Like, wow. And so I was also. I also was, like, used to Tinder. My mom used Tinder a couple times. She used Tinder a couple times when I was in high school. So she, like, she initially introduced me to the app, but I never used it until I was about 18 years old. And then I deleted it. And then when I moved to Georgia for college, I download the app again and I met you.

[02:43] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Yeah. That's crazy because, like, I think I had it deleted for a while too, because my ex partner and I, we were on there initially trying to, like, after my initial experience with it, we're trying to, like, make friends for the both of us. And so then after, like, that all went to crap, I deleted Tinder and I was like, forget this app. But then I redownloaded it on some I'm lonely stuff, and I just I really just wanted, like, a listening ear at that point. But it was crazy because at the time, like, that's when they created Tinderu, and we can put in our college emails. And I was like, oh, my gosh, I can talk to non sketchy people. Like, that's amazing.

[03:34] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah, that was. I remember, Agnes, we have, like, orientation every year for first years, and my parents weren't there. Like, they dropped me off and they stayed with me for four days and they went back home, and my mom had to teach, so I was, you know, moving into campus by myself pretty much. My aunt helped me, but we had orientation with our parents and our families, and I didn't have anyone there with me. And I distinctly remember someone saying, parents, if you don't want your students to meet, you know, sketchy people, don't let them download Tinder. And I look around and I'm like, no one's here to stop me. So I did it. It was a really great decision, though. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's a really good app, I think. And now, you know, we have blk, which is the other app, which is very similar to Tinder, and I found that off from someone's YouTube channel or their Instagram page. And I was like, huh, Maybe we should try this and see if, you know, there's other people. I think it's kind of interesting, though, because, you know, Tinder seems to be an app where they are pretty inclusive for all people. Like, I like the fact that they've made it so that you can meet with college students, especially if you have a college email. So, you know that these people are actually in college, and it doesn't take away the fact that they might be as sketchy, but at least, you know, that they're in college. They're real people. They're less likely to do something that's harmful to you. Right.

[05:12] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: It kind of just makes it feel, like, more secure, like, more safe, even if it. I mean, in the world of college, like, I don't know how safe any of this is, but, you know, like, I guess just for us, like, people that grew up in, like, a time where this is becoming more prominent, you know, like, yeah, it's super. It's super interesting to. To be able to, like, just hop on an app and just meet all these people and, like, have access to, like, all these people and all these different things, and then you're just like, wait, what? You know?

[05:47] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah, I definitely. I definitely, like, have that same kind of, like, take on it. So when people ask you like, how we met or when people ask you, like, how they can meet people on Tinder, what do you tell them?

[06:07] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Well, when I. When I. When I tell people about how we met, I think I just say, like, we swiped on each other. And then I tell them. I kind of go into, like, how I was just, like, telling people about you. And, like, I hadn't even met you yet. You haven't. You hadn't texted me first or anything, and I definitely wasn't gonna text you first. And I was just like, I mean, what do y'all think about this girl? And it was kind of just like, oh, a weird thing. So. But when I tell them, like, how you can meet people on Tinder, like, I always suggest Tinder you. Because, like, most of the people I talk to are in college. College. But I just suggest that, of course, for, like, safety purposes, I guess. Or, like, just to feel like you have more of, like, a. I don't know. Yeah, just like a safe and secure place. But then I, like, I kind of just tell people, like, make sure you're giving people, like, the time of day. Like, the person. I didn't expect that you and I would end up marrying each other or that I would end up falling for you or any of that. Like, I wasn't even on there for that reason. So, like, and on top of that, like, I wasn't, like, my eye wasn't on you, even though it was, if that makes sense. Like, even though I was telling people, like, what do you think about this, girl? Like, I was, like, hoping other people responded to me. And so when you, like, did, like, I think that makes me tell people, like, don't, I guess, just close off everything. Because, like, don't just close off, I guess, the people that you. That you have access to just because they don't, like, fit your criteria right off bat or whatever. Like, just because their bio says something or just because, like, you, like. Like this one cute picture or something like that, like, actually give people the time of day and, like, get to know them so you guys can have an actual organic friendship instead of just some, like, crap that ends up going to waste.

