Shannon Parry and Michael Parry

00:02 My name is Shannon Parry. I'm 45 years old. Today is Sunday, January 26th, 2020. We are in Santa Monica, California and I am interviewing my husband Mike Perry.

00:17 My name is Mike Perry. I'm 45 years old. Today's date is Sunday, January 26th, 2024 in Santa Monica, California. My interview partner is Shannon Parry my wife.

00:34 So like how did we meet we met on a very clear warm.

00:43 Quintessentially Berkeley fall day in the fall of 1990

00:53 6 I was at a party at a friend of ours house a friend. I didn't know at the time was a mutual friend and I've been to this house many many times and this particular day. I was upstairs in one of our friends rooms listening to some people play the drums as we often did at that time.

01:24 It is a very sort of casual fun party get together. We're all just you know, sitting around enjoying the afternoon. Listen to our friends play their music and there probably about 12 or so people in the room 1215 people something like that. And I knew everybody in the room. I've been going to school with all these people for three or four years at that point and

01:56 The music was going on and we're all just sitting there and the door opened and there you were you came in the door and everyone else would seem to know, you know, you know people greeted you as you came in with a sort of pinot and Nod or wave because we're in the middle of listen to our friends play music and as it turned out the only real open space in the room to sit happened to be next to me. So you came over and you asked if you could sit down and I said, yes, and as you sat I noticed that you had a carabiner attached to your keys or your keys attached to a carabiner only one of your belt loops and I thought to myself greats now it instantly have somebody I can ask this woman about because I am very keen to ask her some questions or you know, talk to her if she seems amazing.

02:54 You strike me right away. And so when the music died down after a few minutes, I asked you if you were a climber, which I assumed you were because you had a carabiner climbing Carabiner and then you said that you were and so again perfect entree into my next question, which was do you want to go climbing sometime? And he said yes, and I so I feel like even though that was our meeting the first time we met our real sort of meeting and sort of the time that we were they first got to know each other was the following day when we went on a climbing trip to the boulders just south of Stinson Beach in Marin County. And that was really sweet of our are real moment of getting to know one another

03:45 The thing I love about that moment in our friends house is that I I had just gotten home from Alaska the night before that party and I had spent that whole summer alone in Alaska not for any reason other than to explore nature and to explore myself and wild places and had really come to the realization that I was not interested in dating. I've had found boys to be Men season 2 via I had found dating to be a distraction and I was really coming back to Berkeley like focus on finishing my thesis committed to just like finding my own path and get very consciously committed to not dating and so I remember walking into that party and thinking multiple times. Maybe I should

04:45 Go home. I've been in Alaska all summer, but then I heard our friends drums playing from upstairs. And I thought this is one of my favorite things. Maybe I should head up there and just say hi to everybody and then I'll be on my way. And I remember opening that bedroom door and seeing all these familiar faces in the room. But the one that caught my attention was yours and I was like not leave until I know that guy that was a funny thing because we actually though we count that as the first time that we met we actually had met previously because I remember that two years before this. I took a class which was called ecosystem. I don't know the the Wilderness education education. Yeah, and so I was really interested in this class. It was a basically class meant towards helping kids from the city get out into the Wilderness of him for the

05:45 Time and so I was what interested in it, but I remember that I couldn't really make the class because I have lacrosse practice and I so it always come into the class late and I felt like, you know, the class had a very particular what I viewed as a very particular social structure, which was to me fairly exclusionary because there seemed to be sort of a kadre of dreadlocked very cool people the people that I actually wanted to be friends with but couldn't be friends with because I was sort of Lacrosse playing jock and I was sort of like barred from entry to like hang out these people and I noticed there was a woman who seemed to be their leader and I like she's our seems really cool. She seems like someone I'd really like to know but a man there's no way

06:45 Woman be in my white hat white lacrosse hat. And so it's just a ruse like, you know, whatever. That's just I can't I can't go there and there's no way I can bridge this Gap. So I just want to let it be and then come to find out that same woman from the decal class two years earlier if I thought was so great and so impossibly unapproachable.

07:12 Came and sat next to me at that party.

07:19 How did you know I was the one?

07:25 How did I know you were the one I was the second day we met and our first date we were living in Berkeley and you rode your bike down to my house and we hopped in the car and we were headed out to go on our first date a climbing trip to a spot out of Marin County right on the beach and we got out there. We realize that the El Nino storms from earlier in the season had actually destroyed the portion of the rock face that we were planning to climb on the routes were no longer cuz I'm a ball and so we were sitting on the beach and trying to decide what we were going to do next when an elderly man walks down the beach and invited us to go to some tile Hot Springs with him.

08:20 So like all good Berkeley students do on their first date. We said yes and followed the stranger on a magical Adventure that culminated in us sitting in this beautiful hot springs with the Pacific Ocean crashing beside us and really kind of delving into interesting topics in serious moments together and no time to be done there instead of heading home. We headed over the San Francisco Golden Gate Bridge and had dinner at House of Nanking where we knew as vegetarians not to try to order off the menu but to get a seat at the table with the manager and just tell him we were hungry and we are vegetarians and let him bring what he wanted to the table.

09:10 And after that we were headed home and I remember looking in the rearview mirror and just catching a glimpse of your eyes and thinking wow, I am going to marry this man and have children. Wow. How long can I put this off for and then goes about 10 years before we got married? Yep. Yep.

09:38 So

09:41 How did you propose?

09:43 Well, I proposed.

09:49 On a trip into the Sierras spending time of the Sierras is something that we both very much enjoy and is always extremely special we've had really formative and important experiences both together and apart in the Sierras. And so after we had moved to Los Angeles have been living in Los Angeles together for almost four years, you know, I just almost not I wouldn't say sort of

10:26 Whimsically but it just struck me that like, okay, you know, what now's the time we're going to we're going to do that. I'm going to do this. It's the time to make it happen. And so we planned a Backcountry ski trip into the Sierras into a place called Rock Creek Canyon, which is just about 25 or so miles south of Mammoth north of Bishop. And the idea for the trip is that you drive your car to the end of the road to where the road ceases to be plowed and then you put on your skis and then you ski about five miles up the road and you when you get to the end of the five miles you arrive at a little a little Yurts that cause for like a year. And it's a very simple it's very small and it's basically on a platform that it's been shoveled off and it's

11:26 An amazingly beautiful place. It's surrounded by nothing but Wilderness for many many many miles around. There's no one else around and when you get there, there is for the wood floor to sleep on there is a wood-burning stove and there's a propane stove for cooking and that's it. And so to us, that's just the perfect place to be and what else what what more and what what could you want nothing? So,

12:00 We the funny thing was

12:03 I knew that this trip was meant to be our engagement trip Shannon.

12:09 You didn't know this was meant to be our engagement rip. So, you know, there's the logistics like there aren't any kind of trip or take leadership in the back country and I had gotten some skis with one pair of cross-country skis between us so I got a second pair of skis that I was going to that I was going to use to get up into the mountains and come to find out the boots. I had didn't fit into the skis. I had the boots I had were just a little bit to the soul to be with a little bit too thick to fit properly into the binding and you know, if Shannon is our usual way would like to know what it's not a problem with his go down back down to town. We could try back down to town and we'll just you know, what the new boots or figure it out and get you know, no problem. We'll just like you don't change your plans and I'm thinking like an absolutely not I'm not doing this or getting up that it's going to happen. So check out my pocket knife and I shave that boot down and trimmed up that boot sole.

13:09 Add sure enough got us fit in the binding and we made our way up to the cabin. It was a beautiful beautiful Chris clear winter day and got it plays got ourselves sorted out and it just so happened to be also New Year's Eve. So it's one of our New Year's trip and you know, if we made it ourselves comfortable, we're actually sitting out in these chairs that were sort of pushed out into the snow. So it's very like we had all of our winter gear on we're sitting in these chairs that were sort of half something into the snow and just looking up at the sky and looking at the constellations, you know taking it in the wind is taking it all in and

13:54 I looked up at the constellation of Orion and we just got into talking about like all the things that we done underneath this particular for constellation that have to be particularly memorable and special and I said, you know what speaking of special things that we've done into the constellation. Like how about if you marry me and that was down in the snow in Philly I said, yes. My favorite part of that is that was the days that followed because quickly after I said, yes a massive snowstorm came into the canyon and for days and days and days it snowed and snowed and snowed and while we had a great time in the back country skiing. We were suddenly finding ourselves facing the reality that we had to ski out of this.