[08:06] AMARI SANFORD: I think the problem for, like, people our age is that there's this, like, you. You just said it. You weren't going to text me first, like, from. But it's. That can't come from both sides because then you're not forming or building any form of relationship. You're kind of just waiting for someone else to make the first move. And I think that Is like, a problem with how people are meeting these days is that we kind of have formed collectively as Gen Z to have these very interesting standards of what a relationship is and how relationship should function, rather than taking the step or making the effort to text first or to call someone first. Like you said to, like, you know, not put all your eggs in one basket and really think outside of the box for yourself and what you want in a friend or a partner. I think that's interesting. I definitely think, too, though, like, a problem that some of our friends have told us is they. They feel like people don't respond to them. And I think another aspect of, like, going onto a dating app or an app to meet people is not everyone is going to respond because some people just, you know, went on the app for, like, fun or they're not really invested in the app or, you know, they did it for moral support or out of spite or something like that. And so I think that is hard, too. And then there are people who just, you know, want to hook up and that if that's not what you're there for, then it's, you know, it's hard to, like, navigate that, especially if you like somebody and they're not wanting to actually build a real relationship with you. Right, right.

[09:56] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: I completely agree with that. I think that, like, we all kind of are in this mindset of, like, I mean, if they really want to talk to me, then, you know, they'll hit me up. But if all of us are thinking the same thing, it never actually goes anywhere either.

[10:15] AMARI SANFORD: Right.

[10:16] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: That kind of makes me think, like, about. I mean, I'm someone that firmly believes in, like, everything happens for a reason. So, like, clearly some of these people that don't respond, that we never actually end up connecting with, like, they're not there on purpose. And it may be a good thing, it may be a bad thing, but it's kind of, like, interesting to think about it in that manner, you know?

[10:38] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. I met a lot of people on Tinder that I like from two years ago. I don't even know where they are now. I don't talk to them, so is very interesting. Yeah. I also think, like, I'm very grateful that I, like, found or, like, decided to use Tinder. It's. I mean, not really. It's not really for me, now that I think about it. I don't really care for the app, but I met you and I met some other people that I'm really grateful that I met. And I just think that A lot of people that I know, like, in our friend group usually give up very quickly on forming and trying to build relationships with other people. And I think the problem with that is because a lot of people don't take the next step to get off of the app. So they stay in the app and they don't get off of the app, and they don't, you know, they don't go in, oh, let's meet up and go to the movies or something. And I think that's something that's different that you and I did after we left the app, and we started communicating through text messages. And I think that is what made our relationship more comfortable for me to want to come over, like, the second day that I met you. Yeah.

[12:00] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: I also think, like. Like, because had we not gotten each other's numbers, I feel like you would have still ended up coming over. But, like, getting off the app get basically, like, gave more room because nine times out of 10, had we stayed on the app, I would have responded, like, weeks later or something like that, you know, like, I wasn't, like, consistently on it ever. So but with us, like, getting off the app and then I guess you saying, like, you know, like, let's hang out, that was the first time somebody really was trying to actually, like, hang out right off bat. And, like, I felt more comfortable. One, because, like, I saw you into Agnes Scott, which I had, I guess, just found out about, because I was trying to figure out what ASC mint on Tinder for your little, like, little box. So I looked it up, and, like, I found out, like, where you were, and it said you were three miles away. And I was like, oh, my gosh, like, this is entirely accessible, and I have a car, like, you know, like, I can't wait to, like, go and, like, get her. Especially because I was in a really, like, low state at that point. So I really was just, like, looking forward to connect with. With, like, different people than what I had been dealing with for my whole life. Because we grew up around the same being in, you know, middle and high school. So I think. I think that was, like. I think that was, like, a very vital step, without a doubt, even, like, for our reasons to come over. Like, we decided you were coming over so we could cuddle, and that's, like, all we decided about. And, like, it wasn't, like, code anything. Like, we meant that, like, we wanted to watch movies and cuddle and, like, that it's great in itself. But, like, I mean, I think the only thing you have to worry about is, like, how sketchy that is. I mean, before we got in my bed, you asked me, like, you're not gonna murder me, are you? And I was looking at you like, girl, why would I do that? You know? Like. But yeah, like, definitely. Definitely a vital step. And then, I mean, that led to everything else. Like, I just wanted to keep seeing you. So.

[14:08] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah.

[14:10] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Yeah.

[14:11] AMARI SANFORD: Well, even, like. Even when we went to California for this, for the summer, and you were trying to make friends, like, on Tinder, what do you think was the difference? Because I know that you struggled with, like, not making friends, but, like, leaving the app to, like, strengthen your relationship with them, and you ended up not talking to them. So, like, what do you think the difference was between, like, California and Georgia in terms of who you were trying to communicate with?

[14:41] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: I think in Georgia, even though I had technically I had less time, I still felt like I had more time because, like, I had, like, a very, very structured schedule. Like, I was going to class from this time to this time. I was going to work from this time to this time. This is my free time. These are my off days. This is my free time. And also, like, I'm from here, born and raised. So, like, if someone says, like, oh, I'm from the west side, Like, I mean, not to be, like, stereotypical or anything, but that makes me more skeptical. Like, who am I about to meet? You know, like, do I actually want to meet them? Versus, like, if somebody says I'm from the east side, I'm like, oh, I grew up on the east side. Like, let's. Let's link, you know, like, let's hang out. Or, like, I went to so and so high school in DeKalb county, and I'm like, oh, my gosh, like, we have to, you know, talk some more. But when I guess in California, the one thing I did struggle with heavily is, like, it's a completely different vibe of, like, people out there. So even though I was meeting some, like, great people, like, or who I thought was great, like, I have always had issues, like, picking up on, like, the subtleties that are probably negative. And I think that I was trying to keep my distance enough so I didn't end up doing anything dumb while I was out there. Like, it would suck to be 2,400 miles away from home and everybody I know, everybody I love, and, like, be there with just your family and your friends, and something, like, dumb happens. That's, like, something that you guys have to worry about, you know, while we're out there. Like, Having a great time. But then also in California, I didn't. I had more time to do other things. But between the two of us, like, our schedules are just really busy. Like, four classes online. The deadline is three hours before the normal deadline because we're three to four hours back, you know, with the time zones. And then working two jobs. And then you had your two jobs, which were. One of them was different from my other job. And, you know, like, I just. I don't know. In that time, especially being in a place where you were a bit more vulnerable because we were in your hometown, in your home state where you grew up and, like, lived your life or whatever, and I was around all of your people. Like, I felt like it was. I tried more. I tried to spend more time with you. Like, I tried to be out there with you and, like, use that as a chance to, like, definitely get to know you more and confirm, like, how I was really feeling about you. And so I think that was kind of, like, the difference. Plus, at that point, like, I think you told me, like, some of these people are sketchy, like, don't go for everything that people are just telling you. And the one person that I did get the number of, we actually made plans, but then we ended up going on a random trip with one of your parents, so we never got to meet her. And then we ended up leaving, like, late. But then also the wedding. The wedding ended up happening. And that was the day that we were supposed to hang out. And so. And we were gonna do, like, a couple thing, and it was gonna be cute or whatever, but we didn't do it. And so I haven't hit her up since. Probably since like a month after we were. We came back to Georgia. But, like, that. Those are kind of, like, my setbacks there, I guess. Oh. Plus, people were kind of far. And, like, we needed to save gas money. Gas is so expensive in California, it's ridiculous.

[18:09] AMARI SANFORD: It is.

[18:12] SPEAKER C: Do you mind? Could you explain? What's the wedding thing?

[18:16] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Oh, so we got married. Like, we got married in California. Like, kind of spur of moment question.

[18:26] AMARI SANFORD: Like, explain. Okay, so, like, my. My parents. Well, I'm from California, so my parents have this tradition. We go up to Lake Tahoe or in that general area, like we used to go every year. And so it was her first time meeting my family. And I have three moms. And so we decided. The two of them decided to go up there around the same time, like, back to back. And so one of my moms, Rondi, she was like. We went with my older brother and his girlfriend. And she said, you know, we're really close to Nevada or Reno. You guys should go get married. You guys can witness each other in each other's weddings. Like, let's go do it. And we were all, like. We all, like, looked at each other in the back of the car. No, we're not doing that. So then we go back home, and like, a couple days later, we go back to Tahoe, and it comes up again with a different mom. And so we're like, maybe. Maybe we should talk about this. Like, why not? And Shania's mom, we, like, talked. She talked to her mom, and we were, like, trying to figure out, is this the right thing to do? And, like, my. My parents have never really met anybody that I have ever dated before, because my parents are crazy in my opinion, but they're not. And so I never tried to, like, intertwine my. Outside of my home relationships. And so my biological mother met and, like, loved her, and his only loved her and nobody else that I've ever introduced her to. And my mom was.