14:54 Country ski camp and it has it had snowed at least three or four feet. So we made our way back to the trail. We made our way down to what had been the side of the road only to find that we had parked our truck in a location that wasn't going to get snow plowed and if I only was not going to get snow piled it had gotten snow plowed in so we got to her track and it was 4 ft deep in snow a good 200 feet from any plowed road. So we spent the first few days of our engagement celebrating in the magic of Nature and then we very very quickly came face-to-face with the realities of being in the mountains. So we started by digging getting out of a Avalanche shovels thinking that we would just dig out our truck these two hundred feet and that was going not slow.

15:54 Well, we were figuring out that we were going to have to sleep in the back of her check in the snow that night when in the distance we heard the Rumblings of a snow plow and I just remember looking into each other's eyes and the silent. Yes go and I ran as fast as I could hip deep in snow making as much sound as I could to try to get the snow plow that was coming up the closest Mountain Road to see us and dig us out which luckily he did see us. He was feeling kind and generous and didn't back plow us out. What if I complete happenstance because he told us later that he was just having lunch down the road and he wasn't supposed to be anywhere near there, but just had this inclination that he should drive up there and see if the road needs to be plowed and thought it was a good a good start to this Epic Journey. We're Serendipity in a little bit of good fortune really came our way.

16:55 So what have been the best times or the most difficult times the best times and the most difficult times in the best time? We've spent we have been together.

17:11 More than half my life. So it's really hard to say. Oh, these were the best times but I think probably some of the moments this and out for me, of course, we're the early years you just being able to be in college together and you to learn about ourselves and learn about the world and to be able to kind of set the platform for our relationship with such sort of noble intention and the freedom and possibility that comes with being students that really was a special time in our life. We were learning about the world. We were learning about the great authors and philosophers and scientists and we were living in the Bay Area where there's redwoods in oceans and it's particularly said there was old and internet or a very rudimentary one. It was very different time.

18:11 I think when we were at Berkeley you had to go to the library and rent check out six CDs to install the Internet Explorer. Happy just to install the email software onto your computer to build a check your school e-mail. So they were pretty distraction or the distractions were of love in life and nature and that was really powerful have a Grateful Dead. I would definitely add our time together just you weather was the Grateful Dead or Jerry Garcia band or the early days of fish like so much so much connection comes from the freedom that comes from live music and it's like that was a really special time.

19:03 When we finish college and we had completed our sort of obligation to our parents to get a our degrees. But before we felt compelled to have careers to own a home, we dreamt of the dream of buying a one-way ticket to London England and spending two years traveling Overland from England to India. And I think that was one of the most magical times of our life those moments together, you know, whether it was hiking the bed nevus hiking the west highland way to Ben Davis or you almost taking over the management of a hostel in Northern Ireland the time that we spent living in the French Alps and skiing and snowboarding or the summer. We spent in the Greek Islands exploring ancient ruins and your modern Greek culture.

19:59 The moped rides through turkey turkey the opportunity to be in Pakistan together. I think about the The Arc of of our life in the journal the things that have happened in the world since we took that trip and I just feel so immensely grateful the time that we spent together. I will always remember crossing the border from Pakistan to India and then taking the train North to Nepal and

20:32 Coming back around after it all in settling in to time. We had a month in Thailand with $100 to her name. And I think that was probably one of the most amazing months of Our Lives. That was a time that really just resonated with my heart and mind to know that kind of stuff my soul. But also I think this time like this time of life is been one of the best times because being the parents to Russia and Bowden has been just

21:07 An Epic Journey, you know, we've been on some pretty epic journey together, but just to be able to see the beauty of the world through their eyes and to be able to see the parts of them that are you and the parts of them that come for me but to see it expressed through the trials and tribulations and successes and wisdom that they each bring to the world has been like amazing. Really I feel like

21:33 For me the best of time sometimes you can think of the best is being the most joyful or the most free but sometimes I think the best times are when you're learning the most and I feel like as a parent and as a parent with you, I'm I'm learning a lot about myself and I mean this far in for us. I'm still learning about you and how we support our children. And I mean ultimately that journey of being parents and being the parents of Asha and Bowden is also how you how

22:06 I resonate with obviously the worst time in our life like when our son died that was.

22:16 Obviously, that was the hardest thing I've ever been through in my life.

22:21 I'm like immensely grateful that we met her recently times where I wasn't sure I was going to survive and then I knew producer I knew that if I survive we would survive and I remember just that like pattern.

22:42 Like invisible line that like your love and the support of our friends and family provided me as be like managed through that.