[20:10] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: I was gonna say she gave me a kiss on my cheek.

[20:15] AMARI SANFORD: In the hospital with cancer. So we were. And we were thinking that she was going to pass away before we left for Georgia. So we were thinking maybe we should get married so that she could be there for that. Yeah.

[20:31] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: And then, like, we are kind of standing, like, on the pier one day at the lake, and we were kind of just like, like, how realistic is this? Like, is this something, like, you know, we're ready for? Like, that's such a big step. Like, that's such a huge. And, like, nobody that, like, none of my people are out here. I'm my mom's only child. Like, nobody's here for me, you know? Like. But I think that one thing we've kind of. I guess, like, we, like, our initial connection wasn't just about, like, our conversation and, like, about, like, the physical aspects at all. Like, we definitely bonded, like, spiritually first. And I don't mean spiritually as in, like, religiously. I mean, like, spiritually as in, like, we were, like, reaching each other's souls before anything else. And so I think, like, we knew what our end goal was from jump, but of course, at, what, 19 years old? Like, that's not something that we're trying to, like, think about right off that, like, I'm trying to finish undergrad, I'm trying to pay my bills. But I think that we just knew that, like, our end goal is going to be we're going to be partners. Like, I want you to be my life partner. I'm not doing this crap with anybody else. Like, I literally simply don't want to, you know, And I think, like, having the realization and then being able to say, like, f everybody else, you know, like, other people's opinions don't. Don't matter. So what? You're 19. So what? You're, you know, gay. So what? You're. You can barely, you know, keep up with your bills right now. So what? You're in undergrad. Like, so what? Your family's traditional, and they don't want to hear the gay thing or the fact that you're getting married at this young age. Like, nobody, like, cares. Like, they do care, but, like, that's not for me to care about because guess what? I love you. Like, and it's the simple fact, you know, and, like, because of, like, how deeply, like, rooted it was, even though it took such a short amount of time to get that deeply rooted. Like, I think that was something that we just decided. Like, we looked at each other and we were just like, yeah, like, is this what we're doing? Like, yeah, this is what we're doing. You know? And, like, once we confirmed it, like, I think we were, like, all really just excited for it. And I think telling people about it was also a great experience. It was a great experience.

[23:00] AMARI SANFORD: Like, we FaceTimed my siblings, and they all, like, were very shocked, and they made their shocked faces. And remember, we FaceTime Aubrey. And Aubrey was like, oh, my gosh. And it was just. It was really great. And I think, overall, like, it was. It was. Thinking back, it's hilarious because it was such a us kind of, like, ceremony. Like, even down to the fact that my job catered for the wedding, like, yeah, that's just so funny to me that, like, we got food. Like, I went to work and, you know, we got food. Like, we bought our rings in the mall that I worked at. It was very.

[23:39] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: We bought our outfits in the mall that you worked in.

[23:43] AMARI SANFORD: It's just very silly to me. Like, and so it's kind of like, that is what I think of when I think of someone getting married at, like, 19, 20 years old. I.

[23:53] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Who.

[23:53] AMARI SANFORD: Who's gonna throw, like, a huge wedding and get, like, a really expensive wedding dress? Like, I mean, I'm looking at the dress I wore right now. You know, it's a basic, like, $20 dress.

[24:03] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Yeah.