22:54 And sometimes I think about that time and I just

22:57 But the absolute hardest thing that I have ever been through I certainly did not know in moments if I would make it through it, but the fact that we did make it through that we put this like massive, you know, the old circle around us and just made the commitment in the moment that we were going to grieve as a couple and that we were going to grieve as individuals, but that we were going to do it within the comfort and strength of our marriage. I think that was one of the most like

23:32 The hardest thing we've ever done in the most profoundly important thing we've ever done.

23:39 We did it and then I remember I think about this all the time, you know, in terms of things that are hard and things that have not been hard things have been great what Joanna said that our wedding which was you know, you were going to be blown away by the things that Mike and Shannon two things were going to be blown away by the things that they do and when she said that I thought of like very external achievements like it made me think about things like, you know, Shannon will win a Nobel Prize or you know serve on the faculty of Harvard or you know, get her PhD in you know,

24:27 Saving the world, you know, and I'll have some Great accomplishments or you know, we'll have a big house together or will you know, you know live in Vale or something, you know, I mean while I was just like this grandiose some grandiose reality, you know, I just thought like yeah, she's right, you know, if you are going to be blown away by what we achieve now and I thought about her words so many times since then because

24:55 I think that it away people should be blown away by what we've achieved but what we've achieved is also like it's much more humble than that, but it's not to say that it's any less difficult, you know, and I think that for people who know us, you know, they can say like oh, yeah, you know, they've had like these challenges or these successes, you know, their kids are this way or if their kids are greater their kids are you know have really like put a wrinkle in their lives are like whatever it is, but the thing about it is is it like I think that she was really right when she said that during our wedding, but the way that she was right has really surprised me because even what you just said about, you know Liam being for and it was sort of like when that was when when she made that statement in 2005, you know, did I think that my big achievement?

25:55 It would be you know, grieving loss of an infant be no, baby for years later. Like I never thought in a million years that that would be like my big accomplishment, you know, but come to find out it's just sort of like it that old saying like anyone can handle a crisis. It's the everyday that kills you and I think that just everyday, you know with like the challenges of you know, our kids now and what it means, you know, both sort of the magic that you mention and seeing things through their eyes, which is certainly a magical and wonderful that also just the responsibility and the, you know, the opportunity opportunity play played together with the responsibilities, you know, that isn't just that is not a self.

26:46 Agreed

26:50 What's your favorite memory is me my favorite memory of you. I think a lot of my favorite memories of you to come from that time that you talked about when we were traveling together. Every one of my favorite memories of you was the look on your face when we walked into India having spent a little bit of over a month in Pakistan and you know, though we were very like open-minded liberal kids, you know who had just graduated from a very open-minded liberal University and sort of, you know, wanted to learn about the world on its own terms and learn acceptance and learn tolerance, which we certainly did but you know, even even if that's your goal, it's hard to be in Pakistan for a month and you know have kids throw rocks at you when you ride your bike by and never be addressed in a restaurant and never be asked.

27:50 Opinion and you know constantly being spoken of in the third person in your presence. Like that's just that's not easy regardless of your you know, your how you feel about things and and I thought I'd just so remember like walking over the border and we were probably a hundred feet into India and this guy walked up to you is like would you like a Pepsi? Like I've never heard you say yes to a Pepsi ever in your life. Like yes, I would love a Pepsi. It was a great. It's just the look on your face is like thank you for seeing me and also for me to like see like wow, that was really the whole experience of the previous month light came into even worse Stark relief in that it was really amazing. But I mean, you know, there's there's so many, you know, having you go from being a person who was trying to ask

28:50 The fact that they weren't good at snowboarding because you were afraid that I would like you anymore all the way up to being an extremely accomplished snowboard in a very good snowboarder, being able to snowboard video on dedeaux road. Steep Mountain runs, you know, those are most of my favorite memories of you and I think that also he was seeing you as the mother of our children in a very patient and deliberate way day in and day out meaning of those are also some of my favorite memories of you but I mean, you know, there's so many it's hard to even there the mail about how much life experience we have together. And I remember that moment on the bridge coming across the border so vividly that month had been so powerful. We arrived in Pakistan having had to take the only Airline flight.

29:50 Around the world travel. So we are gone from England to Ireland and Ireland back to England. Wish I could train to Europe we went to France and then Italy and then over to Greece and then to Turkey and then we can get a visa for Ron for a wrong because we were an unmarried couple traveling together unless you're asked took control of Pakistan in the military coup. And so we found ourselves I think a little bit too close for comfort to all the celebratory gunfire we found on the streets. So we hitchhiked with a bunch of young guys and a truck to the Northwest Northwest Territories of Pakistan ended.