[24:04] AMARI SANFORD: It's black and it's cute, and I can wear it anywhere else, you know, and another Very interesting thing about this is, like, we hadn't even known each other an entire year yet. It had been six months since we'd officially been in a relationship. And so that is the truth. I just think that's very interesting. And I think, like, that is why I do support people using Tinder. You know, like, you can actually meet some amazing people and you don't have to be looking for, like, a romantic relationship. Like, even, you know, I made. We both have made friends in the past, like, month that are platonic. And like, that came from a dating app too. So I think. I just think that it's like really great to able to one day tell our children, oh, yeah, we met on Tinder. Like, we like some form of web communication. We didn't meet in person. We didn't meet in a coffee shop.

[25:03] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Right. And it's also cool because you and I have met on Tinder. It's given at least our inner circle a chance to actually get on there too and see what they can find. Like, I mean, like, Ty, you know, that's my best friend. Like, I was like, you know, you should try, like, just get on there. She met her girlfriend and, like, they just proposed to each other. Like, that is so beautiful to me. Like, that is so beautiful to me that, like an app, like a sketchy app, can just, you know, like, bring people together in like such a beautiful way. Even if it is platonic. Like, yeah, yeah. Absolutely amazing.

[25:44] AMARI SANFORD: It is I think also just like just even just moving away from Tinder. Like, I think it's just really great how based like on like just being able to meet new people, especially during this time. Like, I feel like right now these apps where we can meet people are really helping because, I mean, we've been in the house for a really long time. We've been distancing ourselves from a lot of people. We haven't seen, seen all of our friends. We haven't, you know, so it's. It's nice to. And like being in school right now is really hard. So it's nice to like, get a break and go hang out with someone new or, you know, like, meet somebody new and form that connection over, like FaceTime and through text message and hopefully one day we'll see them when, you know, Covid's not as big as it is or, you know, we'll get test and they'll get a test and we can hang out with each other. Just things like that that I'm really grateful for now. So I'm not like Just talking to the same two people every day that I've been talking to for the past six months. So it's just nice to be able to, like, have difference in my life right now and change and really grasping that.

[26:58] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: It's also kind of funny because, honestly, like, we've kind of had two different experiences with, like, you know, being on other medias now trying to meet new people. Like, I haven't really had much luck meeting people that I, like, actually would like to continue talking to or, like, I feel like I'm in the same boat. Is like, a lot of our friends were in with Tinder. You know, like, it's kind of interesting to see. Like, okay, maybe it's because now, like, I'm sitting here, like, looking for new people to talk to, you know, Whereas before, I wasn't looking for anything. I was just on there because I was on there, you know, and you fell into my lap, literally. Like. And so it's. I think now, like, it's kind of interesting because, you know, like, there can be two different people. Like, you know, we have two completely different experiences, like, on the same app, you know, and I guess you're just trying to, like, escape that kind of, like, box of, like, this is what I'm looking for, you know, it's kind of, like, difficult, too. So in turn, like, it can be, like, a really positive thing if you actually find people, but then it can be. It can start to feel more like, blah when, you know, you don't really find anybody. And that's, you know, your whole purpose of going on there. And now, two months later, I'm still sitting here with hardly anyone that I've met. Knew that. It's like, you know, worth. Worth, Really, I don't know, trying to continue with.

[28:36] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah, I think it's interesting, like, I've had the kind of the opposite experience for the most part. Well, I mean, sort of. I found one person, but, like, I remember when I first started, like, using BLK to, like, meet other people. I, like, was talking to, like, multiple people throughout the day. But then, like, slowly as the week went on, like, I stopped speaking to them. Like, we don't talk to each other anymore. And it's funny because, like, I don't even use the app anymore. Like, it's still on my phone, and I'll get the notifications from time to time, but, like, I kind of just ignore it at this point. I'm not really interested in, like, trying to form more connections with people because it's kind of time Consuming and draining in a sense, you know.

[29:20] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Yeah, that's also interesting because I think that has a lot to do with like, our two characters. Like, you do get drained by like, other people way more easy than like, I do. And so, like, I'm on there all day long, like, trying to check the notifications and stuff. And like, these people are responding just so, just like, oh my gosh, what are you guys, you know, like, what are you guys even doing? And like, I would rather there'd be like, I don't know, I'd rather find one, one or two people, you know, but clearly that's not working. So I'm like, I don't. I haven't yet had a chance to like, let all those other people wither away. Like, as people are withering, like more people are coming in, like wafting in. And it's. I mean, I don't really know how beneficial that is either. But you know, like, it kind of like charges me up in a sense to be able to talk to some new people finally. But then like, I'm someone that longs for like, like deep connection and like, like genuineness and like, long lasting things. Like, I hate temporary, super temporary things, you know? So. Yeah, can.

[30:30] SPEAKER C: Can I ask you both, in the time we have, love, could you talk to each other about how y'all first met? I mean, you talked about, you know, meeting and swiping and who's going to reach out to who, but just the act, the actual meeting and stalking.

[30:42] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Yeah, you go ahead.

[30:48] AMARI SANFORD: So, well, let's see. I. So we decided.

[30:53] SPEAKER C: I'm sorry, if you could just talk to each other. So like, just like you're talking to each other.

[30:58] AMARI SANFORD: Okay, well. Okay, well, I think that I'm kind of surprised that I agreed to like, meet with you. The day that I did. It was like my mom was leaving, I had like a migraine and I had made plans to go out. And then like, I kind of was just like, oh, I'll let me see what you're doing tonight. You know, like, I'm. Like you said previously, like, I get drained by people. So going out was not really what I was interested in doing. So the fact that you were like, okay with me coming over and like spending the night was like, great, because I was like, okay, I have something new to do. You know, I've been in Georgia for I think two weeks and I just was not having it. And so I remember not knowing anything about where I was going, getting an Uber. And like, I think it was like 8:45. And I, like, went to your apartment, and I didn't. You would. You gave me the directions, and I completely ignored them, and I had no idea where I was. And so I remember my driver, she went around, like, the back side, and then you came out, and we were, like, trying to figure out where you were. And she was like, well, I'm not going to, like, leave you because I don't see who you're meeting, and I don't want anything to happen to you, so I'm going to wait until, like, I know that you have met who you're meeting. So that was really sweet of her to do. So. Then I remember I finally saw you, and you were so much shorter than I thought you were. You were so short. And I was like, who is this short girl all out? And I was like, what is going on?

[32:47] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Yeah. And I think, like, on my end, like, I had just had someone over, like, literally 15, 20 minutes before you. And, like, it was a man. And I was like, I don't know. We were just vibing and chilling and stuff. And I. Then I was kind of. But I was, like, more nervous about, like, the meeting you part because of, like, how we hit it off when we were texting. But then also, like, we said you were coming over to cuddle. And I was like, I never, like, had physical contact with someone like that. Like, right off that, you know, like, that's something that's, like, cuddling for me, like, super intimate. So I was like, okay, like, you know, this is a new experience. I'm definitely willing to try it, especially with this, like, woman. Like, you know, and so I was like, all right. So, like, he leaves or whatever, and then you're like, I'm on the way. And, like, my heart starts racing. Like, I'm like, oh, my gosh. Like, what does this mean? Like, I don't. I hope she doesn't, like, you feel me? Like, I hope, like, my awful roommates don't do something or, you know, like, something doesn't, you know, go wrong or, like, I don't know, I hope my room smells good. Like, you know, like, stuff like that. Like, I didn't want it to be. Like, I didn't want you to come in there and be like, oh, ew. Like, you know, like. And, like, abort the mission immediately. So when I came down the stairs and I saw the white car, I was like, okay, that must be her. And so I was just like, can I wave? You know? And I was like, okay, well, I don't know. I'm just gonna stand here and wait. And you got out the car, and you had on, like, you had, like, colorful hair. And I was like, that's interesting. And, like, I immediately thought to myself, like, oh, my gosh, you look like Sza. Like, you look like Sza. And I was like, but I didn't tell you that yet. I waited till we got upstairs, but I don't know, I think. I think, like, when I saw you, I didn't really know what to expect, so I didn't have any expectations because most of your pictures on your. On your Tinder, your face was covered. And so when I saw you, I was like, oh, my gosh, she's actually really gorgeous. But I didn't quite get to, like, observe you until we were upstairs and sitting on my floor and, like, actually, I mean, not really interacting. I remember walking up the stairs, though, and I was like, watch your step, because there's one step that's higher than all the others.

[35:17] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah.

[35:18] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: And, like, I thought about, like, letting you trip and, like, catching you just to be, like, a head ass. But then, like, I didn't. So.