30:50 The Northern Territory is ataxia. No mess up to the border of China and hung out there for a while. And that was we found ourselves deep deeply entrenched in a culture where I was not visible or seen it all and so I remember very vividly Crossing that bridge and just feeling immense gratitude for being seen and heard and present glad you were there to see it.

31:32 What was the most profound spiritual moment of your life?

31:36 Yeah, it's it's really interesting because we have we have tracked to The Druids Altar and Ireland. We've stood at the ancient site of the Oracle at Delphi. We have prayed Under the Dome at Aya Sofia we've been pilgrims to the Golden Temple in Amritsar. We meditated at the stupa and third guy we've received teachings from the Dalai Lama And yet when I think about it, you know, the things that are most important to me the moments where I've had the most intense spiritual realization that are really in The Quiet Moments on a name to Trails or a top epic Peaks where the beauty of Nature and the Grandeur and magic of

32:35 Dim the earth makes me feel small in comparison to all those things. So I would say despite all the opportunities and exposure we've had for me those moments in nature are where I feel the most alive in the most connected.

33:11 For your great-great-grandchildren listening to this years from now. Is there any wisdom you'd want to pass on to them?

33:19 Hello, great. Great great great grandchildren. So grateful that you were are you on Mars?

33:28 Where do you live?

33:30 Do you think there is Earth still here if I wanted to share anything with them? I would I would say believe in yourself.

33:46 Have the courage to follow your dreams, but be prepared to put in the hard work to make it a reality.

33:55 I would say.

33:57 If you have the inclination and you feel like it would serve you go to college. There is a beauty in knowing and it will help you find yourself and find your people.

34:12 I would say to travel the world travel is an important way to learn but even more importantly it is a way to unlearn to connect Beyond language and culture and to really get to know yourself in relationship to things that are outside of your Norm.

34:32 I think travel is important because it allows you to question assumptions and to come to terms with your own answers. I would say trouble often and go as far off the beaten path as you can.

34:47 I would say Define love and nurture it every relationship has challenges move through them with all authenticity Grace and courage.

34:58 Remember to take care of the people you love.

35:04 And then I would say take care of the Earth.

35:07 Or as my cat so happily noted if you do not live on earth.

35:13 I would say take care of the earth and and its inhabitants and know that your great-great-grandparents worked hard everyday in our own ways to address the global climate crisis and to make sure that you live in a world where Environmental Protection economic vitality and social Equity are mutually entwined and know that we love you and we're grateful for a lineage that reflects our families values.

35:53 Yeah, that's a good one. I mean it's amazing to think with the lineage of those children will be you know.

36:01 Just being is that we're sort of very like, you know European mutts, but at that point to like what will the borders of the world be like and what will people's access to each other be like and to think about like all that there in Heritage. My include is pretty awesome.

36:25 I think

36:27 I think this has been a remarkable experience. It's amazing having sent you more than 20 years together.

36:36 Having fun in 20 years together to have this opportunity to reflect on you and of the Ark ever urinate from being young college students newly and love to you and pack Packers on This Global adventure to know ourselves in the world and to you follow the Silk Road where it would take us. I'm coming back to the United States and with I think I knew a new appreciation for what it means to be an American and living here in this country and this time and then to follow the Arc of us, you know, each fighting our way you as a filmmaker and me Urban sustainability and then to see our careers flourish as we became parents and to move into this phase of our life where

37:36 We were adults like we're adults who spent more than half our life together and it's nice to have this opportunity to you can appreciate that story are can look at it in some ways for the one of the first times like looking back and then seeing the seeds for what you know, what the looking forward phase will include

38:03 Yeah, I know. We really haven't taken that opportunity to sort of like to a retrospective but it's true. It's so hard it is. So amazing to think about all the phases, you know, which is our lives have been our trajectories have been so I can mutually supportive and like mutually complementary and do maybe you wouldn't have pursued Urban sustainability in Los Angeles if it weren't for me. Yeah, I think if I hadn't fallen in love with the filmmaker, I would definitely not live here. But what would I have this opportunity to be you and you have you would I have this opportunity to be able to work in the belly of the Beast of sustainability if I hadn't fallen in love with the phone maker. I mean, it's like our lives are so connected to each other and that I'm grateful.

39:03 Me too.