[35:28] AMARI SANFORD: No, you grabbed my hand instead.

[35:30] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Oh, yeah.

[35:31] AMARI SANFORD: And you told me you're like, watch your step. And then I was like, what? And then you just grabbed my hand so I didn't fall. That was funny. I also. I remember distinctly remember you wearing your panda socks that you have with, like, the. The toes are pandas, and then the rest are, like, rainbow. And I was like, why? What? You're wearing, like, a white shirt, those pink shorts that you have with, like, the yellow things on them in your panda socks. And I was like, what is going on? Like, because in my mind, I would never invite somebody over to my house and wear, like, my pajamas or, like, my loungewear. Like, now I do, because you made me more comfortable to do that. But, you know, like, my parents are not like that. Like, I would always get dressed with my friends.

[36:13] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Like, I was in my raw state. Like, yeah, you're gonna come into, like, that's like, my room was, like, my only place. You feel me? So it was like. That was, like, the most raw state. And, like, you're either gonna, like, take it or leave it. That's how I feel.

[36:26] AMARI SANFORD: Right. I definitely, like, I really liked and. Oh, I see the socks now. I really liked the, like, the. Our first interaction, even though, like, I wasn't talking that much, because I don't talk that much normally. This is usually the most I've talked before, really. But I, you know, I like I really enjoyed just kind of hanging out with you. And it was just like, a nice change of scenery for me. I'd been in my dorm with, you know, someone else for ever, and it was really tiresome to see the same thing. And so it was nice to have a new environment. And then I'm really grateful that we hit it off because after that, like, I was at your apartment all the time.

[37:08] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Yeah, I remember it was super, like, I was so nervous because I don't normally, like, ox or anything like that. Like, I don't normally play my music for, like, other people because I'm always. I was always the friend with the car. So I would, you know, let other people jump on the aux and stuff. So, like, I didn't know what to play. Like, I was like, oh, my gosh. Like, maybe she'll think, like, my music is lame. Then you told me my music was lame and, like, really, like, unoriginal. And I was like, oh, okay. But there was just, like, this sort of, like, mystery, like, to you that really, like, was drawing me in at, like, every second. And I was just like, okay, like, I have to figure this girl out, you know, Like. And so that's. That's really what made me, like, keep wanting to over. Plus, we were really, like, on the same vibe. Like, we were like. We were really, like, here the whole time. And that was, like, not. That wasn't something that I had encountered before, even with, like, my previous partners. So it was very.

[38:09] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah.

[38:10] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: I don't know. Eye opening.

[38:11] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah, I. I definitely think that was, like a. That was, like, something for me that was like, okay, like, we're actually connecting on, like, a different. Not just, like, physically or, like, emotionally or, like, mentally.

[38:22] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Like, we're like.

[38:22] AMARI SANFORD: I feel like there's, like, definitely a deeper connection. And I. I think it's interesting because I remember that time when we were in your room and we were just, like, looking at each other, you know, And Shaw thought. I don't remember what she thought, but she was.

[38:35] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: She was like this. You guys just. Did you guys just have, like, some sort of, like, sexual thing right now? And I was like, no. Like, did it look like we just. We just caught each other's eyes? That's it.

[38:49] AMARI SANFORD: I think that's. Yeah, that was great. But I just. I'm very, like, grateful that we have that connection just past what is understood by ourselves and other people. Comes in handy very often.

[39:09] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: Definitely. Definitely makes it, like, worth. I don't know, like, instead of, like, treating this marriage like some BS because we're so young and, like, we're actually still girlfriends or something. Like, it makes it, like, so worth, like, fighting for because of, like, what we do, our relationship off of. And, like, our, like, the core of our relationship still remains, even when there's all this other crap going on, all these other developments happening.

[39:38] AMARI SANFORD: Yeah.

[39:38] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: You know, all of these other things, like, at the end of the day, like, we know we came from, and then we know how we ended up in the beginning, and we know, like, essentially what we what we really want to be, not putting any limiting factors on it, but, you know, like, we know how strong our love is and what that actually means for us.

[39:59] AMARI SANFORD: Right, Exactly.

[40:02] SHANIAH WILLIAMS: I agree.